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Elan0204
Mar 10, 2003, 04:35 PM
From MacMinute (http://www.macminute.com/2003/03/10/java)

Apple today released Java 1.4.1, an updated version of its java implementation for Mac OS X. The update adds improved Java applet support for Safari and other Web browsers that support the Java Internet plug-in. According to Apple, Java 1.4.1 is also up-to-date with the latest Java release from Sun, with "hundreds of new features, including built-in support for XML-based Web services, enhanced client functionality, and improved performance and reliability." Additionally, Java applications now take better advantage of Aqua and Quartz Extreme, fully leverage the built-in Universal Access features of Mac OS X 10.2 (Jaguar), and can now be controlled through AppleScript, via the new UI Scripting technology. The update is available via the Software Update preference panel.

For more info go to Apple's Java 1.4.1 Page. (http://www.apple.com/java/)

macktheknife
Mar 10, 2003, 05:05 PM
It's about *&$%#@ time! I've looked over some of the features of Apple's Java 1.4.1 Update, and I must say I'm impressed. Hopefully, this means that Apple will continue to provide full and timely Java support for OS X from now on.

GO APPLE!!!

peterjhill
Mar 10, 2003, 05:19 PM
Sweet!!! Downloading now... I took a java class, and it is a pretty cool language if you want to write something to run on multiple platforms. Thanks Apple

boskie
Mar 10, 2003, 05:48 PM
How spooky!!

I was just browsing this forum and software update pops its head up

Scared the bejesus outta me
:D

edesignuk
Mar 10, 2003, 05:56 PM
There is already a thread on this: http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=21910

AppleDave
Mar 10, 2003, 06:24 PM
Originally posted by edesignuk
There is already a thread on this: http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=21910


Although this is the most appropriate forum for this thread. To quote arn's rules for this forum:

MacApps Forum Open

This forum is now open for user posts. Post new or favorite Applications and discuss.

The previous format of MacApps.com has been suspended at this time.

- Please post threads on applications only.
- New Threads for New Versions is encouraged.
- Place the Application in the thread title.
- All types of software is allowed.
- Do NOT post support topics. These should go in the Mac Help/Questions forum.

If you look at the kind of threads in this forum and the kinds posted in the "software discussion" forum this thread should be here.

edit: arn has closed the other thread.

robotrenegade
Mar 10, 2003, 06:43 PM
I hope I can sell on ebay now and not have to use IE.

tliptak
Mar 10, 2003, 06:49 PM
Originally posted by robotrenegade
I hope I can sell on ebay now and not have to use IE.

Safari and Camino both work for me on Ebay???

ChoMomma
Mar 10, 2003, 06:49 PM
Hmm I sell on ebay and use Safari, what problems are you seeing?

seven5
Mar 10, 2003, 06:51 PM
I went and got NetBeans and i can't get it to use the aqua look and feel. I used the .dmg binary and the tar.gz one. Niether let me set teh aqua UI. Has anyone gotten it to work?

dethl
Mar 10, 2003, 07:14 PM
Hrm, maybe I should try to learn Java again.....anybody got some good links to Java tutorials?

Another thing I noticed, this update doesn't require OS 10.2.4....but that doesn't matter since I can't upgrade right now (56k modem makes upgrading the system kinda hard)

jaykk
Mar 10, 2003, 07:24 PM
I really want JBuilder 8 for Mac to come, the 7 doesn't work with Java 1.4.1, I hope they update it soon.

DavPeanut
Mar 10, 2003, 07:29 PM
I got it right when it came out. I refreshed the software update, and nothing was there, and five seconds later, it opened software update.

BubbaTAC
Mar 10, 2003, 07:31 PM
Does anyone know how this will affect LimeWire and other Java apps? using quartz extreme and aqua more should make it a little bit less of a resource hog...I hope

seven5
Mar 10, 2003, 07:31 PM
Originally posted by jaykk
I really want JBuilder 8 for Mac to come, the 7 doesn't work with Java 1.4.1, I hope they update it soon.


this may help you...


http://developer.apple.com/techpubs/macosx/ReleaseNotes/java141/resolvedIssues/chapter_5_section_5.html



now help me with with netbeans!

bousozoku
Mar 10, 2003, 07:46 PM
I'm shocked. I just went to http://www.eweek.com, which is routine for me and it was almost unusably slow after the Java update. In fact, I tried it with:

Camino 0.7
Safari v60
Internet Explorer 5.2.2 and
Mozilla 1.2.1

I had to force-quit Mozilla because it stopped working. I guess there will be a plug-in update at some point.

