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Jman888
Jan 27, 2007, 11:00 AM
I really want a mac Mini and a new LCD But the Mac mini is Kinda Messed up.
I mean on the $600 Model You only get a Combo Drive but if you want to burn Dvd's You gotta get the $800 Model.
Shouldnt That be standard? I mean Most computors around that price have Dvd Burners..

-Also it only comes with 512Mb Of ram. That is clearly not enough to get by with having OSX (I use Macs 4Hours + A day and i know That much ram is torture) But thats amost ok...

-AND THE INTEGRATED GRAPHICS WTF!
I would own a mac Mini right now if it came with a Decent (Or atleast "OK" GPU) People always say that it cant be done or its a bad idea. But the old Mini had it and it was the first mac i really considered (But having a G4 was kinda holding me back..)I hate integrated graphics WTF is up with the Mini and the Macbook (oddly the only 2 macs i was considering)

-Oh and 80$ for a mouse and keyboard.

I want to switch to a mac (My daily time using them just makes me want one more.) But there is nothing that works for me.
Theres the mini that is perfect exept for those things.
Macbook thats a good price But still has integrated Graphics.
Imac with the built in screen
And MacPro & MacbookPro that cost too much for me.

If apple gave me a Mini With Dedicated Graphics With options for 128/256MB With a Dvd Burner and Lowered the cost of keyboard and mouse i would buy a mini. But i dont want integrated graphics (Main problem) And would like The current highend to be the new lowend. Also Wheres the core2??

Ok /rant Off But seriously apple needs a Non AIO Desktop that works.



aaronw1986
Jan 27, 2007, 12:14 PM
Sounds like an iMac is really what you are looking for...

Jman888
Jan 27, 2007, 12:19 PM
Sounds like an iMac is really what you are looking for...

I dont want the imacs screen..

thejadedmonkey
Jan 27, 2007, 12:27 PM
I really want a mac Mini and a new LCD But the Mac mini is Kinda Messed up.

Bennin your parden?:rolleyes:

Jman888
Jan 27, 2007, 12:29 PM
Bennin your parden?:rolleyes:
?
http://accessories.us.dell.com/sna/productdetail.aspx?c=us&l=en&s=dhs&cs=19&sku=320-5205 < Me want

JAT
Jan 27, 2007, 12:58 PM
The graphics on the current Mini are better than on the old one. Do you actually know what integrated graphics means?

Sounds like you want a 24" iMac. i'm sure you would be quite pleased.

Jman888
Jan 27, 2007, 01:04 PM
The graphics on the current Mini are better than on the old one. Do you actually know what integrated graphics means?

Sounds like you want a 24" iMac. i'm sure you would be quite pleased.
minus the screen + upgradeability if i go that way..

Jasonbot
Jan 27, 2007, 01:04 PM
As said so many times before, the mac mini has its place. What you want is a headless iMac AKA:G4 Cube II this WILL NOT happen, or at leaqst no one ever knows what ol McSteve has in his bag of tricks.

Dont Hurt Me
Jan 27, 2007, 01:12 PM
Integrated means Cheap, make no mistake, It costs near nothing for Apple(less then $4) and it lines the pockets of its CEO's and Apples bank account. Its maxed out by its current cpu's so even if it gets a faster CPU like core2 it will make little difference in stuff such as gaming. Its crippling for imac sales and little else.
Apple went forward with better cpu's and backwards with its integrated graphics that cant even run shaders, etc. Its crap in gaming. Get ready for the fan club who will say how great it is but never ever have benches to prove it. My suggestion is iMac and if you own a decent display go find a Dell or HP tower.

zap2
Jan 27, 2007, 01:20 PM
Integrated means Cheap, make no mistake, It costs near nothing for Apple(less then $4) and it lines the pockets of its CEO's and Apples bank account. Its maxed out by its current cpu's so even if it gets a faster CPU like core2 it will make little difference in stuff such as gaming. Its crippling for imac sales and little else.
Apple went forward with better cpu's and backwards with its integrated graphics that cant even run shaders, etc. Its crap in gaming. Get ready for the fan club who will say how great it is but never ever have benches to prove it. My suggestion is iMac and if you own a decent display go find a Dell or HP tower.

PC gamerzzzzzz ownzz

Its better then the old Minis...again if you want games, don't buy a Mini!

roland.g
Jan 27, 2007, 01:21 PM
Sorry, but you can get a 1.66 with Superdrive (the high end before the speed bump) for $649 or the current 1.83 for $699, both as refurbs from the Apple Store. Back when it was a 1.5 Core Solo and a 1.66 Core Duo, the Core Solo had a DVD burner option for $50. So for the same $649 you get a refurb with the burner, but a Core Duo. For $100 less than retail you get the 1.83. Buy yourself some RAM from OWC or somewhere, either 1 or 2GB and throw it in yourself. Very easy. As far as the graphics. I have a Mini, and the graphics are just fine. What are you using it for that you need a dedicated card? If you tell me you want to BootCamp it for Windows games, then I have no sympathy for you. If you are using photo or video editing then the graphics are just fine, it's the RAM you need. And if you are doing any 3D animation or something you really need graphics power for, then the Mini is not the right machine for you and it sounds like you want power for cheap. Sorry but good products aren't given away. As far as your Mouse and Keyboard, you can use any USB ones so use something you have or get a something cheaper. The Mac Mini setup isn't expensive. I won't lie to you, it is overpriced for what you get to some point, especially when you consider what the iMacs give you for the price. I too don't want an all in one, but the Mac Pro is overkill, and there is no midrange tower. I was hoping to see one at MWSF, but since there wasn't, I will end up with a 24" iMac when Leopard comes out. And if there was I would hook it up to a 23" Apple Display before you ever got a Dell LCD in my house. As for you sig. It's more whining about price and features than an actual rant. :D

passedpast
Jan 27, 2007, 02:15 PM
There are a lot of us out here waiting for Apple to come out with something to plug into our HDTVs. Apple TVs shortcomings make me hesitant on buying it. Hopefully sometime this year Apple will update the Mini to have either HDMI or component out along with a dedicated graphics card. An updated bluetooth keyboard with a trackpad would be nice ala the one Sony is including with its new VAIO mini computer.

SMM
Jan 27, 2007, 02:22 PM
Integrated means Cheap, make no mistake, It costs near nothing for Apple(less then $4) and it lines the pockets of its CEO's and Apples bank account. Its maxed out by its current cpu's so even if it gets a faster CPU like core2 it will make little difference in stuff such as gaming. Its crippling for imac sales and little else.
Apple went forward with better cpu's and backwards with its integrated graphics that cant even run shaders, etc. Its crap in gaming. Get ready for the fan club who will say how great it is but never ever have benches to prove it. My suggestion is iMac and if you own a decent display go find a Dell or HP tower.

So, who says the Mini is targeted for the gaming market? Obviously it is not. What it is becoming very good for is entry-level and a general business desktop. And for that it does very well.

SMM
Jan 27, 2007, 02:28 PM
There are a lot of us out here waiting for Apple to come out with something to plug into our HDTVs. Apple TVs shortcomings make me hesitant on buying it. Hopefully sometime this year Apple will update the Mini to have either HDMI or component out along with a dedicated graphics card. An updated bluetooth keyboard with a trackpad would be nice ala the one Sony is including with its new VAIO mini computer.

The Mini does not come with a keyboard. But, you can run any kind you want. What are the ATV's shortcomings? Oops, never mind, this thread is about the Mini.

srf4real
Jan 27, 2007, 02:36 PM
my g4 mini rocks. I'm not a gamer and use an external dvd burner, but my shiny new :apple: only set me back $500. Got to pick my own choice for peripherals... I'm lovin it for going on two years now!:) (did upgrade to 1 gig ram.)

Tinhead
Jan 27, 2007, 02:36 PM
?
http://accessories.us.dell.com/sna/productdetail.aspx?c=us&l=en&s=dhs&cs=19&sku=320-5205 < Me want

Seems that monitor has the same resolution as a typical 20-incher, why not get 23-24" with higher res instead?

macjonny1
Jan 27, 2007, 03:21 PM
People mention having HDMI in the mini as being important. What would that do for someone that the DVI and optical audio out cant? You can get a cheap DVI/HDMI adapter and there you go? Is there something I'm missing?

I'd like to see the mini be able to have the horsepower to handle an external HD-DVD or bluray drive, as I don't think it would now. In that case, I guess the HDMI for copy protection is necessary?

dornoforpyros
Jan 27, 2007, 03:27 PM
ahh and more people still don't understand the purpose of a mini. Next it'll be "how come the mini doesn't have more than 1 harddrive bay?"

macjonny1
Jan 27, 2007, 03:57 PM
I do understand the purpose of the mini, but that doesn't mean you cant want it to do something it can't. The mini has since the beginning been something that people wanted to turn into some sort of entertainment hub. For example, it wouldnt need that much more (i.e. a grafx card) to be able to process HD content from an external drive. You could make the enclosure a little bit bigger to fit it if necessary and have the option for one. You would then expand the market for it greatly.

I really think apple will eventually move to something like this as they get more involved with consumer electronics, but it may just be wishful thinking.

Jman888
Jan 27, 2007, 04:33 PM
ahh and more people still don't understand the purpose of a mini. Next it'll be "how come the mini doesn't have more than 1 harddrive bay?"
I understand the purpose of the mini i just am mad apple doesnt have what i need. I may end up with a dell... All i really want is a Superdrive Mini with Dedicated Graphics. Not OMGWTFBBQ 8800GTX SLI'd or something Like that. Just something that can handle Newish Games at 1024 x 768 With Decent FPS. The imacs x1600 Would Be perfect (OR as said. (On my Blog (http://deadant.org/blog/?p=13) a x1400 would even work.(Even though a lot of that is farfetched but i know it would cause apple to gain marketshare. I know dozens of people who would kill for that stuff. )
Im just saying i want to switch but apple offers me only
Macmini - almost perfect but... Combodrive And GMA_950?
Imac - Good Specs but i prefer my own Screen..
Mac Pro - Amazing And perfect in every way.. Exept Price
Then what do i have to choose from..A Dell?

I say bring back the cube..

iW00t
Jan 27, 2007, 07:12 PM
PC gamerzzzzzz ownzz

Its better then the old Minis...again if you want games, don't buy a Mac!

