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jelloshotsrule
Feb 13, 2003, 03:50 PM
The 10.2.4 Update delivers enhanced functionality and improved reliability for the following applications, services and technologies: Address Book, Classic compatibility, Finder, FireWire, Graphics, OpenGL, and Sherlock. It includes AFP and Windows file service improvements, as well as audio, disc recording, graphics, and printing improvements.

For detailed information on this Update, please visit http://www.info.apple.com/kbnum/n107362

FelixDerKater
Feb 13, 2003, 03:59 PM
VersionTracker is now listing Mac OS 10.2.4.

http://www.versiontracker.com/dyn/moreinfo/macosx/8848

Dr. Distortion
Feb 13, 2003, 04:02 PM
Well, let's see what this update will bring us... I hope it'll give some noticable openGL speed improvement on my Dual G4/500... :)

-Dr. D.

peteMG
Feb 13, 2003, 04:03 PM
go go go!!!:D

alset
Feb 13, 2003, 04:04 PM
Those looking for beta versions should be very happy!

Dan

Tiauguinho
Feb 13, 2003, 04:07 PM
Already downloading the update...

nickarmadillo
Feb 13, 2003, 04:12 PM
took long enough. I just got off school so im downloading it now. 40mb, jeeze

D0ct0rteeth
Feb 13, 2003, 04:15 PM
The 10.2.4 Update delivers enhanced functionality and improved reliability for the following applications, services and technologies: Address Book, Classic compatibility, Finder, FireWire, Graphics, OpenGL, and Sherlock. It includes AFP and Windows file service improvements, as well as audio, disc recording, graphics, and printing improvements.

For detailed information on this Update, please visit http://www.info.apple.com/kbnum/n107362

-Doc

RBMaraman
Feb 13, 2003, 04:17 PM
Downloading it now...

Hey, maybe this update will help speed up iMovie 3. :D

Mr. Anderson
Feb 13, 2003, 04:18 PM
I've been having some issues with the file servers at work - I hope this fixes it. :)

D

dricci
Feb 13, 2003, 04:20 PM
Originally posted by RBMaraman
Hey, maybe this update will help speed up iMovie 3. :D

Doub it, but a repair permissions and the QuickTime 6.1 update would :P

No iChat updates? Blah :mad:

MrMacMan
Feb 13, 2003, 04:24 PM
Originally posted by D0ct0rteeth
The 10.2.4 Update delivers enhanced functionality and improved reliability for the following applications, services and technologies: Address Book, Classic compatibility, Finder, FireWire, Graphics, OpenGL, and Sherlock. It includes AFP and Windows file service improvements, as well as audio, disc recording, graphics, and printing improvements.

For detailed information on this Update, please visit http://www.info.apple.com/kbnum/n107362

-Doc

um... apple puled the article... Lets all get it before they pull the download!

Quickly! ;)

alset
Feb 13, 2003, 04:26 PM
This is build 6|32. They moved up one since yesterday.

Dan

TMA
Feb 13, 2003, 04:27 PM
Edit - Sorry misread a post above. Some people say they dont see it on software update yet - maybe we're all overloading the servers? :p

Installing now :)

Vlade
Feb 13, 2003, 04:30 PM
Hum, I had trouble from VT getting the download, but Software Update is working fine

iShater
Feb 13, 2003, 04:31 PM
Did anybody notice that the KB article is missing?

alset
Feb 13, 2003, 04:34 PM
Originally posted by iShater
Did anybody notice that the KB article is missing?

I've been checking it ever since I started the download and installed. This is common. I don't think I have ever seen the article placed at the same time as the update, which is a little frustrating. Oh, well. I can stand to wait an hour or so.

Dan

eyeluvmyimac
Feb 13, 2003, 04:35 PM
possibly the first pic on the net??

http://members.cox.net/tmartin316/1024.tiff

shadowfax
Feb 13, 2003, 04:35 PM
Originally posted by iShater
Did anybody notice that the KB article is missing?

i don't think they post it till later. right, someone who knows?

eyeluvmyimac
Feb 13, 2003, 04:36 PM
Originally posted by eyeluvmyimac
possibly the first pic on the net??

http://members.cox.net/tmartin316/1024.tiff

hmm guess that didnt work, is there some kinda trick to doing this? guess you could all click the link if you want to

eyeluvmyimac
Feb 13, 2003, 04:38 PM
ah hah! figured it out!

now

possibly the first pic on the net??

eyeluvmyimac
Feb 13, 2003, 04:39 PM
check it out

8thDegreeSavage
Feb 13, 2003, 04:43 PM
What is the build number guys?

And can you confirm that the Geforce extensions(2MX&3) have been all combined into one kext called "Geforce"?

alset
Feb 13, 2003, 04:49 PM
Originally posted by iShater
Did anybody notice that the KB article is missing?

Now it''s here. Let's have a look and see!

Dan

FelixDerKater
Feb 13, 2003, 04:50 PM
Originally posted by 8thDegreeSavage
What is the build number guys?

And can you confirm that the Geforce extensions(2MX&3) have been all combined into one kext called "Geforce"?

6l32.

Searching for GeForce results in only one .Kext, GeForce.kext.

dguisinger
Feb 13, 2003, 04:53 PM
Originally posted by eyeluvmyimac
ah hah! figured it out!

now

possibly the first pic on the net??

I've never seen that weather application before, looks kind of neat. Where can one find it?

Chad4Mac
Feb 13, 2003, 04:55 PM
Originally posted by RBMaraman
Downloading it now...

Hey, maybe this update will help speed up iMovie 3. :D

My iMovie launches faster without a doubt. I'll say 50% faster. Thanks Apple!

Chad4Mac

8thDegreeSavage
Feb 13, 2003, 04:56 PM
Thanks man.

cyks
Feb 13, 2003, 04:59 PM
"The 10.2.4 Update delivers enhanced functionality and improved reliability for the following applications, services and technologies: Address Book, Classic compatibility, Finder, FireWire, Graphics, OpenGL, and Sherlock. It includes AFP and Windows file service improvements, as well as audio, disc recording, graphics, and printing improvements."


Ignoring the above and it's non-specific ways... has anyone here actually found or noticed a difference? (preferably positive)

Example- with 10.2.3 there was a noticable change it re-draw times... anything along those or any lines with 10.2.4?

Just curious to know before I blindly install it.
Thanks.

TMA
Feb 13, 2003, 05:00 PM
Originally posted by dguisinger


I've never seen that weather application before, looks kind of neat. Where can one find it?

Its a konfabulator widget (one of the ones it comes with) http://www.konfabulator.com Looks like it could be a promising utility if people would stop just making clocks and news tickers for it.

MrMacMan
Feb 13, 2003, 05:01 PM
Originally posted by Chad4Mac


My iMovie launches faster without a doubt. I'll say 50% faster. Thanks Apple!

Chad4Mac

I'll be the judge of that. Lets count the bonces on my iMac 800.
On 5 the screen load it stops bouncing on 6.

A slight improvment over 8 bonces. :D

Chad4Mac
Feb 13, 2003, 05:02 PM
Originally posted by RBMaraman
Downloading it now...

Hey, maybe this update will help speed up iMovie 3. :D

Maybe everything is more"speedy." I might be tripping...

Chad4Mac

JupiterZen
Feb 13, 2003, 05:05 PM
Originally posted by cyks

Ignoring the above and it's non-specific ways... has anyone here actually found or noticed a difference? (preferably positive)


I had the issue of the opening Volumes directory when I connected to the AFP shares on my Netware 6 server.

Now they seem to work fine ;)

Now if only Novell would support filenames longer than 32 characters in their AFP implementation. Because they just cut of longer ones at this time :(

RBMaraman
Feb 13, 2003, 05:11 PM
Originally posted by Chad4Mac

Maybe everything is more "speedy." I might be tripping...


I think you might be right. Everything seems to be a bit "snappier."

I was thinking about performing a clean install to grab a little more "snappiness." Now that 10.2.4 is out, maybe I'll do it this weekend. Time to backup the data!

Once again, nice job Apple!

Kodex
Feb 13, 2003, 05:11 PM
Thursday afternoon? Anyone else feel this one really came out of left feild?

centauratlas
Feb 13, 2003, 05:22 PM
The non-server update is there, but not the server version. Generally they come out at the same time...wonder what is up.

jelloshotsrule
Feb 13, 2003, 05:23 PM
Originally posted by Kodex
Thursday afternoon? Anyone else feel this one really came out of left feild?

nah. as far as i remember, there's no history of any particular pattern of os update releases...


maya now works again! (with gf4ti) whoo! that's what i was hoping for.

Skandranon
Feb 13, 2003, 05:31 PM
I'm sitting put on 10.2.3 through the weekend. Especially after getting bit by the iTunes 2.0 volume-eating installer bug two years ago.

Happy 'venturing!

:)

10.2.4 Loser
Feb 13, 2003, 05:34 PM
I installed 10.2.4 and now I cannot access any browers. They *all* crash when I try to run.

I have restarted the machine numerous times... but still all browsers - give "Application Unexpectantly Quit" error

help???

