Boy dies playing 'passing out game'

[wPod]

I'm sorry, I had to laugh at this. It is the most rediculous thing I've ever heard. I guess kids these days have nothing worth while to do.

http://www.cnn.com/2005/US/07/13/choking.game.ap/index.html

my favorite quote :

"youngsters think the choking game offers a safe buzz compared with drinking or doing drugs." damn, i say just give them a beer!

[Peterkro]

It is sad but it isn't modern these cases have been around for decades at least.
The British MP found hanging with an orange stuffed in his mouth and wearing womens underclothes only one of the more colourful examples,kids having been doing it at least since the 1960's

[iGary]

Darwin wins.

[xli_ne]

thats sad. sad that he is dead and i guess others have died because of this as well. its also sad that 10-12 year olds think this is fun

[rainman::|:|]

We played this as kids, it was hugely popular. i only did it once, but it was pretty scary. I'm really glad these kids are suffocating to death trying to get high, rather than smoking non-toxic cannibis like people have done for decades in our own society. It's a much better trade off. Drugs are bad, kids, find more interesting ways to get high. I knew kids in junior high that experimented with sleep deprivation to get a buzz, for christ's sake. some people are just pleasure seeking, nature planned for that and gave us something OK to use, but we knew better.

[qzak]

back in 8th/9th grade i was living in Germany and i had friends who would do this. stupid as hell. one guy would get behind the other so he can catch the guy who passes out. one of the times they were down by the river and the guy fell forward instead of backwards when he passed out, his face nailed the big rocks. his mouth was practically wired shut for awhile after that, they put concrete in his mouth during it to hold the teeth back in place. like i said, stupid people.

[MongoTheGeek]

Auto erotic asphyxiation comes to the Mary Kate and Ashley Olson set...

[rainman::|:|]

autoerotic asphyxiation and the "pass-out game" are two very different things. one is about sex, the other is about getting high. i doubt people who practice one also practice the other, considering the very different motives and techniques used.

[wdschrank]

Darwin wins.
Agreed. This may sound heartless, but my second thought (the first being iGary's) was what comes of these kids if they actually survive and grow up. If they're addicted to that rush, then beer and pot probably won't do it for them. Seems like the type of personality that looks for harder things. A life of bad decisions was snuffed out early.

[Peterkro]

They are the same thing the difference is the reason for doing it,autoeroticism to highten sexual feeling,school game to highten feeling generally(or just to feel wierd).You understand this is not from personal experience? :eek:

[ham_man]

Now that is just cooky. Choking yourself to get "high". Couldn't that theorectically cause more brain damage than smoking pot? Crazy kids... :rolleyes:

[dsharits]

back in 8th/9th grade i was living in Germany and i had friends who would do this. stupid as hell. one guy would get behind the other so he can catch the guy who passes out. one of the times they were down by the river and the guy fell forward instead of backwards when he passed out, his face nailed the big rocks. his mouth was practically wired shut for awhile after that, they put concrete in his mouth during it to hold the teeth back in place. like i said, stupid people.
I had some "friends" (more like acquaintances) that did this in school. I told them then that it was stupid, and this just confirms it. I just can't see where the fun is in the whole thing. I mean, go play football or something, if you want fun. Then, you'll at least have a lesser chance of hurting yourself. :rolleyes:

[joecool85]

Darwin wins.

I also agree. As cold hearted as it sounds, maybe if this kid thought this was a good idea, whose to say that later on he might think that the "Going 100mph down the wrong side of the road game" is fun? And then he could have killed a ton of other people. It is sad though, I will say that.

[DavidLeblond]

Suddenly GTA doesn't seem all that bad, with its fully clothed sex scenes and all. :rolleyes:

[rainman::|:|]

Now that is just cooky. Choking yourself to get "high". Couldn't that theorectically cause more brain damage than smoking pot? Crazy kids... :rolleyes:

Well pot can't kill you, or cause brain damage at all, so yes.

i'm amazed by the number of people who think it's good that these kids die. i assure you, if you new how many kids did this, you'd be appalled at yourselves.

Who honestly believes this is more of a rush than alcohol or pot? Both are better buzzes that last much, much longer. They just happen to be unavailable to many 12-year-olds.

[Peterkro]

Well pot can't kill you, or cause brain damage at all, so yes.

i'm amazed by the number of people who think it's good that these kids die. i assure you, if you new how many kids did this, you'd be appalled at yourselves.

Who honestly believes this is more of a rush than alcohol or pot? Both are better buzzes that last much, much longer. They just happen to be unavailable to many 12-year-olds.
I'm astounded by how many 12ish year old kids round my way smoke dope openly and yet I never see them drinking,possibly a good thing in my opinion.I do realise its a bit different in other parts of Europe.

[tech4all]

Six girls at the school were suspended for a day after a security camera videotape showed the seventh-graders choking each other in a hallway.

That would be a scary sight for someone to see - kids choking eachother. :rolleyes: :eek:

While the game seems very stupid, I have to sympathize with the parents :( Hopefully this game can be stopped to prevent more unnecessary fatalities.

[rainman::|:|]

I'm astounded by how many 12ish year old kids round my way smoke dope openly and yet I never see them drinking,possibly a good thing in my opinion.I do realise its a bit different in other parts of Europe.

Yeah, I see a lot more preadolescent kids smoking, and it's pretty sad... but it's better than drinking, and a hell of a lot better than asphyxiation. while i'm pro-cannibis, i think one should wait until 15 or so to try it, you need to have at least a little grip on real life before you start escaping it...

[wdlove]

I'm sorry, I had to laugh at this. It is the most ridiculous thing I've ever heard. I guess kids these days have nothing worth while to do.

http://www.cnn.com/2005/US/07/13/choking.game.ap/index.html

my favorite quote :

"youngsters think the choking game offers a safe buzz compared with drinking or doing drugs." damn, i say just give them a beer!

Sorry, but I don't see anything in the story that should cause a laugh. Very sad that a female and male child are now dead due to a silly game. Apparently children have moved on from sniffing glue or other intoxicants. The young just think they are invincible, that it can't happen to me. My prayers are with their family and friends.

[Doctor Q]

Nobody in the Ever been Knocked Out? thread seems to be reporting they enjoyed their loss of consciousness.

Fads among kids often produce dangerous activities, and many kids believe the rumors they hear from peers. When one produces a death or serious injury, it's good that the news spreads about just what can go wrong.

[Santaduck]

Sorry, but I don't see anything in the story that should cause a laugh. Very sad that a female and male child are now dead due to a silly game.

Agreed. The younger you are, the more you don't understand the risk involved, especially when the equation is high-penalty but very-low likelihood. The finality of death that scares the sh** out of older folks probably doesn't typically exist in that age category, and add to that the fact that the kids almost certainly didn't realize that there was any risk at all. When the risk is this high, there will be no 'next time' to learn from.

