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MacRumors
Apr 25, 2006, 10:05 AM
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AdAge.com reports (http://adage.com/article.php?article_id=108772) that Apple is planning on incorporating ads into iTunes -- at least in a limited way.

The information comes from content partners who have reportedly been briefed on the plan.

Apple's current plans call for the ads to appear only in the lower-left corner of the iTunes library while users listen to podcasts from their computers rather than from portable devices.


The area is typically reserved for album covers, but for Podcasts could be a location to display sponsored ads. The commercial viability of Podcasting has been questioned a number of times as its popularity has grown.

twoodcc
Apr 25, 2006, 10:08 AM
i sure hope that this doesn't happen

jamdr
Apr 25, 2006, 10:08 AM
This is a step in the wrong direction I think. The major problem I have with ads in "the iTunes" is not that they are too annoying or intrusive, but that they would cheapen the look. Apple places so much value on their user interfaces and yet they are willing to throw that all away for some bright yellow ad for Nextel or something. I can just imagine a revision to the HIG: ugly ads are okay as long as they make you an extra buck.

avensis087
Apr 25, 2006, 10:11 AM
not really looking forward to seeing how this evolves...keep it in the podcasts, that's fine with me. but if advertising creeps into music or tv shows..or movies for that matter..i won't be too thrilled.

mr

gauchogolfer
Apr 25, 2006, 10:11 AM
The only way I'd like this is if was creator-driven, in order for podcasters to get some revenue for their work. Rather than product placement or audio ads tagged onto the front or end of an individual podcast, why not have it be like the 'chapter art' that is already available. Seems like this might be an unobtrusive way to incorporate ads into podcasts.

kretzy
Apr 25, 2006, 10:13 AM
Is it just me or does the title of this story not sounds right - "the iTunes"? I can't tell whether they mean the program or the music store. Either way I hate ads being integrated into things.

nagromme
Apr 25, 2006, 10:13 AM
"only in the lower-left corner"

Isn't that where album art and podcast images ALREADY appear? And can already be turned off?

So isn't this just (some) podcast creators putting an ad there instead of a more useful image?

How is this Apple doing anything? How is this a change to iTunes at all? What am I missing?

It just sounds like podcast creators trying to get some compensation, which seems like their choice.

Frankly, I'd rather have an image in the corner I can hide, than audio ads in the podcast--which I also think are fair enough if the podcast needs money. (Better an advertiser's money than mine.)

Maybe there's something horrible in the works, but nothing in the article tells me so.


... why not have it be like the 'chapter art' that is already available. Seems like this might be an unobtrusive way to incorporate ads into podcasts.
I assume this IS the chapter art, nothing more. Nothing in the article suggests otherwise to me.

840quadra
Apr 25, 2006, 10:14 AM
As long as these are only Apple related ads I am fine with it. It would be silly if Microsoft had an ad for XP or something of the sort located on this section. Regardless, I will be installing iTunes updates so long as they stay off the main program, and only in the Music store content.

:EDIT:

I didn't read close enough. This goes in the Album Art section of your screen and only displays if podcasts have ads within them. Well I guess this is ok, and from what I understand is already done on some podcasts when they change their picture (mid cast) to show a logo or shot of a sponsor related picture.

ImAlwaysRight
Apr 25, 2006, 10:21 AM
No! No! No! No! No! No! No!

icloud
Apr 25, 2006, 10:23 AM
The last thing i need is ad's in iTunes, it will really cause me to download my podcasts from the respective sites themselves, then simply pop it into itunes without using the music store for podcasts...

...to me, the great thing about the music store is its completely ad-free...no obtrusive content like that...only a matter of time from "ads in lower left corner" becomes a banner in iTMS, or a pop up or something

CubaTBird
Apr 25, 2006, 10:24 AM
iTunes, now bundled with spyware™:mad:

hcuar
Apr 25, 2006, 10:25 AM
It's a free service from Apple... If they want Ads to increase revenue and keep it otherwise "free"... let em. :rolleyes:

nagromme
Apr 25, 2006, 10:27 AM
iTunes, now bundled with spyware™:mad:
The last thing i need is ad's in iTunes, it will really cause me to download my podcasts from the respective sites themselves, then simply pop it into itunes without using the music store for podcasts...
I must be reading a different article from everyone else :p

People are talking about ads added by Apple in some new way to the iTunes UI, but where are they getting that from? Maybe the article uses some misleading language like because the writer doesn't know how iTunes currently works.

If the ads are in the chapter art--from the Podcast creator, not Apple--then downloading the same file from another source won't avoid them... but clicking the button to hide the chapter art will :)

Another reason chapter art is a good tool for podcasters to use: I seem to recall that iPods (not just iTunes) can display it.

I hate ads, but I'll refrain from blaming Apple until there's evidence of some kind. This article points no fingers at Apple if you read it. It just doesn't say enough to suggest anything beyond chapter art, which we already have.

gauchogolfer
Apr 25, 2006, 10:27 AM
The last thing i need is ad's in iTunes, it will really cause me to download my podcasts from the respective sites themselves, then simply pop it into itunes without using the music store for podcasts...


I suppose, though, that the podcasters could incorporate the ads themselves in order to generate revenue. This isn't necessarily advertising inserted by the iTMS. I think it's a nice alternative to audio ads in podcasts.

