World Trade Center design chosen

[MacFan25]

http://www.cnn.com/2003/US/Northeast/02/26/wtc.finalist.ap/index.html

Here is the design chosen for the World Trade Center site. What do you all think of this design?

[howard]

OH MY GOD! A LAWN MOWER HAS ATTACKTED MANHATTAN hehe...i always thought those angular buildings were interesting..

[marcsiry]

I live in Manhattan, and it's been my favorite design since the day they were unveiled.

The simplicity of the memorial- the bare retaining wall of the original foundation- is key among my reasons for liking it.

Additionally, this one had the least "eyesore factor" in my opinion. The THINK towers looked like the Twin Skeletons- a morbid reminder of what once stood there.

Hopefully the final design will retain some of the daring quality of the model- it's likely there will be a lot of concessions to business and economic realities between now and when the construction is complete.

[G4scott]

The design seems like a compromise between the weird looking retro style designs proposed, and the more sensible, yet boring designs. The thing about this that is going to piss off people like Bin Laden, is that the architect is Jewish. I have nothing wrong with Jews, but many see them as the corruption of America, such as Bin Laden, many islamic extremist terrorist, and Bobby Fischer... I just hope for the best.

[voicegy]

This design always was the best of the lot, and I'm pleased as punch.

Also, don't forget that we're goin' for the world's tallest building again...it's time we got that back!

[marcsiry]

Let's hope it pisses off Bin Laden.

Let's hope he comes, personally, to NYC to register his displeasure.

There's a few million New Yorkers who would like to have a word with him...

Anything we can do to annoy, harass, and generally piss off our enemies is fine with me. Along with blowing them to bits, of course.

[LethalWolfe]

I like the model. Hopefully it looks good in real life. :)


Lethal

[alex_ant]

I liked this one better. Best part is that the top part rotates!

[Kethoticus]

Not one building exceeds 70 stories. The 1,760ft garden tower is a fear-based attempt to get height without actually putting genuine business interests in what could someday be a target for attack again. And this fearful response is a moral victory for the terrorists.

Chalk one up for Osama.

[Stelliform]

Originally posted by Kethoticus
Not one building exceeds 70 stories. The 1,760ft garden tower is a fear-based attempt to get height without actually putting genuine business interests in what could someday be a target for attack again. And this fearful response is a moral victory for the terrorists.

Chalk one up for Osama.

Yeah I am dissapointed that they didn't choose one with more office space. I am glad that they are rebuilding something taller.

I was afraid that they would rebuild nothing and just have a memorial.

[sspitsbergen]

In response to a few of the comments:

Originally posted by Kethoticus:
Not one building exceeds 70 stories. The 1,760ft garden tower is a fear-based attempt to get height without actually putting genuine business interests in what could someday be a target for attack again. And this fearful response is a moral victory for the terrorists.

The owner of the WTC said they would not allow living or office space over 70 floors since they cannot be evacuated.

As for the lack of office space, I think there is still a glut of office space in Manhatten anyway, especially after added 70 new floors of it.

Lastly, there was an article last week in the WSJ or cnn.com I think that talked about the new races for the worlds largest towers, the one in Kaula Lampor, Singapore and somewhere else are all fighting each other. Pretty interesting.

Thanks

[jethroted]

I don't know about this design. I don't really know about any buildings going up there actually. I mean think about it. They have not found all the bodies, so that means that some are still there. Now they are going to build on top of someones grave? That sounds creepy, and I will bet money that poeple will be seeing ghosts. Those buildings will be so haunted. Way too mant people died in very unhappy circumstances. They should have made a big garden/grave/memorial site, and treated it like a cemetary of sorts. There are people who are still stuck in the ground there for god's sake! I know that that space is too "valuble" to let sit empty, but it seems like a bad idea.

[medea]

"The architect says that having calculated the arc of the sun, a wedge of natural light would funnel visitors to the memorial site, and that every September 11 between 8:46 a.m., when the first tower was struck by a plane, and 10:28 a.m., when the second tower collapsed, no shadows will be cast by his buildings."
I love that part of the design, though it will take almost a decade to finish the buildings, it will surely be a sight to be seen when completed.

Also, I think it's good that we are not going to fill up the entire building with offices again, not only for safety but for the fact that we really don't need to make this another business center, it's more than that and both of the final designs focused on culture rather than just money.

[Kethoticus]

Nah. I personally don't subscribe to that. Nor do I subscribe to the idea that every time there's a disaster we need to set aside the space as a permanent cemetery. THAT would be a true victory for the terrorists.

The best thing we can do is to go in with life and do so as triumphantly as we can. Sing in front of the faces of our enemies. That's what rebuilding represents. I only wish that NYC would recapture what it once had: the rep for having the tallest buildings on the planet.

