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hellomoto4
May 31, 2011, 09:46 AM
So today we learnt that Lion is definitely being "unveiled" at WWDC 2011:
Apple CEO Steve Jobs and a team of Apple executives will kick off the company's annual Worldwide Developers Conference (WWDC) with a keynote address on Monday, June 6 at 10:00 a.m. At the keynote, Apple will unveil its next generation software - Lion, the eighth major release of Mac OS X; iOS 5, the next version of Apples advanced mobile operating system which powers the iPad, iPhone and iPod touch; and iCloud, Apple's upcoming cloud services offering.

However, I'm here to say now to all those that are hoping for a release:
Unless Apple is hiding something from devs, Lion will not be released next week. There's simply too many bugs and unpolished features.

Not a whole lot of point to this thread, just pointing out to those that are hoping for a release that it is extremely unlikely a release will come.

Thoughts?



Hellhammer
May 31, 2011, 09:49 AM
I never believed it would be released in WWDC so I'm not surprised. August-September seems the most likely IMO.

mrapplegate
May 31, 2011, 10:22 AM
Thoughts?

Nothing to think about. Those of us testing Lion have no doubt it is not ready for release on June 6. Plus unveil does not equal release.

eawmp1
May 31, 2011, 10:24 AM
Unveiled is NOT a synonym for released.

Surely
May 31, 2011, 10:24 AM
I just assumed that it would be discussed/previewed at WWDC and released in the fall.....

Capt Underpants
May 31, 2011, 10:29 AM
Hopefully there are a few big features that Apple's been keeping secret -- which they will unveil at WWDC.

roadbloc
May 31, 2011, 10:38 AM
Hopefully there are a few big features that Apple's been keeping secret -- which they will unveil at WWDC.

This.

And it wouldn't be the first time that Apple have withheld a stable release of an OS from developers until the official release. The same happened with Snow Leopard, the developers was screaming that it wasn't ready... but it was fine when it was released.

Legion93
May 31, 2011, 10:39 AM
It's the same thing - just when Apple released the Mac App Store back in 2010 they unveiled it like 3 months before it was available to download to the public. Same goes with the iPad 2 - it was unveiled at March 2 and was released on 11th (in this case the 25th here in the UK).

Just because something is unveiled at a press conference does not mean it will be released that moment/immediately. I'm sure Apple will release Lion maximum of 3 months before schedule (probably around August till September in my opinion, based on previous releases).

ajvizzgamer101
May 31, 2011, 10:50 AM
I think Lion will be ready with in a month. This keynote is how iCloud will bridge the gap between iOS and Mac OS X.

boilingpoint
May 31, 2011, 10:59 AM
But remember when the earlier Mac OS versions were released...

They had plenty of bugs and they had been stable after ~6 times updates.

I guess Lion will be the same case as the earlier Mac OS.

There will be plenty of buggggggggggggggsssssssssssssssssssss! But Apple fanboy always says, "it is perfectly stable and I love Lion~~~".

TheAppleDragon
May 31, 2011, 11:04 AM
Who said it would be released?

Clearly they don't use the Internet. Or the DP itself.

EDIT: Should update this... did it ever occur to anyone that at the last Apple keynote, the Mac used to show off Lion had one of the recently-added wallpapers? It could be that this build was the same they used then, though it isn't likely.

rdowns
May 31, 2011, 12:07 PM
I think Lion will be ready with in a month. This keynote is how iCloud will bridge the gap between iOS and Mac OS X.

I'm with you. I'm expecting an ambitious cloud offering from Apple and not this store your music in the cloud ****, although I'm sure that will be a part of it. MobileMe was their dress rehearsal.

maflynn
May 31, 2011, 12:31 PM
I think the consensus was that apple was only going to unveil 10.7, never to release it.

I mean it would be a bonus if they did but expectations have been for the unveiling.

baryon
May 31, 2011, 02:54 PM
While they "unveil" it, they will also give us a release date. That release date will probably be sooner than later, as it just sounds better to give a closer release date. Maybe the versions they are giving to developers are a few versions behind... But honestly I have no idea.

BLACKFRIDAY
May 31, 2011, 03:57 PM
Unveiled is NOT a synonym for released.