Edit: nagromme, we seem to be making the same posts, and the same points, at the same time :)

Bonte
Apr 25, 2006, 10:33 AM
Indeed nothing new, if company's want to release music with advertising or TV series with advertising they can do so with a podcast. Problem is the 'close button', it could be that Apple is adding in a sticky Add placement that can't be closed. As long as the content is free i can live with that.

nagromme
Apr 25, 2006, 10:36 AM
I suppose, though, that the podcasters could incorporate the ads themselves in order to generate revenue. This isn't necessarily advertising inserted by the iTMS. I think it's a nice alternative to audio ads in podcasts.
We seem to be making the same posts, and the same points, at the same time :)

blueflame
Apr 25, 2006, 10:38 AM
Ads should be banned. what are we here windows!?
andreas

boncellis
Apr 25, 2006, 10:39 AM
This wouldn't be so bad if iTunes continues to allow the user to close the artwork box--as has been mentioned, it is definitely preferable to audio ads interspersed throughout the podcast itself.

How about Apple creating a large banner-style space at the top of iTunes for Windows so all the seizure-causing neon flashing ads can have their normal place, while the OS X version has a quiet, understated box in the corner that the user can control?

dornoforpyros
Apr 25, 2006, 10:41 AM
meh, podcast are becoming a massivly consumed media, did you really think they would stay ad free forever?

This reminds me of Futurama

Leela: Didn't you have ads in the 21st century?

Fry: Well sure, but not in our dreams. Only on TV and radio, and in magazines, and movies, and at ball games... and on buses and milk cartons and t-shirts, and bananas and written on the sky. But not in dreams, no siree.

jonharris200
Apr 25, 2006, 10:44 AM
Instinctively, I'm against ads. However, daringfireball (http://daringfireball.net) has proved that selective advertising can be classy and useful rather than intrusive...

neocell
Apr 25, 2006, 10:46 AM
meh, podcast are becoming a massivly consumed media, did you really think they would stay ad free forever?

This reminds me of Futurama

Leela: Didn't you have ads in the 21st century?

Fry: Well sure, but not in our dreams. Only on TV and radio, and in magazines, and movies, and at ball games... and on buses and milk cartons and t-shirts, and bananas and written on the sky. But not in dreams, no siree.
Crap that is funny :D

revfife
Apr 25, 2006, 10:46 AM
read the article please before posting.

I spy Trolls! :rolleyes: :p

RIP
Apr 25, 2006, 10:49 AM
This could actually be a good thing. This would allow for more commercial podcasting to be available while keeping the advertisements out of the audio. I'm all for it if this could get my favorite radio talk shows to me free.

milo
Apr 25, 2006, 10:57 AM
It's a free service from Apple... If they want Ads to increase revenue and keep it otherwise "free"... let em. :rolleyes:

No it's not. It's a free service from the people who create the podcasts. They create the content, apple doesn't even host it, they just link to it.

If there are going to be ads in podcasts, they should come from the podcasters and the podcasters should get the revenue. And if the ads are just still pictures, you're not going to see that on ipod, or you can always just hide itunes (which you'll do anyway if you're running other apps).

Something about this story sounds fishy, I suspect it's bogus.

lukevenk
Apr 25, 2006, 11:04 AM
Well I am a podcaster The Lost Podcast with Jay and Jack (http://jayandjack.com). My show is about LOST and I use the AAC enhanced feed to provide my listeners with screen caps and other pictures from the show to aid finding clues and what not.

If the power to place ads is in the podcasters hands then go for it, but if iTunes is going to hijack my show, place ads in it and profit from all of the hard work that I put into it, without my consent. Then I'll be ticked.

I make the show and I want it to be ad free, I pay the money for the dedicated servers, the software, the equipment, and webspace. I should the choice.

There I feel better now :)

Jay

nagromme
Apr 25, 2006, 11:12 AM
if iTunes is going to hijack my show, place ads in it and profit from all of the hard work that I put into it, without my consent. Then I'll be ticked.
Welcome! (I just got into LOST via NetFlix as it happens.)

Do you see anything in the article to suggest that will happen?

Abstract
Apr 25, 2006, 11:15 AM
Crap that is funny :D

Haha, yeah. I don't generally like Futurama, but that was damn funny. :D

And we all knew ads for podcasts were inevitable, right? There's no such thing as a free lunch in our money hungry world.

itsa
Apr 25, 2006, 11:22 AM
i sure hope that this doesn't happen
Me either... it's slower than crap as it is.

Sonofhaig
Apr 25, 2006, 11:26 AM
Who benefits from this? The user? Podcasts should always be free.
Isn't Apple making money hand over fist now?
They need to collect money for advertising in these spots?

I DON"T LIKE THIS AT ALL. YOU WON"T CONVINCE ME OTHERWISE!
THIS WILL JUST BE A STEPPING STONE TO SOMETHING WORSE!
MARK MY WORDS....... :mad:

<rant over> deeeeeeeeeeeeeeep breathes.......

milo
Apr 25, 2006, 11:28 AM
And we all knew ads for podcasts were inevitable, right? There's no such thing as a free lunch in our money hungry world.

Ads for podcasts have been here for awhile. I have no objection to ads in podcasts, it just needs to be done by the podcaster with the podcaster receiving the revenue. From this article, it's hard to tell how this will work, I'll feel better about it once I know apple isn't going to be inserting ads into podcasts.

Doctor Q
Apr 25, 2006, 11:29 AM
Ads would be annoying, but you could always move another window over that corner of the iTunes window. Perhaps a little freeware app could hide them too. It would be some consolation if Apple makes money by doing this and then spends it on R&D or keeping prices in line, both of which benefit me as a Mac user.

