I am disappointed in Apple, Tiger is not worthy of OS X stature yet

[MrSugar]

I stood in line with the rest of the Mac nerds to see Tiger at my local Apple store. Had they told me it was still in beta testing I would have left and spent 2 hours of my life doing something better.

Tiger is very very disappointing in my eyes. To me it is an unfinished product, it feels unfinished, it acts unfinished, and the more people I see talking about it the more problems I see coming up.

I have done a clean install of Tiger, because the upgrade install messed up my entire system and I had to do a clean install. But even with that fact, Tiger still has tons of problems. I have noticed problems with preview, problems with safari, problems with dashboard, problems with Ichat, and so on.

These aren't just minor annoying bugs either, they are frustrating bugs that force me to restart, login and out, or not be able to use an entire program.

I find myself anxiously awaiting for 4.2 to come out. A few weeks ago I was waiting for 4.1 to come out, even with 10.4.1 I still feel like we are beta testing this OS.

The fact is my school's VPN doesn't work for wireless anymore, so I can't use it. iChat is so horrible with my iSight that it just comes back saying "user did not respond" even though I am talking with them on the phone with the person and we are both doing everything right! My safari quits more often than I ever remember it in the past. Preview loses it's borders and completely and locks up every now and then. I can't create new windows in safari, they just don't appear, and finder windows sometimes get cut in half and go completely buggy. The OS feels slow and runs slower than I ever remember Panther. Even with the 64 bit "claim", Panther ran faster on my G5. And still, I find myself trying to justify that Tiger is good. The problem is, it's not! Dashboard widgets don't run as fast as they should, they don't refresh until I hit F12 and then I am stuck waiting for my weather to appear for several seconds. It doesn't work nearly as well as advertised.

Realistically Tiger has a lot of problems. I use it worrying that it's all of a sudden going to crash or mess up. This isn't how an Apple OS should feel. Panther never felt like this! Panther felt stable even with 10.3.0, I never had a doubt it was worth it. Tiger feels like an operating system that shouldn't be out until this fall.

What happened Apple??? This is the first time I have ever used Apple software and felt that it wasn't what it should be. I have put thousands of dollars into Apple, I bleed white plastic blood, I profess my Apple view upon the world, and my car happily holds an Apple sticker. With this dedication I expect the best of the best. I expect that every time I turn on my computer for it to stay on without problems until the power fails. I expect it to run every program I want, and do it perfectly. I expect that the Apple made programs will work when I first open them, if I want to video conference I just hit connect, and BAM ipto facto there it is. I expect Apple's OS to increase my workflow, and make me feel like the thousands of dollars I have given them are going to a good cause.

Tiger is not what it should be, plain and simple.

And please don't tell me to re-install Panther, I shouldn't have to downgrade just to achieve a worry free computing experience.

[MacTruck]

I'm with ya. If it wasn't for a few features I would go back to panther. Spotlight, dashboard = worthless.

[Plymouthbreezer]

It might be a hardware issue...

Tiger has in fact been fine for many of us.

[blodwyn]

My safari quits more often than I ever remember it in the past. Preview loses it's borders and completely and locks up every now and then. I can't create new windows in safari, they just don't appear, and finder windows sometimes get cut in half and go completely buggy.

I'm running Tiger on 2 systems (G4 PB 12" 1.33GHz and iMac G5 20") and not having these problems. I note from your signature that you also have 2 systems - are you getting the same problems on both your systems, or just one? Given that we're both running the same software and getting different experiences I'm wondering if something is up with your system and/or it's configuration.

[csubear]

My overall experince has not been bad but....

Safari crashes more than it used to.
Sometime when I attempt to put my powerbook in clamshell mode, the window server frezzes. Kinda sucky

but other than that, i think every thing has went well.

[bousozoku]

Well, it's good that Panther was better for you when it was first released. Tiger is way ahead of Panther for me. Even with 10.3.9, networking two machines never worked as well as with 10.2.8. I'm just glad that by 10.3.4, I was able to print.

I upgraded two machines and haven't looked back. Tiger's performance is faster and slower at the same time but that will improve. Panther's did, eventually.

If you're expecting Apple to release a fast and bug-free operating system, don't, because they can't. Things are better but .0 releases of anything rarely work correctly.

[MrSugar]

I'm running Tiger on 2 systems (G4 PB 12" 1.33GHz and iMac G5 20") and not having these problems. I note from your signature that you also have 2 systems - are you getting the same problems on both your systems, or just one? Given that we're both running the same software and getting different experiences I'm wondering if something is up with your system and/or it's configuration.

My second system is a laptop I use for school, I have to have wireless for it. This means that I can't use Tiger because of Cisco vpn that my wireless uses.

[chibianh]

I'm running Tiger on 3 systems.

Powermac G5 - clean install, no problems so far
Tibook 550 - upgrade install, no problems either
iBook G3 500 - upgrade install, no problems either

I use the G5 mostly, but haven't had the problems you described. I think Safari has crashed once. Besides other minor things and the fact that VPN doesn't work with the setup at school, I'm satisfied overall.

Sorry to hear you're having such bad experiences though.

[Sharewaredemon]

Tiger is not only fine on my computer, it's great!
I have had not problems, no crashes, nothing!

[Mitthrawnuruodo]

No (major) problems with my Tiger install...

The fact is my school's VPN doesn't work for wireless anymore, so I can't use it.Have you reset the proper encryption mode? (Like this article from Apple Support (http://docs.info.apple.com/article.html?artnum=107706) suggests.)

