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dbwrobel
Jun 6, 2011, 09:28 PM
Hi, just a quick question about multiple monitors in Lion; I noticed today during the keynote them showing swiping through apps as well as full screens apps...has anyone had any experience as to how these work with two monitors (ie. stretch, full screen on one display/other uneffected, etc)? Also as a side note, was interesting to see them using macbook pros as the onstage computers, normally they use imacs/mac pros as far as I can remember..



thankins
Jun 6, 2011, 10:01 PM
Hi, just a quick question about multiple monitors in Lion; I noticed today during the keynote them showing swiping through apps as well as full screens apps...has anyone had any experience as to how these work with two monitors (ie. stretch, full screen on one display/other uneffected, etc)? Also as a side note, was interesting to see them using macbook pros as the onstage computers, normally they use imacs/mac pros as far as I can remember..

I have my iMac connected to a 27 inch Cinema Display. When you are in full screen the secondary monitor displays the gray wallpaper that you see on the login screen and the mission control screen. It seems buggy as it only displays that about 50% of the time. The other times it has just been a gray screen.

When you switch to your desktop it changes to the wallpaper you have

wangkom
Jun 6, 2011, 10:56 PM
Hi, just a quick question about multiple monitors in Lion; I noticed today during the keynote them showing swiping through apps as well as full screens apps...has anyone had any experience as to how these work with two monitors (ie. stretch, full screen on one display/other uneffected, etc)? Also as a side note, was interesting to see them using macbook pros as the onstage computers, normally they use imacs/mac pros as far as I can remember..

Apple has never been very friendly towards multiple monitors. I wouldn't expect too much from them this time around.

RellikSadab
Jun 10, 2011, 08:57 PM
If it were me I would want to be able to switch between my spaces depending on which monitor my cursor was on. However I can see people wanting their display's synchronized.

Items like Launchpad should pop up on the active display. And Mission Control should operate on both displays with independent full screen apps. We should be able to drag and drop full screen apps in Mission Control from one monitor to another (and they should initially go full screen on the monitor they were opened in).

And the menu bar would be at the top of every monitor column and the dock would be at the bottom of every monitor column. The menu bar would have the menu for the last active application for that monitor and the docks could be customized independently.

And not for any native apps... but maybe add an API for any developers who want to go full screen across all displays.

That would be my ideal full screen support.

larkost
Jun 10, 2011, 10:07 PM
Apple has never been very friendly towards multiple monitors. I wouldn't expect too much from them this time around.

I think you are mistaken. Apple has had support for multiple monitors baked into the OS since the MacPlus (you could add a monitor with a "processor direct slot" card). And sometime close to that they made the modification to the OS to support at least 6 monitors (I remember the demo with a Mac IIfx and six external monitors). Note that this is with each monitor allowing a separate resolution and color space.

Windows did not get around to allowing you non-contiguous monitor regions (so not just a simulated bigger square region presented to Windows by a driver) until Windows XP or so, and even then it was buggy as all get-out.

So their might have been/still be bugs, but Apple is solidly in favor of multiple monitors, and has done a lot of work to make sure that they just work.

Cougarcat
Jun 10, 2011, 10:16 PM
So their might have been/still be bugs, but Apple is solidly in favor of multiple monitors, and has done a lot of work to make sure that they just work.

Yes, they've supported multiple nonitors for ages, but that doesn't mean their implementation is any good. How long will it take before they let us add another menubar to the second display?

kristoffers4
Jun 11, 2011, 03:20 AM
Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; U; CPU iPhone OS 4_3_3 like Mac OS X; nl-nl) AppleWebKit/533.17.9 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/5.0.2 Mobile/8J2 Safari/6533.18.5)

I just want to be able to change the brightness ony secondary display... It's driving me crazy! When I hook up my iMac to my MBP the brightness of the iMac goes to its maximum... I haven't found a way to change that....

talmy
Jun 11, 2011, 10:10 AM
Multiple monitor support has really gone downhill with Lion. Not only is the new Full Screen apps a problem (which, BTW, older full screen apps like Aperture handled just fine) in that the extra monitor(s) are useless, but the handling in Mission Control is a disaster. Off course, add that to the perennial problem of menu bars...

