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View Full Version : Does this logo look alright?




dogbone
Feb 21, 2006, 11:21 PM
This is the final version. There was much agonising over how to deal with the ampersand.



p0intblank
Feb 22, 2006, 12:30 AM
It looks fine now, but I think it would look neat if you made the & symbol the same yellow as the bottom of the logo.

evilgEEk
Feb 22, 2006, 01:00 AM
I agree with p0intblank, try the ampersand the same shade of yellow as "Accounting Solutions".

A good rule to keep in mind when creating logos is try to keep the colors as limited as possible. Especially if said design is for a small company, because the more colors there are the more expensive it will be to print.

Generally I try to create my designs in black and white first, and then start adding colors. The reason I do this is because it's inevitable that your design will be printed in black and white at some point, and sometimes a great design when in color looks bad in black and white. I think you'd be okay with this particular design since it's relatively simple, but just something to keep in mind.

Arnaud
Feb 22, 2006, 01:27 AM
On the other hand, the ampersand in yellow would pull the attention to 1) the ampersand, 2) the "accounting solutions" and finally 3) the "S" and "K", hence the name. Isn't it a little backward order :confused:

Additionally, in grey / black & white, both the yellow and the grey could be turned into grey or even white, no ?

Otherwise, to follow the line of the other posts, maybe the S and K in yellow, the ampersand in white ? But that looks "gold" oriented.

Don't know, just talking about my perception... :)

A.

CanadaRAM
Feb 22, 2006, 01:33 AM
What is SEK's business again? (say it out loud if you don't get it the first time)

Gotta watch out for graphic elements that read like letters, or letters that read like the wrong letters --- the first-glance impression may be unfavorable.

Consider what would happen with FLICK your BIC
if the L and I were kerned too close. (Saw something like this on the grocery store shelf yesterday)

Blue Velvet
Feb 22, 2006, 01:51 AM
OK, my 2 cents... no to the ampersand being yellow. Why put such a strong visual emphasis on an ampersand?

The first thing I immediately noticed was that the top line doesn't look centred even though it may be as measured by a ruler. The amount of negative space to the right of the K outweighs the margin to the left of the S.

The more I look at it, the more it bugs me.

Arnaud
Feb 22, 2006, 02:02 AM
OK, my 2 cents... no to the ampersand being yellow. Why put such a strong visual emphasis on an ampersand?

The first thing I immediately noticed was that the top line doesn't look centred even though it may be as measured by a ruler. The amount of negative space to the right of the K outweighs the margin to the left of the S.

The more I look at it, the more it bugs me.

The negative space effect could be reduced with broader sides, with both letters away from the sides, so that the relative amounts are reduced too.
You don't really need to almost-stick the letters to the side of the logo, do you ?

You could also start from the Ampersand, centered, and then place S and K with some space, not all stuck together.

ATD
Feb 22, 2006, 02:10 AM
Ask 5 designers and you are going to get 6 different opinions. :D

My 2, try making the & smaller or outline it or a darker blue. Right now it is drawing too much attention to itself.

Arnaud
Feb 22, 2006, 04:30 AM
Additionally: besides my critics, I had a good feeling of the colours and all, just got a little bugged on some details.

Don't let our comments put you down ! :)

dogbone
Feb 22, 2006, 04:33 AM
Terrific comments, thanks to everyone. My first thoughts on dealing with this ridiculous ampersand between two letters was to make it smaller but that looked as bad or worse. I thought a + sign might work which I have seen in other accounting logos but the ampersand is part of their registered name.

I mainly put this up here to see if there was a unanimous response to make the amp smaller, which there wasn't so that is good.

They wanted blue and yellow and the amp is a tint so it's still two colours and It does work well in B/W. So I'll go with putting some more tint in the amp to knock it back and I'll try some more space on the side to see if I can visually centre it better.

I'll put a couple of minor variations up soon.


Blue Velvet
Yes what you have said is exactly as I saw it.

dogbone
Feb 22, 2006, 06:00 AM
both these have more tint. The bigger one has some extra tracking on the 'account sol'

My challenge now is to get the tint percentage right. And I am at a bit of a loss here. I want it dark enough to kill the ampersand but not so dark as it looks odd, it's 30% at the moment.

What do you guys think,

dogbone
Feb 22, 2006, 06:18 AM
btw, here's the logo of their umbrella organisation. Which is why they chose yellow and blue. I wanted a logo that would associate with their logo without looking too blatent.

PS CanadaRam
About 20 years ago there was a huge hand painted billboard in Thailand advertising the latest Clint Eastwood movie and the L and I were indeed run together.

