why always blaming Syria for loose border?

Discussion in 'Politics, Religion, Social Issues' started by clevin, Apr 9, 2007.

  1. clevin macrumors G3

    clevin

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    #1
  2. dpaanlka macrumors 601

    dpaanlka

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    #2
    Yes, millions of them will die if they stay in Iraq. Millions.
     
  3. princealfie macrumors 68030

    princealfie

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    #3
    Liebermann is a neg here.

    Never cared for him.

    My Yale LDS ward FHE involved one night of punk'd his backyard. Classic move.
     
  4. skunk macrumors G4

    skunk

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    How can you be so flippant about lives your government has trashed and left in ruins? Don't you understand what has happened here?
    http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/6476907.stm
     
  5. dpaanlka macrumors 601

    dpaanlka

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  6. princealfie macrumors 68030

    princealfie

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    #6
    Wow, inhumane :eek: :eek: :eek: :(
     
  7. skunk macrumors G4

    skunk

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    Work it out for yourself.
     
  8. dpaanlka macrumors 601

    dpaanlka

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    #8
  9. j26 macrumors 65832

    j26

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    Would you rather have your nuts chopped off or your little finger?

    I'm guessing finger, although that doesn't mean chopping your finger off is good ,does it?

    Polls like that are pretty useless - it depends on how the question is asked (and who is asking).
     
  10. dpaanlka macrumors 601

    dpaanlka

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    Well they're not happy with us, but they were even less happy with Saddam. I don't get what you're trying to say. If a million people are fleeing Iraq now (as opposed to under Saddam, who they liked even less), maybe they're just sick of Iraq period and are glad the Saddam-less Iraq affords them the chance to finally get out.
     
  11. skunk macrumors G4

    skunk

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    Well, obviously the poll wasn't taken among the refugees. If you can make the effort to picture the level of perceived threat which would be enough to make you uproot your entire family and go to a neighbouring country for your safety, with no resources whatsoever, you might just realise that figures such as these represent a mind-boggling scale of terror and disruption.
     
  12. princealfie macrumors 68030

    princealfie

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    Sorry but the Times UK is a rather unreliable source of information. I find it rather amusing needless to say.

    The BBC didn't report anything.
     
  13. j26 macrumors 65832

    j26

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    #13
    Or maybe they hated Saddams repression, but were afraid to do anything about it or they'd be killed. Now they face a real risk of being killed anyway and are running in fear of their lives.

    I find it very unlikely that such a large proportion of the population (one in seven people) would simultaneously decide that they're sick of living in a country and decide to head off to a refugee camp, because it's much better :rolleyes: .
     
  14. Swarmlord macrumors 6502a

    Swarmlord

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    #14
    What a great attitude. Nothing is worth sticking around and fixing, just run away somewhere else.

    It seems like some here think that anything including tyranny and slavery is preferable to risking death. Everyone should just cower in their little hovels and be grateful that at least they are alive.:eek:
     
  15. princealfie macrumors 68030

    princealfie

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    Yeah, hiding in my compound here... bunker in South SLC :eek:
     
  16. OldCorpse macrumors 65816

    OldCorpse

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    Actually, there's a much simpler argument to be made, and which I've made to my conservative friends, and it's always shut them up... they had no counterargument.

    The U.S. and Israel always complain about how Syria/Iran or the Palestinian Authority don't do enough to stop terrorist traffic across their borders. Meanwhile, those countries and governments claim that they are doing all they can. So who is right?

    Factually - you cannot know if they are in fact doing all they can to stop terrorist traffic across borders, or in fact encouraging it.

    However, my answer is very simple - the U.S./Israel are liars when they claim that the very fact that there's such traffic constitutes proof that Iran, Syria and other countries are NOT doing all they can to stop such traffic. Why? Here's why:

    If the U.S. thinks it is within the power of the Syrians or Iranians or Palestinians to stop such traffic, they are welcome to show how. THe U.S. in that case is just as guilty of letting terrorists cross the Syrian and Iranian borders as are Syria and Iran - after all, there are two sides to the border. If you think the Syrian/Iranian side can stop traffic - why can't you, on the other side do the same? The U.S. and allied forces have control over their side of the border inside Iraq, just as the Syrians/Iranians have control over theirs. If they are supposed to stop all traffic, why aren't the U.S./UK supposed to do the same on theirs?

