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MacRumors
Apr 27, 2006, 06:06 PM
http://www.macrumors.com/images/macrumorsthreadlogo.gif (http://www.macrumors.com)

Apple today held its annual shareholder meeting. While Apple kept to its policy of not discussing upcoming products, Apple's CEO Steve Jobs reportedly replied "we hear you" when one shareholder requested that the company make the "ultimate media center," including personal video recorder functionality.

The exact circumstances of the quote are unclear at this point, with conflicting reports from Macworld (http://www.macworld.com/news/2006/04/27/sharehldrmtg/index.php) and Think Secret (http://www.thinksecret.com/news/0604shareholders.html). Think Secret specifies that the shareholder was speaking in regards to Microsoft's Media Center.

Jobs also mentioned a new TV ad campaign to launch next week, although the campaign's topic (iPod, Mac, etc.) was not specified.

Of final note, former president of the Sierra Club Larry Fahn questioned Apple on its environmental sensitivity.

Quote from Macworld
"We are concerned that besides being a hip, cool company, Apple is falling short of the industry environmentally." Fahn said. "I would like to thank you for the program introduced last week, but there is still a long way to go."

In response, Jobs noted that the Sierra Club recently voted Apple one of its top 10 environmentally friendly companies. "So there is some kind of disconnect with your numbers," he said. Jobs also noted that Apple's new recycling program takes any computer, not just Macs, "because we like switchers, too."

Update: CNet adds (http://www.macrumors.com/c.php?u=http%3A%2F%2Fnews.com.com%2F2061-10793_3-6066128.html%3Ftag%3D6066128&t=1146187504) that Apple's upcoming ad campaign will be geared towards promoting the Mac.

twoodcc
Apr 27, 2006, 06:12 PM
sounds like good news to me. bring on the PVR :)

ahmurphy7
Apr 27, 2006, 06:13 PM
finally, we could give up waiting for tivotogo.

gugy
Apr 27, 2006, 06:13 PM
PVR please!
Media center where itunes, iphoto, movies, videos and PVR all live together.

Object-X
Apr 27, 2006, 06:14 PM
Make the ultimate media center?

"We hear you loud and clear!" -- Jobs

Can't wait for that. Bring it!

thejadedmonkey
Apr 27, 2006, 06:14 PM
PVR, Mac commercials, and Hints, oh my!

P.S. What are PVR's?

Di9it8
Apr 27, 2006, 06:14 PM
http://www.macrumors.com/images/macrumorsthreadlogo.gif (http://www.macrumors.com)

Jobs also mentioned a new TV ad campaign to launch next week, although the campaign's topic (iPod, Mac, etc.) was not specified.

Quote from Macworld

Must be the Macbook for consumers and or home media centre :D

twoodcc
Apr 27, 2006, 06:15 PM
Must be the Macbook for consumers:D

i sure hope so

rdowns
Apr 27, 2006, 06:16 PM
PVR, Mac commercials, and Hints, oh my!

P.S. What are PVR's?

DVRs or Tivo like device.

rikers_mailbox
Apr 27, 2006, 06:22 PM
"We are concerned that besides being a hip, cool company, Apple is falling short of the industry environmentally." Fahn said. "I would like to thank you for the program introduced last week, but there is still a long way to go."

In response, Jobs noted that the Sierra Club recently voted Apple one of its top 10 environmentally friendly companies. "So there is some kind of disconnect with your numbers," he said. Jobs also noted that Apple's new recycling program takes any computer, not just Macs, "because we like switchers, too."

oh, snap. Sounds like Jobs pwned that dude. "Like, check your numbers before you blast me."

I think the recycling program is a great move by Apple... why are people so quick to point out yet unseen faults?

zap2
Apr 27, 2006, 06:24 PM
"Everyone wants a MacBook Pro because they are so bitchin"

Thats what MacWorld said Jobs said!


Also “We only have one CRT product left and that’s the eMac,” Jobs noted. “We could be sitting here next year with none.”

Seems like Jobs is not letting the eMac stay around as is... come on LCD eMac

richdun
Apr 27, 2006, 06:27 PM
oh, snap. Sounds like Jobs pwned that dude. "Like, check your numbers before you blast me."

I think the recycling program is a great move by Apple... why are people so quick to point out yet unseen faults?

Gotta love people (like Jobs) who know other people's stuff better than the other people do. Just goes to show how really on top of things most special interest orgs are. They use any audience to trumpet the current cause, even if they just trumpetted the opposite not too long ago.

dongmin
Apr 27, 2006, 06:32 PM
P.S. What are PVR's?Pabst Violet Ribbon?

(ok, that was a bad pun...)

So "We hear you loud and clear" = "It's in testing now and will be released to manufacturing in two weeks"??? We've come a long way from Jobs' original denial and derision.

danielwsmithee
Apr 27, 2006, 06:36 PM
... come on LCD eMacIs'nt that the 17" iMac. I don't see what else they could make for a LCD eMac, smaller hard-drive & no wireless maybe?

michaelb
Apr 27, 2006, 06:38 PM
I like what Phil Schiller added:

"I think there are a lot of PCs that should be recycled...”

zap2
Apr 27, 2006, 06:38 PM
Is'nt that the 17" iMac. I don't see what else they could make for a LCD eMac, smaller hard-drive & no wireless maybe?


IT would need wireless
but slower Specs(Core Solo, 80Gb hardrive, no iSight ,15'' Screen) and the sexy iMac G4 look

swingerofbirch
Apr 27, 2006, 06:44 PM
I am an Apple shareholder and this is the first I am hearing of this meeting.

Doctor Q
Apr 27, 2006, 06:44 PM
CNET reports (http://news.com.com/2061-10793_3-6066128.html?tag=6066128) that the ads will be for Macs.

nagromme
Apr 27, 2006, 06:48 PM
I'm sure the ads will be for iPod wallets and Hi-Fi. Now we know why they haven't had a TV campaign for these products before now. Get ready!!

And regarding environmental protests: these challenges to Apple have clearly resulted in changes for the better--so I say, keep them up! As long as Apple COULD do better, I'm glad there are people pushing for it to happen.

68164
Apr 27, 2006, 07:23 PM
Why didn't SJ mention Front Row when he replied 'loud and clear'? If they allowed Front Row to be extended so EyeTV could be part of the picture that would be cool...

As for the TV ads - to maximise the value of the campaign I'd be guessing they will be advertising MacBooks - and highlighting that all consumer Macs are now Intel!