RideIt
Feb 22, 2006, 10:15 AM
I don't like the font... I too agree its looks off center even though its not.

nbs2
Feb 22, 2006, 10:25 AM
I have to agree with the comments taking issue with the font. The K just looks way bigger than the S...I would probably feel better if the S was a bit wider. Right now the first thing I think of is Agustus Gloop after going through the pipes - his fat got all smooshed together. Would it be unreasonable or inappropriate to try out the S&K with the same font as CPA?

Arnaud
Feb 22, 2006, 11:20 AM
I have to agree with the comments taking issue with the font. The K just looks way bigger than the S...I would probably feel better if the S was a bit wider. Right now the first thing I think of is Agustus Gloop after going through the pipes - his fat got all smooshed together. Would it be unreasonable or inappropriate to try out the S&K with the same font as CPA?

The problem is that K's are often bigger than S's, especially in bold and more classical fonts with serif... The font of CPA might give the same disbalance! (Compare the P and the C for instance).

S&K

(In bold Times New Roman).

nbs2
Feb 22, 2006, 11:26 AM
The problem is that K's are often bigger than S's, especially in bold and more classical fonts with serif... The font of CPA might give the same disbalance! (Compare the P and the C for instance).

S&K

(In bold Times New Roman).
But, if you compare your TNR with the original, the two are at least somewhat more balanced. I'm not denying that there will always be some imbalance (unless you use terminal...hmmmm), but I just wonder if the two letters will demand something that provides more balance

Seasought
Feb 22, 2006, 11:37 AM
This is the final version. There was much agonising over how to deal with the ampersand.

I would suggest adding some transparency to the ampersand. Also, can you convert the 'K' to outlines and shrink the width of the K a bit so that it's a bit more narrow (like the 'S'). It looks like the K is somewhat off in comparison to the 'S'.

Just my opinion, for what it's worth.

dogbone
Feb 22, 2006, 12:43 PM
I don't know why I always seem to get stuck with letters that don't logo together, (is it legal to use logo as a verb?). Last time it was AAC, try it, it's a crap combination.

OK I do tend to agree with everyone, I got to this font because all the other ampersands were so fugly.

Here's a thinned down 'K' which is better balanced with the 'S' unfortunately it sort of opens up the neg K space again, or does it?

2nyRiggz
Feb 22, 2006, 01:10 PM
Change the fonts...too much attention is on the & thats the focus point in your logo and it distracts from the name. Make it smaller or something and a yellow color would be fine.


Bless

dogbone
Feb 22, 2006, 01:29 PM
How about this, I think it is an improvement. I'm never going to be able to do anything about the extra neg space to the right of the K unless I don't use an enclosing box.

flyfish29
Feb 22, 2006, 01:30 PM
On the other hand, the ampersand in yellow would pull the attention to 1) the ampersand, 2) the "accounting solutions" and finally 3) the "S" and "K", hence the name. Isn't it a little backward order :confused:
.

The above is EXACTLY TRUE! You want your business and "name" = S K to be front and center either by size or color.

Just to throw out some ideas- (not that I agree with all of them but it might spark another idea:
What about shortening to just accounting?

Making accounting larger with solutions smaller?

Keep the & a light blue, S K a screen of the gold and make the & much smaller?

Make the S and K overlap with a small & in white or light blue- then accounting much larger?

What about changing the company name to A & S Accounting Solutions...say it fast and yout will get the joke.:D

Hope some of this helps.

flyfish29
Feb 22, 2006, 01:33 PM
How about this, I think it is an improvement. I'm never going to be able to do anything about the extra neg space to the right of the K unless I don't use an eclosing box.

I like the improvements but I still think that the accounting part is too small- If the letter part of the logo were catchy or something I would say it might be easy for people to identify with the "name" and know it is accounting, but really, I think most people will not remember the letters therefore you really need two things to happen- you need a very identifiable logo (which I think you are close to) and you need to convey the main business (acconting) very clearly.

What about making the logo just be S & K accounting and then have a short sentence that is included below or next to the logo like "Financial solutions for..." or "Financial Solutions for an ever changing world." or something like that. Then your logo is very identifiable, says your business and the extra text gives a soft message about the company.
Does this company have a niche at all or are they simply an accounting firm? That would be important to know. (I worked in advertising and marketing for 15 years before becoming an educator. If I had more time I would brainstorm more for you.)

good luck

dogbone
Feb 22, 2006, 01:40 PM
Unfortunately their registered business name is S&K Accounting Solutions and I can't do anything about that.