Jarbo
Apr 25, 2006, 11:36 AM
I have no problem with a Podcaster trying to create a bit of revenue in the form of static artwork in the lower left corner. What worries me more is the Major networks bundling Ads with their programming that I am not allowed to skip.

I guess it's a tried and true practice. We go to the movies and see ads we are forced to watch promos on many DVDs.

Still, It's annoying and the wrong direction.

nostaws
Apr 25, 2006, 11:37 AM
I am generally okay with the ad thing - If I am listening to an ESPN podcast I don't mind an ESPN ad.

If I am listening to Jack's Lost podcast and HE decides he wants to share an ad with me: also okay.

But the only problem I have with it - You let little ads in - where/when will it stop? if ever?

lukevenk
Apr 25, 2006, 11:38 AM
I am a huge Apple fan, but the cost of podcasting is all on the podcaster not on itunes or apple. All the downloading comes from the podcasters personal sever not itunes. So essentially its practically free for itunes to have a page with links to podcasters rss feeds.

This artical is a little ambigiuos (sp*), so this may not be the case, but if apple is going to make a profit without giving the podcaster the choice is wrong.

Jay: The Lost Podcast with Jay and Jack (http://jayandjack.com)

nagromme
Apr 25, 2006, 11:40 AM
Who benefits from this? The user? Podcasts should always be free.
Isn't Apple making money hand over fist now?
They need to collect money for advertising in these spots?
It sounds to me like ads by the podcast creators--and embedded in podcasts--not by Apple at all.

What in the article makes you assume it is Apple who would be making money from these ads? It's not impossible, but what makes you think it's the case?

For that matter, the whole store IS an ad for Apple stuff. It's a store. Would adding visual Apple ads to audio podcasts really help Apple that much? I don't really see why Apple would try to put ads in podcasts, but I DO see why podcast creators would--and that's all I see in the article.

lukevenk
Apr 25, 2006, 11:45 AM
It sounds to me like ads by the podcast creators--and embedded in podcasts--not by Apple at all.

What in the article makes you assume it is Apple who would be making money from these ads? It's not impossible, but what makes you think it's the case?

For that matter, the whole store IS an ad for Apple stuff. It's a store. Would adding visual Apple ads to audio podcasts really help Apple that much? I don't really see why Apple would try to put ads in podcasts, but I DO see why podcast creators would--and that's all I see in the article.

We already can put ads in with pictures in the left hand corner and stuff, thats why I am a bit worried about this


Jay: The Lost Podcast with Jay and Jack (http://jayandjack.com)

narco
Apr 25, 2006, 11:52 AM
It's weird seeing so many posts about something that's not going to happen. Some podcasts use the album art feature to just show their logo, so it would be wise to advertise and help pay some of those high-bandwidth charges. I don't see the difference between showing an ad in that spot versus showing a regular image -- it doesn't bother me one bit, and it shouldn't bother everyone else either.

Fishes,
narco.

milo
Apr 25, 2006, 11:53 AM
We already can put ads in with pictures in the left hand corner and stuff, thats why I am a bit worried about this


Jay: The Lost Podcast with Jay and Jack (http://jayandjack.com)

Hey there, Jay. Huge lost fan but haven't checked out your podcast yet because I'm paranoid about getting spoiled. Heck, I don't even watch the promos for the next weeks episode. How much spoilers/hard core speculation do you guys get into?

lukevenk
Apr 25, 2006, 12:03 PM
Hey there, Jay. Huge lost fan but haven't checked out your podcast yet because I'm paranoid about getting spoiled. Heck, I don't even watch the promos for the next weeks episode. How much spoilers/hard core speculation do you guys get into?

we discuss everything from theroies, recap episodes, and spoilers. But the spoilers are kept in there own section so you can fastforward through them, or if you subscribe to the Chapter Enabled one you can skip to the next chapter :)


And as long as the power to place ads is in the podcasters hands then thats fine, just as long as it is in the podcasters control:D


Jay: The Lost Podcast with Jay AND Jack (http://jayandjack.com)

Stridder44
Apr 25, 2006, 12:04 PM
What I'm more worried about is the talk of ads going to your iPod....which I doubt would happen but some people have mentioned it....


...pure B.S. or is there some truth to this?

whocares
Apr 25, 2006, 12:05 PM
iTunes, now bundled with spyware™:mad:

iTunes already is. Remember the "Mini Store™"? :rolleyes:

rolleyes for Mini Store, not Cuba

shamino
Apr 25, 2006, 12:07 PM
One thing everybody seems to forget: Apple does not author most of the podcasts. With the exception of a small number of podcasts (like the iTunes New Music Tuesday (http://phobos.apple.com/WebObjects/MZStore.woa/wa/viewPodcast?id=73663807&s=143441) one), they are authored by independent third parties. The iTMS simply acts as a large search engine. When you subscribe, the files are downloaded from third-party web sites.

If one of those third parties wants to insert an ad, nobody is going to stop them. And nobody should. If you don't like it, complain to the author or unsubscribe.

If you think Apple is going to download a third-party podcast, edit it to insert their own ads, and then feed the modified version to customers, think again. Such a process would cost a fortune (far more than the ad revenue could ever produce), it would create a huge disgruntled user-base, would be illegal (violation of copyright) and it wouldn't work (because you could still download the original files from the original source.)

So let's drop all the paranoid conspiracy theories already, OK?

quigleybc
Apr 25, 2006, 12:18 PM
If i cared about Podcasts whatsoever I might be upset by this..

But, I don't really download podcasts.

But, this could be a slippery slope and lead to more ads in other areas, and that would be the worst thing ever...

