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MacRumors
May 26, 2003, 05:34 AM
MacNews.net.tc claims (http://macintosh.fryke.com/cgi-bin/ikonboard/ikonboard.cgi?act=ST&f=10&t=102) that a revised Location Manager is a part of Panther.



aggemam
May 26, 2003, 06:51 AM
Automatic location switching based on eg. accessible airport networks would be great.

This way, my PowerBook would be able to sense that I'm at home or at school, and switch the location accordingly.

I hope they implement functionality like this, but even if they don't, It'll be good to have the OS9-style location manager back.

Hozie
May 26, 2003, 08:30 AM
Agreed. This would be simple to implement and yet useful. I'm all in favor for it. (The auto-switching as well, by the way...)

Snowy_River
May 26, 2003, 09:56 AM
(Disclaimer: I'm currently stuck in OS9, and haven't been able to play in OS X for about a month, so everything I have to say is from memory of a year and a half working and playing in OS X.)

Okay, I'm not sure I understand what the issue is with a Mac OS 9-like Location Manager. While I do agree that an auto-detect system is an intriguing idea that I really like, much of the capabilities of the Location Manager already exist in OS X. Isn't there a 'Location' menu item in the Apple menu?


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Kwyjibo
May 26, 2003, 11:09 AM
I would like it to be an option in the finder if you like. often times I take my iBook fro mthe airport network and hook it up to my xbox and then i need to go in and switch off airport and change the connection type to DHCP using manual IP rather than jsut DHCP. And if i want to go back to airport i have to undo it all. I was actually looking for a "location manager" app with little luck.

vniow
May 26, 2003, 01:29 PM
Ummm....what exactly is a location manager?

rainman::|:|
May 26, 2003, 01:38 PM
Originally posted by vniow
Ummm....what exactly is a location manager?

A software set that is supposed to change all of your network (and some other) settings for a laptop-- so you can tell it you're at home, and you can access your cable modem and have volume at high, and at work it can access the 802.11b network with volume muted. you get the idea... it never really worked that well for me, at least under 9-- it forgets a lot of the settings.

pnw

coolfactor
May 26, 2003, 01:48 PM
Originally posted by Kwyjibo
I would like it to be an option in the finder if you like. often times I take my iBook fro mthe airport network and hook it up to my xbox and then i need to go in and switch off airport and change the connection type to DHCP using manual IP rather than jsut DHCP. And if i want to go back to airport i have to undo it all. I was actually looking for a "location manager" app with little luck.

You can already do exactly what you describe using the Network preference pane. Create one location with the settings for your Airport network, then create a new location with the settings for your xbox, and then it's just a matter of choosing the appropriate location from the Location menu under the Apple menu. :) Hope that helps.

coolfactor
May 26, 2003, 01:51 PM
Originally posted by vniow
Ummm....what exactly is a location manager?

Or another description would be... a mechanism to maintain various settings based on "where" you are using your computer. Switching locations automatically changes all of your settings... network settings, etc.

Kwyjibo
May 26, 2003, 02:43 PM
Originally posted by coolfactor
You can already do exactly what you describe using the Network preference pane. Create one location with the settings for your Airport network, then create a new location with the settings for your xbox, and then it's just a matter of choosing the appropriate location from the Location menu under the Apple menu. :) Hope that helps.

thats what I do right now but its a hassle I would like to be able to change these locations much easier. I don't keep preferences in my dock so i have to open applictions then preferences then netowrk then switch then apply. It would be much cooler to be able to have a menu like the airport one where i could click a new location and all the setting would change. I know i don't have to mess with the DHCP options but usually it re-intializes the airport faster if it stays on the one location.

Vroem
May 26, 2003, 02:58 PM
Originally posted by Kwyjibo
It would be much cooler to be able to have a menu like the airport one where i could click a new location and all the setting would change.
Kwyjibo: what did you smoke? The man exactly answered your question:
Originally posted by coolfactor
it's just a matter of choosing the appropriate location from the Location menu under the Apple menu. :)

Kwyjibo
May 26, 2003, 06:14 PM
Ok ummm no he didn't.
1) It was never a question, it was a complaint a hassle that I experience.

By advanced location management, i would expect the process to simplify a bit too like as simple as it is to switch to a different airport network....in the finder if possible....one click......

