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Discussion in 'Politics, Religion, Social Issues' started by Pinto, Sep 24, 2003.
a very balanced news source you've found, to be sure.
but nonetheless, the article is disturbing. fighting freedom: the GOP's war on terrorism?
i think a suggestion like that one has a lot of validity, though it's hyperbolic to some extent. the controversy is pretty wild though. did you guys see that hardball with chris matthews takeoff on SNL a few weeks ago, where they had ashcroft arguing for an insane curtailment of freedom and some democrat rep i have never heard of talking about how it's outrageously unjust that ashcroft is taking away the guns of the terrorists, and not letting them call their friends and leaders...
knowing where to draw the line really can be hard, and i don't know how much inflammatory anecdotal argumentation adds to the meat of the argument. i am not siding with the GOP on this, but i'm definitely questioning the counterargument.
shadowfax: "If you bake a cake, that doesn't make you a baker. If you paint a painting, that doesn't make you a painer. But if you blow up ONE embassy, it automatically makes you a terorrist! That's a LITTLE hypocritical!" It was brilliant that they cast John McCain as John Ashcroft...
As for the original post: that's scary. I can't imagine any way in which ANY court can consider the Patriot Act in accordance with the U.S. Constitution. Somebody should file a lawsuit. I'm amazed the ACLU hasn't stepped in yet (if they have, I don't know about it). Not only that, I've heard they're working on another Patriot Act.
"He who is willing to give up essential freedoms for temporary security deserves neither freedom nor security." (sorry if I butchered the quote)
The Patriot Act goes against everything that this country is supposed to stand for. Our founding fathers are rolling over in their graves. I'm not an ultra-liberal type, but this country could use a revolution, and I expect it will come within the next one hundred years. If the rebellion comes from a right attitude (I still consider THAT issue up in the air), I will be more than happy to throw the first stone.
Stories like this make me sick to the stomach. I feel like loading my tiger, comic books, and candy bars into my wagon and heading to Mars.
Joseph McCarthy, thy name is John Ashcroft, and thou art STILL an embarrassment to this country.
hahahaha! YES! it was the best
one of the few good things i have seen on there in a long time....
bottom line is the patriot act sucks and is a joke, they let 20 muhammads- armed with razor blades strip our country of our freedoms. this is ashcrofts police state and we need to get rid of this freedom destroying crap! They turn a blind eye to all the illegals coming in through mexico & canada, they let countless visa's expire with no idea where these people are and then want to strip us of our freedoms under the guise of catching some muhammad whatch you mcallit. Pure crap from Bush/Ashcroft. we need to eliminate the patriot act and start using common sense instead of freedom stripping laws. Bush is spending our tax dollars like there is no tomorrow. I just might go libertarian!
maybe he knows something we don't ;-)
it really sickens me that these abuses are allowed under the patriot act. there is nothing patriotic about destroying more of our freedoms. amazing that it takes billions of dollars just to catch these few muhammad want a be's. Bush's popularity is falling all the time and if he keeps on this spending path he is on he will end up just like his dad. a 1 term president.
I still believe that the Congress as a whole believed that Flight 93 was aimed at the Capitol, not the White House. After all, Congress is a near-permanent job; Presidents come and go, and are far less important in the Grand Scheme Of Things. You should pardon my slightly cynical view of Congress...
Anyhow, the Patriot Act was passed and signed into law by a bunch of scared people. It is set up to protect them and the upper echelons of bureaucrats and appointees. It doesn't do jack squat to protect Joe SixPack beyond past legal methods. (Okay, there are a very few good investigative tools added, but danged few.)
Once you get past Ashcroft's view of the Second Amendment, he and I just never would be able to agree about "security".
those are some very interesting and good points you make desertrat, and you may be right. anyhow our government pretends to do one thing (security) while doing another ( no security & letting illegals into our country every day) meanwhile billions more of our tax dollars up in smoke and our freedoms again being torn down in the name of false security.