Should be a good week!

sinisterdesign
Apr 27, 2006, 07:26 PM
new ad campaign? this is almost as exciting as a "media event".

actually, i'm hoping it's MORE exciting than a media event. :cool:

MacFan782040
Apr 27, 2006, 07:29 PM
Yayy!!!!!!!!!! :d

polyesterlester
Apr 27, 2006, 07:35 PM
I hope the new ad campaign copies something really cool!

Bman721
Apr 27, 2006, 07:41 PM
A PVR would be a good option for any macs, but i doubt it will ever happen.

If Apple makes a PVR, then it will kill off the iTunes TV show purchases....just doesn't make sense for them to make it.

AppleinJapan
Apr 27, 2006, 07:55 PM
A PVR would be a good option for any macs, but i doubt it will ever happen.

If Apple makes a PVR, then it will kill off the iTunes TV show purchases....just doesn't make sense for them to make it.

Think about it..The option to buy TV shows is only in America - I read an article I think it was on macbytes.com from an Australian news paper that said it will be a long long time before it happened in OZ- Channel 7, 10 and especially 9 have a hold on the market. So I don't really think that Apple can expand the TV market - maybe to the UK ???

PVR would bring the option to record TV to every mac user around the world and offer one more reason to move from a PC.

johnbro23
Apr 27, 2006, 07:58 PM
CNET reports (http://news.com.com/2061-10793_3-6066128.html?tag=6066128) that the ads will be for Macs.
Arn, shouldn't this be in the first post?

Stridder44
Apr 27, 2006, 07:58 PM
PVR, Mac commercials, and Hints, oh my!

P.S. What are PVR's?


PVR: Personal Video Recorder

DVR: Digital Video Recorder

Same thing essentially.


and BRING ON THE NEW GOODS!! WAHOO!

aswitcher
Apr 27, 2006, 08:03 PM
When Steve says a big TV campaign next week - is that a play on words on his part hinting at the Multimedia Mac being released next week?

gugy
Apr 27, 2006, 08:06 PM
doubt it

JGowan
Apr 27, 2006, 08:07 PM
A PVR would be a good option for any macs, but i doubt it will ever happen.

If Apple makes a PVR, then it will kill off the iTunes TV show purchases....just doesn't make sense for them to make it.Wrong... once again, they provide additional content to go on iPods. Apple is not making enough money on TV downloads to care. It's selling the idea that you can bring your DVR shows on the ipod that people would want.

gugy
Apr 27, 2006, 08:11 PM
I think DVR eventually will come. It's just a matter of time.
maybe next MWSF.
I don't buy the argument of killing Itunes video store sales. It's just another cool feature that a lot of people want in their Macs.
If that was the case Elgato would be in trouble. I think Apple's approach will be something similar to Elgato's that incorporate the Itunes store, plus music, video and photos on a device that hook to your current Entertainment set up and maybe controlled by your mac remotely and sync by .Mac or maybe Airport.

rockthecasbah
Apr 27, 2006, 08:19 PM
even just new ads for the Mac makes this a good story, but Job's "we hear ya" doesn't hurt either! :)

longofest
Apr 27, 2006, 08:23 PM
CNET reports (http://news.com.com/2061-10793_3-6066128.html?tag=6066128) that the ads will be for Macs.

Thanks Q. Added to the story.

emac kinda guy
Apr 27, 2006, 08:27 PM
Apple should look after its (and mine) trash too.

amac4me
Apr 27, 2006, 08:28 PM
I've been an advocate of Apple producing Mac ads. I've held the position that Apple should be doing all that it can do to promote the Mac.

In light of Apple's increasing market share gains, I think Apple should demonstrate that people are making the switch and that the Macintosh running OS X is the choice for consumers and businesses.

I look forward to seeing the ads.

longofest
Apr 27, 2006, 08:32 PM
I've been an advocate of Apple producing Mac ads. I've held the position that Apple should be doing all that it can do to promote the Mac.

In light of Apple's increasing market share gains, I think Apple should demonstrate that people are making the switch and that the Macintosh running OS X is the choice for consumers and businesses.

I look forward to seeing the ads.

I hope we're not looking at more switcher-esque commercials. I for one was not a huge fan of them. I also don't want to see iPod-like mac commercials... I'd rather see ads actually show off some of the cooler features of the Mac, and give people a short little glimpse of why our platform is so great.

marchcapital
Apr 27, 2006, 08:46 PM
i dont care about PVR to be honest. i just want a 13 or 12 in macbook.

EricNau
Apr 27, 2006, 08:50 PM
Finally, a commercial about the Mac. (hopefully)

And bring on that DVR!

dr_lha
Apr 27, 2006, 08:52 PM
CNET reports (http://news.com.com/2061-10793_3-6066128.html?tag=6066128) that the ads will be for Macs.
CNET are pulling this out of their asses I think. Jobs said nothing about the ads being for Macs. It could be a huge new iPod advertising campaign.

I hope it is for Macs, but that has yet to be confirmed.

brepublican
Apr 27, 2006, 08:53 PM
All smiles :)

longofest
Apr 27, 2006, 09:02 PM
CNET are pulling this out of their asses I think. Jobs said nothing about the ads being for Macs. It could be a huge new iPod advertising campaign.

I hope it is for Macs, but that has yet to be confirmed.

Were you at the meeting? How do you know CNet is making it up?

That said, the disparity between Macworld and Think Secret on a number of issues (i.e. the multimedia mac) is a bit disheartening. Somewhere in between it all lies the truth...

GeoffRuth
Apr 27, 2006, 09:03 PM
I think the recycling program is a great move by Apple... why are people so quick to point out yet unseen faults?

Well, here's a good link that points out why Apple is lagging the industry in recycling. Yes, this is better tha before, but it could be much stronger without much work.

http://www.wired.com/news/culture/mac/0,70739-0.html?tw=rss.technology (http://www.wired.com/news/culture/mac/0,70739-0.html?tw=rss.technology)

Frisco
Apr 27, 2006, 09:13 PM
Yes, finally. I am sick of them only advertising the iPod.

And I am so waiting for a PVR--Media Center from Apple.

PLEASE APPLE!

ClimbingTheLog
Apr 27, 2006, 09:45 PM
PVR: Personal Video Recorder
DVR: Digital Video Recorder


Yeah, except TiVo has trademarks on PVR. Dish (our new sponsor!) was forced to change its on-screen branding to DVR. VDR makes more sense anyway, so they're both wankers.