It's no coincidence that high-penalty/low-likelihood risk behaviors decrease markedly with age, be it driving or swimming in unfamiliar waters. Sure you can partake in risky habits with no immediate penalty, but as a teenager or younger, one simply does not yet have the experience with comparing extended patterns of risk over a 1 year, or even a 10 year period. It's statistics. For example speeding in traffic on the fast lane is fine, but I estimate I come across a serious obstacle in the fast lane of a freeway once every five years (e.g. a mattress or boulder), but if you've only been driving for 2 years, that equation is meaningless. Ditto for other things that may happen less frequently such as catastrophic mechnical failure, or someone driving the wrong way on the freeway (~once every 5-15 yrs). Accident and death rates that change with age don't lie-- People don't become more boring, they become more scared, and any further risk taking is either a completely-informed intentional decision (i.e. knowing the risk but not caring), or tweaked to reduce risk acceptably (e.g. speeding in less crowded conditions with an open lane beside you).

Bottom line-- the kids didn't even know they were playing with fire.

[applemacdude]

stupid kids these days......

[emw]

stupid kids these days......
Perhaps - I did a ton of stupid things as a kid (25-odd years ago), and managed to survive.

I have to question if kids that are 9, 10, 11 years old really understand the ramifications of this activity. Their friends say it's fun, so they try it, not understanding that they could die from it.

It's not stupidity - it's ignorance. The hard part is that parents don't know this is going on and can't provide some guidance to their children. Or they do know, and assume their kids wouldn't do it.

Sad that this child died (those who laughed or don't care must not have kids), and sadder still that more likely will.

[Peterkro]

emw having your own kids or not is not a prerequisite for caring.I didn't laugh and I love kids(much more than adults) and I have no issue of my own.

[emw]

emw having your own kids or not is not a prerequisite for caring.True, but in my opinion if you have your own kids, you're much less likely to laugh at someone else losing their children. This is not to say that if you don't have kids, you can't be equally sympathetic.

[unfaded]

Hey, if I lived in Boise, I'd be choking myself too.

[dubbz]

back in 8th/9th grade i was living in Germany and i had friends who would do this. stupid as hell.

Same thing in Norway. My friends did this when they were around 13-14 years old. Never did it myself, since it seemed like a stupid and dangerous thing to do.

[krimson]

we did this when I was a kid too, except, i never actually was the one fainting... the last time we tried it, my friend blacked out and hit his head, he woke up and blood started to gush out of his nose. :eek:
that kinda ruined it.

[Sun Baked]

I'm just wondering in the dead kid won the game or not... :confused:

The twerp sure seems to have passed out the longest and deepest.

Silly games, that I cannot understand.

:(

Worse when the kids playing it don't know CPR, or have the equipment needed to monitor the heart or restart it.

[dsharits]

I'm just wondering in the dead kid won the game or not... :confused:

The twerp sure seems to have passed out the longest and deepest.

Silly games, that I cannot understand.

:(

Worse when the kids playing it don't know CPR, or have the equipment needed to monitor the heart or restart it.
I doubt anyone was concerned about who won the game after a few minutes.

[Toppa G's]

When I was in elementary school (5th/6th grade, 12 years oldish, so 10 years ago, I had a number of classmates who would do this in the bathroom at school during recesses. :confused: One kid hit his face on the urinal when he fell :eek:, which made the teachers and principal aware of it. This led to a number of lectures on why playing this "game" is a really bad idea.

[Chip NoVaMac]

autoerotic asphyxiation and the "pass-out game" are two very different things. one is about sex, the other is about getting high. i doubt people who practice one also practice the other, considering the very different motives and techniques used.


Both IMO are very related. The getting "high" is just an excuse for anedotal (sp - darn Apple spellcheck) information about the arousal response from those that are hanged. In fact I first heard of this response from an English teacher in HS when we were covering Waiting for Godot.

A friend of mine, who went to the same HS years earlier, did die in his attempt autoerotic asphyxiation. Never thought about the possible link between the discussion of this teacher in the classroom, and the possible link to my friends death till now.

[rickvanr]

It is sad but it isn't modern these cases have been around for decades at least.
The British MP found hanging with an orange stuffed in his mouth and wearing womens underclothes only one of the more colourful examples,kids having been doing it at least since the 1960's


I think that boarders from being just a game into something more twisted, and disturbing.

Sad to hear about the kids, but how stupid can you be?

[rainman::|:|]

Both IMO are very related. The getting "high" is just an excuse for anedotal (sp - darn Apple spellcheck) information about the arousal response from those that are hanged. In fact I first heard of this response from an English teacher in HS when we were covering Waiting for Godot.

A friend of mine, who went to the same HS years earlier, did die in his attempt autoerotic asphyxiation. Never thought about the possible link between the discussion of this teacher in the classroom, and the possible link to my friends death till now.

I disagree, I think autoerotic asphyxiation comes from a progressive sexual desire, you don't hear of adults going that way because they wanted to get high, they could do that with any number of substances... tho the end result is, of course, a rush. Kids, on the other hand, are doing this to get high, because you don't have to obtain anything and it's free. If kids had access, and I'm not encouraging drug use in the young, to safer alternatives, they would do those instead. I've yet to meet a stoner that still chokes. So the difference is that these kids could be deterred as it's just a means to an end, while adults are seeking this very specific method to enhance orgasm. Mostly tho, I think it's sad people are making light of this by comparing it to a sexual deviancy. And I'll say it again, if you take away drugs like cannabis, and your kid has a stroke doing whip-its in your kitchen at 2am, think about what's really the danger here.

[Nanda Devi]

This reminds me of something some of my "acquaintances" used to do back when I was in college... when taking a hit from a water-filled cylindrical smoking apparatus (i.e., bong), the "hitee" would crouch while inhaling the goods and a bystander would stand behind them and put their arms around the person's chest (picture the Heimlich Maneuver). The bystander would then swiftly pull the person up to his or her feet as the person exhaled, and every time it was the same result: the person passed out cold for 20-30 seconds or so. It was crazy.... I've seen people vehemently deny that this would cause them to pass out, then do it and be out cold a few moments later.

They called it a compression hit... naturally I never took part, and I certainly wouldn't recommend it for today's impressionable youth.

Another destructive high I've been witness to is nitrous oxide. I had some other "acquaintances" in college who were flat-out addicted to that stuff, and one guy actually would do balloons (filled w/ nitrous, that is) while driving and - no joke here - rolled his car over twice. :eek:

Unfortunately he survived both accidents......

ND

[runninmac]

stupid kids these days......