    Fact is, terrorists will move across borders if they put their minds to it. The fact that there is traffic MEANS NOTHING wrt. the Syrians/Iranians/Palestinians wanting such traffic. They can do nothing about it. Maybe they do support such traffic, maybe they don't, but don't tell us that they or we, or anybody controls that traffic.

    I don't see the U.S. controlling its own borders, or Israel for that matter. Why the higher standard for Iranians/Syrians/Palestinians? It's like asking the Palestinians to "stop all terror 100%" - how come Israel doesn't stop all terror? After all, it was a Jewish terrorist who killed Rabin! If Israel cannot control Israeli terrorists who kill Israeli high officials within Israeli borders, why do they demand the impossible from Palestinian Authority to control their terrorists 100%?

    Fact is, that the border control issue is another baseless accusation with no proof. Maybe they do, maybe they don't, but we know one thing: the U.S. has zero proof of any Iranian/Syrian complicity in letting terrorists cross their borders. NONE.
     
  17. princealfie macrumors 68030

    princealfie

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    #17
    Wow, why isn't this guy president? Very succinct.
     
  18. Ugg macrumors 68000

    Ugg

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    #18
    Hovels? I didn't realize that Iraq was a third world country?

    Some people think that by invading a mostly defenseless country, dismissing the armed forces, opening the borders to all and sundry, having no post war plan, destroying overnight the infrastructure of a country and failing to provide any security for the vast majority of the citizens, that that is preferable to Saddam?

    What planet to do you live on?
     
  19. zimv20 macrumors 601

    zimv20

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    #19
    when you say things like that, it makes me think you really don't have any idea what's going on in iraq -- how much the situation has deteriorated even in the past year. it's gone from bad to much, much worse.

    i read a piece last night about journalists' experiences, here, which i found very informative.
     
  20. skunk macrumors G4

    skunk

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    #20
    Why don't you go and show us how it's done? Oh, and take your wife and children, too, just for a bit of realism.
     
  21. Swarmlord macrumors 6502a

    Swarmlord

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    #21
    Do you really think that I (or most other Americans for that matter) would just pack up what could fit into our cars and just drive to Mexico or Canada if we were being attacked whether from invaders or roving gangs of malcontents? I don't think so. And to think that one's principles should be compromised because they have a wife and kids makes me sick to my stomach.

    God, what a pathetic country this would be if our forefathers had been as squeemish to do what had to be done to make us what we are today.
     
  22. OldCorpse macrumors 65816

    OldCorpse

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    #23
    There is now a civil war going on in Iraq. It is based on ethnic (Kurd vs Arab) and religious differences (Shiite and Sunni). There is widespread ethnic and religious cleansing and mass killings.

    This did not happen during Saddam's time - there was not Shiite vs Sunni civil war with mass murder.

    So, that's the background to the exodus - mass murder and civil war.

    Why do the "cowards flee instead of staying and fighting?"

    Ask the Jews of WWII - how many wish they had a chance to flee?

    Ask the Jews from the time of Moses who took them out of Egypt.

    Mass killings in a civil war - damn those cowardly Iraqis fleeing death. We destabilized their country, our invasion ushered in the civil war, and when they flee for their lives, they get called cowards by our conservatives. Sounds to me like compassionate conservatism. Typical. Then again, those who support this war and this criminal administration - well what else do you expect? Swell folks, those!
     
  23. skunk macrumors G4

    skunk

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    #24
    As a country which has never suffered an invasion, you have a lot of gall to take such a tone. This is nothing to do with principles. Are you telling me that if there was no work, no security and no future, you would keep your family in harm's way for some idiotic and irrelevant principle? What principle would that be?

    And what are you today?
     
  24. princealfie macrumors 68030

    princealfie

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    #25
    The principle of free markets I suppose for Mr. SL.
     

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