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MacRumors
Feb 16, 2007, 01:25 AM
http://www.macrumors.com/images/macrumorsthreadlogo.gif (http://www.macrumors.com)

Appleinsider provides (http://www.appleinsider.com/article.php?id=2500) additional confirmation that Apple is indeed working on a sub-notebook version of their MacBook line.

The rumor site draws parallels to Apple's PowerBook Duo (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PowerBook_Duo), Apple's first sub-notebook released in 1992. The Duo-line of PowerBooks offered a unique 152-pin port in the back that allowed it to connect to various Docks that provided additional functionality, such as external drives, video capabilities, and ethernet that were left off the notebook itself to maximize portability.

Appleinsider reports that the new mini MacBook will be "lighter and more compact than any other Mac portable Apple has put forth in recent years" and is on track for release near WWDC (http://guides.macrumors.com/WWDC) in mid 2007. Other features listed in the MacBook include the use of NAND flash ram to speed up boot times, as well as the exclusion of an optical drive to save on space.

The first rumors of a sub-compact ("Ultra-thin") notebook coming from Apple came in December 2006 (http://www.macrumors.com/2006/12/04/ultra-thin-12-macbook-pro/) from MacScoop. At that time, however, the rumors pointed to a MacBook Pro model that would see miniaturization with a 12" Widescreen display. It isn't clear if these two reports are related , and this new report may represent a distinct project.

A patent application (http://www.macrumors.com/2007/01/25/thin-macbook-with-bottom-mounted-optical-drive/) from January provided additional evidence that Apple had been actively working on methods to miniaturize their notebooks, with research into alternative locations for the optical drive in a laptop computer. Making smaller laptops was listed as the motivation for pursuing these alternative designs.



spicyapple
Feb 16, 2007, 01:28 AM
My wallet is ready. :)

I predict this sub-notebook will have a touch control screen instead of a traditional keyboard.

Superdrive
Feb 16, 2007, 01:28 AM
I'm ready to buy. Just don't put that optical drive in the bottom. :)

powermac_daddy
Feb 16, 2007, 01:31 AM
a lie

arn
Feb 16, 2007, 01:31 AM
Some of you may not have been around... but back in the day people really loved their Duos. Almost as much as people loved their Newtons. :)

arn

koobcamuk
Feb 16, 2007, 01:37 AM
I want a sub notebook but I would be surprised if it lacked a keyboard. I would sell my MacBook and prepare for Rev B of this new machine (not buying rev A again - although I have no problems with my Rev A MacBook I just don't like Rev A anymore).

Lacking a keyboard? hmmm....

I like the idea of something really small I can take around with me.

matticus008
Feb 16, 2007, 01:38 AM
Some of you may not have been around... but back in the day people really loved their Duos. Almost as much as people loved their Newtons. :)

arn
Oh yes, we did. Though looking back, they were a bit ridiculous, much like our clothing (blasphemy! I know).

siurpeeman
Feb 16, 2007, 01:45 AM
i can see an apple ultra portable, but a docking one? i'm not so sure about that. but boy, i remember wanting a duo back in the day.

DMann
Feb 16, 2007, 01:47 AM
Some of you may not have been around... but back in the day people really loved their Duos. Almost as much as people loved their Newtons. :)

arn

I have a Powerbook Duo still......... it was great 10 years ago.
Looking forward to the "Thin" incarnation to surface soon.

My wallet is ready. :)

I predict this sub-notebook will have a touch control screen instead of a traditional keyboard.

Now you're talking, Spicy Apple .........

aswitcher
Feb 16, 2007, 01:49 AM
I can see this thing being more expensive than a normal MacBook - touch screen and flashram HDD.

After G
Feb 16, 2007, 01:50 AM
This is good. I can't wait.

koobcamuk
Feb 16, 2007, 01:50 AM
This rumour really excites me. The iPhone - great, but I already have a phone. I am not really after a super duper phone (although I will probably buy one). I am after something really cool regarding portable laptops from Apple.

I always wanted a 12" Powerbook. Now I can afford one - it's not fast enough any more and is being phased out (software wise, over the next few years). I would happily sell my MacBook (UK seller, amazing condition, 2 years applecare ;)) and cannot wait for a professional looking small notebook that I can take with me around the world, surf the net and email from, give presentations with and actually do work on.

The MacBook is fine, but I want something pro for a change. I hope whatever's coming is metal I don't care about optical drives or not. A firewire add on is fine if u need one.

DeSnousa
Feb 16, 2007, 01:56 AM
I'm just glad to hear rumors that Apple is working on Mac products :cool:

Poff
Feb 16, 2007, 02:00 AM
YES! YES! YES!

This is what I've been waiting for!! :;:;:;) :D

Finally I can replace my Big Clunky PBG5!!

(but seriously, I'm really excited by this product..)

ero87
Feb 16, 2007, 02:00 AM
no optical drive would be ridiculous! no way apple would take such a huge step backwards.

4np
Feb 16, 2007, 02:01 AM
Other features listed in the MacBook include the use of NAND flash ram to speed up boot times

That definately sounds like Santa Rosa's Robson Caching...

billystlyes
Feb 16, 2007, 02:05 AM
I'm just glad to hear rumors that Apple is working on Mac products :cool:

I am too. But it seems like we keep hearing the same rumors over and over and over and over and over and over. Wish I had a dollar for every time I read about a 12" MacBook coming out. I might actually have enough money to buy when it does.:p

iMacZealot
Feb 16, 2007, 02:05 AM
I think anything smaller than 12 inches is almost unusable as a fully-featured computer. I think a 13 inch widescreen is the sweet spot in size. I'd really love to see a 13" MacBook Pro because I'd like more power than the MacBook, but in a smaller and more affordable package than the 15" MacBookPro.


If this is true, then mark my words: it'll be called the MacBook mini.

Squareball
Feb 16, 2007, 02:06 AM
no optical drive would be ridiculous! no way apple would take such a huge step backwards.

Actually it's a step forward. An ultra portable is meant to be used on the go and should be smaller and provide better battery life. I would say that on average I use my super drive 99% of the time to burn CDs/DVDs. I rarely rip my music (as I already did that years ago and new stuff I download from iTS) so dropping the DVD drive wouldn't be a huge loss.

They will promote it as 'take it anywhere' and promote iTunes Store to download digital media (such as movies and tv shows for your viewing on long trips).

The fact is, physical media as a way of distributing content is on its way out. In 10 years we'll look back at having DVD drives on everything and think 'how quaint'.

iAlan
Feb 16, 2007, 02:07 AM
I'm just glad to hear rumors that Apple is working on Mac products :cool:


Aren't we all...

I hope it has a real type-on-the-plastic-buttons keyboard, the latest 'touch-screen' technology as demo'd on the iPhone and a new incarnation of Inkwell. I can see a need for all three on a small form factor laptop.

I know there are a lot of people out there who do not like the whole 'tablet' concept, but if anyone can do it with style and true functionality, Apple can. A reversable screen folding back on the keyboard to allow full use of the screen in tablet mode for touch and Inkwell would be cool.

And who is to say that the patent discussed here (http://www.macrumors.com/2007/02/15/patent-wireless-iphone-charging-station/) is purely for the iPhone - could easily be incorporated into a smallform factor laptop...

Bring it on...

Squareball
Feb 16, 2007, 02:08 AM
That definately sounds like Santa Rosa's Robson Caching...

Indeed. There are already going to be 100gb microdrives out this year. Combine that with the Robson caching and the removal of the dvd drive and you have a LOT of free space left. Throw in a nice intel processor and a screen and you can get battery life around 8 hours or more.

mashinhead
Feb 16, 2007, 02:09 AM
what a year. maybe appleinsider can write an article about how everyone on macrumors will be broke by the end of 2007.



i know i will be.

Clive At Five
Feb 16, 2007, 02:11 AM
It's unlikely for AI to post a report without Shaw Wu's confirmation. They must be really certain about this one ;)

I'd say multi-touch has a *chance* at this one, but if it comes with a keyboard and trackpad, navigation technology will be redundant. So, the question is, will Apple ditch the keyboard and mouse (and if so, what will they do with all the blank space), or will they give the user that redundant technology (with an inflated price tag).