ChoMomma
Feb 13, 2003, 05:46 PM
Originally posted by eyeluvmyimac
possibly the first pic on the net??

http://members.cox.net/tmartin316/1024.tiff


What is that you are using to put the time and weather on the desktop like that? That's cool :D

-----------

"Originally posted by dguisinger


I've never seen that weather application before, looks kind of neat. Where can one find it?


Its a konfabulator widget (one of the ones it comes with) http://www.konfabulator.com Looks like it could be a promising utility if people would stop just making clocks and news tickers for it."

------------

Nevermind seems like everyone else had the same question I just had to read further :)

donco
Feb 13, 2003, 05:48 PM
Originally posted by 10.2.4 Loser
I installed 10.2.4 and now I cannot access any browers. They *all* crash when I try to run.

I have restarted the machine numerous times... but still all browsers - give "Application Unexpectantly Quit" error

help???

I had that problem a while ago with 10.2.3
I had force quit a stuffit expander installer (not a bright thing to do as it turned out), and NO browser would work after that. FTP, Mail etc. were all ok. Bad news is: I had to re-install the OS. Try repairing permissions and post to MacFixit to see if there is a better way.
good luck.

MacBandit
Feb 13, 2003, 05:48 PM
Originally posted by 10.2.4 Loser
I installed 10.2.4 and now I cannot access any browers. They *all* crash when I try to run.

I have restarted the machine numerous times... but still all browsers - give "Application Unexpectantly Quit" error

help???


First try repairing permissions. If that doesn't work backup your bookmarks then delele the preferences and .plist files. If that doesn't work try reinstalling the program.

robotrenegade
Feb 13, 2003, 05:55 PM
Downloading now....

bradbomb
Feb 13, 2003, 05:57 PM
Finally since 10.2, 10.2.4 fixed the problem with my Pismo 500 that when the laptop was plugged in and fully charged, the battery menu was say Calculating when under show time, 100% under show percent, and the icon was the charging icon. Now, finally it says plugged in when fully charged like other PBs and iBooks and shows the plug icon!

Kodex
Feb 13, 2003, 06:03 PM
Well it seems to boot a little faster, but finder operations seem to be a little slower, noticably with opening/closing new windows. They did fix the desktop icon bug which is helpful. Also freed up a bunch of room on my system hard drive, that was suprising. Anyways thats all i have noticed so far, hope i was helpful.

jacg
Feb 13, 2003, 06:05 PM
Just installed it on my 17" iMac 800. Menu text seems to have changed - sharper?

Update added the 'input flag' to my menu bar and this proved difficult to get rid of, even though I only had one type selected. (Got rid of the flag by selecting another type, then going back to one).

Oh and I got a shock when it restarted into some horrible stretched 1024x768 screen mode!

Haven't noticed much else yet.

tagy
Feb 13, 2003, 06:08 PM
i notice these 2 new utilities:

Bluetooth Serial Utility
Bluetooth Setup Assistant


will see what they do tommorow when i get my USB bluetooth module back from a friend.

MacBandit
Feb 13, 2003, 06:11 PM
Originally posted by jacg
Just installed it on my 17" iMac 800. Menu text seems to have changed - sharper?

Update added the 'input flag' to my menu bar and this proved difficult to get rid of, even though I only had one type selected. (Got rid of the flag by selecting another type, then going back to one).

Oh and I got a shock when it restarted into some horrible stretched 1024x768 screen mode!

Haven't noticed much else yet.

Could be that it recognizes your computer as an LCD iMac and usess a reduced level of smoothing.

To get rid of or rearange any icon drop down menu in the finder menu bar you can use hold the option? key and click and drag it around or drag it off the menu bar to get rid of it. Also the flag menu is in the system preferences under languages? I believe. You can turn it on and off from there.

Sorry about the question marks and slight uncertainty. I am currently at work on a PC and not at home where I can verify what I remember.

ChoMomma
Feb 13, 2003, 06:16 PM
Konfabulous !!!

I love my TiBook more and more everyday ;)
Now I know why the Dell (laptop) user in my Art history class keeps eyeballing me! I'll have to get a wrist cord like they have on surf boards.. but only for my TiBook!!!

**I use my TiBook to take notes in class @ school **
Art history is a 2 hour slide lecture in the dark ; ) so my long lasting battery and ultra sharp (even when dimmed way down) screen are making the PC laptop users jealous ; ) Muhahahaha!!!!

:D

buffsldr
Feb 13, 2003, 06:17 PM
Originally posted by FelixDerKater


6l32.

Searching for GeForce results in only one .Kext, GeForce.kext.


I think the build number varies according to what computer you have (eg ibook vs powermac). Can anyone confirm this?


Edit: The only sad part about this update is after 8 days of uptime I will have to reboot my iBook. Aren't macs great :)

shadowfax
Feb 13, 2003, 06:51 PM
I'm getting pissed. my custom finder icon left, and i can't get it back using the normal means. it's that ugly blue mac smile, it doesn't fit with any of my other icons. this is really annoying me!

anyone know what the deal is?

ultrafiel
Feb 13, 2003, 06:53 PM
Come on guys, I can't believe no one has even mentioned this improvement. It better show up in the apple document...


If you look in the "About this Mac" window the copyright date now goes to 2003!!! And just think I thought the New Year was a month and half ago. BEHOLD THE APPLE NEW YEAR!!!! FEBRUARY 13TH!!!!

Choppaface
Feb 13, 2003, 07:10 PM
grrrr.. why does apple always turn on auto-updating after every update? It's my internet connection, not theirs >_<

looks like the bug in the photoshop file browser has been fixed though (it seems a bit faster too)

LimeiBook86
Feb 13, 2003, 07:25 PM
Hah, me and my iBook 466 SE don't see much of a difference...eh...:rolleyes:

Lz0
Feb 13, 2003, 07:34 PM
I'll run Xbench, upgrade and then run Xbench again.

That should sort out and speed increase issues.

eyeluvmyimac
Feb 13, 2003, 07:37 PM
Originally posted by dguisinger


I've never seen that weather application before, looks kind of neat. Where can one find it?

that's just konfabulator

www.konfabulator.com

awesome program

Pekk
Feb 13, 2003, 07:54 PM
:)
Have 2 monitors setup and before the update I couldn't have quartz extreme enabled, now Quartz Extreme Check says both monitors are accelerated. Great!

I also find the computer a little faster.

Pekk
G4 400 w/ ATI Radeon 8500 and 768Mb RAM

beatle888
Feb 13, 2003, 07:59 PM
fourty one megs, jeeezus. well i guess
i'll have to be patient. downloading now.

yosoyjay
Feb 13, 2003, 08:00 PM
The best improvement to my iBook 500 is finding out about Konfabulator. Thanks a million!

Hemingray
Feb 13, 2003, 08:22 PM
Originally posted by ultrafiel
If you look in the "About this Mac" window the copyright date now goes to 2003!!! And just think I thought the New Year was a month and half ago. BEHOLD THE APPLE NEW YEAR!!!! FEBRUARY 13TH!!!!

Wow, not only that, this is apparently the 20th anniversary of the MacOS. :cool:

G4scott
Feb 13, 2003, 08:23 PM
If this does what I think it does, CD burning finally won't be a pain in the butt without toast:

From the k-base article
Further improves an enhancement introduced with Mac OS X 10.2.3, in which files and folders specific to Mac OS file systems are no longer copied to the disc when burning a CD.

This is just funny:

Improves wording in the progress indicator window when copying a large file to an iDisk or WebDAV volume ("5 seconds remaining" could previously for much longer than five seconds).

They may have improved wording in the copy box, but not on their info article...

Seems like a solid update. I just hope if can fix my sleep problem by some odd chance...

rubikcube
Feb 13, 2003, 08:52 PM
Well, the biggest thing I notice is the 4x FSAA finally works in Jedi Knight II. This is a most welcome enhancement for me.

beatle888
Feb 13, 2003, 08:58 PM
they must have done something to crank
up quartz extreme. my folder windows resize a lot better. however in adobe acrobat i notice a
glitche when trying to put my document window
up tight agaisnt the top tool bar in acrobat.

vniow
Feb 13, 2003, 08:59 PM
Originally posted by buffsldr


Edit: The only sad part about this update is after 8 days of uptime I will have to reboot my iBook. Aren't macs great :)

shadowfax
Feb 13, 2003, 09:04 PM
Well, repairing disk permissions helped me for the first time ever. earlier i posted that after getting OS X 10.2.4, my finder icon WOULD NOT change from the default icon. after repairing them, everything worked fine. how weird is that? [not very]

i bought CandyBar tonight. what a fun little program.

3777
Feb 13, 2003, 09:16 PM
Originally posted by yosoyjay
The best improvement to my iBook 500 is finding out about Konfabulator. Thanks a million!

I just downloaded that too, cool program.

pilotgi
Feb 13, 2003, 09:19 PM
Quartz Extreme Check
Where do I get this?

Edit: Never mind, I found it.

veedubdrew
Feb 13, 2003, 09:31 PM
Well, even though Xbench seems to disagree, my 800 MHz 17" iMac seems quite a bit snappier. Almost all of the OS X interface lag is gone on my machine. iMovie is smoother now (thank god) and the whole machine just runs quicker. Anyone else noticing this?

MrBillGates
Feb 13, 2003, 09:33 PM
Originally posted by 3777


I just downloaded that too, cool program.