[dsharits]

Tiger is not only fine on my computer, it's great!
I have had not problems, no crashes, nothing!
Same here. No problems to speak of. None on iBook, B&W or MDD.

[mwpeters8182]

If it's Cisco's VPN that you're having trouble with, there's a Beta out there that works with Tiger (on single processor Macs). I'm using it right now.

MP

[yellow]

My second system is a laptop I use for school, I have to have wireless for it. This means that I can't use Tiger because of Cisco vpn that my wireless uses.

Cisco's 4.6.03.0160 VPN client works just fine with Tiger. Supposedly, it causes kernel panics with multi-processor Macs, but I haven't had that problem yet.

Some of the problems you're seeing, I've not seen yet in Tiger and I've got it installed on some 25 Macs. Of course, none of them are G5s. But what you are seeing is not normal.

[jaseone]

My second system is a laptop I use for school, I have to have wireless for it. This means that I can't use Tiger because of Cisco vpn that my wireless uses.

Well get on Cisco's case then for not having a VPN client for Tiger.

There is something seriously wrong with either your hardware or your configuration if Tiger gives you that bad of an experience, sure there are minor annoyances but for the most part Tiger is great for the majority of people.

[csubear]

Cisco's VPN works fine for me

[me_94501]

Some minor quirks, but no major Tiger problems here. It's as solid as any version I've used before.

[unfaded]

I completely disagree in every single way. Tiger is my favourite, and I think, the best OS release to date. Using 10.3 on computers faster than mine seems sluggish and unbearable now.

[jsw]

iChat is so horrible with my iSight that it just comes back saying "user did not respond" even though I am talking with them on the phone with the person and we are both doing everything right!
It works fine for me. It's likely you haven't opened up the correct ports in Tiger.

Also, it's possible you've altered the IP address used by the Mac in question and/or have altered firewall rules in your router.

iChat works in Tiger. It works with other iChat users, and it works with PC users with AIM - at least as long as it's the latest version of AIM. I assume it works with Trillian Pro as well.

[EGT]

I'm still on Panther but anxiously waiting to install Tiger. Apple has done a good job getting 10.4.1 out the door so quickly and it won't be long until 10.4.2 is available. Keep posting bug reports. The more bugs they know about the better.

I was a little surprised at how many users on here had problems with Tiger but since this is a specific Mac forum i supposed it's expected. It seems the majority of people with Tiger are happy to have upgraded. Just give it time.

[beige matchbox]

Been using Tiger since the day after release, only problem is login items refuse to hide, apart from that, not a single problem of any kind :)

Alot of people are having problems, but i'd bet there's even more who aren't :)

[Fukui]

I'm with ya. If it wasn't for a few features I would go back to panther. Spotlight, dashboard = worthless.
Well, I've got 28+ days of uptime 4.0 -not updated- and am just fine.

VPN stuff doesnt work because the kernel was changed too much.
Now that there is a KPI (Kernel Programming Interface) VPN kernel
extentions shouldn't break with updates any more.

Other than that, I'd say I don't miss panther.
Most problems are from old kernel extentions, and a bad hardware.

I had a trouble installing Tiger in a computer, removed the airport card,
it was fine. In fact I now know why it was freezing before in panther.
Another was bad ram. In both cases, tiger was blamed, in both cases, it was
faulty hardware.

Sometimes it is the O.S, but sometimes the O.S jsut exposes a hardware flaw...

[James Philp]

Tiger on:
iMac G4 1GHz 17" - Upgrade
PB G3 500MHz Pismo - Clean install.

Absolutely no major problems here at all. Installed in the middle of my masters' project report write-up and did not loose a thing.

I suggest you revise your "Tiger is not worthy of OS X stature yet" to:
"My experiences of Tiger have been less than good".

Making sweeping statements is just an inappropriate thing to do, when mainly everything you experience on your Mac will be unique to you.

[XNine]

lmfao@ Tiger being beta. OMG. Even the Micro$oft Nazi's haven't said that oen yet. lol

OMG. I'm running 10.4 on a PowerMac G4 2002 Quicksilver and it's purring away. Love it. No complaints (except the annoying file transfer sound)

[Pismo]

Tiger is working great for me and I hope Apple gets the 10.4.2 update out soon. I haven't had a lot of problems so far, just some really annoying things. My biggest gripe is not beinig able to put my mailboxes on the right side in Mail. I naturally look to the right of the screen because that's the way it has always been in previous versions.

Other than that, everything is cool.

[Maxiseller]

Tiger has been fine for me too.

And contrary to people saying Dashboard and Spotlight is useless, I actually find them very useful. Widgets are only in the beginning phases don't forget - they only have a small user base adopting this new technology. I am very interested to see how it develops in the long run.

As for spotlight, it's great! I simply cannot understand how people don't find is useful.

Everything works much better than it did in Panther, and I have to say, I'm glad I paid the upgrade price.

[wrldwzrd89]

I am experiencing the "user did not respond" error in iChat sometimes when I try to initiate a or respond to an invitation to video chat. I'm also getting beachballs from Spotlight when I try to specify other kinds in my searches. Besides those two things, Tiger's great.

[iindigo]

I do believe you've got some hardware issues on your hands there, buddy - I've been running Tiger ever since since the WWDC build up to 10.4.1 and haven't seen any of the problems you're describing - In fact it's working better than it did in Panther...

[Lacero]

I am disappointed in Apple, Tiger is not worthy of OS X stature yet
Tiger is very very disappointing in my eyes. To me it is an unfinished product, it feels unfinished, it acts unfinished...Apparently you haven't used Cheetah. Your little rant can be applied to Puma, Jaguar and Panther, and no doubt Lion and Cougar. Where will the madness end?