Its not that thyre stupid its just they dont know what it can do to them. When I was in the 7th grade (seems to be the time alot of kids do this) I was at a party and this idiot kid that know one liked (he ivited himself) wanted to do that so a few people got he out. He was fine the first 3 times ( :confused: :eek: ) Then the 4th time he passed out for 5 mins then woke up and had know clue where he was for 1/2 hour. The next monday at school everyone at the party got called down to the principals office and was givin the whole speach about the consicuences (SP???) and I havnt seen anyone do it since. Im really glad I wasnt doing making him pass out (talkin to people while this happend) imgine being a kid who killed someone this way. I would be scared for life. But there was a stpuid part about it, Every minute was videotaped!!! What idiots :eek:

Sorry for my ramblings

[runninmac]

Same thing in Norway. My friends did this when they were around 13-14 years old. Never did it myself, since it seemed like a stupid and dangerous thing to do.

Where is all the common sence in the world?? It seems like only 5% of the earth has it at times!

[~Shard~]

Some kids used to do this when I was 10 or 12. Thought it was stupid then, still think it's stupid now. Parents need to educate their kids better about stupid things like this, pay more attention to what their kids are doing, and get the kids involved in something worthwhile and productive, like clubs, sports, music, anything. :cool:

As iGary said, Darwin wins again...

[barneygumble]

it is times like this that i remember a quote i was once told

"you can't idiot proof everything, then we will find better idiots" or something like that

[~Shard~]

it is times like this that i remember a quote i was once told

"you can't idiot proof everything, then we will find better idiots" or something like that

These are my favorite variations of the quote:

"You can't idiot-proof the world. Idiots are too goddamn inventive."

"You can't idiot proof anything, everytime you do they make better idiots."

"You can't idiot-proof computer equipment. You can try, but the idiots just keep getting more creative."

:cool:

[dornoforpyros]

"In addition to talking to kids about drugs and alcohol, parents should discuss other risky behavior, like the pass-out game, Shapiro said."

Do I sence an after school special?

"Hey Jimmy, wanna place the pass out game?"
Jimmy:"No thanks, I'll just smoke some pot"

[mcarnes]

Where is all the common sence in the world?? It seems like only 5% of the earth has it at times!

"Common sense is not so common" -- Descartes

Still true 400 years later.

[ksz]

I think this is just as stupid as boxing. You knock your opponent out cold, you win. Never mind the boxers who died recently during and after their games.

Stupidity will always be with us in one form or another. Gladiator games lasted 400 years. America as a nation has not been "alive" for even 300. Institutionalized slavery was alive for hundreds of years. Some things that are "accepted" are not necessarily right or civilized.

But then again we still have animal instincts. Give the gorilla a human-like brain and you've got yourself a more potent gorilla. But still a gorilla.

Like someone said, Darwin wins.

[whooleytoo]

I disagree, I think autoerotic asphyxiation comes from a progressive sexual desire, you don't hear of adults going that way because they wanted to get high, they could do that with any number of substances... tho the end result is, of course, a rush. Kids, on the other hand, are doing this to get high, because you don't have to obtain anything and it's free. If kids had access, and I'm not encouraging drug use in the young, to safer alternatives, they would do those instead. I've yet to meet a stoner that still chokes. So the difference is that these kids could be deterred as it's just a means to an end, while adults are seeking this very specific method to enhance orgasm. Mostly tho, I think it's sad people are making light of this by comparing it to a sexual deviancy. And I'll say it again, if you take away drugs like cannabis, and your kid has a stroke doing whip-its in your kitchen at 2am, think about what's really the danger here.

Very good points.

I do think there is a little more to it though, I think the children aren't just looking for a rush but also pushing the boundaries of what they are allowed to do. If cannabis was legalised, they might possibly have less interest in it and instead crave harder drugs that still are proscribed?

[chucknorris]

Hey, if I lived in Boise, I'd be choking myself too.

Boise may be morphing into a suburban hellscape, but at least there isn't garbage everywhere (like say......L.A.), or rampant crime (take for instance....L.A.).

I can't stand the politics, the racial/cultural homogeny, or the utter lack of apple stores, but there's something rapturous about surfing the internet wirelessly at a fair-trade coffeehouse then being able to drive for thirty minutes and be in the middle of a national forest.

Boise is not the best place to live-- nor is L.A., New York, Seattle, Paris, London, Oslo, Toronto, or Tokyo. Every city has its drawbacks, and its perks. Boise happens to be where I've grown up. I'll surely move in the near future, but not to escape.

I would encourage some thought before concluding that a place is any more unbearable than the next.

[kwajo.com]

am I the only one that finds things like giving 110% out on the field/court playing a sport, or going hiking through nature, or any number of things just as exciting as going out and getting wasted? cause i've done it all, and I really haven't gotten as good a feeling from getting wasted as I have from those other things, they give me rushes that truly make me feel happy and healthy, I don't get why that isn't appealing to others :confused:

[Mavimao]

I used to do this with friends in High School. Only, we wouldn't choke or hang ourselves. We'd have someone stand up against a tree or solid wall, have them breathe in, and someone else would press against their chest where their lungs are located and that person would pass out for a split second. Only thing is, you felt like it was an hour you were out of it.

No one ever got hurt.

Hanging yourself is stupid. These kids aren't doing it right!

[Johnny Rico]

Boise is not the best place to live-- nor is L.A., New York, Seattle, Paris, London, Oslo, Toronto, or Tokyo. Every city has its drawbacks, and its perks. Boise happens to be where I've grown up. I'll surely move in the near future, but not to escape.

I would encourage some thought before concluding that a place is any more unbearable than the next.
I would encourage some thought before comparing Boise to ANY of those cities.. :rolleyes:

[wdschrank]

Anyone who defends these kids by saying they don't know they're playing with death must be an elder idiot. When you choke someone and watch them pass out, it is obvious to anyone that it's not healthy. Even Lassie would go and run for help :D Whether they know that death can ensue or just a crack on the skull from the fall is irrelevant. IT CANNOT BE GOOD FOR YOU! Maybe next time these tardo kids will play the "stab me in the chest" game. Then we can have another forum will people will say that kids that age don't understand that skin can be punctured.

[Chip NoVaMac]

Anyone who defends these kids by saying they don't know they're playing with death must be an elder idiot. When you choke someone and watch them pass out, it is obvious to anyone that it's not healthy. Even Lassie would go and run for help :D Whether they know that death can ensue or just a crack on the skull from the fall is irrelevant. IT CANNOT BE GOOD FOR YOU! Maybe next time these tardo kids will play the "stab me in the chest" game. Then we can have another forum will people will say that kids that age don't understand that skin can be punctured.


Problem is that kids generally think that they are invincible. That they will never die, that it will happen to some other bloke.

As a high schooler, I remember taking the hilly, riled back roads of WV at speeds of 60 to 70 mph. To get my wheels off the ground. I know now just how stupid I was.