Fixed that for you.

GPUs on Apple computers exist for the sole purpose of pimping Apple's extravagent eye candy. They don't exist to play those 3 games that sit in your local Applecentre. It is a fact. :p

aristobrat
Jan 27, 2007, 07:20 PM
AND THE INTEGRATED GRAPHICS WTF!
You mean the integrated graphics that can run Aero on Vista (which quite a few of the dedicated Windows video cards can't)?

Jman888
Jan 27, 2007, 08:33 PM
Fixed that for you.

GPUs on Apple computers exist for the sole purpose of pimping Apple's extravagent eye candy. They don't exist to play those 3 games that sit in your local Applecentre. It is a fact. :p

Im not a real serious gamer (Heck im running Linux) But there is that occasional game i would like to play (UT2K7 Seems to be the Next) That i would like to play. Why cant Apple make their machines with Decent Graphics cards? (Other than pro) Im sure they are losing a lot of Customers solely because of that. I mean Bootcamp seems like it makes the whole game issue a non issue but without the power to power it...
Ah well. guess i'll get a dell :(

psychofreak
Jan 27, 2007, 08:38 PM
I reccomend that you get a second hand powermac g5...good for games, and cheaper than a Mac Pro

Jman888
Jan 27, 2007, 08:56 PM
I reccomend that you get a second hand powermac g5...good for games, and cheaper than a Mac Pro

Windows?

Look once apple makes a mid-Desktop and a faster mini ima have some problems. :mad:

Gordy
Jan 28, 2007, 05:24 AM
I've actually got two mac mini's in the house, 1 g4 1.42ghz one and a new 1.83ghz Core Duo one, but neither are my main machine that is still a mini-itx pc (Same type of chip as the intel mini's but with dedicated ATI card).

I'd love to switch to a mini for my main rig, but the OP got the nail on the head with the graphics. Thats the deal killer for me. Something like x1600 in there and I'd buy one in a heart beat.

The mini form fact is superb, yes if they could find a way of squeezing a full sized hdd in there it would be even better, but I'm not bothered by that.

Jman888
Jan 28, 2007, 07:10 AM
I've actually got two mac mini's in the house, 1 g4 1.42ghz one and a new 1.83ghz Core Duo one, but neither are my main machine that is still a mini-itx pc (Same type of chip as the intel mini's but with dedicated ATI card).

I'd love to switch to a mini for my main rig, but the OP got the nail on the head with the graphics. Thats the deal killer for me. Something like x1600 in there and I'd buy one in a heart beat.

The mini form fact is superb, yes if they could find a way of squeezing a full sized hdd in there it would be even better, but I'm not bothered by that.
Amen. Any GPU would really do it for me. I just dont wanna waste Ram and have laggy Graphics. (Specially in Photoshop where i saw CD imacs Lag (with GMA_950 ) And no i wasnt doing anything intese either.

Chundles
Jan 28, 2007, 07:13 AM
Amen. Any GPU would really do it for me. I just dont wanna waste Ram and have laggy Graphics. (Specially in Photoshop where i saw CD imacs Lag (with GMA_950 ) And no i wasnt doing anything intese either.

Photoshop doesn't use the graphics processor - it doesn't, no it really doesn't. The reason Photoshop lags on CD minis is because it's running in Rosetta.

The only place you're going to need something with more grunt than the GMA950 is in 3D games and video compositing apps. Anything else is processor, not GPU, bound.

As soon as Photoshop goes Universal it's performance on Intel Mac minis will destroy it's performance on G4 minis.

Blue Velvet
Jan 28, 2007, 07:13 AM
...I just dont wanna waste Ram and have laggy Graphics. (Specially in Photoshop where i saw CD imacs Lag (with GMA_950 )


The graphics card doesn't affect Photoshop performance. What you saw was Photoshop running through Rosetta on a Core Duo iMac.

Edit: Beaten by Chundles, but I'll say it again anyway. :D

JAT
Jan 28, 2007, 08:53 AM
www.dell.com

It's waiting for you. Enjoy.

JBazz
Jan 28, 2007, 09:02 AM
Help me out here, you want the bottom line mac desktop....but you want it full of upgrades that you dont want to pay for? Um, okay. :confused:

If you dont like having to pay for the upgrades you want or what the bottom line mini offers, then you really dont want a mini. So, whats the problem?

roland.g
Jan 28, 2007, 12:45 PM
Im not a real serious gamer (Heck im running Linux) But there is that occasional game i would like to play (UT2K7 Seems to be the Next) That i would like to play. Why cant Apple make their machines with Decent Graphics cards? (Other than pro) Im sure they are losing a lot of Customers solely because of that. I mean Bootcamp seems like it makes the whole game issue a non issue but without the power to power it...
Ah well. guess i'll get a dell :(

Actually, it's the other way around. Bootcamp made the whole game issue an issue because before you couldn't run PC games on a Mac so no one really said too much at all about graphics. Little to nothing. Now that you can run windows, it seems all most people, translate kids, want to do is play games on it which IMHO is what Xboxs and PSs are for, and so everyone is now complaining about the GPU. They still live in the dell, gateway, hp world where they get cheap computers that are cheaply made, and they don't want to spend the money on a decent computer that comes loaded with a lot more than any pc. We can talk about the need for a mid-tower till the cows come home, but Apple doesn't offer one. So get an iMac that satisfies your GPU need and don't cry about the AIO, or get a MacBook Pro or Mac Pro. Otherwise Dell is still there with open arms waiting to sell you a black box thing.

Help me out here, you want the bottom line mac desktop....but you want it full of upgrades that you dont want to pay for? Um, okay. :confused:

If you dont like having to pay for the upgrades you want or what the bottom line mini offers, then you really dont want a mini. So, whats the problem?

Exactamundo.

Jman888
Jan 28, 2007, 05:02 PM
Actually, it's the other way around. Bootcamp made the whole game issue an issue because before you couldn't run PC games on a Mac so no one really said too much at all about graphics. Little to nothing. Now that you can run windows, it seems all most people, translate kids, want to do is play games on it which IMHO is what Xboxs and PSs are for, and so everyone is now complaining about the GPU. They still live in the dell, gateway, hp world where they get cheap computers that are cheaply made, and they don't want to spend the money on a decent computer that comes loaded with a lot more than any pc. We can talk about the need for a mid-tower till the cows come home, but Apple doesn't offer one. So get an iMac that satisfies your GPU need and don't cry about the AIO, or get a MacBook Pro or Mac Pro. Otherwise Dell is still there with open arms waiting to sell you a black box thing.


Exactamundo.Did'nt i say i would pay for the upgrades??
I would pay +200 Just for Dedicated Graphics i mean apple offers no real consumer desktop without a screen. Im still getting a mini but i know apple goes to a lot of sites (If you read some people blogs when they post who goes to the site you see sometimes apple Goes to apple related sites.. Or somebody from ***.apple.com So if they see this they would know GMA pisses people off (I dont game either but more and more Programs are becoming GPU leveraged because.. They are. I mean look at Itunes on windows Part of it needs a DirectX9 VideoCard (Coverflow) And all of it lags on Pc's With crap graphics..
Oh well im buying a mini anyway but i will never forgive apple for the GPU choices.(Ask any pc owner. The GPU's Even before bootcamp hold them back)

sycho
Jan 28, 2007, 05:14 PM
Windows?

Look once apple makes a mid-Desktop and a faster mini ima have some problems. :mad:

www.dell.com

they try to give you ideas, you continued to bitch, so, yeah, i'm pretty much saying go there and shut up.

Gordy
Jan 28, 2007, 05:24 PM
www.dell.com

It's waiting for you. Enjoy.

www.dell.com

they try to give you ideas, you continued to bitch, so, yeah, i'm pretty much saying go there and shut up.

God people like you on here make me mad, whats the point in posts like that.
Just because someone has a different idea of what they want from the mini doesn't mean they want a dell.:rolleyes:

The OP wants something that is more than possible to add to the mini. They don't want an iMac they want a mini. They want something that would drastically increase the sales of the mini to new mac switchers something apple are already actively seeking to do.

SMM
Jan 28, 2007, 05:47 PM
God people like you on here make me mad, whats the point in posts like that.
Just because someone has a different idea of what they want from the mini doesn't mean they want a dell.:rolleyes:

The OP wants something that is more than possible to add to the mini. They don't want an iMac they want a mini. They want something that would drastically increase the sales of the mini to new mac switchers something apple are already actively seeking to do.

No, he wants to get on here and rant (words from his own mouth). If he wants Apple to change the configuration of their products, he needs to contact the only source that can do it...Apple. The other posters have been very patient with this guy. They have explained who the Mini is marketed for. They explained what his current options are. All of this to no avail. He wants to complain, continue with this incessant whining, and not accept the good information he has been given. Now some people are tired of his ranting and are suggesting that no further benefit is being derived for him, or them either.

If you have a solution for him that will close this and satisfy him, please bring it forward. Everyone else has seemed to fail, and not through a lack of trying.

aristobrat
Jan 28, 2007, 05:52 PM
The OP is buying a mini.

Thread closed.

(Hey JMAN888, update your signature!)

timswim78
Jan 28, 2007, 05:57 PM
I really want a mac Mini and a new LCD But the Mac mini is Kinda Messed up.
I mean on the $600 Model You only get a Combo Drive but if you want to burn Dvd's You gotta get the $800 Model.
Shouldnt That be standard? I mean Most computors around that price have Dvd Burners..

-Also it only comes with 512Mb Of ram. That is clearly not enough to get by with having OSX (I use Macs 4Hours + A day and i know That much ram is torture) But thats amost ok...

-AND THE INTEGRATED GRAPHICS WTF!
I would own a mac Mini right now if it came with a Decent (Or atleast "OK" GPU) People always say that it cant be done or its a bad idea. But the old Mini had it and it was the first mac i really considered (But having a G4 was kinda holding me back..)I hate integrated graphics WTF is up with the Mini and the Macbook (oddly the only 2 macs i was considering)

-Oh and 80$ for a mouse and keyboard.

I want to switch to a mac (My daily time using them just makes me want one more.) But there is nothing that works for me.
Theres the mini that is perfect exept for those things.
Macbook thats a good price But still has integrated Graphics.
Imac with the built in screen
And MacPro & MacbookPro that cost too much for me.

