why do people do things like this?

Discussion in 'Politics, Religion, Social Issues' started by Leareth, Nov 10, 2009.

  1. Leareth macrumors 68000


    Nov 11, 2004
    little background- part of my job enables to work with community youth shelters and organizations. One of them aimed at street and at risk youth under 24 providing health services, food, showers and emergency shelter. this one had an interesting situation;

    one of the health volunteers , who is Catholic , was using a needle (sterilized one ironically) to poke holes through the condoms they were handing out , so it does not prevent possibility of conception because the Church says that 'condoms are immoral' and is 'the duty of everyone to have children'
    the fact that is essentially eliminated the barrier to STD's was of no concern to her.

    the organization let her go as a volunteer.
    I personally would have gotten criminal charges against her.
    the fact she intentionally did this to already at risk youth is unbelievable.
    especially when the youth WERE trying to reduce their risks.
    I am furious right now.
    Why would a person do such a thing when the organization is non-religious, non partisan and really trying to BETTER lives of kids.
    if your beliefs conflict with the mandate of the organization, don't volunteer there.
  2. jmann macrumors 604


    Dec 8, 2007
    bump on a log in a hole in the bottom of the sea
    That is awful. I hope for the teens sake that they used different condoms, or that they still worked.. :(
  3. leekohler macrumors G5


    Dec 22, 2004
    Chicago, Illinois
    Charges should have indeed been filed. She was not only risking pregnancy for these kids, but also disease. That is disgusting.
  4. ucfgrad93 macrumors P6


    Aug 17, 2007
    Wow, that really is inexcusable. I agree, that she should have been charged. It is idiots like this that give people of faith bad names.

    You hit the nail on the head with your last sentence. That volunteer should have gone to work for Catholic Charities.
  5. DarkHeraldMage macrumors 6502a


    Oct 5, 2007
    Fort Worth, TX
    Without straying too far from topic (since technically it applies), this is what many religious people do. Now before everyone grabs their pitchforks, I am religious as well and hold to certain beliefs, but I would never force those upon someone else.

    But this is what various religions are doing in the US political system. So it's a bigger problem than just this shelter, these people are going out and "volunteering" or lobbying for things they believe, that has nothing to do with the people they're affecting with their actions.

    Yes, charges should've been brought against her. I think that needs to happen more often in more situations as well. I'm tired of someone else's religion being used against me when I didn't ask for it. Those kids didn't ask for it either.
  6. richard.mac macrumors 603


    Feb 2, 2007
    51.50024, -0.12662
    not only diseases, but by doing this you are purposely bringing children into the world when there are already too many that are poor and suffering. as a Christian, it doesnt sound very Christian to me.
  7. Macaddicttt macrumors 6502a


    Apr 22, 2004
    San Diego, CA
    As a Catholic opposed to birth control, I think she did a horrible thing. She obviously doesn't quite understand the theology behind the Church's teachings. She must be ignorant beyond belief, and should be prosecuted criminally for what she did.
  8. Ttownbeast macrumors 65816

    May 10, 2009
    I am reminded of the Python flick with the nuns singing "every sperm is sacred"
  9. barkomatic macrumors 68040

    Aug 8, 2008
    There is nothing stopping you from alerting the media to this. People like her need to be exposed. She could easily find her way to another program and continue poking holes in condoms--thus spreading HIV.
  10. rasmasyean macrumors 6502a

    Jul 11, 2008
    Religion in general is a dying philosophy especially among more advanced civilizations. It doesn’t have as much impact on people as it used to. So one thing that zealots do, is try to impose their beliefs on others because not as many people “willingly” follow their faith…not to mention following an alternate faith. So when they have this need for “community” (which causes them to be religious in the first place), they can justify their actions by doing the “work of god” or whatever. To them, it isn’t “wrong”. It’s everyone else who doesn’t follow their faith that is wrong, and perhaps they look for opportunities to “correct” this…and in your case, in some “spy-infiltration-like way” for lack of a better analogy.

    As for the STD-risk, from a certain point of view, it may not be so bad. Because if you consider that people will give birth to children, assuming most won’t be AIDS children, then you have successfully sprung part of the next generation, albeit sacrificing a few existing people to AIDS. After-all, this can be justified as god choosing who to kill in a “natural” way. Unfortunately however, youth pregnancy and poverty often coincide and these people then often become a burden on the welfare system and cause a whole bunch of other social problems. Of course AIDS causes it's fair share of social problems too, but when does it balance out the need for more children? Do these zealots do the math beforehand? Or they just don't care? hmmm...
  11. jav6454 macrumors P6


    Nov 14, 2007
    1 Geostationary Tower Plaza
    Ok, one thing is to parade and make giant protests against condoms, but a totally wrong, awful, deceiving and tyrannical way is to poke holes on condoms with a needle and handing them out.

    People are confident said condoms are legit, but with holes in them a myriad of STDs can go thru, not to mention the unwanted pregnancy in many cases.
  12. yg17 macrumors G5


    Aug 1, 2004
    St. Louis, MO
    So let's see, you can either give people unaltered condoms and no unwanted pregnancies take place, or you can poke holes in them, and unwanted pregnancies will happen, possibly leading to abortions which you don't like either :rolleyes:

    Clearly this moron isn't all there in the head.

    And I'd report her to the police as well, IMO, she is personally responsible if someone gets an STD by using one of those condoms.
  13. VideoFreek macrumors 6502


    May 12, 2007
    I'm very sorry to hear of this. I have a few comments:

    1) I do think you need to go public with this story. It will no doubt be embarrassing for your organization, but I believe you have a moral obligation to inform your clients that they may be at risk and, depending on their personal circumstances, should consider having themselves tested for STDs. If you can determine the timeframe during which this crime was perpetrated, this would help people decide if they might be at-risk.

