Two words I wish had never been put together....

Discussion in 'Politics, Religion, Social Issues' started by bandrews, Apr 5, 2016.

  1. bandrews macrumors 6502a

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    #1
  2. FieldingMellish, Apr 5, 2016
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    FieldingMellish Suspended

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    Another recently invented phrase of the perpetually outraged with a perpetual chip on the shoulder.

    Those who want to suppress the world's lexicon of words they find bigoted, while they come up with their own bigoted entries designed to keep the white man down.

    So it appears Beiber should dispense with his cultural misappropriation and settle for his white privilege.
     
  3. sim667 macrumors 65816

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    I've said it before and I'll say it again. Identity politics can go **** itself.
     
  4. obeygiant macrumors 68040

    obeygiant

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    If there is a phrase i dislike the most its "cultural appropriation"

    =================
    Why Cultural Appropriation Is a Problem

    Cultural appropriation remains a concern for a variety of reasons. For one, this sort of “borrowing” is exploitative because it robs minority groups of the credit they deserve. Art and music forms that originated with minority groups come to be associated with members of the dominant group. As a result, the dominant group is deemed innovative and edgy, while the disadvantaged groups they “borrow” from continue to face negative stereotypes that imply they’re lacking in intelligence and creativity. In addition, when members of a dominant group appropriate the cultures of others, they often reinforce stereotypes about minority groups.

    When singer Katy Perry performed as a geisha at the American Music Awards in November 2013, she described it as an homage to Asian culture. Asian Americans disagreed with this assessment, declaring her performance “yellowface.” The Wall Street Journal’s Jeff Yang said that her performance did not celebrate Asian culture but misrepresented it entirely. He found it particularly problematic that Perry dressed as a geisha to perform the song “Unconditonally,” which describes a woman who pledges to love her man no matter what.

    “The thing is, while a bucket of toner can strip the geisha makeup off of Perry’s face, nothing can remove the demeaning and harmful iconography of the lotus blossom from the West’s perception of Asian women — a stereotype that presents them as servile, passive,” Yang wrote, “and as Perry would have it, ‘unconditional’ worshippers of their men, willing to pay any price and weather any kind of abuse in order to keep him happy.”

    Nico Lang, a guest blogger for the Los Angeles Times, pointed out in a post that cultural appropriation highlights the power imbalance that remains between those in power and those who’ve been historically marginalized. As such, a member of a dominant group can assume the traditional dress of a minority group for a Halloween party or a musical performance. Yet, they remain blissfully unaware of the roots of such dress and the challenges those who originated it have faced in Western society. link
    =================

    Its like trying too hard to make something out of nothing.
     
  5. Eraserhead, Apr 5, 2016
    Last edited: Apr 5, 2016

    Eraserhead macrumors G4

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    I don't give a ****. Unless someone is going to claim Asians have no culture or some other such nonsense.

    I definitely think people caring about cultural appropriation are ridiculous.
     
  6. jnpy!$4g3cwk, Apr 5, 2016
    Last edited: Apr 5, 2016

    jnpy!$4g3cwk macrumors 65816

    jnpy!$4g3cwk

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    You are tempting me.


    Proponents of the concept bring out things from the past like blackface. I have to agree with them that blackface is offensive. The problem is that I have no algorithm for determining that blackface is racially/ethnically offensive, while calling Taco Bell "Mexican Food" is not (although I find the food itself offensive-- as faux-Mexican "food").
     
  7. bandrews thread starter macrumors 6502a

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  8. Mousse macrumors 68000

    Mousse

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    [​IMG]
    If it worked for the Romans and the Borg, I have no complaints.:D
     
  9. thewap macrumors demi-god

    thewap

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    They want diversity and integration but no cultural appropriation.. makes total sense..:confused:
     
  10. hulugu macrumors 68000

    hulugu

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    I get the idea, but I think it's entirely misunderstood by proponents and critics.

    The best recent example is Urban Outfitters copying Navajo weaving patterns (some that are considered sacred) and using them to decorate t-shirts, underwear, and liquor flasks.

    Not only did Urban Outfitters just lift something wholesale from the Navajo culture, but they're making a large profit in doing so—money that won't go back to the tribe, or the artists who made the original weavings that Urban Outfitters copied.

    Cultural appropriation isn't a white guy wearing dreadlocks, it's a white guy using black culture to make money without acknowledging the originators of the cultural sign or artifact.

    So, in this case, Bieber isn't doing anything wrong—besides making terrible pop songs and being a little knob.
     
  11. VulchR macrumors 68020

    VulchR

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    Erm... dreadlocks have a very long history and have arisen in many cultures, and if we are being accurate about the origin of Rastafari dreadlocks, then it's Judaism.