If apple gave me a Mini With Dedicated Graphics With options for 128/256MB With a Dvd Burner and Lowered the cost of keyboard and mouse i would buy a mini. But i dont want integrated graphics (Main problem) And would like The current highend to be the new lowend. Also Wheres the core2??

Ok /rant Off But seriously apple needs a Non AIO Desktop that works.

You make great points. The mini is overpriced, considering its hardware and the price points of Apple's other hardware.

Yes, it should have more RAM and a superdrive at the $600 price point.

I'm not too concerned about the integrated video as long as it can run all of the eye candy in Leopard.

shu82
Jan 28, 2007, 06:23 PM
The only reason people consider it overpriced is because it is about to get an update. Steve waits for his peeps to get their fill of the current line (gross sales wise) then he brings out the new stuff. Just wait 2 months, just 2 months, maybe one, god thats only 4 weeks, I can do that right, right, RIGHT, ......BAD SHU WAIT. Ok now I feel better.

Jman888
Jan 28, 2007, 08:38 PM
No, he wants to get on here and rant (words from his own mouth). If he wants Apple to change the configuration of their products, he needs to contact the only source that can do it...Apple. The other posters have been very patient with this guy. They have explained who the Mini is marketed for. They explained what his current options are. All of this to no avail. He wants to complain, continue with this incessant whining, and not accept the good information he has been given. Now some people are tired of his ranting and are suggesting that no further benefit is being derived for him, or them either.

If you have a solution for him that will close this and satisfy him, please bring it forward. Everyone else has seemed to fail, and not through a lack of trying.
I still want the mini i just know more programs are leveraging against the gpu thesedays. I'll still get one but ima wait a few months(Intels coming out with something new in june so.. )

Edit: Sig Fixed

@Shu
I hope your right. Im still switching but i thought about a macbook but... Eh.

aristobrat
Jan 28, 2007, 09:01 PM
I still want the mini i just know more programs are leveraging against the gpu thesedays.
Out of curiosity, other than games, do you have any other examples of OS X consumer programs that would fit your comment above?

AFAIK,

Coverflow in iTunes
All of OS X's core image eye-candy
HD movies from apple.com/trailers
(and even though not a consumer application) Photoshop

all run well enough on the mini/MacBooks integrated graphics.

And oddly enough, so does the Aero eye-candy feature of Vista, something that quite a few of dedicated Windows graphics cards can't pull off.

roland.g
Jan 28, 2007, 09:04 PM
All whatever aside, here's to hoping that Apple gives us that midrange tower that a lot of us really want.

I have: a Mac Mini 1.66 refurb, 2GB RAM added, miniStack 500GB HDD that my dad wants to buy off me to hook to his plasma.

I had: a G4 450 'sawtooth' for 6 1/2 years that I could no longer use, so I got the Mini as an interim knowing my dad would buy it.

I want: a 'Mac Pro Jr.' - dedicated graphics, 2 3.5" SATA II HDD bays, 4 RAM slots supporting up to 8GB (or at least 4 to 6), one optical drive, and an extra PCI slot (though I honestly don't know what I'd use it for, maybe TV), all in a larger than the Mini smaller than a Mac Pro, sexy anodized silver case. I don't care if it is a Conroe, a Xeon (giving me two cores, not four), but prefer it not be a Core 2 Duo since Meroms have already hit the 2.33 ceiling. And I will hook that to a beautiful 23" Apple Cinema Display (no Dell flat-panels thank you).

I will settle for: a 24" iMac, either 2.16 or 2.33, 2GB RAM, 7600GT 256MB, 500GB HDD, (preferably in Black or Silver - but I will take white), because I am getting a machine as soon as Leopard is released. And if what I want comes out at WWDC in June, I will sell the iMac and get it as such is life.

eenu
Jan 28, 2007, 09:04 PM
God people like you on here make me mad, whats the point in posts like that.
Just because someone has a different idea of what they want from the mini doesn't mean they want a dell.:rolleyes:

The OP wants something that is more than possible to add to the mini. They don't want an iMac they want a mini. They want something that would drastically increase the sales of the mini to new mac switchers something apple are already actively seeking to do.

ohhhh look its Gordy from KustomPcs Forum.....

The issue with the original poster is his constant moaning over several posts. I got the fact he was unhappy with GMA right back up on the first page.

To the OP, i can't understand your issue with the iMac built in screen. As the owner of a 24" iMac which also powers a Dell 20" widescreen i can tell you now the Apple panel craps on the Dell. IMHO the iMac would be better for you than the Mini. If your that bothered about a Dell monitor get one of those as well!

Yukinara
Jan 28, 2007, 09:19 PM
Grrrr, Core Duo and GMA,that is the stupidest combination of ever.Both MacMini and MacBook are beautiful,but just look at their specs make me feel like.....%$^&*

whenever I think about it,I feel it's not balance,the C2D is powerful,but GMA is crap.And people need Mac to edit video like me need GPU than CPU
Well,at least,they should put in some decent GPU

aristobrat
Jan 28, 2007, 09:32 PM
And people need Mac to edit video like me need GPU than CPU
I had no problems using iMovie to edit video video from my JVC camcorder. That was a Core Duo (not Core 2 Duo) MacBook.

Are you trying to run something like Final Cut Pro on a mini/MacBook?

Gordy
Jan 29, 2007, 05:06 AM
ohhhh look its Gordy from KustomPcs Forum.....

The issue with the original poster is his constant moaning over several posts. I got the fact he was unhappy with GMA right back up on the first page.

To the OP, i can't understand your issue with the iMac built in screen. As the owner of a 24" iMac which also powers a Dell 20" widescreen i can tell you now the Apple panel craps on the Dell. IMHO the iMac would be better for you than the Mini. If your that bothered about a Dell monitor get one of those as well!

And whats my membership of other forums got to do with this, not to mention thats a really bad example as I've not posted their in some years...

I still fail to see what pointing someone to dell's website has to do with this thread at all...

Its clear from this thread alone,that he's not alone in wanting something more from the mini.

Jman888
Jan 29, 2007, 05:51 AM
Out of curiosity, other than games, do you have any other examples of OS X consumer programs that would fit your comment above?

AFAIK,

Coverflow in iTunes
All of OS X's core image eye-candy
HD movies from apple.com/trailers
(and even though not a consumer application) Photoshop

all run well enough on the mini/MacBooks integrated graphics.

And oddly enough, so does the Aero eye-candy feature of Vista, something that quite a few of dedicated Windows graphics cards can't pull off.
Well when i boot into windows i see more and more programs going eyecandy crazy and some programs use the GPU more. And all people are saying now that GPU's are getting more powerful Programs will use them a lot more.

But if the whole reason Photoshop Ect. Ran like crap was "Rossetta?" Then i guess ill be fine.

Edit:Also why do they make it so hard to open? Ive seen videos and it looks like crap to open. I dont wanna pay apple 300 For a ram upgrade (Especcially because Newegg has 1Gb For 86$ Or had it last time i checked. Actually ram has gone up in price because of vista :p )

Sol
Jan 29, 2007, 07:06 AM
No one has mentioned there is another Intel GPU on the horizon. It is not going to blow your eye-balls with graphics effects but it will run 3D engines faster than the current GPU.

One thing I do not like about the Intel GPU is that it uses the same RAM as the OS and applications. 2 GB is too expensive and 1 GB is hardly enough if several applications are open, especially if they are big like Photoshop or Final Cut Express.

The Mac Mini could be great if it ever gets either an HD-DVD or BD optical drive. Yes, it would cost more than stand-alone players, or a PS3, but it would be a lot more functional.

Chundles
Jan 29, 2007, 07:33 AM
Well when i boot into windows i see more and more programs going eyecandy crazy and some programs use the GPU more. And all people are saying now that GPU's are getting more powerful Programs will use them a lot more.

But if the whole reason Photoshop Ect. Ran like crap was "Rossetta?" Then i guess ill be fine.

Edit:Also why do they make it so hard to open? Ive seen videos and it looks like crap to open. I dont wanna pay apple 300 For a ram upgrade (Especcially because Newegg has 1Gb For 86$ Or had it last time i checked. Actually ram has gone up in price because of vista :p )

Photoshop ran like crap because the current version of Photoshop was only ever designed to run on PowerPC processors. Apple implemented an emulation layer that translates the PowerPC instructions from the application into Intel instructions for the system. All this translation to and from the hardware means there is a significant performance hit (less with more RAM) but in all fairness I think it's amazing something so complex as Photoshop or Office:mac can run at the speed they do on a system they were never designed for in the first place.

Adobe Creative Suite 3 and Office:mac 2008 will both be out this year and will be Universal binaries. Then you'll see just how much faster that Core Duo Mac mini is than the old G4 mini.

Where is an upgrade to 1GB of RAM on the apple.com online store that costs $300?

The Mac mini comes with 512MB (2x256MB) standard, to upgrade to 1GB (2x512MB) costs US$75 and to upgrade to 2GB (2x1GB) will cost $250 so yes you can save money by buying 2 of those $86 1GB sticks but then you have to open the case yourself and hope to hell that cheap RAM isn't "cheap" RAM.

Or you could buy just one 1GB stick and upgrade to 1.25GB - you'll lose dual-channel but the extra RAM would negate the extra system speed.

CptnJustc
Jan 29, 2007, 07:56 AM
To answer the OP, I'm guessing sometime after April-ish, when Santa Rosa (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Centrino#Santa_Rosa_platform_.282007.29) comes out, with its new GPU.

Since I currently use my Mini as a server / HTPC, I can't wait for one to come out that's Blu-Ray / HD-DVD capable. And since I play a little Warcraft on it, that hardware T&L wouldn't hurt, either. :D

shikimo
Jan 29, 2007, 08:35 AM
Seems pretty likely to me that there will be a minor mini upgrade quite soon, just so it doesn't become any more glaringly overpriced than it already has, but this will not satisfy the OP: Like many others, I expect C2Ds for sure, and probably some minor rearrangement of specs and prices to make it just a bit less of a ripoff, but nothing else until there's a major change in Apple's consumer-end headless plans. An earlier post correctly observed that the current minis (like most macs) were a good deal when they came out, but time moves on, stuff gets better, prices drop, and yesterday's great deal is todays white elephant...so it goes.