Face the fact that OS X Lion is optimized for single, small screen notebooks, which is what Apple sells most. No thought has been given to multiple or large screens. (Just look at 27" full screen Address Book!)

phpmaven
Jun 11, 2011, 12:46 PM
Multiple monitor support has really gone downhill with Lion. Not only is the new Full Screen apps a problem (which, BTW, older full screen apps like Aperture handled just fine) in that the extra monitor(s) are useless, but the handling in Mission Control is a disaster. Off course, add that to the perennial problem of menu bars...

Face the fact that OS X Lion is optimized for single, small screen notebooks, which is what Apple sells most. No thought has been given to multiple or large screens. (Just look at 27" full screen Address Book!)

"optimized for single, small screen notebooks" :rolleyes: Complete nonsense. Also, There have been third party addons available for ages that address any of the issues with menu bars and the like.

Cougarcat
Jun 11, 2011, 01:00 PM
" Also, There have been third party addons available for ages that address any of the issues with menu bars and the like.

But they are hacks, and nowhere as good as an official Apple-made solution would be. Besides, we shouldn't excuse Apple's failings in this area just because a few developers picked up their slack.

dbwrobel
Jun 17, 2011, 07:12 PM
hmmmm that kinda sucks, I really hope they start supporting the second monitor in lion a bit better, it does seem like its a waste if all it shows is just grey when using a full screen app.....and if not, then I'll have to enjoy my 'full screen address book' lol

talmy
Jun 17, 2011, 10:50 PM
Since the apps are not forced into full screen, you can just use them maximized. It's amusing that the existing full screen mode of Aperture will actually take advantage of extra monitors or allow using them for other applications. Why the new full screen support in Lion can't do the same just point out that Apple only cares about small, single-screen laptops.

woddy
Jul 2, 2011, 05:08 AM
Also the assign an app to a space is vanished... The new fullscreen apps are useless in a dual screen setup :( to bad.

Both screens should be individually handled...

I'm curious about 10.7.1....

I'm also going to file a bug report... :)

haravikk
Jul 2, 2011, 06:25 AM
Also the assign an app to a space is vanished... The new fullscreen apps are useless in a dual screen setup :( to bad.
This sounds bad, as I was looking forward to full-screen Safari.

So while I'm in a full-screen app on my main screen, my secondary screen is blanked and useless, is that correct?

This seem really odd, as full-screen Quicktime has always supported multiple monitors, to the point that you can have a full-screen movie on each screen, which is great. So why not do this for full-screen apps?


A large number of users are still professionals who are a lot more likely to have multiple monitors, and considering that the LED screens are designed as a kind of dock for your laptop, then why not take advantage of both screens?

talmy
Jul 2, 2011, 10:41 AM
So while I'm in a full-screen app on my main screen, my secondary screen is blanked and useless, is that correct?


The problem is in apps that use the Lion full-screen APIs. Any current apps that use full screen will continue to work as they have done before, unless they get recoded.

The way they have integrated the new full-screen API with Mission Control's Spaces really precludes having separate full-screen apps on separate monitors. They want to be able to switch between apps like iOS. Again, it's great on a small notebook (11" Air or 13" MacBook) but irritating on a desktop system with multiple displays.

hankydysplasia
Jul 12, 2011, 09:39 PM
Also the assign an app to a space is vanished...