Exactly.

I am not looking for a release @ WWDC. The release is far from now. At least 2 - 3 months.

PBF
May 31, 2011, 05:19 PM
OP, I don't know where you got the idea that someone thought that Lion would be released at WWDC. No source or person has ever claimed anything like that.

Again, at WWDC, all we will get is a new build with some new exciting (maybe even groundbreaking) features. That is all. No actual release until Fall.

MacBookPro13"
May 31, 2011, 05:32 PM
No actual release until Fall.

Ammm..

Were taking our best thinking from iPad and bringing it all to the Mac with Mac OS X Lion, available in summer 2011.

ErikGrim
May 31, 2011, 07:08 PM
No surprise here.

Also: There will be no major new features revealed at WWDC. What you see in previews are what you get in release. Any "new" features will be related to the iCloud and iOS 5. Perhaps we'll see a new iTunes. Perhaps we'll see AirDrop work with iOS.

But no, there has never been a brand new feature just pulled out of the hat this late in the game. Ever.

Thunderbird
May 31, 2011, 09:15 PM
So today we learnt that Lion is definitely being "unveiled" at WWDC 2011:


However, I'm here to say now to all those that are hoping for a release:
Unless Apple is hiding something from devs, Lion will not be released next week. There's simply too many bugs and unpolished features.

Those aren't bugs, they are features ;)

Not a whole lot of point to this thread, just pointing out to those that are hoping for a release that it is extremely unlikely a release will come.

Fanbois will find release through a macgasm once Lion is unveiled. :)

Like many others on this thread, I anticipate Steve-o will announce the approximate or even exact release date for Lion at WWDC, which will most likely be in August sometime.

Maclver
May 31, 2011, 09:38 PM
OP, I don't know where you got the idea that someone thought that Lion would be released at WWDC. No source or person has ever claimed anything like that.

Again, at WWDC, all we will get is a new build with some new exciting (maybe even groundbreaking) features. That is all. No actual release until Fall.

There has been plenty of rumors that Lion would drop on WWDC day

http://www.cultofmac.com/will-mac-os-x-lion-launch-at-wwdc-in-june/97336

http://leftoverapple.com/2011/05/28/will-lion-be-released-during-wwdc/

and even on Macrumors front page
http://www.macrumors.com/2011/05/26/mac-os-x-lion-almost-ready/

So there is rumors out there! And Steve said it would be released Summer 2011 not fall!

PBF
May 31, 2011, 10:49 PM
There has been plenty of rumors that Lion would drop on WWDC day

http://www.cultofmac.com/will-mac-os-x-lion-launch-at-wwdc-in-june/97336

http://leftoverapple.com/2011/05/28/will-lion-be-released-during-wwdc/

and even on Macrumors front page
http://www.macrumors.com/2011/05/26/mac-os-x-lion-almost-ready/

So there is rumors out there! And Steve said it would be released Summer 2011 not fall!
Fine, I stand corrected. But then again, June 6th ain't no summer. :D

slb
May 31, 2011, 11:11 PM
My guess is that Lion won't be released at WWDC, but after Xcode 4 suddenly went GM after a string of buggy previews, I'm open to any possibility.

hellomoto4
Jun 1, 2011, 01:01 AM
Although I understand unveil does not mean release, many of my friends and colleagues believed that it did. Meaning that many "Apple noobs" ( la my friends) could also believe it to be true.

I'm sure they will announce a date, probably sometime in Spring (most of you guys' fall). Although they originally stated winter (your summer) they probably a bit behind.

I would love to see a few new features as well but doubtful.
Cannot wait for iTunes release, I'm sure we'll see that soon alongside iCloud integration. I'm sick of the old style traffic lights on iTunes in Lion!

farmersland
Jun 1, 2011, 03:32 AM
I always doubted too that we would see Lion released at WWDC.

But I am a bit curious if you remember what Apple told us at their last Presentation of Lion: They said that they will release it in summer 2011. If I look at the current Developer Preview 3, I would say that they are on schedule. DP3 was a huge improvement in stability and the whole system seems to look and feel somewhat polished. Sure, there are some minor bugs to iron out in Safari or Preview. But I can't see why they should postpone their release to fall or even spring 2012. That makes no sense.