Ok i'm going to explain this again.
To switch your location in jaguar I need to open up Macintosh HD, then click applications then click preferences, then I can assign a new location like xbox for my xbox settings or homeNetwork for my home settings or school for my school settings. This is very simple, and it is what he meant. Then once you select that you hit apply. then you close the window and do whatever you need to do. Then I have to open the hard drive then the applications folder then the preferences then the network tab and switch it back to undo it. then hit apply. All of this so i can transfer one file......What I want is to be able to to easily select the locations i have pre-defined in the settings were talking about and easily switch them with a click or two not like seven. Then switch them back. Its a minor inconvience to do then undo everything under the current method thats why i'm looking for simplification.... I also know when my question has been answered, but i didn't ask a question.

Snowy_River
May 26, 2003, 06:14 PM
Originally posted by Kwyjibo
... I don't keep preferences in my dock so i have to open applictions then preferences then netowrk then switch then apply...

You don't have to do this. There is a menu item under the Apple menu that is 'Location'. It gives you a sub-menu that lists the Locations you have set up in the network prefs. Just pick the one you want to use. Do it from any application. Works like a charm! ;)


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uhlawboi80
May 26, 2003, 06:24 PM
ok im confused....i take my laptop to school, and it detects and logs onto the wireless network (though to get off campus i need the cisco VPN), then i bring it home and plug it into my router from my DSL and it just works, and then i take it to the coffee shop and use their wireless without problem...

i never change any settings, ever. So what you guys want seems to be unnecessary...:confused:

Longey Nowze
May 26, 2003, 06:24 PM
Originally posted by Kwyjibo
thats what I do right now but its a hassle I would like to be able to change these locations much easier. I don't keep preferences in my dock so i have to open applictions then preferences then netowrk then switch then apply. It would be much cooler to be able to have a menu like the airport one where i could click a new location and all the setting would change. I know i don't have to mess with the DHCP options but usually it re-intializes the airport faster if it stays on the one location.

i think what you are looking for is in the apple menu, right under the Dock menu there's a location menu, you can change locations from there! i if thisn't what you're looking then... sorry!

thank you
MaT

Snowy_River
May 26, 2003, 06:36 PM
Originally posted by uhlawboi80
ok im confused....i take my laptop to school, and it detects and logs onto the wireless network (though to get off campus i need the cisco VPN), then i bring it home and plug it into my router from my DSL and it just works, and then i take it to the coffee shop and use their wireless without problem...

i never change any settings, ever. So what you guys want seems to be unnecessary...:confused:

Some people don't have it as easy as you. With my iBook, I only used the Location setting when I travelled, so I could keep local dial-up numbers for different cities in different location set-ups. Others need to have slightly different settings for their different local connections.


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Kwyjibo
May 26, 2003, 08:09 PM
Originally posted by Longey Nowze
i think what you are looking for is in the apple menu, right under the Dock menu there's a location menu, you can change locations from there! i if thisn't what you're looking then... sorry!

thank you
MaT

.....when i get my ibook back from applecare i'll try that thank you.

F/reW/re
May 27, 2003, 05:38 AM
The loaction changer in the Apple menu works great, but I would love to have the same for the energy saver.

Everytime I'm going to watch a movie (once everydag) I have to open the syspre/enery and change the settings and change it back when the movie is finished.

Chimaera
May 27, 2003, 06:55 AM
I'd really like a more comprehensive location manager that could (for example) do the following:

Change default printer based on location (so I can use my printer at home when at home, and work when I'm not)

Change my dock contents (there are applications I use regularly at home that I don't touch at work, and vice versa)

Change my login items contents (same as dock above)

Basically as has been suggested OSX doesn't need location manager as most people understand it (except for people that travel about a lot) but the beauty of OS9's location manager was that you could tie *other* settings to it - the location profiles included other profiles ans switched them all as necessary - something like that would be a welcome reappearance.

windboy
May 27, 2003, 07:01 AM
dumb question... but what are you doing when you link your ibook to your xbox??

Snowy_River
May 27, 2003, 10:37 AM
Originally posted by Chimaera
I'd really like a more comprehensive location manager that could (for example) do the following:

Change default printer based on location (so I can use my printer at home when at home, and work when I'm not)

Change my dock contents (there are applications I use regularly at home that I don't touch at work, and vice versa)

Change my login items contents (same as dock above)

Basically as has been suggested OSX doesn't need location manager as most people understand it (except for people that travel about a lot) but the beauty of OS9's location manager was that you could tie *other* settings to it - the location profiles included other profiles ans switched them all as necessary - something like that would be a welcome reappearance.

Yes, I agree. If a more comprehensive Location Manager were implemented, it could be a really good thing for some people. The ability to have it switch time zone, for example, would be a nice thing for me.


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Maclicious
May 27, 2003, 12:44 PM
Originally posted by windboy
dumb question... but what are you doing when you link your ibook to your xbox??