[whenpaulsparks]

i completely agree. tiger is wayyyy too buggy for mass deployment. they really dropped the ball on this one. and about the 2 system thing, whoever said that, it happens on both my systems, a powermac g4 and a powerbook g4, both well above the requirements to run tiger. safari crashes all the time, dashboard crashes which is very interesting, spotlight doesnt find what i need, the dock crashes, basically a bunch of crashing.

[James Philp]

i completely agree. tiger is wayyyy too buggy for mass deployment. they really dropped the ball on this one. and about the 2 system thing, whoever said that, it happens on both my systems, a powermac g4 and a powerbook g4, both well above the requirements to run tiger. safari crashes all the time, dashboard crashes which is very interesting, spotlight doesnt find what i need, the dock crashes, basically a bunch of crashing.
did you do upgrades or installs?
Have any "special" software installed?

[hhlee]

My second system is a laptop I use for school, I have to have wireless for it. This means that I can't use Tiger because of Cisco vpn that my wireless uses.

My school (www.bu.edu) has made a interim release of Cisco VPN which works with Tiger. Maybe you should email the computing services at your school and ask.

[AdamZ]

Who designed this Spotlight Window anyway. It is so un-user friendly. This whole idea and functionality of Spotlight is awesome, however trying to work it into a smooth second nature workflow is difficult and downright unelegant.

First, the Spotlight menu icon. Not a bad idea, but it is so jumpy. LET IT BE DEDICATED. If you click there and happen to move your mouse ever so slightly to the left, it default jumps and toggles to the next menu icon over, and you have to center the mouse again before typing. But if you click once on the icons and try to toggle to Spotight, you can't. This thing doesn't know if it wants to be a menu icon or not. I think it should be separate, and if clicked, stay in that state until clicking outside it. and yes Realize you can hit command space to get there too.

Next, the Spotlight Window. Oh My God! How did this interface get through to the final release. It is horrible. First it just looks ugly, getting information about a file is simple but getting there is a problem, there is no "reveal in Finder", the only oftion you have is to start/open the item. It seems weird that I have to search for things differently in all the instances of Spotlight throughout the system. Finder Spotlight searches are different? Why can't Spotlight default to my home folder? It sucks indexing and looking at weird files in system folders when you type in "Mom", that I will never acess anyway. There is no way in Sportlight preferences to isolate just your home folder. Fine I'll use, command F or N to get a Finder Window, but there is no way to acess the search field without clicking with the mouse. The whole thing just sucks pretty bad.

[zap2]

I'm with ya. If it wasn't for a few features I would go back to panther. Spotlight, dashboard = worthless.


i dashboard each and every day it s great, i use spotlight less because i know where all my files are, but in my school all i hear is '' i can not find this doc'' i say well if we had macs(spotlight) u could, but u know its a PC world( so many closed mind people only using PC never trying mac.)

i was on MS publisher( in school) and we had to do a newpaper, MS pub died and we had to redo all this( was my friend had not saved) this also happened to many others, i smiled and thought Mac OS X.4

[Lacero]

Oh My God! How did this interface get through to the final release. It is horrible. First it just looks ugly, getting information about a file is simple but getting there is a problem, there is no "reveal in Finder"I think the Spotlight interface and window looks clean, uncluttered and elegant. What would you do to make it look beautiful? Secondly, "reveal in Finder" is simply a command-click away. Can't get any more elegant than that. If you are going to rant, at least do it right.

[killuminati]

So far I haven't had a SINGLE problem with tiger. It's weird how some people's work fine and others are really buggy.

[AdamZ]

I think the Spotlight interface and window looks clean, uncluttered and elegant. What would you do to make it look beautiful? Secondly, "reveal in Finder" is simply a command-click away. Can't get any more elegant than that. If you are going to rant, at least do it right.

Oh you mean control-click to reveal in Finder, yep I knew that but I'm sure that there are little touches throughout the Spotlight Interface that could and will be improved upon. I am not an interface designer but I think that it just seems kinda weird and out of place. There is a great interview at the end of last weeks Tech Night Owl, http://www.macradio.com/thursday/nightowl/ this is a great little interview with a long time author who sees the issues as well. Great show if havent been tuning in. Anyway I've been on Mac Rumors tip for 3 years now, so every once in awhile I'll rant away, I brought up some other stuff though that are an embodiment of how many friends and coworkers are feeling. So strongly though that many of my friend are looking for ways to turn Spotlight off. This reaction can't be good

[Lacero]

Command-click in the Spotlight drop-down list.

[chatin]

The Tiger upgrade CD for my mac mini caused the little bugger to say "network cable unplugged." Knowing it was working with Panther, I carefully did my best trial and error troubleshoot and fixed it!

If you run into this, try switching manual ethernet config to 10baseT from auto. :rolleyes:

[wrldwzrd89]

The Tiger upgrade CD for my mac mini caused the little bugger to say "network cable unplugged." Knowing it was working with Panther, I carefully did my best trial and error troubleshoot and fixed it!

If you run into this, try switching manual ethernet config to 10baseT from auto. :rolleyes:
Something doesn't sound right here...

As far as I know, there is no such thing as a "Tiger upgrade CD/DVD".
"Network cable unplugged" is a Windows XP error message that (thankfully) doesn't appear on Mac OS X.