[homerjward]

skin can be punctured.
skin can be punctured? :eek: :D :p

[dsharits]

skin can be punctured? :eek: :D :p
No way. He's making that up. ;)

[chucknorris]

I would encourage some thought before comparing Boise to ANY of those cities.. :rolleyes:

And what, pray tell, does that mean (besides the fact that you missed an obvious hyperbole)? It goes without saying that nobody is going to put Boise at the top of their list of world destinations. I'm just emphasizing that this is all subjective, and that nobody can prove OBJECTIVELY that Boise or Elko or Sheboygan or Paris, Texas (more hyperbole) is worse than the cities mentioned in my previous post.

:rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

[wPod]

back in 8th/9th grade i was living in Germany and i had friends who would do this. stupid as hell.

i never imagined that anyone else would do this, but i forwarded this artical to a friend of mine and he said he used to do something like that in middle school. kids would breathe in and out really quickly to cause hyperventalation, then someone else would punch them in the chest to knock the wind out of them. man, when i was that age i was outside riding my bike, going to the cornor store buying baseball cards. when i become a father (hopefually a long time from now) i will make sure my kids have something to do, or at least money to buy baseball cards, so they arent sitting around board trying to see how they can get high!

[~Shard~]

i never imagined that anyone else would do this, but i forwarded this artical to a friend of mine and he said he used to do something like that in middle school. kids would breathe in and out really quickly to cause hyperventalation, then someone else would punch them in the chest to knock the wind out of them. man, when i was that age i was outside riding my bike, going to the cornor store buying baseball cards. when i become a father (hopefually a long time from now) i will make sure my kids have something to do, or at least money to buy baseball cards, so they arent sitting around board trying to see how they can get high!

Exactly. There are so many far better things for children to be dong than "this". All it takes is proper parenting and good role models.

[Chip NoVaMac]

Exactly. There are so many far better things for children to be dong than "this". All it takes is proper parenting and good role models.

And honest discussion of the issues facing the kids of today. Parents ned to be willing to be part of their child's growing phases.

[Benjamin]

Passing out game? never heard of it in my area of course I wasn't one of the cool kids back in the day, guess I never had the chance to kill brain cells till beer. my bad.

too bad for these children that are killing themselves.

[takao]

haha yeah i remember 2 guys who showed that in school during a break (7th grade ? somthing like that) but when the 2nd one fell down i stumpled forward and fell on his forehead.. so it wasn't that popular and caused more laughter than "i gotta try that" and after all alkohol is gettable with 15 etc. (at least beer wine etc.) here so it was not really something widespread

[~Shard~]

And honest discussion of the issues facing the kids of today. Parents ned to be willing to be part of their child's growing phases.

Well put. Open communication is a good thing, and in many cases, a necessity. And yes, above all else, parents actually need to participate and take an active role in their child's life - is that really too much to ask?

[Chip NoVaMac]

Well put. Open communication is a good thing, and in many cases, a necessity. And yes, above all else, parents actually need to participate and take an active role in their child's life - is that really too much to ask?


I am glad that I am not a parent today. The things that need to be talked about today are much more difficult than the birds and the bees discussion that mine faced with me. I still remember my dad blushing when we had the "chat".

Today parents face challenges that mine never could dream of. It is a sad statement that the news of this death will only lead to even more kids attempting to get "high" from the technique. Add to that the economic situation for most families today leaves little time to focus positive attention on the kids. And that many parents today don't/won't accept the idea that the kids come first. Shuttling them from one event to another does not count.

Today I can count on my hand and still have fingers left the number of times my parents went out and had "time for themselves". No trips to the "islands" for the weekend for my parents. Instead of expensive cars, they put in a pool, that they never really used themselves. I never realized until I came closer to their age as I grew up, what sacrifices they made freely to insure that my sister and I had a "good and safe" life.

[~Shard~]

Add to that the economic situation for most families today leaves little time to focus positive attention on the kids. And that many parents today don't/won't accept the idea that the kids come first. Shuttling them from one event to another does not count.

Very true. Economically, in the past we saw a lot of single income families. The father worked, while the mother stayed home and truly took care of their children. Nowadays, both parents need to work and that's just to get by it seems. As a result, children grow up seeing babysitters and pre-school teachers more than their actual parents, which is sad.

And as you say, shuttlnig kids to and from events doesn't count as spending "quality time" with your kids. This behavior has become more prevalent in today's society as well, where we see the TV, computers and video games acting as babysitters because the parents are too "busy" and can't be bothered to get their life's priorities straight and focus on their own flesh and blood.

Today I can count on my hand and still have fingers left the number of times my parents went out and had "time for themselves". No trips to the "islands" for the weekend for my parents. Instead of expensive cars, they put in a pool, that they never really used themselves. I never realized until I came closer to their age as I grew up, what sacrifices they made freely to insure that my sister and I had a "good and safe" life.

I know exactly what you mean. When I look back on everything my parents did for me, I'm just blown away. It was all about sacrifice, and putting someone else (me and my brother) first before themselves - always. It's a quality that makes truly good parents unique and special, and something that I admire. I do wish my parents took more time for themselves back then, (and I'm glad to see now that both me and my brother are gone that they are), but at the same time, I think one of the reasons myself and my brother turned out the way we did is thanks to their selfless acts, genuine love, and focus on their children. :cool:

[Dagless]

stupid kids. i have no sympathy for people who go round taking drugs or trying to get the same effect. its pathetic.

god when i was 13 we were playing British Bulldog... not injecting LCD into our eyes with a noose around the neck, with an STD, a baby and a council house to boot. and that was only 6 years ago. idiots.

[Lacero]

stupid kids. i have no sympathy for people who go round taking drugs or trying to get the same effect. its pathetic.I agree. I think we should round up all the troublemakers and gas them.

[devilot]

god when i was 13 we were playing British Bulldog... not injecting LCD into our eyes with a noose around the neck, with an STD, a baby and a council house to boot. and that was only 6 years ago. idiots.
So you're 19 now, and you're already intolerant of others' mistakes? We've all made mistakes-- some people die making theirs, others luck out. I'm nearly 21 and when I was 13, I knew several peers who were already slanging coke and crack, but I didn't do any of those drugs, and still haven't to this day. Undoubtedly, the values and morals instilled in one from family and your close circle has some play. However, I still don't think it's fair to cast these misguided youths as "stupid." In all likelihood, they're probably above average in their schoolwork-- but because they are not stimulated in other ways, resort to stimulation through unhealthy, external means such as drugs, video games (think of that other thread w/ the guy who died after 50 hours of game play), or this choking game phenomenon.

[~Shard~]

So you're 19 now, and you're already intolerant of others' mistakes? We've all made mistakes-- some people die making theirs, others luck out. I'm nearly 21 and when I was 13, I knew several peers who were already slanging coke and crack, but I didn't do any of those drugs, and still haven't to this day. Undoubtedly, the values and morals instilled in one from family and your close circle has some play. However, I still don't think it's fair to cast these misguided youths as "stupid." In all likelihood, they're probably above average in their schoolwork-- but because they are not stimulated in other ways, resort to stimulation through unhealthy, external means such as drugs, video games (think of that other thread w/ the guy who died after 50 hours of game play), or this choking game phenomenon.