Default look-and-feel is much different. For examples, see my thread in Distributed computing: http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=21248

greenstork
Mar 10, 2003, 08:34 PM
ESPN Fantasy baseball still does not work, oh well, perhaps when the full release of Safari and Camino arrive, it will be fixed.

ryan
Mar 10, 2003, 08:39 PM
Originally posted by dethl
Hrm, maybe I should try to learn Java again.....anybody got some good links to Java tutorials?

Another thing I noticed, this update doesn't require OS 10.2.4....but that doesn't matter since I can't upgrade right now (56k modem makes upgrading the system kinda hard)
http://java.sun.com

On left side of the page look under the Documentation heading for "Tutorials"

yzedf
Mar 10, 2003, 08:39 PM
Originally posted by bousozoku
I'm shocked. I just went to http://www.eweek.com, which is routine for me and it was almost unusably slow after the Java update. In fact, I tried it with:

Camino 0.7
Safari v60
Internet Explorer 5.2.2 and
Mozilla 1.2.1

I had to force-quit Mozilla because it stopped working. I guess there will be a plug-in update at some point.

Default look-and-feel is much different. For examples, see my thread in Distributed computing: http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=21248

Safari beta v.64 works great at eweek for me.

alset
Mar 10, 2003, 08:41 PM
Hooray for AppleScript support! This will lead to great things.

Dan

ryan
Mar 10, 2003, 08:42 PM
Originally posted by jaykk
I really want JBuilder 8 for Mac to come, the 7 doesn't work with Java 1.4.1, I hope they update it soon. Forget JBuilder, use Eclipse (http://eclipse.org)

MacKenzie999
Mar 10, 2003, 09:09 PM
Originally posted by BubbaTAC
Does anyone know how this will affect LimeWire and other Java apps? using quartz extreme and aqua more should make it a little bit less of a resource hog...I hope

Well, after installing it I find the Limewire answer to be yes and no. Limewire itself feels a bit zippier, entered keywords seem to be accepted a bit faster, but it still messes up the display of other apps if it's visible behind them.

YMMV
-Mike

ernstp
Mar 10, 2003, 09:39 PM
Originally posted by MacKenzie999
Well, after installing it I find the Limewire answer to be yes and no. Limewire itself feels a bit zippier, entered keywords seem to be accepted a bit faster, but it still messes up the display of other apps if it's visible behind them.

YMMV
-Mike

Sorry to kill your illusions, but LimeWire doesn't work at all with java 1.4.1.
But 1.3.1 is still installed (look in /System/Library/Frameworks/JavaVM.framework/Versions/) and programs can choose which version they want to use.

They will probably update LimeWire soon, but right now LimeWire depends on lots of the old carbon-apple specials in 1.3.1.

eric_n_dfw
Mar 10, 2003, 09:51 PM
Originally posted by ryan
Forget JBuilder, use Eclipse (http://eclipse.org)
I'll 2nd that! Eclipse is awesome!

khollister
Mar 10, 2003, 09:58 PM
Uh, Bousozoku, I tried eweek.com, and it loads fine for me. Furthermore, I took a look at the page source, and I don't believe there is any Java involved (they use ASP's - boo). There is javascript, but that is no relation to Java.

Hey guys, I use Eclipse on Windows at work, but there is no Os X version. Furthermore, I was under the impression that they use their own binary UI classes, not Swing, so I fail to see how it could even run under X11 on OS X.

If I'm wrong, I'll be happy to be set straight.

Keith

Catfish_Man
Mar 10, 2003, 09:58 PM
Originally posted by eric_n_dfw
I'll 2nd that! Eclipse is awesome!

Bah. I like a few parts of it (the syntax checker, autocomplete, a few other things), but it just seems so clunky on the machine I use it on at school. I'm sure there are some higher end features I'm missing out on, but I really don't like it that much.

khollister
Mar 10, 2003, 10:00 PM
Oops - I just saw the OS X version of Eclipse in the Current Stable Builds. I was looking for a released version.