Magnus Reftel
Jan 29, 2007, 08:49 AM
As said so many times before, the mac mini has its place. What you want is a headless iMac AKA:G4 Cube II this WILL NOT happen, or at leaqst no one ever knows what ol McSteve has in his bag of tricks.

The Cube is an old acquaintance which has not been forgot... ;-)

Jman888
Jan 29, 2007, 08:55 AM
Photoshop ran like crap because the current version of Photoshop was only ever designed to run on PowerPC processors. Apple implemented an emulation layer that translates the PowerPC instructions from the application into Intel instructions for the system. All this translation to and from the hardware means there is a significant performance hit (less with more RAM) but in all fairness I think it's amazing something so complex as Photoshop or Office:mac can run at the speed they do on a system they were never designed for in the first place.

Adobe Creative Suite 3 and Office:mac 2008 will both be out this year and will be Universal binaries. Then you'll see just how much faster that Core Duo Mac mini is than the old G4 mini.

Where is an upgrade to 1GB of RAM on the apple.com online store that costs $300?

The Mac mini comes with 512MB (2x256MB) standard, to upgrade to 1GB (2x512MB) costs US$75 and to upgrade to 2GB (2x1GB) will cost $250 so yes you can save money by buying 2 of those $86 1GB sticks but then you have to open the case yourself and hope to hell that cheap RAM isn't "cheap" RAM.

Or you could buy just one 1GB stick and upgrade to 1.25GB - you'll lose dual-channel but the extra RAM would negate the extra system speed.
Yeah its $75 Dollars to 1Gb so i would get that. but i still think $250 Is to much for 2gb Because a little while ago they had Kingston Ram For 86$ (After Rebate) But of course Vista brought it back up so i guess 250 isnt so bad anymore (Still about 50$ Extra but worth it not to have to break into it.

My problem with the GMA was my relization that after it was all said and done i would Pay about $1200 (Superdrive Mini + 2Gigs + Wireles KeyBoard and Mouse + HD Enclosure for a 7200 RPM drive) So i had problems knowing that i would still have Integrated graphics..

Also i was just in a bad mood yesterday because i lost my ipod (It was under a CD Case) And was in a REAL bad mood (Why didnt i look where it would be obvious...)

Edit: Santa Rosa is looking Good. I just hope the x3000 Is ok. But it really doesnt bother me anymore.

Dont Hurt Me
Jan 29, 2007, 09:04 AM
The GMA 3000 isnt going to be much more then a slight step up from a Gma 950. Add the shaders and ability to use the new graphic capabilities but its still not going to match a real GPU. Those waiting for this next integrated graphics from Intel & Apple are going to be dissappointed if they think its going to vastly improve the graphic situation on Mini. Im talking 3d now not 2d that no one measures or cares about. Integrated graphics are what they are. A cheap way to run your display.

CptnJustc
Jan 29, 2007, 09:14 AM
The GMA 3000 isnt going to be much more then a slight step up from a Gma 950. Add the shaders and ability to use the new graphic capabilities but its still not going to match a real GPU. Those waiting for this next integrated graphics from Intel & Apple are going to be dissappointed if they think its going to vastly improve the graphic situation on Mini. Im talking 3d now not 2d that no one measures or cares about. Integrated graphics are what they are. A cheap way to run your display.

I have no doubt it won't match dedicated graphics cards, but with the hardware T&L and significant speed boost, it should be a fair bit of an upgrade as far as gaming (considering the very, very low bar the 950 sets). It should certainly make WoW prettier and smoother. Yes, it's an older game, but the only one I care about. :D

eenu
Jan 29, 2007, 09:18 AM
My statement about the kustompcs forum was a straight 'oh look i recognise you' no malice intended, though gordys suspect response does make me wonder what he is hiding ;)

Gordy as for directing the user to Dell.....have you read the thread? The OP keeps going on about not wanting an iMac as he wants a Dell monitor! If you read my post i was not sending him to Dell! People reading a thread properly before posting would go down a treat on this forum.

Gordy
Jan 29, 2007, 09:30 AM
My statement about the kustompcs forum was a straight 'oh look i recognise you' no malice intended, though gordys suspect response does make me wonder what he is hiding ;)

Gordy as for directing the user to Dell.....have you read the thread? The OP keeps going on about not wanting an iMac as he wants a Dell monitor! If you read my post i was not sending him to Dell! People reading a thread properly before posting would go down a treat on this forum.

If you would care to read the two people's post who I quoted re the dell links again you yourself might learn something...

Why bother posting something about me being a member on kustompcs as follows: "ohhhh look its Gordy from KustomPcs Forum....." If it was because you recognized me from their why not just say that?

And then you follow it with trying to make a point I have something to hide seriously whats the heck is your point?


Back on topic:

It's not just about 3d performance in games that require the better graphics in the mini. The 2d quality is no where near as good with the mini's graphics. Its no where near as clean or crisp as the say the x1600 in the macbook pro.

CptnJustc
Jan 29, 2007, 09:31 AM
ohhhh look its Gordy from KustomPcs Forum.....
To the OP, i can't understand your issue with the iMac built in screen. As the owner of a 24" iMac which also powers a Dell 20" widescreen i can tell you now the Apple panel craps on the Dell. IMHO the iMac would be better for you than the Mini. If your that bothered about a Dell monitor get one of those as well!

Is that right? iMac screens must have improved greatly since I got my G5 (which of course is entirely possible). But there are good reasons for wanting to keep your CPU and screen separate, and the Dell does provide a few more features -- multiple inputs, PiP, USB ports... if you're into that sort of thing.

roland.g
Jan 29, 2007, 09:35 AM
Has anyone really heard otherwise? Last I checked Santa Rosa was delayed from April to end of summer.

If that is the case it will still be interesting to see what Apple does since neither the iMac or Mini can wait that long for some sort of revision. Likewise it would be unrealistic that the MacBook goes that long too. However there really are no new chips or speeds available. Will Apple put 2.33 Meroms in the iMacs standard and bump the MacBook to 2.16 and 2.33s just to have a slight update as well as finally dropping 2.0 C2Ds into the Mini. The next five weeks will prove interesting. It is doubtful Apple will go through February by doing nothing more than shipping :apple:TV and the Airport Extreme. And I don't think an event to announce Leopard and iLife features and ship dates will do either. Something in the way of computer hardware has to be in the pipeline. Though MacPros are now the oldest and 8-core machines are virtually a lock. That could get Apple through to late March or early April before updating the consumer lines.

...then again, 8-core MacPros, iLife and Leopard, iPhone, and one more thing... the MacPro Jr. could let Apple skate by till a September Santa Rosa and November Penryns for the iMacs and notebooks!

eenu
Jan 29, 2007, 09:35 AM
If you would care to read the two people's post who I quoted re the dell links again you yourself might learn something...

Why bother posting something about me being a member on kustompcs as follows: "ohhhh look its Gordy from KustomPcs Forum....." If it was because you recognized me from their why not just say that?

And then you follow it with trying to make a point I have something to hide seriously whats the heck is your point?


Back on topic:

It's not just about 3d performance in games that require the better graphics in the mini. The 2d quality is no where near as good with the mini's graphics. Its no where near as clean or crisp as the say the x1600 in the macbook pro.

I did read them Gordy i also saw that they followed the OPs whine that he wanted a Dell monitor! So to be honest they had a point! Well at leat the first one did, didn't need a second link.

Why you getting so heated Gordy....both your responses have been snappy and rude! If you noticed there was a 'winky' emicon after my 'something to hide' comment it was a joke in reference to your previous snappy post.

So please feel free to spit my head out and hand it back....

Is that right? iMac screens must have improved greatly since I got my G5 (which of course is entirely possible). But there are good reasons for wanting to keep your CPU and screen separate, and the Dell does provide a few more features -- multiple inputs, PiP, USB ports... if you're into that sort of thing.

Well i think that is correct of the 24" iMac, i have used 17" G5s where i would say my Dell is better. Also at the end of the day my post was trying to say that the iMac has the hardware he wants and he can still output to a Dell monitor if he wants....even if the iMac screen croaked it.

CptnJustc
Jan 29, 2007, 10:24 AM
Has anyone really heard otherwise? Last I checked Santa Rosa was delayed from April to end of summer.


Is that so? Hadn't heard. Got a link?

If so, that would be a shame... it is a long time to wait, both for me and for Apple. On the other hand, I don't need it to have too much more power... I'm just crossing my fingers and hoping that the next revision supports at least one type of high-def DVDs.

roland.g
Jan 29, 2007, 10:33 AM
Is that so? Hadn't heard. Got a link?

If so, that would be a shame... it is a long time to wait, both for me and for Apple. On the other hand, I don't need it to have too much more power... I'm just crossing my fingers and hoping that the next revision supports at least one type of high-def DVDs.

link (http://www.techarp.com/showarticle.aspx?artno=379&pgno=0)

Although we expected Intel to launch Santa Rosa by Q2 of this year, it appears that the new Centrino Pro platform will only be launched in the second half of this year. The launch date has been tentatively said to be around the middle of the second half, putting it around September or October 2007.

As of this moment, Intel has yet to decide the components that are necessary to qualify for the Centrino brand, but here are some juicy facts about the upcoming platform upgrade.

There may have been other articles but that is what I could find so far. It may or may not be reliable.

Jman888
Jan 29, 2007, 11:12 AM
Boo.

Agreed.
Im not pecific to having a dell monitor (Ive considered others)But i seriously dont wanna be stuck with the same monitor until i buy a new computor. Especially because if you saw CES videos you would know about the new Screen technology coming. 1,000,000:1 Contrast :drools:
I mean think about if you had a CRT Emac before LCD's Got big.Still stuck with that screen.I just dont want that.

Mayby i will just get a Macbook... (And a LCD)

ftaok
Jan 29, 2007, 11:28 AM
Out of curiosity, other than games, do you have any other examples of OS X consumer programs that would fit your comment above?

AFAIK,

Coverflow in iTunes
All of OS X's core image eye-candy
HD movies from apple.com/trailers
(and even though not a consumer application) Photoshop

all run well enough on the mini/MacBooks integrated graphics.

And oddly enough, so does the Aero eye-candy feature of Vista, something that quite a few of dedicated Windows graphics cards can't pull off.
Are yous sure about CoverFlow in iTunes leveraging the GPU? I have an iBook G3/500mhz and CoverFlow in iTunes works for me. OK, it's a little slow, but it does work (unlike the ripple effect, etc.).

