Where did Canadian Aboriginal people originate?

Discussion in 'Politics, Religion, Social Issues' started by waloshin, May 8, 2010.

  1. waloshin macrumors 68040

    waloshin

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    #1
    Where did Canadian Aboriginal people originate, and you can't answer Canada. I may live in Canada, but my grandparents dads , dad is from Ukraine, and my mothers mother is from Germany, so where are the Aboriginal people from?

    I've heard they all know , they are taught in there teachings, but are not allowed to tell anyone outside of there tribe.

    Especially the Aboriginal tribes that speak Ojibwe?

    I work with a older Aboriginal lady, and I asked her and she said she doesn't know she just knows they were here first.

    Thanks in advance.
     
  2. TEG macrumors 604

    TEG

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    #2
    Likely the same place as Native Americans, and Mayans/Incas/Aztecs.... Asia.

    TEG
     
  3. Queso macrumors G4

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    #3
    You can't be from Canada. That's part of Earth.
     
  4. waloshin thread starter macrumors 68040

    waloshin

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    Very Spiritual of you.
     
  5. lewis82 macrumors 68000

    lewis82

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    They must come from upper China or eastern Russia, because they had to cross the Bering strait.
     
  6. Peterkro macrumors 68020

    Peterkro

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    #7
    Although this is the most widely held theory it's by no means the only one,trans Pacific and European migration theories also have their followers.
     
  7. TuffLuffJimmy macrumors G3

    TuffLuffJimmy

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  8. Desertrat macrumors newbie

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    #9
    "I've heard they all know , they are taught in there teachings, but are not allowed to tell anyone outside of there tribe."

    waloshin, I can believe a thousand years of verbal history, but not twenty-thousand or more.

    Michener, in his "Hawaii" spoke of Polynesians and their verbal history heritage. But there are limits...

    SFAIK, the archaeologists seem to believe in a high degree of similarity in art and tools from the people of northeastern Asia and the earliest people of northern America. Thus the travel path across what is now the Bering Strait...
     
  9. unid macrumors regular

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    #10
    except for us neanderthals
     
  10. Lord Blackadder macrumors G5

    Lord Blackadder

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    The short answer is Asia, as discussed at length at the Wikipedia link above.

    Anthropologists and linguists believe that some words and stories that are part of our culture today are tens of thousands of years old. Our collective cultural memory is pretty strong. Most major religions and many folk tales are based on stories that are far older, and some of them are essentially cultural artifacts that preserve the memory of natural phenomena observed many thousands of years ago.

    There is as yet no archaeological "smoking gun", and there probably never will be, because all of the archaeological sites that contain such data lie under the ocean as a result of global water levels rising after the ice age ended. But the Bering Strait hypothesis is the most likely. The possibility of prehistoric sea-travelers making it to the Americas can't be completely ruled out, but it is vastly more likely that most of the people native to the Americas came by land across the Bering land bridge. There is enough similarity between the material culture of people in Asia an the Americas to at least make that explanation very plausible.
     
  11. mactastic macrumors 68040

    mactastic

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    #12
    And on that note, I would highly recommend Joseph Campbell's "Hero with a Thousand Faces". Anyone interested in the pervasive nature of the story of the hero's journey across all cultures would find it fascinating.
     
  12. Desertrat macrumors newbie

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    #13
    Thanks, mac.

    "Anthropologists and linguists believe that some words and stories that are part of our culture today are tens of thousands of years old."

    No argument from me on that. My "however" would have more to do with specificity for any one given tirbe to go back all those years. IOW, the accuracy of this remembered history. Adaptation from some other group, e.g.
     
  13. mcrain macrumors 68000

    mcrain

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    #14
  14. rasmasyean macrumors 6502a

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    I would imagine they come from Asia…either through the Bering Straight of the ice age and/or early watercraft near there. Maybe sometime afterward, from the south too because I’ve heard of ancient Chinese artifacts that claim they have discovered “America” a long time ago, but it just didn’t turn into like a “country” until after the European conquest.

    If you think about it, many Indians look more somewhat like Asians…and at least more than Europeans.