Very good post devilot76. As you say, a lot of it stems from the values that are instilled by the parents. That, or just actually spending time with your kids, knowing what they are doing and *gasp* taking an interest in your children. So many parents nowadays seem to use the TV, computer and video game console as a babysitter. Without guidance and a general sense of what is right and wrong, how can we expect anything else from these kids? They are either not being properly informed/educated/brought up by their parents, or they are lacking something in their life (parental attention, other hobbies, etc.) which their parents should recognize and address.

At the end of the day though, this is really extreme. When I was a kid I would just have sticked to playing with my G.I. Joe, He-Man and Transformers any day of the week. :cool:

[applemacdude]

I guess your influences depends on your surroundings

[rainman::|:|]

Wait, who injected LSD into their eyes? I mean, you can barely even get acid anymore, all that happened in the 70s. So right there, you see how our generation is using a lot less mind-altering substances(/methods) than previous. I mean, speaking as one who is pretty familiar with street drugs, dangerous hallucinogenics like acid, peyote, mescaline, and psilocybin are more difficult to find than ever.

In the war on drugs, the casuality are the kids who should be smoking pot, but instead strangle themselves.

Still not amused by those who find this "just" or "funny".

[~Shard~]

... the casuality are the kids who should be smoking pot ...

Some would argue that there are no children who should be smoking pot, but that's a discussion for another thread... ;)

[Dagless]

Well when I was a kid and was with my parents, and there was a drunk guy or watching TV and some other guy doing drugs. they wouldn't tell a 7 year old the whole details about why somebody would do that, or their lives or anything they'd just say "what an idiot" or similar. hell it taught me. my mates were the same.

[PaRaGoNViCtiM]

This "Passing out game" is it just like "California High"?! I don't know if anyone here has ever heard this term, but when I was young, my friends and I use to play "California High" all the time. Crazy stuff!

[deanbo]

I thought a boy of this age would be intelligent enough to know that hanging yourself from a tree is not particularly good idea, especially if you want to live. I used to play a game similar to this in school but it didn't involve hanging yourself from a tree...

[PaRaGoNViCtiM]

I thought a boy of this age would be intelligent enough to know that hanging yourself from a tree is not particularly good idea, especially if you want to live. I used to play a game similar to this in school but it didn't involve hanging yourself from a tree...
Yea, the game we used to play didn't require that either.

[absolut_mac]

Well pot can't kill you, or cause brain damage at all, so yes.

Mick Jagger and all the other rockers from that generation are proof of that.

And before anyone starts listing all the rockers that OD'd, it was too much of the *hard* stuff that did in Jimi Hendrix and Jim Morrison. Too bad, because I miss them both.

[rendezvouscp]

I used to do this with friends in High School. Only, we wouldn't choke or hang ourselves. We'd have someone stand up against a tree or solid wall, have them breathe in, and someone else would press against their chest where their lungs are located and that person would pass out for a split second. Only thing is, you felt like it was an hour you were out of it.

No one ever got hurt.

Hanging yourself is stupid. These kids aren't doing it right!

Before I read the article I thought they were doing it "the right way." I've played "the game" before (I really don't think it's a game, more like an experience). You'd put the person against a wall, you'd clear the surroundings around them, put a few people around them to make sure they're safe wherever they start to fall (but they'd usually just slide down the wall and not fall anywhere), and then have the person breathe quickly while hunched over. Once the person was light-headed, then they'd pull themselves up and someone would "choke" them (that seems a lot more violent than just putting a finger on their neck though). The person would be out for just a few seconds, and that was it.

Yes, I'm one of those "stupid kids." I found that it was like a high (but never doing drugs this was a first for me, and I won't ever know what a real high feels like), but it's shocking that people do this by themselves and actually hang themselves. That's almost like suicide. How would you plan to fall out and not be strangled to death while unconscious?

For all of you who would think that kids doing pot wouldn't do this, I've got some friends to show you.

This "Passing out game" is it just like "California High"?! I don't know if anyone here has ever heard this term, but when I was young, my friends and I use to play "California High" all the time. Crazy stuff!

I'm guessing there's a bunch of names for it, but California High is interesting, being in California and having played "the game."

Overall? There seems to be a sense of security in "the game" that you can't die from it, at least the way I know how to "play it." It's sad that someone lost their life because they weren't thinking, but it happens every day in life.
-Chase

[gwuMACaddict]

you people would actually do this??

why??

killing brain cells for fun? this is really beyond my realm of comprehension...

[scubabeano]

People do it because like most stuff that's bad for you, it feels good.

[kalisphoenix]

I intentionally passed out once in seventh grade, with the direct influence of someone else (ie, I breathed out and got nailed in the chest). I have a very definite, clear memory of seeing myself (hands and feet and such) floating around in pure blackness that stretched out forever, and then the locker room (where this happened) rushed in around me like the endless shelves of weapons in t3h Matrix. I never did it again, though I considered it a very interesting experience worthy of being explored... for me, the variables seemed too much, and I'm not particularly interested in dying when there is so much left to experience. But then, if I was an epileptic I would probably give myself seizures intentionally...

It is funny, though, that the "drug" frenzy whips up immediately. Hey -- guess what! Some people are born wanting to get high. I was. I had a dream when I was about six where I saw fractals and geometric patterns, and when I woke up I almost cried because I realized I couldn't see anything so beautiful in real life -- and I didn't see it again until I dropped LSD about 13 years later. I'd wanted to have a near-death experience ever since I first heard about them, and got my chance with an intramuscular injection of ketamine hydrochloride at 23. Let's not mention the warm sensations of wandering around through Middle-Earth on a nice psilocybin boatride...
Anyway, there are people who are born with an intense curiosity about their environment and their perceptions about that environment or their thought processes, and these people are likely to eat mescal beans or do whatever it takes to get high. This has little to do with whether one has a good old-fashioned upraising with family dinners and corporal punishment. Actually, if anything you'll tend to find the "exploring" mentality most often in children with secure attachments, who by definition are more well-adjusted individuals... when you were a tiny child, what did you do when your mother left the room?

Oh, yeah, and there are also people who do drugs for other reasons, although I can't really fathom what these reasons might be. I knew guys in college who'd get drunk so they could talk to girls easier, or drink heavily and snort a lot of ritalin so that they'd stay up longer, or snort cocaine so they'd have a lot of energy, or smoke pot just because "it made everything funny." I also knew guys who'd get drunk in order to lower their inhibitions and make a tense night more relaxing and productive on an interpersonal level. I also knew guys who'd snort cocaine because it heightened their ability to relate to political philosophy (sounds like a whacked example, but I used to smoke pot with two guys who'd only snort coke when they were discussing Hobbes).

Oops... too far off-topic. Better just start a whole new post now.