Or maybe I misunderstood your post.

ft

milo
Jan 29, 2007, 11:46 AM
While I disagree with some of the original post, I think you guys piled on a bit much.

More ram? Definitely needs it, apple shouldn't ship any machine with 512. Max of 4 gigs (if not more) would be nice as well.

DVD burner? Absolutely, they're dirt cheap. At least make it a $50 option on the cheaper model.

The mini also needs at least one config with C2D. Faster, and apps and OS are starting to go 64 bit.

And what about faster wifi? The mini is the only mac without N wifi right now, by not upgrading it they're going to shut out many potential AppleTV buyers (like myself - I'd love one, but not without a faster wireless on my computer).

Keyboard/mouse? Silly complaint, buy generic and get dirt cheap ones.

GPU? Don't need it, the mini isn't a gaming machine and it has zero effect on things like photoshop.

Overall, the mini is a great box, but the current rev is long in the tooth, I'd totally wait for the next update.


That said, where are the cheap PC's that are supposed to be better bang for the buck than the mini? I was pricing lately, and couldn't find any CD or C2D machines that were competitive with the mini. Any suggestions?

Jman888
Jan 29, 2007, 12:21 PM
While I disagree with some of the original post, I think you guys piled on a bit much.

More ram? Definitely needs it, apple shouldn't ship any machine with 512. Max of 4 gigs (if not more) would be nice as well.

DVD burner? Absolutely, they're dirt cheap. At least make it a $50 option on the cheaper model.

The mini also needs at least one config with C2D. Faster, and apps and OS are starting to go 64 bit.

And what about faster wifi? The mini is the only mac without N wifi right now, by not upgrading it they're going to shut out many potential AppleTV buyers (like myself - I'd love one, but not without a faster wireless on my computer).

Keyboard/mouse? Silly complaint, buy generic and get dirt cheap ones.

GPU? Don't need it, the mini isn't a gaming machine and it has zero effect on things like photoshop.

Overall, the mini is a great box, but the current rev is long in the tooth, I'd totally wait for the next update.


That said, where are the cheap PC's that are supposed to be better bang for the buck than the mini? I was pricing lately, and couldn't find any CD or C2D machines that were competitive with the mini. Any suggestions?
I also agree with you. more ram would be awesome and no modern machine should be without Dvd Burning. The price difference is like 6$.
I guess i could get Generic mice but i like apples keyboard. soso about the mouse (2nd button is kinda flaky..)But mice are so cheap these days it should just be included. Definately not 80Bucks..
Also you can get a Dvd burner for less than 50 bucks these days(Local Target Sells Externals for 80..)

roland.g
Jan 29, 2007, 12:35 PM
More ram? Definitely needs it, apple shouldn't ship any machine with 512. Max of 4 gigs (if not more) would be nice as well.


That has nothing to do with Apple. The Intel motherboard cannot address more than 3GB of RAM. Until Santa Rosa or some other mobile chipset is available that can deal with that much RAM, only the Mac Pro will have that option. And I don't know any notebook out there that has more than two RAM slots anyway.

You can't put a desktop solution in the Mini or the iMac with those form factors and control the heat that a desktop CPU produces.

aristobrat
Jan 29, 2007, 01:05 PM
Are yous sure about CoverFlow in iTunes leveraging the GPU? I have an iBook G3/500mhz and CoverFlow in iTunes works for me.
Actually, it was the OP who made the statement that CoverFlow in iTunes for Windows leverages the GPU, and lags on machines. I was just commenting that even with on-board graphics, the mini and MacBook don't have any problem with it. At least not my mini or MacBook.

Overall, the mini is a great box, but the current rev is long in the tooth, I'd totally wait for the next update.
Same here. That's when I'd expect to see the 802.11n and perhaps 1GB RAM standard on the more expensive one.

But i seriously dont wanna be stuck with the same monitor until i buy a new computor. Especially because if you saw CES videos you would know about the new Screen technology coming. 1,000,000:1 Contrast :drools:
I mean think about if you had a CRT Emac before LCD's Got big.Still stuck with that screen.I just dont want that.

Mayby i will just get a Macbook... (And a LCD)
Respectfully, if you're upset about the price of the mini and the Apple mouse, by the time the new screen technology you saw at CES is in your price range, whatever mini or MacBook that you bought today will be very outdated.

Jman888
Jan 29, 2007, 02:42 PM
Respectfully, if you're upset about the price of the mini and the Apple mouse, by the time the new screen technology you saw at CES is in your price range, whatever mini or MacBook that you bought today will be very outdated.
Not really. Another upside to it is that its cheaper to make then LCD.
The price doesnt bothe me too much its just it overall.(All the little stuff added up.. 80$ Mice 512Ram (gotta upgrade), How hard it is to upgrade., Combo Drive even being availible, GMA_950 , Core Duo (not C2D) , Ect.
I just think its time for a update.

milo
Jan 29, 2007, 02:44 PM
I guess i could get Generic mice but i like apples keyboard. soso about the mouse (2nd button is kinda flaky..)But mice are so cheap these days it should just be included. Definately not 80Bucks..

The apple keyboard is $29. You can get a nice optical for dirt cheap, if apple was going to include a free mouse they'd probably make it a cheap one you wouldn't want anyway. Just go to the store and pick out the mouse you want. Even with apple keyboard, you can get keyboard and mouse for way less than 80 bucks.

That has nothing to do with Apple. The Intel motherboard cannot address more than 3GB of RAM. Until Santa Rosa or some other mobile chipset is available that can deal with that much RAM, only the Mac Pro will have that option. And I don't know any notebook out there that has more than two RAM slots anyway.

You can't put a desktop solution in the Mini or the iMac with those form factors and control the heat that a desktop CPU produces.

Then they should at least get it up to 3 gigs. And they need to push intel for chipsets that support more. Aren't there other windows laptops that support more than 3 gigs of ram?

iW00t
Jan 29, 2007, 02:48 PM
Then they should at least get it up to 3 gigs. And they need to push intel for chipsets that support more. Aren't there other windows laptops that support more than 3 gigs of ram?

Who is Apple to push Intel? We all know Apple buys millions upon millions of processor like Dell.... NOT.

Name a PC laptop that supports more than 3 gb of ram?

milo
Jan 29, 2007, 03:00 PM
Who is Apple to push Intel? We all know Apple buys millions upon millions of processor like Dell.... NOT.

Name a PC laptop that supports more than 3 gb of ram?

Dell XPS. And since that's a C2D machine, I guess apple doesn't need to push anyone, they just need to use the better chipset in the minis AND in the laptops. 3 gigs is ok, but 4+ would be better.

aristobrat
Jan 29, 2007, 03:07 PM
Dell XPS. And since that's a C2D machine, I guess apple doesn't need to push anyone, they just need to use the better chipset in the minis AND in the laptops. 3 gigs is ok, but 4+ would be better.
Looks pretty affordable to get one of the 12" XPS with 4GB of memory. LOL

milo
Jan 29, 2007, 03:09 PM
Looks pretty affordable to get one of the 12" XPS with 4GB of memory. LOL

There are people who need it and can afford it. Expensive is better than impossible. Not to mention that ram prices drop, it would be nice to put in 2 now and upgrade to 4 in the future when it's cheaper.

aristobrat
Jan 29, 2007, 03:15 PM
There are people who need it and can afford it. Expensive is better than impossible. Not to mention that ram prices drop, it would be nice to put in 2 now and upgrade to 4 in the future when it's cheaper.
Oh, I totally agree.

Speaking of being able to afford what's needed, I just thought it was funny to see a $1600 memory upgrade mentioned in a thread where the OP was upset that the $600 mini couldn't burn DVDs. :D

milo
Jan 29, 2007, 03:26 PM
Oh, I totally agree.

Speaking of being able to afford what's needed, I just thought it was funny to see a $1600 memory upgrade mentioned in a thread where the OP was upset that the $600 mini couldn't burn DVDs. :D

For the record, I'd love to see the mini updated to a version that has four ram slots so you can increase the memory without mortgaging your house.

roland.g
Jan 29, 2007, 03:31 PM
For the record, I'd love to see the mini updated to a version that has four ram slots so you can increase the memory without mortgaging your house.

I would too. However, I have installed RAM in my Mini and I don't think there is room in that thing for 2 more slots. NOT TO MENTION, the INTEL motherboard can't run it. Maybe the Santa Rosa version will, but short of that it can't happen.

milo
Jan 29, 2007, 03:39 PM
I would too. However, I have installed RAM in my Mini and I don't think there is room in that thing for 2 more slots. NOT TO MENTION, the INTEL motherboard can't run it. Maybe the Santa Rosa version will, but short of that it can't happen.

I agree on the size. But if the mobo won't run it they just need to get a different mobo, I don't see why they're tied to that mobo when other laptop mobos can go up to 4 gigs.

roland.g
Jan 29, 2007, 03:54 PM
I agree on the size. But if the mobo won't run it they just need to get a different mobo, I don't see why they're tied to that mobo when other laptop mobos can go up to 4 gigs.

That is quite a customized mobo. It is only about 5 or so inches square. I don't know about the size of the mobo in laptops, and I know there are some PC and Linux box knockoffs of the Mini that look almost identical but I don't think redesigning the mobo is that easy. They have probably been working on it, but also maybe in conjunction with Santa Rosa... I dunno. Remember that the G4 Mini had one RAM slot capable of 1GB. Also I have miniStack, which is an identical footprint to the Mini and just a bit shorter and the full size 3.5" HDD I put in it barely fits, so all those clamoring for a full size drive need to realize that there is no possible way unless the form factor changes. Part of the reason the Mini is so compact is that they made it just as big as need be to hold an optical drive, not a 3.5" HDD or more RAM.

milo
Jan 29, 2007, 04:00 PM
That is quite a customized mobo. It is only about 5 or so inches square. I don't know about the size of the mobo in laptops, and I know there are some PC and Linux box knockoffs of the Mini that look almost identical but I don't think redesigning the mobo is that easy. They have probably been working on it, but also maybe in conjunction with Santa Rosa... I dunno. Remember that the G4 Mini had one RAM slot capable of 1GB. Also I have miniStack, which is an identical footprint to the Mini and just a bit shorter and the full size 3.5" HDD I put in it barely fits, so all those clamoring for a full size drive need to realize that there is no possible way unless the form factor changes. Part of the reason the Mini is so compact is that they made it just as big as need be to hold an optical drive, not a 3.5" HDD or more RAM.

