Who believes Trump/Sessions accusation of Obama "starting" MS13?

How much you belive the Trump/Sessions accusation about MS13?

  • 100% accurate, Trump is always right

    Votes: 5 13.9%
  • Mostly correct

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Mostly fiction

    Votes: 1 2.8%
  • Pants on Fire false, fake, wrong

    Votes: 30 83.3%

  • Total voters
    36
  • Poll closed .

PracticalMac

macrumors 68030
Original poster
Jan 22, 2009
2,745
3,710
Houston, TX
Who believes Trump/Sessions accusation Obama of starting MS13?

In the recent Sessions press conference and Trump tweets they blamed the rise of violent gang MS13 on Obama, implying he allowed it to form (newly created) and grow (since recent inception).

I just asking how many astute people here believe those statements before the facts are presented.

Anonymous poll.

(I am not even linking, letting you do your own research.)

----
EDIT: clarification and spelling error fix
 
Last edited:

Chew Toy McCoy

macrumors regular
May 13, 2016
202
2,835
So now Obama is a Hispanic Muslim born in another country. Alright I guess.

You'd think we'd be battling these gangs and cartels south of the border who are probably more a direct threat than terrorists but I guess those countries don't have any resources for us to pillage which is always a minimum prerequisite.
 

Gutwrench

Contributor
Jan 2, 2011
3,921
9,048
Who believes Trump/Sessions accusation Obama of starting MS13?

In the recent Sessions press conference and Trump tweets they blamed the rise of violent gang MS13 on Obama, implying he allowed it to form and glow.

I just asking how many astute people here believe those statements before the facts are presented.

Anonymous poll.

(I am not even linking, letting you do your own research.)

"...Implying he allowed it to form and grow..."

Implying? Is that your description or someone else's?

I'm assuming it's yours (since you cowardly won't support yourself) and it's laughable since MS13 has been around since the late 80's. That's two decades before Obama even took office. I saw them in SF in the mid 90's. Today they're aligned with the Surenos. Get real PracticalMac.
 

JayMysterio

macrumors 6502a
Apr 24, 2010
667
12,085
Rock Ridge, California
MS13 has grown its presence in the US due to Obama sleeping at the wheel, no doubt about that
How does a president reduce the 'presence' of a criminal group?

Have other president's been held liable for the rise of other criminal organizations in the past like you want to hold Obama?

MS13 is a result of refugees from the civil war in El Salvador from 1980 - 1992, are you going to blame the immigration policies or the policing during the runs of those presidents?

Keep in mind during Obama, deportations to El Salvador, Guatemala, & Honduras accounted for almost a third of the total during some years.

It's one thing to blame everything on presidents & quite a few will shoulder it, but it's also a bit unrealistic to blame every negative thing on a president that they had no direct hand in.
 

duffman9000

macrumors 68000
Sep 7, 2003
1,887
5,363
Deep in the Depths of CA
MS13 has grown its presence in the US due to Obama sleeping at the wheel, no doubt about that
Since you don't live here and I doubt you grew up in ground zero where MS started (like I did) what do you know about the gang except whatever right wing news feeds you?

I remember MS and machete going hand in hand in the late 80's.
[doublepost=1492903137][/doublepost]In other news, the bloods and crips have been around through multiple presidencies. To right wing nuts I bet that's Obama's fault too.
 

Zombie Acorn

macrumors 65816
Feb 2, 2009
1,301
9,062
Toronto, Ontario
How does a president reduce the 'presence' of a criminal group?

Have other president's been held liable for the rise of other criminal organizations in the past like you want to hold Obama?

MS13 is a result of refugees from the civil war in El Salvador from 1980 - 1992, are you going to blame the immigration policies or the policing during the runs of those presidents?

Keep in mind during Obama, deportations to El Salvador, Guatemala, & Honduras accounted for almost a third of the total during some years.

