What's more fascist?

Discussion in 'Politics, Religion, Social Issues' started by 63dot, Jul 31, 2012.

  1. 63dot macrumors 603

    63dot

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    norcal
    #1
    Obamacare or the far right in America?

    I just talked to this nice couple who honestly believe the Democrats and the left of center crowd is pushing a form of socialism on America to the point where they consider it fascist. Though it's not my understanding of the term, it's a widely held belief on the far right (and some in the Tea Party).

    But then there's the far right, some who say they are fighting for "freedom" and others who simply want a more pragmatic approach to things and don't care much about freedom in the sense of a Libertarian definiton, who are accused of being fascist.

    In your opinion, are either of these fascist? And whether they are or not, what exactly is wrong with fasicsm? If fascism offers any good points, what are they?

    Thoughts.
     
  2. mudslag macrumors regular

    mudslag

    Joined:
    Oct 18, 2010
    #2
    Neither, as neither is fascist or fascism. The US is not ruled by a dictatorship and people who cry this are often ignorant and just tend to regurgitate nonsense they hear from other like minded people without trying to understand whats even being said.
     
  3. codymac macrumors 6502

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    Jun 12, 2009
    #3
    It doesn't have anything to do with fascism.

    It's simply the common, pejorative use of the term.
     
  4. 63dot thread starter macrumors 603

    63dot

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    #4
    As the election gets closer, I am sure we will see the Tea Party out there with some signs showing Obama with a Hitler mustache. I do remember back in 2004 when Kerry was running and some overzealous democrats wielded similar signs but with Bush and the Hitler mustache. Tensions run high and what's scary about calling Obama or Bush a Hitler is that there are plenty of people who believe it strongly enough to where that's the only thing bringing them to the polls.

    So now we have a non-American (or at least fake birth certificate) president going against a greedy, corporate 1%-er ready to continue to strip our civil rights and bring us that much closer to totalitarianism. ;)
     
  5. jeremy h macrumors 6502

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    UK
    #5
    I like to think of politics as a clock face.

    At 12 o'clock you have your average, middle of the road person. They're reasonable and try to be decent about most things. They'll take ideas from both left and right according to the issue and to them the end certainly doesn't justify the means.

    As you move around the clock face to either the left or right - opinions strengthen gradually and then move apart. So for example - at 9 I tend to put your average British Labour supporter, on the opposite side (3) I'd put a British Tory. (This is probably the biggest political difference).

    You then progress around the clock downwards. As this happens despite apparently being 'polar opposites' the political views harden on both sides and become more aggressive, so the actions they take and effects it has on 'normal' people (the vast bulk of people who are at 11,12 and 1) move ever closer together. We eventually get to 6 where you've got a jumble of fascists and communists all sat together.

    I like to imagine them all bunched up on 6 and screaming at each other (how much they hate each other and how the world would be a better place without the others in it etc etc) yet they've all journeyed around the clock to end up in the same place with pretty much the same policies.

    The poor chap sat the furthest away at 12 thinks all look equally horrible down there and can't tell them apart anyway.

    You can have great fun putting politicians on the 'clock face' and arguing about where exactly they sit...
     
  6. 63dot, Aug 1, 2012
    Last edited: Aug 1, 2012

    63dot thread starter macrumors 603

    63dot

    Joined:
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    norcal
    #6
    I see it as this way in America, too. While I am Green Party, I probably fall around 10 or 11 am on that clockface, but some compatriots in my same party are so extreme they head down towards that 6 o'clock extreme. While the current democratic president has been here for nearly four years, we have seen the 6 o'clock right wingers who are also out to lunch and are really hard to tell from the extremists from the other side.

    I turn on talk radio and the talk show host not only puts Romney in that top 1% percent but suddenly, though not mentioned before, he's one of the kingpins? Just like George W. Bush, governor of Texas and failed oilman, suddenly became president Bush and oil baron. Though candidate Romney may have financial skeletons in his closet he's no Bernie Madoff.

    Obama, while taking a lot of ideas of Romneycare, is deemed a socialist (but not to be confused with a Stalin or Mao like some conservatives like to paint him) but had Obama ventured the same path and been a republican, Romney would be out praising him on the model. For now, Romney says the model he came up with works for states but not nationally? WTF?

    What you have is an 11 am democrat running against a 1 pm republican. If anything, McCain from 2008 was closer to the 3 pm clockface conservative with the likes of Cain or Santorum being a true 3 pm republican. While I would have liked to have seen Obama rule from more of a 9 or 10 o'clock liberal standpoint, his more towards the center is what got him the votes to get the nomination and election. It should be no surprise that the slow pull out of Iraq and favoritism to Wall Street did not change overnight. The GOP will spin this in their favor hoping most forgot that the costly war was under Bush and that the Wall Street corruption was in place long before Obama.

    Right now, it looks like Romney has the advantage as long as the economy posts current numbers like they are. With social issues and foreign policy issues getting some airplay, it's the economy that decides who wins the White House.
     
  7. quasinormal macrumors 6502a

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    Oct 26, 2007
    Location:
    Sydney, Australia.
    #7
    I reckon that is a brilliant analogy. Thank you.
     

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