Which is why many think that they made a big mistake by going that small. If they would have gone just a little bit bigger, they could have fit a 3.5, a regular optical drive instead of a laptop one, and saved a ton of money in component costs. Hopefully they'll learn from their mistakes next time they launch a new model.

iW00t
Jan 29, 2007, 04:05 PM
Dell XPS. And since that's a C2D machine, I guess apple doesn't need to push anyone, they just need to use the better chipset in the minis AND in the laptops. 3 gigs is ok, but 4+ would be better.

Are you sure you will be able to address the full 4GB of memory? Or is Dell just providing the 4GB configuration for the sake of dual channel + 3.1GB of addressable memory?

PCs are no more magical than Macs, they use the same chipsets and are subjects to the same limitations. There are actually quite a few posts out on the internet by one of the 3 people who is stupid enough to spend $2K on 4GB of memory only to find that he can't take advantage of all of it.

If you need so much memory get a Mac Pro. It has nothing to do with Apple telling you what to and what not to do with their machines. It is a plain and simple fact.

No consumer needs so much. There are even heaps of computers out in the world today getting by on 512.

milo
Jan 29, 2007, 04:16 PM
Are you sure you will be able to address the full 4GB of memory? Or is Dell just providing the 4GB configuration for the sake of dual channel + 3.1GB of addressable memory?

I don't know, that might be the case.

No consumer needs so much.

Well, nobody needs 4 gigs to send an email to grandma. But there are certainly plenty of people who can take advantage of more ram. "Consumer" is a pretty meaningless category these days.

roland.g
Jan 29, 2007, 04:58 PM
The Dell site has small print on the XPS saying that not all 4GB are available, though it doesn't say how much is, or why.

Jman888
Jan 29, 2007, 07:25 PM
Oh, I totally agree.

Speaking of being able to afford what's needed, I just thought it was funny to see a $1600 memory upgrade mentioned in a thread where the OP was upset that the $600 mini couldn't burn DVDs. :D

I was just mad because i relized after it was all done i would spend like 1700$

CD Mini -W- Superdrive & 2Gigs Ram (1050)
Bluetooth Mouse and Keyboard (99)
Lacie Firewire Drive (250)
Monitor (350)

roland.g
Jan 29, 2007, 11:25 PM
I was just mad because i relized after it was all done i would spend like 1700$

CD Mini -W- Superdrive & 2Gigs Ram (1050)
Bluetooth Mouse and Keyboard (99)
Lacie Firewire Drive (250)
Monitor (350)

So get a Mac Mini Core Duo 1.66 refurb for $649 with Superdrive.
Order 2GB RAM from OWC for $225 and install it easily yourself. They even have a video online.
Get your Bluetooth Mouse and Keyboard for $99.
Get a newertech miniStack from OWC with a Seagate 500GB drive for $259. Or get the empty case for $75 and put any drive in you want. Better than the LaCie, offers more ports.
And Get you Monitor for $350.

I just cut your cost down for the same setup to $1,582 from $1,749. You could even get with the refurb the Final Cut Express deal $99 instead of $299. That's another $200 off. When I got my Mini I got the printer promo, $100 of my Canon PIXMA MP530.

Jman888
Jan 30, 2007, 02:58 PM
So get a Mac Mini Core Duo 1.66 refurb for $649 with Superdrive.
Order 2GB RAM from OWC for $225 and install it easily yourself. They even have a video online.
Get your Bluetooth Mouse and Keyboard for $99.
Get a newertech miniStack from OWC with a Seagate 500GB drive for $259. Or get the empty case for $75 and put any drive in you want. Better than the LaCie, offers more ports.
And Get you Monitor for $350.

I just cut your cost down for the same setup to $1,582 from $1,749. You could even get with the refurb the Final Cut Express deal $99 instead of $299. That's another $200 off. When I got my Mini I got the printer promo, $100 of my Canon PIXMA MP530.

Yeah but the lacie is aluminum and the Ministack is plastic I dunno how hot minis are (But i read they're quiet and thats my biggest problem with my Pc. LOAD AS HECK it sounds like a battery powered fan beside your ear.)
But i assume being fairly small it would be really hot(Like how laptops can burn your lap.)

roland.g
Jan 30, 2007, 04:41 PM
Yeah but the lacie is aluminum and the Ministack is plastic I dunno how hot minis are (But i read they're quiet and thats my biggest problem with my Pc. LOAD AS HECK it sounds like a battery powered fan beside your ear.)
But i assume being fairly small it would be really hot(Like how laptops can burn your lap.)

I've had a miniStack under my Mini running night and day since October with the system set to put the display to sleep but never the hard disk (mini internal, the ministack HDD sleeps when the mini sleeps) and I never hear it nor have I had any heat issues.

One person recommended just putting 4 clear rubber feet (from like Home Depot or somewhere) under the Mini to give it a tiny bit of extra clearance over the stack for heat, but I haven't gotten around to it yet, and frankly don't think I need it. Still a good idea for added ventilation. The bottom of the mini is rubber like and does get warm, not hot, but warm to the touch.

Jman888
Feb 1, 2007, 03:08 PM
I do think it should have dedicated graphics though. Nothing fancy and i know they can because of the Original mini and also.. Apple TV has dedicated graphics AND IS THINNER and is Cheaper. I know they can do it now. No more excuses.

Ironduke
Feb 1, 2007, 03:14 PM
I think apple need to look at the back of the mini more then anything

1.Twin DVI or add a HDMI
2.Firewire 800 for sure
3.Possible Express card Slot like new lap tops (this would open the mini to Fire Wire/ eSata and the possibility of connecting something like ASUS's new External GFX card

as far as the internals apple should try and offer the mini with and without a midrange Laptop GFX card like the Go7600 or x1600 (and dont cripple the mhz like they did with the mac book pro ffs)

make it available in the same colors as the Nano and Shuffle:D

Jman888
Feb 1, 2007, 03:31 PM
I think apple need to look at the back of the mini more then anything

1.Twin DVI or add a HDMI
2.Firewire 800 for sure
3.Possible Express card Slot like new lap tops (this would open the mini to Fire Wire/ eSata and the possibility of connecting something like ASUS's new External GFX card

as far as the internals apple should try and offer the mini with and without a midrange Laptop GFX card like the Go7600 or x1600 (and dont cripple the mhz like they did with the mac book pro ffs)

make it available in the same colors as the Nano and Shuffle:D

Ok heres My Idea.
1. Update the Mac mini to a Core2 And have more Normal Ram
2. Apple Needs to invents a Connector like how some laptops have Docks but have it so that you can connect a little cord to a external GPU thru a HDMI like cable. So you can have your little Mini and underneath it have a
7600GS : Mini Edition Connected Thru MBP (Mega Bandwith Port)
Also MBP Would need about 4x The bandwith (Max) Of Pci Express For Futureproofing.
3. The Mac mini Would need to have about 4 Of those 4 Usb Firewire On the Back.
4. Open it up so that Ati + Nividia Can make their own Graphics cards for it.(I'd Love a Mini with a External x1950 XT :p )
5. Market it correctly with the Right Features and the Right Price and THERE YOU HAVE A PC KILLER.
People who need expandablilty would love it because they can just plug up a New card if they so please. (That would also please gamers)
Cheap people (Like me) Would love it because its affordable and Fast at the same time.
Also all people who hate apple would have to agree. That was a good idea.

kildraik
Feb 1, 2007, 07:23 PM
... it lines the pockets of its CEO's and Apples bank account...

Aple's bank account, yes, but the CEO's?

Did you know that Steve Jobs only makes $1 a year? Thats his salary.

:apple: Think different.

Jman888
Feb 1, 2007, 07:53 PM
Aple's bank account, yes, but the CEO's?

Did you know that Steve Jobs only makes $1 a year? Thats his salary.

:apple: Think different.
And gets Paid with amazing Amounts of stock (Lots of CEO's Do it Its a way to avoid taxes)

kildraik
Feb 1, 2007, 09:00 PM
And gets Paid with amazing Amounts of stock (Lots of CEO's Do it Its a way to avoid taxes)

O yeah, I know that- My point was that he does not earn a great salary, that is being paid by the company in dollars.

Apple stocks are, of course his payment.

I honestly don't know why I threw in that little tid bit, it was just fun to say.

:)

imacdaddy
Feb 2, 2007, 12:42 AM
I've searched and read that the Intel GMA 3000 is a few months away but the nVidia G72M (GeForce Go 7400) will be shipping in the :apple:tv. Does this mean the new mac mini will be configured with the same GPU as the :apple:tv in the spring? :rolleyes:

The spec on the GeForce Go 7400 looks alright.
http://www.nvidia.com/object/go_7_series_techspecs.html

iW00t
Feb 2, 2007, 12:43 AM
I've searched and read that the Intel GMA 3000 is a few months away but the nVidia G72M (GeForce Go 7400) will be shipping in the :apple:tv. Does this mean the new mac mini will be configured with the same GPU as the :apple:tv in the spring? :rolleyes:

The spec on the GeForce Go 7400 looks alright.
http://www.nvidia.com/object/go_7_series_techspecs.html

Yes. I think so.

Ironduke
Feb 2, 2007, 01:10 AM
I've searched and read that the Intel GMA 3000 is a few months away but the nVidia G72M (GeForce Go 7400) will be shipping in the :apple:tv. Does this mean the new mac mini will be configured with the same GPU as the :apple:tv in the spring? :rolleyes:

The spec on the GeForce Go 7400 looks alright.
http://www.nvidia.com/object/go_7_series_techspecs.html

I think the 7400 is a poor choice, it is a low end card, apple should try and get the 7600/7700 or x1600 which are midranged and can power games like bf2, remember the itv is basic in what it does compared to a computer

Father Jack
Feb 2, 2007, 01:17 AM
Buy the cheaper Mini and an external DVD burner. (that was my solution)



FJ

iW00t
Feb 2, 2007, 04:17 AM
I think the 7400 is a poor choice, it is a low end card, apple should try and get the 7600/7700 or x1600 which are midranged and can power games like bf2, remember the itv is basic in what it does compared to a computer

Quite frankly for a Mac Mini I'd be happy with even a 7300.