    2) She should be publicly "outed" and criminally charged, if only to stop her from repeating this elsewhere, and to serve as a deterrent to other deranged idiots.

    3) As a Catholic, I can assure you that her actions are NOT in line with Church teaching and must be condemned in the strongest possible terms. She has not only committed a crime, she has committed a grave sin (immoral act)--it is NEVER OK to intentionally put another human being in harm's way. It is sad that her ignorant, distorted understanding of Church doctrine has led her to this depraved act. I can only pray that she hasn't hurt anybody. PLEASE act so that she is brought to justice.
  14. Zombie Acorn macrumors 65816

    Zombie Acorn

    Feb 2, 2009
    Toronto, Ontario
    What charges would be possible? Some sort of product tampering?

    If I saw the lady doing that I would be beyond pissed off
  15. IntheNet macrumors regular


    Oct 6, 2009
    Any independent verification of this story in Vancouver newspapers? Seems like something someone might invent to tar someone or some organization...
  16. Tomorrow macrumors 604


    Mar 2, 2008
    Always a day away
    Seems to me that the logical solution for resolving this with her beliefs would be to not work there, or at least request a different assignment.

    The fact that she remained on staff, in the role of passing out condoms, and still poked them full of holes suggests to me that her entire motive was a sabotage of sorts.

    I'm not a lawyer, but that sounds like criminal negligence to me, at the very least.
  17. mkrishnan Moderator emeritus


    Jan 9, 2004
    Grand Rapids, MI, USA
    I guess arguably reckless endangerment of human life? At least in some jurisdictions it's a crime to knowingly set in motion a chain of events that will cause someone else to be injured or die (different degrees of the crime). Arguably such a person knows that the consequences include a fair likelihood that someone will contract HIV -- a currently incurable disease -- or another illness that could shorten their life. I don't know if BC has a similar law?

    Arguably it's an act of terrorism, too. :rolleyes:

    Anyway, wow.
  18. XNine macrumors 68040


    Apr 7, 2005
    Why are you wearing that stupid man suit?

    If this story is indeed true, you need to publicly disgrace this woman so she never finds work in this kind of business again (volunteer or otherwise). She's a menace to those she's supposed to be helping, and those that have intimate relationships with those people.
  19. 63dot macrumors 603


    Jun 12, 2006
  20. AP_piano295 macrumors 65816

    Mar 9, 2005
    I would also reccomend this...I would hate for here to move on to another organization and continue this life threatening behavior.
  21. Leareth thread starter macrumors 68000


    Nov 11, 2004
    let me clarify
    it is not my organization
    I work with them on somewhat related issues.

    I am NOT member of their board/committee/council and have no say in how they run they organization.
    and what their policies toward volunteer issues like these are.

    they get enough flak from the public by running a shelter for street youth , all of whom are essentially 'criminals' , majority are drug users/dealer and some prostitute themselves.

    I bet there would be public praise for this woman's deeds of getting rid of the 'parasites' (that is quote from a protestor of the place).
  22. rasmasyean macrumors 6502a

    Jul 11, 2008
    In that case, maybe they felt it wouldn't make a difference even if they said something. I can see some law enforcement people might not even bother and just look the other way.
  23. XNine macrumors 68040


    Apr 7, 2005
    Why are you wearing that stupid man suit?
    It doesn't matter. As a witness to this, you are obligated to inform the public of the dangers this woman presents. I'm unsure if the laws work the same where you live, but witnesses who don't take any action to deter or stop a crime is considered a crime in the States.

    And I can guarantee that sabotaging condoms is a crime if someone gets a serious STD from it.

    There was a woman here in Colorado that was a nurse, A NURSE, who spread Hepatitis because she was addicted to intravenous drugs, and she was doping up on patient's meds on the job, filling the syringes back up with saline, and putting them back in the cabinets after using them. Of course, the first Hospital didn't raise a public fuss about it, so she went on to another and infected more people. UP TO 6,000 PEOPLE may be infected because of her.

    Stop this woman.
  24. rasmasyean macrumors 6502a

    Jul 11, 2008
    The world ain’t so black and white and you can’t always assume it’s really clear what “the right thing” is. For example, maybe the committee doesn’t want to expose more reasons of doubt to people who think this is a lost cause. Maybe they will lose funds and be deemed a failure and have to shut down entirely and not be able to hand out ANY condoms at all. There are many political considerations you have to consider and ramifications that come from decisions potentially can have a large impact that wasn’t your original intention.
  25. VideoFreek macrumors 6502


    May 12, 2007
    Fair likelihood? Depends on how many "holy condoms" were passed out. We ought to inject some scientific fact here to quell hysteria. The good news here is that the risk for an individual to contract HIV as a result of this sabotage is quite low. The per-incidence infection rate for having sex with an infected person ranges from 5-10 per 10,000 for vaginal intercourse, up to 50 per 10,000 (0.5%) for receptive anal intercourse. Of course, if a person is already infected with another STD, the infection rates can be 5-10 times higher due to the presence of genital lesions. But overall, HIV just doesn't pass THAT easily between humans, thank God. If it did, with an average 2-3% breakage rate for condoms, the HIV epidemic would be completely out of control.

    Much more likely is transmission of chlamydia, gonorrhea, herpes, etc. While nasty, these needn't be life-threatening.

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