As for the undiscovered bodies, I have a feeling that they will NEVER find all of the remains. Many were likely incinerated, many were probably ground up in all the rubble. Gruesome yes, but probably true. I'm sure many of the remains were carried off as organis debris absorbed by the stone and other rubble carried away.

[IJ Reilly]

Originally posted by Kethoticus
Not one building exceeds 70 stories. The 1,760ft garden tower is a fear-based attempt to get height without actually putting genuine business interests in what could someday be a target for attack again. And this fearful response is a moral victory for the terrorists.

Chalk one up for Osama.

Not so fast. Those uppers floors would have been unleasable, so that part of the design was entirely pragmatic.

I'm another who believes they picked the best design. The THINK proposal was just too literal. In 20-30 years people would be looking at those skeleton towers and asking themselves, "how much longer to we need to be reminded of what happened here in September 2001?" Leibskin's approach was far more subtle. Exposing part of the "pit" is something like tripping over bits of the Roman wall in central London surrounded by generations of subsequent building. I causes a person ponder the history of the spot, without having to clobber them over the head with it.

[dabirdwell]

The design from Richard Meier's firm was the best, not this gaudy piece of Americana.

[IJ Reilly]

Originally posted by dabirdwell
The design from Richard Meier's firm was the best, not this gaudy piece of Americana.

Really? What did you like about his proposal?

I guess I'm not a big Meier fan. His Getty Center in LA works well enough once you're inside, but from down below it's hard to distinguish from the generic condo complexes nearby. The Getty spent nearly $1 billion on the center and what they got from Meier was not to my mind especially grand.

[3rdpath]

blah...another soul-less futuristic architectural disaster.

as faddish as the platform shoe.:eek:

[elfin buddy]

Is there an approximate date for then the new centre is to be complete? I don't expect anything until at least 2012, but it would be nice to have some idea. IMHO, I like the design. I don't know why. It just seems so peaceful.

Also, I'm wondering what constitutes the world's tallest building. Is it just the sheer height, or is it the highest floor where people can be? Is there a difference between the world's tallest building and the world's tallest free-standing structure? The CN Tower stands at 553 metres (1,815 feet), but it's observation deck is only at 447 metres (1,465 feet).

Please enlighten me :)

[GeneR]

Originally posted by Kethoticus
Not one building exceeds 70 stories. The 1,760ft garden tower is a fear-based attempt to get height without actually putting genuine business interests in what could someday be a target for attack again. And this fearful response is a moral victory for the terrorists.

Chalk one up for Osama.

I agree. I would think they might consider making a building that was one central building that took up the entire space of the city block where the two towers were. But the difference is this:

It would be taller than the Twin Towers.

Secondly, it would be hollow in two sections where the two towers originally existed.

I should think it wouldn't be such an eyesour if done tastefully with glass and metal skyviews. Think of it as a giant catherdral type building where you walking in and the ceiling is the same distance as the top of the Twin Towers' height. I think it would make it both a shrine as well as an extremely interesting complex for innovation and business.

My $0.02.

[pantagruel]

I would have been happy with either of the final designs, but I do like this one more. That ray of light between the buildings will be incredible when its done. Now lets get to work on it already.

[mikulashek]

I myself prefered the THINK teams choice, but this will not doubt serve the WTC well. Our prayers are with those departed.

[GeneR]

Originally posted by alex_ant
I liked this one better. Best part is that the top part rotates!

ALEX_ANT -- YOUUUU AREEEE AA GEENNNNIUSSSS!!!

:D

I think that picture's great. Great. Great. Great.

I would, however, add a giant disco ball to that arrangement... you know, hang it from the cross beam along with a giant pink fuzzy dice with white dots.

:D

[Mr. Anderson]

Its not a bad design, the buildings themselves since the won't overpower the skyline. But what I dont understand is what type of plants they're going to put on the spire/garden. The wind and weather conditions are going to require something special. Not to mention upkeep on them will be tough and expensive.

D

[King Cobra]

They say that pyramids on the tops of buildings are lucky.

I would expect this projec to cost well over $1 billion, and I wouldn't be surprised if it totals $10 billion as the final estimation.

[Mr. Anderson]

Yah, but money won't be an object in this case. Cost overruns won't keep it from being built. ;)

D

[dabirdwell]

The Meier team design was much more understatedly elegant, I don't know about the other projects he has done, but I liked the fact that the design was parsimonious and efficient, and retained some sense of human scale.

The abstracted interlocking hands concept was a good start. Why not make the memorial about peace and cooperation in the future rather than an obtuse statement about American superiority.

[macfan]

Why not make the memorial about peace and cooperation in the future rather than an obtuse statement about American superiority?

Because the United States is superior, particularly superior to the bastards who flew the planes into the previous towers. The WTC towers were themselves symbols of peace and cooperation. Do you know how many countries lost citizens in that attack? It was a large number.

[marcsiry]

Thousands are killed in a heinous terrorist act and you want to memorialize them with something about "peace and cooperation?"