Claven2
Feb 2, 2007, 10:38 AM
OK, well before someone gang-piles on me like most of the other posters on here who hate the GMA950 in the mini, I will qualify my statements by saying:

1) I have a Macbook with the intel GMA950 (1.83C2D, 2G ram) and while it works fine for my basic laptop needs, it is sadly lacking when compared to all but the most basic PC desktop towers being sold by Dell or HP, etc.

The Mini is the SAME THING as a Macbook but packaged differently, so I can speak with some authority on its performance. for the prices being asked, apple could EASILY include even a 1600 series radeon and still turn a fair profit - as well as boost sales considerably to switchers who already own a good quality LCD monitor.

2) I would NEVER buy anything with an integrated monitor unless it is a laptop where you need one for portability. Applecare is fine, but I expect and have always gotten 5 years from a good machine, not three. On day 1 of the 4th year of ownership if the monitor dies you are SOL and you have to scrap the whole system. Not acceptable to me, so I'll never buy an iMac.

3) There is NO REASON that a mac owner should not want to play a few UB games like CivIV Warlords (won't run on the GMA chipset) or Imperial Glory for mac or whatever. Saying wanting to play non-console games and being a mac guy are mutually exclusive is ignorant IMHO and shame on anyone who responded that such a person should buy a Dell. OSX is perfectly capable - it's the hardware that is lacking for anyone who can't/won't buy a 24" iMac or MacPro (read $$$$$).

If Steve & Co. at Apple ever release a mid-tower or Mini with dedicated graphics I will buy it and gladly pitch my last remaining PC out the window but until that time, half my money has to grudgingly continue to support the M$ corporate machine :(

Jman888
Feb 2, 2007, 11:59 AM
Quite frankly for a Mac Mini I'd be happy with even a 7300.
If it and the Macbook had a 7400 or Better (Preferably better) I would be more than happy. i just hate the idea of integrated. The slowness and the Fact that without matched ram im screwed.
OK, well before someone gang-piles on me like most of the other posters on here who hate the GMA950 in the mini, I will qualify my statements by saying:

1) I have a Macbook with the intel GMA950 (1.83C2D, 2G ram) and while it works fine for my basic laptop needs, it is sadly lacking when compared to all but the most basic PC desktop towers being sold by Dell or HP, etc.

The Mini is the SAME THING as a Macbook but packaged differently, so I can speak with some authority on its performance. for the prices being asked, apple could EASILY include even a 1600 series radeon and still turn a fair profit - as well as boost sales considerably to switchers who already own a good quality LCD monitor.

2) I would NEVER buy anything with an integrated monitor unless it is a laptop where you need one for portability. Applecare is fine, but I expect and have always gotten 5 years from a good machine, not three. On day 1 of the 4th year of ownership if the monitor dies you are SOL and you have to scrap the whole system. Not acceptable to me, so I'll never buy an iMac.

3) There is NO REASON that a mac owner should not want to play a few UB games like CivIV Warlords (won't run on the GMA chipset) or Imperial Glory for mac or whatever. Saying wanting to play non-console games and being a mac guy are mutually exclusive is ignorant IMHO and shame on anyone who responded that such a person should buy a Dell. OSX is perfectly capable - it's the hardware that is lacking for anyone who can't/won't buy a 24" iMac or MacPro (read $$$$$).

If Steve & Co. at Apple ever release a mid-tower or Mini with dedicated graphics I will buy it and gladly pitch my last remaining PC out the window but until that time, half my money has to grudgingly continue to support the M$ corporate machine :(
Yes. How many people do you know that are Wanting this but it is nonexistant. They Should Make it.

I would be happy with a 7400 in the minis and macbook. I mean its 6.5 Times FASTER then the GMA!
http://www.notebookcheck.net/NVIDIA-GeForce-Go-7400.2143.0.html
(But still less than half the x1600 :( )
I think that a x1400 Mobile or a 6600 Mobile would be better (Close To MBP - 500 3DMarks ) But why dont they give mini's and Macbooks the x1600 and Bump the MBP's To something better (x1700 .. Ect.) But oh well.

Hope - 7400 Clocked decently
Dream - x1600 or 7600 :P

aristobrat
Feb 2, 2007, 12:32 PM
On day 1 of the 4th year of ownership if the monitor dies you are SOL and you have to scrap the whole system. Not acceptable to me, so I'll never buy an iMac.
In that case, why wouldn't you just hook up an external monitor to your iMac? Do you really still have PCs around from late-2002/early-2003?

Yes. How many people do you know that are Wanting this but it is nonexistant. They Should Make it.
This is all based on your guess that there is a large market of people wanting this, and frankly, this comment almost always comes from someone like you or Gordy (very technically literate PC people that can quote you the latest rev of any Nvidia or ATI product line).

I guess my question is this: If the market for people like you guys is as big as you think it is, why hasn't Apple targeted it?

benpatient
Feb 2, 2007, 01:05 PM
wow. 4 pages of complaining and complaining about complainers.

And oddly enough, so does the Aero eye-candy feature of Vista, something that quite a few of dedicated Windows graphics cards can't pull off.

how many times do you think you need to post this claim before it becomes true?

a radeon 9600 non-pro handles Aero without any problems. Microsoft's recommended specs are exaggerating what you need. the GMA950 is able to run it fine. Look at some charts to see where the GMA950 is on the graphics chip pecking order and you'll see that pretty much every single graphics solution available today is faster, and supports DX9. The mini's version of the 950 isn't faster than any other version of the 950, so it stands to reason that any card that's faster would be able to handle Aero just fine, as well.

a LOT of people who are generally PC users are interested in the mini because they want to use it as a HT hub. They have media storage servers and separate gaming rigs (those who play games, anyway), so they're really only looking for:
a small, quiet box
with optical output (for 5.1 and unfiltered CD stereo),
a DVD drive (for upconverted DVD watching),
a hard drive to hold programs any maybe email and stuff,
a fast network connection (gigabit) for streaming video from a media server,
enough memory to keep things working smoothly,
processing power enough to render 720p or 1080p trailers and videos,
a good enough graphics processor to avoid bottlenecking the CPU,
a TV tuner card, preferrably HD with an ATSC tuner.

The mini is 95% there. All you need is an external HD tuner card and a better graphics system. Who cares if it is integrated...that's not the problem. The problem is that when you use exposť, it studders. When Front Row is trying to navigate around, it can be jerky and distracting. Most of all, videos are unreliable in their playback when they're over DVD dimensions.

a lot of you are saying that you don't need a good graphics card unless you're playing games or doing video editing...but that's not true at all. Apple chose to utilize the 3d graphics capabilities of their machines in every aspect of the system. EVERYTHING uses the graphics card now-a-days on OS X.

some things more than others. My dual processor G5 tower hangs when i open my dashboard because it uses the graphics card and i've got a stinky 5200. By all accounts, the 950 isn't much better. In fact by many accounts, it's worse...

Dont Hurt Me
Feb 2, 2007, 01:32 PM
Quite frankly for a Mac Mini I'd be happy with even a 7300.True a 7300 just blows away no contest the GMA950 or even 3000 . I have a 7300 that im not using anymore and it had no fan was passive cooled and could turn on every feature shaders vertix etc. I would guess its a $50 card now so I still dont see cheapo Apple using one in Mini. The Integrated graphics are still Integrated graphics. Cheap and slow performing. Ill bet the next mini stays with cheapo integrated graphics and gets a cpu bump.
GMA950 is horrible for gaming and the benches show this. Just go to MacWorld, or Barefeats if you need proof. Next we get to hear from the "it looks great to me crowd" Its wonderful, runs this and runs that and its better then poontang but never a benchmark, never. There is a reason Apple use to bust on integrated graphics before they went cheap.

Jman888
Feb 2, 2007, 02:24 PM
In that case, why wouldn't you just hook up an external monitor to your iMac? Do you really still have PCs around from late-2002/early-2003?


This is all based on your guess that there is a large market of people wanting this, and frankly, this comment almost always comes from someone like you or Gordy (very technically literate PC people that can quote you the latest rev of any Nvidia or ATI product line).

I guess my question is this: If the market for people like you guys is as big as you think it is, why hasn't Apple targeted it?
Ok want Proff. Do a poll on every apple Site. Ask all of them if they would love to have a upgradeable consumer Mac. Seriously.
I know a lot of Mac owners who are ok having a Macbook But buy a Pc for a desktop just because of The mini not being enough. The imacs AIO factor and the Mac Pros Price.
Seriously Start a offsite Poll that anybody can vote on (Without registering because members of this forum find it ok :( )

aristobrat
Feb 2, 2007, 02:44 PM
how many times do you think you need to post this claim before it becomes true?

a radeon 9600 non-pro handles Aero without any problems. Microsoft's recommended specs are exaggerating what you need. the GMA950 is able to run it fine. Look at some charts to see where the GMA950 is on the graphics chip pecking order and you'll see that pretty much every single graphics solution available today is faster, and supports DX9.
Maybe that's been the problem -- I've been dinking around with Vista for the past several months on different consumer-grade machines, none of which have been able to do Aero. They've mostly been IBM NetVistas and Dell Dimensions that we issue to our users here at work.

a lot of you are saying that you don't need a good graphics card unless you're playing games or doing video editing...but that's not true at all. Apple chose to utilize the 3d graphics capabilities of their machines in every aspect of the system. EVERYTHING uses the graphics card now-a-days on OS X.

some things more than others. My dual processor G5 tower hangs when i open my dashboard because it uses the graphics card and i've got a stinky 5200. By all accounts, the 950 isn't much better. In fact by many accounts, it's worse...
For my account, I've never had my Intel mini or MacBook (which have been my daily drivers) hang/lag because of anything graphical that Apple's OS X threw at it. The only time Dashboard lags is when you hit it the first time after a reboot, and that has nothing to do with graphics.

aristobrat
Feb 2, 2007, 02:47 PM
Ok want Proff. Do a poll on every apple Site. Ask all of them if they would love to have a upgradeable consumer Mac. Seriously.
I know a lot of Mac owners who are ok having a Macbook But buy a Pc for a desktop just because of The mini not being enough. The imacs AIO factor and the Mac Pros Price.
Seriously Start a offsite Poll that anybody can vote on (Without registering because members of this forum find it ok :( )
I'm thinking that as authoritatively as you've been speaking about "the number of people wanting this" being big, you would have already done such a poll yourself. :confused:

