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Discussion in 'Community' started by Ovi, Nov 9, 2002.
haha. anti americanism is a central principle of "liberals".
you people and your desire to label people. amusing.
then it was a jackass move to use the article to start up a conversation. amazing.
"your people". hahaha. how did you know that i only associate myself with liberals????
your short/narrow sigtedness amazes me still. how everyone has to be clumped together in some category or another. one gang or another.
here's something for you.... i'm pro life, and i voted for the green party. odd combo don't you think?
but no, there's no grey area. no one can be a person first and a political affiliation second.
when you sleep do you put on headphones with people chanting "liberals are bad. they're anti-american. they want to hurt you. liberals are bad."?
you seem to have this telescope that enables you to focus in on one person based purely on a belief or two of theirs (e.g., don't want immediate war with iraq, don't want the difference b/w rich and poor to be so extreme, etc) and label them and probably even determine their entire life story.
after all, you knew so well that alex was still depressed about senator wellstone's death.. truly amazing psychic abilities.
as for how i can think the "liberals" need to get elected (since that's ever so important to you... winning), i actually have no hope for the political system to be honest with you. i don't put enough faith in the current state of humanity to change drastically for the good in my time..
that said, i'm not nearly depressed about it. i just look at people and laugh. hence why it's so easy for me to laugh at this entire thread.
ovi, when you make an arguement, i enjoy it because it is serious and well thought out...you back your points and defend your ideas and are fair expecting good answers
if a liberal gives a good answer, you are always polite and give credit to that person...even if it is something you may not agree with
but that nazi crap that souza is expousing does not deserve a serious answer...it borders on rush/dr laura garbage (wanna hear good conservative commentary then robert novak or george f will are the guys)
souza is the same person who believes there are differnces in race when it comes to intelligence...he believes asians, like him (and me) are inherently the smartest and blacks are of the lowest intelligence
then why did bush appoint colin powell and condoleeza rice? they are black and very republican
i would like to see souza's answer to that one
that's the funny thing... i'm a vegetarian, i don't think that smoking pot is the worst thing someone could do (though i do no drugs, nor drink, etc). i don't think we should drill in alaska. suv's make me want to vomit... etc.. so by all those things, i would probably fit more into the "liberal" mould as it were... but my point is just that, that people aren't just "liberal" or "conservative" and therefore shouldn't be talked about as such. if you want to say "the liberal viewpoint" or whatever, that's at least a bit more reasonable.
as for not caring about the political system, it's not that. it's just that i don't see much hope for it... i do care, i voted. i want to see it changed dramatically, i just don't foresee that happening.
and i don't have advice for democrats because i think it will take a change in humanity to not be driven to just make money, to just buy suvs, to just eat meat and not think about the factory farm system, to not care about the environment, etc....
i don't like politics in the fact that they are politics. but i do care in that i want to see change for the better, and obviously the way to achieve that is through governmental change....
I count myself as a die-hard economic conservative: free market, low taxes, sensible regulation, etc. I am a graduate of UC Berkeley, and while I had a great time in college, I utterly despise the "progressive" political agenda and overall permissiveness of the city that has turned Berkeley into haven for crime and homelessness. The rights of businesses and students are utterly ignored, while the interests of junvinile delinquents and the homeless are constantly championed.
That said, I really hate it when other conservatives can label anyone who questions American policies as "anti-American." If you don't like SUVs, America's right to bomb other nations at will, etc., you're just a nothin' but a dirty commie! Remember folks, dissent is not un-American. The liberal left, despite their idealism/naivete, have raised some genuine concerns about the wisdom another adventure into Iraq.
And about fiscal responsibility: remember that the Republicans are just as guilty of being free spenders as Democrats. And about the recent tax cut our president pushed through that will primarily benefit those in the higher income brackets? What about the repeal of the inheritence tax? Even Warren Buffett, America's most successful entrepreur and richest man, urged Bush not to repeal the inheritence tax on the grounds of basic social equality.
Not necessarily--I should have said low *and* sensible taxes. Anyhow, the Democrats should just wait for the political pendulum to swing the other way and wait for the mood of the country to change. Remember that it took more than a decade for the Republicans to finally take back Congress after the rout of 1932 and 1934. If the economy keeps sputtering along, the Republicans will have a difficult time keeping their majority.
Take a look at the current Democrat-Republican map and you will see what policies each side may have to say to make some gains. The Democrats are very weak in the Deep South and parts of the Midwest: it will have to start standing up for issues important to those folks in those Republican bastions while keeping their predominantly urban constituents happy.
We are in for a double-dip recession, folks. The average consumer is tapped out: what money he didn't lose in the stock market has either gone to pay for his new home or fuel his shopping sprees. Personal household debt is at an all-time high. Corporate spending is still in the toilet. The latest 3Q02 GDP and employment numbers show that while July was a good month for the economy, August and September were extremely weak. Hence the 50 basis points cut by Chairman Greenspan.
While the "huge deficits and gdp numbers are irrelevant for the average consumer," the economic reality will start making its presence felt for the average Joe's pocketbook and paycheck. Our current President's father lost his re-election bid despite having record-high approval ratings from the Gulf War due to the worst US economic recession since the Great Depression.
Bush senior paid the price for the problems that began under his predecessor, while the same thing might happen to Bush junior. So yes, unless the economy starts to turn around and barring another terrorist attack that will make Americans associate patriotism to incumbency, I think the Democrats will have a good 2004 election.
Polls say many things. Perhaps Americans are reluctant to think badly of the party in power during this "War on Terrorism." Perhaps they still realize that the excesses from the late 1990s under a Democratic administration are responsible for their current plight (despite a Republican-controlled legislature). Who knows?
The GDP gains from the first half of 2002 proved to be unsustainable, and as I said, the 3Q GDP figures were somewhat deceptive, given the strong numbers in July. Even weak GDP growth of 1%-2% is not necessarily a good thing.
God damn it! I was so busy in the other thread that I missed this one!
nice try at what?
how exactly do "personal life" and the "political arena" differ? how i feel in my personal life effects how i vote, ie, the political arena.
i hate the democrats and the republicans. so how are they my friends?
i voted green wherever i could and spread the rest of the votes for the smaller elections.
as for the democrats being in trouble... that's what people thought about the republicans before... history's shown that things sway back and forth... joe voter votes democratic.... things don't get better. he votes republican. things don't get better. he votes democrat.. things don't get better... etc. ad nauseam. there are plenty of those that stick to their guns and keep with either party. but obviously the key is those people on the fence.
You realize that most people in America are either Democrats or Republicans?
hmm. you don't say?
i don't look at joe candidate and say "he's a republican, he's out" or "he's a democrat, he's out"... i take em on a case by case thing... for instance, john mccain i find to be quite intelligent and while not perfect, he's got some good ideas. that said, there are few other republicans i feel the same about. same for democrats..
it's not that i hate them for what their chosen party is. i hate the organization that is the reps and dems... the politcal parties themselves. because as a whole they are crooked and all about buying their way to power. there are always exceptions to the rule.
kinda like how not all conservatives spit on the poor and how not all liberals hug trees.