Me too... Awesome software. Downloaded and registered.

shadowfax
Feb 13, 2003, 09:51 PM
Originally posted by veedubdrew
Well, even though Xbench seems to disagree, my 800 MHz 17" iMac seems quite a bit snappier. Almost all of the OS X interface lag is gone on my machine. iMovie is smoother now (thank god) and the whole machine just runs quicker. Anyone else noticing this?

i popped iMovie up for a few seconds and fooled around. it WAS quite a bit faster--at least on the load time.

bousozoku
Feb 13, 2003, 10:02 PM
Originally posted by veedubdrew
Well, even though Xbench seems to disagree, my 800 MHz 17" iMac seems quite a bit snappier. Almost all of the OS X interface lag is gone on my machine. iMovie is smoother now (thank god) and the whole machine just runs quicker. Anyone else noticing this?

I think snappier is the right adjective. I've been looking for an improvement and it all seems to be in responsiveness.

For me, nothing seems to be broken so it's one more positive update.

straphound
Feb 13, 2003, 10:19 PM
THIS IS MY FIRST POST ON MY FIRST MAC!

Anywho, I just downloaded 10.2.4. It seems to boot a little faster. Window re-sizing is also much better. I have been having problems with finder hanging with airport and hopefully this will correct it. GREAT SITE!

DannyZR2
Feb 13, 2003, 10:26 PM
Between the update and me setting up a striped RAID, I'd say I noticed some welcomed speediness....


time to work on the uptime again.. (not work at all really :)

Centris 650
Feb 13, 2003, 10:27 PM
Originally posted by LimeiBook86
Hah, me and my iBook 466 SE don't see much of a difference...eh...:rolleyes:

Yeah, same here with my iBook 466 SE. Don't see much speed improvement. I even think it took longer to boot after restart.

Xerov
Feb 13, 2003, 10:27 PM
Originally posted by buffsldr



I think the build number varies according to what computer you have (eg ibook vs powermac). Can anyone confirm this?


Edit: The only sad part about this update is after 8 days of uptime I will have to reboot my iBook. Aren't macs great :)

You think that sucks!? I had to reboot my iBook after having it up for almost 60 days (58 to be exact) when The 10.2.3 update arived ;)

Oh, and As a side note I delayed installing it for about 3 days.

shadowfax
Feb 13, 2003, 10:48 PM
Originally posted by bousozoku

For me, nothing seems to be broken so it's one more positive update.

hehe, yeah. i look for performance increases, however slight. i don't care about most of the bug fixes--they usually don't help any problems i am specifically having. i just like having the latest and greatest :)

Hemingray
Feb 13, 2003, 10:50 PM
Hm, I just launched iTunes for the first time after updating and the first thing I noticed was it came up in one bounce! If I remember correctly, it used to take 3 or 4 bounces for me before the update. Nice!

shadowfax
Feb 13, 2003, 11:10 PM
Originally posted by Hemingray
Hm, I just launched iTunes for the first time after updating and the first thing I noticed was it came up in one bounce! If I remember correctly, it used to take 3 or 4 bounces for me before the update. Nice!

wow! not quite 1 over here, but about 2 (mine don't bounce, but the arrow pulsates). much better! and that's like my most used program.

springscansing
Feb 13, 2003, 11:51 PM
Originally posted by Hemingray
Hm, I just launched iTunes for the first time after updating and the first thing I noticed was it came up in one bounce! If I remember correctly, it used to take 3 or 4 bounces for me before the update. Nice!

You sure it was on the first launch? If it was... damn.. I'm getting three on a dual 867. Bof.

I do not wanna update. If it ain't broke, don't fix it and break more stuff.

Aw hell I wanna update. *tries to restrain self*

vniow
Feb 14, 2003, 12:12 AM
Two bounces for me, 300Mhz blueberry iBook with 320MB RAM.

davester
Feb 14, 2003, 12:21 AM
Does anyone know if the build of this release of OS 10.2.4 is newer than that of the MWSF hardware?

[edited due to beer intake]

Performfreak
Feb 14, 2003, 12:21 AM
I'm pretty sure this is new, now there are actual ATI 9000 drivers included... before it was just running the previous 8500 drivers for the 9000 card. I'll have to see if I notice any improvements in 3d performance...

strider42
Feb 14, 2003, 12:28 AM
Originally posted by Hemingray


Wow, not only that, this is apparently the 20th anniversary of the MacOS. :cool:

Maybe in terms of development, but in terms of release, the only GUI out on the market 20 years ago was LISA. Next year would the 20th anniversay of the release of the first macinotosh (which of course was the beginning of mac OS, LISA used a different operating system)

shadowfax
Feb 14, 2003, 12:33 AM
Originally posted by vniow
Two bounces for me, 300Mhz blueberry iBook with 320MB RAM.

sounds like springcansing's gonna whip out some proc envy :):eek: lol.

it's funny how the loads don't get THAT much better as the systems get faster. he could own your computer (and probably mine) on something like PS performance or iTunes visualization, but the playing field doesn't seem so varied on load times. that surprises me, as you probably have a 4200 rpm drive like me, and springcansing prolly has a 7200 on his PM.

shadowfax
Feb 14, 2003, 12:35 AM
Originally posted by Performfreak
I'm pretty sure this is new, now there are actual ATI 9000 drivers included... before it was just running the previous 8500 drivers for the 9000 card. I'll have to see if I notice any improvements in 3d performance...

my Radeon M9000 is still using 8500 drivers :(

Dave Marsh
Feb 14, 2003, 01:09 AM
Can anyone tell me if the Sherlock Weather Channel works for them? I normally use Watson and Meteo, but thought I'd test the Weather Channel in Sherlock just for fun to see how it compared. It says it's loading, but nothing ever displays.:(

JupiterZen
Feb 14, 2003, 01:09 AM
Originally posted by Choppaface
grrrr.. why does apple always turn on auto-updating after every update? It's my internet connection, not theirs >_<

looks like the bug in the photoshop file browser has been fixed though (it seems a bit faster too)

That has always been an issue with Apple updates. Pt was even worse in the past Even in the days of Mac OS 7.5 -> 7.5.3 all the way thru OS 8 and 9 and their updates. You had to go thru every setting you ever made in the OS because Apple set them back to default.

Very inconvenient.

MacBandit
Feb 14, 2003, 01:28 AM
Originally posted by Dave Marsh
Can anyone tell me if the Sherlock Weather Channel works for them? I normally use Watson and Meteo, but thought I'd test the Weather Channel in Sherlock just for fun to see how it compared. It says it's loading, but nothing ever displays.:(

Weather channel? Are you sure this isn't a third party add on to sherlock. Mine doesn't have it and never has.

I suspect you are using this (http://www.versiontracker.com/moreinfo.fcgi?id=17339&db=mac).

globalwidget
Feb 14, 2003, 01:45 AM
Yippee! iCal and Address book no longer quit when you close their windows. Correct me if I'm wrong, but before they used to quit when you closed their windows.

That drove me nuts. Absentmidedly closing instead of hiding either app would mean I'd have to restart them. Very annoying for what are probably my two most switched apps.

iPhoto and the Calculator still quit upon closing though... I can live with that.

FredAkbar
Feb 14, 2003, 01:48 AM
I installed the 10.2.4 update, and it seems to be going fine...just one odd thing I noticed, though. I have my desktop set to show info on the icons (my hard drives), so it shows the total space and remaining space of my two partitions. However, since I installed 10.2.4 earlier today, my OS X partition only shows the total size, and not the remaining space. My other partition still shows both pieces of info fine. I've relaunched the Finder, and have only restarted once (immediately after installation). Has anyone else had this problem? I turned "Show item info" off and then on again in the View Options for the Desktop, but still it doesn't show my OS X partition's remaining space. Hmm :confused: .

shadowfax
Feb 14, 2003, 01:54 AM
Originally posted by FredAkbar
I installed the 10.2.4 update, and it seems to be going fine...just one odd thing I noticed, though. I have my desktop set to show info on the icons (my hard drives), so it shows the total space and remaining space of my two partitions. However, since I installed 10.2.4 earlier today, my OS X partition only shows the total size, and not the remaining space. My other partition still shows both pieces of info fine. I've relaunched the Finder, and have only restarted once (immediately after installation). Has anyone else had this problem? I turned "Show item info" off and then on again in the View Options for the Desktop, but still it doesn't show my OS X partition's remaining space. Hmm :confused: .

for the sake of trying, you might open disk utility and repair permissions and see what happens. i just had some funky errors with my finder dock icon that "repair permissions" fixed... it's kind of the "restart" of the OS X world (for you PC users out there). if something totally inexplicable is occurring, and nothing logical works, always try repair permissions. heh. :)

Dave Marsh
Feb 14, 2003, 01:58 AM
Thanks, MacBandit... That's probably it. I just forgot I'd previously installed it. It's gone now.

Dave Marsh
Feb 14, 2003, 02:02 AM
It works fine on my iBook...shows total and free.

Brain
Feb 14, 2003, 02:09 AM
I installed 10.2.4 on my Ti Book this evening and have noticed an overall speed improvement, its worked out pretty well.

In particular, Civ III ran better than ever, the graphics card must be getting better support now. For quite some time now certain menus were very slow and unresponsive, but this has done the trick!