Click and hold on the Dock icon an select the space you want to run the app or if you want to run it in all spaces. They ditched the prefpane options, and you can do it on the fly now.

woddy
Jul 13, 2011, 04:18 AM
Click and hold on the Dock icon an select the space you want to run the app or if you want to run it in all spaces

I don't see any of those anticipated options :( It fires actually the same as a control click, see here (http://www.appleinsider.com/articles/11/04/14/mac_os_x_10_7_lion_new_multitouch_gestures_dock_integration_for_expos_launchpad_mission_control.html&page=2) for details.

djrod
Jul 13, 2011, 07:41 AM
I don't see any of those anticipated options :( It fires actually the same as a control click, see here (http://www.appleinsider.com/articles/11/04/14/mac_os_x_10_7_lion_new_multitouch_gestures_dock_integration_for_expos_launchpad_mission_control.html&page=2) for details.

right click -> options -> assign to this desktop / assign to all desktops

METOO999
Jul 13, 2011, 06:46 PM
I'd really like a feature in OS X where you can right click on the desktop and switch it over to a HDTV. You can do that in Windows. On my black Macbook, I have to put it to sleep and then wake it up by plugging in a flash drive. Only then will it output just to the TV. If I don't do this, it will only extend the desktop and video won't play well.

DeckMan
Jul 18, 2011, 04:32 AM
Wait, really? Someone else had posted somewhere that if you close the lid while an external display (like an HDTV) is plugged in, Lion will not put the MacBook to sleep, but instead use only the external display. Did they change that again?

Southern Dad
Jul 18, 2011, 06:28 AM
I use multiple monitors on my MacPro and one thing I've found that I dislike is that when I click the full screen button in the upper right, it takes that window full screen but then my other monitors all go to the blank dashboard background screen. Why not let me full screen multiple apps, one per screen?

So far, I have not found it possible to display the dashboard on one screen and programs on the others. Which would have been a nice option.

Patrick J
Jul 18, 2011, 07:20 AM
Full screen apps are great!

The second screen is great for Inspector windows and other stuff!

jive turkey
Jul 18, 2011, 07:44 AM
I'm guessing I will never use full screen apps on my dual monitor Mac Pro. I think they will be great on the MBP, though.

RoelJuun
Jul 18, 2011, 08:39 AM
It's really a shame, since having large (screen size) apps like Final Cut or Logic in fullscreen would be great. For example; One monitor with fullscreen app that can be switched to other programs with just a gesture, and the other monitor with some monitoring programs or browsers/calendar etc.

talmy
Jul 18, 2011, 08:54 AM
Full screen apps are great!

The second screen is great for Inspector windows and other stuff!

Full Screen apps that don't use the Lion full screen API allow using the second screen for inspector windows (example: Aperture prior to the most recent update) but also allow having additional full screen apps using the second or additional screens. It's the latter ability that is gone in Lion. No matter how you look at it, it is a step backwards for using Lion with multiple screens.

METOO999
Jul 18, 2011, 11:34 AM
Wait, really? Someone else had posted somewhere that if you close the lid while an external display (like an HDTV) is plugged in, Lion will not put the MacBook to sleep, but instead use only the external display. Did they change that again?

I haven't used Lion yet, so I was wondering. That's good to know. :D

incredibilistic
Jul 20, 2011, 12:48 PM
right click -> options -> assign to this desktop / assign to all desktops

That helped a lot but it still doesn't address the fact that going full-screen makes the 2nd monitor completely useless.

I still love Apple but simple omissions like this are starting to make me wonder who's in charge over there. First FCP had some major issues and now we're seeing a few too many "huh, what happened" situations on Lion.

Normally Apple is the company I look to for doing things that you wonder why no one thought of before. Like using 2 fingers to navigate within Finder. That's gone now. Why?!

Anyway, thanks for the right-click > Options tip.

phutch3
Jul 20, 2011, 04:57 PM
This is a huge issue. This needs to be fixed ASAP or I'm headed back to 10.6.

EDIT:
Anyone with the new Thunderbolt display able to weigh in on the issue?

phutch3
Jul 20, 2011, 05:23 PM
Normally Apple is the company I look to for doing things that you wonder why no one thought of before. Like using 2 fingers to navigate within Finder. That's gone now. Why?!