What about an "iTunes Pro" concept, like quicktime.

If you want more pro features, like wave editors, and more encoding options, and no ad's. Pay Apple $ Is that a really far fetched idea?

Twenty1
Apr 25, 2006, 12:19 PM
One thing everybody seems to forget: Apple does not author most of the podcasts. With the exception of a small number of podcasts (like the iTunes New Music Tuesday (http://phobos.apple.com/WebObjects/MZStore.woa/wa/viewPodcast?id=73663807&s=143441) one), they are authored by independent third parties. The iTMS simply acts as a large search engine. When you subscribe, the files are downloaded from third-party web sites.

If one of those third parties wants to insert an ad, nobody is going to stop them. And nobody should. If you don't like it, complain to the author or unsubscribe.

If you think Apple is going to download a third-party podcast, edit it to insert their own ads, and then feed the modified version to customers, think again. Such a process would cost a fortune (far more than the ad revenue could ever produce), it would create a huge disgruntled user-base, would be illegal (violation of copyright) and it wouldn't work (because you could still download the original files from the original source.)

So let's drop all the paranoid conspiracy theories already, OK?

Amen!!! Thank you for bring some common sense to the forum. :)

cdpilkington
Apr 25, 2006, 12:33 PM
Meh, if it keeps podcasts away from the paid subscription model (as adopted by Ricky gervais' second series) then I don't mind putting up with it. It'd have to be implemented so it didn't take away the artwork content that used to go there though.

Stella
Apr 25, 2006, 12:36 PM
iTunes already is. Remember the "Mini Store™"? :rolleyes:

rolleyes for Mini Store, not Cuba

:cool:
The MiniStore was NOT spyware.

The only information it transmitted was the track you were currently playing. Apple clearly stated what data is being sent from iTunes. Just how is that "spyware"?!

Do you know what Spyware really is?

mozmac
Apr 25, 2006, 12:55 PM
I really don't think this would be such a bad idea if it was only limited to podcasts. Those guys are trying to figure out a way to make money, and that'd be a great way. However, that's ONLY IF it doesn't poor over to other areas of iTunes; e.g. your iTunes library.

plinkoman
Apr 25, 2006, 01:04 PM
I absolutely despise adverts. but what really amazes me is that they actually do work with people. i mean, how retarted do you have to be to be like "oh hey, there's an ad for dish network at the top of my screen, i guess i'll go ahead and buy it then" :rolleyes:

the stupidity of people in general never ceases to amaze me.

MrCrowbar
Apr 25, 2006, 01:07 PM
Don't we already have the Apple logo flashing up in the iTunes visualization sometimes? Or is that just the windows version? Worked for me, the desire to buy a Mac is very present now. :rolleyes:

That article can really lead to some misunderstanding. I don't mind ads in the album art place on podcasts. You can still minimize iTunes when listening. It's ok if the ads are from the podcasters. I wouldn't mind an option to have huge banners if I can listen to everything on ITMS for free. I can dream right?

Some day will come where we get custom made ads like in Minority Report. The Mac will know what you think by looking at you via iSight and BOOM, full screen banner on both 30" display! :eek: :eek: :eek:


I wouldn't worry too much about it.

baleensavage
Apr 25, 2006, 01:09 PM
I would rather see ads in podcasts than see people go the Rush Limaugh route and have paid podcasts. Actually I have already seen a couple ads in podcasts and while it suprised me, I really don't mind (there's a fast forward button). As for ads in the album art, who cares? Its a tiny little box in the bottom right that you can turn off if you want. It's just like with any other new technology, people realize very quick as it becomes popular how expensive it is to podcast and now they want to make a little of their money back. Then some exnteprise realizes that they can make big bucks off it and the medium is now commercial.

Can anyone remember when there weren't ads all over the internet or when everything on the internet didnt cost money? I can, it actually wasnt that long ago. As podcasts get popular the same thing is going to happen there.

fabsgwu
Apr 25, 2006, 01:21 PM
iTunes for Podcasts is nothing but an aggregator with a directory. Apple should not mess with the content (especially without consent) of something produced by non-affiliated podcasts.

By inserting ads automatically it give the appearance that the podcaster has "endorsed" the product being pushed. Ask Adam Curry if he'd appreciate that; Pod2Mob did some similar ad placing before his podcast and he raised hell about it.

sam10685
Apr 25, 2006, 01:36 PM
just as long as they're not ads for E.D. medicines.

Peyton
Apr 25, 2006, 02:26 PM
It's a free service from Apple... If they want Ads to increase revenue and keep it otherwise "free"... let em. :rolleyes:

OK, I agree with you. But I hate to see this happen as iTunes is so clean and void of ads (unless you count a billion album covers and ipod ads). They keep saying they are just 'breaking even' but with 9+ billion sitting around I would think twice about this...

make money on innovation not ad location

nagromme
Apr 25, 2006, 02:32 PM
By inserting ads automatically it give the appearance that the podcaster has "endorsed" the product being pushed. Ask Adam Curry if he'd appreciate that; Pod2Mob did some similar ad placing before his podcast and he raised hell about it.
What in the article makes thing Apple would do that?


:cool:
The MiniStore was NOT spyware.

The only information it transmitted was the track you were currently playing. Apple clearly stated what data is being sent from iTunes. Just how is that "spyware"?!

Do you know what Spyware really is?
Transmitted... but not tracked or recorded even :) Merely sent as a kind of search and then forgotten.

weg
Apr 25, 2006, 02:38 PM
This is a step in the wrong direction I think.