Thanks apple...and could they now just release the new ipods!!!!!!

FredAkbar
Feb 14, 2003, 02:16 AM
Thanks Shadowfax, I repaired permissions and now it's working fine--I didn't even have to restart. I'll restart when I go to bed anyway, though, since it seems to be going a bit slow after the permissions repair.

--Fred

shadowfax
Feb 14, 2003, 02:31 AM
Originally posted by FredAkbar
Thanks Shadowfax, I repaired permissions and now it's working fine--I didn't even have to restart. I'll restart when I go to bed anyway, though, since it seems to be going a bit slow after the permissions repair.

--Fred

That's awesome, though i wouldn't expect that it would slow you down after the repair. who knows, though? restarting never hurt anybody, unless you are going for record uptime;).

shadowfax
Feb 14, 2003, 02:34 AM
Originally posted by Brain
I installed 10.2.4 on my Ti Book this evening and have noticed an overall speed improvement, its worked out pretty well.

In particular, Civ III ran better than ever, the graphics card must be getting better support now. For quite some time now certain menus were very slow and unresponsive, but this has done the trick!

Thanks apple...and could they now just release the new ipods!!!!!!

seems like i read somee CivIII specific fixes on the list of things fixed....


from the apple 10.2.4 KB article:
# Improves compatibility with Firaxis Civilization III when the application's "Quartz text rendering" option is enabled.


good for you!

hibitdatman
Feb 14, 2003, 02:56 AM
So does this give new drivers for ATI9000 cards in the MDD power macs or not? How do I find out (dumb user alert!)...

Perhaps this will fix the lack of res/refresh rate options with 9000 cards using VGA CRT monitors. Here's hoping!

shadowfax
Feb 14, 2003, 03:08 AM
Originally posted by hibitdatman
So does this give new drivers for ATI9000 cards in the MDD power macs or not? How do I find out (dumb user alert!)...

Perhaps this will fix the lack of res/refresh rate options with 9000 cards using VGA CRT monitors. Here's hoping!



hey i just thought i'd post this for any UNIX junkies out here. i know i've always gotten a wierd satisfaction watching my linux boxes boot in a pure text fashion. now i have the same on my mac.

sudo nvram boot-args="-v"

that will do it for you and now your mac will boot with the cool quasiretrofuturistic textmode.

sudo nvram boot-args=""

turns it back off.


edesignuk posted this (he was quoting someone else here. (http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=18876))
If you set boot-args to "-v", you will get a verbose startup, which will tell you everything you ever wanted to know about what goes on in the startup.... from setting up your swap file to mounting the drive to your video card kernel extension... so set this up, reboot, and watch... if you see "Radeon 8500=using AGP" or something like that, you're out of luck :(. if you see something else, well, chances are...

there is an easier way to do this, but i don't know what it is. don't forget to set the boot-args back to "" unless you like the verbose start (i do ;)).

donco
Feb 14, 2003, 04:36 AM
I'm running a G3-333 upgraded to G4-500 (yup... bottom of the barrel) and I have to tell you (been this way since 10.2.2 or so) I am loving this(OSX). I think we are very close to the OS9 experience... the speed is almost there and the "no crashing" thing is VERY real.
cheers people... hope you love it like me.

pianojoe
Feb 14, 2003, 06:37 AM
Originally posted by JupiterZen


That has always been an issue with Apple updates. Pt was even worse in the past Even in the days of Mac OS 7.5 -> 7.5.3 all the way thru OS 8 and 9 and their updates. You had to go thru every setting you ever made in the OS because Apple set them back to default.

Very inconvenient.

Hm, that wasn't true for me. I never lost my preferences, all the way from 7.5.0 to 9.2.2.

yzedf
Feb 14, 2003, 07:27 AM
Originally posted by JupiterZen


That has always been an issue with Apple updates. Pt was even worse in the past Even in the days of Mac OS 7.5 -> 7.5.3 all the way thru OS 8 and 9 and their updates. You had to go thru every setting you ever made in the OS because Apple set them back to default.

Very inconvenient.

They still do.

iBook 800 640MB RAM:

I had to reset mouse/monitor config, as well as re-arrange icons on the dock. I don't use iChat, so why was the icon put back on the dock?

Minor annoyances, took 2 min to fix.

XBench says not any faster. I tend to agree.

DakotaGuy
Feb 14, 2003, 07:29 AM
I will have to give Apple credit for doing a lot of improvement in the speed of OSX over the past couple of years. I remember when my iMac DV struggled with it and now it runs pretty darn good and pretty snappy. I think a lot of people give Apple a hard time for forgetting people who are running their older hardware, but I have to admit in the case of OSX this has not happened. Sure when I see a little improvement someone with a Dual G4 sees a lot more, but I am very happy with the way 10.2.4 runs on my iMac and iBook.

Now the question is, for us people that run older G3 Macs, when is a good time to stop updating? I know at some point all the gains we made will be lost when the OS becomes more complicated for the processor to run. I am not saying that the new machines made when the OS comes out will be slow, but there will be a point when it is no longer optimized for older Macs. Anybody want to care to guess? I am guessing the last update that will benefit older G3's is the 10.3 and 10.3.x. I think once we move beyond that, it will become more complicated and just like in the days of the classic OS we will be stuck at that point. Not all bad since we will still have a good version of OSX that will last as long as the computer is functional.

davy the bunny
Feb 14, 2003, 07:36 AM
Originally posted by Shadowfax





edesignuk posted this (he was quoting someone else here. (http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=18876))
If you set boot-args to "-v", you will get a verbose startup, which will tell you everything you ever wanted to know about what goes on in the startup.... from setting up your swap file to mounting the drive to your video card kernel extension... so set this up, reboot, and watch... if you see "Radeon 8500=using AGP" or something like that, you're out of luck :(. if you see something else, well, chances are...

there is an easier way to do this, but i don't know what it is. don't forget to set the boot-args back to "" unless you like the verbose start (i do ;)).

That's a bad place to play. . . you could just hold down I think either just the "V" key on start-up. . . or maybe it's command and V. I'm not sure but that'll do the job.

Dont Hurt Me
Feb 14, 2003, 07:50 AM
I could be wrong but i think this is it for jag, Puma is on the horizon and so is the 970. I think os9 will be history in puma and you will see osx sparkle on the 970. I expect all this this summer or just before christmas at the latest along with a new powermac design. I am expecting something big from apple this year in the powermac. If its just more of the g4 bumps then ill just keep waiting before i get my next machine. ( after some primal screaming of course! )

paulc
Feb 14, 2003, 07:55 AM
Hold cmd-v at startup to stgart in verbose mode.

And everytone, be very, very careful when you see people posting terminal commands starting with "sudo." Type one key wrong and you could wipe your drive, corrupt the kernel and/or do major damage.

pimentoLoaf
Feb 14, 2003, 08:07 AM
Downloaded it overnight and now my 640mb iBook 500 seems to be a tad snappier overall -- though I haven't tried any apps yet to see if they crash.

---

I won't upgrade this machine with Puma. Still need os9 for a few things, particularly the SmartDisk 2700 slide scanner which operates from a Photoshop 7 plug-in. (And no, I don't usually use PS7 under os9, but I discovered that after PS installed, the os9 version was also on the machine.)

And a few games, like the Marathon series.... speaking of which (click here) (http://source.bungie.org/).

groov'
Feb 14, 2003, 08:15 AM
hi,

since i updated to 10.2.4, I cannot connect anymore via samba to my windows machines.

That's to say: connect to server gives me smb://x.x.x.x and I can mount any of them on the desk once, but as soon as I click it to open, the icon disappears and it doesn't show anything of the directories I shared on the windozes.

Trying to connect to the PCs again gives me a
"error -5000". Retrying a copuple of times gives me a black screen with the announcement in 4 languages (included japanese or chinese) that I have to restart my computer by holding down power for several seconds.

I still can connect to windows via ftp and I can see al the files if I want. I also can see in the browser all my websites on the apacheserver on windows.

Never had any problems with samba in older builds.

No problems with connecting from windows to the mac via 'networklocations', the browser or ftp. It even works faster than before.


Anybody with these troubles out there?

grouse
Feb 14, 2003, 08:37 AM
I feel a bit pathetic to bother your folk with this and this may not be the right thread upon which to do this.... But I am SO frustrated with reading all about the continuing enhancements with 10.2 (.x) (I leave out the points when saying it by the way "tentwofour" for example ) as I am still unable to install it from the disc I bought ages ago.

everytime I try I get the multi-lingual screen of death, grey and indicating a kernal panic.

And yes, I 've removed all external devices, and yes, I'm removed any extra ram and yes, I've done everything suggested, but still no joy.

The final suggestion was to wipe my 4 partitions, reformat the lot and start from scratch.

I am resolved to give this a go, but first a. has anyone tried this and will it work?
and b. having archived most things I can on to CD, I am down to system 9, my applications and system tenonefive. What is the best way to archive what's left (I don't had a DVD drive, and I don't have an extra Hard Drive) but I am networked (to non-OS X machines). I want to try and do it without causing huge headaches when I put everything back.

So do we think this palaver will fix it? Can it done relatively painlessly? And if, no, to the first question what else can I try?