The attackers were deviants whom, in their primitive weakness, used the tools of our modern lifestyle to strike terror into the common man. Using planes they could never build, these fundamentalists destroyed towers they could never create, to paralyze our society with fear.

Our response should not be a desire to reach out to these sociopathic freaks in a spirit of "peace and understanding." Our response should be one of defiance- a demonstration that no matter what they do in a misguided attempt to damage our society, we'll just come back bigger and better, while they dwindle inevitably into the dustbin of history.

Attempting to understand and accept the motives of these monstrous attackers smacks of moral relativism and displays a soft underbelly in our society. Lots of people have greivances- here in the States, there are plenty of people unhappy with the upcoming war on Iraq.

Do they detonate bombs in shopping malls to prove their point? No, they protest peacefully, fully understanding that their message will have all the more power and endurance that way. We shouldn't give the barbarians who would resort to these sort of attacks any sort of satisfaction.

[Kethoticus]

Why not make the memorial about peace and cooperation in the future rather than an obtuse statement about American superiority.
You don't sound like an American, or if you are, you sound like someone apologizing for the country. If I'm wrong, I apologize.

But the whole idea here ain't about American superiority, but about being able to rebound from a national disaster. Anything less is an expression of fear and broken morale--exactly what the terrorists want. They like symbolic attacks and psychological devastation. The best thing we can do is to blast upwardly and more grandiosely than before.

We *are* a great country. In spite of our many sins, God has granted the US great favor. And it shows. Be grateful, be proud. But do not misinterpret a grandiose rebuilding plan as America flaunting its strength. That's ridiculous. The best revenge is living well.


Thousands are killed in a heinous terrorist act and you want to memorialize them with something about "peace and cooperation?"

I think he believes that each of us should try to defuse the already tremendous international stress level. I disagree with his statement, but I don't think he means to mock the dead.


The attackers were deviants whom, in their primitive weakness, used the tools of our modern lifestyle to strike terror into the common man. Using planes they could never build, these fundamentalists destroyed towers they could never create, to paralyze our society with fear.

Never thought of it that way. You're right.


Our response should not be a desire to reach out to these sociopathic freaks in a spirit of "peace and understanding." Our response should be one of defiance- a demonstration that no matter what they do in a misguided attempt to damage our society, we'll just come back bigger and better, while they dwindle inevitably into the dustbin of history.

Amen. This is why I wanted to see taller -- but stronger and safer -- buildings. Do you think the Empire State Building would have went down so easily? I tend to doubt it. It was built differently, in a different era. We might need to take a few queues from the architect of the building that King Kong conquered. But I believe that it can -- and should -- be done.


Attempting to understand and accept the motives of these monstrous attackers smacks of moral relativism and displays a soft underbelly in our society.

I think that depends on the individual making the statement. I've never heard anyone but the terrorists say that we need to "accept" their motives. But understanding their motives can actually help us.

Understanding things from their side can help us be more sensitive to those who sympathize with the loonies but haven't actually crossed the line yet. We need serious PR help in the ME, and at least understanding why they hate us so much may help to defuse future bombs that may come our way.

I read in the LA Times today about Maan, Jordan. It's a pretty messed up city, a hot bed of radical elements totally frustrated with their third-world lifestyle. The gov't has pretty much forgotten them, but instead of getting mad at the gov't, they get angry at the US for supporting their enemy, Israel. I speculate that radical Muslim elements see the ignorance and poverty-based frustration of the people, then channel that high emotion in the wrong direction, taking full advantage of their ignorance.


Lots of people have greivances- here in the States, there are plenty of people unhappy with the upcoming war on Iraq.

Do they detonate bombs in shopping malls to prove their point? No, they protest peacefully, fully understanding that their message will have all the more power and endurance that way. We shouldn't give the barbarians who would resort to these sort of attacks any sort of satisfaction.

Very true. I could not agree much more.

[IJ Reilly]

I agree with portions of all of these statements. In my view the new WTC should not be about terrorists, or peace or war, it should be a monument to the resilience of the American people and a testament to our national character. As such it should not wallow in self pity, nor be grandiose and overstated. It should also be a better development then the former WTC. That, actually, should be the easy part.

[MacFan25]

I think that by remember the victims of 9/11, the new WTC should be the grandest buildings in NYC and in the whole world. At the new WTC site, there should be a memorial for the vicitms, but I think that there should also be plenty of office space, too.

[void]

Originally posted by GeneR
ALEX_ANT -- YOUUUU AREEEE AA GEENNNNIUSSSS!!!

:D

I think that picture's great. Great. Great. Great.

I would, however, add a giant disco ball to that arrangement... you know, hang it from the cross beam along with a giant pink fuzzy dice with white dots.

:D
That is really not funny... i live in New York and to see people like you joking around like this is disgusting. Typical behavior of a Californian