I'll have to give it a go

reiggin
Mar 10, 2003, 10:10 PM
Originally posted by ernstp
Sorry to kill your illusions, but LimeWire doesn't work at all with java 1.4.1.
But 1.3.1 is still installed (look in /System/Library/Frameworks/JavaVM.framework/Versions/) and programs can choose which version they want to use.

They will probably update LimeWire soon, but right now LimeWire depends on lots of the old carbon-apple specials in 1.3.1.

How do you uninstall 1.4.1? Or make an app use 1.3.1? Yahoo! Games doesn't like 1.4.1.

khollister
Mar 10, 2003, 10:11 PM
Aside from the fact that Eclipse runs a hell of a lot faster than any version of JBuilder I tried, the CVS integration (it's merge capability is awesome) and the refactor capability is really nice in a real project environment, i.e. a team working from a CVD repository rather than individual efforts.

Nipsy
Mar 10, 2003, 10:17 PM
Now I'm just waiting for my apps to get updated with scrollwheel support...

jaykk
Mar 10, 2003, 10:42 PM
this may help you...


http://developer.apple.com/techpubs..._section_5.html



now help me with with netbeans!


Thank you so much, ur the man, glad to see a lot of Java Gurus in the forum. I searched for this info to run Jbuilder for sometime, then gave up.

And I never used NetBeans on OS X, so i downloaded new version, followed the instructions here..but i found out that u have to modify the command like this in the following document. It works for me, let me know if you need any further help.


./runide.sh -jdkhome /Library/Java/Home -ui apple.laf.AquaLookAndFeel -fontsize 11

http://www.netbeans.org/ide/support/mac.html,


Yes, eclipse is a neat IDE, i used it a lot, i actually worked on IBM's Webpshere Application Developer which is based on eclipse.

Foxer
Mar 10, 2003, 10:46 PM
Originally posted by ChoMomma
Hmm I sell on ebay and use Safari, what problems are you seeing?

I had ebay problems, too. I was never able to upload a picture of my item. Always had to use IE. With luck, those days are over.

Mudbug
Mar 10, 2003, 10:59 PM
1st - I've installed 1.4.1 on two machines now, but I don't really have any measure of it working/improving life for me or my machines. Can you point me to some "benchmark" or something like that which can show me or tell me what this is really doing for me?

2nd - I'm pretty savvy with most things mac, but haven't really gotten into coding/writing programs/developer stuff, other than just screwing around. I want to build things like konfabulator widgets, but don't have the first idea where to start. What can I get my hands on to learn?

Sorry about the length, but I thought I might not be the only one reading this forum and wondering the same thing.

jaykk
Mar 10, 2003, 11:14 PM
Also, if you are using Netbeans Launcher, just add -ui apple.laf.AquaLookAndFeel in ${IDE_HOME}/bin/ide.cfg file.

Here is a must-read article -> Bringing your application to Mac OS X (http://developer.java.sun.com/developer/technicalArticles/JavaLP/JavaToMac/)

lmalave
Mar 10, 2003, 11:22 PM
WTF?

Software update won't start the download. Anyone else having trouble connecting?

Mirus
Mar 10, 2003, 11:27 PM
I've been using 1.4 since beta 4 or 5. Been a long time coming. I'm a Java programmer and the rest of the development team uses Windows w/1.4 so I needed to get 1.4 running on my Mac. Glad it's finally officially released.

Most, if not all, current Java apps are set to run with JVM 1.3 and you need to explicitly set to to run in 1.4. For those running/trying Eclipse this is especially true if you want to take advantage of the 1.4 capabilities like "assert".

Control-click on the app and select "Show Package Contents". Select info.plist (if you have the developer tools installed you can use Property List Editor, or textedit). If the app was built recently it'll have a JVMVersion tag under Java. If not you'll have to create it. This is probably set to 1.3* or 1.3, you'll want to change it to 1.4+ and try running the app. If the app crashes (i.e. Limewire) change it back and wait for an app update... :)

Here's an example key tag:

<key>JVMVersion</key>
<string>1.3*</string>

Change it to:

<key>JVMVersion</key>
<string>1.4+</string>

I'm currently running Eclipse M5 on my laptop and it runs fine with JDK1.4 release. So, if you want a big app to play with under 1.4 go grab it at www.eclipse.org...RC2 was just released, need...to...update...my...laptop...

edesignuk
Mar 11, 2003, 01:04 AM
Originally posted by AppleDave
Although this is the most appropriate forum for this thread. To quote arn's rules for this forum:



If you look at the kind of threads in this forum and the kinds posted in the "software discussion" forum this thread should be here.

edit: arn has closed the other thread.
Yes, thank you for that newbie, I do realise. However the other thread was started about 30mins before this one :rolleyes:

skymaXimus
Mar 11, 2003, 02:28 AM
WTF?