I'm running a pre-quicksilver G4 500Mhz, 10GB tower, which runs OS X fine, more or less. I used to get kernal panics quite a lot, not so much now.

Help, pretty please.

thanks

pbrennen
Feb 14, 2003, 08:42 AM
from slashdot:

Re:Much faster -- Mails not the only thing... (Score:5, Interesting)
by Rouxfus (567556) on Friday February 14, @12:02AM (#5299816)
I think the post-update speed bump most people percieve is due to re-starting and getting rid of their swap files. Whenever a unix system starts swapping memory out to disk it's gonna slow down. I keep an eye on the number of swap files - when it goes from one to two, I re-start machine, uptime be damned - once there's more than one swap file the system gets -s l o w- in my experience.
The easiest way to track the number of swap files is to use the "Go To Folder" command in the Finder's Go menu, and type "/var". Drag the "vm" folder to the right side of the dock (bottom if the dock is oriented vertically). Now you can click and hold on that folder in the dock and the pop up dock menu will show you the swap files. Another way is to run Memory Stick.

Fruzz
Feb 14, 2003, 08:59 AM
I Installed 10.2.4 through Software Update - Probably the best way to get any Apple upgrade sonce FTP always gets overloaded.
So far so good, I have noticed certain slight improvements in response mainly in the finder but also in a few Apple iapps etc...

:confused: Any Audio users notice improvements in Cubase SX using Core Audio? There were quite a few bugs here and there - I am still awaiting my Cubase SX dongle that I have leant to a friend.

I have not really noticed any significant improvments in games : MOH, Jedi Knight 2...

Tibook 1ghz
512 ram, Radeon 9000

QuiteSure
Feb 14, 2003, 09:19 AM
Originally posted by Shadowfax
restarting never hurt anybody

When in doobt, reboot

groovebuster
Feb 14, 2003, 09:23 AM
@Fruzz:

That Cubase SX issue really sucks. Cubase was the only reason for me to keep a full installtion of OS 9 on my harddrive. I purchased Cubase SX right after it was available just to find out that it is unusable with my configuration (M-Audio-Hardware and Cubase SX don't get along, causing CPU usage spikes that freeze the system for a fraction of a second once in a while). Steinberg still didn't fix that porblem. With all other programs my M-Audio stuff just works fine under Mac OS X! :mad:

M-Audio says it is a Cubase problem and doesn't offer a new driver. In their opinion the drivers are "perfect" and meet the CoreAudio specifications. And Steinberg still didn't provide an update that solves the known issues so far. So I'm still stuck with Cubase VST 5.1... and shelled out the money for the update for nothing months ago...

I couldn't install 10.2.4 so far, because I am not in my Home-Office the whole day, but I am pretty sure that the update doesn't change anything considering my problems with Cubase SX.

groovebuster

sedarby
Feb 14, 2003, 09:35 AM
Okay, the update seems to be solid but I did run into an interesting issue when it installed. I had 300+ megabytes free on my OS/X partition and when I tried to install the update it said it needed 327 megabytes for the selected installs!!! A 40 MB install needs 327 megabytes? I removed the development stuff and the install then went fine since I now had ~800 MB free. For the particulars I am running a Rev A iMac, yes that's right, OS/X on a 233 mhz G3 but it does work okay. So, if you think your G3 500 is an issue try it on a Rev A and yes I am upgrading very soon.

Anyone else see this?

yzedf
Feb 14, 2003, 10:13 AM
Originally posted by paulc
Hold cmd-v at startup to stgart in verbose mode.

And everytone, be very, very careful when you see people posting terminal commands starting with "sudo." Type one key wrong and you could wipe your drive, corrupt the kernel and/or do major damage.

you mean from the root directory I am not supposed to:

# sudo rm -fr *

:rolleyes:

a_kim
Feb 14, 2003, 10:26 AM
My coworker had similar problems with her G4 500 Tower. Reinstalled Jaguar about five times... changed out the RAM, removed devices, etc. to no avail. Even brought it to the Apple Store, and they did nothing (except spill Sprite on her tower casing!).

Then I stumbled upon an Apple Knowledge Base article about updating the firmware for her machine. Once she did that, the machine ran Jaguar perfectly. She hasn't had any problems since.

If you haven't updated the firmware for your machine, I'd say with certainty that that is the problem. If you have already updated it, sorry for wasting your time.

-Alex

Originally posted by grouse
I feel a bit pathetic to bother your folk with this and this may not be the right thread upon which to do this.... But I am SO frustrated with reading all about the continuing enhancements with 10.2 (.x) (I leave out the points when saying it by the way "tentwofour" for example ) as I am still unable to install it from the disc I bought ages ago.

everytime I try I get the multi-lingual screen of death, grey and indicating a kernal panic.

And yes, I 've removed all external devices, and yes, I'm removed any extra ram and yes, I've done everything suggested, but still no joy.

The final suggestion was to wipe my 4 partitions, reformat the lot and start from scratch.

I am resolved to give this a go, but first a. has anyone tried this and will it work?
and b. having archived most things I can on to CD, I am down to system 9, my applications and system tenonefive. What is the best way to archive what's left (I don't had a DVD drive, and I don't have an extra Hard Drive) but I am networked (to non-OS X machines). I want to try and do it without causing huge headaches when I put everything back.

So do we think this palaver will fix it? Can it done relatively painlessly? And if, no, to the first question what else can I try?

I'm running a pre-quicksilver G4 500Mhz, 10GB tower, which runs OS X fine, more or less. I used to get kernal panics quite a lot, not so much now.

Help, pretty please.

thanks

yzedf
Feb 14, 2003, 10:31 AM
you could buy a 2nd hard drive. use that as a seperate Jaguar partition, as well as another general data partition to keep your other stuff uncluttered.

40GB drives are cheap, as well as being faster than your 10GB, most likely.

or

you can zip the data that you don't have on CD and transfer to another machine on the network. if you have a linux machine... you can scp it over no problem.

grouse
Feb 14, 2003, 10:57 AM
Thanks both of you.

Do you know if 7up works instead of sprite?

But seriously folks, I'll try the firmware thing, but do you know which version, when I looked up 4.4.8 on apple's site, it said it was for "mirror drived Power Macs only" whatever they are?!

I think I currently have 4.28F1, if that's the right thing.

And thanks for the second drive idea, someone else mentioned that, I'll just bite the bullet and do that, especially if it's faster.

thanks again... I'll let you know if it works, to help others in a similar pickle.

encro
Feb 14, 2003, 10:57 AM
Originally posted by Centris 650


Yeah, same here with my iBook 466 SE. Don't see much speed improvement. I even think it took longer to boot after restart.

Agreed. No speed improvement. Slower Boot Time and Login.

Darwin is now up to 6.4

MacBandit
Feb 14, 2003, 10:59 AM
Originally posted by encro


Agreed. No speed improvement. Slower Boot Time and Login.

Darwin is now up to 6.4

The slow boot should only be the initial restart after install. All normal restarts and cold starts should be much quicker then that initial reboot. If not it's time to do a fresh install of the system requiring a reformat of the drive.

Performfreak
Feb 14, 2003, 11:16 AM
on second glance I now realize I'm still runnin the 8500 drivers. The reason I thought otherwise was because when I checked "driver info" in a couple of games it said ATI 9000. But I did realize that ATI now has the 9000 drivers for mac up on their site, have been there since the middle of january, being downloaded right now. just go to ATI (http://www.ati.com) and click on find a driver, you'll find it.

blogo
Feb 14, 2003, 11:17 AM
when i press 'command + shift + q' to log out it says that it will auto-log out in 2 min. if you dont do anything.

Has it always been like that?

Performfreak
Feb 14, 2003, 11:31 AM
well, after the install, I'm still just runnin the 8500 drivers again apparently, oh well

nickgold
Feb 14, 2003, 11:40 AM
Faster speed probably = "optimization" that is done after an install. Prebinding or some technical gobbledegook.

bbowdon
Feb 14, 2003, 12:22 PM
Dumb question:
What's the difference between downloading:

10.2.4

and

10.2.4 "Combo"?

Thanks!

aaron128
Feb 14, 2003, 01:13 PM
Originally posted by Shadowfax


seems like i read somee CivIII specific fixes on the list of things fixed....



good for you! [/B]

You don't even know! I can finally play CivIII in OS X! It crawled in X and flew in 9 ... it was so slow I began to lose faith in the speed of X, but after X.2.4, now it's just as speedy in X....the difference is incredible. I'm so glad I don't have to boot into 9 anymore. This was the last thing I expected to be fixed by a system update, but it's much appreciated. Not much of a gamer, but CivIII is the best.

(In case you curious, the response time to adjust a slider was about 5-10 seconds...PAINFUL!)

dermeister
Feb 14, 2003, 01:54 PM
I just went psycho for half an hour... The 10.2.4 update had defaulted my apache config, and my whole webserver has hosed. After a bit of desperate searching, turns out the installer renamed my config to httpd.conf.applesaved, and made a default httpd.conf... After swapping e'm back and restarting apache, I fixed it...

Point is, apple REALLY can't be doing crap like this to people, I was going insane. Very irresponsible...