It's 6:40 am here and the kookaburras have just started. I might try 'accounting solutions' on two lines and rework it tomorrow...er...later today.

dejo
Feb 22, 2006, 01:45 PM
If you want to draw the least attention to the ampersand, I'd suggest making it white, the same color as the S and K. That way it is blends in and is "camouflaged" by those letters.

Arnaud
Feb 22, 2006, 02:30 PM
If you want to draw the least attention to the ampersand, I'd suggest making it white, the same color as the S and K. That way it is blends in and is "camouflaged" by those letters.

It might as well confuse more, now ? A big, white name.

What about thinning the Ampersand, i.e. keep a bold-looking typo the letters and the thinner looking typo for the Ampersand ? You can even mix different fonts, as long as they get close to each other.

I'd still keep a Serif typo though, it looks "classical and serious". A non-serif would be too modern for a company which takes care of your money... (It'd look like Enron to me !)

Proposal 251: S&K

...Ok, this one looks ugly, but you can play more with your own typos !

NB: 20 assistants, only one being really responsible for the logo... Good luck !

dogbone
Feb 22, 2006, 02:49 PM
I really appreciate you guys taking an interest in this.

I couldn't sleep so I had a few more goes. The ampersand will not work as white, too confusing.

I think this latest one looks about as optically balanced as I could make it. I had to enlarge the blue copy to disguise the off centre logo (which actually appears centred, sort of) which is a good thing anyway. What makes this job even more challenging is that they have already accepted it, so I'm only doing all this for my own sake of not wanting to supply crap.

Arnaud
Feb 22, 2006, 03:03 PM
I think this latest one looks about as optically balanced as I could make it. I had to enlarge the blue copy to disguise the off centre logo (which actually appears centred, sort of) which is a good thing anyway. What makes this job even more challenging is that they have already accepted it, so I'm only doing all this for my own sake of not wanting to supply crap.

Looks quite good to me :)
No confusion, clear S and K, no optical disbalance...

Congratulations !

A.

makisushi
Feb 22, 2006, 03:22 PM
I really appreciate you guys taking an interest in this.

I couldn't sleep so I had a few more goes. The ampersand will not work as white, too confusing.

I think this latest one looks about as optically balanced as I could make it. I had to enlarge the blue copy to disguise the off centre logo (which actually appears centred, sort of) which is a good thing anyway. What makes this job even more challenging is that they have already accepted it, so I'm only doing all this for my own sake of not wanting to supply crap.

Designing logos is the toughest venture. That is why they are so expensive. I used to charge more for a logo than a 64 page brochure.

ok...now for my critique, and keep in mind, I am an arrogant prick.

It may be "optically balanced" but I am not quite feeling the essence of it. At first glance, I get the feeling that the firm is a new firm trying to look and feel like an old firm.
The blue and yellow convey a "royal" feeling to me. The colors themselves are bold and it screams for more dynamics.
It needs to be more dramatic. None of the objects in your logo interact with each other. It is ok to overlap things. Don't design in the center, it gives it no movement.

good luck!

CompUser
Feb 22, 2006, 03:32 PM
I'm no graphic design specialist, but it looks a little unbalanced.

Move the & up a little maybe?

dogbone
Feb 22, 2006, 05:41 PM
Designing logos is the toughest venture. That is why they are so expensive. I used to charge more for a logo than a 64 page brochure.

ok...now for my critique, and keep in mind, I am an arrogant prick.

It may be "optically balanced" but I am not quite feeling the essence of it. At first glance, I get the feeling that the firm is a new firm trying to look and feel like an old firm.
The blue and yellow convey a "royal" feeling to me. The colors themselves are bold and it screams for more dynamics.
It needs to be more dramatic. None of the objects in your logo interact with each other. It is ok to overlap things. Don't design in the center, it gives it no movement.

good luck!


Pretty spot on analysis. Do you think something like this could possibly work? I'm not sure what meaning would be taken from the smaller 'k'.

Here's two designers who haven't fared any better.
http://www.skmenswear.com/skmenswear/0010_index.asp
http://www.skecorp.com/

dogbone
Feb 22, 2006, 06:08 PM
OK it's all over, they like the big ampersand and don't want me to go any further.

Thanks for everyones input. It has been excellent. Here's one of the latest versions that they didn't see. Sort of like an outake.

Lau
Feb 22, 2006, 06:19 PM
I also thought a lighter weight of the same typeface for the ampersand - you keep the uniformity of the height of the letters, but the ampersand looks less important in the hierarchy. I did an example in Helvetica Neue, but obviously could just as easily be a serif typeface.

edit - oops, was doing the example, forgot to refresh and didn't see your post....:o

flyfish29
Feb 22, 2006, 09:49 PM
OK it's all over, they like the big ampersand and don't want me to go any further.