OR option 3 is that they don't offer multi-touch at all, which probably has the most credence. I'd say, let it run our iPods and iPhones for a year first, then move it into bigger platforms.

-Clive

koobcamuk
Feb 16, 2007, 02:15 AM
I really do not want a tablet to be released. What do you people use tablets for?

I think 12" widescreen or something more 12" PB size would be so awesome.

iMacZealot
Feb 16, 2007, 02:17 AM
It's unlikely for AI to post a report without Shaw Wu's confirmation. They must be really certain about this one ;)

I'd say multi-touch has a *chance* at this one, but if it comes with a keyboard and trackpad, navigation technology will be redundant. So, the question is, will Apple ditch the keyboard and mouse (and if so, what will they do with all the blank space), or will they give the user that redundant technology (with an inflated price tag).

OR option 3 is that they don't offer multi-touch at all, which probably has the most credence. I'd say, let it run our iPods and iPhones for a year first, then move it into bigger platforms.

-Clive


Maybe it'll just be the top half (the screen part) with no laptop hinge or table swivel. Maybe it'll be all mutli-touch. I remember some patents with a device looking like this not too long ago.

bdkennedy1
Feb 16, 2007, 02:23 AM
OMG. The end of the optical drive like the floppy drive on the iMac. Steve quit making me feel old! Or do you have some sort of technology for that?

Clive At Five
Feb 16, 2007, 02:29 AM
If Apple tossed in a 4 or even 8GB flash drive, I'd say "see ya" to the optical drive. ODDs are barbaric. All these years and we're still using freaking spinning media! Not only that but think about how scratch-prone they are!

Not to say flash drives are indestructible (I know first-hand), but they're much easier, quicker, and sturdier than Optical media. The only complaint some might have is storage... in which case, don't buy this computer. Simple as that.

-Clive

Cepe Indicum
Feb 16, 2007, 02:32 AM
This sounds great... the first rumour I've actually got excited about in ages! Probably because it's Mac related.

With the miniaturisation on show in iPhone, this should be fairly easy for Apple, shouldn't it? Take away the Multitouch, replace it with an actual keyboard and track pad, increase hard-drive and RAM (which there is plenty of room to do, given that it'll be bigger than iPhone) and - in the words of Mr Jobs himself - "Boom"! :)

siurpeeman
Feb 16, 2007, 02:34 AM
I think anything smaller than 12 inches is almost unusable as a fully-featured computer. I think a 13 inch widescreen is the sweet spot in size. I'd really love to see a 13" MacBook Pro because I'd like more power than the MacBook, but in a smaller and more affordable package than the 15" MacBookPro.


If this is true, then mark my words: it'll be called the MacBook mini.

Not the MiniBook or NanoBook?

fraggle
Feb 16, 2007, 02:34 AM
I think anything smaller than 12 inches is almost unusable as a fully-featured computer. I think a 13 inch widescreen is the sweet spot in size. I'd really love to see a 13" MacBook Pro because I'd like more power than the MacBook, but in a smaller and more affordable package than the 15" MacBookPro.

I used a 10" Sony laptop a few years back. Of course no optical drive in it but for use on the road is was great! Today I would also prefer 12" as I need a decent resolution!

If this is true, then mark my words: it'll be called the MacBook mini.

MacBook Pro mini!

The reason mainly being that it will be more expensive than a MacBook (being smaller normally makes things more expensive...) and they will probably use an enclosure similar to the MacBook Pros (metal, not plastic).

Clive At Five
Feb 16, 2007, 02:42 AM
Not the MiniBook or NanoBook?

No way. Apple LOVES its consistent product matrix.

Now the only odd ball is the iMac... or the lack of "iMacBook," however you choose to look at it.

If Apple ever DOES come out with a prosumer tower, how will they ever avoid just calling it "Mac"? Maybe THIS is why there isn't one.

heh... totally kidding.

-Clive

mixel
Feb 16, 2007, 02:49 AM
I really do not want a tablet to be released. What do you people use tablets for?

Art. I'd love a photoshop running mac-tablet. If it had a docking keyboard type thing that'd be fine too.

I'd *really* love something like a giiiant nintendo DS with a touch keyboard at the bottom.. That'd be crazy. :D as long as it was small enough to put on your lap fully open in any orientation anyway.

iMacZealot
Feb 16, 2007, 02:50 AM
No way. Apple LOVES its consistent product matrix.

Now the only odd ball is the iMac... or the lack of "iMacBook," however you choose to look at it.

If Apple ever DOES come out with a prosumer tower, how will they ever avoid just calling it "Mac"? Maybe THIS is why there isn't one.

heh... totally kidding.

-Clive


Yeah, they've split the line from the i's and power's to Mac and MacBook. You have the two pro's (Mac Pro and MacBook Pro,) and it would make sense to have a MacBook Mini to complement the Mac Mini. While the iMac doesn't really fit anymore, it wouldn't make sense to have a computer just called "Mac." However, I have a feeling that when it's redesigned, the iMac may also see a new name.

coffeecty
Feb 16, 2007, 02:57 AM
Why hasn't anyone suggested something like This (http://pc-museum.com/031-compaq/rcm-031.jpg)?
I remember using this at my school ages ago. It was a DREAM to use.
Ok, I know it was running Windows... And yes, it was 1994, but Come on It was so cool for the time.
I could imagine Apple releasing something somewhat similar to that design. No trackpad, a touchscreen, and either a detachable (but I know Steve would never approve something that could possibly be removed from the product to make it slightly less usable) or built in KB.
And, possibly it would be clad in the same 5 colour scheme of the shuffles?

nagromme
Feb 16, 2007, 03:00 AM
Ah, the Duo. The first Mac I couldn't stop myself from wanting even in my anti-Mac days.

I think I can hold out for Penryn to be added... but if the thing comes out with at least 128 MB of real VRAM, I may have to buy now! Even if that means giving up an iPhone and some meals....

I don't expect a touchscreen though. A keyboard and mouse have traditional advantages that make a touchscreen unnecessary--and I don't see it being a convertible if the plan is ultrathin. (Which is just what I want--and an external optical drive is A-OK with me.)

freddiecable
Feb 16, 2007, 03:13 AM
Specs:

1. 10 - 12" widescreen OLED.
2. 32GB NAND + 80 GB 1.8"-drive.
3. Regular keyboard (multitouch can't replace this as I see it).
4. Multitouch-enabled larger touch/mouse-pad for enhanced interaction with adapted applications like iPhoto? (don't believe the screen is going to be multitouched since it's going to be ruined and it's not properly fixed so it will be pushed back all the time).
5. No optical drive.
6. Very slim and light.

Philsy
Feb 16, 2007, 03:29 AM
A Duo-type dock is so last century.

How about a mini notebook computer that automatically and wirelessly links to your full size keyboard, mouse and screen whenever it is in range of them?

That, I'd like. :apple:

pesc
Feb 16, 2007, 03:29 AM
Not that I think it will ever happen, but I really wish Apple would have the guts to NOT use widescreen aspect ratio on a subnotebook.

For a computer meant to WORK with, the more pixels the better. Given the same PPI, a widescreen (reduced height screen) has fewer pixels than 4:3. And at subnotebook sizes, the extra pixels that 4:3 gives would be welcome.

Unless all you do is watching movies.

NewSc2
Feb 16, 2007, 03:34 AM
Does anybody seriously think Apple's "doing away" with optical drives? What is Apple going to do, sell Leopard pre-mounted onto flash drives? Download it?

We still use spinning hard drives, and spinning optical drives will be around for a long, long time. When we get affordable 60GB flash-based hard drives, we'll have cheaper 500GB or even 1TB laptop hard drives.

CaptainHaddock
Feb 16, 2007, 03:36 AM
They really need this for the Japanese market. Macs are big in Japan, but there is no laptop small enough right now. The current 13" Macbooks are far bigger than what most people buy. The typical laptop in use here is around 10", but Japanese text on a small screen in Windows is just hideous.

I suspect, even hope, that this product will be designed with the Japanese market in mind first, and also gain a following in Apple's other markets. There are boatloads of money to be made in Japan, but all Apple's recent products have been designed for Americans.

timmillwood
Feb 16, 2007, 03:51 AM
Just what i want!