Mac TV ads? What world am I living in? Is M&M going to rap about Macs? How is this possible? They might actually sell some!.

(I know, but he's a di** so I misspell his name on purpose)

nagromme
Apr 27, 2006, 10:07 PM
If Apple makes a PVR, then it will kill off the iTunes TV show purchases....just doesn't make sense for them to make it.
Ripping CDs doesn't kill off iTunes. iTunes profits aren't Apple's main goal--the service mainly sells hardware. I don't think Apple PVR is out of the question. (In fact, it would likely be integrated WITH iTunes.)

As for Mac ads... I would be shocked.

But if a new iBook/MacBook appears next Tuesday, I've long thought that model had the potential to break all Mac sales records... so maybe MacBook ads are called for :D

macpastor
Apr 27, 2006, 10:10 PM
CNET are pulling this out of their asses I think. Jobs said nothing about the ads being for Macs. It could be a huge new iPod advertising campaign.

I hope it is for Macs, but that has yet to be confirmed.

If it was for iPod, that wouldn't be news and I think that Steve wouldn't be so coy about it...

Could it be that really the MacBook could also be the DVR we have all been waiting for?

Record
Watch on your TV
Watch on your MacBook
On the Couch or On the Road...

miketcool
Apr 27, 2006, 10:18 PM
oh, snap. Sounds like Jobs pwned that dude.

"pwned?" or, however you say that ;)

boncellis
Apr 27, 2006, 10:21 PM
I don't want to come off like a pessimist, but with regards to the comment about the potential media center "We hear you" and "We are working on it" are two very different things. I sure hope Apple is coming out with something media centric though!

I'll be the first (in this thread) to speculate--could there be a VIIV compatible offering coming from Apple? I know it was designated as Windows only, but why couldn't Apple develop something for it?

eric_n_dfw
Apr 27, 2006, 10:26 PM
... maybe that's why that guy is the former president of the Sierra Club. :rolleyes:

digitldrew
Apr 27, 2006, 10:44 PM
E3 2006 — Los Angeles
May 10-12

would this AD campaign after the event?

just wondering if anyone knows.

some ideas.
The Macbook's video card could be juiced enough and be marketed as an entertainment/gaming machine.... a stretch. but realisticly arent the bulk of PC game buyers the kids who deck out everything on the cheapest Dell gaming rig. The bulk who buy games arent going to be buying a $2000 Macbook Pro, so they might be filling that nitch somehow.

It would be sweet if the Macbook would be geared more into that form.

dr_lha
Apr 27, 2006, 10:46 PM
They're not going to advertise the MacBook Pro as a games machine. Its too much of a small niche market. Much better to go after a much broader user base.

AidenShaw
Apr 27, 2006, 11:05 PM
CNET are pulling this out of their asses I think. Jobs said nothing about the ads being for Macs.
And since when has any Jobs statement had any relationship to the truth? (Check for "video on iPod", or "1st 64-bit desktop", or "5 times faster", or anything about how bad Intel is relative to whatever it was that IBM/Moto used to sell.)

I'm sure that the ads will be for the new Conroe-based mini-tower.

Bubbasteve
Apr 27, 2006, 11:25 PM
This is terrific news because I was thinking about spending/wasting some of my future paychecks on an eyetv

rick6502
Apr 27, 2006, 11:41 PM
A PVR would be a good option for any macs, but i doubt it will ever happen.

If Apple makes a PVR, then it will kill off the iTunes TV show purchases....just doesn't make sense for them to make it.

I always got the impression that Apple didn't make any significant money off of iTunes. iTunes purpose was to sell iPods. Thus, a PVR would induce more people to put stuff on their iPods, necessitating larger capacity iPods. Some would be new purchasers and some up-graders.
I've been waiting for Apple to show-up Tivo for a long time. The only thing I see as a problem, is that Tivo won that lawsuit about the patent for a "multimedia time warping system." This means that Apple would either have to pay "Tivo" (not happening), not have the ability to pause Live TV (that sucks), or circumvent Tivos's patent. (Good luck, Chuck.)

touring
Apr 27, 2006, 11:44 PM
As a computer specialist for a very large school district, I am aware of the ways some PC makers recycle their products. Last year, I opened a brand new high school with brand new _ _ _ _, P4 computers. Two weeks into the school year, a large truck delivered 180, _ _ _ _, P2 computers that had been removed from other schools and re-imaged. I was told to loan (give) those old Win98 pieces of junk to students for home use. The district got to say that it was providing technology to the students, _ _ _ _ got to say that the thousands of P2s were recycled and the students who received the junk had to dispose of it, somehow.:mad:

nagromme
Apr 27, 2006, 11:48 PM
Intel's next chips keep getting sooner and sooner:
http://www.theinquirer.net/?article=31316

Apple could have a really good all-Intel lineup by July! I'd say that calls for starting some advertising :)

asherman13
Apr 28, 2006, 12:02 AM
I know I'm supposed to be a pure-Macrumors reader, but I have to say that I loved the end of Engadget's commentary about the meeting:

In regards to the recent 17-inch MacBook Pro's release, Jobs let everyone know, "Everyone wants a MacBook Pro because they are so bitchin’." Thanks for that, Steve. Jobs also mentioned the possible demise of the CRT in their lineup, due to environmental concerns and their general lack of bitchin-ness.

Yeah. :)

avensis087
Apr 28, 2006, 12:11 AM
it's about time apple started boosting advertising for the mac. so many people i've talked to had no idea that mac was moving to intel or anything. i hope to see ALOT more mac advertising in the near future.

mr

boncellis
Apr 28, 2006, 12:12 AM
I think the ad campaign will be for the MacBook Pro now that Apple offers it in 15" and 17" configurations.

If that is the case, that would tend to confirm that the smaller (13.3" or whatever it turns out to be) notebook is geared to a different market segment, maybe warranting its own ad campaign.

kugino
Apr 28, 2006, 12:34 AM
i personally hope they bring back ellen feiss for the next round of ads...

i predict there will be a bitchin' macbook sometime in the next week or two. if not, i still like usin' the word bitchin'

iMeowbot
Apr 28, 2006, 12:50 AM
I always got the impression that Apple didn't make any significant money off of iTunes. iTunes purpose was to sell iPods.
That would seem to be about right. Apple never have released specific numbers on iTMS, but they have always called it profitable (except for the first year, when they said it broke even). They have never claimed that it made them a lot of money (and given the cost structure, it can't -- it's a typical retail operation with typical razor-thin margins).

iTMS revenues are buried in the same line item as iPod accessories and AppleCare, but even that combined number only runs at about 1/6 of the revenues for the iPods themselves. So, even though Apple pretty much own the download market, it's not a major business for them.