I am pretty sure that we will see Lion released in June or July.

baryon
Jun 1, 2011, 04:19 AM
I have a programmer friend (I'm not saying that this proves anything), and he told me that there is always a priority list in what to do. Generally the priority is on bigger things, new features, etc... rather than small bugs. And since there is always more things to do than can be done, the programmer never gets to a point where they can actually fix the lower priority bugs (the ones that people keep saying "how is it possible that this bug is still not fixed!?").

It is quite possible that once they get Lion to be feature complete - and that can happen any time, maybe it already is - they will be finally able to move onto the small bugs everyone is talking about. Maybe fixing them is very fast, the only reason they haven't been fixed until now is that they were low priority.

Of course I know nothing about developing an entire OS or anything like that, but this is just an idea that may make it possible for Lion to be released "soon" - but not WWDC, that's still too soon.

macpro2000
Jun 1, 2011, 07:23 AM
Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; U; CPU iPhone OS 4_3_3 like Mac OS X; en-us) AppleWebKit/533.17.9 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/5.0.2 Mobile/8J2 Safari/6533.18.5)

Haven't they already theoretically unveiled Lion?

Sodner
Jun 1, 2011, 07:34 AM
Anyone know if the keynote will be streamed live?

And it's my bet we see Lion in August.

DJHack
Jun 1, 2011, 07:44 AM
Anyone know if the keynote will be streamed live?

And it's my bet we see Lion in August.

+1 on streaming?

Really hoping it is

hellomoto4
Jun 1, 2011, 08:46 AM
Haven't they already theoretically unveiled Lion?
Yeah I guess they theoretically have. One could probably argue that we had a 'preview' rather than an unveiling though.

Anyone know if the keynote will be streamed live?

And it's my bet we see Lion in August.

+1 on streaming?

Really hoping it is

If I remember correctly, the last keynote that was live streamed was the introduction of iOS4 (correct me if I'm wrong). Apple only announced the live stream 1 - 2 days before the event, so stay tuned and they might announce it. I too hope that they stream it live!

Jyby
Jun 1, 2011, 09:09 AM
Lion is ready! No doubts about it!

If Steve Jobs has anything to say about it, it might be "We have a great team here at Apple, but they don't sit on their asses every-time we're successful."

Apple works hard and they anticipate release dates... Most importantly work on Lion started right after Snow Leopard... They released Snow Leopard, had fun for a weekend, and went back to work on Monday.

Also Apple is pretty confident about this date, sources say. They also like to leave the rest of the world off with some goodies... Why not Mac OS X.

I can see an iCloud delay due to licensing, because most other companies are in it for the money, not the passion...

newfoundglory
Jun 1, 2011, 01:41 PM
Yes, there are bugs in Lion. Safari is great but particularly annoying bug-wise right now, but it won't take 2 or 3 months to fix that. There are some graphics (driver) issues which need addressing. But its really quite stable (no panics compared to DP1). It doesn't lack as much polish as people make out.

Apple will have been working on an update and fixes for 11A459e, and hopefully we will see that update at WWDC on Monday. Along with more bugs i'm sure. I would say this release is going to be key and will probably determine what needs to be done to bring this to RTM. By July, Lion as we know it will be very different from 11A459e and we may not even see another release after the 6th. Or we might see several.

My money is on a dev preview 4 for next week.

Lord Appleseed
Jun 1, 2011, 01:55 PM
Is it ready? Probably, or close to be.

Will it be released @ WWDC? Not likely, but maybe a few weeks / a month or two after. We'll see.

Thunderbird
Jun 1, 2011, 03:12 PM
Lion is ready! No doubts about it!

If Steve Jobs has anything to say about it, it might be "We have a great team here at Apple, but they don't sit on their asses every-time we're successful."

Apple works hard and they anticipate release dates... Most importantly work on Lion started right after Snow Leopard... They released Snow Leopard, had fun for a weekend, and went back to work on Monday.

Also Apple is pretty confident about this date, sources say. They also like to leave the rest of the world off with some goodies... Why not Mac OS X.