I assume you're referring to the back/forward controls. I use a Magic Mouse and noticed you can still use this feature but by holding down option while swiping. Not sure if you'll see results with the trackpad.

Hope that helps, at least a little.

Thenimaj
Jul 20, 2011, 05:24 PM
Full screen apps are great!

The second screen is great for Inspector windows and other stuff!

It seems like the Fullscreen app has to be fullscreen on the primary monitor. Non-fullscreen apps can be run at the same time on the second monitor.

talmy
Jul 20, 2011, 09:19 PM
It seems like the Fullscreen app has to be fullscreen on the primary monitor. Non-fullscreen apps can be run at the same time on the second monitor.

Nope, non-fullscreen apps cannot be run at the same time on the second monitor. The second monitor is forced to the new Linen Background.

Also applications that used to have their own fullscreen mode, which did allow using the second monitor for other apps, take much more time to enter and leave fullscreen mode because of animations that cannot be disabled.

LERsince1991
Jul 21, 2011, 01:54 PM
If it were me I would want to be able to switch between my spaces depending on which monitor my cursor was on. However I can see people wanting their display's synchronized.

Items like Launchpad should pop up on the active display. And Mission Control should operate on both displays with independent full screen apps. We should be able to drag and drop full screen apps in Mission Control from one monitor to another (and they should initially go full screen on the monitor they were opened in).

And the menu bar would be at the top of every monitor column and the dock would be at the bottom of every monitor column. The menu bar would have the menu for the last active application for that monitor and the docks could be customized independently.

And not for any native apps... but maybe add an API for any developers who want to go full screen across all displays.

That would be my ideal full screen support.

I also agree that this is the perfect multi screen support system.
each screen independent, drag full screen apps between monitors, launch control independent as well.
As it is the multi-screen support is pretty lame, especially for mission control and full screen apps...

When can we expect Apple to improve this system?!

kfmfe04
Jul 24, 2011, 01:07 AM
Full screen works great on my mbp, but is useless on my multi-monitor iMac.

Until Apple fixes this, I will just continue to use Divvy for my multi-screen setup.

4ndrw
Jul 25, 2011, 02:58 AM
Full screen works great on my mbp, but is useless on my multi-monitor iMac.

Until Apple fixes this, I will just continue to use Divvy for my multi-screen setup.

I hadn't heard of divvy
looks pretty nice.


I use a similar tool called Better Snap Tool
it's only $2.50 on the app store.
same idea but different implementation.
by the same guy who does SecondBar - puts extra menubars on your external monitors.. free app and essential!)

I agree that Apple seems to not give a fk about multimonitor support.
I think they really dropped the ball on this one with Lion
especially as they were simultaniously announcing the daisy chaining capabilities of the thunderbolt display
which opens up more options for mac laptop users like myself who prefer matching external screens

(dual monitor setups with mismatched screens is a pain.. you can't drag windows over both.. It's obvious apple is going for the "optimise 1 screen for portable devices" and "one giant screen so big you wont want 2!" for workstations. but i still like having 2 monitors.)

4ndrw
Jul 25, 2011, 02:59 AM
as someone else said earlier.

sure, extra monitors is better supported than ever before
but not better implemented.

to me that seems backwards from apple's normal way of doing things

Comeagain?
Jul 25, 2011, 03:16 AM
It's really to bad...especially with a $999USD cinema display.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

plexdk
Jul 25, 2011, 03:28 AM
Can someone confirm that the full screen API doesn't support 2nd monitor? Seems odd, now that the new Cinema display even give the option to have 3 displays (2 cinemas and 1 macbook).

Cannot find anything here: http://www.wnd.com/?pageId=322113#ixzz1SBdRPhli

djrod
Jul 25, 2011, 03:42 AM
That helped a lot but it still doesn't address the fact that going full-screen makes the 2nd monitor completely useless.

I still love Apple but simple omissions like this are starting to make me wonder who's in charge over there. First FCP had some major issues and now we're seeing a few too many "huh, what happened" situations on Lion.