    The current believe of the “pigment loss” in humans after they migrated out of Africa was that it basically took 2 branches. The 2 “White people” are actually White and Yellow people. As to why Yellow ppl have mostly all black hair vs. blonde like the Nordic specimens, I have no clue. But that’s the “scientific evidence” that they have concluded.
     
  15. Shotglass macrumors 65816

    Shotglass

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    #16
    Read the Wikipedia article on the Dorset culture and Thule peoples. Very interesting, and it might answer your question in part.
     
  16. snberk103 macrumors 603

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    #17
    Resurrecting an old thread, but I just found it. You heard wrong. Aboriginal People are more than happy to tell you where they are from. They'll tell you that they are from this continent, and have always been here.

    Within the continent there have been some migrations over time of course, and these are recorded in their oral histories. However generally these occurred after contact with Europeans and were either (rarely) voluntary migrations to get away from the encroaching settlers or forced migrations. The forced migrations are what we would call in other parts of the world 'internally displaced persons' or 'internal refugees'. Of course the several First Nations pushed out of the US who then crossed the border into Canada would have been just 'refugees'.

    Cheers
     
  17. mcrain macrumors 68000

    mcrain

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    #18
    I'm from the moon! Does that make it true. Just because they want to say they have always been here doesn't change the fact that the human species originated in the N.E. part of Africa/S.W. Asia and migrated from there in every direction, including over the bering straight (possibly on multiple separate migrations - see link above).

    I'm assuming you have more than, "I'm from here, I really am." to prove that point.
     
  18. snberk103 macrumors 603

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    #19
    The funny thing about archeological evidence on this continent is how often they have to keep revising how far back human occupation dates back. The whole "across the dry land in the Bering Strait" theory is not holding up well as they keep finding artifacts that pre-date the land-bridge.

    They are only just now starting to figure out that they need to do a bunch of marine and terrestrial archeology along the BC Coast. I just read an article a couple of weeks ago about some very early archeological activity around the Hecate Strait (the water between Haida Gwaii and the BC mainland). In one case they identified a village site on the mainland that ranges up and down a slope for 10s of metres. They are just doing initial "shovel" explorations (Eyeball for a likely spot, stick a shovel in ground and see if you find any artifacts.) First shovel, over 200 artifacts. The archeologist said they have never seen a exploratory shovel so rich. This village site ranges up and down the slope, they figure, because it was occupied for 10s of thousands of years and moved with the changing height of the beach. In which case, that village was already occupied when the so called "first migrants" were humping their belongings across the Land Bridge.

    Another team has also been looking at the terrain underwater nearby and found a flat spot near the banks of a (now underwater) salmon river-bed, now under about 30 metres of ocean, iirc. Same idea as the shovel exploration. Locate a likely spot based on your understanding of where people like to live, and drop a dredging bucket and hope find something. First bucket brought a stone knife up. What are the odds that they found a knife that just happened to fall out of a canoe in that spot? Anyway, this site won't be looked at for a long time because it means a marine exploration, in a very stormy and nasty bit of ocean.

    First Nations on the BC coast have been telling us for a hundred years about cataclysmic events. Mountains that exploded and buried villages. Waves that came in from the sea and wash whole communities away. For most of that time we've just thought they were quaint mythologies that were allegorical tales. Then we found the Nisga'a lava beds, and then we found this coast has been inundated by tsunamis every few centuries. When someone took one of the "big wave" stories seriously, they were able to match it to an actual tsunami on January 1, 1700 iirc. This gives us a calibration point within the oral histories of that nation.

    In the next 20 to 50 years the history of human habitation on this continent is going to be rewritten, imho. Actually, in lots of other archeologists opinions too. It's a long, slow process to get a new "theory" in archeology accepted - especially one this fundamental. But the archeologists we know are confident that this theory is about to be rewritten in a major way.

    And finally, I will remind you that until someone took the "myth" of the Trojan Horse seriously, the city of Troy was just a fable. And Israeli archaeologists use the "myths" of the Bible routinely to find real places.

    So... just because you say you are from the moon, doesn't mean you aren't. Which is why I can tell that you don't read SF literature.
     
  19. Zombie Acorn macrumors 65816

    Zombie Acorn

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    #20
    Does it really matter who was here first? Shouldn't we look more at who owns it now?
     