A fairly small increase in much-more-profitable hardware sales on either the computer or iPod side would more than make up for any dent in iTMS.

Peace
Apr 28, 2006, 12:51 AM
The ads are supposed to be starting during televisions sweeps week in the US.The general demographic for that is 18-49..
Judging by that I'd say any ads for Macs are going to be the whole Intel line-up.We could even see a "one more thing" type ad slipped in somewhere.Apple has done some creative advertising in the past so I'm looking forward to see what happens!!

gwangung
Apr 28, 2006, 01:14 AM
Well, here's a good link that points out why Apple is lagging the industry in recycling. Yes, this is better tha before, but it could be much stronger without much work.

http://www.wired.com/news/culture/mac/0,70739-0.html?tw=rss.technology (http://www.wired.com/news/culture/mac/0,70739-0.html?tw=rss.technology)


Meh. That article's not very good in pointing that out. For example, there's a problem in using the weight of recycled products--if HP's average product is substantially heavier than Apple's, then it's naturally going to have more tonnage of recyling (particularly since their sales are higher). Too, a company with a higher percentage of corporate sales are going to find it easier and cheaper to recycle its products.

THe people pressing Apple on recycling are not doing a very good job in presenting their case.

MattInOz
Apr 28, 2006, 01:28 AM
Is'nt that the 17" iMac. I don't see what else they could make for a LCD eMac, smaller hard-drive & no wireless maybe?

Well once they get some chips to push the iMac back up to 64bit and add those Camera LCD (maybe a case revision, with cooler adjustable stand) say for January. The eMac really could be the current model drop iSight, wireless, smaller harddrive, lower spec DVD. After all it's a machine aimed at schools, but sounds like it would be popular for call centres as well at the right price.

NVRsayNVR
Apr 28, 2006, 01:34 AM
Apple is moving at a pretty rapid pace when you consider that a company their size are about to pump out new gear across the board with new chipsets and new software.

It has been a long "behind the scenes" road for them in reality.

NOW... the chip's are set, the designs are in production or nearing production, the company is positioning itself for SERIOUS GROWTH through Intel's chipset roadmap, building of more stores, purchasing more space... AND building more space... Not to mentions the NEXT OS release!

Confidence in their future is finally in their (and our) grasp! Steve"o" knows!

IT'S TIME TO ROCK THE MAC!!! PUMP UP THE VOLUME ON MAC ADVERTISING!! THIS IS THE YEAR OF APPLES HARDEST ATTACK ON ALL FRONTS. Gooooo baby! :cool:


"Think Alike... BE Different!"

7on
Apr 28, 2006, 01:48 AM
Gotta love people (like Jobs) who know other people's stuff better than the other people do. Just goes to show how really on top of things most special interest orgs are. They use any audience to trumpet the current cause, even if they just trumpetted the opposite not too long ago.

People often forget that before Apple Jobs was a hippie ;)

milatchi
Apr 28, 2006, 01:56 AM
I'm wondering if it will be an extension or a variation of the Mac mini?

CallmeKenneth
Apr 28, 2006, 02:34 AM
I thought the eMac has been discontinued...????

Di9it8
Apr 28, 2006, 02:36 AM
This is terrific news because I was thinking about spending/wasting some of my future paychecks on an eyetv

You would not be wasting your time/money with EyeTV, I think it is one of the best Mac apps/hardware. Use it all the time!!:)

50548
Apr 28, 2006, 03:26 AM
And since when has any Jobs statement had any relationship to the truth? (Check for "video on iPod", or "1st 64-bit desktop", or "5 times faster", or anything about how bad Intel is relative to whatever it was that IBM/Moto used to sell.)

I'm sure that the ads will be for the new Conroe-based mini-tower.

Sorry, there will be no Conroe based tower...Apple would be unwise to launch a mini-tower to compete with its own MacMinis and iMacs...not a single chance for that to happen.

But it was fun anyway to see a Cube sitting on a desk at the University in Bern yesterday (they ALL use Macs, fortunately)...what a beautiful piece of kit, which no other PC maker in the world will ever match.

netdog
Apr 28, 2006, 03:48 AM
For those who think that Apple should be concerned about an OS X based media center cutting into iTMS sales, remember that surely over 90% of iTMS sales don't got to Macintosh users anyway.

Multimedia
Apr 28, 2006, 04:22 AM
It's Always Good When Steve Hears Someone. Still not too old to have lost his hearing. :p

liketom
Apr 28, 2006, 04:42 AM
so when does this new advert air in the states ? what day are we looking at ?


Tuesday or a media event ?

so many questions and only one credit card bill to pay :D

Detlev
Apr 28, 2006, 05:36 AM
How often does Jobs mention that there is a new ad coming out? Could it mean there is a new ad campaign coming out, a new direction? Is "Think Different" done for good?

Hmm, exactly how many campaigns have there been?

Bonte
Apr 28, 2006, 05:53 AM
it's about time apple started boosting advertising for the mac. so many people i've talked to had no idea that mac was moving to intel or anything. i hope to see ALOT more mac advertising in the near future.

it is a good thing they waited for the after the intel transition, now they have something bitching to advertise. :) We'll soon see a full Intel lineup.

ImNoSuperMan
Apr 28, 2006, 06:31 AM
Apple CEO Steve Jobs touted the company’s forthcoming products as “the best I’ve ever seen in my life,”

Just hope the new MacBook is the first in this list.:rolleyes:

cyberrob
Apr 28, 2006, 06:34 AM
TBWA\CHIAT\DAY :cool: :cool: :cool:

THE CANNES LIONS WILL BE YOURS!!!

deadturtle
Apr 28, 2006, 07:21 AM
I am an Apple shareholder and this is the first I am hearing of this meeting.

Me too.... Obviously my paltry sum of apple stock doesnt warrant an invitation of this magnititude!

Photorun
Apr 28, 2006, 07:33 AM
Wow, Apple/Jobs MUST have lost it's mind if the C|Net article about them actually advertising their MACS are true. Apple? Actually advertise their COMPUTERS?!? Why what's next, pigs flying, cats and dogs living in harmoney, The rich getting poorer and the poor getting richer?

