Wisconsin Recall of Scott Walker

Discussion in 'Politics, Religion, Social Issues' started by basesloaded190, Jun 4, 2012.

  1. basesloaded190 macrumors 68030

    basesloaded190

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    #1
    I am probably sure people have been hearing about this on a National level, but the Recall for Governor Scott Walker will take place this week. The WSJ had a decent overview of the recall for those who don't know the entire story.

    I am curious as to what those of you from either Wisconsin or outside of the state feel about this.

    http://online.wsj.com/article/SB100...7438304188861694.html?mod=WSJ_Opinion_LEADTop
     
  2. citizenzen macrumors 65816

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    #2
    I sure hope so.
     
  3. leekohler, Jun 4, 2012
    Last edited: Jun 4, 2012

    leekohler macrumors G5

    leekohler

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    #3
    Walker should be ashamed of what he did. Has he taken a huge cut in pay himself, maybe I'd have some respect for him. Something tells me people will be dumb enough to retain him though.
     
  4. basesloaded190 thread starter macrumors 68030

    basesloaded190

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  5. Ugg macrumors 68000

    Ugg

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    #5
    I live in California.

    Wisconsin has traditionally been a progressive state, especially in regards to labor. Scott has demonized unions, refused federal rail funding while pushing for increased federal highway spending and generally been a slave to arch conservative corporate interests.

    I admire the recall effort and I hope they succeed. People like Scott want to destroy America and the sooner they are out of office, the better.
     
  6. Huntn macrumors G5

    Huntn

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    #6
    Why don't you reveal your thoughts on this subject? Since you know about it, I guess you have an opinion?

    Good luck to you (liberal) Wisconsinites! I have my fingers crossed but am not hopeful he will be recalled, because ultimately I am a pessimist.
     
  7. mcrain macrumors 68000

    mcrain

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    Location:
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    #7
    As a candidate, he did not run on this plan to demonize state workers. He promised job creation and tax cuts. What he did was cut huge amounts of taxes for large corporations which created a fiscal deficit. He then used that fiscal deficit in order to strong arm legislation that undermined contracts between the state and its workers.

    Regardless of how you feel about unions, taxes, etc... the guy flat out manipulated the voting public in order to jam through an agenda they did NOT know he planned on implementing.

    That's shady.

    He may keep his job, but it will be because of money and the amount of time that has passed.
     
  8. Huntn macrumors G5

    Huntn

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    #8
    The entire approach of the Gov/GOP in Wisconsin has been one of outright deceit. Saying one thing and meaning something else. Taking a XXX dollars in concessions from unions and instead of applying it to the Wisconsin budgetary problems, turning around and giving XXX dollars in business tax breaks while executing a deliberate effort to eradicate public unions.
     
  9. basesloaded190 thread starter macrumors 68030

    basesloaded190

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    #9
    I will probably get grief for this, but as you can imagine I think Wisconsin is better with Walker in office. He made a lot of tough decisions that others wouldn't have been able to make. Taxes weren't raised and the state is finally getting itself out of the hole they had dug themselves into. Collective bargaining needed to go. Jobs have been created and Wisconsin unemployment is lower now than it was a year ago.

    Those are my reasons for supporting Walker
     
  10. citizenzen macrumors 65816

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    #10
    Why did collective bargaining need to go?

    Disclosure: I am a California state worker and a member of a union.
     
  11. leekohler macrumors G5

    leekohler

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    #11
    Really? It looks like Wisconsin is simply following national trends.

    http://www.politifact.com/wisconsin/promises/walk-o-meter/promise/526/create-250000-new-jobs/
     
  12. Huntn macrumors G5

    Huntn

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    #12
    Which jobs have been created due to Walker's actions? And are they relatively good jobs?

    Why did collective bargaining need to go?

    Do you know why unions have existed? Not implying you don't know, but wondering what your basis is for disliking collective bargaining? I've spent the last 25 years in a union and I understand it gives individuals some power, not much, but some to control the terms of their employment. And unions represent the only entity that is looking out for worker's rights, other than the government when it decides it wants to. Are unions perfect? Not by a long shot, but neither is management. They balance each other out.
     