It's one thing to blame everything on presidents & quite a few will shoulder it, but it's also a bit unrealistic to blame every negative thing on a president that they had no direct hand in.
Weak borders allowed drugs and people to flow across, hiring thousands of more border staff, building a wall and deporting all of the illegals will take care of quite a bit of this issue.
 

citizenzen

macrumors 65816
Mar 22, 2010
1,433
11,628
"...Implying he allowed it to form and grow..."

Implying? Is that your description or someone else's?

I'm assuming it's yours (since you cowardly won't support yourself) and it's laughable since MS13 has been around since the late 80's. That's two decades before Obama even took office. I saw them in SF in the mid 90's. Today they're aligned with the Surenos. Get real PracticalMac.
o_O Cowardly? Please. Let's not escalate leap to personal attacks so quickly.

From USA Today ...
Later that day, Attorney General Jeff Sessions also cited the MS-13 gang in remarks about efforts to combat transnational criminal organizations, claiming that the gang “now has more than 10,000 members in at least 40 states in this country – up significantly from just a few years ago.” But the FBI has been using the 10,000 estimate for years, as early as 2006.
However, when they tried to verify that claim, they could not find proof of it ...
It’s certainly possible that MS-13 membership has increased either recently or since 2006, but the Justice Department was unable to provide numbers showing that. Nora Scheland in the FBI’s national press office told us in an email that she had “no further data and no year-by-year data that I can provide” beyond the estimate of 10,000 “MS-13 members and associates.”
More ...
Trump claimed that the Obama administration “allowed” MS-13 to “form in cities” across the country, but its origins and spread date back much earlier than Obama’s time as president.
And as usual ...
We asked the White House press office for support for the president’s claim, but we have not received any.
The trump administration: quick to claim, quick to blame ... but not so good at backing it up.
 

Gutwrench

Contributor
Jan 2, 2011
3,921
9,048
o_O Cowardly? Please. Let's not escalate leap to personal attacks so quickly.

From USA Today ...
Hmmm, I hadn't thought describing his post as cowardly was actually a personal attack but of course it is. I apologize.

He chose not to support himself and probably for good reason...he couldn't.

Thanks for the USA link. It was informative but doesn't support the op. But then it probably wasn't your intent.
 
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citizenzen

macrumors 65816
Mar 22, 2010
1,433
11,628
Hmmm, I hadn't thought describing his post as cowardly was actually a personal attack but of course it is. I apologize.

He chose not to support himself and probably for good reason...he couldn't.

Thanks for the USA link. It was informative but doesn't support the op. But then it probably wasn't your intent.
You've compelled me to revisit the OP to see what the issue is here.

And I think I found it ...
... In the recent Sessions press conference and Trump tweets they blamed the rise of violent gang MS13 on Obama, implying he allowed it to form and glow. ...
On this point, I must agree with you Gutwrench. I've seen nothing to indicate that the trump administration believes MS13 to be glowing. Sparkling? Perhaps. But glowing? I see absolutely no evidence for that. Good call on your part.
 

JayMysterio

macrumors 6502a
Apr 24, 2010
667
12,085
Rock Ridge, California
Carter yes, Reagan and Sr no. :p
Sorry, can't work that way. You blame all or none. They were presidents during the rise & formation of MS13 in it's early stages when law enforcement didn't take them to ( compared to the more infamous Bloods, Crips, a few biker gangs, and La eMe ) seriously at the time. Think of it as 'warehouse' blame. You either blame in bulk, or you shop elsewhere, no selective blame here. ;)
 
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MacNut

macrumors Core
Jan 4, 2002
21,544
7,802
CT
Sorry, can't work that way. You blame all or none. They were presidents during the rise & formation of MS13 in it's early stages when law enforcement didn't take them to ( compared to the more infamous Bloods, Crips, a few biker gangs, and La eMe ) seriously at the time. Think of it as 'warehouse' blame. You either blame in bulk, or you shop elsewhere, no selective blame here. ;)
Don't yell at me, I was just speaking for our Zombie friend.