Jman888
Feb 2, 2007, 02:56 PM
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&client=firefox-a&rls=org.mozilla%3Aen-US%3Aofficial&hs=LD5&q=%22mac+mini+pro%22&btnG=Search
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&client=firefox-a&rls=org.mozilla%3Aen-US%3Aofficial&hs=0E5&q=%22headless+mac+%22+-Mini&btnG=Search
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&client=firefox-a&rls=org.mozilla%3Aen-US%3Aofficial&hs=yvP&q=%22Mac+Pro+mini%22&btnG=Search
And just google any of its other names in quotes to see people talking about it.(To bad google doesnt move around the words and only takes a Exact quote)

I'm thinking that as authoritatively as you've been speaking about "the number of people wanting this" being big, you would have already done such a poll yourself. :confused:
No but if you go to forums when somebody starts a rumor of a headless consumer mac and people go Nuts.
Or when you say G4 Cube and people change the whole subject to about how they wish there was a consumer desktop mac similar to that.
Or how the people at 123macmini are always talking about the missing link (The non all in one between the Mac mini and the Mac Pro )

balamw
Feb 2, 2007, 03:03 PM
No but if you go to forums when somebody starts a rumor of a headless consumer mac and people go Nuts.
Just because a minority is vocal, it doesn't make them a large market. And I'm one of those that would love to see an screen-less iMac.

Also net hype doesn't always translate into real $. Take "Snakes on a Plane" as a good example of that.

B

Jman888
Feb 2, 2007, 03:09 PM
Just because a minority is vocal, it doesn't make them a large market. And I'm one of those that would love to see an screen-less iMac.

Also net hype doesn't always translate into real $. Take "Snakes on a Plane" as a good example of that.

B

I guess.. But AIO's Have a even smaller market and it seems to have worked for apple.

gregorsamsa
Feb 2, 2007, 03:36 PM
I guess my question is this: If the market for people like you guys is as big as you think it is, why hasn't Apple targeted it?

Keep in mind that out of all the Macs, the mini in particular is aimed primarily at switchers. In fact, it could so easily be the ideal Mac for any switcher. Only one problem: many (though by no means all) PC users also like gaming.

Who knows how many potential switchers have looked at the mini's integrated graphics & concluded: "No way can I run a lot of my PC stuff through Boot Camp on this!"

An iMac isn't a viable option for many of these guys. So, IMO, Apple are certainly losing market share because of this deficiency.

I think it's about time that at least the higher-end Mac mini had dedicated graphics.

Jman888
Feb 2, 2007, 04:02 PM
Keep in mind that out of all the Macs, the mini in particular is aimed primarily at switchers. In fact, it could so easily be the ideal Mac for any switcher. Only one problem: many (though by no means all) PC users also like gaming.

Who knows how many potential switchers have looked at the mini's integrated graphics & concluded: "No way can I run a lot of my PC stuff through Boot Camp on this!"

An iMac isn't a viable option for many of these guys. So, IMO, Apple are certainly losing market share because of this deficiency.

I think it's about time that at least the higher-end Mac mini had dedicated graphics.

Amen. Im a potential (And likely) Switcher but i dont like Integrated graphis. They are cheap and slow. I think there should be a mac mini pro.

JAT
Feb 3, 2007, 11:32 AM
The mini is 95% there. All you need is an external HD tuner card and a better graphics system. Who cares if it is integrated...that's not the problem. The problem is that when you use exposť, it studders. When Front Row is trying to navigate around, it can be jerky and distracting. Most of all, videos are unreliable in their playback when they're over DVD dimensions.

Are you talking about an Intel Mini? Cause mine has no such issues. 1.66GHz. Sometimes I read what people say on the web and think I must have gotten a 3.0GHz instead, but About This Mac assures me otherwise. Expose/Dashboard is like lightning, Front Row has no graphics issues and this baby can play 1080p at 24 frames/sec.

Maybe it's possible that people don't actually try something and assume based on what other non-owners have "authoritatively" stated on the web? Sometimes known as FUD.

Amen. Im a potential (And likely) Switcher but i dont like Integrated graphis. They are cheap and slow. I think there should be a mac mini pro.

I agree they need to have a midrange headless model. But why all the ripping on the Mini because of it?

kellen
Feb 3, 2007, 11:50 AM
Quite frankly, I am glad they haven't upgraded the mini, as I am still feeling quite good about buying the 1.66 Core Duo the week it came out, roughly a year ago:D .

Although the only reason I would buy a newer mini is if a graphics chip came with it.

Jman888
Feb 3, 2007, 02:41 PM
I agree they need to have a midrange headless model. But why all the ripping on the Mini because of it?
Oh. sorry it sounded like i was ripping on the Mini i wasnt. I was just saying that they are cheap (2$-4$) And are 1/7 The speed of the GPU in the :apple: Tv
The fact that they can put a GPU in the :apple: Tv and not the mini kinda makes me mad. I hope they put a decent card in the next. Or Give it the 7400 (Hopefully clocked higher) and offer me a midrange upgradeable one. Because i want a Mac but cant really justify integrated graphics.

imacdaddy
Feb 3, 2007, 10:54 PM
Oh. sorry it sounded like i was ripping on the Mini i wasnt. I was just saying that they are cheap (2$-4$) And are 1/7 The speed of the GPU in the :apple: Tv
The fact that they can put a GPU in the :apple: Tv and not the mini kinda makes me mad. I hope they put a decent card in the next. Or Give it the 7400 (Hopefully clocked higher) and offer me a midrange upgradeable one. Because i want a Mac but cant really justify integrated graphics.

Well, the :apple:tv is a new product while the mac mini has been out for a year now. Hopefully and I'm pretty confident the new mac mini's will have a new graphics chip, either the nVidia G72M or Intel GMA 3000

countach
Feb 5, 2007, 10:03 PM
The mini would be better as a media centre if it had:

* Games level graphics. Would make a neat little gaming system set top box.
* Full size 3.5" hard drive. Need a big honking 750MB drive for a decent video recorder / media holder.
* Blu-ray drive and HDMI connector for next-gen movies.

And the whole thing needn't be much bigger than it is now.

I think we need it for people who want a separate monitor. Since Apple won't give it to us, for most people I think you have to just suck up the pain and buy a 24" imac, enjoy it, and if necessary sell it on when that screen doesn't fit your needs. You'll lose a little, but Macs have reasonable resale, so it may not be as much pain as you think.

bigdz68
Feb 6, 2007, 01:51 AM
So should we be expecting these updates anytime within the next month? Only reason I ask is I am installing a touchscreen "carputer" and want to use the Mini instead of those sub-par "PC" setups. Just curious as I notice it has been almost 6 months without an update. I don't mind spending the $$$ for the 1.83Ghz now but I would hate to see something new come out next week!

shikimo
Feb 6, 2007, 06:14 AM
So should we be expecting these updates anytime within the next month? Only reason I ask is I am installing a touchscreen "carputer" and want to use the Mini instead of those sub-par "PC" setups. Just curious as I notice it has been almost 6 months without an update. I don't mind spending the $$$ for the 1.83Ghz now but I would hate to see something new come out next week!

Well now that's the big question isn't it :) . I think the Feb. 20 rumor isn't completely without potential, but my bookie still has it at 10 to 1.

He also won't take bets anymore on the "new mini by the end of March" teaser, as it has become too close to a sure thing, and bookies are almost never wrong. So if you have 6-8 weeks to wait like I do, I'd wait, and if comes out earlier I'll use my winnings to pay for it :cool: .

Mgkwho
Feb 6, 2007, 02:58 PM
Apple usually only announces a SE one week in advance, right?

So it's possible they might send out an invite on the 13th and still make it in time for the 20th.

-=|Mgkwho

iW00t
Feb 6, 2007, 03:33 PM
Are there any DX10 cards out at the moment?

We have always been talking about how the iMacs, MBPs, and *other macs* have dated puny graphics but I just popped by ATi's website and apparently they are still selling the X1600. Why isn't it replaced with something else yet? :confused:

Dont Hurt Me
Feb 6, 2007, 03:36 PM
Are there any DX10 cards out at the moment?

We have always been talking about how the iMacs, MBPs, and *other macs* have dated puny graphics but I just popped by ATi's website and apparently they are still selling the X1600. Why isn't it replaced with something else yet? :confused:You need to look again, Ati has a bunch of stuff more powerful then the old 1600. Just not for little marketshare Mac.

Jman888
Feb 6, 2007, 03:41 PM
Are there any DX10 cards out at the moment?

We have always been talking about how the iMacs, MBPs, and *other macs* have dated puny graphics but I just popped by ATi's website and apparently they are still selling the X1600. Why isn't it replaced with something else yet? :confused:

I really dont get ATI. actualy (Yes i know theyre laptop gpu's) the x1600 Costs MORE than a much faster 7600 GT .. WFT (My new word) Personally i have always preferred nividia over ati. Most of they're cards are pretty fast. All are affordable (strike the 8800GTX But that will be like 400 after the r600 comes out. Its always been nividias strategy.)
also they have the 7900GS .. 179$ But when backed with 2gigs of ram and a Conroe you can get 60+ FPS on High on most games With all maxed at Semi high reses (Whatever is over 1024 x 768 but under 1600 x 1200 )

roland.g
Feb 6, 2007, 03:46 PM
I really dont get ATI. actualy (Yes i know theyre laptop gpu's) the x1600 Costs MORE than a much faster 7600 GT .. WFT (My new word) Personally i have always preferred nividia over ati. Most of they're cards are pretty fast. All are affordable (strike the 8800GTX But that will be like 400 after the r600 comes out. Its always been nividias strategy.)
also they have the 7900GS .. 179$ But when backed with 2gigs of ram and a Conroe you can get 60+ FPS on High on most games With all maxed at Semi high reses (Whatever is over 1024 x 768 but under 1600 x 1200 )

FPS

Jman888
Feb 6, 2007, 03:58 PM
FPS

Proof nividia is made of pure win. AND. That card is cheaper then the x1600 :p (But hotter)