Mac Pro Front Panel Board Mod!!!!

[All Taken]

I was looking at the front panel board and wondering if it's at all possible to modify it with a new board that has a eSata connection?

Seems the part is a single board that connects to the rest of the system via cable? Currently it has firewire and USB ports so to me it is at least possible, anyone got some insight?

I know you can add PCI-e Sata cards etc but i'm curious.

[Transporteur]

If you really want it (what would pretty much destroy the resale value of the machine), cut a hole in the front and use a standard SATA to eSATA cable like this: (minus the slot cover of course ;))

http://www.muchtech.com/productImages/CB-eSATA-ES1P.gif

[All Taken]

Oh come on lol, you can do better than that. :p

Is the system capable of having a esata port connect via that front board connector?

If it could be mocked up on a new board that connects and fits in the same way as the existing system could it be done? Put all the alternatives out of the answers.

[nanofrog]

Oh come on lol, you can do better than that. :p

Is the system capable of having a esata port connect via that front board connector?

If it could be mocked up on a new board that connects and fits in the same way as the existing system could it be done? Put all the alternatives out of the answers.
You have the tools and skills to design and make PCBs?

If not, the easiest thing to do, is use what Transporteur linked. Unscrew it from the PCI bracket, use the hole to pencil the opening and screw holes on the case, and get out a Dremel to cut away the aluminum. Then screw it down (might want to get different screws of some kind, such as flush mounts or Button type Torx for example).

Finally, attach the SATA end to an available port. If you don't have one, get a SATA card (here (http://cgi.ebay.com/4-Port-ESATA-SATA-II-PCI-E-PCI-Express-Card-SIL3132-/190391554821?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2c54389305) as it's the only card that's selectable on the ports, and the seller will ship internationally; just understand if you use this, it cannot boot OS X, only work via drivers here (http://www.siliconimage.com/support/searchresults.aspx?pid=32&cat=3&os=3)).

[mjsmke]

I know you said no alternatives but why not just run a lead from the back of the Mac and plug it into your external devices? Surly this is simpler and safer. Also think about when/if you sell the Mac Pro...... I wouldn't want to buy a Mac with a modification like that.

[4JNA]

i have no use for the connector up front.

if i did, i would remove the bottom optical drive, drop the cover/door, and use a matching piece of aluminum with the port and power connector machined in. lots of room for other connectors if you needed more.

when you go to sell it, remove the cables/panel, let the optical door go back up, no problem. best of luck.

[All Taken]

Thanks for the replies, I already run a PCI-e Sata card and was only interested in the possibility, would the Back Board support a SATA connection on that front panel board or would it need to be a modified USB to SATA connection? If someone were to use the Data pin out would you get full a full 'SATA 3' header?

I really don't have plans to dremel my Mac Pro at any point, I was just curious ;)

[goMac]

As others have pointed out, you'd need to design your own custom board. So unless you have the tools to design + produce that...

[All Taken]

I don't have the tools to do this, let me make it very very very clear: I have no plans to do it yet I am very curious to find out if it is possible. Can you replace one of the firewire or usb headers for a sata port and gain a full SATA 3GB/s interface?

[goMac]

I don't have the tools to do this, let me make it very very very clear: I have no plans to do it yet I am very curious to find out if it is possible. Can you replace one of the firewire or usb headers for a sata port and gain a full SATA 3GB/s interface?

Sure, if you alter the board to have the right connectors, and you alter the front panel to have the right connectors.

Headers aren't universal, you can't just swap one kind of header for another. It requires replacing connections.

[DoFoT9]

i have no use for the connector up front.

if i did, i would remove the bottom optical drive, drop the cover/door, and use a matching piece of aluminum with the port and power connector machined in. lots of room for other connectors if you needed more.

when you go to sell it, remove the cables/panel, let the optical door go back up, no problem. best of luck.
i think this is the best advise - the most logical anyway. :D

[nanofrog]

I don't have the tools to do this, let me make it very very very clear: I have no plans to do it yet I am very curious to find out if it is possible. Can you replace one of the firewire or usb headers for a sata port and gain a full SATA 3GB/s interface?
There's no direct swap.

You could try to mod a USB to eSATA bridge device to get it to work (example (http://www.sunsky-online.com/view/6734/USB+to+ESATA+%26+SATA+Bridge+Adapter.htm); looks to be the easiest version), but it won't do what you want as-is (mod it via a cable to attach it to a USB header, and you have to find a way to mount it).

[goMac]

There's no direct swap.

You could try to mod a USB to eSATA bridge device to get it to work (example (http://www.sunsky-online.com/view/6734/USB+to+ESATA+%26+SATA+Bridge+Adapter.htm); looks to be the easiest version), but it won't do what you want as-is (mod it via a cable to attach it to a USB header, and you have to find a way to mount it).

Of course if you're using a bridge device, what's the point of esata? Might as well use a USB2 connection.

[DoFoT9]

There's no direct swap.

You could try to mod a USB to eSATA bridge device to get it to work (example (http://www.sunsky-online.com/view/6734/USB+to+ESATA+%26+SATA+Bridge+Adapter.htm); looks to be the easiest version), but it won't do what you want as-is (mod it via a cable to attach it to a USB header, and you have to find a way to mount it).
speaking of eSata - do you think apple will ever adopt it? or jump straight to LP or similar? (fw3200?).