AidenShaw
Apr 28, 2006, 07:36 AM
Intel's next chips keep getting sooner and sooner:
http://www.theinquirer.net/?article=31316

Apple could have a really good all-Intel lineup by July! I'd say that calls for starting some advertising :)
And native software by July '07 :eek:

AidenShaw
Apr 28, 2006, 07:43 AM
Sorry, there will be no Conroe based tower...Apple would be unwise to launch a mini-tower to compete with its own MacMinis and iMacs...not a single chance for that to happen.

But it was fun anyway to see a Cube sitting on a desk at the University in Bern yesterday (they ALL use Macs, fortunately)...what a beautiful piece of kit, which no other PC maker in the world will ever match.
Interesting that you rhapsodize over a piece of kit that few people wanted (the cube), while saying that the problem with the upcoming Conroe mini-tower is that people would like it better than what's currently in Apple's lineup.

Apple would sell more systems if the big gap between the MiniMacIntel and the maxi-tower were filled. (marketshare goodness)

Probably a fair number of the Conroe mini-tower sales would include an Apple display - meaning more money for Apple than an iMacIntel purchase.

Since Apple doesn't even break out sales figures by product line - what's the real problem if some of the Conroe mini-tower sales are upsells from the MiniMacIntel and the iMacIntel?

weg
Apr 28, 2006, 07:55 AM
Apple's CEO Steve Jobs said that the upcoming products are "the best I’ve ever seen in my life".


Well, we know what that means (http://store.apple.com/1-800-MY-APPLE/WebObjects/AppleStore.woa/wo/0.RSLID?mco=259870B9&nplm=MA398G%2FA)!

Gasu E.
Apr 28, 2006, 08:04 AM
Larry Fahn, a former president of the Sierra Club, said a recycling program recently announced by Apple didn’t go far enough. He also said that Apple has only recycled 2.4 percent of the computer equipment sold seven years ago, compared to 10 percent recycled by Dell and 7 percent by HP.


My personal observation about the lifecycle of a Mac is that any functioning Mac would still be in use after seven years. Almost everyone I know donates their old functioning Macs to the local schools, which eagerly take them. If the Macs are too slow to power current applications, they are set up as browser machines in the libraries or even set aside for typing practice.

BenRoethig
Apr 28, 2006, 08:26 AM
"Everyone wants a MacBook Pro because they are so bitchin"

Thats what MacWorld said Jobs said!


Also “We only have one CRT product left and that’s the eMac,” Jobs noted. “We could be sitting here next year with none.”

Seems like Jobs is not letting the eMac stay around as is... come on LCD eMac

Close. More like an iMac with MacMini guts for the education market.

Ripping CDs doesn't kill off iTunes. iTunes profits aren't Apple's main goal--the service mainly sells hardware. I don't think Apple PVR is out of the question. (In fact, it would likely be integrated WITH iTunes.)


Like you said, Apple can sell itunes shows or computers. Most windows machines over $500 come with MCE and its PVR. Of course, they are going to take heat from following Microsoft and having to use a full featured remote.

Interesting that you rhapsodize over a piece of kit that few people wanted (the cube), while saying that the problem with the upcoming Conroe mini-tower is that people would like it better than what's currently in Apple's lineup.

Apple would sell more systems if the big gap between the MiniMacIntel and the maxi-tower were filled. (marketshare goodness)

Probably a fair number of the Conroe mini-tower sales would include an Apple display - meaning more money for Apple than an iMacIntel purchase.

Since Apple doesn't even break out sales figures by product line - what's the real problem if some of the Conroe mini-tower sales are upsells from the MiniMacIntel and the iMacIntel?

Apple is going to do what it always does, claim it'll compete with the iMac or make it completely overpriced and useless like the cube. Then they'll seem bewildered that people bought the windows PC over their superior offerings or didn't want to pay two grand on a PowerMac..

Kelmon
Apr 28, 2006, 08:32 AM
The only thing that I'm going to say on this subject is that I hope that they start expanding downloadable television shows into other countries via iTunes. It would also be interesting to know how well the current catalogue of shows in the US is going down with customers - are people buying them and are they seeing any trends in acceptance of downloadable television?

jonharris200
Apr 28, 2006, 08:44 AM
Steve is happy that Apple is in the top 10 of companies that recycle? Sounds a bit like complacency to me.

I'd like to see Apple push much further ahead on environmental responsibility, become the market leader, demonstrate it is thinking beyond just end-of-life 'recycling' to the whole product life including manufacture, shipping and the rest, changing and raising the game so that other companies have to follow suit because consumers begin to expect it as normal.

Just like Apple does in other areas.

Mackey
Apr 28, 2006, 09:04 AM
I think Apple could rock the world with their take on PVR, but I'm going to order a 20" InteliMac soon and, if it gets good reviews, the Eye 250 that's about to ship. Sounds like it can do the job, it's under $200 and the software wins awards. Can't wait forever.

odedia
Apr 28, 2006, 09:09 AM
And since when has any Jobs statement had any relationship to the truth? (Check for "video on iPod", or "1st 64-bit desktop", or "5 times faster", or anything about how bad Intel is relative to whatever it was that IBM/Moto used to sell.)

I'm sure that the ads will be for the new Conroe-based mini-tower.

And what about "we don't have a problem with people installing windows on our machines, but we wll not support it in any way"? that was whay, 2 months before boot camp was out? :)

Oded S.

odedia
Apr 28, 2006, 09:11 AM
Me too.... Obviously my paltry sum of apple stock doesnt warrant an invitation of this magnititude!

I got an invitation.

And I live in Israel, so it should have taken quite some time for it to get to me. plus, it got here almost 1.5 months ago. Surprising indeed.

Oded S.

Peace
Apr 28, 2006, 09:14 AM
And what about "we don't have a problem with people installing windows on our machines, but we wll not support it in any way"? that was whay, 2 months before boot camp was out? :)

Oded S.

Apple never said " we will not support it in any way"..What Apple said was "We won't keep people from installing Windows."

No mention about "in any way"

ukmaestro
Apr 28, 2006, 09:28 AM
“The new products in the pipeline are the best I’ve ever seen in my life,” Jobs said.