[Soulstorm]

I stood in line with the rest of the Mac nerds to see Tiger at my local Apple store. Had they told me it was still in beta testing I would have left and spent 2 hours of my life doing something better.

Tiger is very very disappointing in my eyes. To me it is an unfinished product, it feels unfinished, it acts unfinished, and the more people I see talking about it the more problems I see coming up.

I have done a clean install of Tiger, because the upgrade install messed up my entire system and I had to do a clean install. But even with that fact, Tiger still has tons of problems. I have noticed problems with preview, problems with safari, problems with dashboard, problems with Ichat, and so on.

These aren't just minor annoying bugs either, they are frustrating bugs that force me to restart, login and out, or not be able to use an entire program.

I find myself anxiously awaiting for 4.2 to come out. A few weeks ago I was waiting for 4.1 to come out, even with 10.4.1 I still feel like we are beta testing this OS.

The fact is my school's VPN doesn't work for wireless anymore, so I can't use it. iChat is so horrible with my iSight that it just comes back saying "user did not respond" even though I am talking with them on the phone with the person and we are both doing everything right! My safari quits more often than I ever remember it in the past. Preview loses it's borders and completely and locks up every now and then. I can't create new windows in safari, they just don't appear, and finder windows sometimes get cut in half and go completely buggy. The OS feels slow and runs slower than I ever remember Panther. Even with the 64 bit "claim", Panther ran faster on my G5. And still, I find myself trying to justify that Tiger is good. The problem is, it's not! Dashboard widgets don't run as fast as they should, they don't refresh until I hit F12 and then I am stuck waiting for my weather to appear for several seconds. It doesn't work nearly as well as advertised.

Realistically Tiger has a lot of problems. I use it worrying that it's all of a sudden going to crash or mess up. This isn't how an Apple OS should feel. Panther never felt like this! Panther felt stable even with 10.3.0, I never had a doubt it was worth it. Tiger feels like an operating system that shouldn't be out until this fall.

What happened Apple??? This is the first time I have ever used Apple software and felt that it wasn't what it should be. I have put thousands of dollars into Apple, I bleed white plastic blood, I profess my Apple view upon the world, and my car happily holds an Apple sticker. With this dedication I expect the best of the best. I expect that every time I turn on my computer for it to stay on without problems until the power fails. I expect it to run every program I want, and do it perfectly. I expect that the Apple made programs will work when I first open them, if I want to video conference I just hit connect, and BAM ipto facto there it is. I expect Apple's OS to increase my workflow, and make me feel like the thousands of dollars I have given them are going to a good cause.

Tiger is not what it should be, plain and simple.

And please don't tell me to re-install Panther, I shouldn't have to downgrade just to achieve a worry free computing experience.
I have been using Tiger for some days now, And I have seen none of the problems you described. Safari works perfectly, even If I load it up with 5-6 java-loading tabs. Finder has never been so fast for me, and I haven't experienced any problem whatsoever. I have even networked Tiger with a mac running Panther. Still no problems.

I did a clean install, and I was carefull NOT to use any 3rd party application which in their website didn't mention clearly "Optimized to run under Tiger". Preview is fine for me. I use 10.4.1, but 10.4 was bug-free for me too. And I know many other users who run Tiger flawlessly.

You must have done something wrong.

And If you haven't, then you should seriously consider that the upgrade from Panther to Tiger was not the same as Jaguar to Panther. THis is the most complete OS revision that ever happened in OS X since the upgrade from 10.0 to 10.1. There will surely be problems, that they could not be detected during pre-release stage, because no-one can predict each users system configuration.

And you should do a clean install from the start. For such a major system upgrade, there is little chance that everything will work with a simple upgrade. Just wait a little longer.

For me, I just love the way spotlight works and is implemented into every aspect of the os, even in smart folders. With a hot key, you can enable spotlight on the top right of the menu bar, or bring a spotlight window to front. The search is really FAST and it is categorized per kind, per size, etc.

Smart folders are very useful to me to categorize my files according to the date I opened them, without having to open spotlight every once in a while. For programmers, this is VERY important sometimes.

So, don't complain. Please look if someone else is having the same problems as you have before you say something is incomplete.

[byla]

This is what is most worrying (http://cgtalk.com/showthread.php?t=246259)

It seems that noone is developing real, public used 64 bit applications for OS X, not even Mental Images with their not so public Mental Ray.

Even Maxon (www.maxon.de) gave up on offering Cinema 4d 64 bit on OSX and that is very very sad, maxon being one of the best supporters for 3d graphics on Macs.

Overall, it looks like this Tiger is lots of bull and eyecandy. Nothing more. Sure it has some nice stuff, but come on. Even Microsoft is offering real 64 bit OS!!!!


Apple seemed to be on the vagon with 64 bit processing when presenting their g5. What happened? I tell you what. iPod happend. And thats a shame.

[MattG]

I completely agree and was actually going to start a thread like this yesterday myself.

On my G5, I've gone back to using 10.3.9 and will probably continue to until things improve. I installed 10.4 twice on this machine. The first time I did an upgrade, and it just didn't run very well (as could be expected, it was an upgrade). So, I wiped it clean and reinstalled. Earlier this week, when QT 7.0.1 was released, I installed it, rebooted, and now I can't log in. I called Apple who had me run the Disk Utility, and apparently the install caused some kind of problem that has rendered me unable to log in. There is no repairing it, unless I go out and buy 3rd party software (gee, thanks Apple). I'm stuck wiping the hard drive again and reinstalling EVERYTHING.