[nanofrog]

Of course if you're using a bridge device, what's the point of esata? Might as well use a USB2 connection.

speaking of eSata - do you think apple will ever adopt it? or jump straight to LP or similar? (fw3200?).
I realize that. But there's no choice given the way the question and information's been posted from the OP.

He'd need to be able to make a custom board. Past that, the device Transporteur posted would be the best, and easiest solution (just mod the case, and attach the cable to a SATA port; no PCB work).

[DoFoT9]

I realize that. But there's no choice given the way the question and information's been posted from the OP.

i dont think you were meant to quote me in that reply :p

[nanofrog]

i dont think you were meant to quote me in that reply :p
Oops. :o

To answer your original question, No, I don't think so, as they've had ample opportunity to do so already, and there's still no eSATA port available. They're too cheap I think, as they'd need to add in a separate controller (without sacrificing the current bay configuration in order to get a port).

[DoFoT9]

Oops. :o

To answer your original question, No, I don't think so, as they've had ample opportunity to do so already, and there's still no eSATA port available. They're too cheap I think, as they'd need to add in a separate controller (without sacrificing the current bay configuration in order to get a port).
so basically (for the MP at least) it would require a complete redesign - especially if it takes out 1HDD capability internally.

for the iMac/MBP i would have assumed it critical - obviously not.

[nanofrog]

so basically (for the MP at least) it would require a complete redesign - especially if it takes out 1HDD capability internally.
Pretty much. They had the option of dumping the 2nd optical bay for an eSATA port, or adding in an additional SATA controller. The former would likely generate a lot of complaints, and the latter cost more, cutting into the margins a bit. And we know how Apple likes their margins... :eek: :p

for the iMac/MBP i would have assumed it critical - obviously not.
It seems they expect users to use USB or FW to get the job done (those with no choice, as there's no Express slot), and those that do have one will go buy a card if they're that determined to have eSATA.

[DoFoT9]

Pretty much. They had the option of dumping the 2nd optical bay for an eSATA port, or adding in an additional SATA controller. The former would likely generate a lot of complaints, and the latter cost more, cutting into the margins a bit. And we know how Apple likes their margins... :eek: :p
thats what i was going to say - FireWire would give apple good margins of profits etc, why would they change for a few extra MB and customer happiness? :rolleyes:

It seems they expect users to use USB or FW to get the job done (those with no choice, as there's no Express slot), and those that do have one will go buy a card if they're that determined to have eSATA.
a good alternative yes, Express slots are only available for the 17" MBP now though IIRC? it would be much easier to pull that out and put in an eSata slot you would think.. but then again we circluate back to Apple "values" hehe.

eSata is not as popular as USB, so i guess they will stick with USB whilst its the "champion".

[goMac]

Or they could wait another revision (hopefully) and support eSata via Lightpeak.

[nanofrog]

eSata is not as popular as USB, so i guess they will stick with USB whilst its the "champion".
USB is included in the ICH, so there's no additional funds necessary. They do pay to add the FW chip (not included in the ICH), but that's based on previous decisions over adopting FW (they did have a hand in developing it).

Or they could wait another revision (hopefully) and support eSata via Lightpeak.
I suspect this will be what happens.

But it will mean either new enclosures (includes the SATA to LP bridge chip), or some separate bridge device between the disk and LP signal (single port or a hub) with existing eSATA disks/enclosures.

[DoFoT9]

USB is included in the ICH, so there's no additional funds necessary. They do pay to add the FW chip (not included in the ICH), but that's based on previous decisions over adopting FW (they did have a hand in developing it).
well of course they would use firewire as they helped to make it, publicity and discounts etc.


But it will mean either new enclosures (includes the SATA to LP bridge chip), or some separate bridge device between the disk and LP signal (single port or a hub) with existing eSATA disks/enclosures.
light peak to esata cable converter with a terminating/converting device inside it for the change in signal? :D

[nanofrog]

light peak to esata cable converter with a terminating/converting device inside it for the change in signal? :D
Something like that. Or a Hub (think 5 port USB), but it would have a single LP port to the system, and say 5x eSATA ports to attach to enclosures.

[DoFoT9]

Something like that. Or a Hub (think 5 port USB), but it would have a single LP port to the system, and say 5x eSATA ports to attach to enclosures.

Agh that makes sense. Kind of clutzy I guess but it will work nicely.

LP will work just like a container for existing protocols from what I understand, on what layer does it run? (physical)?

[nanofrog]

Agh that makes sense. Kind of clutzy I guess but it will work nicely.
They'll have to make devices like this so users can use what they already have, and current products at the time of LP's release could be used as well.

If they didn't, users would get upset having to replace existing equipment, and products would have to wait for the next revision in order to add an LP chip to the design. Both would negatively affect profits and the adoption rate.

Clunky, clumsy, whatever, it will be better for them to go with devices like this so users can take advantage of the tech with what they already have. Wet their appetite as it were, and once the LP equiped products release, they'll be more willing to buy.


LP will work just like a container for existing protocols from what I understand, on what layer does it run? (physical)?
It uses protocol translation (software) on the system side (send to a device), and a bridge chip to convert the original protocol into an LP signal (device to LP port in the system).

Since LP uses a Quality of Service (QoS) implementation, it has a protocol as well (not just hardware), so the way they've advertised it isn't actually correct (no matter how simple an implementation it may be).