Software update won't start the download. Anyone else having trouble connecting?

Yah, i'm having problems w/ softare update as well. I'm going to look for the link on Apple's web site.

tduality
Mar 11, 2003, 03:59 AM
I'm currently running Eclipse M5 on my laptop and it runs fine with JDK1.4 release. So, if you want a big app to play with under 1.4 go grab it at www.eclipse.org...RC2 was just released, need...to...update...my...laptop...

My company abandoned IBM Visual Age for Java in favor of Eclipse soon after the first pre-releases. And since there's OS X I got interested in the Mac and thinking about introducing it as an alternative development platform in our shop.

Now on my G4 400, 1.2GB, no QE at home the Eclipse UI is still too slow to be competitive with our PCs in the office (on Java 1.3.*, I'll give 1.4.1 a try tonight.)

Sure, the widget set of Eclipse (SWT) is not completely native in Carbon yet, but
I just wonder whether a 1 GHZ, QE, 15'' Powerbook would already do the trick to impress my collleagues.

Any experiences on faster machines than mine, anyone?


Martin

rsnyder@psu.edu
Mar 11, 2003, 08:31 AM
There is rather big revision of the Java Developer Tools on ADC. However, you need to path to downloads/java. This March 10, 2003 update is 48.6 MB. The discription is:

Java 1.4.1 Developer Tools Update
Java 1.4.1 updates for the December 2002 Mac OS X Developer Tools. This update contains a new application packaging tool Jar Bundler, 1.4.1 Java docs, examples, and source code.

Goekeli
Mar 11, 2003, 09:54 AM
Camino is crashing every 5 minutes or so!:(

X-Baz
Mar 11, 2003, 01:12 PM
Originally posted by jaykk
Also, if you are using Netbeans Launcher, just add -ui apple.laf.AquaLookAndFeel in ${IDE_HOME}/bin/ide.cfg file.

after five minutes of playing with netbeans, i can say that startup is significantly slower, but during use it is faster (i don't have quartz extreme). the aqua look is significantly different ... and lastly, you still get a class-cast exception when trying to set the menu bar into its proper place (boo).

addertheblack
Mar 11, 2003, 01:30 PM
Originally posted by BubbaTAC
Does anyone know how this will affect LimeWire and other Java apps? using quartz extreme and aqua more should make it a little bit less of a resource hog...I hope

well, I am the lead developer for Myster (http://www.mysternetworks.com) which is a java based p2p app. Right now java 1.4.1 will not activate for programs like limewire or Myster because MacOS X will continue to use java 1.3.1 for java applications that are bundled as .app application bundles.

This is a very good thing from my perspective as java 1.4.1 still has too many bugs to run Myster properly. I don't know if the same goes from limewire.

bigjohn
Mar 11, 2003, 02:27 PM
The Yahoo! Fantasy Baseball live draft test link didn't work with Camino 0.7 before the Java update - now it does in fact work. Yay for me since I like Camino so much (and now, please add separators to Camino bookmarks!).

jasonM
Mar 11, 2003, 03:01 PM
Originally posted by addertheblack
well, I am the lead developer for Myster (http://www.mysternetworks.com) which is a java based p2p app. Right now java 1.4.1 will not activate for programs like limewire or Myster because MacOS X will continue to use java 1.3.1 for java applications that are bundled as .app application bundles.

This is a very good thing from my perspective as java 1.4.1 still has too many bugs to run Myster properly. I don't know if the same goes from limewire.


If you look at /usr/bin/javac its a symbolic link to /System/Library/Frameworks/JavaVM.framework/Versions/CurrentJDK. CurrentJDK is a symbolic link to the directory 1.4.1. So, if I were to use javac on the command line, or java for that matter, I'd get the 1.4.1 version. How is this different than if I were to run a program via an icon on the desktop?