In addition to that, I'm having major issues with QuickTime 7 (besides for the latest update) not working properly with our Quicktime Streaming Server. I wish I could just install 6.5, but Tiger doesn't allow that.

I've also had more system freezes/kernel panics with 10.4.x than I was having with 10.3.9.

I was really expecting to be "wowed" with this upgrade, but it just didn't happen...certainly not the way I was when 10.3 was introduced.

I will continue running Tiger on my laptop, as it seems to be functioning just fine on there and I don't rely on it nearly as heavily as I do my G5. For now, the G5 will run 10.3.9.

Here's to hoping 10.4.2 fixes a lot of bugs.

[Abstract]

I've had to do an Archive and Install while using 10.4.1 last week because I couldn't even log back on.

I'm using 10.4.1 again this time, and I hope it treats be better. I had to do 2 hard resets today because Tiger crashed on me twice (things stopped working, not really kernel panics), but believe it or not, its still better than the first install, which was an Archive and Install from Panther 10.3.9.

And before you ask me about any hardware mods I've made and start questioning that first, I'll tell you that I haven't made any. Nothing except my 1GB stick of RAM from OWC that I've had since I bought the system, and its not the problem.

[Fukui]

This is what is most worrying (http://cgtalk.com/showthread.php?t=246259)

Overall, it looks like this Tiger is lots of bull and eyecandy. Nothing more. Sure it has some nice stuff, but come on. Even Microsoft is offering real 64 bit OS!!!!

Apple seemed to be on the vagon with 64 bit processing when presenting their g5. What happened? I tell you what. iPod happend. And thats a shame.
That thread is ************ I'm sorry.
There is no excuse for maxon to NOT offer a 64-bit version of thier app for OSX. In fact, if they offer a linux version, all they have to do is port over X-window or whatver they use in the 64-bit linux to Tiger. And if they couldn't do that, there's nothing preventing them from rendering to a surface and piping that to a cocoa GUI.

They (Maxon) just don't want to commit.
Porting Cocoa/Carbon to full 64-bit will happen.
Not to mention, if apple came out with a 64-bit "everything" all your drivers would become useless just like on Windows64.

I think hyperbole is something very common around here...

[Fukui]

I had to do 2 hard resets today because Tiger crashed on me twice (things stopped working, not really kernel panics)

Nothing except my 1GB stick of RAM from OWC that I've had since I bought the system, and its not the problem.
Hard freezes are 90% likely a H/W problem.
I had this too, and thought the same.
Don't be so sure its not your ram until you pull it and try with the original.

Before with other macs, one was the memory, the other was a bad airport card, both are now fine.

[mcdermd]

Hard freezes are 90% likely a H/W problem.
I had this too, and thought the same.
Don't be so sure its not your ram until you pull it and try with the original.

Before with other macs, one was the memory, the other was a bad airport card, both are now fine.

Well, I've had no problems with my two desktops - a G3 400 and a DP G4 500. I have had nothing but trouble with my 1.25 PB (random, probably unrelated point - neither of the desktops support Core Video, but the PB does). I've been beginning to wonder if it's the RAM in it. It has a single 1gb SODIMM I bought from OWC about six months ago. I've had zero trouble in Panther. In Tiger I get lots of hard freezes (not kernel panics), especially when doing things like opening a new Safari tab, deleteing an email to display a new one, opening a new finder window, etc. This is on a clean install (one of the freezes and ensuing hard reset completely ate my home dir on the PB). No 3rd party apps running.

So, I can see both sides of this fence - two machines run great, but the PB is a dog. That's my fuel for the fire.

[stump]

I admit I am new to Mac as a recent switcher but I must admit I have been impressed with Tiger. I have had some issues with vendors not having their software quite ready for Tiger but I find in the Mac world that these things are quickly fixed as mine are already.

Since updating and doing some tweaking everything runs quite well. And, I am constantly Dashboarding, listening to ITunes, writing, syncing, etc. all at once with no problems at all. I as others have mentioned have found Tiger to be much snappier than Panther.

I might assume from your tone that you have never had the "pleasure" of updating a Windows OS. I could talk for hours about my experiences with just that, but won't, just want to forget that other OS...

[Fukui]

I've been beginning to wonder if it's the RAM in it. It has a single 1gb SODIMM I bought from OWC about six months ago. I've had zero trouble in Panther. In Tiger I get lots of hard freezes (not kernel panics), especially when doing things like opening a new Safari tab, deleteing an email to display a new one, opening a new finder window, etc.

Same here. Not many problems in Panther... install Tiger and boom, everything went to crap. Removed the RAM and placed the original, boom, all fine. I've since bought a replacement memory upgrade, and all is fine.

So you really might check into that.

[byla]

That thread is ************ I'm sorry.
There is no excuse for maxon to NOT offer a 64-bit version of thier app for OSX. In fact, if they offer a linux version, all they have to do is port over X-window or whatver they use in the 64-bit linux to Tiger. And if they couldn't do that, there's nothing preventing them from rendering to a surface and piping that to a cocoa GUI.

They (Maxon) just don't want to commit.
Porting Cocoa/Carbon to full 64-bit will happen.
Not to mention, if apple came out with a 64-bit "everything" all your drivers would become useless just like on Windows64.

I think hyperbole is something very common around here...

Maxon is not offering Linux version. Just Windows and OSX.

Yeah, maybe they dont want to commit, but can you tell me one 3d software company that comminted to building real 64 bit software that works on OSX? The answer is, not even one. Lightwave 64 bit seems to be Windows only, Alias is suggesting that 64 bit version of Maya is close to finishing and only Windows/Linux, XSI again windows version (ok, so far XSI has never been ported to Mac) and even Mental images with Mental Ray renderer gave up on that. Maybe they are all uncommitted. Or perhaps it is just very painfull to do that. Therfore, Apples fault.