Normally Apple is the company I look to for doing things that you wonder why no one thought of before. Like using 2 fingers to navigate within Finder. That's gone now. Why?!

Anyway, thanks for the right-click > Options tip.

You can still navigate trough the file system in Finder using 2 fingers, but now you need to press the option key too, at least it works like this with a magic mouse

itsadoozy
Jul 25, 2011, 04:28 AM
I find it incredible that Apple have made what looks like such a boo boo on the dual screen implementation in OSX Lion.

I can't calibrate my second VDU, as the control panel to change this only allows one profile to be selected for both monitors. Although there are two option panes shown on each screen, the primary is the only one affected.

The full screen mode makes second screen useless, what's that all about?!!

Today is crunch time, I am seriously looking at reverting back to Snow Leopard.

malaqian
Jul 26, 2011, 03:16 AM
Hi there,
I have a strange problem with the second screen connected to MBP (the second screen is main, with menu bar). Now, when system goes asleep and then I wake it, the wallpaper on second screen dissapears. The background is grey and I'm not able to change even in System Preferences. I have to unplug the second screen and connect it again - then wallpaper comes back.

Also, I have magic mouse and bluetooth keyboard which also do not behave properly after Lion upgrade. When I wake up my MBP devices are not connected, I have to restart bluetooth to connect them again.

Thanks for any help :)

Lorddeff
Jul 29, 2011, 11:30 AM
A temporary fix is actually to right click on an app icon and set to open it in all desktops. Doing this allows you to have a seperate app on each desktop and if you have a dual setup the external display shows the background of your desktop. though this so far only seems to work for non apple apps like chrome.

So i have my setup such that cbmc which within xmbc I have set to only open in the external display is visible regardless of what i am doing on my primary 27' imac display. As long as i am not using itunes as a full screen app.

talmy
Jul 29, 2011, 02:32 PM
A temporary fix is actually to right click on an app icon and set to open it in all desktops. Doing this allows you to have a seperate app on each desktop and if you have a dual setup the external display shows the background of your desktop. though this so far only seems to work for non apple apps like chrome.

It works because these apps don't use the new Lion full screen API. For instance Aperture, prior to the most recent point revision, would run full screen in Lion just like it did in Snow Leopard, but now it uses the full screen API. As third party apps change over (and if they change over) they will have the same "broken" operation in multi-monitor setups.

I can't calibrate my second VDU, as the control panel to change this only allows one profile to be selected for both monitors. Although there are two option panes shown on each screen, the primary is the only one affected.

Something appears broken with your system. I can separately calibrate both my iMac monitor and the external monitor attached to it, and I can select profiles independently for each monitor.

Can someone confirm that the full screen API doesn't support 2nd monitor? Seems odd, now that the new Cinema display even give the option to have 3 displays (2 cinemas and 1 macbook)

I can confirm the full screen API DOES support the second monitor. Apps using the API can use additional monitors (example -- Aperture does this). However you can't run a full screen app on the main monitor and another app (fullscreen or not) on the second monitor.

xraydoc
Jul 29, 2011, 02:38 PM
I guess I'm just not seeing the need for using full-screen apps with two monitors. It's great for smaller single screens to maximize space, but why bother using full-screen mode with two or more monitors? Just use the app as you did in every previous version of Mac OS X.

hkjels
Aug 11, 2011, 02:39 AM
Download Simbl & megazoomer. Only works with native cocoa applications, but besides that it's quite good. I have it hooked to ⌘+↵, something that also doesn't work well with the native fullscreen. It will open to fullscreen, but since the menubar is hidden, it won't find the action for minimizing back.
After using Lion extensively for a couple of weeks, I would say that Apple is starting to get "sloppy", or at least they are not as perfectionists as I've been led to believe.

nabbet
Aug 11, 2011, 04:35 AM
I guess I'm just not seeing the need for using full-screen apps with two monitors. It's great for smaller single screens to maximize space, but why bother using full-screen mode with two or more monitors? Just use the app as you did in every previous version of Mac OS X.