A Flybook with Mac OS X on it

12" sounds to big for what i want, i want an e-mail, web browser, word processer, quick code editor, which is bigger than a phone and smaller than a laptop. would like to see built in HSDPA

I switched from a Powermac to a macbook pro because i need portability for some small tasks, but all main tasks are at home. I am now missing the speed to would like a macbook and mac pro, but if i could get a smaller macbook (like flybook size) that would be so much better.

JVC
Feb 16, 2007, 04:21 AM
If this is true, then mark my words: it'll be called the MacBook mini.

Then, 1-2 years later, it'll be replaced by the scratch-tastic MacBook nano ;)

tny
Feb 16, 2007, 04:25 AM
Does anybody seriously think Apple's "doing away" with optical drives? What is Apple going to do, sell Leopard pre-mounted onto flash drives? Download it?


The thing will have FireWire target mode, so you can do a reinstall from another Mac, or you can use an external FireWire or USB drive - maybe Apple will even release its own external solution (unlikely, though). This won't be a machine for Photoshop or Final Cut or Logic, but primarily for mail, web, and word processing, so they'll expect most of the software to be downloaded (not sure what the MS Office folks will do, unless MS starts offerring Office as a download). I'd expect an Apple subnotebook to be something like the VAIO VGN-TX2, with an 11.1 in. widescreen (though the 8.9 in. size has its proponents); I'd expect a miniaturized version of the MacBook keyboard and trackpad (fix the button, please), one FireWire, two USB 2.0, an audio jack, a mini-DVI connector, no memory card slots, and no iSight (which would also make it an ideal choice for use in no-camera environments), 1 GB of RAM, and a price in the $1999 range, and the name MacBook mini. Black finish like the black MacBook, glossy screen, WiFi and Bluetooth - maybe even built-in Cingular EDGE.

j26
Feb 16, 2007, 04:26 AM
A Duo-type dock is so last century.

How about a mini notebook computer that automatically and wirelessly links to your full size keyboard, mouse and screen whenever it is in range of them?

That, I'd like. :apple:

Not necessarily a good idea - you're in the living room checking your e-mail and the screen in the study lights up (where your wife is working) just as you're reading a lovelove from your girlfirend :eek: :eek: )

Philsy
Feb 16, 2007, 04:41 AM
Not necessarily a good idea - you're in the living room checking your e-mail and the screen in the study lights up (where your wife is working) just as you're reading a lovelove from your girlfirend :eek: :eek: )

LOL! You obviously have a guilty mind. ;)

OK, so some sort of porn/illicite love letter/football result filter will be required.. :p

mrwonkers
Feb 16, 2007, 04:52 AM
I don't care about the specs as long as it comes in "Zune Brown". ZooPoo 4 short ;)

But alas I know Its just a fantasy........oh well....sigh....

Leoff
Feb 16, 2007, 04:53 AM
OMG. The end of the optical drive like the floppy drive on the iMac. Steve quit making me feel old! Or do you have some sort of technology for that?

This is HARDLY the end of the optical drive. Optical media is in far greater daily use to not be an abandoned format than the floppy.

The mini laptop itself will not have an optical drive, but that doesn't mean one won't somehow be included (a small external drive included? Part of an included dock?)

auyongtc
Feb 16, 2007, 05:05 AM
I'd say it'll be called the :apple: MacPad :p

What's smaller than a notebook? A notepad, of course! :rolleyes:

You heard it here first :D

devilot
Feb 16, 2007, 05:08 AM
Figures this rumor solidifies the week I buy a MB. :o Sigh. Would definitely prefer a smaller, lighter notebook.

Hattig
Feb 16, 2007, 05:21 AM
no optical drive would be ridiculous! no way apple would take such a huge step backwards.

I never use the optical drive on my iBook when I'm not at home.

So why have it internal on a subnotebook? It is a waste of space.

Stick the optical drive in the docking bay / slimline USB enclosure.

Cepe Indicum
Feb 16, 2007, 05:23 AM
If there are no major product announcements before June, then WWDC this year will be very expensive...

- iPhone
- Leopard + iWork
- 'MacBook mini'

Guess Apple will keep updating the other product lines before June tho. I still think that this is gonna be an amazine year for Apple, Inc.

emotion
Feb 16, 2007, 05:23 AM
Figures this rumor solidifies the week I buy a MB. :o Sigh. Would definitely prefer a smaller, lighter notebook.

There were also heavy rumours of a 12" mbp the week after I bought my macbook (a 12" pb replacement).

The way I dealt with it was to think that I wouldn't want a Rev A machine :)

I still think this macbook is a little big.

pizzacake
Feb 16, 2007, 05:49 AM
I think it's a great idea. My sister recently bought a 3 yr old second hand 12.1" IBM Thinkpad ultraportable notebook for £150 (couldn't afford a mac :( ). Stay with me here, I know the OS stinks but the hardware has some really cool features.

It's really compact and light because IBM has done away with the optical drive and the touchpad.

The keyboard has a red nipple in the middle called a TrackPoint which is the pointing device. Let me tell you this thing rocks. In my opinion its so much quicker and easier to use than a touchpad (comparing it to my other sister's MacBook touchpad). You don't have to move your hand away from the keyboard to move the mouse pointer. I love this thing :D Did any Apple notebooks ever have a TrackPoint?

The optical drive is in the dock.

Hopefully Apple has something equal to TrackPoint or buy the rights to use it. Anyway have a look for yourself at http://shop.lenovo.com/SEUILibrary/controller/catalog.workflow:category.details?current-catalog-id=12F0696583E04D86B9B79B0FEC01C087&current-category-id=135A781CA29B4ECB9ADAD8E72CF6FD61 and http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trackpoint

emotion
Feb 16, 2007, 06:00 AM
Did any Apple notebooks ever have a TrackPoint?


Arrrgh no! not the dreaded nipple!

Admittedly I've not really given IBM's implementation of this a go (I had one on a Dell machine, the IBMs are meant to be ok).

Trackpad please Apple.

BigPrince
Feb 16, 2007, 06:10 AM
MATTE SCREEN please

MacVault
Feb 16, 2007, 06:11 AM
Sounds cool! But to compare it to the old Duo seems a little strange... I HATE those docking contraptions.

em500
Feb 16, 2007, 06:16 AM
Hopefully Apple has something equal to TrackPoint or buy the rights to use it.
No. The trackpoint seems to be a very polarizing love-it or hate-it thing, at least, more than a trackpad. I'm a bit of a fan myself, but I must say, the IBM trackpoints that I've used were a lot better than those on Compaqs and (especially) Toshibas. But Apple does have a NIH syndrome about these things, so unless it's unambiguously superior than the alternatives, forget it. They even ditched the Synaptic licensed trackpad an in-house implementation.

As far as optical drives are concerned, ditch it ASAP. In a subnotebook like the PBG4 they are the biggest component in there. It made the PBG4 bigger and heavier than almost any competing 12" laptop on the market. I'd much rather they make the machine smaller or spend the room on a bigger battery. For those who need it, a slim-line FW drive can be very compact. No need to force everybody to carry an optical drive all the time, even those who rarely need it.

j26
Feb 16, 2007, 06:22 AM
At this stage nobody would have me!:(
<<<---------- I mean, look at me;)
LOL! You obviously have a guilty mind. ;)

jellomizer
Feb 16, 2007, 06:28 AM
Are Docking stations still useful? I know on older models and some of other companies more poorly designed laptops may need one because you had a lot of plugs to plug in Monitor, Keyboard, Mouse, Network, Printer, Zip Drive... But Now all you really need is a USB Hub and plug that in and the display. Seeing how most docks are very clunky and picky and difficult to get docked, Plugging in 1 USB Port and a Monitor on the side seems very easy.

Making a Dock 3rd party for a MBP isn't that hard either. if you have like a C-Clamp and some guides then all the connections just plug right in.

Jeonat
Feb 16, 2007, 06:39 AM
Flash RAM and no optical drive? Hmm it could be like the $100 laptop! Only about $1000 instead! :D

jouster
Feb 16, 2007, 06:43 AM
I really do not want a tablet to be released. What do you people use tablets for?