I'd like to know too, please :-).

foniks2020
May 27, 2003, 02:33 PM
i actually sent this in to Apple's feedback as a proposed feature... ;-p as i'm sure many others did.

I do hope that it works the way the article describes it... maybe it is also tied in to the multiple log on w/out log out? Seems likely. There is also the rumor of the re-emergence of themes in an Appearance CP... *crossing fingers* which of course would be integrated into locations as well, I'd presume... along with the Energy Saver Settings, Input/Output devices, Printers, Displays (ambient light isn't the same at home as it is in office), etc. So many wonderful ways to customize my laptop for different locations...

It's almost like I'd want to have the whole System Preferences app tied to it and be able to pick a location from a menu, then edit all of the Control Panels, pick another location and edit those independently and of course have some sort of Global settings that would become the 'defaults' for all locations.

my.02

sparkleytone
May 27, 2003, 03:57 PM
One thing that seems to slip everyones mind is that this will probably somehow be very involved with the rumored User Profile Management and its ability to be moved across Macs. To me that would indeed get into the term "Advanced Location Manager'.

DaveGee
May 27, 2003, 03:58 PM
What would it cost to add a 'GPS location reader' (dunno what it's really called) to a laptop... I'm not talking about transmitting a GPS location but just reading 'where I am'.

Then you could do some really cool stuff with location manager...

Imagine...

If I am at location 'x / y' with a radius of 'x feet / yards / etc' then use connection method x first followed by y followed by z else test for next defined location else default to 'modem'.

GPS might still be too expensive for this now but maybe in a few more years (or less) this would be a great hands off way to work with this kinda stuff.

Dave

Tim Flynn
May 27, 2003, 04:00 PM
A simplified answer.

In preferences -> network -> network port configuration; is a list of of ports for the "location" (typically "Automatic")
OS X searches down the list from the top. So if you have Ethernet first and say airport second, modem third, it tries to connect with ethernet first, if no luck goto airport etc.
Now if you want to use Ethernet with DHCP at work and Ethernet with static IP at home, you create a new location and a new list of network ports.

So ... if you use DHCP only then pick the order of search and OS X will sort out your connections. Like one user's experience in this list. (you might be able to to static ip this way aswell ?)

or if you want to use DHCP and static at different locations, then set them up and use the Location menu from the Apple menu.

I hope this helps.

frozenstar
May 28, 2003, 12:36 AM
I'd love to be able to create a fully customizable profile...
My first one would be "hacker mode", in which the wallpaper would turn solid black, the theme would change to Graphite, and the dock would only contain network and coding tools.

It'd be nice if they integrate profile management with .Mac, so that profiles can be pulled down from any Mac with an Internet connection.

nef919
May 28, 2003, 09:54 AM
Originally posted by uhlawboi80
ok im confused....i take my laptop to school, and it detects and logs onto the wireless network (though to get off campus i need the cisco VPN), then i bring it home and plug it into my router from my DSL and it just works, and then i take it to the coffee shop and use their wireless without problem...

i never change any settings, ever. So what you guys want seems to be unnecessary...:confused:
Same here. No problems between locations. I put the PBook to sleep and open it when needed, it pulls an address from whatever wireless network is available. As for places with static IP's I just choose it from locations. Modem access from hotel rooms with no broadband (shudder) works just as simply. Plug in modem and open safari, modem tries to dial out.

Chimaera
May 28, 2003, 10:13 AM
mabe not in terms of what location Manager WAS, but what they are adding could be fantastic

From macnews.net.tc - Currently, you define 'pointers' for a location. Printing, networking, connected servers, open applications, energy saver settings - even desktop pictures

Now then, let me go through these one at a time...

Printing - this means I can set up all the printers I use at work and have them available, but when I'm at home only the ones I have access to there are visible - saves trawling through a huge list (I currently have 32 printers installed for work alone)

Networking - ok fair enough, this is no use to me, however it is of *great* use to someone whose network settings are variable - for example someone who has DHCP-based network at work, but static based at home, or someone who uses different ISP settings based on location - for example if I used a modem to connect to the internet, in my home town I use a certain number (local number, not national, therefore free to call) but out of town that number is a *lot* more expensive to use, so would use the national-rate one available instead - this way no fuss to switch.

Connected Servers - this would be fantastically useful - I could set my laptop up so when I turn it on at work it connects to all the local servers at work I need access to, and at home it can connect to the fileservers there too - each time without waiting for it to fail to connect to a non-available service (which is the price of automatic logins if I were to use them as they stand).