You may want to do some double-checking on that. I have Netbeans running on my machine at home, and using ps and traversing a forest of links, I discovered that 1) netbeans is a .app package and 2) it was started with the 1.4.1 version of java.

paulc
Mar 11, 2003, 03:15 PM
First, anyone who dabbles in p2p should immediately get Acquisition. Great little Cocoa app.

For a long while, that buggy POS 1.3.1 was the cause of MUCH grief with this app. But a lot of us started running the dev preview of 141. BIG difference. At least 13,756,97 oddities went away just from shifting to a MUCH MUCH better version of Java.

Funny that we kept being promised "world class Java" with the shipment of X. It wasn't even in the ballpark; w/ 141 we MAY have a good Java on the Mac.

addertheblack
Mar 11, 2003, 04:16 PM
Originally posted by jasonM
If you look at /usr/bin/javac its a symbolic link to /System/Library/Frameworks/JavaVM.framework/Versions/CurrentJDK. CurrentJDK is a symbolic link to the directory 1.4.1. So, if I were to use javac on the command line, or java for that matter, I'd get the 1.4.1 version. How is this different than if I were to run a program via an icon on the desktop?

You may want to do some double-checking on that. I have Netbeans running on my machine at home, and using ps and traversing a forest of links, I discovered that 1) netbeans is a .app package and 2) it was started with the 1.4.1 version of java.

http://developer.apple.com/techpubs/macosx/ReleaseNotes/java141/multiplevms/chapter_3_section_2.html

+ I actually tried double clicking on my app with 1.4.1 installed. it uses 1.3.1.

edenwaith
Mar 11, 2003, 06:16 PM
Woo hoo! Mouse wheel scrolling, finally!

Greenlightboi
Mar 11, 2003, 06:31 PM
I was hoping it would resolve some issue I was having with chat rooms I goto, but 1.4.1 just made all java apps (online) unuseable! ITs so slow and locks the computer up.

macktheknife
Mar 11, 2003, 10:07 PM
Originally posted by ryan
Forget JBuilder, use Eclipse (http://eclipse.org)

Wow, I'm pretty impressed with Eclipse. Hopefully the release of Java 1.4.1 for OS X will encourage the folks developing Eclipse to release a Released Build. I will still have to say that JBuilder is much more polished, but Eclipse does definitely seem better than NetBeans.

iccy82
Mar 11, 2003, 11:18 PM
yahoo games doesnt work no (in safari, v64) works ok in both camino (if you can live with it crashing over and over) and IE (argh!!!!)

but i dunno, ive seen a dramatic increase in the number of crashes since download - can this be coincidental?

but more than not its to do with the individual software and not java's problem!

kas95125
Mar 12, 2003, 12:01 PM
I've had difficulty setting up eBay auctions with Safari too, but I'm not sure Java is the culprit.

The problem, as somebody mentioned, is that you cannot successfully upload images using Safari (at least, I can't). But isn't this a symptom of Javascript, and not Java? I'm no programmer, but my understanding is that they're entirely separate langauges, with separate implementations.

I wish I had something to sell right now, so that I could try it out. Anyone interested in buying a half-used Epson cartridge?

bobindashadows
Mar 13, 2003, 11:18 AM
this upgrade is incredible... performance on the helicopter game at addictinggames.com is so much better, i can actually paly it now without using ie!

bousozoku
Mar 14, 2003, 04:47 PM
Originally posted by khollister
Uh, Bousozoku, I tried eweek.com, and it loads fine for me. Furthermore, I took a look at the page source, and I don't believe there is any Java involved (they use ASP's - boo). There is javascript, but that is no relation to Java.

Hey guys, I use Eclipse on Windows at work, but there is no Os X version. Furthermore, I was under the impression that they use their own binary UI classes, not Swing, so I fail to see how it could even run under X11 on OS X.

If I'm wrong, I'll be happy to be set straight.

Keith

The only difference I can imagine that I'm having with Java applets, at EWeek and elsewhere, is that I've got folding@home running on both processors. I'll try it when one of the processes achieves a checkpoint.

As far as Eclipse goes, I was going to download the source code to see what's going on there. It does seem as though Websphere Developer, after which it was supposedly developed, is only available on Windows.

I also noticed with this Java update that there's still no Java3D. I just came from the J3D.org website and they mentioned that there was apparently a port going on at one time but Apple apparently refused the licencing agreement.