US is net exporter of refined crude first time in decades

Discussion in 'Politics, Religion, Social Issues' started by dukebound85, Dec 15, 2011.

  1. dukebound85 macrumors P6

    dukebound85

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    #1
  2. Sydde macrumors 68020

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    Not a whole lot, really.

    The article states that the US has become a net exporter of refined petroleum, not crude. This means that the rest of the world is sending crude to the US to be refined and shipped out, due to reduced refinery capacity outside US.

    The other part of the picture is reduced demand in US. The shaky domestic economy plays a big part in this. If the US economy were to start heating up, the stats could turn around again very quickly.
     
  3. Macky-Mac macrumors 68030

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    your link says

    So we import 9 million barrels of crude but we only export 3.2 million of refined product.....and also import another 2.2 million of refined product.

    That still leaves us very reliant on foreign oil.
     
  4. firestarter macrumors 603

    firestarter

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    Thread title is incorrect and not supported by the link.
     
  5. dukebound85, Dec 16, 2011
    Last edited: Dec 16, 2011

    dukebound85 thread starter macrumors P6

    dukebound85

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    Regardless it applies to refined petroelum and is the first time in a long time the US has been in this position
     
  6. firestarter, Dec 16, 2011
    Last edited: Dec 16, 2011

    firestarter macrumors 603

    firestarter

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    Did you actually read the article you posted?

    The US is still a net importer of foreign crude oil so it is wrong to imply that you do not rely on it.

    The US refines and is now a net exporter of oil products. These are oil derivatives, not crude oil. And even though more is exported than imported, that surplus is still overwhelmed by the deficit in the volume of crude imported.

    The figures in the article stated that the net export of oil products is 1 million barrels a day, whereas the net import of crude amounts to almost 9 million barrels a day.

    Edit: The latest figures suggest (not reported in that article) put the US domestic crude production at around 6 million barrels a day. So not only are you reliant on foreign oil - actually the majority of your oil comes from abroad.

    ps: Not good forum etiquette to go back and edit your posts when you've been proved wrong.
     
  7. Ugg macrumors 68000

    Ugg

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    I've always thought of you as a reasonable poster but I'm not sure why you're defending yourself.

    We are a, by far, net importer of oil and export modestly more refined product than we import. To me, that means the US is still a net importer. I don't know how you can spin that into a net exporter of petroleum.

    From ditionary.app

    Petroleum by definition then is crude oil. Perhaps it's just a matter of semantics? If not, why is this a big deal? Also, it might well be a temporary issue so why do you bring it up?

    You've not provided any reason for posting this. I am honestly interested.
     
  8. dukebound85 thread starter macrumors P6

    dukebound85

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    Yea, I saw that. I edited my post to better reflect my thoughts but you guys are so quick to grab my initial post!

    Haha it does seem that I've jumped the gun doesn't it? ;)

    With that said, is there any implications of being a net exporter of refined crude? I have been reading some more reports on this and it is projected that the US will stay a net exporter in this regard for some time to come
     
  9. mcrain macrumors 68000

    mcrain

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    #9
    Which begs the question, if we are a net exporter of refined crude, then why the massive push to drill baby drill? We have too much!
     
  10. Macky-Mac macrumors 68030

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    sure, it's definitely better to be a net exporter rather than an importer. As your link says;

    but every little bit helps
     
  11. mcrain macrumors 68000

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    #11
    Brazil has protective trade policies which have resulted in a very expensive price for the iPhone 4S. According the story on the main page, Apple is feverishly working to bring manufacturing up to speed in Brazil.

    Can anyone explain why the same thing wouldn't happen if we did the same thing?
     
  12. Macky-Mac macrumors 68030

    Macky-Mac

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    what are you talking about? protective trade policies? oil exports? are you thinking they're somehow related?
     
  13. Ugg macrumors 68000

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    The fact that we are a net exporter of refined crude is interesting. The US hasn't built any new oil refineries in , however, three factors have impacted gasoline use in the US. Ethanol, reduced vehicle miles traveled (VMT) and increased fuel efficiency.

    The last new, major continental US oil refinery was built in the late 70s. However, existing refineries have been significantly expanded. Ethanol currently makes up about 10% of all gasoline sold in the US. I seriously doubt that ethanol subsidies will last more than a decade so unless corn to ethanol becomes a lot cheaper, that percentage may decline or not based on future gasoline consumption. Finally, fuel efficiency standards in the US are going to increase a lot over the next 25 years because of new laws that resulted from the auto company bailouts. Due to increased urbanization, mass transit and intercity transit, and perhaps even a Total Vehicle Miles Traveled Tax to replace the current gas tax, gasoline usage will probably decline during that same period even though the population will continue to increase.