  20. mcrain macrumors 68000

    mcrain

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    #21
    I'd love a source or link to those findings. Not because I doubt you, but because I find it interesting.

    That being said, all of what you wrote doesn't change the fact that the DNA studies are showing a direct lineage between the east Asians and the North Americans. Initially they thought it was a single migration, but now believe the migration might have occurred multiple times over many years. Perhaps it wasn't dry land, but sufficient ice over a long enough period of time. Either way, it's pretty unlikely that homo sapiens didn't evolve from monkeys separately and independently in the new world.

    Perhaps Jesus loaded a big boat full when he came and visited with all the other Mormons.
     
  21. snberk103 macrumors 603

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    #22
    Part of the problem is that a lot of what is happening is still just being talked about over dinner tables and over coffee. Articles can take a year or more to get reviewed and published. I should not that I'm not in the field, but we are friends with a couple of people in the field in our community.

    But.... here is a G&M story that takes several threads and combines them into a story. Though they are still hooked on the "out of Asia" theory. Note the paragraph about humans in Chile up to 15,000 years ago. The thinking is: Chile is a large country, and it's incredibly rugged. While the areas that are suitable for human habitation is quite small (the terrain is too rugged in most of the country) those areas are very difficult to get to, and to explore. They have also just started to scratch the surface of possible archeological sites. So... they thinking is, what are the chance that they have already found the oldest human habited spot? Probability suggests that they will find much older human artifacts as they keep exploring.

    The 1700 tsunami is here. The short version is there was a big subduction 'quake off the Oregon/Washington/BC coast. They can time it because Japan was also hit by the tsunami, and officials noted it in their records. Seems I had the day in January wrong... oh well. This link is interesting. It notes that once researchers stopped looking for "the ground shook" in the oral histories, and started looking at the much more colourful way storytellers presented cataclysmic events (sort of how we created "dragons" and other mythical beasts as way to describe events we couldn't quite understand).

    This link has a bit of oral history recorded in an explorer's diary, from 1864. Note that Neah Bay is the NW corner of Washington, and that Nootka is 200km north on Vancouver Island.

    Here is a link to the Nisga'a oral tradtion. And then the link to the Wikipedia article.

    ------

    I will also self identify and state that I do actually believe that the first 'beings' that eventually became Home Sapiens started in Africa. But... in the last few years there has been several discoveries that have challenged the initial migration theories. There are so called Hobbits in, I forget - Papua New Guinea? The Aborigines of Australia are also not fitting the theories well. Some of the timings for the earliest human artifacts in Asia also don't mesh well with the current "We evolved in Africa, and then a final form migrated out and inhabited the globe." theory.

    My belief (and it is just a belief) is that there have been several waves of advanced "almost" human primates to have emerged from Africa, each wave a little different than the previous wave due to evolution. Over time these waves would have intermingled (different combinations in different places depending on which waves were successful in getting there.) Once the intermingling was complete we had homo sapiens. So, in the Americas several not-quite-yet humans-as-we-know-them groups combined. A similar, but not quite the same, set combined in Asia.

    This is sort of like populating a bunch of islands with different conditions with dogs. Say you took 6 purebred "strains". On each island you put 100 dogs, from just these 6 strains, but on each island you changed the ratios between the strains. In 50 years you would have a new type of dog on each island (in this analogy we would be calling this dog 'The Dog' (like we call ourselves homo sapiens) and the earlier strains the proto-dogs like we call our earlier ancestors 'pro to-humans'.) There would still be a huge range of difference between the dogs, within each island community (not enough time to create a new 'purebred' line) ... and ... the differences between the islands' strains would be noticeable, but really as much as one might think since the initial DNA seeding was the same. If you looked at the 'history' of the DNA on an island where an older bred of dog was more successful, then you might be tempted to say that that island was inhabited first since the other islands had proportionally more dogs with younger DNA. This despite the fact that all the islands were seeded at the same time.

    Using this analogy, I think one can have the Africa theory (where proto-humans evolved) and the "we were always here" theory. Proto-humans came to the Americas in several waves, combined, and became the homo sapiens we know today. But that is just a belief, and I hope to be alive for a very long time to see how my prediction pans out.
     

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