Steve Jobs action figure with built in ipod in his stomach? :D

ImAlwaysRight
Apr 28, 2006, 09:37 AM
I think the ad campaign will be for the MacBook Pro now that Apple offers it in 15" and 17" configurations.You gotta remember when Apple is airing these ads ... during prime time TV when the masses are watching. 15"/17" MBP's are NOT for the masses. They are for professionals. iBooks/MacBooks ARE for the masses. Hmmm ... I've got a very good feeling about this. ;) Or, the ads could just be for the Mac Mini/iMac.

But introducing the MacBook 13" Tuesday would make news headlines, plus with Apple MacBook ads on TV during sweeps month for the MacBook translates into a lot of exposure which also translates into a large number of sales.

Bring on the MacBook, baby! :D

MattG
Apr 28, 2006, 09:39 AM
Very cool...bring on the PVRs and new iPods. Mine's due for a replacement :)

someguy
Apr 28, 2006, 09:46 AM
oh, snap. Sounds like Jobs pwned that dude.
Don't you mean 'pwnt'? Gees, get with it. And you call yourself an internet junkie... :rolleyes:

jouster
Apr 28, 2006, 09:55 AM
For those who think that Apple should be concerned about an OS X based media center cutting into iTMS sales, remember that surely over 90% of iTMS sales don't got to Macintosh users anyway.

More to the point, I would expect any OS X media center to incorporate the iTMS.

youngjake
Apr 28, 2006, 10:03 AM
i dont care about PVR to be honest. i just want a 13 or 12 in macbook.

While everyone may not want one, there is a big market for college kids, ie. people who live out of one room. And these are the same kids buying iPods, so Apple really needs to grab this market while the brand is still "cool" - from my experience, it's becoming less "cool" everyday to have an iPod.

jouster
Apr 28, 2006, 10:05 AM
While everyone may not want one, there is a big market for college kids, ie. people who live out of one room. And these are the same kids buying iPods, so Apple really needs to grab this market while the brand is still "cool" - from my experience, it's becoming less "cool" everyday to have an iPod.

Also, whether it happens through a TiVo or TiVo-like device, or a computer or PDA or being built in to a TV, the simple fact is that PVRs are going to be ubiquitous in the not-too-distant future. It will seem incredible that they didn't always exist......

youngjake
Apr 28, 2006, 10:11 AM
Also, whether it happens through a TiVo or TiVo-like device, or a computer or PDA or built in to a TV, the simple fact is that PVRs are going to be ubiquitous in the not-too-distant future. It will seem incredible that they didn't always exist......

I wish it were true... with all of the new DRM tech they are putting into new standards for HDTV singnals, it may become increasingly difficult to record anything. In the future that is...

bearcat2000
Apr 28, 2006, 10:37 AM
The real question is whether a DVR will make Apple money. Tivo is by far the best in the industry currently and as of yet have never made an annual profit. The interface on Tivo is spectacular, but we all know that if Apple took them over it would be better and more beautiful than ever...and work with Macs. That is where Tivo lacks bigtime now, us Mac users are always last to receive the updates...ie tivotogo.

nagromme
Apr 28, 2006, 10:49 AM
"Everyone wants a MacBook Pro because they are so bitchin"

Thats what MacWorld said Jobs said!
I can't believe all this bitchin! :D


And since when has any Jobs statement had any relationship to the truth? (Check for "video on iPod", or "1st 64-bit desktop", or "5 times faster", or anything about how bad Intel is relative to whatever it was that IBM/Moto used to sell.)

I'm sure that the ads will be for the new Conroe-based mini-tower.
Are you saying the problems with Netburst and the Pentium 4 weren't real? Because Intel would disagree. And Apple has shown no sign of using any of the chips they have touted the G5 over. Apple is actually using new Intel chips (known as "Core") that did not even exist before this year.

I don't think ads for Conroe make sense in May, in any case.


And native software by July '07 :eek:
That's right, because software that's already native doesn't matter, only software that isn't yet ;) And nobody could ever be productive in the meantime with Photoshop at G4 speeds via Rosetta on Conroe ;) That's why every print shop always has only brand-new top-speed computers ;)

touring
Apr 28, 2006, 11:16 AM
Me too.... Obviously my paltry sum of apple stock doesnt warrant an invitation of this magnititude!

You needed to have owned your Apple shares prior to February 28, 2006. I bought my shares on March 7, 2006, so I did not get an invite either. I will be going next year for sure!:cool:

Checkout the 2006 Proxy on http://www.apple.com/investor

imacdaddy
Apr 28, 2006, 12:21 PM
Meh. That article's not very good in pointing that out. For example, there's a problem in using the weight of recycled products--if HP's average product is substantially heavier than Apple's, then it's naturally going to have more tonnage of recyling (particularly since their sales are higher). Too, a company with a higher percentage of corporate sales are going to find it easier and cheaper to recycle its products.

THe people pressing Apple on recycling are not doing a very good job in presenting their case.

Life cycle of Apple computers are much longer than PCs. People are still using their 5+ years Macs. So not much to recycle ya think?

swingerofbirch
Apr 28, 2006, 12:46 PM
will the audio of this meeting be released?

boncellis
Apr 28, 2006, 01:00 PM
You gotta remember when Apple is airing these ads ... during prime time TV when the masses are watching. 15"/17" MBP's are NOT for the masses. They are for professionals. iBooks/MacBooks ARE for the masses...

Hmm...you might be on to something...;)

I remember Apple advertising the PowerMac (the one that blew its user through the wall of his house) and that is supposedly for "professional" users. I understand your point, though.

boncellis
Apr 28, 2006, 01:01 PM
...That's right, because software that's already native doesn't matter, only software that isn't yet ;) And nobody could ever be productive in the meantime with Photoshop at G4 speeds via Rosetta on Conroe ;) That's why every print shop always has only brand-new top-speed computers ;)

I believe that's check...and mate. Where have you been lately, Nagromme?

JAT
Apr 28, 2006, 03:02 PM
Steve is happy that Apple is in the top 10 of companies that recycle? Sounds a bit like complacency to me.

I'd like to see Apple push much further ahead on environmental responsibility, become the market leader, demonstrate it is thinking beyond just end-of-life 'recycling' to the whole product life including manufacture, shipping and the rest, changing and raising the game so that other companies have to follow suit because consumers begin to expect it as normal.

