What about that?!?

hobie

macrumors member
Original poster
May 27, 2002
64
0
far, far away
Okay fellas,

to put oil in the fire again, it seems that Apple has x86 support since OS X DP 2 or previous:
Check it out here

It still is in Jaguar that you find i386 folders and documents, just make a search. But what makes me even more think of it is the fact that the Developer Tools in Jaguar come with i386 assembler instructions rendered in HTML!!! You can find them in ~Developer/Documentation/Developer Tools/Assembler.

If you have the developer tools installed you can see the Assembler Guide table of contents here

So could you please explain me why the heck Apple includes instructions in their developer tools for a non PPC platform... :rolleyes:
 

al256

macrumors 6502a
Jun 7, 2001
853
240
Re: What about that?!?

iginally posted by hobie [/i]
So could you please explain me why the heck Apple includes instructions in their developer tools for a non PPC platform... :rolleyes: [/QUOTE]

Well, my guess would be that it was something left from the Darwin X86 port. Apple keeps two versions of Darwin X86 and PPC. But after taking a look at that website you mentioned Mac OS DP2 stands for developer preview 2 which was like from 1999 or 2000. That was long ago. You can see in those pictures that there is no Aqua interface in it. Mac OS X Server 1.x didn't have Aqua either I guess, but anyway...

We all know that Marklar exists, but why it exists no one really knows. MOSR.com says Marklar is suppose to be a surprise attack on Windows when satisfaction with Windows drops to a super low. Then when everyone hates Windows so much Apple will sell an X86 version of it's OS. Then ¡WHAM! Apple get lots of $$$ and new followers. I don't know if I buy into all that but hay it just might be true but no one can ever tell with rumors.
 

arn

macrumors god
Staff member
Apr 9, 2001
14,953
2,607
Re: What about that?!?

Okay fellas,

to put oil in the fire again, it seems that Apple has x86 support since OS X DP 2 or previous:
[/QUOTE]

Darwin (Mac OS X's core) compiles and runs on x86

arn
 

hobie

macrumors member
Original poster
May 27, 2002
64
0
far, far away
Re: Re: What about that?!?

Originally posted by al256

Well, my guess would be that it was something left from the Darwin X86 port. Apple keeps two versions of Darwin X86 and PPC. But after taking a look at that website you mentioned Mac OS DP2 stands for developer preview 2 which was like from 1999 or 2000. That was long ago. You can see in those pictures that there is no Aqua interface in it. Mac OS X Server 1.x didn't have Aqua either I guess, but anyway...

We all know that Marklar exists, but why it exists no one really knows. MOSR.com says Marklar is suppose to be a surprise attack on Windows when satisfaction with Windows drops to a super low. Then when everyone hates Windows so much Apple will sell an X86 version of it's OS. Then ¡WHAM! Apple get lots of $$$ and new followers. I don't know if I buy into all that but hay it just might be true but no one can ever tell with rumors. [/B]
Originally posted by arn
Darwin (Mac OS X's core) compiles and runs on x86
I know that it is the Developer's Preview 2, and I know that it's Darwin that runs on x86.
But could you please tell me why there are x86 assembler guides included in TODAY'S developer tools :confused:

I mean, Darwin for x86 is useless on the PPC platform and as such, there should be no need to include any x86 instructions even for Darwin. In my eyes, it is wasted effort when there's no particular purpose behind it!
 

al256

macrumors 6502a
Jun 7, 2001
853
240
Re: Re: Re: What about that?!?

Originally posted by hobie


I mean, Darwin for x86 is useless on the PPC platform and as such, there should be no need to include any x86 instructions even for Darwin. In my eyes, it is wasted effort when there's no particular purpose behind it!
Well, I guess if you look at it that way then it's just a useless limb that lost it's purpose in evolution, but that's why they call it Darwin ;)

Honestly, I don't why it's in there, maybe they just forgot about it?
 

gbojim

macrumors 6502
Jan 30, 2002
353
0
The gcc compiler (the one Apple uses and is included with the dev tools) has a variety of flags that can be used to tune compiled code for various processors including x86. I suspect the docs are there because they are part of the normal gcc doc set.
 

iJon

macrumors 604
Feb 7, 2002
6,564
151
who really knows, i ran developer preview 4 and it was the biggest heap of junk. it was the most weird and messed up thing i had ever used. i think i still have it on cd, i may go install it on my powerbook just to look at this system from 3 or 4 years ago.

iJon
 

FattyMembrane

macrumors 6502a
Apr 14, 2002
966
154
bat country
i've seen screenshots of rhapsody running on intel procesors. rhapsody was origionally going to be released for both x86 and ppc and if you dug around in the "preview" application on 10.0.x, you could find the "preview for yellow box" splash screen. these are all just left-overs from the origional dev previews. osx had been out for a good while before darwin x86 port was complete. apple keeps marklar under lock and key, and it's not like they just accidentally forget to separate the files when the new version of x ships. what we see in osx are just relics from a time when osx was rhapsody and required only a 2gig hard drive and 64 megs of ram, as well as no quartz or any cool features. what apple has planned for the current x86 builds is anyone's guess, but they aren't sloppy enough to give away clues to those who do some digging (ichat features are another story...).
 

iJon

macrumors 604
Feb 7, 2002
6,564
151
I still have DP4. If you guys tell me where to look maybe i can find some of these hidden things you are talkign about. let me know.

iJon
 

bobindashadows

macrumors 6502
Mar 16, 2002
419
0
Originally posted by FattyMembrane
i've seen screenshots of rhapsody running on intel procesors. rhapsody was origionally going to be released for both x86 and ppc and if you dug around in the "preview" application on 10.0.x, you could find the "preview for yellow box" splash screen. these are all just left-overs from the origional dev previews. osx had been out for a good while before darwin x86 port was complete. apple keeps marklar under lock and key, and it's not like they just accidentally forget to separate the files when the new version of x ships. what we see in osx are just relics from a time when osx was rhapsody and required only a 2gig hard drive and 64 megs of ram, as well as no quartz or any cool features. what apple has planned for the current x86 builds is anyone's guess, but they aren't sloppy enough to give away clues to those who do some digging (ichat features are another story...).
:D Fame, notoriety...
Actually I shouldn't say that, after some crackhead at my school ripped off my story and put it on MacNN.com.
I have to buy into what gbojim said about how the gcc compiler (i always thought yacc was a C compiler.. the "yet another compiler compiler") I've found stuff in places I don't rightly remember with some .strings files from the Installer framework, with a list of architectures, including PPC, i386, x86. I doubt that it was anything important though, just remnants.
 

nixd2001

macrumors regular
Aug 21, 2002
179
0
UK
Re: Re: Re: What about that?!?

Originally posted by hobie




I know that it is the Developer's Preview 2, and I know that it's Darwin that runs on x86.
But could you please tell me why there are x86 assembler guides included in TODAY'S developer tools :confused:

I mean, Darwin for x86 is useless on the PPC platform and as such, there should be no need to include any x86 instructions even for Darwin. In my eyes, it is wasted effort when there's no particular purpose behind it!
Maybe it's more effort to take it out? You seem to be implying that the presence has a specific purpose that has been hidden from us. At the Darwin level, myabe it's worth leaving there because it might be of benefit to someone? I think trying to find a purpose is going to be either futile or (ultimately) trivial/dull - vaguely interesting but I wouldn't spend time trying to find an amazing hidden message here.

$0.02
 
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