Hmm, isn't iTunes already full of ads for music?? And doesn't Apple already incorporate advertisment into OS X? (think of the option to buy ink via the printer settings).

Don't we already have the Apple logo flashing up in the iTunes visualization sometimes?

Yeah, but the Apple logo also shows up at the backside of my Powerbook. I like it. I would be pretty annoyed though if Apple would replace it by a Mini LCD that shows ads for WalMart and Gatorade...

hyperpasta
Apr 25, 2006, 02:45 PM
There is only one way that I could think of where this would work: adding a "force album art open" feature in GarageBand, where a picture to be displayed in the album art pane would HAVE TO be displayed. The pane would then hide when a different picture came up.

This is completely up to the podcaster. But the consequences are that Diggnation could now sell GoDaddy a "GoDaddy Image" in the album art box that links to their site while they say that the podcast was sponsored by GoDaddy.com

All of a sudden, podcasters could bring in extra ad revenue by allowing companies to have pictures and links displayed. This is not a bad thing, in my opinion, since it's so unintrusive and you can still just fast forward if the ad is too long.

And hey, maybe its good sometimes to be able to force the album art pane open. As you talk about your vacation, you can play a photo slideshow. Then the pane dissappears as you move on to a different topic.

fabsgwu
Apr 25, 2006, 02:47 PM
What in the article makes thing Apple would do that?



I was responding to people on the Forum who suggested that might be a next step. Inserting album art ads would be just as bad, IMO.

daysleeper
Apr 25, 2006, 03:05 PM
Everyone just take a deep breath. This is not a big deal.

I can't vote this as positive, 'cause I don't want to see a crappy microsoft ad in my album art window, but I can't vote negative, 'cause I know I can't always get content with no strings attached. Heck, you can't even look at many webpages without being exposed to advertising. Do the banner ads on this site make you angry?

jettredmont
Apr 25, 2006, 03:18 PM
I was responding to people on the Forum who suggested that might be a next step. Inserting album art ads would be just as bad, IMO.

Again, though, in what version of reality has anyone with any authority said anything like Apple actually doing that?

Don't respond to posts from forum people who didn't read or didn't understand the article as though they know what they're talking about. Read the ... article.

Now, that having been said, I think at face value the article does say that Apple will be adding a new option for advertisers. However, given the various conceptual errors the author makes, I think it is just about as likely that he is talking about podcasts (ESPN) using the technology (album/chapter art) that already exists to sell ads. In the first paragraph of the piece, it sounded like he was talking about selling space in the lede banner on the iTunes Music Store, but that doesn't fit with any of the rest of the article, so that's probably not it either.

On the other hand, it is hard to square album art with the statement "We are looking at new technology that will provide a much richer advertising experience [than 30-second audio ads] and hope to roll that out very soon." When advertisers talk about "rich", they usually mean one of two things:

1. Motion video
2. Interactivity (even as basic as a "click here to go to our web site" link)

As a result, I think it is highly possible that Apple is planning on expanding the "album art" podcast tag to allow for either quicktime video or for basic HTML. One can only hope that if they do HTML then they deactivate the "break out" features which riddle HTML ads in the web at large (popup windows, popunders, DHTML "you didn't really want to read that paragraph, did you?" craptacularities).

In any case, there's not enough here for anyone to get their panties in a bunch. Chill. Wait and see what happens.

For all you people howling about Apple stealing podcast content, inserting ads, and broadcasting that out ... man, you guys muct have some potent drugs out there!

Off-topic: I found it amusing that clicking on the link sent me to a full-page ad for ... nothing. Just a blank page with "Skip this ad" in the top-right. You'd think the brain trust at Advertising Age would be able to figure out this whole interstitial ad thing the cool kids have been playing with for five or six years now already ...

alfismoney
Apr 25, 2006, 03:18 PM
i already had to abandon safari for firefox because i wanted a more compatible javascript package. i won't go crying home to mama if i have to ditch itunes in favor of another media players because apple begins wasting my time with ad space.

besides, apple's looking to get bitten if they start competing on google's playing field. make a deal with someone who's good at this stuff or don't bother trying.

Kilchzimmer
Apr 25, 2006, 03:21 PM
If one of those third parties wants to insert an ad, nobody is going to stop them. And nobody should. If you don't like it, complain to the author or unsubscribe.

If you think Apple is going to download a third-party podcast, edit it to insert their own ads, and then feed the modified version to customers, think again. Such a process would cost a fortune (far more than the ad revenue could ever produce), it would create a huge disgruntled user-base, would be illegal (violation of copyright) and it wouldn't work (because you could still download the original files from the original source.)

So let's drop all the paranoid conspiracy theories already, OK?

I disagree there.
Some things you are correct on... True, as a podcaster I have been creating my own enhanced podcasts and have been free to put any photo advert or link that I want. That's nothing new so the article couldn't just be addressing this. True, Apple isn't about to edit my enhanced podcast to insert their ads. True, this would be illegal.

BUT... it would be legal, no cost to Apple, and should be possible to have an ad, totally independant of my podcast, pop up in the iTunes viewer window BEFORE my podcast is permitted to play. THIS is the point. I would not have control over the type of ad shown. It could even be advertising something I (or my podcast viewers) would not endorse. Not good.

Generally, I do think that there is a lot of misunderstanding, reading into, and overreacting to the article. Wait and see how it materializes.

direzz
Apr 25, 2006, 03:35 PM
i really hope this doesnt happen. because ok.. think about it. in the very long run.. ads and commercials could very well be uploaded onto our ipods.

that would tick the hell out of me.

puuukeey
Apr 25, 2006, 03:38 PM
booooooooooooooooo.... its bad enough apple advertises its own products on my computer with out my say so.