    It's also possible that Brazil will increase its own refining capacity to generate more income from its deep sea oil discoveries.

    Short term. The US will continue to export refined petro products.

    Long term. The US might continue to export refined petro products depending upon a multitude of economic and political variables:D
     
  14. firestarter macrumors 603

    firestarter

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    One interesting point that the article failed to pick up on is the Japan tsunami effect.

    The tsunami knocked out approx 1 million barrels/day of refining capability in Japan - and must have had a knock on effect WRT increased demand for refined products in the international market.

    Couple this with a decreased demand at home, and it makes sense that spare refining capacity would step up to fill the void.

    It will be interesting to see if demand remains as high - as in the last few weeks it's been reported that Japanese refining capability has returned to normal.
     
  15. mikeyredk macrumors 65816

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    I found a wall street journal article with some nice pictures check it out.

    http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052970203441704577068670488306242.html

    Second link:
    You may notice that that the amount of diesel exports sky rocketed after 2007 this is when we switched to Ultra Low sulfur diesel in the US.

    http://www.investmentu.com/2011/September/diesel-fuel-export-record-highs.html

    Side note:
    For those who think that the Keystone Pipeline will reduce the prices of fuel in the US fat chance it will make it easier for that refined fuel to leave the US.
     
  16. mcrain macrumors 68000

    mcrain

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    Well, let's see... There is an entire political party running around talking about drilling in areas that might suffer massive ecological damage that we can't fix all because we need oil here. We need to drill for oil for out energy needs.

    The fact of the matter is that oil is a commodity that is sold on a worldwide market, and this just proves that THE ONLY effect that drilling in Anwar, or the gulf, or anywhere else will have is to increase the overall supply of oil, and thus the profits of the big oil companies.

    The next time a Republican says we need to drill baby drill, tell them to shut the hell up. They are lying to you to enrich the oil companies. Why, you ask? Well, because the oil companies give massive, MASSIVE amounts of money to the GOP.
     
  17. Macky-Mac macrumors 68030

    Macky-Mac

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    Unfortunately choices aren't always between good and evil. Usually you're faced with all options having negatives as well as benefits. In the case of oil, buying oil overseas and importing drains money from our economy and transfers it to other countries, that produces jobs overseas while costing jobs at home, it enriches the likes of Saudi princes and Iranian politicians, and leads to politicians at home deciding to "protect" our oil supply in countries like Iraq thru warfare.

    Alas, I think your analysis is distorted too much by your hate for the oil companies :p
     
  18. mcrain macrumors 68000

    mcrain

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    Ahh, that's funny. In this case, it is good and evil. One side wants to starve to death old people, children, minorities and anyone else with the misfortune of being poor. That same side is willing to sacrifice untold lives all for a few billion dollars for its benefactors.

    If you think they are "good," then feel free to defend them.
     
  19. Macky-Mac macrumors 68030

    Macky-Mac

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    well see, I think your everything is good or evil view is a fallacy that cripples your ability to think about issues with anything approaching an open mind.
     
  20. mcrain macrumors 68000

    mcrain

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    Ahh, but I am able to do both. Feel free to explain how the choices made by certain conservatives aren't evil. Explain how those choices were for the "greater good." Explain the issues. Prove me wrong.
     
  21. Macky-Mac macrumors 68030

    Macky-Mac

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    But you aren't discussing any issues. You've simply reduced yourself to authoritarian sounding proclamations that you're fighting evil....and all those who disagree with you are promoting evil! :rolleyes:
     
  22. CalWizrd Suspended

    CalWizrd

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    Wow, I find this amusing. Once again, someone (not me this time) seems to think that you have other than an open mind. Funny!

    ... and your response (good attorney that you must be) is "Proof. Need proof"

    You are so blinded into the "they are evil, we are good" mindset that it's just sad. So sad.
     
  23. mcrain macrumors 68000

    mcrain

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    #23
    Would it be fair to say that attacking me is a strawman or an ad hominem response?

    Look, here's the thing. There are legitimate reasons for supporting many of the positions taken by the Republican party, but we have 30+ years of trickle down economics and more recently we have the GWB administration and its policies. Some things just don't work, and some things no longer can be supported by theory. There are just too many historical facts showing the fallacy of the theory.

    I'm more than happy to change my mind. If there is some explanation for the repeated and persistent efforts by the GOP to cut taxes on the wealthy while at the same time fighting every effort to assist the poor, I haven't found it.
     

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