In other words, because you don't want one, no one should be able to have one?

dernhelm
Feb 16, 2007, 06:58 AM
no optical drive would be ridiculous! no way apple would take such a huge step backwards.

No kidding. I mean USB flash drives are great, but even on a subnotebook, I want to be able to watch a movie, rip my music, and install software. Nobody wants to screw around with an external USB CD, but I might not mind if my optical drive had a non-standard placement....

Arrrgh no! not the dreaded nipple!

Admittedly I've not really given IBM's implementation of this a go (I had one on a Dell machine, the IBMs are meant to be ok).

Trackpad please Apple.

I have given IBM implementation of this a go, and it is terrible. No way apple does this - they'll use a trackpad. If it isn't a trackpad, a multi-touch interface is more likely.

BenRoethig
Feb 16, 2007, 06:59 AM
Now here's the million dollar question, are we talking about a lighter full featured notebook like the 12" Powerbook or the dell XPS in the 4lbs range or a slower low voltage machine in the 3lbs range.

Philsy
Feb 16, 2007, 07:01 AM
At this stage nobody would have me!:(
<<<---------- I mean, look at me;)

Oh I dunno, I have a thing for yellow fur :p

Philsy
Feb 16, 2007, 07:01 AM
No kidding. I mean USB flash drives are great, but even on a subnotebook, I want to be able to watch a movie, rip my music, and install software. Nobody wants to screw around with an external USB CD, but I might not mind if my optical drive had a non-standard placement....

Goes back to my plan for wireless docking - let's have a wireless drive as well... :cool:

DTphonehome
Feb 16, 2007, 07:05 AM
I predict this sub-notebook will have a touch control screen instead of a traditional keyboard.

Oh, puhlease. Try using one of those "laser projection" keyboards that project onto a tabletop and let me know how useful you think it is to have ZERO tactile feedback.

Chef Medeski
Feb 16, 2007, 07:06 AM
Specs:

1. 10 - 12" widescreen OLED.
2. 32GB NAND + 80 GB 1.8"-drive.
3. Regular keyboard (multitouch can't replace this as I see it).
4. Multitouch-enabled larger touch/mouse-pad for enhanced interaction with adapted applications like iPhoto? (don't believe the screen is going to be multitouched since it's going to be ruined and it's not properly fixed so it will be pushed back all the time).
5. No optical drive.
6. Very slim and light.

Yes... magically fit keyboard and a multi-touch touch pad in 10" space. Yeah right.....

Chef Medeski
Feb 16, 2007, 07:08 AM
A Duo-type dock is so last century.

How about a mini notebook computer that automatically and wirelessly links to your full size keyboard, mouse and screen whenever it is in range of them?

That, I'd like. :apple:

Ehhh I rather have on dock port that connect to a little monitor port, power, extra USB and Firewire. But the instant bluetooth would be nice. I would also love a switchable bluetooth. Like to switch ur bluetooth keyboard/mouse between computers instantly like a KVM.....but wireless. Its purely software so it would be easy to do.

DTphonehome
Feb 16, 2007, 07:11 AM
Does anybody seriously think Apple's "doing away" with optical drives? What is Apple going to do, sell Leopard pre-mounted onto flash drives? Download it?

We still use spinning hard drives, and spinning optical drives will be around for a long, long time. When we get affordable 60GB flash-based hard drives, we'll have cheaper 500GB or even 1TB laptop hard drives.

There's no reason they can't include a slim external drive (or sell it as an option). PC subnotebooks have been doing that for years. Anyway, I hope they DO get rid of the internal optical drive. Like many here, I rarely use my MacBook's drive. Since I got it in July, I've used it maybe 10 times total. And almost never while travelling.

koobcamuk
Feb 16, 2007, 07:15 AM
In other words, because you don't want one, no one should be able to have one?

Essentially, yes. I do not want Apple to waste the time and money on a tablet. If they do, I will eat my phone.

I needn't worry about it because a tablet would not sell well compared to a mini MBP. So no worries.

Tablets are crap for any kind of work involving lots of text inputs. This is why we will not see a mac tablet.

dernhelm
Feb 16, 2007, 07:25 AM
There's no reason they can't include a slim external drive (or sell it as an option). PC subnotebooks have been doing that for years. Anyway, I hope they DO get rid of the internal optical drive. Like many here, I rarely use my MacBook's drive. Since I got it in July, I've used it maybe 10 times total. And almost never while travelling.

Yeah I know, but that all just seems so inelegant. Messing about with cables, and "where'd I put my drive" and all that. Apple in the past has made some pretty proud statements about the fact that they don't ship crippled laptops in order to ship light laptops. It'd be interesting if they viewed having no optical drive in your subnotebook as crippling it.

Chef Medeski
Feb 16, 2007, 07:30 AM
Essentially, yes. I do not want Apple to waste the time and money on a tablet. If they do, I will eat my phone.

I needn't worry about it because a tablet would not sell well compared to a mini MBP. So no worries.

Tablets are crap for any kind of work involving lots of text inputs. This is why we will not see a mac tablet.

http://msnbcmedia.msn.com/j/msnbc/Components/Photos/060309/060309_origami_hmed_6a.standard.jpg

Umm well heavy text input maybe hard but thats what bluetooth keyboards are for.

If you want to do light to medium typing, a keyboard like in the origami would be great. Since typing on a hybrid tablet and inputing using pen is a pain. So, this would be even easier for light-to medium typing.

Light typing like search words or changing titles is easily done with on screen non-dynamic keyboards.

So lets see keyboard less tablets would actually be easier for up to medium typing, but higher than that would need a keyboard. But usually those situations only arrive at an office or at home withere a bluetooth keyboard would be easy to keep.

I say go slate. Get an on board keyboard. Ditch the keyboard. Ditch the optical drive.

Now that makes for a light computer. Make it 12"-13" and suddenly you have what people have always been hoping for..... a virtual notepad. Plus battery life would be a lot more. Sans optical, sans keyboard.

Yvan256
Feb 16, 2007, 07:31 AM
I really don't see the point of making thinner laptops. They could be a bit thinner yes, but a 11x8" laptop is going to require the same room no matter its thickness. It doesn't matter if it's 2 inches thick or 0.25 inch thick, it still takes 11x8" room to use, carry around, etc.

Sub-notebook is about overall size and weight, not about how thin it can be.

If Apple makes a sub-notebook I hope it's really ultra-portable, not only ultra-thin.

Edit: I'm also with the "we don't need optical drive in sub-notebooks" crowd. In these days of internet downloads, wi-fi networking and external USB and FireWire drives, it's not needed anymore. At least not in a sub-notebook.

emotion
Feb 16, 2007, 07:32 AM
Now here's the million dollar question, are we talking about a lighter full featured notebook like the 12" Powerbook or the dell XPS in the 4lbs range or a slower low voltage machine in the 3lbs range.

Good question.

Personally I'd like a small machine but much smaller than the pbg4 12" is possbly a little too cut down for me. I'd probably need something above the ULV level. maybe the LV chip that Intel have just come out with (2x1.5GHz with decent cahce size....will be upped to 1.6 for santa rosa) would suffice for my needs.

As for the trackpad, apple has some nice features on their trackpad that they'd be daft to ditch.


Optical media: I hardly ever use mine but I don't know how represntative I actually am of the market. I'd be very happy with an external drive.

sionharris
Feb 16, 2007, 07:34 AM
I predict it will have no screen at all, because it will be.......






MacBook Shuffle

I WAS the one
Feb 16, 2007, 07:42 AM
I really do not want a tablet to be released. What do you people use tablets for?

I think 12" widescreen or something more 12" PB size would be so awesome.

I'm a cartoonist, I used to work with a cintiq and I loved it. Today I work with two monitors and a wacom tablet. I really love te idea of a real Mac Tablet. right now the ModBook looks apealing but it's not Apple's product so at the end I don't trust it. so, if Apple works on a tablet I will buy it!

Porco
Feb 16, 2007, 07:45 AM
Not that I think it will ever happen, but I really wish Apple would have the guts to NOT use widescreen aspect ratio on a subnotebook.

For a computer meant to WORK with, the more pixels the better. Given the same PPI, a widescreen (reduced height screen) has fewer pixels than 4:3. And at subnotebook sizes, the extra pixels that 4:3 gives would be welcome.