I can see an iCloud delay due to licensing, because most other companies are in it for the money, not the passion...

Steve....is that you? :)

rorschach
Jun 1, 2011, 04:22 PM
"Confident about this date"? The only date announced by Apple is Summer 2011 not WWDC. A new Developer Preview build will be released next week with whatever features are announced at the keynote and the GM will come sometime after that.

Lion is ready! No doubts about it!

If Steve Jobs has anything to say about it, it might be "We have a great team here at Apple, but they don't sit on their asses every-time we're successful."

Apple works hard and they anticipate release dates... Most importantly work on Lion started right after Snow Leopard... They released Snow Leopard, had fun for a weekend, and went back to work on Monday.

Also Apple is pretty confident about this date, sources say. They also like to leave the rest of the world off with some goodies... Why not Mac OS X.

I can see an iCloud delay due to licensing, because most other companies are in it for the money, not the passion...

dejo
Jun 1, 2011, 04:36 PM
I can see an iCloud delay due to licensing, because most other companies are in it for the money, not the passion...
If Apple has some licenses, I can see they don't delay iCloud but release it in a more-limited manner, same as they did with the iBookstore and the absence of publisher McGraw-Hill.

rdowns
Jun 1, 2011, 04:42 PM
If Apple has some licenses, I can see they don't delay iCloud but release it in a more-limited manner, same as they did with the iBookstore and the absence of publisher McGraw-Hill.


I agree. We know Lion and iOS5 aren't ready to ship. They need iCloud to be ready on Monday.

QuarterSwede
Jun 1, 2011, 04:52 PM
I think Lion will be ready with in a month. This keynote is how iCloud will bridge the gap between iOS and Mac OS X.
I'm thinking the same as well and it makes the most sense. It locks people further into the Apple ecosystem (and makes them want to buy a Mac), makes syncing all your stuff a breeze which negates the need for a much needed file manager (yuck) on iOS and hopefully the new data center stabilizes Apple's online experience (MobileMe).

iBunny
Jun 2, 2011, 08:17 AM
I am really happy with 10.6.7 right now on my 2010 MBP. I have no issues and everything is super fast <3

Heres hoping that 10.7 is released when its ready and not a moment sooner.

antmarobel
Jun 2, 2011, 04:14 PM
Release or not release...that's the question:rolleyes:

Icy1007
Jun 2, 2011, 08:47 PM
Lion won't be released next Monday. They haven't even released 10.6.8 yet. That has to come first before 10.7.0

MattInOz
Jun 2, 2011, 09:26 PM
Ammm..

20th of September is the last Tuesday of American Summer.
So that we be my guess.

Guessing that will be AppStore and BTO release date.
If they follow normal practice then any machine sold between now and when store stock with Lion roll in will be get cost of delivery upgrade. Which is time could well be a free code to download from the app store.

Retail DVD's might even come after that.

Be surprised if Apple doesn't give developers three months with the feature complete version.

slb
Jun 3, 2011, 12:42 AM
Lion won't be released next Monday. They haven't even released 10.6.8 yet. That has to come first before 10.7.0

They've previously released point updates for previous versions even after the latest version was out.

Cougarcat
Jun 3, 2011, 02:05 AM
They've previously released point updates for previous versions even after the latest version was out.

10.6.8 has to be released before or the day of release because it contains App Store enhancements (http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=1160587) for downloading Lion.

Lord Appleseed
Jun 4, 2011, 03:11 AM
10.6.8 has to be released before or the day of release because it contains App Store enhancements (http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=1160587) for downloading Lion.

They'll probably release it shortly before or at the same time as Lion then.

gofightlose
Jun 4, 2011, 11:08 AM
So...
Next week

10.6.8
Lion Preview 4

Summer (July-Sept.)

Lion
iCloud
iOS 5

I'm pretty sure that all three will be released at the same time since they are so tightly integrated, although that would mean a lot of work for apple if/when bugs are discovered. I'm feeling a late July release.

Jyby
Jun 4, 2011, 11:23 AM
Nope Lion will be sold to us the day of or within the week!

mrapplegate
Jun 4, 2011, 12:04 PM
Nope Lion will be sold to us the day of or within the week!