ITS MINE!

blueimac'00
Apr 25, 2006, 03:59 PM
I would definitely dislike apple having ads on itunes, but people wont just stop using itunes if they start putting ads on it. From a business perspective its a good move for apple.

fabsgwu
Apr 25, 2006, 04:02 PM
Again, though, in what version of reality has anyone with any authority said anything like Apple actually doing that?

Don't respond to posts from forum people who didn't read or didn't understand the article as though they know what they're talking about. Read the ... article.


The article DID imply that Apple would insert ads, so it would be in Advertising Age's version of reality. It's a shoddy article, so why not open up this forum for discussion.

Of course people are going to comment regarding Apple's involvement in ad placing when MacRumors posts this on the front page: "Apple's current plans call for the ads to appear only in the lower-left corner of the iTunes library while users listen to podcasts from their computers rather than from portable devices."

The second half of your comment was much more constructive, keep to your opinions and lay off telling people how to comment. this whole site is about speculation, informed and (usually) otherwise.

weitzner
Apr 25, 2006, 05:14 PM
the ads are in the artwork section. if you don't want them, just click hide artwork. no biggie.

lvnmacs
Apr 25, 2006, 05:35 PM
That is so unlike Apple. For example: The major difference (appearance)between my PowerBook and PC notebook is the stickers that come on the
PC notebooks! No adds please!

gooddog
Apr 25, 2006, 05:40 PM
Are we going to get vibrating, spinning, flashing and otherwise obnoxious images in the lower left corner of our iTunes browser ???

I will set fire to my powerbook and toss it in the dumpster, in front of media cameras.

Now, let me settle down .......

OK,

Apple M U S T defend its minimalist aesthetics and must NEVER slip toward
the poor taste exemplified by WMP , REAL , et al. BARF !!!

This would be a SERIOUS betrayal of the Apple community.

If ads are worth watching, Apple could put a category on iTunes that
links to a menu of various types of ads : award-winning funny ads, infomercials of various types as seen on TV, public service ads, appliances, cars, causes, etc.

THEN we could choose to watch or download these without adding an iSore to iTunes.

Those accounts who choose to play certain ads might be credited with points
toward savings, via ecoupons, free tunes, etc.

With this model, we could all set an example viz., that ads do not need to violate our dignity, aesthetics, privacy, etc.

What do we think of this ??????

---gooddog

:mad: :mad: :mad: :mad:

shamino
Apr 25, 2006, 06:11 PM
BUT... it would be legal, no cost to Apple, and should be possible to have an ad, totally independant of my podcast, pop up in the iTunes viewer window BEFORE my podcast is permitted to play. THIS is the point. I would not have control over the type of ad shown. It could even be advertising something I (or my podcast viewers) would not endorse. Not good.
Podcasts are not much different from any other kind of iTunes-compatible audio file.

If Apple would do this, then ads would end up appearing before and during all music playback. I think I can state with certainty, that most people would drop iTunes altogether if it became an adware product. I know I would. There are plenty of other programs that can play my music collection without ads, and you can be certain that many more would be developed if Apple made a brain-dead decision like this.

It just isn't going to happen.

The article DID imply that Apple would insert ads, so it would be in Advertising Age's version of reality. It's a shoddy article, so why not open up this forum for discussion.
The article claims that sponsored ads would be displayed as a part of the music store (which they call the iTunes service). Doesn't say anything about editing content (like podcasts) or making the iTunes program an adware application.

SiliconAddict
Apr 25, 2006, 06:24 PM
iTunes, now bundled with spyware™:mad:


:rolleyes: Ads != spyware. Calm down people. Apple may be starting to turn into a Microsoft but they aren't stupid. If they start dropping ads all over iTunes people will go somewhere else for their music. Remember the beauty of the what Apple has isn't just the iPod. Isn't just iTunes. Isn't just iTMS. It’s the whole ball of wax. The minute they degrade any one aspect of the three they degrade them all. No doubt Apple is keenly aware of this and is keeping that in mind.
Also keep in mind that it was Jobs who stuck to his guns about .99 cent tracks. He knows what would happen if the price started to jump all over the board and he knows what would happen if they started dropping a ton of ads into iTunes.

fabsgwu
Apr 25, 2006, 06:50 PM
The article claims that sponsored ads would be displayed as a part of the music store (which they call the iTunes service). Doesn't say anything about editing content (like podcasts) or making the iTunes program an adware application.

Has this thread been hijacked by monkeys? :eek:

"Apple's current plans call for the ads to appear only in the lower-left corner of the iTunes library while users listen to podcasts (http://www.macrumors.com/pages/2006/04/20060425110511.shtml) from their computers rather than from portable devices."

Multimedia
Apr 25, 2006, 06:51 PM
I Love Advertising. Bring It On! :p

Entertainment Value. Distractions from Reality. Notification of Innovation. It's all good.

balamw
Apr 25, 2006, 07:06 PM
Meh, if it keeps podcasts away from the paid subscription model (as adopted by Ricky gervais' second series
Actually I have already seen a couple ads in podcasts
Actually Ricky Gervais' first (free) podcast series included plenty of ads for TV programming, in particular the later episodes. How is this new?

B

p0intblank
Apr 25, 2006, 07:33 PM
If they don't get in the way, and they don't sound like they will, then I don't mind.

scotto07
Apr 25, 2006, 07:37 PM
I absolutely hate Ads, they all should die.......:mad: :mad:........