[kalisphoenix]

Anyway, what I mean to say is that you can't look at the behavior and infer its motive, necessarily. You read this article and there is nothing to suggest that these children were trying to get "high", other than the fact that these children committed suicide before puberty.

[rendezvouscp]

Anyway, what I mean to say is that you can't look at the behavior and infer its motive, necessarily. You read this article and there is nothing to suggest that these children were trying to get "high", other than the fact that these children committed suicide before puberty.

That's true. I know I did it because everyone was talking about the dreams you'd have while you were out, but the "high" was just a side effect, not to mention that I felt really refreshed like I had just woken up from a night's sleep.
-Chase

[~Shard~]

if I was an epileptic I would probably give myself seizures intentionally...

I'm sure my cousin who has severe epilepsy and is on heavy medication to supress his potentially-fatal seizures would love to trade places with you. Please try being a little more tasteful and appreciative of what you have when it comes to your health. :mad: :cool:

[themacman]

happend to a private school here, very sad.

[amin]

When I was in elementary school, I remember doing something analagous to this. I think what we did was exhale maximally, then someone would push on our chest making it hard to breath. There wsa no choking involved. None of us did it to get high. I think we each tried it just to see what it was. I was 10 and definitely felt that getting high was wrong. I remember some kids would pass out though. The very first day we did this, the principal saw us doing it in the playground during recess, yelled at us, and we never did it again. I think that some of you just don't understand the fact that kids aren't born with common sense. Those of us who are parents get it. I feel terrible for the parents of these children. Danger is around every corner when one raises a child.

[tlh]

Normally I am a very tolerant person, but this subject is so sensitive to me that I couldn't help but be offended by some of the comments of the children dying from this game, such as 'retarted' or my least favorite "imagine if these children had lived."
I was researching the pass out game, and came across these comments, and couldn't bring myself not to add my own, as I found many of these comments ignorant, insensitive, and brutal.
You see, my 12 year old beautiful brother was found hanging one morning in January, by my now very screwed up mother. Can you imagine finding someone you love like that, with no warning? I bet you can't. While two of the police officers automatically ruled suicide, the third, and the priest, said it definitly looked accidental. My little brothers feet were touching the ground, and he was found hanging by a strong necklace. Rumors of this pass out game, which we had never heard of, circulated. There was no note nor evidence of it being a suicide.
If you had been through such a traumatic event, you would change the way you viewed these 'stupid children' drastically.
I must say, and let me relate this to you in terms that you can understand....how many adults, yourself included, drive after having quite a few drinks, although you know its life threatening? Far to many. I guess you could most likely call yourself 'stupid, retarted' and if you died "I couldn't imagine what you would of turned out like had you lived." This is just one example of many.
For your information, children are not adults. They do not process information as we do, and are far less expierenced, educated, and alot more ignorant. Thats why there are parents, meant to teach, guide, and steer young children away from trouble. You must not be used to young children, otherwise you would not label these children as 'retarted'. My brother was exceptionally intelligent.
I do not really mean to respond in anger, as some of the comments were well informed, but many others very ignorant and insensitive. Please be more careful about the words you choose, they do hurt.
Since my little brother can no longer defend himself, I will do it for him. :(

[Doctor Q]

What happened to your brother is simply awful, tlh, and you have my sympathies. No doubt everyone in your family has been deeply affected, not just your mother. What a terrible shame.

Teens and pre-teens (and plenty of young adults) think they are invincible. I think it is normal human behavior while growing up to think of mortality as something that others worry about, because parents (if they are doing their job) protect you when you are very young, so you don't think of yourself as being vulnerable until you become more world aware and learn to separate from your parents. That's probably as it should be, since youngsters couldn't really deal with all the dangers in the world, nor cope with the responsibility. Unfortunately, tragedies like this can be the result.

It's easy to talk about other people's problems in a flippant way when you don't know them personally, and because forum members are not face to face. Thanks for giving us your first-person account. We needed to hear it. Perhaps you can do some good for others by relating your family's experience, and I hope it helps you deal with it too.

[kalisphoenix]

I'm sure my cousin who has severe epilepsy and is on heavy medication to supress his potentially-fatal seizures would love to trade places with you. Please try being a little more tasteful and appreciative of what you have when it comes to your health. :mad: :cool:

If he has problems that serious with his health, then I feel sorry for him, but it doesn't change the fact that if I had TLE (granted, we'll assume that it's not potentially fatal), I'd probably intentionally induce seizures -- I should also note that this is not an uncommon occurrence. Some TL epileptics refer to their condition as "temporal lobe ecstasy"....

[~Shard~]

If he has problems that serious with his health, then I feel sorry for him, but it doesn't change the fact that if I had TLE (granted, we'll assume that it's not potentially fatal), I'd probably intentionally induce seizures -- I should also note that this is not an uncommon occurrence. Some TL epileptics refer to their condition as "temporal lobe ecstasy"....

All I'm saying is try to be more respectful and sensitive towards those who do have epilepsy. I am sure that my cousin is not alone in that if he could choose, he would choose a normal, healthy life as opposed to having seizures. Many epileptics would gladly trade their lives with you if you were more than willing to have these seizures instead of them. And I realize you're not saying you WANT to have this condition, only that if you DID, then you would take these actions, but nonetheless, it is still a bit of a slap in the face to the people inflicted by these ailments to imply that these seizures are almost "desirable" and that you're almost envious of them. Be fortunate for what you have, many people do not have the choice. :cool:

With regards to this whole topic (not directed at you) I don't understand how some people can take their health for granted. Kids, sure, they don't know any better in some cases - that's where you need good parents. But as for adults themselves, they have no excuses. They have perfectly healthy minds and bodies, yet abuse them and destroy them in some cases. The mind is probably the most important asset a person has, yet some people take drugs and cause irreparable damage to their brain. I find it hard to respect people who don't even respect their own health and themselves. :cool:

[wdlove]

Yes, good health is something to honor. Sadly most don't realize how important good health is until its lost. Have seen a lot of misery in my career asa nurse. Many ponder on the fact that one should enjoy good health.

I just thought of another take on the passing out game. I attended nurse flight school in the Air Force Reserve. That taught us to recognize the loss of oxygen to the brain. This game and sniffing causes the same problem. They wanted us to know what it feels like so that we would recognize the problem and take corrective actions during a flight. We were in a sealed chamber as a group. Had us put on oxygen masks and they removed all the oxygen in the air. It was for us to observe others also. You could see the loss of oxygen and turning blue. It causes a feeling of euphoria. That was at the point that they wanted our mask on. Some of our members needed assistance to put the mask on again. Very scary to lack oxygen. :eek:

[WillMak]

Well pot can't kill you, or cause brain damage at all, so yes.


Pot can't cause brain damage? are you sure about that?

[~Shard~]

Pot can't cause brain damage? are you sure about that?