Unless all you do is watching movies.

That's only true if you view widescreen as "widescreen (reduced height screen)" rather than 'widecreen (increased width screen)'.

Is the glass half-full of half-empty? :p

Yes more pixels is better, but with the same number of pixels (the only fair comparison surely?) a widescreen is more natural to view and more useful to most people, IMHO (and in Apple's opinion it seems).

andiwm2003
Feb 16, 2007, 07:45 AM
Are Docking stations still useful? I know on older models and some of other companies more poorly designed laptops may need one because you had a lot of plugs to plug in Monitor, Keyboard, Mouse, Network, Printer, Zip Drive... But Now all you really need is a USB Hub and plug that in and the display. Seeing how most docks are very clunky and picky and difficult to get docked, Plugging in 1 USB Port and a Monitor on the side seems very easy.

Making a Dock 3rd party for a MBP isn't that hard either. if you have like a C-Clamp and some guides then all the connections just plug right in.

only usb and monitor?:rolleyes:

how about power? firewire 800 for external HD? firwire 400 for ipod dock? audio out? microphone?

please, give me a good docking station!

rockthecasbah
Feb 16, 2007, 07:45 AM
I really hope Apple begins to embrace the subcompact market. This could be so awesome: a tiny, powerful little notebook with great battery life to tote around on the college campus!

*salivates*

fraggle
Feb 16, 2007, 07:46 AM
Does anybody seriously think Apple's "doing away" with optical drives? What is Apple going to do, sell Leopard pre-mounted onto flash drives? Download it?

Hu? They will of course provide an external drive. Just because it's not built in doesn't mean there is no way to connect an optical drive!

kerpow
Feb 16, 2007, 07:57 AM
Its really good to hear that Apple are making exciting computer products again. There's been nothing to shout about since the iMac G5 came out. iPod, iPhone, Apple TV all great (and very profitable) but its the computers that tickle my pickle :)

Its not for me, I'm sick of my 12" PB and can't wait to buy something with a bigger screen, but it will sell well and show that Apple is innovating again.

iomar
Feb 16, 2007, 08:03 AM
I would love to get one of these too.

balamw
Feb 16, 2007, 08:08 AM
Does anybody seriously think Apple's "doing away" with optical drives? What is Apple going to do, sell Leopard pre-mounted onto flash drives? Download it?
Given that external USB DVD drives can be had CHEAP, it's not to much of a stretch to want an ultraportable without the optical drive.

You don't need to install Leopard on the road that often, do you?

B

balamw
Feb 16, 2007, 08:16 AM
MacBook Shuffle
Whatever you type it randomly reads back the result of a Google I feel lucky search.

Sounds a bit like the Hitchhiker's Guide. :p
B

Digitalclips
Feb 16, 2007, 08:39 AM
My wallet is ready. :)

I predict this sub-notebook will have a touch control screen instead of a traditional keyboard.

Or both maybe.. Bluetooth keyboard would be an easy optional extra and still maintain zero built in keyboard as you (most likely correctly) suggest :)

princealfie
Feb 16, 2007, 08:40 AM
Okay, perhaps it's ditch that 15" Macbook thing and get what I truly desire.

A really portable MacBook! Woohooo I'm on board. Choo choo.

Centris 650
Feb 16, 2007, 08:45 AM
A year or 2 ago I posted somewhere that I would love a sub-notebook even if it came without an optical drive. Not having an optical drive isn't as big of a loss as it was a few years ago especially with the advent and price dropping of flash drives. Could optical drives go the way of the floppy drive? Now granted there are many who need to burn dvd's for video projects and the like but for many it's not that important.

I have an iBook and an iMac. I rarely use the optical drive in my iBook. Most of the data I transfer is done through .mac and flashdrives. I'm really interested in this macbook mini. The main issue will be price. If it's priced right I think these things will sell like crazy.

Grakkle
Feb 16, 2007, 08:53 AM
Sounds interesting. I suspect it could be popular, though I won't be buying one. I'd much rather have a larger notebook with a larger screen, an optical drive, and more practicality for general use.

That being said, I'm sure there is a market for an ultraportable machine, especially since there's virtually nothing like it on the market today.

glennyboiwpg
Feb 16, 2007, 08:59 AM
Hey instead of a keyboard, why not make the laptop like a nintendo DS and have just a big flipscreen. Then you have have a sweet virtual keyboard with the brand new iphone touch screen technology.


Thats the ticket!

Rocketman
Feb 16, 2007, 08:59 AM
Some of you may not have been around... but back in the day people really loved their Duos. Almost as much as people loved their Newtons. :)

arn

More to the point APPLE loved Duos. They had high hopes for the form factor. The chip switch to PowerPC (from 68030 tp 68LC040 to 603e) was not all that great for ultra-compacts (video performance sucked) at first so it killed that thread of Apple products, then narrowing of the line generally killed off more.

But Apple PR always purred when Duo's were involved and Management really pushed them.

They were really expensive too as I recall.

Now that chip speeds are somewhat level and in any case they are now fast enough for any consumer application that people no longer wait for their computer very much, it becomes a form factor marketing effort. This is something Apple is good at. I posted about this a couple times late last year and early this year.

Rocketman

Hey instead of a keyboard, why not make the laptop like a nintendo DS and have just a big flipscreen. Then you have have a sweet virtual keyboard with the brand new iphone touch screen technology.


Thats the ticket!

Apple's patent application does exactly that.

They show the lower display interchangeably being a keyboard, a series of video-audio controls and pots, a piano keyboard, etc.

I for one hope it is a 3-4x iPhone sized pad (ATNN) which docks to your base hooked to CD, extra HD (ZFS/backup), hardwire internet, power and either a bluetooth or USB keyboard.

Rocketman

Zadillo
Feb 16, 2007, 09:08 AM
I don't understand this idea that you have to ditch the optical drive still to make an ultraportable. Certainly this used to be the case, but this is an engineering issue that has already been figured out:

http://www.dynamism.com/g1/main.shtml
http://www.dynamism.com/tx93/main.shtml
http://www.dynamism.com/r6/main.shtml
http://www.dynamism.com/t5/main.shtml

etc.

Really, a lot of these companies have figured out how to make some incredibly thin and light laptops while still putting full optical drives in there, so I don't see why Apple can't do this as well.

I would much prefer to have the optical drive built-in, even if it wasn't used much; I used to own an old Toshiba Portege, which was awesome because it was so thin and light, but having to carry around the big external CD-ROM drive at the time was a pain.

b0ned0me
Feb 16, 2007, 09:17 AM
That being said, I'm sure there is a market for an ultraportable machine, especially since there's virtually nothing like it on the market today.
Nothing like it? Try the Thinkpad X60, which people in our company are ordering in a frenzy since they were offered as a standard alternative to a full-size laptop. I have one on order. I have no idea about the sales numbers, but from the number I have seen around the place, they must be selling like hot cakes. With 4gb flash drives under £20, 54g wireless networks everywhere and external DVD burners under £35, who cares about optical drives? You can get an 8gb memory stick for £130, for crying out loud - it's a lot easier to carry than a couple of DVDs.

Zadillo
Feb 16, 2007, 09:19 AM
Nothing like it? Try the Thinkpad X60, which people in our company are ordering in a frenzy since they were offered as a standard alternative to a full-size laptop. I have one on order. I have no idea about the sales numbers, but from the number I have seen around the place, they must be selling like hot cakes. With 4gb flash drives under £20, 54g wireless networks everywhere and external DVD burners under £35, who cares about optical drives? You can get an 8gb memory stick for £130, for crying out loud - it's a lot easier to carry than a couple of DVDs.

Yeah, I got a chance to try out an X60.......... awesome little machine (although not as convenient if you do need to carry the docking station around, at which point a Vaio TX is a better bet).

tkn
Feb 16, 2007, 09:21 AM
I don't understand this idea that you have to ditch the optical drive still to make an ultraportable. Certainly this used to be the case, but this is an engineering issue that has already been figured out:

http://www.dynamism.com/g1/main.shtml
http://www.dynamism.com/tx93/main.shtml
http://www.dynamism.com/r6/main.shtml
http://www.dynamism.com/t5/main.shtml

etc.