[Fukui]

Or perhaps it is just very painfull to do that. Therfore, Apples fault.
Or perhaps the market is not big enough (more than half of apple's line up is still 32-bit) and they need to find a "reason" not to support OSX yet.

[Soulstorm]

This is what is most worrying (http://cgtalk.com/showthread.php?t=246259)

It seems that noone is developing real, public used 64 bit applications for OS X, not even Mental Images with their not so public Mental Ray.

Even Maxon (www.maxon.de) gave up on offering Cinema 4d 64 bit on OSX and that is very very sad, maxon being one of the best supporters for 3d graphics on Macs.

Overall, it looks like this Tiger is lots of bull and eyecandy. Nothing more. Sure it has some nice stuff, but come on. Even Microsoft is offering real 64 bit OS!!!!


Apple seemed to be on the vagon with 64 bit processing when presenting their g5. What happened? I tell you what. iPod happend. And thats a shame.
First of all, Tiger has tons of new features that have nothing to do with eye candy, but are intended for developers (apart from 64-bit aspects of the system).

Secondly, you say that microsoft offers a real 64-bit OS. Yeah, right. They offered a 32-bit OS on already but it didn;t work the way it should.

It's like "yeah, windows have a search function also, so what's the fuss about spotlight?". The fuss about spotlight is that it rocks, and although it is another search function, it is faster, more reliable, and more elegant.

Same thing happens with 64-bit support and applications that use it. Microsoft is developing 64-bit OS. But what applications use that feature on the PC? 3? 4? And we are talking about proffessional programs only. So, apple has given the basic 64-bit support that these companies need to build an application to use the necessary features. And believe me, if Maxon and every other company wanted to make a program 64-bit on the mac, they would have done this already. The reasons why they haven't done this yet are other.

Anyway, Apple will fully implement 64-bit support when they really have to. When apple releases a product, the first thing they check is wether it works perfectly (apart from some minor bugs that will be fixed with future updates). When microsoft releases a product, it may not work at all! So before you start making assumptions, buy microsoft's 64-bit OS, and see how things happen. Then, when you will have completed your evaluation, apple will have released a fully 64-bit compatible OS that will WORK.

[iMeowbot]

Something doesn't sound right here...

As far as I know, there is no such thing as a "Tiger upgrade CD/DVD".

I have one right here that came from mini preloaded with Panther. The disc label reads "CPU Drop In DVD", part number 2Z691-5341-A, and the disk name when mounted is "Mac OS X Upgrade DVD".

A DVD from the retail Tiger box is labeled "Install DVD", part number 2Z691-5305-A, and the disk name when mounted is "Mac OS X Install DVD".

I'm too lazy to bother and see if the installer from the "upgrade" DVD will allow an install from scratch, but it's definitely a different disc.

"Network cable unplugged" is a Windows XP error message that (thankfully) doesn't appear on Mac OS X.

It's probably a reference to the attached.

[wrldwzrd89]

I have one right here that came from mini preloaded with Panther. The disc label reads "CPU Drop In DVD", part number 2Z691-5341-A, and the disk name when mounted is "Mac OS X Upgrade DVD".

A DVD from the retail Tiger box is labeled "Install DVD", part number 2Z691-5305-A, and the disk name when mounted is "Mac OS X Install DVD".

I'm too lazy to bother and see if the installer from the "upgrade" DVD will allow an install from scratch, but it's definitely a different disc.



It's probably a reference to the attached.
Wow. I had no idea either of those existed. I learn something new every day I visit these forums...

[mikemodena]

I installed Tiger on my iBook G4. It runs GREAT for me. Everything is super fast, my dashboard is great, final cut, aim, firefox, not a problem. The only thing that is not working is Software Update, but a friend of mine is going to fix that for me soon. (It keeps crashing)

[QCassidy352]

I'm only having one problem with Tiger, and that is that it needs to reconnect with my bluetooth mouse nearly every time I turn on the computer (but not actually every time... strange). Other than that, haven't noticed anything wrong or buggy.

[iMeowbot]

Wow. I had no idea either of those existed. I learn something new every day I visit these forums...
Those discs seem to be relatively rare, presumably they only ship with machines in the assembly pipeline when a major OS release happens. It was a nice stroke of luck that the minis came with those discs, they had been on backorder through CDW and I was expecting to have to go through the up-to-date thingy.

[virus1]

I'm with ya. If it wasn't for a few features I would go back to panther. Spotlight, dashboard = worthless.now u know what you are talking about. not jobs on his little keynote

cept for the weather app. my pb was so incredibly slow for the first 2 hours i turn on my comp every day because it is indexing spotlight. i can't find things BY THE NAME OF THE DOC.. i type somthing in, because i remember the name. and it doesn't show.. i want to find a chat with soandso right? ichat archives my chats for me. i spotlight soandso, and all i get is some other chat where i mentioned soandso's sn..

on to dashboard. it is useless except for weather, and calculator..

everything else: useless. i installed tiger because i got it for free because i have a seeding account with apple. the one thing i like about it is the one thing apple is still good about: the new looks.

[Fukui]

now u know what you are talking about. not jobs on his little keynote

.................

everything else: useless. i installed tiger because i got it for free because i have a seeding account with apple. the one thing i like about it is the one thing apple is still good about: the new looks.
You paid for the developer seed, and you think all to tiger is dashboard and spotlight???