- Der Meister

Apple][Forever
Feb 14, 2003, 02:32 PM
Originally posted by bbowdon
Dumb question:
What's the difference between downloading:

10.2.4

and

10.2.4 "Combo"?

Thanks!

The Combo update is for those who didn't upgrade from 10.2 to 10.2.1, .2, .3, etc. It's all the 10.2.x releases in one.

shadowfax
Feb 14, 2003, 04:34 PM
Originally posted by davy the bunny


That's a bad place to play. . . you could just hold down I think either just the "V" key on start-up. . . or maybe it's command and V. I'm not sure but that'll do the job.

what? is that a wart on her nose? she must be a witch! seriously, stop being so stinking superstitious. it's the terminal, not an electromagnet. it's not going to blow your computer up if you open it. of course you don't fool around, but i never told anyone to do that!

reflex
Feb 14, 2003, 04:35 PM
Originally posted by Eple
when i press 'command + shift + q' to log out it says that it will auto-log out in 2 min. if you dont do anything.

Has it always been like that?

I don't know about always, but it was definitely like that in 10.2.3.

shadowfax
Feb 14, 2003, 04:39 PM
Originally posted by dermeister
I just went psycho for half an hour... The 10.2.4 update had defaulted my apache config, and my whole webserver has hosed. After a bit of desperate searching, turns out the installer renamed my config to httpd.conf.applesaved, and made a default httpd.conf... After swapping e'm back and restarting apache, I fixed it...

Point is, apple REALLY can't be doing crap like this to people, I was going insane. Very irresponsible...

- Der Meister

yeah, i really don't like how they change random settings. some things they might change and you'd never know! like automatic updating--i hate having that on, it's a waste of time, as i check for updates myself. that apache thing is a real shame; it's too bad you had to go through that. they should at least make some documentation on that.

shadowfax
Feb 14, 2003, 05:14 PM
Originally posted by groov'
hi,

since i updated to 10.2.4, I cannot connect anymore via samba to my windows machines.

That's to say: connect to server gives me smb://x.x.x.x and I can mount any of them on the desk once, but as soon as I click it to open, the icon disappears and it doesn't show anything of the directories I shared on the windozes.

Trying to connect to the PCs again gives me a
"error -5000". Retrying a copuple of times gives me a black screen with the announcement in 4 languages (included japanese or chinese) that I have to restart my computer by holding down power for several seconds.

I still can connect to windows via ftp and I can see al the files if I want. I also can see in the browser all my websites on the apacheserver on windows.

Never had any problems with samba in older builds.

No problems with connecting from windows to the mac via 'networklocations', the browser or ftp. It even works faster than before.


Anybody with these troubles out there?
I haven't worked with it much, but my samba won't connect me to my win98 box; it used to connect fine. this is ironic, as apple advertises some "enhancements" to wondows-PC connections in 10.2.4.

finleymac
Feb 14, 2003, 05:43 PM
After using 10.2.4 for a couple of hours most Cocoa Apps are much faster. iMovie has had a 50 speed boost on me Dual 867, and Safari runs much better as well. Overall this was a great patch from Apple, well worht the 4 hours spent on my dial-up connection downloading it.

Choppaface
Feb 14, 2003, 06:03 PM
kewl AFP now works when I turn on sharing on my G4 and I connect to it using my powerbook through airport HW BS-> router -> G4. for some reason that didn't work in 10.2.3.... had to do it the other way around...

bryanc
Feb 14, 2003, 06:19 PM
I've noticed a couple of minor glitches that've been fixed...cutting and pasting icons now works better (I found that it used to work, but you had to restart finder to get it to update...now it updates automagically). And iTunes and iMove both start *much* faster.

Overall my 667 TiBook seems more responsive and nothing seems broken.

I have a few questions though. Firstly, I thought I had uninstalled Norton system utilities but after rebooting after updating, a window popped up saying 'Norton has detected a system update' or something like that. How do I get rid of Norton...I think it's slowing my system down and I don't use it.

Something I haven't checked yet (will do when I go home tonight) is wether my difficulties with seeing a Windows share have been fixed. But I wonder if anyone else has encountered this problem and may know how to fix it: When I go to a shared folder on a windows machine, I can see the machine and open the folder, but I can only see a few of the files in it...from my PC I can see that there are dozens of files there, and I haven't done anything (intentionally) to distinguish the files.

Cheers

MacBandit
Feb 14, 2003, 06:27 PM
Originally posted by bryanc
I've noticed a couple of minor glitches that've been fixed...cutting and pasting icons now works better (I found that it used to work, but you had to restart finder to get it to update...now it updates automagically). And iTunes and iMove both start *much* faster.

Overall my 667 TiBook seems more responsive and nothing seems broken.

I have a few questions though. Firstly, I thought I had uninstalled Norton system utilities but after rebooting after updating, a window popped up saying 'Norton has detected a system update' or something like that. How do I get rid of Norton...I think it's slowing my system down and I don't use it.

Something I haven't checked yet (will do when I go home tonight) is wether my difficulties with seeing a Windows share have been fixed. But I wonder if anyone else has encountered this problem and may know how to fix it: When I go to a shared folder on a windows machine, I can see the machine and open the folder, but I can only see a few of the files in it...from my PC I can see that there are dozens of files there, and I haven't done anything (intentionally) to distinguish the files.

Cheers

Well you can do a search for all Norton and Symantec items and delete them. This won't cure your system slowdown though. I had the same thing happen to me. Norton modifies the System Kernel when installed and from my experience this is not a good thing. To truly rid yourself of the virus they sell as Norton Utilities back up your data, reformat and do a fresh install. For me this increased my system speed by about 10-20% on a dual/GHz /DDR PowerMac. That's a huge increase.

One note I had a hard time backing up seems that somehow Norton screwed up how the system finalized CDs and DVDs when burning. I ended up with about 6 DVDs and 5 CDs that are coasters (about 50% of the time the burn would fail).

shadowfax
Feb 14, 2003, 06:44 PM
Originally posted by bryanc
I've noticed a couple of minor glitches that've been fixed...cutting and pasting icons now works better (I found that it used to work, but you had to restart finder to get it to update...now it updates automagically). And iTunes and iMove both start *much* faster.

Overall my 667 TiBook seems more responsive and nothing seems broken.

I have a few questions though. Firstly, I thought I had uninstalled Norton system utilities but after rebooting after updating, a window popped up saying 'Norton has detected a system update' or something like that. How do I get rid of Norton...I think it's slowing my system down and I don't use it.

Something I haven't checked yet (will do when I go home tonight) is wether my difficulties with seeing a Windows share have been fixed. But I wonder if anyone else has encountered this problem and may know how to fix it: When I go to a shared folder on a windows machine, I can see the machine and open the folder, but I can only see a few of the files in it...from my PC I can see that there are dozens of files there, and I haven't done anything (intentionally) to distinguish the files.

Cheers

first of all, i know nothing about norton antivirus from fisrthand. this is just a guess. usually, applications with such extensive reaches into the heart of OS X have package installs; if you want to remove norton antivirus, chances are you can't just delete the .app file and the plist/preference pane. you may need to run the installer again and select "uninstall" instead of "easy install" under the customization pane before the installation starts. I can't say that this is definitely the case with norton, but it's worth a try. a clean reinstall is your best bet, ultimately, if you have time/means to backup. good luck!

RndmAxess
Feb 14, 2003, 07:24 PM
Deleted

shadowfax
Feb 14, 2003, 08:22 PM
Originally posted by RndmAxess


I just updated and after working for awhile realized my clock was incorrect. I opened "Date and Time" to reset it and found the date was changed to December 31, 1969!!

I better starting checking everything!

LOL i have had that happen before, i don't recall in what context though. i don't think 10.2.4 did it though. it's so weird how such different things happen to different people. i guess it could be explained by the changes your OS undergoes as you install different software and because of the different hardware drivers different people are running. disappointing that apple can't provide a more common user experience in spite of that, but understandable, eh?

jelloshotsrule
Feb 15, 2003, 12:29 AM
Originally posted by aaron128


You don't even know! I can finally play CivIII in OS X! It crawled in X and flew in 9 ... it was so slow I began to lose faith in the speed of X, but after X.2.4, now it's just as speedy in X....the difference is incredible. I'm so glad I don't have to boot into 9 anymore. This was the last thing I expected to be fixed by a system update, but it's much appreciated. Not much of a gamer, but CivIII is the best.

(In case you curious, the response time to adjust a slider was about 5-10 seconds...PAINFUL!)

yes! i just found this out tonight too... it rules now! gives the game whole new life

has anyone noticed similar improvements in any other games since the update?

CybrCyfr
Feb 15, 2003, 12:40 AM
Anyone else noticed system hangs on 10.2.4? It happened earlier on my iBook (fresh install, I bought it 2 days ago) and again tonight on my iMac flat panel.

I get a systemwide beechball, and no response from anything in the dock (although the dock itself does let me access it's context menu.... but not for long).

Seems when the computer wakes from sleep it has some it doesn't like to respond. Both times I ended up just powering down the computer via the power button.

All of this was after I used Disk Util to verify and repair perrmissions...