Really, a lot of these companies have figured out how to make some incredibly thin and light laptops while still putting full optical drives in there, so I don't see why Apple can't do this as well.

I would much prefer to have the optical drive built-in, even if it wasn't used much; I used to own an old Toshiba Portege, which was awesome because it was so thin and light, but having to carry around the big external CD-ROM drive at the time was a pain.

Yeah, the Panasonics and the other superlights have been out for years in Japan. They can eliminate the optical drive if they make it even lighter than there, but I have a feeling it will probably weigh over 3 pounds and still not have an optical drive. I will still buy one unless it is a tablet or something weird like that.

Zadillo
Feb 16, 2007, 09:25 AM
Yeah, the Panasonics and the other superlights have been out for years in Japan. They can eliminate the optical drive if they make it even lighter than there, but I have a feeling it will probably weigh over 3 pounds and still not have an optical drive. I will still buy one unless it is a tablet or something weird like that.

Yeah, if they have a good reason for eliminating the optical drive, I'm all for it.

But I really don't want to see them release a 1" thin 3 pound ultralight but then use some excuse about how they got rid of the optical drive to make it so "thin" and "light".

gkarris
Feb 16, 2007, 09:33 AM
I predict it will have no screen at all, because it will be.......






MacBook Shuffle

It just sits there in its randomness...

The Universe is random...

Spectrum
Feb 16, 2007, 09:45 AM
Waiting for:
12" non widescreen. Matte.
Aluminium.
No optical drive.
Full size, PB/MBPro class keyboard.
HiSpeed Wifi + mini DV for connectivity.
Low power Core Duo. Intel graphics.
up to 2GB RAM
up to 80GB HD (1.8" with same NAND help).
3lb.
$1500.

kerpow
Feb 16, 2007, 10:00 AM
Waiting for:
12" non widescreen. Matte.
Aluminium.
No optical drive.
Full size, PB/MBPro class keyboard.
HiSpeed Wifi + mini DV for connectivity.
Low power Core Duo. Intel graphics.
up to 2GB RAM
up to 80GB HD (1.8" with same NAND help).
3lb.
$1500.

Is 12" considered sub-notebook? Nearer 10" I'd expect. The rest is realistic.

Does it need Ethernet or Modem? I don't think so.

Zadillo
Feb 16, 2007, 10:02 AM
Is 12" considered sub-notebook? Nearer 10" I'd expect. The rest is realistic.

Does it need Ethernet or Modem? I don't think so.

Yes, 12" can definitely be a subnotebook. 10.4" screen subnotebooks seem to be less common now.

See the new Vaio G1 for an example though: http://www.dynamism.com/g1/main.shtml

devilot
Feb 16, 2007, 10:06 AM
See the new Vaio G1 for an example though: http://www.dynamism.com/g1/main.shtmlWow, you really do pay for the <2lbs weight. :p $3K! And I thought my MB was bank.

Zadillo
Feb 16, 2007, 10:08 AM
Wow, you really do pay for the <2lbs weight. :p $3K! And I thought my MB was bank.

Yeah, not saying it's cheap....:)

That actually would be something, if Apple managed to make a real ultraportable that wasn't quite so expensive.

volvoben
Feb 16, 2007, 10:11 AM
I hate to be archaic, but what I really want is a mac version of the sony and ibm tiny laptops i've seen occasionally at work...they're very light (the ibm was literally ~ 2.5lbs), have super battery life, often have built in support for wireless networks (cingular/att 3g for apple?), but are real computers. one guy even did a fair bit of photoshop/quark type design work on flights, and it ran faster than they did on the sawtooth i had at that job.

I want a trackpad and real keyboard...i've never been able to get any real work done on small machines without input devices i can use efficiently. I don't care if it takes up a few inches less space in my bag, as long as it's a real step down in size from the macbook they'll sell plenty of 'em. In europe and asia these 'small real computers' are quite common, especially with their superior wireless broadband networks.

So apple, toss the optical, use the robson, just be sure it runs real OSX, runs any real program (slowly is fine) and can handle an external monitor when it's at home.

Cinch
Feb 16, 2007, 10:44 AM
Waiting for:
12" non widescreen. Matte.
Aluminium.
No optical drive.
Full size, PB/MBPro class keyboard.
HiSpeed Wifi + mini DV for connectivity.
Low power Core Duo. Intel graphics.
up to 2GB RAM
up to 80GB HD (1.8" with same NAND help).
3lb.
$1500.

What about:

12" touchscreen (similar to the UI of iPhone)
no optical drive...ditto
eliminate trackpad and keyboard (touchscreen off course)..if we can compose a lengthy email on a touchscreen keyboard than by all means get rid of the conventional keyboard
40 GB of NAND and just do away with the 20th century tech HD
runs OSX, iLife and Office well..this should cover 95% of all users out there
if you have to work with Photoshop etc..get a Mac Pro or MacBook Pro

I think the current MacBook or laptop setup is too cumbersome. I would like to buy a computer/tablet like device where you don't have to think about buying a special carrying case for it or finding a plug at StarBucks. I'll definitely trade in my black MacBook for this, even it will cost more.

Cinch

twoodcc
Feb 16, 2007, 10:45 AM
well i hope this is true. i don't think i would buy one right away, but it's still good for Apple and many people. bring it on ;) :apple:

CommodityFetish
Feb 16, 2007, 10:52 AM
This is great news. I'm more than glad to see the optical drive dropped - way to go apple! Docking / external drive makes a lot of sense to me.

:)

cbatt
Feb 16, 2007, 10:53 AM
What I want:

NO Optical drive
1 FW 400
1 FW 800
2 USB 2.0
1 Mini-DVI
Bluetooth
802.11n
_small_ ("flybook" or Fujitsu tablet PC sized)

Built in optical drive is useless in a machine this size.

Saves tons of space for the really usefull features:

Firewire ports
USB ports
DVI ports
Wireless antennas
Bigger battery



It's a no-brainer in the ultra-portable market, especially in today's world where everything mass-storage related can be attached externally via high-speed ports.

timmillwood
Feb 16, 2007, 10:57 AM
http://www.dynamism.com/images/gallery/imgv33i_2.jpg

Flybook + Mac OS X + Apple styling = macbook mini

Thats what i want, Very small and light, touch screen, sim card slot for EDGE, 3G, HSDPA connectivity.

b0ned0me
Feb 16, 2007, 11:02 AM
I think the current MacBook or laptop setup is too cumbersome. I would like to buy a computer/tablet like device where you don't have to think about buying a special carrying case for it or finding a plug at StarBucks.
Huh? The IBM/Lenovo/whatever X60 described above is pretty much bog-standard technology nowadays, and all it needs is a bag large enough to take a writing pad. 5 hours or more of battery life with the extended battery takes care of your Starbucks woes, and it comes in a tablet version if that's what floats your boat. No innovation is needed, just for the Apple marketing department to pick a price point & design sketch they like and email it to Flextronics/Foxconn/BenQ or whoever is going to bolt the thing together.

Cinch
Feb 16, 2007, 11:10 AM
What I want:

NO Optical drive
1 FW 400
1 FW 800
2 USB 2.0
1 Mini-DVI
Bluetooth
802.11n
_small_ ("flybook" or Fujitsu tablet PC sized)

Built in optical drive is useless in a machine this size.

Saves tons of space for the really usefull features:

Firewire ports
USB ports
DVI ports
Wireless antennas
Bigger battery



It's a no-brainer in the ultra-portable market, especially in today's world where everything mass-storage related can be attached externally via high-speed ports.


Don't forget to include a parallel port for my 250MB Zip Drive..We can't forget that!:D :D


Ultraportable? It sounds like you are trying to tie this thing down to your desk every conceivable way:D

Cinch

lukeisme09
Feb 16, 2007, 11:12 AM
Just what i want!