Only the good thing is the new looks?
What are you doing with a developer seed? Planting it in the ground? :(
There's way more to tiger than just consumer features you know...

[MrSugar]

Hey there everyone, sorry I didn't respond to my own theard, I have been out for a couple of days moving back home.

However, I do want to get a few certain things strait. Just because I have not had good luck with Tiger does not mean that it can't be a great OS. I have noticed as well as many other people that Tiger has some bugs. My opinion is Apple should have waited longer or done more user testing to make sure things had been worked out. That being said, spotlight is a feature that I enjoy, as is dashboard. I think the ideas behind the OS are fine. Unlike some, I am not opposed to Spotlight, but I am opposed to my computer running in a non stable environment.

However, I haven't experienced the problems that some people have mentioned about Kernel panics, etc. I agree with other members that most of the time Kernel panics are the cause of bad Hardware. And I suppose I should be happy that to this day my G5 has never had a kernel panic.

My point of posting this thread was that Tiger has some serious issues, at least for some of the users. I am one of these people. The hope is that in the long run Tiger will become the best Apple OS to date. But right now I just think it has too many issues and was released too early. I can't change my opinion on that because I have been experiencing the problems first hand.

I am happy that some of you have had such a great experience, that's the way it should be. However, many of us have not had this feeling yet, and are waiting for updates hoping it will fix our problem.

[thequicksilver]

And If you haven't, then you should seriously consider that the upgrade from Panther to Tiger was not the same as Jaguar to Panther. THis is the most complete OS revision that ever happened in OS X since the upgrade from 10.0 to 10.1.

I respectfully disagree. I got on the OS X gravy train back at 10.2.6, and I will say without a doubt that from this users' point of view, Panther over Jaguar is a significantly bigger step than Tiger over Panther. When I say this user, I should clarify - I'd be categorised as having a well above average grasp of computing, but I couldn't care less about things "under the hood" of the OS, such as the new kernel.

Panther felt about twice as fast as Jaguar on my hardware of the time, and added significant polish to the OS X experience. Tiger has offered speed increases, yes, and some polish. But for me, Spotlight, Dashboard etc are nothing in comparison for the main reason I rate the Jaguar-Panther transition so highly: Exposé. Within two hours on Panther, I knew this would change my computer use forever. In a month or so on Tiger, I have not found anything of this magnitude.

Technically I'm sure Tiger is the biggest leap. But I don't see how any user except those with ultra-specific needs could claim the 10.3->4 leap is bigger than 10.2->3.

So, don't complain. Please look if someone else is having the same problems as you have before you say something is incomplete.

Again, with respect, you are using your opinion to tell him not to express his. This doesn't work. He has every right to complain, and as Mac forums all over the web have shown, people have had issues with the new OS.

[mpopkin]

Tiger has been perfect, NO PROBLEMS with TWO DIFFERENT COMPUTERS. Powerbook G4 1.5 ghz and Powermac G5 Dual 2.0 Original. No offense, but talk to apple before u tell us what u think. Yeah i have heard from friends that some people are having problems, is it bad, yeah it shouldnt be happening, but is it life threatening NO, not at all. I am not disappointed in Tiger, in fact i love it, I absolutely LOVE spotlight and dashboard is pretty cool too, but what i like the most is the new mail app and the faster load up times for my g5, the real fact of nature was that this OS was designed more for 64 bit than it was for g4's and that is the nature of apple

[Fukui]

Exposé. Within two hours on Panther, I knew this would change my computer use forever. In a month or so on Tiger, I have not found anything of this magnitude.
Yes, but just try launching apps with spotlight (you no longer have to care where on your home folder you downloaded anything) and tell me you wanna go back to the just finder in Panther.

Or make a smart folder in the finder for all files created in the last 24 hours, last week, or files changed within the last 3 days. This type of thing has been a huge savings for me since I deal with a lot of files every day.

I'm already starting to find another thing I miss when using windows is defiantly expose and spotlight.

[ja0912]

Not one problem with Tiger on 3 systems:

G3 - 500Mhz iBook
G4 - 1.25Ghz Mac mini
G5 - Dual 2.0Ghz Power Mac

[grabberslasher]

I stood in line with the rest of the Mac nerds to see Tiger at my local Apple store. Had they told me it was still in beta testing I would have left and spent 2 hours of my life doing something better.

Tiger is very very disappointing in my eyes. To me it is an unfinished product, it feels unfinished, it acts unfinished, and the more people I see talking about it the more problems I see coming up.

I have done a clean install of Tiger, because the upgrade install messed up my entire system and I had to do a clean install. But even with that fact, Tiger still has tons of problems. I have noticed problems with preview, problems with safari, problems with dashboard, problems with Ichat, and so on.

These aren't just minor annoying bugs either, they are frustrating bugs that force me to restart, login and out, or not be able to use an entire program.

I find myself anxiously awaiting for 4.2 to come out. A few weeks ago I was waiting for 4.1 to come out, even with 10.4.1 I still feel like we are beta testing this OS.

The fact is my school's VPN doesn't work for wireless anymore, so I can't use it. iChat is so horrible with my iSight that it just comes back saying "user did not respond" even though I am talking with them on the phone with the person and we are both doing everything right! My safari quits more often than I ever remember it in the past. Preview loses it's borders and completely and locks up every now and then. I can't create new windows in safari, they just don't appear, and finder windows sometimes get cut in half and go completely buggy. The OS feels slow and runs slower than I ever remember Panther. Even with the 64 bit "claim", Panther ran faster on my G5. And still, I find myself trying to justify that Tiger is good. The problem is, it's not! Dashboard widgets don't run as fast as they should, they don't refresh until I hit F12 and then I am stuck waiting for my weather to appear for several seconds. It doesn't work nearly as well as advertised.