Thinking about downgrading back to 10.2.3. And yes, it does boot slower on both of my machines, noticeably on my new iBook.

shadowfax
Feb 15, 2003, 12:45 AM
Originally posted by jelloshotsrule


yes! i just found this out tonight too... it rules now! gives the game whole new life

has anyone noticed similar improvements in any other games since the update?

nothing new on my BG2 (the only really good game i play). i am waiting for the expansion pack, when they should get this game screaming on OS X. it's really poorly done on OS X right now :(.

MacBandit
Feb 15, 2003, 12:57 AM
Originally posted by CybrCyfr
Anyone else noticed system hangs on 10.2.4? It happened earlier on my iBook (fresh install, I bought it 2 days ago) and again tonight on my iMac flat panel.

I get a systemwide beechball, and no response from anything in the dock (although the dock itself does let me access it's context menu.... but not for long).

Seems when the computer wakes from sleep it has some it doesn't like to respond. Both times I ended up just powering down the computer via the power button.

All of this was after I used Disk Util to verify and repair perrmissions...

Thinking about downgrading back to 10.2.3. And yes, it does boot slower on both of my machines, noticeably on my new iBook.

I have to suspect that you are using a menu extra or a system modifier of some sort. Maybe something to change the appearance of the system? Also disable any program you have that auto starts at login in. You aren't using Norton Utilities are you?

.a
Feb 15, 2003, 08:11 AM
i just installed 10.2.4 last night and worked today for the first time with it - everything seems a little bit faster an my g4 dual 450 - wondering how fast a dual 1.42 would be :)

but startup times are much longer and when i turned the machine on it hang first by the spinning wheel. after using the reset button it was okay...

.a

RndmAxess
Feb 15, 2003, 08:27 AM
Deleted

MacBandit
Feb 15, 2003, 10:23 AM
Originally posted by RndmAxess
This is too weird! Whenever I power down in 10.2.4 my clock will reset to 7:00PM December 31, 1969.

I thought at first that my battery died. Could this update have killed my battery? Maybe messed up prefs for Date and Time? I repaired permissions. No problem there, no help either.

This happened after I immediately after I installed 10.2.4 and did the required restart. Then I realized that I didn't power down, I restarted! But now after a power down the clock resets to 12/31/69 @ 7PM! Every time after a power down the clock goes to this apparent default.

Even more weird is I booted into OS9.2.2, zapped PRAM, rebuilt desktop, lit some incense and chanted while I turned counter clockwise three times and then once clockwise to please the clock god. It worked! Power cycles in OS9 retain the clock settings! Four power cycles in OS9 and it still works.

So I changed startup disk back to OS10.2.4, power down, wait a minute, reboot. The clock is fine on first power cycle from OS9 to OSX. It's only when power cycling in OSX that this problem happens and CLOCK is back to Jimi Hendrix, Janis Joplin years.

Some might say to just leave it on all the time, but I have a Korg Oasys card that won't let my Mac go into sleep mode. Plus I prefer to shut things down for the night when not in use anyway.

I could use some help on this one! Anyone?

P.S. Apple kbase reports this exact problem with OS10.1 and OS10.1.2. Updating to OS10.1.3 fixes it.
Hold on, let me check something... yup... OS10.2.4.

Last edited by RndmAxess on 12-31-1969 at 19:04 PM

After reading through many many thread in the Apple Kbase my suggestion is to shutdown your computer and remove the clock battery for at least 10 minutes. Reinstall the battery and start up. You will then have to correct the date and time but hopefully next time it will stay correct after a shutdown.

This should reset your PMU. You could also push the little button next to the battery. It is the PMU reset but from what I have read there are better results from removing the battery.

CybrCyfr
Feb 15, 2003, 11:13 AM
Originally posted by MacBandit


I have to suspect that you are using a menu extra or a system modifier of some sort. Maybe something to change the appearance of the system? Also disable any program you have that auto starts at login in. You aren't using Norton Utilities are you?

No menu extras loaded. Brand new iBook. Got it Tuesday. I did a fresh install (who needs OS 9), and then updated via Software update.

I do have Norton Utilities installed as well as Norton Antivirus. Is that a bad thing? I just hae Utiilities installed for the live update feature that works with Antivirus. I never even use the bloody thing.

I assume by your post you know of specific issues with OSX and Norton?

Should I trash that syuff and use the .Mac supplied antivirus?

RndmAxess
Feb 15, 2003, 12:12 PM
Deleted

jayscheuerle
Feb 15, 2003, 12:19 PM
I downloaded the installer package on the broadband at work, applied it to my machine there and brought it home, hoping to avoid updating/downloading on a 56k dial-up.

No such luck, it wouldn't install on this machine as the package had no record of being downloaded. I even tried partially downloading the package and then trying to insall again, but no luck... several hours later, I'm updated.

What kind of bumblefug made that installer decision? None of the others have worked that way. Or is there some "user error" here? ;)

teetoo
Feb 15, 2003, 12:28 PM
I've installed 10.2.4 on both G4 Cube & Superdrive TiBook and now neither can use their DSL connection anymore - I've had to downgrade the cube back to 10.2.3 to get back online via DSL.

When in 10.2.4 the WebShuttle DSL modem could get a line sync but not a server connection - any suggestions on a fix for this or do I wait for 10.2.5?

RndmAxess
Feb 15, 2003, 01:50 PM
Deleted

AhmedFaisal
Feb 15, 2003, 04:30 PM
Man this sucks, installed 10.2.4 just now and despite the fact of it being snappier it now ate my entire clipboard and drag & drop, meaning I can no longer drag & drop files into applications such as toast & others. Photoshop reports a clipboard error after starting and also classic can not interact with the OSX clipboard. I repaired permissions, restarted, installed combo 10.2.4, repaired permissions again, restarted again. No avail. Anyone know a way of fixing this?
Cheers,

Ahmed:confused:

RndmAxess
Feb 15, 2003, 04:49 PM
Deleted

shadowfax
Feb 15, 2003, 04:55 PM
Originally posted by RndmAxess
WOW! :mad: :mad: :mad:

I was reading on the apple knowledge base discussion boards about 10.2.4 causing some serious problems on a lot of machines. If you are having an issue with 10.2.4 I highly recommend reading this stuff.

My clock issue is only one of the things that was broken with an update to 10.2.4.

so curious. but once again, 10.2.4 doesn't innately break your clock. it didn't break mine. it's too bad they didn't do sufficient testing on it though. my gosh, they've been working on it for nearly 3 months now.

RndmAxess
Feb 15, 2003, 05:07 PM
Deleted

teetoo
Feb 15, 2003, 05:20 PM
Originally posted by RndmAxess


How did you downgrade?

I just tried to downgrade to 10.2.3 via MacOSXUpdate10.2.3.dmg and wasn't able to. Do I have to reinstall OS10.2 and update to 10.2.3 from there?



yep... Reinstalled the 10.2.1 keeping old Users/Network settings and then upgraded to 10.2.3 and things are sweet once again on the cube. Still got 10.2.4 on the Tibook, I'm gonna keep it on and find a way to get DSL up and running.

Next time I'm gonna hold off an the update for a couple of days and wait for feedback... I've learnt my lesson.

woodsey
Feb 15, 2003, 07:23 PM
Just got back from a holliday...

I was about to download 10.2.4 as soon as i heard it was released, untill i read all the negative feedback!

Is there likely to be a small upgrade which fixes these problems any time soon? such as 10.2.4b or 10.2.4.1, and if not should I upgrade to 10.2.4 or keep 10.2.3?

any help would be greatly appreciated!

zach
Feb 15, 2003, 07:54 PM
hmm... strange, os 10.2.4 hasnt done anything bad for me, and ive had it since 15 minutes after it came out http://forums.macrumors.com/images/smilies/biggrin.gif

RndmAxess
Feb 15, 2003, 07:58 PM
Deleted

beatle888
Feb 15, 2003, 10:05 PM
Originally posted by CybrCyfr


No menu extras loaded. Brand new iBook. Got it Tuesday. I did a fresh install (who needs OS 9), and then updated via Software update.

I do have Norton Utilities installed as well as Norton Antivirus. Is that a bad thing? I just hae Utiilities installed for the live update feature that works with Antivirus. I never even use the bloody thing.

I assume by your post you know of specific issues with OSX and Norton?

Should I trash that syuff and use the .Mac supplied antivirus?


i almost sold my powerbook thinking it was a
dog...too slow....until i did a reformat reinstall.

for some reason norton slows down the system.
i cant believe they havent publicly apoligized to
the mac community. those guys dug their own
grave...sorta sad...i used them all the time in
os9. maybe they will fix things and apologies.

Phazer80s
Feb 16, 2003, 09:03 AM
Another little performance boost-- it's all good!

I played around with 10.2.4 last night and noticed that scrolling speed and some window resizing has improved. Resizing in TextEdit was definitely [dare I say it] 'silkier' (more evidence that the word might apply to all OS X window performance on my 733 someday-- we can wish :) )

Scrolling is zippier in IE, as if Apple popped in some line of code like, "if user activates IE, allocate 100% of available resources to scrolling" It's also faster in Safari, as though there's some sort of scrolling acceleration going on, like with a Windows cursor. This could just be a v.0.6 release thing-- dunno.

I don't like Microsoft's implementation of cursor accelleration in Windows, but I really welcome the scrolling acceleration in OS X. Then again, maybe there's no real "acceleration" in OS X, it might just be quicker.

