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Discussion in 'Politics, Religion, Social Issues' started by mcrain, Jul 3, 2012.
8 whole minesweepers - that will make the Strait safe.
That's only the ones the US has sent. Other nations, such as the UK, Australia and France, will be supplementing that. No way can the industrialised world allow that waterway to be disrupted.
Not sure if HMS Daring is still out that way, which is one of our top notch destroyers. Anyone able to confirm?
EDIT : LOL. Apparently she is, but not for reasons the British government would like to advertise. Link
I find it a bit ironic that this news should be released today. Because it's exactly thirty four years to the day, that an American destroyer shot down a civilian Iranian Airbus killing 290 people.
"Of all the enemies to public liberty war is, perhaps, the most to be dreaded, because it comprises and develops the germ of every other. War is the parent of armies; from these proceed debts and taxes; and armies, and debts, and taxes are the known instruments for bringing the many under the domination of the few. In war, too, the discretionary power of the Executive is extended; its influence in dealing out offices, honors, and emoluments is multiplied; and all the means of seducing the minds, are added to those of subduing the force, of the people. The same malignant aspect in republicanism may be traced in the inequality of fortunes, and the opportunities of fraud, growing out of a state of war, and in the degeneracy of manners and of morals engendered by both. No nation could preserve its freedom in the midst of continual warfare." -James Madison
He's a Scot. They have their own oil.
Or do they? <shifty>
Hey, Internet tough guy, how many minesweepers are necessary to protect the straits? Surely you must have that information to make a comment such as you did.
Official Secrets Act, and all that.
Wouldn't be sporting, old chap.
The Navy has the 5th fleet based in Bahrain.
And I'm sure that even a rowboat venturing out into the Strait is being seen by someone, somehow.
I gotta leave this secure location now. ****!!!!
I wholeheartedly agree.
How that quote could get down voted is beyond me.
The industry of War is varied and wide, like so many entrenched negatives in today's Society.
Underestimate them at your peril.
My sister's in the Navy and they were somewhat recently in the area. Although nothing is for certain (and if it was, she couldn't say), it seems highly likely instead of whatever odd name they have for a light following deployment (want to say pleasure call or something), things point toward more than likely going right back to that area instead. New Zealand or something will have to wait.
It got downvoted because some of our GOP members are more than happy to send our less fortunate sons and daughters to war to protect their interests.
If it were their kids, guess what? No war. That's why I advocate mandatory one year's service for all.
If you expect others to fight and possibly die for this country, you yourself should be doing the same.
Lumbering oil tankers are vulnerable to missiles, bombs, and torpedoes in addition to mines. The Iranians don't have to score many victories before the cost of insuring tankers would start having an impact. My point is that it is much easier to attack a big target like a tanker than to defend it (see link). As strong as the militaries of the US and its allies are, it is naive to think that they can protect all of the traffic through the strait. Thus, I hope this is resolved peacefully.
Not if you believe some of the English press...
I think people forget that Iran has the missiles right now to take down almost every major oil terminal on the south side of the Persian Gulf.
And that's scary--imagine if Iran gets the nuclear bomb and attacks the gigantic oil terminal at Dharhan in Saudi Arabia, it could send the price of oil to US$180 or higher in a blink of an eye....
This is why we need a way to deter Iran from doing something this crazy.
Iran would not do this, because Iran knows that the next step in this scenario would be Iran being turned into obsidian. That bomb they're trying to get is to wave at those who would invade them, a great big nuclear "don't you dare". Chances of them using it are as remote as Israel or France using theirs.
I find it more than ironic you choose to insult the US every chance you get specifically around our Independence day...A day, in fact you too should be celebrating or perhaps not, as there were plenty of collaborators, relatives perhaps..??
Just to keep the record straight the USS Vincennes (CG-49) was a Ticonderoga-class Aegis guided missile cruiser not a destroyer..
This person never forgot, because he never knew of this.
And really, take down? I assume we will be standing around with our hands in our pockets, wondering at all the pretty colours.
Much like tonight, right?
Oh, oil prices. Dear me.
Oh, Mr. Good With Numbers, how many people would such an attack kill/injure/irradiate?
How would one distinguish this level of crazy from pretty much everything that the U.S. lays it's hand on?
A country doing some good things 60-70 years ago doesn't excuse all of its bad actions since.
Go enjoy the fireworks.
All I was pointing out was with so much military hardware in the area, mistakes get made.
Please remember it was more than likely the loss of Flight 655, that was directly linked to the attack on PanAm 103 over Lockerbie.
For ever action there is a reaction.
I disagree. I served in the US Army for 10 years during the Desert Storm era. The repercussions of the Vietnam war draft were still playing out at that time. Logically, it's a sound statement, but we're talking about humans here, and they tend to stray from logic.
When you don't want to fight a war, you are not an effective soldier. I don't want to fight with you. Or near you. Especially if you are the son/daughter/niece/nephew, etc. of a politician or an influential business person.
One of the biggest advantages of serving as an enlisted member (IMO), is that in doing so, you are bypassing a whole lot of political BS that your superior sergeants and officers have to deal with on top of the reality of being in the military.
So while I think I can understand the thought space that deduced your statement, I'm betting you can also understand why I disagree.
Keep the military full of people who choose to serve for whatever reason, and you get a formidable force that can flex and perform as deemed necessary by the PTB.
or before...?? This country has done more for the world than any other since its inception...Stumbles at times but it is run by humans, good ones both right, left and in the middle.....
I'm not getting pulled into this. You go have your day, but don't expect everyone around the world to join in the blind patriotic fervour you're currently feeling.