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topgunn
Aug 16, 2006, 08:00 AM
Does anyone know if a Mac Pro will operate with 1 of the Xeons removed?



Mr. Mister
Aug 16, 2006, 08:25 AM
I've been wondering this as well, and I think it's possible but I'm sure as hell not gonna try it.

topgunn
Aug 16, 2006, 08:32 AM
I don't expect anyone with a Mac Pro to try this. Maybe someone with a little more knowledge of the 5000x chipset or multiprocessor systems in general could educate me a bit.

Mr. Mister
Aug 16, 2006, 08:35 AM
I think it's possible because single-proc Xeon systems can use dual-proc motherboards.

ampd
Aug 16, 2006, 01:13 PM
I remember this being brought up in one of my CS courses and it will still run normally without problems

Sun Baked
Aug 16, 2006, 01:16 PM
Something wrong with CHUD?

Zwhaler
Aug 16, 2006, 01:19 PM
Yay, lets make our Mac Pros slower.

Trekkie
Aug 16, 2006, 01:54 PM
Architecturally from the chipset perspective there is no reason you cannot run with one processor.

however they could have designed their firmware to go 'oh crap, i'm broken' when both aren't seen.

Mr. Mister
Aug 16, 2006, 02:16 PM
Yay, lets make our Mac Pros slower.
Perhaps some of us want to collect $800 in exchange for power that a small percentage of apps actually take advantage of?

CyberPrey
Aug 16, 2006, 02:23 PM
Tim "The Tool Man" Taylor would be very disturbed by that last statement.....

tipdrill407
Aug 16, 2006, 02:25 PM
Perhaps some of us want to collect $800 in exchange for power that a small percentage of apps actually take advantage of?

Would anyone actually pay $800 for a processor that's not brand new??

thegreatluke
Aug 16, 2006, 02:46 PM
Would anyone actually pay $800 for a processor that's not brand new??
The processors that the Mac Pros use cost about $800 each.

So one ripped out of a Mac Pro might get about $750 (just $50 off because of no box/whatever I guess and it's not NIB)

topgunn
Aug 16, 2006, 07:14 PM
A Mac Pro with one 2.66GHz processor would be faster than a dual processor 2.0GHz machine in 95% of the applications available. So someone can buy a dual 2.66GHz for $2499 ($2299 with edu discount) and get $700 for the unused CPU leaving them with the $1799 ($1599) "consumer" Mac Pro that so many people are clammering for.

bousozoku
Aug 16, 2006, 07:56 PM
Perhaps some of us want to collect $800 in exchange for power that a small percentage of apps actually take advantage of?

The operating system has been taking advantage of multiple processors for quite a long time. Isn't that enough?

Willis
Aug 16, 2006, 08:10 PM
i think it'd be a bit pointless though. and you'd have to be confident enough to pull it out to start with. i know i wouldnt even dream of it. all that power is why i would buy the machine to start with

risc
Aug 16, 2006, 08:20 PM
however they could have designed their firmware to go 'oh crap, i'm broken' when both aren't seen.

I work with multi processor Xeon boxes daily and I can see no reason for it not to work other than the great advice given above. As for selling them it might not be as easy as you think. Every tier 1 Xeon box I work with has a specific heat sink for that model of machine, and without the correct heat sink they aren't fitting in anywhere. So even if it does work you may have to drop your price by heaps if Apple use non-standard heatsinks. Which I would assume they do to keep the machine quiet.

Anonymous Freak
Aug 16, 2006, 11:29 PM
Anandtech successfully ran one with only one processor. They also ran it with only one 512 MB FB-DIMM. (Apple officially says memory must be installed in pairs.)

topgunn
Aug 17, 2006, 08:26 AM
Anandtech successfully ran one with only one processor. They also ran it with only one 512 MB FB-DIMM. (Apple officially says memory must be installed in pairs.)
From AnandTech, "The fifth configuration was the dual socket dual core Mac Pro 2.0GHz with one socket disabled, thus running as a dual core Mac Pro 2.0GHz." I take this to mean that they used CHUD to turn the CPU off, essentially. I don't think they physically removed the processor.

Bunsen Burner
Aug 17, 2006, 10:09 AM
Does anyone know if a Mac Pro will operate with 1 of the Xeons removed?

I do not think the 5000X chipset (http://www.intel.com/products/chipsets/5000x/index.htm) will allow it.

BB

Anonymous Freak
Aug 17, 2006, 11:31 AM
From AnandTech, "The fifth configuration was the dual socket dual core Mac Pro 2.0GHz with one socket disabled, thus running as a dual core Mac Pro 2.0GHz." I take this to mean that they used CHUD to turn the CPU off, essentially. I don't think they physically removed the processor.