I chuckled when I read that comment as well. Yeah, and alcohol can't cause liver damage... :rolleyes:

All drugs of this nature affect the brain in a negative capacity, regardless of any side effects which are incorrectly perceived as "beneficial". Anyone who believes otherwise is simply fooling themselves. But, we're somewhat straying off topic here, this is probably best left for another discussion in another thread.... :cool:

[wdlove]

Pot can't cause brain damage? are you sure about that?

Here is a list of drugs and a detailed explanation of the effects on the brain.

It goes along with humans wanting to alter their reality rather depriving of oxygen or drugs. :(

http://www.nationalfamilies.org/brain/

[~Shard~]

Here is a list of drugs and a detailed explanation of the effects on the brain.

http://www.nationalfamilies.org/brain/

Thanks fore the link wdlove, I appreciate information like this especially from people in your profession. I believe in some respects you can speak to these issues better than others due to your knowledge, education and experience. :cool:

It goes along with humans wanting to alter their reality rather depriving of oxygen or drugs. :(

And what a truly sad thing that is. I embrace life, live it to its fullest, and take in as much as I can - as a result, I experience natural highs all the time, and have no desire to harm my brain to experience artificial highs. If those people had a true appreciation for life and what "reality" really is, they would have no need to alter it in the first place. I feel sorry for people who need to resort to drugs. :(

But here I am going against what I just said in my last post - topics for other conversations. :o I'll try to get back on the topic at hand, which deals with a child who unfortunately lacked a lot of guidance. :(

[AP_piano295]

It obvious whos to blame for this, violent videogames and movies
duhhhhhhhhh :rolleyes:

[Chip NoVaMac]

Normally I am a very tolerant person, but this subject is so sensitive to me that I couldn't help but be offended by some of the comments of the children dying from this game, such as 'retarted' or my least favorite "imagine if these children had lived."
I was researching the pass out game, and came across these comments, and couldn't bring myself not to add my own, as I found many of these comments ignorant, insensitive, and brutal.
You see, my 12 year old beautiful brother was found hanging one morning in January, by my now very screwed up mother. Can you imagine finding someone you love like that, with no warning? I bet you can't. While two of the police officers automatically ruled suicide, the third, and the priest, said it definitly looked accidental. My little brothers feet were touching the ground, and he was found hanging by a strong necklace. Rumors of this pass out game, which we had never heard of, circulated. There was no note nor evidence of it being a suicide.
If you had been through such a traumatic event, you would change the way you viewed these 'stupid children' drastically.
I must say, and let me relate this to you in terms that you can understand....how many adults, yourself included, drive after having quite a few drinks, although you know its life threatening? Far to many. I guess you could most likely call yourself 'stupid, retarted' and if you died "I couldn't imagine what you would of turned out like had you lived." This is just one example of many.
For your information, children are not adults. They do not process information as we do, and are far less expierenced, educated, and alot more ignorant. Thats why there are parents, meant to teach, guide, and steer young children away from trouble. You must not be used to young children, otherwise you would not label these children as 'retarted'. My brother was exceptionally intelligent.
I do not really mean to respond in anger, as some of the comments were well informed, but many others very ignorant and insensitive. Please be more careful about the words you choose, they do hurt.
Since my little brother can no longer defend himself, I will do it for him. :(

My sincerest sympathies to you and your family over a young persons life being cut short by what ever means.

I will take it that your brother was lost to "huffing" and not "auto-erotica". In either case, the loved ones - and in most cases it is the loved ones - are victims by fact of the "discovery".

The comments about a wasted life IMO are meant more in a more positive way. Being Gay, I have lost friend to auto-erotica and AIDS. I morn their loss on a personal basis and in society basis.

The use of "retard" is based on the present point of view of the writer. As we grow older we start to realize just how short life is, that we will not live for ever.

To be fair though, "children" of today are much wiser or "worldly" than I was (I am 47) at the same age. And that leads to danger. Wish there were a simple answer in order to prevent what happened to your brother from happening to others. All it takes is the "seed" of knowledge for people to act on bad information.

There is only so much that parents can do to protect their children today. Take away their computer, or log every website they visit is one. Only allow them to visit friends at your own home is another. Demand that schools and libraries have no internet access is another.

To provide some perspective here. I lost a good friend to auto-erotica. The family insisted that it be labeled suicide. So I do know the pain you and your family feel.

I see where you are coming from though. If your brother or these other kids had died doing crack or other drugs, they would not wear the label of being "retarded"; though they took risks in order to get a "high".

Again with my "many" years of life experiences behind me (for the life of me, I can not understand anyone having unprotected sex today), I do offer my thoughts and prayers to you and everyone that your brother touched. Try to find comfort in that in your sharing, some one might learn from your loss.

[wPod]

It obvious whos to blame for this, violent videogames and movies
duhhhhhhhhh :rolleyes:

well, i was going to take the argument that it was the parents' fault for not being there for the kids!!! but then kalisphoenix made a very interesting argument. . .

Some people are born wanting to get high.

which suddenly dawned on me as a somewhat legitimate explination. i doubt a kid, especially 12 or so thinks to themsleves "hey, i want to get high" but more along the lines of "wow if i <fill in the blank> then it feels good and i like it" some people like different things. i might fill in the blank with "ride my bike" while someone else might say "play the pass out game"

the true follow up question then becomes: what gives the predisposition to people? and no, dont turn around and say video games. because if you do then ill just ask what makes kids play video games?

[Chip NoVaMac]

All I'm saying is try to be more respectful and sensitive towards those who do have epilepsy. I am sure that my cousin is not alone in that if he could choose, he would choose a normal, healthy life as opposed to having seizures. Many epileptics would gladly trade their lives with you if you were more than willing to have these seizures instead of them. And I realize you're not saying you WANT to have this condition, only that if you DID, then you would take these actions, but nonetheless, it is still a bit of a slap in the face to the people inflicted by these ailments to imply that these seizures are almost "desirable" and that you're almost envious of them. Be fortunate for what you have, many people do not have the choice. :cool:

With regards to this whole topic (not directed at you) I don't understand how some people can take their health for granted. Kids, sure, they don't know any better in some cases - that's where you need good parents. But as for adults themselves, they have no excuses. They have perfectly healthy minds and bodies, yet abuse them and destroy them in some cases. The mind is probably the most important asset a person has, yet some people take drugs and cause irreparable damage to their brain. I find it hard to respect people who don't even respect their own health and themselves. :cool:

I think the issue is one of political correctness run amuck. For we are willing to forgive some, and not others.We fail to realize that the youths that are seeking a "high" with this "game" are lacking something in their own lives and from their families.

Keep in mind that we seem to feel that we can live forever. That something will correct the bad ways of our past lives. Look at liposuction and other cosmetic surgery.

Yes, good health is something to honor. Sadly most don't realize how important good health is until its lost. Have seen a lot of misery in my career asa nurse. Many ponder on the fact that one should enjoy good health.