Funny, obviously you have not been testing it. No way they will release it Monday or even within a week of Monday :D

DJJAZZYJET
Jun 4, 2011, 03:17 PM
Apple probably havent released their most stable and polished versions of 10.7 to the (wonderful) dev's, as it would show it off to much and reveal all its features, lion is close and it is summer, Steve Jobs said that they were on track to release lion at the preview, so either at the end of june or start of july it will become available, thats my speculation guess anyway :p

dilgit
Jun 4, 2011, 03:52 PM
Surprise!!!??? I have no doubt in my mind that Lion, Ios 5 and iCloud will be released to the public on Monday.

Cougarcat
Jun 4, 2011, 03:55 PM
Surprise!!!??? I have no doubt in my mind that Lion, Ios 5 and iCloud will be released to the public on Monday.

I have no doubt you will be severely disappointed.

Jyby
Jun 4, 2011, 05:45 PM
Funny, obviously you have not been testing it. No way they will release it Monday or even within a week of Monday :D

It runs great, it is just up to developers to adapt to it.

mrapplegate
Jun 4, 2011, 07:05 PM
It runs great, it is just up to developers to adapt to it.

I had to fall back to Firefox as my main browser. Safari is unusable. I am running Lion as my primary system on a couple of machines, but it is not ready to be released yet. It does run great for a preview, and you can see the progress from DP1, to DP3.

ArmanUV
Jun 4, 2011, 07:21 PM
it think it comes down to three scenarios on Monday:
1. 90% Apple is going to introduce the gm version of lion (which probably doesn't have any new features) and set a date for the final release.
2. 9% Steve is going to unveil some exiting new features for lion such as icloud integration and apple is going to continue releasing beta versions with a gm release at the end of summer
3. 1% there won't be a gm release/new features because as some people mentioned lion may not be ready. This scenario doesn't really make sense cause why would apple re-announce something they introduced months ago?

antmarobel
Jun 4, 2011, 07:55 PM
:mad: ...Where's that damn crystal ball?!...:confused:

Maclver
Jun 4, 2011, 08:02 PM
What do people not understand about the term Developer Preview.... Developer preview is like the alpha version of software.. I bet we will at least see a feature complete beta version... It will not be released Monday..

vincenz
Jun 4, 2011, 08:08 PM
Latest we'll see it is July or August, no big deal. I'm anticipating it as much as everyone else, but there's no real rush. I'm banking on late June or early July.

rmbrown09
Jun 4, 2011, 09:01 PM
Could be released in it's current condition. It's 95% polished and running great. But that 5% will keep Apple from releasing it.

sth
Jun 4, 2011, 10:06 PM
I think there's no doubt about the fact that we will get developer previews for Lion and iOS 5 (with iCloud support, of course). Looking at the past, Apple will most likely give developers a few weeks to adapt their software to the new systems. So the best-case scenario I can think of is a release in the July/August timeframe.

In case iCloud replaces MobileMe completely, we might get iCloud-compatible Snow Leopard, iOS 4 and iTunes releases.
[edit]: With that I mean: But without all the major new features of iCloud.

I am running Lion as my primary system on a couple of machines
Why?

Could be released in it's current condition.
No.

Warbrain
Jun 4, 2011, 10:42 PM
I think there's no doubt about the fact that we will get developer previews for Lion and iOS 5 (with iCloud support, of course). Looking at the past, Apple will most likely give developers a few weeks to adapt their software to the new systems. So the best-case scenario I can think of is a release in the July/August timeframe.

In case iCloud replaces MobileMe completely, we might get iCloud-compatible Snow Leopard, iOS 4 and iTunes releases.

Judging from the banners iCloud is going to be a Lion and iOS 5 feature. There may be a way for the old operating systems to interface but it won't be ideal.

I agree with you on the likely release.