(The ads that is)

bigandy
Apr 25, 2006, 07:55 PM
here's my view, summed up in one word:

NOOOOOOOOOOOOoooooooooooooOOOOOOoooooooOOOOOOOOOOOOooooOOO!


:( :( :( :(

mrweirdo
Apr 25, 2006, 08:49 PM
Sounds to me like anouther good reason for add blocking software particularly on the firewall itself. I have allready implamented one on my ipcop firewall system :) and Im sure there are many other firewalls both software and hardware that allow you to do the same.

mongoos150
Apr 25, 2006, 09:29 PM
So what about video podcasts? And photo podcasts?!

Ripcord
Apr 25, 2006, 10:43 PM
I would rather see ads in podcasts than see people go the Rush Limaugh route and have paid podcasts.

Wait, to know whether or not Rush Limbaugh's podcast is paid-only or not, it must mean that you've intentionally looked for his podcast. This makes no sense.

astral
Apr 25, 2006, 10:57 PM
They most likely wont do this. I'd like to be 100 percent sure Apple wouldn't tack on ads to podcasts, but then again, this is the company that will sell you a 3000 dollar computer and make you pay extra money to watch videos full screen.

Mechcozmo
Apr 25, 2006, 11:08 PM
If I can hide it, sure. I need all the screen real estate I can get on my 12" PowerBook's screen. If it takes up screen space... I won't be happy.

macnews
Apr 26, 2006, 01:37 AM
It's a free service from Apple... If they want Ads to increase revenue and keep it otherwise "free"... let em. :rolleyes:

Wow, I have a huge problem with this. If the creators of the podcasters are placing the ads then I wouldn't mind it being in the albulm art section. But if Apple is placing the ads and getting all the money I have a HUGE problem with that. They would basically be Apple making money off the podcasters backs.

Will_reed
Apr 26, 2006, 01:58 AM
If their going to host our podcasts for free as well then it's fine,
But they have no reason to do this. the podcasts section of the itunes store is nothing more than a collection of web links we still have to find out own way of getting the podcast hosted uploaded and paid for etc. The Podcasts them selves are almost free advertising for apple as it gets people into the music store.

jadekitty24
Apr 26, 2006, 07:04 AM
They most likely wont do this. I'd like to be 100 percent sure Apple wouldn't tack on ads to podcasts, but then again, this is the company that will sell you a 3000 dollar computer and make you pay extra money to watch videos full screen.
If you think you have to pay to watch videos in full screen then you deserve to be taken advantage of.

On topic, I really don't give a crap if Apple puts ads somewhere that could easily be hidden. If it's not shoved down my throat then go for it. I don't understand...why all the fracking drama? I feel like I'm in a locker room with a bunch of PMS'ing teenaged girls.

Will_reed
Apr 26, 2006, 07:08 AM
If you think you have to pay to watch videos in full screen then you deserve to be taken advantage of.

On topic, I really don't give a crap if Apple puts ads somewhere that could easily be hidden. If it's not shoved down my throat then go for it. I don't understand...why all the fracking drama? I feel like I'm in a locker room with a bunch of PMS'ing teenaged girls.

Read my post.

cdpilkington
Apr 26, 2006, 10:03 AM
Actually Ricky Gervais' first (free) podcast series included plenty of ads for TV programming, in particular the later episodes. How is this new?

B


Don't think I was very clear in my original post, I meant that I preferred this model to the paid-for one in the second series. I thought the ads were generally done quite well.
incidentally, do you know if the ads are still in the first series now, even though you have to pay for it?
Kudos to nagromme and everyone for their explanations of the article. makes sense when you put it like that. :)

celavato
Apr 26, 2006, 02:57 PM
If the power to place ads is in the podcasters hands then go for it, but if iTunes is going to hijack my show, place ads in it and profit from all of the hard work that I put into it, without my consent. Then I'll be ticked.

You're point is well-taken, but Apple is providing your podcast with a massive audience. If Apple wants to run ads in its music player that it developed, your only recourse is to pull your podcast from iTunes. Don't be so quick to bite the hand that feeds you.

Will_reed
Apr 26, 2006, 07:14 PM
You're point is well-taken, but Apple is providing your podcast with a massive audience. If Apple wants to run ads in its music player that it developed, your only recourse is to pull your podcast from iTunes. Don't be so quick to bite the hand that feeds you.

No one here seems to understand how podcasting on the itunes music store works.

balamw
Apr 26, 2006, 07:30 PM
No one here seems to understand how podcasting on the itunes music store works.
I think you misunderstood TechnoLawyer. The point is that if Apple wants to add a feature to the iTunes software that displays random ads every so often while you are listening to podcasts, they can. Of course there's nothing stopping you from using a different piece of software to get the content, but you would lose the integration of directory+jukebox+portable player that makes iTunes+iPod so appealing.

I think the only way this makes sense is if it follows a model like Google AdSense as was proposed in another thread, as a way of providing some way of paying the podcasters per listen. Just like AdSense has preserved the free internet a bit longer, something similar for podcasts might help keep content free.

B

Will_reed
Apr 26, 2006, 07:36 PM
I think you misunderstood TechnoLawyer. The point is that if Apple wants to add a feature to the iTunes software that displays random ads every so often while you are listening to podcasts, they can. Of course there's nothing stopping you from using a different piece of software to get the content, but you would lose the integration of directory+jukebox+portable player that makes iTunes+iPod so appealing.

