What exactly is the problem with single payer?

Discussion in 'Politics, Religion, Social Issues' started by Chew Toy McCoy, Apr 27, 2017.

  1. Chew Toy McCoy macrumors regular

    Chew Toy McCoy

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    #1
    I have to admit I’m ignorant to the particulars but the only people I see who are against it are politicians who are in the insurance industry's pocket or citizens who don’t think the government should be involved in anything other than keeping their house from burning to the ground, and they might even be mad about that.
     
  2. samcraig macrumors P6

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    #2
    Well clearly you're a socialist ;)
     
  3. poloponies Suspended

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    Political suicide. But that's about it.
     
  4. ibookg409 Suspended

    ibookg409

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    https://www.pacificresearch.org/article/socialized-medicine-a-global-failure/
     
  5. ucfgrad93 macrumors P6

    ucfgrad93

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  6. steve knight macrumors 68020

    steve knight

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  7. ibookg409 Suspended

    ibookg409

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    #7
    Use specifics to refute the study or be quiet. Or conduct your own study.
     
  8. Chew Toy McCoy thread starter macrumors regular

    Chew Toy McCoy

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    How so?

    It’s disturbing how many times “political suicide” gets tied to enacting legislation that a vast majority of people want in poll after poll. All decisions are based on corporations and a handful of loud mouthed crackpots.
    --- Post Merged, Apr 27, 2017 ---

    It’s upsetting how many American ideas other countries have used and improved upon them and we think an idea from another country will only result in the worst case scenario or we will make it worse, or more arrogantly think no other country on earth has good ideas.
     
  9. BeeGood macrumors 68000

    BeeGood

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    The problem is that people imagine that things will work better once our broken federal government (who can barely cobble together a budget each year BTW) comes in and replaces the (admittedly flawed) quasi-market based system we have today.

    The country is on a slow slide to liberalism so I expect we get single payer sooner or later, but I also expect a lot of disappointed people.
     
  10. Chew Toy McCoy thread starter macrumors regular

    Chew Toy McCoy

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    #10

    There we go with the worst case scenario while the majority of people on Medicare and Medicaid really like it. We've really become a country of pessimists and the American dream is now closer to the American nightmare for anybody who actually lives here.
     
  11. BoxerGT2.5 macrumors 68000

    BoxerGT2.5

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    1. US citizens will flip if there are wait times
    2. There WILL be rationing by the government and that's infuriates the right (they'll take rationing by the insurance companies to benefit the shareholders however, but not government).
    3. Our government hasn't show it can be honest and run SS and Medicare, so why hand them a 3rd entitlement program (justifiable concern). If they fail the pain will be greater than anything we've ever endured.
    4. It's never been done with a population of 330+ million people.
     
  12. steve knight macrumors 68020

    steve knight

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    that was not a study you posted just a opinion piece. Now show us stupid people How all other countries that have single payer medicine are worse off the note US. show us how lower income people get worse care then they do in the us. Show us the facts. Show is reports from the actual countries not some americas making claims.

    Koch Brothers Financed 'Research' Institute Steps Up Misleading Obamacare Attacks
     
  13. Huntn macrumors P6

    Huntn

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    #13
    Arguably it's the people who wanted something that backed Trump. This would counter your argument about political suicide. The GOP pays hollow lip service to the idea of a better health plan, but you'd better examine closely what their definition of better means.
     
  14. poloponies Suspended

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    #14
    Follow the money. Voters don't control outcomes anymore (but sweet of you to think that the people still have a voice).
     
  15. BeeGood macrumors 68000

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    Of course they like it. They have no other alternative.

    You can't assume that someone being forced from a private plan to public one will feel the same way.
     
  16. ibookg409 Suspended

    ibookg409

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    #16
    This doesn't refute a single thing Steve. Try again.
     
  17. mikegoldnj macrumors regular

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    #17
  18. bodonnell202 macrumors 65816

    bodonnell202

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    #18
    I'll just preface my comment by saying I am a Canadian and have first hand experienced with the Canadian system.
    This seems to be the same crap that keeps getting spread about medical care in Canada. Sure, people with non emergency issues may need to wait a bit longer to see a specialist. I know people who were diagnosed with cancer who were scheduled to begin radiation and chemotherapy the next day. Those wanting a mole removed may have to wait a few weeks (boo hoo). The reports of people "fleeing" to the US for treatment are mostly people seeking elective or cosmetic surgery.

    I think the single biggest issue with the Canadian single payer system is it gets abused. People with a cold show up at the emergency room expecting prompt treatment (and they can't be turned away, but these people do end up waiting hours to be seen by a doctor since they are seeing patients with real emergency issues), when they should have gone to a walk in clinic, or better yet, the pharmacy to pick up some over the counter cold medication.
     
  19. steve knight macrumors 68020

    steve knight

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    it does not make your study worth the bandwidth it is posted on. I don't think a group paid by people who hate workers rights are going to give us good info on a foreign countries health care. So far I have not seen big complaints about healthcare in Canada but I sure have seen them in the us. If you have a good income in the US healthcare is fine if you don't it is not.
    --- Post Merged, Apr 27, 2017 ---
    we get that in the us too. but it happens because people don't have access to doctors if they don't have insurance.
     
  20. danny_w macrumors 601

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    #20
    We have wait times now, usually 1-2 months to see a doctor, sometimes more. My wife who is Korean always s complains at the long wait times and high costs over here compared to S Korea. I am beginning to think she has a point.

    When even poor countries like Ecuador have arguably better health care, it really does make you wonder.
     
  21. Chew Toy McCoy, Apr 27, 2017
    Last edited: Apr 27, 2017

    Chew Toy McCoy thread starter macrumors regular

    Chew Toy McCoy

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    #21


    Good lord. If people are happy with it they are happy with it. I don’t get this mentality of people are only happy with something because somebody else hasn’t punched a lot of holes in it for them.


    Plus I can only assume Medicare isn’t the only coverage they’ve experienced in their whole life and they know what the difference is.
     
  22. BeeGood macrumors 68000

    BeeGood

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    #22
    Maybe you didn't understand my post. I'll try again another way.

    You have two people, Adam and Bob.

    Adam has a car. Bob does not.

    The government comes in, takes Adam's car away and tells both Bob and Adam to ride the bus.

    Bob is happy because now he has transportation, where before he did not.

    Adam is sad because he no longer has a car and has to ride the bus.

    Does this make sense?
     
  23. BoxerGT2.5 macrumors 68000

    BoxerGT2.5

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    #23
    You have to be seeing a specialist extraordinaire if it takes 1-2 months from the time you call their office to the time you're seen.

    As far as Ecuador, yes everyone knows to bypasses the US and head to Ecuador and their superb healthcare.
     
  24. BeeGood macrumors 68000

    BeeGood

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    I think that would be a bad assumption. Nearly everyone I know who is on Medicare today was on CHIP as a kid.
     
  25. Chew Toy McCoy thread starter macrumors regular

    Chew Toy McCoy

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    #25

    OK, I get what you are saying.

    And to use the same analogy, let’s say the government provides both Adam and Bob with an econo car that will handle most travel needs, but if they need another vehicle and can afford it there’s no reason why they can’t get another vehicle. That also creates a market for better vehicles, just not primary vehicles.
     

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