Cougarcat
Jun 5, 2011, 12:38 AM
9to5Mac thinks it's coming the 14th.
(http://www.9to5mac.com/70490/apple-to-release-mac-os-x-lion-on-june-14th/)
I think all signs are pointing to it coming sooner rather than later, but a week wouldn't give developers much time with the GM.

dilgit
Jun 5, 2011, 01:03 AM
Surprise!!!??? I have no doubt in my mind that Lion, Ios 5 and iCloud will be released to the public on Monday.
Well? I was wrong after all. It's June 14 and not June 6. Sorry!!

jeanlain
Jun 5, 2011, 03:15 AM
Could be released in it's current condition. It's 95% polished and running great. But that 5% will keep Apple from releasing it.
I hope so. dp3 is full of bugs.

Atarikid
Jun 5, 2011, 07:06 AM
I would be surprised if Lion will get a release date sooner then september.
I mean, Lion isn't running very smoothly on three Mac I use.
Graphically wise it is very bad compared to SL. Just run a app in Lion with a lot of window animations (stretching, shrinking, ... you now what I mean). Within SL it smooth as silk, within Lion it is jerky.
Very possible because Lion is now using OpenGL 3.x and the graphics drivers aren't optimized very well.
Also, many default apps (Mail and Safari to name two) are unstable to say the least (DP3).

Lion has good ideas but it will take Apple some effort to make it a smooth running OS like SL was/is.

Atarikid
Jun 5, 2011, 07:08 AM
What do people not understand about the term Developer Preview.... Developer preview is like the alpha version of software.. I bet we will at least see a feature complete beta version... It will not be released Monday..

Only SL had beta versions. All other OSX versions had DP versions. Mostly it ended at DP4 before the actual release. DP and Beta are imo the same.

Warbrain
Jun 5, 2011, 08:40 AM
9to5Mac thinks it's coming the 14th.
(http://www.9to5mac.com/70490/apple-to-release-mac-os-x-lion-on-june-14th/)
I think all signs are pointing to it coming sooner rather than later, but a week wouldn't give developers much time with the GM.

A week when they're all at a developer convention not focusing on testing code for a new OS that will be released in a week.

newfoundglory
Jun 5, 2011, 08:45 AM
DP1 was like alpha. DP2 + updates transitioned this from alpha to beta, and DP3 seems to be most beta like. Safari in Lion, combined with the graphics issues need to be addressed before release. Apple may have already done this for a release on the 6th. I suspect that the external releases are several builds behind the internal ones. So Apple may be more ahead than we imagine, especially if there are more features to go in.

Don't forget that most optimisation takes place just before release.

I think SJ is going to stand up and announce a "July" availability for Lion, along with some pricing if we're lucky and distribution channels (App Store, USB, DVD etc)

mrapplegate
Jun 5, 2011, 10:23 AM
Why?


.

I should clarify primary to me means a machine that gets daily use and I am not worried if anything bad happens. Data loss would not bother me. I tested a clean and an upgrade install. That was my reason for running on a "primary" machine. I should say it is not running on a production machine ;)

sth
Jun 5, 2011, 10:28 AM
I should say it is not running on a production machine ;)
Okay, that clarifies it. :D

Macopotamus
Jun 5, 2011, 03:29 PM
Anyone who thinks Lion is coming soon hasn't used the developer previews, they are still quite buggy and can't even install on some hardware.

WWDC will reveal the Lion features that aren't bundled in the previews, like iCloud integration. A new beta will be released for developers to use and work with these features to include in their apps, with a GM set quite some time after that.

I would guess a public release will be set for August.

MacBookPro13"
Jun 5, 2011, 03:43 PM
Anyone who thinks Lion is coming soon hasn't used the developer previews, they are still quite buggy and can't even install on some hardware.

WWDC will reveal the Lion features that aren't bundled in the previews, like iCloud integration. A new beta will be released for developers to use and work with these features to include in their apps, with a GM set quite some time after that.

I would guess a public release will be set for August.

For all we know, the developer previews could have been used by Apple a long time ago and have fixed the bugs with their latest build.

It could be finished now and being prepared for shipment to retailers.

Who knows? :apple:

TomRadfahrer
Jun 5, 2011, 04:04 PM
If there is a really new and fantastic feature which comes with Lion I doubt that Apple would unveil it in a developer pre-release. So the DP3 may be far away from a GM, just because there is something in the GM that Apple wants to hide until tomorrow.

I have no other explanation why the GM is not in the hands of the developer community until now.