I think the only way this makes sense is if it follows a model like Google AdSense as was proposed in another thread, as a way of providing some way of paying the podcasters per listen. Just like AdSense has preserved the free internet a bit longer, something similar for podcasts might help keep content free.

B

The only way this could have any benifit is if it gave the money to the back to the podcasters as oposed to apple just being greedy and having it there for the sole purpose of makin them selves a little extra cash. This Just sounds like a ridiculous rumour to me and from reading these posts you get the impression that people think apple hosts the podcasts them selves which is most definatly not the case.

Detlev
Apr 26, 2006, 07:39 PM
Assimilation into the PC world is futile. Your iLife is now under our control. This is why 2006 will be like 1984.

Detlev
Apr 26, 2006, 07:41 PM
I think the only way this makes sense is if it follows a model like Google AdSense as was proposed in another thread,
After all, nobody abuses that system—no, not at all.

macEfan
Apr 26, 2006, 07:45 PM
booo no ads.. Apple is making enough money already... I dont want to see any ads anytime soon.

celavato
Apr 26, 2006, 10:22 PM
No one here seems to understand how podcasting on the itunes music store works.

Yes, I do. While a user can always copy and paste a podcast feed into iTunes, most people don't know how to do that. The beauty of listing your podcast with iTunes is that "subscribing" becomes simple -- no need to understand RSS feeds. A podcaster upset about Apple showing ads can remove the podcast from Apple's directory, but doing so would be unwise in my opinion. Your podcast would no longer appear in iTunes searches and those who wanted to listen to your podcast in iTunes would have to understand what to do with your feed.

Will_reed
Apr 26, 2006, 10:43 PM
The podcast section of the itunes music store is pretty much just a directory of web links. You click on the subscribe button and itunes kindly places it in your playlist and chechs for updates now and then. Ok now apart from making itunes look a bit like a microsoft product how will this benifit anyone?
Is there a good reason for this? It's not like podcasters are losin revanue they never planned on makin money in the first place remember?
Anyone who supports this is either nuts, doesn't know what their talkin about or both.

balamw
Apr 26, 2006, 11:36 PM
Is there a good reason for this? It's not like podcasters are losin revanue they never planned on makin money in the first place remember?
Anyone who supports this is either nuts, doesn't know what their talkin about or both.
Bandwidth still costs money, so typically a popular podcast will end up costing the podcaster more money than one no one listens to.

Micropayments from ad revenue provide some kind of mechanism to reward the producers of popular podcasts and offset the costs of hosting and producing the content.

Many of the professional podcasts I listen to already include spoken ads, and the last few episodes of the Ricky Gervais show sported both spoken and artwork ads. Then there's strict paid subscription like the second Ricky Gervais series or Rush Limbaugh or Air America. Ultimately what's better? I don't know and I'm not advocating any particular solution, but you can count on money getting involved when podcasts become popular enough.

B

Will_reed
Apr 26, 2006, 11:46 PM
Bandwidth still costs money, so typically a popular podcast will end up costing the podcaster more money than one no one listens to.

Micropayments from ad revenue provide some kind of mechanism to reward the producers of popular podcasts and offset the costs of hosting and producing the content.

Many of the professional podcasts I listen to already include spoken ads, and the last few episodes of the Ricky Gervais show sported both spoken and artwork ads. Then there's strict paid subscription like the second Ricky Gervais series or Rush Limbaugh or Air America. Ultimately what's better? I don't know and I'm not advocating any particular solution, but you can count on money getting involved when podcasts become popular enough.

B

yeah and the podcasters are sorting it out because the podcasters are the ones paying. so why should we have more ads shoved on top of that by apple. I mean think about it how would apple distribute all this advert money to the differnt podcasters. Somthing like this just couldn't work logicly unless apple started hosting all the podcasts and doing what those free space websites do

balamw
Apr 27, 2006, 08:11 AM
yeah and the podcasters are sorting it out because the podcasters are the ones paying. so why should we have more ads shoved on top of that by apple.
This site makes use of ads "shoved" on there by doubleclick and Google, with arn's consent of course, but is not hosted by either of those companies, nor do each of the ads get approved individually.

Your point?

Where does it say that Apple will do anything without the podcaster's consent/involvement?

B

Will_reed
Apr 27, 2006, 08:19 AM
This site makes use of ads "shoved" on there by doubleclick and Google, with arn's consent of course, but is not hosted by either of those companies, nor do each of the ads get approved individually.

Your point?

Where does it say that Apple will do anything without the podcaster's consent/involvement?

B

So it's ok for apple to shamlessly make money by sticking ads in itunes. It just doesn't sound like very apple like behaviour to me.

OldTimey
Sep 19, 2006, 11:12 AM
:( while not too thrilled about this news either...i can live with ads in iTunes for podcasts...but get nervous thinking about all the new graphical capabilities of the 5G iPod and what that might mean for "advertising in my pocket". Ads on my iPod??? I'd toss the thing so quickly. Next thing you know...ads in iChat, a dedicated ad drawer in Safari...

Apple hooks you to their software/hardware, by "thinking different" and then it turns iout they are no better than Msoft or AOL.:(

Ripcord
Sep 19, 2006, 07:06 PM
What news? This thread has been inactive for 5 months.

So far there's been no more evidence of this, right? So as far as we know not going to happen?

balamw
Sep 19, 2006, 07:08 PM
What news? This thread has been inactive for 5 months.

So far there's been no more evidence of this, right? So as far as we know not going to happen?
Guess you missed the more recent thread...

http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=235212

B