Open Applications - I actualy posted a request about this a while back - my work necessitates certain applications to be on all the time, wheras my home interests use different applications, and theres very little crossover between the two - it would be very useful to me if i could specify startup items for each seperate location, and have the system switch accordingly.

Energy Save Settings - Truthfully this isn't much use to me personally, as 90% of the time I'm operating off the mains, however I can see the appeal of tying this panel in to the overall scheme of things

Desktop Picture - As with energy saver settings to be honest.

Basically as someone else said it would be *great* if location manager basically let you change more or less everything in the system preference panes with a single profile.

If this location manager turned out to be true, it would alone be a good enough reason for me to pay the upgrade fee, even if *nothing* else changed.

maradong
May 30, 2003, 03:44 AM
Originally posted by Macrumors
MacNews.net.tc claims (http://macintosh.fryke.com/cgi-bin/ikonboard/ikonboard.cgi?act=ST&f=10&t=102) that a revised Location Manager is a part of Panther.

certainly a newbish question:
but what is the location manager ?

Vroem
May 30, 2003, 04:14 AM
Another useful function for a location manager is smtp server. Because if you use the smtp server from your ISP (smtp.stupidisp.com) you wil probably not be able to send mail with your mail application when connected to another ISP, unless you change the server adress every time. (Of course this problem does not apply to .mac owners ;)) The same applies for news (nntp) servers.

Chimaera
May 30, 2003, 04:25 AM
true, this again would be useful to a lot of people but not to anyone who handles email throught a 3rd party (.Mac or something else of that ilk)

visor
Jun 1, 2003, 01:24 PM
Originally posted by uhlawboi80
ok im confused....i take my laptop to school, and it detects and logs onto the wireless network (though to get off campus i need the cisco VPN), then i bring it home and plug it into my router from my DSL and it just works, and then i take it to the coffee shop and use their wireless without problem...

i never change any settings, ever. So what you guys want seems to be unnecessary...:confused:

What you do is use DHCP on your networks.
This works great unless you need to have always the same IP for some reason, have more than one airport acces, have some more restricted - alias secure airports around, etc.
You wouldn't for example be able to find my airport with your autodetect.
You would be able to find the airport where I work, but you'd have absolutly no rights on the network - efficently beeing unable to do anything than surf the net, etc.

visor
Jun 1, 2003, 01:36 PM
Originally posted by Chimaera
mabe not in terms of what location Manager WAS, but what they are adding could be fantastic



Now then, let me go through these one at a time...



Connected Servers - this would be fantastically useful - I could set my laptop up so when I turn it on at work it connects to all the local servers at work I need access to, and at home it can connect to the fileservers there too - each time without waiting for it to fail to connect to a non-available service (which is the price of automatic logins if I were to use them as they stand).


Really man - this is actually my most requested new feature. I truely hate it when i forget to unmount a server someplac, and the sodding Ibook simply hangs until I reboot it someplace else.
and all this mounting all the time, use, say 6 different servers ... good grief. Best OSX offers now is the favorites - now the shares mostly aren't named very differntenly.
have 'Users' at home 'users' at work 'home' on some other server... blah...
If you click something wrong, you might end up needing to reboot because the ****ing panther lazes in the sun.
Damn - I REALLY hate the server mounting implementation right now.

I say - look at w2k - it notices the server is unavailable, notifies you - thats it. System is up and usable, the app using the connection might die - but it does anyway if the conn isn't available, so why wait for a couple of days?

frozenstar
Jun 2, 2003, 09:00 AM
Originally posted by Chimaera
true, this again would be useful to a lot of people but not to anyone who handles email throught a 3rd party (.Mac or something else of that ilk)

Not true. Many places require that you use the local SMTP server for outbound mail. The university I work at is one of them, for example. I have to manually change the SMTP server in Mail in order to use my Mac to send email while I'm on campus. Being able to automate that through a location manager would be a welcome feature.

Chimaera
Jul 14, 2003, 08:59 AM
Really? that seems overly restrictive to me - most ISP SMTP servers are inaccessable when using other connections, and this applies to every uni I'm familiar with too, but I have no difficulty using third party stuff either (in my case a server in a data center with shared ownership amongst a group of friends) - so to be more accurate:

ISP email - home only

Work Email - work only (or via VPN, but lets not get into that :))

Personal Email - wherever the hell I like as its not tied to any connection provider.

So basically what I'm trying to say is I've never seen a system that you *have* to use the providers SMTP server, but plenty of SMTP servers you can only use IF you are connected to their network (in fact almost all the free ones) - that make sense?