Either way, the speed is a welcome relief. The less a user has to slow down their thought flow to wait for OS X to catch up, the better. Don't quit now, Apple-- enhancements like these encourage people to not switch away. I might have to tweak my sig soon. ;) 10.3

zach
Feb 16, 2003, 09:09 AM
Yeah, the scrolling does certianly seem to accelerate. But, i had noticed that in os 10.2.3........

CybrCyfr
Feb 16, 2003, 01:37 PM
Originally posted by RndmAxess


It may not break everyones clock but it sure broke mine and more than a few others along with numerous other issues. Interesting to read the variety of problems that are being reported.

Obviously machines will be, to some degree, configured differently but there does appear to be some common problems.

What is the sxact URL for those boards? I can' find them....

RndmAxess
Feb 16, 2003, 02:03 PM
Deleted

cleo
Feb 16, 2003, 02:42 PM
Originally posted by globalwidget
Yippee! iCal and Address book no longer quit when you close their windows.

Woo-hooooooooo! This was my biggest complaint EVER. Happy, happy Cleo!

Brain
Feb 17, 2003, 04:05 AM
Originally posted by aaron128
You don't even know! I can finally play CivIII in OS X! It crawled in X and flew in 9 ... it was so slow I began to lose faith in the speed of X, but after X.2.4, now it's just as speedy in X....the difference is incredible. I'm so glad I don't have to boot into 9 anymore. This was the last thing I expected to be fixed by a system update, but it's much appreciated. Not much of a gamer, but CivIII is the best.

(In case you curious, the response time to adjust a slider was about 5-10 seconds...PAINFUL!)


sir, I feel your pain...and I am now much more adept at changing my science rate, thanks to 10.2.4! Civ III is truely a great thing.

funny thing, I had my mom and sister upgrade on their 12" ibook & 12'Pwbk respectively, and then for some odd reason my mom's airport ceased to function.

after numerous long distance calls (I'm on the west coast, they are on the east) and system reinstalls, alas, my dad finally figures out the problem....

he had to reset his linksys wireless access point!

Doh!

b.

DannyZR2
Feb 17, 2003, 04:55 AM
you'll see

MacBandit
Feb 17, 2003, 06:44 PM
Originally posted by CybrCyfr
No menu extras loaded. Brand new iBook. Got it Tuesday. I did a fresh install (who needs OS 9), and then updated via Software update.

I do have Norton Utilities installed as well as Norton Antivirus. Is that a bad thing? I just hae Utiilities installed for the live update feature that works with Antivirus. I never even use the bloody thing.

I assume by your post you know of specific issues with OSX and Norton?

Should I trash that syuff and use the .Mac supplied antivirus?

Sorry for the long delay between posts. I often go offline durring the weekends as I am out and about either camping or exploring away from all technology.

Yes, I have had many many serious problems with Norton Utilities/System Works with OSX. There current versions have not be created from the ground up to work with OSX but have been simply patched to get it by. Also so that Norton can work with OSX it has to modify the System Kernel. This is where I suspect the serious problems come from.

On my machine I started noticing that it was losing system prefs and permissions consistently. At first it was having failures a couple times a week. When I finally gave up and backed up (nearly unsuccesfully) and reinstalled I was having problems multiple times a day. There was also an extreme system slow down. I nearly wan't able to backup do to the fact that OSX was not able to finish a burn anymore from any program (a system level error). You can not simply uninstall or delete Norton it modifies the system kernel necessitating a complete reinstall.

I do not know for sure that this will fix your problem but to me it is highly suspect. In any case to avoid future problems I seriously recommend formatting and starting from scratch. Use Norton for a coaster or for target practice. What ever you do don't put it in your computer even to repair from the disk.


I personally have had absolutely no problem with 10.2.4 and highly recommend it as a bug fix. To anyone pointing at posts and knoweldge boards to problems as reasons for not upgrading remember for every post of someone having problems there are thousands of people with no problems and therefore have no reason to post.

MacBandit
Feb 17, 2003, 06:48 PM
Originally posted by teetoo
I've installed 10.2.4 on both G4 Cube & Superdrive TiBook and now neither can use their DSL connection anymore - I've had to downgrade the cube back to 10.2.3 to get back online via DSL.

When in 10.2.4 the WebShuttle DSL modem could get a line sync but not a server connection - any suggestions on a fix for this or do I wait for 10.2.5?

I would highly suspect your setting and would in fact reinstall all your settings. Be sure that you have your port prefs in network set to ethernet first. It has been a long standing recommendation to delete or remove all othere ports from the list this way OSX can't default to another port even by chance.

What config method are you using? i.e. dhcp, bootp, etc..

teetoo
Feb 18, 2003, 04:12 AM
quote:
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by teetoo
I've installed 10.2.4 on both G4 Cube & Superdrive TiBook and now neither can use their DSL connection anymore - I've had to downgrade the cube back to 10.2.3 to get back online via DSL.

When in 10.2.4 the WebShuttle DSL modem could get a line sync but not a server connection - any suggestions on a fix for this or do I wait for 10.2.5?
------------------------------------------------------------------------


I would highly suspect your setting and would in fact reinstall all your settings. Be sure that you have your port prefs in network set to ethernet first. It has been a long standing recommendation to delete or remove all othere ports from the list this way OSX can't default to another port even by chance.

What config method are you using? i.e. dhcp, bootp, etc..



Strange one this... as I mentioned, I had exactly the same problem on two machines once they'd been upgraded from 10.2.3 > 10.2.4 Both could get a DSL line sync but not connect to the ISP's server

I spoke to the tech guys at my ISP and all the network settings appear to be correct - the modem connects using PPP andd is usually provided an IP address (this isn't happening now), tried a reinstall for the DSL modem software (WebShuttle DSL).

The WebShuttle (USB modem) installler creates it's own item in the port selector (and this is above Built-in Ethernet in the drop down list), just tried making the webshuttle the only active setting (on the TiBook) and it still doesn't work.

In 10.2.3 I can have multiple ports in the drop down menu and things work fine.

I'm currently back on 10.2.3 on the cube with net access, the TiBook is on 10.2.4 and getting it's net access via internet sharing from the cube. I think this weekend I'll reinstall the TiBook completely and then get it up back to 10.2.4 and give it another go to see if that makes a difference.

If you've got any suggestions I'd love to hear them.

MacBandit
Feb 18, 2003, 09:57 AM
Originally posted by teetoo
Strange one this... as I mentioned, I had exactly the same problem on two machines once they'd been upgraded from 10.2.3 > 10.2.4 Both could get a DSL line sync but not connect to the ISP's server

I spoke to the tech guys at my ISP and all the network settings appear to be correct - the modem connects using PPP andd is usually provided an IP address (this isn't happening now), tried a reinstall for the DSL modem software (WebShuttle DSL).

The WebShuttle (USB modem) installler creates it's own item in the port selector (and this is above Built-in Ethernet in the drop down list), just tried making the webshuttle the only active setting (on the TiBook) and it still doesn't work.

In 10.2.3 I can have multiple ports in the drop down menu and things work fine.

I'm currently back on 10.2.3 on the cube with net access, the TiBook is on 10.2.4 and getting it's net access via internet sharing from the cube. I think this weekend I'll reinstall the TiBook completely and then get it up back to 10.2.4 and give it another go to see if that makes a difference.

If you've got any suggestions I'd love to hear them.

I'm thinking that the problem is related to the internet connection through you USB ports. Have you tried disconnecting all your other USB devices except your keyboard. Also have you tried switching the USB port on the back of your computer that the DSL modem is connected to. I assume you have the USB modem connected directly to the computer and not to a hub.

teetoo
Feb 18, 2003, 10:06 AM
Originally posted by MacBandit
I'm thinking that the problem is related to the internet connection through you USB ports. Have you tried disconnecting all your other USB devices except your keyboard. Also have you tried switching the USB port on the back of your computer that the DSL modem is connected to. I assume you have the USB modem connected directly to the computer and not to a hub.

Yeah, I did have a problem when I first got the modem which was solved by plugging it directly into the back of the Cube, but with the TiBook it's the only thing plugged in (no hub) I've also tried both ports...

It might be a case of waiting for updated drivers from the modem maker.

Anyway if you've got any other ideas let us know, cheers.

h'biki
Feb 19, 2003, 07:21 AM
I was thinking I was going so well. 10.2.4 has sped up OS Xs recognition of my adaptec firewire card when its put in. It used to freeze for a minute or so, now its around 10 secs!

Awesome.

No other (apparent) problems until I started using FCP3.0.4. Slow. Crasy. 10.2.3 and FCP3.0.4 were an awesome combination but i had to upgrade. Bugger.

TiWarrior
Feb 20, 2003, 03:03 AM
Anyone else had the input menu appear in the menu bar? It shows UK and USA flags, even though the USA flag isn't selected in the menu! If I select then un-select the input menu vanishes....until reboot:mad:

That, along with discovering the nice new way of telling you that there is a kernel panic, has made me downgrade to 10.2.3.

Apple can't have tested this so called upgrade on many machines. Both my brand new MDD 1.25GHz and my 667MHz Ti book where screwed by it.

I wonder if Steve Jobs is kicking ass in Cupertino;)

TiWarrior