Ah... Yeah, re-reading it, that does make sense.

I do not think the 5000X chipset will allow it.

I know from personal experience that the 5000X chipset will allow the computer to run with only a single processor. For more proof, look at the configurations from HP and Dell. Both sell 5000X-based workstations that are configurable with one or two processors.

Super Macho Man
Aug 17, 2006, 11:53 AM
Woodcrest isn't pin-compatible with Conroe, is it? If it is, you could take out both the procs, sell them, replace them with a midrange Conroe and end up a $1300 Mac with PCI slots.

topgunn
Aug 17, 2006, 11:59 AM
I do not think the 5000X chipset (http://www.intel.com/products/chipsets/5000x/index.htm) will allow it.

BB
I would think that Intel would want a machine like this to keep running if one of the processors was missing or failed. Its another redundant level of redundancy to insure that the machine will not crap out in the middle of a mission critical project. Not that CPU's fail out of the blue but it is still better to be safe than sorry.

Anonymous Freak
Aug 17, 2006, 12:04 PM
Woodcrest isn't pin-compatible with Conroe, is it? If it is, you could take out both the procs, sell them, replace them with a midrange Conroe and end up a $1300 Mac with PCI slots.

No, they are not. Woodcrest is a Xeon that uses the Xeon 771-pin socket. Conroe is a 'Core 2' chip that uses the 775-pin socket that had been used for Pentium (4/D/Extreme) processors.

And, of course, neither are compatible with Merom's 479-pin ('Core 1'-compatible) socket.

Silentwave
Aug 17, 2006, 12:22 PM
Woodcrest isn't pin-compatible with Conroe, is it? If it is, you could take out both the procs, sell them, replace them with a midrange Conroe and end up a $1300 Mac with PCI slots.


Not at all. LGA 771 for Woodcrest, LGA 775 for Conroe.
Oh yeah and they use different RAM too.

DavidC1
Aug 17, 2006, 08:13 PM
http://www.techreport.com/etc/2006q2/woodcrest/index.x?pg=9

Yes you can.

topgunn
Aug 17, 2006, 09:18 PM
http://www.techreport.com/etc/2006q2/woodcrest/index.x?pg=9

Yes you can.
Thanks for the link. Good find.

topgunn
Aug 23, 2006, 08:57 PM
I can confirm that it works.

55670

mrgreen4242
Aug 24, 2006, 08:41 AM
Hm, that's very interesting! I'd be even more interested to see of a lower priced (slower) chip gets released (a Core 3 Duo if you will)... I don't NEED 4 2+ghz high end cores. I do WANT a machine with upgradable GPU, extra HDD and optical bays, etc. I'd be pretty pleased with two Core Duo 1.6ghz type chips (so 4 1.6ghz cores) and a 7300GT... if these Xeon chips really ended up being resellable for even $700 each, that would get an edu priced model down to just $1k, add another $400 back in for some lesser CPUs and you'd have a really, really nice computer.

Why can't Apple do that? I'd pay $1500 for a dual Core Duo 1.66ghz Mac Pro in an instant. I mean like RIGHT NOW, I would leave work, drive the 70 miles to the Apple store and leave with one.

Of course, I'll probably buy a Mac Pro anyways (as soon as I can talk my wife into not killing me for it) and I'll find something completely unnessicary to do with all that power. Like encode all of my DVDs to H.264 files and set up some sort of media streaming center. :P

KingYaba
Aug 24, 2006, 02:15 PM
I doubt there is a market for these. Good luck selling for 700 bucks.

Trekkie
Aug 24, 2006, 02:23 PM
I doubt there is a market for these. Good luck selling for 700 bucks.

You've never sold anything on eBay have you?

There is *always* a market for something, getting $700? Doubt it, but I bet you could get $500 - $600

topgunn
Aug 24, 2006, 02:36 PM
As I said before, for what I do, a single dual core 2.66GHz CPU is faster than than a quad-core 2.0GHz setup. So, I bought the 2.66GHz machine and planned to sell one of the processors.

I need to get at least $400 for the CPU to break even with what I would have spent on the 2.0GHz machine. I plan on getting about $500 for it meaning I spent $100 less on my Mac Pro than I would have buying the low-end. And, if I decide that I ever want dual dual-core CPU's, I will go back and buy one off of eBay.

Worst case scenario is that it doesn't sell and I throw it back in the Mac Pro.

If anyone is interested, it is for sell on eBay here (http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ih=001&item=110025232020&rd=1&sspagename=STRK%3AMESE%3AIT&rd=1).

bbrosemer
Aug 24, 2006, 02:53 PM
The operating system has been taking advantage of multiple processors for quite a long time. Isn't that enough?
Not 4 though..Leopard will utilze them much better...