US Now 12 Trillion in the hole...and its just starting

Discussion in 'Politics, Religion, Social Issues' started by Full of Win, Nov 18, 2009.

  1. Full of Win macrumors 68030

    Full of Win

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    #1
    We are now 12 trillion in the hole guys 12,000,000,000,000.00 of intergenerational debt. That comes to about 40,000 for every man woman and child in the US.

    In the title I said, its only the begfinning. This is not an opinion, this is based on CBO projections. Wait for Cap and Trade to go into effect, yep - guess how is pushing it? We are looking at a 20-25 trillion dollar intergenerational debt in the coming decade if Obama is re-elected.

    [​IMG]

    Just so you guys don't thinks I'm ranting and raving, here is a good story on what Cap and Trade will do from the Wall Street Journal.

    http://online.wsj.com/article/SB123655590609066021.html


    Notice the size of the bars, not a good trend gents.Is this the change we needed? Is it? Giving the next generation a mountain of debt is not my idea of 'change we need'. Actually, it can be repurposed to "change is all you have left" after 7 more years.
     
  2. awmazz macrumors 65816

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    #2
    What's your point? Are you saying he shouldn't have stimulated the economy and instead allowed the Second Great Depression to happen? Then you'd be posting "Unemployment now 35%... and it's just starting" threads instead.

    Anyway according to your projections, Obama will reduce the deficit in just the first 12 months after the stimulus spending by as much as the entire deficit left by George Bush. So imagine what he could have done and how well your country would be heading into the future under Obama's guidance if Georgie hadn't left such a steaming sh*tpile for him to clean up first.

    I have to ask again, what's the point you keep trying to make? That America would be better off if the Republicans had retained office, is that what you're trying to say? Because I'm not getting why you are even trying to say that, sorry.
     
  3. Full of Win thread starter macrumors 68030

    Full of Win

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    #3
    Yeh, lets talk "stimulate the economy'. For example, Cash for Clunkers.... most of the sales were for autos made in South America, Canada, and Asia. Yeh, that was brilliant.

    Stimulus worked so well that we are now making up congressional districts touting the job creation.

    I think it would be better if Republicans controlled the congress and the presidency.
     
  4. awmazz macrumors 65816

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    #4
    How?
     
  5. Full of Win thread starter macrumors 68030

    Full of Win

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    #5
    Simple, we would not have the debt generating programs we have under this joker. Debt incurring healthcare program (with no tort reform:confused:), cap and trade, cash for clunkers, ineffectual stimulus programs ect...

    Not saying it would be perfect. However, it would not be as bad as it is right now.
     
  6. IntheNet macrumors regular

    IntheNet

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    #6
    Thank you for your post; very informative. I thought terrorists were dangerous to America now I see we face a worse threat from within. May God help us as we battle the assaults on our Constitution and the dark forces that threaten our existence and endanger our freedom and liberty. Our very fiscal existence is under attack and we must rally to save the Union.
     
  7. gibbz macrumors 68030

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    #7
    Full of Win, I philosophically disagree with you on many topics you post, even some of your statements here, but I am glad to see that you posted a note about the lack of tort reform in the current health care plan.

    My fiancee is almost done with schooling to be a doctor and we both want to see health care overhauled. However, we are disappointed that there is no substantive tort reform, as this is one of the biggest cost inflators in our current system. Unless you place limits to reduce defensive medicine and ludicrous malpractice lawsuits that ruin people's lives, the new system will be just as f'ed up.

    The Constitution was assaulted quite a bit during the previous administration. Where was your fervor then?

    Dark forces ... you mean like a black President? :rolleyes: (I kid)
     
  8. IntheNet macrumors regular

    IntheNet

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    #8
    While we have ventured into deficit spending before, by the current president, by the last president, and prior presidents, no president has pushed us quite so far into the hole as Obama - he's stealing our money. I call your attention to Treasury Direct:
    http://www.treasurydirect.gov/NP/BPDLogin?application=np

    which lists current debt held by public... note those words "held by public".... Porkulus (stimulus), Taxpayer Cash for Klunkers, US budget, health care, cap & trade, etc.... all these steal our money....

    -12,031,299,186,290.07...

    That's a number identifying Obama Failure...
     
  9. bruinsrme macrumors 601

    bruinsrme

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  10. bruinsrme macrumors 601

    bruinsrme

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    #10
    here here.....

    Wait until the banks start releasing all that money they were given.
    The reason why they won't disclose where it is, is because it is all heavily invested and when the economy improves they will be lending at unheard of interest rates...imagine paying 15% interest on a mortgage?
    On a$300k mortgage that is $3800 a month on a 30 year loan.
    Remember the banks got that money for 1 to 2%
     
  11. awmazz macrumors 65816

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    #11
    I ask again. How? You've replied with how not.