I just thought of another take on the passing out game. I attended nurse flight school in the Air Force Reserve. That taught us to recognize the loss of oxygen to the brain. This game and sniffing causes the same problem. They wanted us to know what it feels like so that we would recognize the problem and take corrective actions during a flight. We were in a sealed chamber as a group. Had us put on oxygen masks and they removed all the oxygen in the air. It was for us to observe others also. You could see the loss of oxygen and turning blue. It causes a feeling of euphoria. That was at the point that they wanted our mask on. Some of our members needed assistance to put the mask on again. Very scary to lack oxygen. :eek:

That would be an interesting study - those that participated in such a training and down the road committed suicide by suffocation....

Here is a list of drugs and a detailed explanation of the effects on the brain.

It goes along with humans wanting to alter their reality rather depriving of oxygen or drugs. :(

http://www.nationalfamilies.org/brain/

Not to discount the information on this site, you have similar links from the AMA, NIH, or even the FDA? Not to say that I trust the government more, but there can be less bias from than links from "non-profits".

[kalisphoenix]

All I'm saying is try to be more respectful and sensitive towards those who do have epilepsy.

By lying?

All drugs of this nature affect the brain in a negative capacity, regardless of any side effects which are incorrectly perceived as "beneficial". Anyone who believes otherwise is simply fooling themselves. But, we're somewhat straying off topic here, this is probably best left for another discussion in another thread....

You wanna see some nasty **** that'll @#$% up your brain? Look at glutamate :P Absolutely annihilates your neurons. And that's in your brain! :eek:

Personally, I stay away from harmful chemicals. I don't smoke cigarettes, drink alcohol, drink coffee/tea, eat cane sugar, drink cow milk, eat red meat, or any of that other poisonous crap. That stuff's horrible! Red meat is a leading cause of intestinal cancer.

It goes along with humans wanting to alter their reality rather depriving of oxygen or drugs.

http://www.nationalfamilies.org/brain/

Pot? Pot's @#$%ing harmless. All the NFIA's website could say is that heavy use messes you up. Well, no ****! Heavy use of anything messes you up. All it could say about LSD is that some users experience flashbacks, without mentioning that the incidence for unpleasant flashbacks in LSD users is lower than the occurence of unpleasant flashbacks in the population as a whole. And maybe it's my drug-addled mind and all these damn tracers affecting my vision, but I can't find any mention at all on that site of psilocybin mushrooms, one of the most popular illicit entheogens in our society.

Putting marijuana in the same category as cocaine or heroin or crystal meth is like putting milk in the same category as Everclear. Seriously -- just because they share some extremely superficial characteristics is no reason to assume that they are equal in effect or equally deserving of prohibition.

And what a truly sad thing that is. I embrace life, live it to its fullest, and take in as much as I can - as a result, I experience natural highs all the time, and have no desire to harm my brain to experience artificial highs. If those people had a true appreciation for life and what "reality" really is, they would have no need to alter it in the first place. I feel sorry for people who need to resort to drugs.

Neither you nor any other "straight-edger" have any comprehension whatsoever of "artificial highs." I find it amusing that, in the movies, I see people in Alcoholics Anonymous talking about "natural highs." But are you aware of the success rate of alcoholics attempting to reform by going to AA? About five percent. What is the success rate among those using LSD? About half. Kinda funny when God and support groups have one-tenth the effect of 100 micrograms of a synthesized alkaloid. Maybe there's more to the "artificial high" thing than you think, eh?
http://www.maps.org/media/nyt022204.html

"One of the founders of Alcoholics Anonymous [Bill Wilson] described to me the transcendental experience he credits with giving him control over his compulsive drinking. Years later he took LSD five or six times. This, he said, reinstated his original ecstasy, and consequently he wishes that LSD were more available to alcoholics."
-Walter Houston Clark. Chemical Ecstasy: Psychedelic Drugs and Religion, page 101. Sheed & Ward, New York. 1969.

Gee... it's so horrible to think of all the lives ripped apart by a lack of LSD :D

[~Shard~]

By lying?

Um, no, no one ever asked you to lie. Just use a little thing called tact, that's all. It's all about being considerate. :)

You wanna see some nasty **** that'll @#$% up your brain? Look at glutamate :P Absolutely annihilates your neurons. And that's in your brain! :eek:

Yes, you are correct. Actually, oxygen is technically poisonous to humans as well, yet we need it to live. ;)

Personally, I stay away from harmful chemicals. I don't smoke cigarettes, drink alcohol, drink coffee/tea, eat cane sugar, drink cow milk, eat red meat, or any of that other poisonous crap. That stuff's horrible! Red meat is a leading cause of intestinal cancer.

Good for you, I wish more people were as health conscious as you are. :) I treat myself from time to time, as I believe everything in moderation (and as I eluded to above, essentially everything is poisonous for us anyway), but yes, I don't smoke, I have a glass of red wine maybe once a week (if that), I don't drink coffee, I have as little sugar as possible, and only eat fresh "real" meat from the butcher's shop, not anything processed or injected with steroids, growth hormones and who knows what else. As I said, everything in moderation, with some obvious exceptions - I will never eat fast food (there's another great MacRumors thread on that topic), or poison my brain with "street drugs" (or whatever you want to call them). Otherwise, I've been known to enjoy a nice bowl of ice cream from time to time. :o

Pot? Pot's @#$%ing harmless. All the NFIA's website could say is that heavy use messes you up. Well, no ****! Heavy use of anything messes you up.

<snip>

Putting marijuana in the same category as cocaine or heroin or crystal meth is like putting milk in the same category as Everclear. Seriously -- just because they share some extremely superficial characteristics is no reason to assume that they are equal in effect or equally deserving of prohibition.

I definitely wouldn't call pot harmless, but I agree that it shouldn't be classified in the same league as heroin or cocaine. But, as you say, many things are harmful to us, especially in excessive dosages - heck, water is harmful to human in excessive doses. ;) Nonetheless, I just don't like the idea of adversely affecting my brain with something like pot or any other drug of that nature - I value my mental health far too much. To each his own though.

People saying that pot is harmless reminds me of people back in the 50's saying that smoking cigarettes were harmless before they knew any better. In fact, they even went so far as to say that cigarette smoking was healthy for you! :eek:

Neither you nor any other "straight-edger" have any comprehension whatsoever of "artificial highs."

Nope, nor do I have any desire to. Your point being? ;)

Oh, and if a "straight-edger" is the same as a person who respects and cares about their mind, body, health and well-being then yes, I guess that would be an accurate label to use. But, as I say, everything in moderation - awareness and balance is the key. :cool:

As I said, if people feel the need to resort to drugs to experience these "artificial highs", that's really too bad - there's so much to experience in life that gives you natural highs which isn't detrimental to your health and well-being. But, as I said, to each his own.

Thanks for the discussion, I appreciate it. :)