    EDIT: Oh, and the French want their Statue of Liberty back.
     
  12. Renzatic Suspended

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    #12
    I think the biggest issue is using the sacred cows of other cultures to sell pop merchandise. It'd be like flying over to Japan and seeing a series of porn videos narrated by a characterized cartoon version of Jesus Christ. To the Japanese, it won't mean much. It's a part of our culture, not theirs. They're just using it for the kitsch factor. But a Christian westerner would find it greatly offensive.
     
  13. hulugu macrumors 68000

    hulugu

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    Right, but for the Diné (Navajo) the appropriation is even more striking because they, along with dozens of other tribes, were subject to the American Indian boarding schools—where students were forced to assimilate often through brutal subjugating tactics at schools run by the BIA.

    Pushed onto reservations and forced to assimilate with U.S. culture, many native tribes endure the possibility that they could lose their language, identity and art within a generation.

    Thus having Urban Outfitters grab a part of their culture to send hipster undies is even more infuriating.
     
  14. FieldingMellish Suspended

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    Being a little knob. Priceless. :)
     
  15. Eraserhead macrumors G4

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    Presuming those designs are out of copyright I fail to see the issue. Do you have to pay the Chinese government for using Chinese writing on clothing? What about Kanji? Do you pay both Japan and China for that?
     
  16. hulugu macrumors 68000

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    Writing is generic and cannot be protected, but Diné designs are not generic, but as distinctive as a Jackson Pollock painting.
     
  17. Eraserhead macrumors G4

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    In which case they should be protected equivalently to other equivalent art.
     
  18. hulugu macrumors 68000

    hulugu

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    That's the argument from the Diné who launched a lawsuit against Urban Outfitters. Lawyers from UO responded, arguing that the word Navajo was generic but a judge rejected this and has ruled that the lawsuit can go forward.

    The larger point is this case represents true cultural appropriation—UO took something from a distinctive culture and tried to make money on it, without asking permission or paying for the rights. You can see similar parallels with the beginnings of rock'n'roll, when white producers took the riffs and stylings of black musicians and repackaged them.

    I'm also a little uncertain about the current use of Dia De Los Muertos iconography, which has shifted from an important cultural tradition into kitschy nonsense that includes tattoos of skulls, and a glancing moment in Batman v. Superman.

    Again, it's not just about copying the art form, but taking it, repackaging it and selling it, all without the original acknowledgment or permission of the people who made it.

    That's the cultural appropriation that matters.
    It's not college students doing yoga—it's Bikram Choudhury using yoga to build a cult-like empire around the spiritual practice.
     
  19. FieldingMellish Suspended

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    Is homage going to be a banned word? Kind of an excuse to rip people off?
     
  20. Eraserhead macrumors G4

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    So? I really don't see an issue, any more than I see an issue with Princess of China:


    --- Post Merged, Apr 5, 2016 ---
    So basically everything we listen to is based on black culture, I'm OK with that to be honest.

    Plus its not as if black artists have failed, people like Jay Z and Kayne West are some of the worlds biggest music stars.
     
  21. hulugu macrumors 68000

    hulugu

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    This video better be a Rickroll because if you're making me to listen to Coldplay, I'm going to be pissed.

    Tell that to Blind Willie Johnson who lived in his burned-out home on a wet mattress and died after a hospital refused to take him, but whose music has been lifted by Led Zeppelin and Paul McCartney. Or, for that matter Papa Charlie Jackson who lost his song to the Allen Brothers, and Robert Johnson who saw little from a cover of his song by Cream.

    Homage is troublesome because it dances on the fine difference between acknowledgement of an original work and outright theft. But, I think a homage takes parts of a cultural artifact and makes it into something new while respecting the original source.

    So, for instance, a scarf decorated with a Navajo-style pattern might past muster in a way that a direct copy printed to a pair of panties does not.
     
  22. bpeeps macrumors 68020

    bpeeps

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    You're doing God's work in this post and some still can't grasp it.
     
  23. Eraserhead, Apr 5, 2016
    Last edited: Apr 5, 2016

    Eraserhead macrumors G4

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    I'm not surprised, every one of those bands has turned out to be total *****. If I was going to bet on any pop stars paying their ****ing taxes and stuff I'd bet on Taylor Swift and friends, but I'm sure there I'll be disappointed too.

    That's fair.

    Of course the Coldplay song, and Katy Perry's songs as bought up by @obeygiant are new works.
     
  24. sim667 macrumors 65816

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    I wouldn't say that dreads are reliably traced back to Judaism as their origins, they're found in almost every culture at some point in time. Even the egyptians did dreads
     
  25. VulchR macrumors 68020

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    Rastafari dreadlocks do trace their roots to Judaism, but it is a special case.
     

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