Just like Apple does in other areas.
Sounds like people are confusing Apple recycling their own stuff and collecting stuff from customers. I think SJ was talking about their own stuff. They haven't had much of a collection program running before, so doubtful he'd gush over that.

dongmin
Apr 28, 2006, 05:57 PM
Ripping CDs doesn't kill off iTunes. iTunes profits aren't Apple's main goal--the service mainly sells hardware. I don't think Apple PVR is out of the question. (In fact, it would likely be integrated WITH iTunes.)Umm, the TV/video market is nothing like the music market.

1. TV, as it's consumed, is essentially a subscription model. You shell out $40-60 to your cable provider to have access to content. Music, on the other hand, has traditionally been owned.

2. The video quality on iTMS sucks, and it's not gonna cut it in the world of HDTV. The quality of the music, on the other hand, is 'good enough' for the vast majority of people.

The DVR essentially allows people who're renting the content to actually own it. The quality and convenience of TiVo is vastly superior to any previous method of recording TV. That's why it's a big deal. Imagine if music was broadcast in 128kbps AAC quality and people had the means to record any broadcast/stream out there and do it smartly by having a piece of software locate all songs by bands and genres you like. Don't you think that would change how you consumed music? That's essentially what TiVo does for video.

The only way iTMS will be able to compete against DVRs is if they upped the quality drastically, which is not likely to happen anytime soon, and if they sold content not available on normal cable.

aswitcher
Apr 28, 2006, 06:08 PM
Interesting that you rhapsodize over a piece of kit that few people wanted (the cube), while saying that the problem with the upcoming Conroe mini-tower is that people would like it better than what's currently in Apple's lineup.

Apple would sell more systems if the big gap between the MiniMacIntel and the maxi-tower were filled. (marketshare goodness)

Probably a fair number of the Conroe mini-tower sales would include an Apple display - meaning more money for Apple than an iMacIntel purchase.

Since Apple doesn't even break out sales figures by product line - what's the real problem if some of the Conroe mini-tower sales are upsells from the MiniMacIntel and the iMacIntel?

They could do an iMac without a screen (lies flat and in black) and an extra port or two but in my mind it would want to be a digital receiver like device but without speaker out port and have:

Up to Dual 250gig HDD
DVI out
HDMI out and preferably a couple HDMI ins
Digital Audio out and anything up to four optical audio ins
802.11n for broadcasting video to new 802.11n airports
and they also may want a few analogue video and audio inputs as well

I think my dream MM centre is to ambitious for Apple.

Oh, and upscaling DVD player and bluray... ;)

AidenShaw
Apr 28, 2006, 09:12 PM
Are you saying the problems with Netburst and the Pentium 4 weren't real?
They're 'bitchin' chips that work really well and fast - but the "problem" is that they are power hungry.

Needs to be fixed (and is in the upcoming "Core" microarchitecture - although the current "Core" chips don't use the "Core" microarchitecture).

How many of the Apple adverts touted power consumption - any? They seemed to focus on performance.


Apple is actually using new Intel chips (known as "Core") that did not even exist before this year.
The Yonah is a stop-gap, based on the Banias/Dothan architecture - it's not the new "Core" architecture.

However, all of the Intel chips (Netburst, Pentium M/Yonah, and Core) have SSE, not Altivec. (Ooops, the Lord God Jobs says "Velocity Engine", not "Altivec".)

So, all of the Apple criticism of SSE in the Pentium no longer applies to SSE in the Yonah/Core? LOL :rolleyes:

Intel's integrated GMA graphics were the spawn of the Devil - but now that Apple's using it in the MiniMacIntel and upcoming iBookIntel it's a wonderful low cost high performance solution. :eek: :rolleyes:

Arcady
Apr 29, 2006, 01:23 AM
You needed to have owned your Apple shares prior to February 28, 2006. I bought my shares on March 7, 2006, so I did not get an invite either. I will be going next year for sure!:cool: [/url]

I've been a shareholder since 1997, and I have never received an invite to anything.

And what's all this junk about recycling old Macs? I thought that was what eBay was for.

Macnoviz
Apr 29, 2006, 08:18 AM
OOOOOhh

Anyone else experiencing cold shivers on his back?

because I do

I hope Winblows lusers will finally realise Mac superiority with a cool 13,3 inch Macbook

Oh! Suit you, Sir !

7on
Apr 29, 2006, 12:21 PM
I can't believe all this bitchin! :D



Are you saying the problems with Netburst and the Pentium 4 weren't real? Because Intel would disagree. And Apple has shown no sign of using any of the chips they have touted the G5 over. Apple is actually using new Intel chips (known as "Core") that did not even exist before this year.

I don't think ads for Conroe make sense in May, in any case.



That's right, because software that's already native doesn't matter, only software that isn't yet ;) And nobody could ever be productive in the meantime with Photoshop at G4 speeds via Rosetta on Conroe ;) That's why every print shop always has only brand-new top-speed computers ;)


haha, word. My design prof still uses an old G3 running os9. :o

AidenShaw
Apr 29, 2006, 03:17 PM
Life cycle of Apple computers are much longer than PCs. People are still using their 5+ years Macs. So not much to recycle ya think?
Used to be - but now that Apple is selling Intel PCs that run Windows, with the same chips and chipsets that Dell/HP/Lenovo/... use, why would you assume that the anecdotal historical data will still apply?

Or apply anymore than it does now? I still run into the occasional Pentium running Windows 95 - there are 10 year old Intel computers still in use out there....

I don't think ads for Conroe make sense in May, in any case.
You're right - ads for the new Conroe mini-tower will be in late June and July.

TopGear
Apr 29, 2006, 04:19 PM
i dont care about PVR to be honest. i just want a 13 or 12 in macbook.

Me too. Lightweight and widescreen.

50548
Apr 30, 2006, 09:46 AM
Interesting that you rhapsodize over a piece of kit that few people wanted (the cube), while saying that the problem with the upcoming Conroe mini-tower is that people would like it better than what's currently in Apple's lineup.

Apple would sell more systems if the big gap between the MiniMacIntel and the maxi-tower were filled. (marketshare goodness)

Probably a fair number of the Conroe mini-tower sales would include an Apple display - meaning more money for Apple than an iMacIntel purchase.

Since Apple doesn't even break out sales figures by product line - what's the real problem if some of the Conroe mini-tower sales are upsells from the MiniMacIntel and the iMacIntel?

Sorry, but you misunderstood me...notwithstanding my romantic comment on the Cube (a really nice design), the fact is that a headless mini-tower is totally unnecessary for Apple's interests.

Besides, I don't know where I said that the tower would be the preferred machine for people; I just implied it would hurt offerings such as the iMac and the PM/MacPro.