    How would it be better if the Republicans retained office? How would they have made it better? How would they have avoided the Second Great Depression. How would they have avoided 30% unemployment? How would they have stimulated economic recovery? What policies would they have changed and/or enacted when facing economic oblivion?

    If I recall, the massive debt-funded bailouts started while George and the Republicans were still in office. On Sept 29, 2008 the $700 billion "Emergency Economic Stabilization Act" was defeated in the House of Representatives by the Republicans and $1.2 trillion was immediately erased from the market value of American stocks as frightened investors fled the markets. The Dow Jones Industrial Average had the largest one day decline since the index was first published in 1896.

    On Friday, October 3rd 2008, the House of Representatives passed the amended version of the bill.

    So to even get it through, the bill had to have $150 billion extra tacked onto it to win 12 Republican votes to save America from collapse.

    We're looking at $850 billion of debt right there including $150 billion of Republican pork barreling, $1.2 trillion needlessly lost off the stock market, and Obama hasn't even been elected yet.

    So as I asked, how would it be better if the Republicans had retained office? And how would they have made it better?
     
  12. awmazz macrumors 65816

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    #12
    By the way, that's half of the first red column you have in your chart. Debt from before Obama was even elected.

    Oh, and also, the projected deficit reduction in Obama's first year 09-10 in just his first full 12 months is *more* than George's entire deficit. One can only imagine what he could have achieved if he didn't have to waste it fixing the steaming s**tpile financial mess he inherited. You're actually making Obama look really good with that chart.
     
  13. CarlisleUnited macrumors 6502

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    #13
    The graph shows that the white house isn't planning to cut the deficit to zero, that seems silly to me. Surely in 10 years time the economin recovery should have ecovered enough to start repaying the debt...
     
  14. Sky Blue Guest

    Sky Blue

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    #14
    Luckily, the majority of the country disagrees with you.
     
  15. zioxide macrumors 603

    zioxide

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    #15
    Sweet! $40,000 a person and the majority of it is going to build new bridges and schools in Iraq while our own infrastructure is crumbling and more and more people are out of work.

    Our government is so full of ****, and has been for quite a while now.
     
  16. Sky Blue Guest

    Sky Blue

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    #16
    Maybe God can give us an interest free loan?
     
  17. IntheNet macrumors regular

    IntheNet

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    #17
    God only lends at prime rate!

    :rolleyes:

    What I meant was that prayers to the Almighty may be our only recourse to a Government out of control; spending the nation to the poorhouse.
     
  18. leekohler macrumors G5

    leekohler

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    #18
    They wouldn't. And they don't know what to do. All they know how to do is point fingers after ten months. BTW- that chart is old news, we discussed it months ago, when we had sane conservative members. It was a pretty good discussion too. Too bad those conservatives no longer post and have been replaced with the current birthers and teabaggers.
     
  19. jb1280 macrumors 6502a

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    #19
    For those who want to demagogue the issue, how would you proceed? Increase revenue (ie taxes) or decrease spending? I imagine for the sky is falling crowd you would have to do both, very very drastically to eliminate as quickly as you might want.

    The truth is, it's easy to bitch about it, and to some I give the benefit of the doubt for being single issue voters. It's entirely another to try to actually deal with the deficit - ironically something the President and Orszag are actually trying to do.

    With the exception of Defense and Veterans, all Departments will be required to submit two budgets for 2011 - one with a spending freeze, one with a 5% reduction.

    http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5g2RBEQAPpNMNour8nrK0y8IEYmeQD9BURIEO0
    Clearly the administration is seriously attempting to handle the deficit. This could very well set the stage for a big fight between the Congress and White House, and potential vetos once healthcare gets through.
     
  20. nbs2 macrumors 68030

    nbs2

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    #20
    In talking to Fox, Obama says that too much debt could lead to a secondary recession. So, how much is too much?
     
  21. callmemike20 macrumors 6502a

    callmemike20

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    #21
    Hopefully we will hear his answer in only a few more hours.
     
  22. leekohler macrumors G5

    leekohler

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    #22
    Still waiting for substantial suggestions from conservatives. Breath not being held.
     
  23. bradl macrumors 68040

    bradl

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    #23
    You had it for 6 years. Your lot blew the surplus handed to you within the first 2. 4 years after that, your lot sent us into recession, in which the stimulus your President and Congress failed (he meant for those checks to be spent by the people, not put into savings accounts by the people).

    So 6 out of 8 years, your President and Congress failed on a lot of things. What makes you think that a Red-controlled POTUS and Congress would be better?

    Fail.

    BL.
     
  24. NT1440 macrumors G4

    NT1440

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    #24
    Don't worry, I'm sure cutting taxes will get us out of this jam!
     
  25. jav6454 macrumors P6

    jav6454

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    #25
    Oh look, its this thread and Full of Win
     

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