  13. rdowns macrumors Penryn

    rdowns

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    #13

    Did he really create any jobs?

    http://www.jsonline.com/news/wiscon...-to-create-jobs-number-fe5ht47-153791995.html
     
  14. basesloaded190 thread starter macrumors 68030

    basesloaded190

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    #14
    The little ( and I emphasize little) knowledge I have on unions and how they have worked for people in Wisconsin have come through my mom who has been a member of the teachers union for 20+ years. The benefits that they had were unbelievable, and she admitted to that. State tax payers are the one's paying for those. Teachers were contributing very little to these benefits (health insurance). Now they will be able to shop around and find better/ and or cheaper plans. Sure they will have to contribute more than they did before, but my mother agrees that they should have been in the first place.


    If I am way out of line hear, please by all means let me know. Again this what I have gathered on the subject.
     
  15. mcrain macrumors 68000

    mcrain

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    #15
    So, the teachers who negotiated for those fantastic benefits also agreed to be paid a whole heck of a lot less so that they would get those benefits. Do you understand that compensation is what they receive for what they do, and while the benefits are tremendous, that is because that was what they negotiated for; in lieu of salary.

    Some people just don't get it.
     
  16. basesloaded190 thread starter macrumors 68030

    basesloaded190

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    #16
    Compared to what?
     
  17. Huntn macrumors G5

    Huntn

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    #17
    I'm the first to admit that some unions have gone overboard. They are composed of people just like the people in the Wisconsin statehouse who want to disenfranchise union members, who are not perfect either.

    As far as benefits, those are usually accounted for as part of a union members compensation. They are not freebies. When State revenues are low, unions have to agree to adjustments in their salaries. What I've read indicates they were more than willing to make adjustments and offered up millions in concessions. It appears that conservative law members involved didn't want to be in a position where they had to negotiate. They much prefer to dictate.
     
  18. mcrain macrumors 68000

    mcrain

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    #18
    Compared to what they would have received during negotiations had they NOT received those benefits.

    When a contract expires, the parties sit down and talk about what it will take to renew the contract. Let's use Drew Breese as an example. He wants more money, but the team doesn't want to give him as much. That's common. The team can hire someone else, but if you have seen how that works in football, like the education system, it's a mess best avoided. Anyway, often times teams will offer a player less money, but give incentives, like bonuses for making it to the superbowl, leading the league in touchdowns, yards, etc... Those "bonuses" are in lieu of the salary that the player was demanding. If the player signs the contract, and the team later decides not to give the bonuses that were earned, do you think that's ok, because if you do, then that's the same thing as Scott Walker (and the entire GOPs platform of screwing over state and federal employees).
     
  19. rdowns macrumors Penryn

    rdowns

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    #19
    So, let's say that's all true and unions werre able to negotiate themselves excellent benefits; benefits that Wisconsin can no longer afford to pay. How do we get from there to doing away with collective bargaining?
     
  20. mcrain macrumors 68000

    mcrain

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    #20
    The simple answer is that if you look at the top organizational donors, all but two or three donate primarily to the GOP. The others are unions. The argument is that they can't afford the benefits, but the reality is that they intentionally underfunded the pension plans and then awarded massive tax breaks to businesses to create the fiscal "crisis" so they could use it to break an opponent.

    Similarly, the argument for election reform is to protect against election fraud, while the reality is they want to prevent or make it more difficult for democrat to vote.
     
  21. rdowns macrumors Penryn

    rdowns

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    #21
    Oh my.




    http://www.wisdems.org/news/press/view/2012-06-breaking-scott-walkers-closest-aide-revealed-in-cour
     
  22. citizenzen macrumors 65816

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    #22
    Exactly.

    Unions like mine have made concessions in order to accommodate struggling companies or governments. We're not intractable.

    ----------

    Hah-hah.
     
  23. ericrwalker macrumors 68030

    ericrwalker

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    #23
    I've been a big fan of Scott Walker since late 2010. I think he's doing a good job of bringing about real hope and change.
     
  24. Huntn macrumors G5

    Huntn

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    #25
    Holy Shinola! You think this will make any difference to GOP voters in the state? Not a bit. Hopefully it motivates some of the fence sitters if any exist in that State.
     

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