Apart from the MacMini (which is meant to be an entry-level/switcher's machine), Apple is historically linked to higher margin products and the paradigm of AIO consumer machines.

Apple doesn't break sales figures for obvious reasons, competitive advantage being the first of them. If Apple discloses that the MacMini is selling zero, you give shareholders a horrible PR message, and a great tip to competitors about Apple's weak or strong areas.

I don't believe most would prefer expensive Apple displays...the market for that is huge, and Apple cannot risk separating CPU and display in prosumer machines. For MacPros, fine; not for the iMac.

And to replace the MacMini would be also unwise, as the tower would certainly carry a higher price tag, scaring off switchers and people on a budget.

The Cube is great, though...why not offer it again as a revamped boutique product?

50548
Apr 30, 2006, 09:56 AM
How many of the Apple adverts touted power consumption - any? They seemed to focus on performance.

However, all of the Intel chips (Netburst, Pentium M/Yonah, and Core) have SSE, not Altivec. (Ooops, the Lord God Jobs says "Velocity Engine", not "Altivec".)

Intel's integrated GMA graphics were the spawn of the Devil - but now that Apple's using it in the MiniMacIntel and upcoming iBookIntel it's a wonderful low cost high performance solution. :eek: :rolleyes:

You keep on rockin' as a fanboy, AidenShaw:

1) Apple has always stressed the good power consumption specs of the CoreDuo, as well as its performance, which is more than proven nowadays...unless you live in another planet you would've realized that.

2) Altivec, VMX and VE are the same things (jointly developed by Apple, IBM and Motorola), but Jobs HAS to use VE because this's the trademarked name by Apple...Altivec is Motorola's (which then require a license for its use)...you should've known that also...that's basic legal knowledge.

For your own knowledge again:

http://www.apple.com/legal/trademark/appletmlist.html
Velocity Engine® vector processing unit

3) Previous GMAs were really the devil's spawn...but the GMA950 is way better than previous crap offered in PCs, so Jobs has a good way out of that as well...

AidenShaw
Apr 30, 2006, 10:48 AM
You keep on rockin' as a fanboy, AidenShaw:
Back in ad hominem style, Mr. Lawyer - I was surprised that your previous post didn't start with a personal crack.


1) Apple has always stressed the good power consumption specs of the CoreDuo, as well as its performance, which is more than proven nowadays...unless you live in another planet you would've realized that.
The context of the thread was Apple's comments about PPC vs. Intel chips before the big switch - not what Apple is saying now about its Intel line. ("another planet" - crack #2)


but Jobs HAS to use VE because this's the trademarked name by Apple...
But Apple didn't need to invent its own name for the technology, so your point is not relevant. (And a name that not even many of the ardent fanbois even use - AltiVec is by far the most commonly used name.)

Did Apple trademark "Velocity Engine Extreme" for SSE3? No, that would be silly.


3) Previous GMAs were really the devil's spawn...but the GMA950 is way better than previous crap offered in PCs, so Jobs has a good way out of that as well...
That's a nice rationalization.

Most people here would only agree that the GMA950 doesn't suck as badly as the earlier ones. It's still poor at 3D, but like the earlier ones, fine for 2D work like surfing, email and Photoshop.

The big advantage of the GMA950 for Apple is the hardware accelerated MPEG decoding - so that the mini can keep up with a quad at HD video playback. That's huge.

AidenShaw
Apr 30, 2006, 12:05 PM
Besides, I don't know where I said that the tower would be the preferred machine for people; I just implied it would hurt offerings such as the iMac and the PM/MacPro.
The only way the new Conroe mini-tower would hurt the sales of the other lines would be if some people preferred the new Conroe mini-tower instead of the MiniMacIntel, iMacIntel, or PowerMacIntel -- c'est vrai, n'est pas?

50548
Apr 30, 2006, 02:42 PM
The only way the new Conroe mini-tower would hurt the sales of the other lines would be if some people preferred the new Conroe mini-tower instead of the MiniMacIntel, iMacIntel, or PowerMacIntel -- c'est vrai, n'est pas?

Bien sûr, but you said "people" before, not "some people"...this is huge difference; and your argument as moot, as "some people" will always prefer the mini tower...

zap2
Apr 30, 2006, 02:47 PM
Used to be - but now that Apple is selling Intel PCs that run Windows, with the same chips and chipsets that Dell/HP/Lenovo/... use, why would you assume that the anecdotal historical data will still apply?



Perhaps the same Chip but Dell and HP(not to sure abot Lenovo) uses low quality stuff because the have to, they sell PC for 299, the what you get for 299 is not going to last you, and Apple Hardware is not 299 peices of crap

AidenShaw
Apr 30, 2006, 08:28 PM
Perhaps the same Chip but Dell and HP(not to sure abot Lenovo) uses low quality stuff because the have to, they sell PC for 299, the what you get for 299 is not going to last you, and Apple Hardware is not 299 peices of crap
Same disks, same graphics, same....

Can you honestly show that any component of the $800 Dell or HP is really inferior to a component used by Apple in a system at close to twice the price? (Don't compare the bottom of the barrel loss leader - look at the more typical system. I see people go to Dell when they see the $500 tag, and end up with an $800 system when they think about what they really want and need. Or, compare the $299 Apple to the $299 Dell - if you can ;)
)

Considering that Dell and HP warranties are often much longer than Apple's - I don't think that you'll be successful in finding those "low quality" items. I think you'll more often find exactly the same components in both.

dpaanlka
May 1, 2006, 12:29 AM
Maybe this has something to do with the new advertising campaign?

These suddenly have been showing up allllllll over my campus:

http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=197497

Macnoviz
May 1, 2006, 09:03 AM
Maybe this has something to do with the new advertising campaign?

These suddenly have been showing up allllllll over my campus:

http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=197497

Mixed feelings about this, because the rumored Macbook would be ideal for students, yet here they are talking about the MBP and iMac
I hope this doesn't mean that they are unsure about releasing the MB in time for the next school year.
Still, it's pretty nive material for the ad campaign

kresh
May 1, 2006, 07:39 PM
Attacking pc's on the virus front. This is just awesome!

Multimedia
May 1, 2006, 08:30 PM
Attacking pc's on the virus front. This is just awesome!On What Show Please? We're still 90 minutes 'til primetime here on the west coast. :eek: 24? Prison Break? CSI Miami?