Realistically Tiger has a lot of problems. I use it worrying that it's all of a sudden going to crash or mess up. This isn't how an Apple OS should feel. Panther never felt like this! Panther felt stable even with 10.3.0, I never had a doubt it was worth it. Tiger feels like an operating system that shouldn't be out until this fall.

What happened Apple??? This is the first time I have ever used Apple software and felt that it wasn't what it should be. I have put thousands of dollars into Apple, I bleed white plastic blood, I profess my Apple view upon the world, and my car happily holds an Apple sticker. With this dedication I expect the best of the best. I expect that every time I turn on my computer for it to stay on without problems until the power fails. I expect it to run every program I want, and do it perfectly. I expect that the Apple made programs will work when I first open them, if I want to video conference I just hit connect, and BAM ipto facto there it is. I expect Apple's OS to increase my workflow, and make me feel like the thousands of dollars I have given them are going to a good cause.

Tiger is not what it should be, plain and simple.

And please don't tell me to re-install Panther, I shouldn't have to downgrade just to achieve a worry free computing experience.

Apple went overboard on localising costs so they went over-budget and needed some earnings to continue development. That's why it's still like a beta.

[thequicksilver]

Yes, but just try launching apps with spotlight (you no longer have to care where on your home folder you downloaded anything) and tell me you wanna go back to the just finder in Panther.

I have used Butler since late 2003, and still do. For app launching, Butler is demonstrably quicker (as it only caches a small amount of things) and doesn't necessitate actually selecting the thing from the menu. Example - say I wanted Entourage. In both, it'd find it probably after the entour part. But in Butler, I press return and it launches. In the Spotlight menu, I either have to press down a couple of times, or mouse to it.

Small difference, sure, but enough to keep me using Butler, because it's better for the task.

[skunk]

Yes, but just try launching apps with spotlight (you no longer have to care where on your home folder you downloaded anything) and tell me you wanna go back to the just finder in Panther.Great idea, that. Just wanted to take a screenshot with Grab, typed in "grab", and Spotlight came up with "grab plist" and 10 other items. Guess what? No Grab.app. Gosh I love these "upgrades"!

[Fukui]

Great idea, that. Just wanted to take a screenshot with Grab, typed in "grab", and Spotlight came up with "grab plist" and 10 other items. Guess what? No Grab.app. Gosh I love these "upgrades"!
Thats because there's no grab.app in OS X anymore!
Use Preview.app ... yea intuitive I'm sure... :rolleyes:

You know what you can do though, do a "get info" on preview.app, type
"grab" in the spotlight comment, type grab in the spotlight. Top Hit.

[skunk]

Thats because there's no grab.app in OS X anymore!
Use Preview.app ... yea intuitive I'm sure... :rolleyes:Oh really? Fancy that! I wonder what the Grab app and its plist are doing on my system, then? I must have a Special Edition of Tiger.:cool:

[psycho bob]

Great idea, that. Just wanted to take a screenshot with Grab, typed in "grab", and Spotlight came up with "grab plist" and 10 other items. Guess what? No Grab.app. Gosh I love these "upgrades"!

I did the same BUT grab.app appeared as the top hit. And for those that say grab is no longer an included app just check the utilities folder!!

[Fukui]

I did the same BUT grab.app appeared as the top hit. And for those that say grab is no longer an included app just check the utilities folder!!
Oh, thats right. My bad.
I was lookin for Grab.app, but on mine it was gurabu.app. (Japanese)
Forgot they renamed it. :)

[croshtique]

Great idea, that. Just wanted to take a screenshot with Grab, typed in "grab", and Spotlight came up with "grab plist" and 10 other items. Guess what? No Grab.app. Gosh I love these "upgrades"!

Finds it fine on my computer...

[skunk]

Finds it fine on my computer...Yeah, well. Lucky old you! My Spotlight is really flaky.
:mad:

[Fukui]

Yeah, well. Lucky old you! My Spotlight is really flaky.
:mad:
Maybe you should get a better light bulb for you spotlight. ;)

[skunk]

Maybe you should get a better light bulb for you spotlight. ;)Hmmm. Maybe I should just revert to 10.3.9...
:mad:

[Fukui]

Hmmm. Maybe I should just revert to 10.3.9...
:mad:
Have you tried forcing a reindex of your HD?
Yea painful, but it might fix your spotlight.

[skunk]

Have you tried forcing a reindex of your HD?
Yea painful, but it might fix your spotlight.Been there, done that, ripped up the t-shirt. Weirdness persists. I'm not having a good Tiger experience. I just don't trust my computer as it is. If the Finder can't find, what else is going on???
:confused:

[apple_g5]

Running Tiger on 20 Macs -> every type from g3 iMacs up to g5 iMac and Powermacs, and g4s. NOT SINGLE PROBLEM [so far] :D

[whooleytoo]

Yes, but just try launching apps with spotlight (you no longer have to care where on your home folder you downloaded anything) and tell me you wanna go back to the just finder in Panther.


Surprisingly, Spotlight can fail for me trying to do even this. Tried to launch GraphicConverter by typing 'graphicc' in Spotlight and it failed to find it, even through there are three copies (different versions) in my Applications folder. A few minutes later, no problem. It's a bit worrying.