I'm guessing you're a single screen kind of guy/gal?

There are already fullscreen options in SL that aren't forcing you to "single display mode" - and why should they? I don't see what argument makes it a good idea to do that? Now they've made an API which makes full-screen easier to implement (for developers) and integrated with Mission Control, coreanimation and so on. Which is all well and good, but it is not for multiple monitors - the whole idea revolves around single monitor usage. Mission Control makes a little more sense with full-screen apps (MC binds a 'desktop' to that application) but it disappears when only allowed to use one of your screens.

... and don't get me started on MC and multiple monitors :eek:

The Lion doesn't like us.

kasakka
Aug 11, 2011, 05:04 AM
Having fullscreen mode working on several displays has several problems, mainly in switching them. How would you switch them in Mission Control? How would you switch them with mouse gestures.

I think what they really need is an implementation that combines full screen and spaces, meaning that you assign apps to a certain space and when you full screen them they are full screen in that space but don't show as separate full screen apps.

The blanking of the second display is pretty idiotic tho.

pacmania1982
Aug 11, 2011, 05:33 AM
I don't like what Apple have done with the multi monitor support in Lion. I used to plug my MBP into the TV, plug in a keyboard and mouse, and speakers, then put it to sleep. Then press the space bar to wake my MBP up and it would then work with just the one monitor, once that was done, I'd open up my MBP for ventilation. Now in Lion, when I do the same thing, the screen turns on on the monitor and it switches to multi monitor mode again.

Its a pain in the ass

pac

nabbet
Aug 11, 2011, 06:06 AM
Having fullscreen mode working on several displays has several problems, mainly in switching them. How would you switch them in Mission Control? How would you switch them with mouse gestures.

The only reason that is a problem is because both monitors are treated as linked. If they did away with that notion and instead implemented a Monitor 1 - Desktop X - Monitor 2 - Desktop Y approach, where the screens are individual you would get around those issues.

I don't use gestures (proper mouse) but was a slave to spaces+exposť.

kasakka
Aug 11, 2011, 07:34 AM
The only reason that is a problem is because both monitors are treated as linked. If they did away with that notion and instead implemented a Monitor 1 - Desktop X - Monitor 2 - Desktop Y approach, where the screens are individual you would get around those issues.


This would simply create a different problem, mainly discerning which monitor is selected.

nabbet
Aug 11, 2011, 07:51 AM
This would simply create a different problem, mainly discerning which monitor is selected.

And how exactly is that a big problem?

talmy
Aug 11, 2011, 08:38 AM
Having fullscreen mode working on several displays has several problems, mainly in switching them. How would you switch them in Mission Control? How would you switch them with mouse gestures.

Currently you see the all the desktops on all the monitors in Mission Control. Clicking on any desktop changes them on all monitors. So you decouple it -- click on a desktop on the "left" monitor and only the left monitor changes desktops.

As far as mouse gestures are concerned. Lion also got rid of that icon in the title bar that allowed choosing a space. Just bring it back. If it's good enough for most Linux distros and Solaris for the past decade+ it should be good enough for OS X.

I think what they really need is an implementation that combines full screen and spaces, meaning that you assign apps to a certain space and when you full screen them they are full screen in that space but don't show as separate full screen apps.

Which is what we had in Snow Leopard!

-------------------------------------

The bottom line is that Apple doesn't really care about multiple monitor support. Having run multi-monitor Windows for about 10 years and OS X for 5, OS X has always failed in comparison.

kasakka
Aug 12, 2011, 02:04 AM
And how exactly is that a big problem?

How would the system know which one you've got selected? Based on which screen your cursor is? Which screen the currently selected application is on? Clicking the desktop on the second display? What if you want to use the keyboard to switch apps on display 2 while you're working on display 1?


Which is what we had in Snow Leopard!