A Flybook with Mac OS X on it

12" sounds to big for what i want, i want an e-mail, web browser, word processer, quick code editor, which is bigger than a phone and smaller than a laptop. would like to see built in HSDPA

I switched from a Powermac to a macbook pro because i need portability for some small tasks, but all main tasks are at home. I am now missing the speed to would like a macbook and mac pro, but if i could get a smaller macbook (like flybook size) that would be so much better.

iphone- bigger than a phone smaller than a lap top... :confused:

Cinch
Feb 16, 2007, 11:13 AM
http://www.dynamism.com/images/gallery/imgv33i_2.jpg

Flybook + Mac OS X + Apple styling = macbook mini

Thats what i want, Very small and light, touch screen, sim card slot for EDGE, 3G, HSDPA connectivity.

I think a Dell or a HP at a cafe looks better than the Flybook. Off course this dosen't say much if anything at all.

This Flybook look so repulsive, lets fly it out the window as quickly as we can:D .

Cinch

Bobthemonkey
Feb 16, 2007, 11:22 AM
Waiting for:
12" non widescreen. Matte.
Aluminium.
No optical drive.
Full size, PB/MBPro class keyboard.
HiSpeed Wifi + mini DV for connectivity.
Low power Core Duo. Intel graphics.
up to 2GB RAM
up to 80GB HD (1.8" with same NAND help).
3lb.
$1500.

You would probably have to go 12" widescreen to gain the extra space for a full keyboard. The spec above is very similar to the Dell D420. One of those (I'm using it now) made by Apple and hence running OSX, in the style of an MBP wopuld be perfect. If it was about when i needed the Dell then Apple would have got my money. Actually wasn't there an article doing the rounds a couple of months ago about some guy who said he wanted an Apple but ended up having to get the Dell. I sympathise with him.

AnimeUnrivaled
Feb 16, 2007, 11:23 AM
A basic rundown of what I'd like to see and think is reasonable:

1. 12-inch (or slightly smaller) widescreen.
Many people are clamoring for fullscreen rather than widescreen. I'd prefer widescreen mainly because of media. Also, I enjoy being able to put two documents/windows side by side. I find multiple windows much more workable when placed next to one another rather than above or behind each other. Frankly, the "Mac way" of doing things (no full-screened windows) works better on a widescreen. If it comes with Leopard, the new resolution independence features should come in handy if Apple decides to make a higher-res screen for it. We should be able to scale things to our liking size-wise while still being able to fit quite a bit on the screen if we cant to go by the pixel.

2. No internal optical drive.
I would have been absolutely opposed to this until recently. Recently, with the boom of wireless home networking and usb flash drives, I've found that I very rarely use my optical drive and I never do so outside of the home. As others have said, Apple could definitely release the laptop with an optional external optical drive. A slim external Apple-branded drive would be aesthetically pleasing and functional. This drive should be offered as what I call a "tier-one" upgrade, meaning it should be listed in the BYO menus online on the first customization page along with the various HD sizes, RAM sizes, and so on as to avoid being easily overlooked. Eliminating the internal optical drive allows for a big boost in internal space while reducing size and increasing battery life, even if Apple decided not to put in a larger battery, which brings me to...

3. Long battery life.
Eliminating the optical drive does a few things for battery life. First, it reduces the load on the battery produced by the optical drive. Granted, I'm saying it should be tossed out because of lack of use, but even an idle drive uses a minute amount of power. Really though, this is negligible and I'm only writing it to make this look more appealing. Second, and more significant, is that the weight and space reduction in removing the drive allows for a much higher capacity battery. If Apple were to use a portion of the freed space for expanding the battery, it would allow for considerably longer battery life without sacrificing all of the weight and space gains.

4. Proper use of perimeter for ports.
A small notebook has limited space for ports, so Apple would have to choose carefully. 2 USB ports, gigabit Ethernet, headphone, and power are mandatory. Other than that, things get more complex. It would depend on whether or not Apple released a dock. If Apple released a dock, then I would say those should be the only ports accessible directly on the computer with the addition of a proprietary "dock" port. The dock port would have more usb ports, firewire, audio-in, and DVI. If, however, Apple did not release a dock, then I would add a single firewire port, a mini-dvi port, and an audio-in port. That would make it have the same port setup as the current MacBook, but the computer would have sufficient room because of the absence of an optical drive.

5. Processor, RAM, and HD.
While I would like apple to keep the 2.5" drives for the hard disk for capacity's sake, I would understand if it dropped down to 1.8" to save space. With capacities getting up to a reasonable size, this could be a decent option, especially if Robson caching is enabled to help counter for the low speeds. Both RAM slots should be accessible by users, just like in the MacBook. Frankly, It'd be amazing if Apple replaced the HD entirely with NAND, but I don't think it'll happen this soon. I'd like it though. Random-access speeds are more valuable than bandwidth speed when considering the average user who's not big on the Photoshop or video-editing.
The only thing that could make me not want this computer is if Apple released it using one of the low-voltage single core processors Intel makes. A real Core 2 Duo is absolutely mandatory. A low-speed one is fine, but we need to have the whole laptop lineup on a unified architecture. All Macs available with Leopard should have full support for its 64-bit features, and there should not be another single-core Mac. Once again, throwing out the optical drive makes this easier because the space constraint is not as much an issue. This is even more true if Apple uses a 1.8" hard drive. There should be adequate room for cooling especially if apple follows my next suggestion:

6. Metal case.
The metal case of the MBP can be thinner than the plastic one of the MB while still remaining durable. It also helps with heat dissipation, which always becomes an issue when you make things small.

7. Full-size Keyboard.
This can easily be done. The 12" Powerbook had a full-size keyboard. A 12" widescreen notebook would have even more horizontal space. In fact, the screen sizes dictate the following: A fullscreen, 4:3 ratio, 12" notebook, calculated by screen size, would have to be at least 9.6" wide. A widescreen 16:10 ratio (as used in most widescreen computer displays) notebook would have to be 10.46" wide to contain the screen. Nearly an extra horizontal inch should be more than sufficient for a full-size keyboard.

8. Screen options!
I hear demand for matte screens. I prefer glossy screens. Default to glossy, since there seems to be more demand for that, but make it an obvious option on the BYO screens to switch to matte. Frankly, I don't care if Apple decides to default to matte screens. All I care is that the customers have the option.

As far as other features, like removing the trackpad in favor of multi-touch screen or a pointing stick (ala Thinkpads), are concerned, I think you people are dreaming. It's just not feasible yet. Apple rarely puts tech into its products unless it has proven itself capable elsewhere. The iPhone is using multitouch because Apple has found it reliable in small applications. It would get more complicated when dealing with a much larger surface (notebook screen) and I really don't think it'll happen until after all the iPods have it.

Did I miss anything? I'm talking realistic here. Nothing pie-in-the-sky.

janstett
Feb 16, 2007, 11:38 AM
I can't wait, that's what I wanted all along. <Thinking of ways to justify another notebook purchase to the wife, and why I need this in addition to the 15" MBP...>

EagerDragon
Feb 16, 2007, 11:49 AM
I seem to rember that Apple trademarked "MobileMe", Maybe this is it.

Also remember that other patent where a computer did not have a keyboard and instead you placed different "masks" and depending on the mask that surface had different functionality?

Obviously the induction charging would be great for this baby on its docking station. But the laptop needs an ethernet port as wireless is not always available on the road.

This could be a real hit.

BTW, you guys are way too rich. I seen many of you buy or promise to buy just about every single product Apple puts out.
:cool:

I really do not want a tablet to be released. What do you people use tablets for?

I think 12" widescreen or something more 12" PB size would be so awesome.

A table with the power of the MacBook Pro I would consider. I could use it for everything including Photoshop, Video Editing, reading, surfing, writting, video chats, etc.
But mainly for the photoshop, using my fingers or a stylus would be more accurate than a mouse or trackpad when editing photos or video.
:cool:

:p Here it is and it uses a virtual click wheel (look at screen)

http://d.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/p/nm/20070213/2007_02_12t085114_450x326_us_onelaptop.jpg

:p

pgwalsh
Feb 16, 2007, 12:09 PM
My wallet is ready. :)

I predict this sub-notebook will have a touch control screen instead of a traditional keyboard.
You've been smoking something. :rolleyes:

spicyapple
Feb 16, 2007, 12:13 PM
You've been smoking something. :rolleyes:
LOL. It's another one of my drug-induced fantasies! It could happen... you never know with Apple. :)

pgwalsh
Feb 16, 2007, 12:24 PM
LOL. It's another one of my drug-induced fantasies! It could happen... you never know with Apple. :) Well I could certainly see an iMac with touchscreen and would love one for my mother, but a laptop I'm not so sure. You're getting into tablet territory. Now if the screen flipped over and you could use it as a tablet or a laptop then that would be something, but now I might be smoking something. ;)

kcmac
Feb 16, 2007, 12:31 PM
I agree with a lot from above. For me, the thing should:

be faster than a MacBook.
have more VRam than a MacBook / no shared graphics
come in a different body color/material than a MacBook
have ability to plug into a large monitor
have a keyboard
have plenty of ports although I could get by on the same as 12" PB.