Thanks for everyones input. It has been excellent. Here's one of the latest versions that they didn't see. Sort of like an outake.

Boy- I really like the S and K with the and small and inside the two letters- your last post- I would only have put a slight amount of space between the S and the K but that looks very nice. It really makes the Accounting stand out with it larger!

makisushi
Feb 23, 2006, 08:32 AM
OK it's all over
Good job!

GoCubsGo
Feb 23, 2006, 08:42 AM
It looks fine now, but I think it would look neat if you made the & symbol the same yellow as the bottom of the logo.
TOTALLY AGREE!
Good eye.

Sam/B
Feb 23, 2006, 09:22 AM
I also think the font is dragging anything you do to it down. I can't see it ever looking professional with that font, the stroke weights shouldn't really vary that much.

Have a look through this a few times and reference to it when you can, i've found it very useful many a time - http://layersmagazine.com/magazine/novdec05/before_and_after.php

http://layersmagazine.com/images/magazine/novdec05/ba_image5.jpg

Blue Velvet
Feb 23, 2006, 09:33 AM
I also think the font is dragging anything you do to it down. I can't see it ever looking professional with that font, the stroke weights shouldn't really vary that much.

Stroke weights only come into play in terms of legibility for body copy.

Besides, Bodoni can be a beautiful face if generously leaded with a short measure and can be eminently suitable for display work.

usclaneyj
Feb 23, 2006, 10:19 AM
agree. nothing wrong with bodoni as a display face. i only dislike it when it is cramped up or streeeeeeeetched out.

_bnkr612
Feb 23, 2006, 10:25 AM
Is this a company that looks towards the future or dwells in it's past?

The font doesn't do anything for me. Maybe grandma would have grown up with that font.

What's your demographic? Sorry if grandma is your demo...

I whipped these up in 10 minutes. I would go with a sans serif identity and serif secondary... My two copper pieces...

http://www.imgdump.net/images/picture1.png

PS, those colors you are using don't suggest business, you need some darker hues.

RideIt
Feb 23, 2006, 10:29 AM
OK it's all over, they like the big ampersand and don't want me to go any further.

Thanks for everyones input. It has been excellent. Here's one of the latest versions that they didn't see. Sort of like an outake.

If your customer is happy thats all that matters... Good job man.

Arnaud
Feb 23, 2006, 12:29 PM
...Honestly, for the sake of talking, I stick to the serif typo, as in the last official design, type "S&K".
It's classical, as should be for stability and money.

Without being adressed to grandma's, accounting is the market. The other modern designs, type "S&K, appear to me like:
- Swedish furniture shop,
- nurses outsourcing,
- young-company-which-wants-to-look-trendy (but will drown in 2 years, like most of the young companies).

Anyway, my perception :p

2nyRiggz
Feb 23, 2006, 01:22 PM
OK it's all over, they like the big ampersand and don't want me to go any further.

Thanks for everyones input. It has been excellent. Here's one of the latest versions that they didn't see. Sort of like an outake.


That one is nice....except for the S being clouded by the K but its cool.


Bless

eclipse525
Feb 23, 2006, 09:45 PM
Pretty spot on analysis. Do you think something like this could possibly work? I'm not sure what meaning would be taken from the smaller 'k'.

Here's two designers who haven't fared any better.
http://www.skmenswear.com/skmenswear/0010_index.asp
http://www.skecorp.com/


NOW you are starting to actually design a logo. Keep thinking outside the box. It's still not there but keep thinking. I highly recommend you stay away from the typeface if you insist on that logo configuration. Best of Luck!


~e

stevep
Feb 24, 2006, 01:48 PM
I agree with bnkr612 about the colours - they look a bit like a cheap DIY shop logo. Try http://stylephreak.frogrun.com/cm.php for colour work. For each of the colours specified, these are the suggestions:

marchcapital
Feb 25, 2006, 04:31 PM
I also thought a lighter weight of the same typeface for the ampersand - you keep the uniformity of the height of the letters, but the ampersand looks less important in the hierarchy. I did an example in Helvetica Neue, but obviously could just as easily be a serif typeface.

edit - oops, was doing the example, forgot to refresh and didn't see your post....:o

i like Lau's font suggestion. i prefer the contemprary look. especially if its a new company. the originally posted logo has sort of a dated look; no affence to the graphic artist.