We didn't have fullscreen mode for anything but video players really. The 3rd party solutions probably do what I meant.

nabbet
Aug 12, 2011, 04:25 AM
How would the system know which one you've got selected? Based on which screen your cursor is? Which screen the currently selected application is on? Clicking the desktop on the second display?

Application focus doesn't have to change any other way than normally. Why should it?

What if you want to use the keyboard to switch apps on display 2 while you're working on display 1?

Sure. Why should that be a problem?

We didn't have fullscreen mode for anything but video players really. The 3rd party solutions probably do what I meant.

Sure, we had. The ones I've used extensively are Fusion, Aperture and CoRD - but I'm sure there are plenty of others. Application focus works like you would expect, the active window is the active window - regardless of which 'desktop' I'm working on. The same rules apply.

Your brain is still locked in single application, single monitor mode.

talmy
Aug 12, 2011, 08:36 AM
We didn't have fullscreen mode for anything but video players really.

??? Full screen mode for virtual machines (Parallels, Fusion, VirtualBox), Microsoft Remote Desktop, Aperture, Pages, Keynote and Powerpoint (for presentations). I'm sure there are more I'm missing.

dusk007
Aug 12, 2011, 09:12 AM
Anybody used BetterTouchTool in SL
When one enables the snap to screen feature it works absolutely flawless with multiple monitors.
The whole full screen support is useless of course as pretty much any Lion feature. I still haven't switched the only thing I like about Lion are some of the GUI changes. Like grey icons and semi visible scroll bar but everything else is either bad or worse.
Even the Version control I prefer to do the way I have done it till now. For programming with support that I know how it works and for anything else the manual way.
Resume has the potential of being useful but it often is also more trouble than it is worth, and really late too considering how often one actually needs to shut down an app with current RAM prices and most people never shutting down for anything but updates.

talmy
Aug 12, 2011, 09:36 AM
Anybody used BetterTouchTool in SL
When one enables the snap to screen feature it works absolutely flawless with multiple monitors.

Works fine in Lion as well.

The whole full screen support is useless of course as pretty much any Lion feature.

Still BTT is no substitute for a true full screen mode. At least one that works.

Even the Version control I prefer to do the way I have done it till now. For programming with support that I know how it works and for anything else the manual way.

I've done enough with autosave/version/resume that I'm liking it. Versions is a natural extension of the way TimeMachine works. If you don't currently use TimeMachine I can see how Versions might be awkward.

Resume has the potential of being useful but it often is also more trouble than it is worth, and really late too considering how often one actually needs to shut down an app with current RAM prices and most people never shutting down for anything but updates.

Hard to parse this sentence. Resume seems to be a natural given abundant RAM, but why is it more trouble than it is worth? Only trouble I've seen is closing documents with command-Q rather than command-W. In other words, you *never* want to quit an application with command-Q in Lion unless you really want it to relaunch exactly where it was.

Chase R
Aug 23, 2011, 12:07 AM
Well Lion pretty well crippled the experience of running an external display. For one, you can't full screen a movie, or any app for that matter, to an external display, and two, the external display becomes useless when switching spaces.

How can Apple market and sell an external display for Macs when it is near useless?

Please fix Lion!!!!!!!!!!!

talmy
Aug 23, 2011, 07:59 AM
Well Lion pretty well crippled the experience of running an external display. For one, you can't full screen a movie, or any app for that matter, to an external display, and two, the external display becomes useless when switching spaces.

How can Apple market and sell an external display for Macs when it is near useless?

Please fix Lion!!!!!!!!!!!

The only thing Lion subtracts is the ability to use both screens when running an app in the new Lion full screen mode. You can make the external display the primary display by moving the menu bar to it in Display Preferences, then all full screen apps will use the external display. Or you can use another program line VLC which will go full screen in whichever monitor you run it in. And while moving apps between monitors is not possible within Mission Control (it was in Spaces) changing spaces will change the apps in all screens just like before.