I would prefer that the screen not be widescreen.

I don't see Apple providing a laptop without an optical drive. And I think I would want one.

timmillwood
Feb 16, 2007, 01:32 PM
iphone- bigger than a phone smaller than a lap top... :confused:

yeh but i wanted it to be more computery than a phone

I like the flybook because it is really small and has Sim card slot

Macinposh
Feb 16, 2007, 02:48 PM
For me, the thing should:

1. be faster than a MacBook.
2. have more VRam than a MacBook / no shared graphics
3. come in a different body color/material than a MacBook
4. have ability to plug into a large monitor
5. have a keyboard
6. have plenty of ports although I could get by on the same as 12" PB.
7. I would prefer that the screen not be widescreen.
8. I don't see Apple providing a laptop without an optical drive. And I think I would want one.

Dude,lay down the crackpipe!!

1. WHY on earth would it have to be faster than macbook? It is an ultraportable for chrissake! The typical usage of them dont require processing power like macbook,let alone MPB.

2. It might have a 3" narrower display (10") than MB, so the requirements would be lower on that part,let alone than the typical usere,wich would NOT use any graphically intensive tasks because the computer wouldnt be catered for such users in the first place.

3. Alu would be the propable,like MPB. Light,relatively easy to manufacture and good heat dissapation.

4. Definately. Mini-dvi and capable of driving a 23",like the g950 can do.

5. Duh?! Lick screen is at least..well..10 years away.. Multitouch is not costprobhitive atm.

6. Well,as stated here,2usb,power,audio out,mini-dvi and power is enough for this type. RS-232 is not propable.

7. Actually,me neither! For this small screen estate,it might be a bummer. And getting a keyboard layout with the "palm rests" in this small computer with a widescreen might be a bitch,let alone fitting a trackpad.

One huge problem that the advent of "widescreen" displays have brought to a certaing group of professionals,photographers, is that the displays are too bloody height constricted!! To view vertical pictures is a real biatch,even on 23" monitors and the 30" is so-so. Not that it would matter on theese speciality MiniBooks,even if photographers would propably steal them from stores...
The 12" iBooks and Powerbooks are propably the most traveled computers with photogs.This new minibook would be godsent.

8. Hopefully they do exclude it. The cd/dvd is nice, but as said,you can use externals. They are cheap and small. The drive is unused for most of people for the most of the time. At some point I made a quick survey on our work place,how many times people have used their drive in the last year.

It was around 10 times, for 6 people...in a year...total.

jayb2000
Feb 16, 2007, 03:13 PM
Ultra-portable would be nice, but I would still like to see a 10-12 inch MacBook Pro.
Something that could run Aperture, Photoshop, etc.
Decent GPU, plenty of disk space and such.

However, for this thread, and just to have another gadget, something that was very light, with whopping battery life, a wide-screen for movies (with no letterboxing), all the usual wireless stuff and FW800 and USB 2.0 would be pretty cool.

I think having an external optical drive is great for batter life and weight. Figure if you can get one of those Vaios to weigh 2 pounds, then without the drive it would be 1.5 or such.

If we could get 8-10 hours of batter life, WHILE watching DVDs, that would be great for flights or working all day and then watching a movie on the way home.

Or to be on campus all day, checking email, recording lectures via iSight, etc and never having to plug in. Plus being small enough to just tuck in a coat pocket.

Could be pretty cool.

Manatee
Feb 16, 2007, 03:18 PM
I'll probably buy one -- whatever it is, but I wish it could also be a tablet. That would really make my day, or at least the part of the day when I see the official announcement. ;)

sishaw
Feb 16, 2007, 03:34 PM
It's the Return of the Newton, people--modernized, with a sleek form factor, an optical drive on the back, pen/virtual keyboard/real (external) keyboard input, multi-touch screen, bluetooth, wi-fi. Of course, it will also play music and videos--goes without saying. It will be usable for entertainment, personal organizing, notetaking, gaming (games to be created by the Apple/EA jv) and light computing tasks.

anonicon
Feb 16, 2007, 03:51 PM
Just read the first 6 pages of replies...

I'd love it if Apple brought out a subnotebook. In fact, I've been wanting one for a couple years now, but the only people who make them are vague 3rd party manufacturers like Avera.

As for features:

* No optical drive. That's what the desktop PC at home or a slimline docking station are for.
* 8.9"-11.1" widescreen display (16:9) at 1280x800 or higher, although a 4x3 screen wouldn't kill it as long as this thing was truly portable.
* As fast as the lowest-end MacBook (1.83ghz) with the option to have 1GB of RAM.
* Edit: A built-in keyboard would be nice, but if it came with a seek-ahead touchpad, that would also be groovy. Otherwise you'd need to carry around a mini-keyboard to enter data into it.
* At least 3 hrs of battery life, but the more, the better.
* A 60-80GB hard drive. A flash drive of 8-32GB would also be nice, but not if it's going to add a few hundred dollars to the high price the machine will already cost.
* No video card. You want a video card, buy a bigass MacBook Pro or desktop PC. Integrated graphics are just fine.
* 802.11B/G/N, and Bluetooth or RF for keyboard/mouse.
* No trackpad. Use the ThinkPad nipple, or even the nipple from the Mighty Mouse - I love those, and haven't found a trackpad on any notebook that I liked - so unintuitive, and force you to pick your hands off the keyboard while you're working (ugh).
* At least 1 USB port, firewire port, and multi-media reader port each for moving data between PCs that aren't your own, and because CDs/DVDs should go the way of the floppy drive.
* A DVI or Mini-DVI out port so that you can output the home work to a nice 19-30" flatscreen monitor.
* iSight. I don't care at all about iSight, and can take it or leave it.

Of course, YMMV.

fraggle
Feb 16, 2007, 04:22 PM
Does it need Ethernet or Modem? I don't think so.

How much space do you save by not having Ethernet compared to how useful it is?

As far as the modem is concerned: I agree, but so does Apple: The MacBooks do not have a built-in modem anymore.

The dock port would have more usb ports, firewire, audio-in, and DVI.

I disagree, a (mini-)DVI port is mandatory. You do not want to drag around the docjing station just to be able to hook the laptop to a projector to give a presentation.

timmillwood
Feb 16, 2007, 05:06 PM
Loads of people are mentioning 12" screen, does that make it much more of a sub-notebook than the macbook?

i think it should be 10" or less.

fraggle
Feb 16, 2007, 05:09 PM
* As fast as the lowest-end MacBook (1.83ghz) with the option to have 1GB of RAM.

You need an option for at least 2GB RAM. 1GB just doesn't cut it anymore.

* No trackpad. Use the ThinkPad nipple, or even the nipple from the Mighty Mouse - I love those, and haven't found a trackpad on any notebook that I liked - so unintuitive, and force you to pick your hands off the keyboard while you're working (ugh).

Leave my trackpad alone! The keyboard doesn't take up that much space so there will be enough room for one anyway.

Glenny2lappies
Feb 16, 2007, 05:10 PM
As long as it:
* is small enough to work in a coach/economy aircraft seat
* has a *long* battery life - please, lets get from London to New York in one charge (that's a day to most people)
* has ethernet & wireless
* is wide screen 1280x800
* has 4Gb ram capability (future proofing), comes with 1 or 2Gb standard
* has at least 100Gb disc with larger options (music man, music)
* must have a video out - mini-DVI?
* bluetooth
* 2 USBs
* is lightweight

Don't need an optical drive, this can be in my bag/left in the office, but should be supplied. Personally I like the idea of it being underneath the device. As the patent says, it's easier to make it smaller and it means the case can be robust.

It's the missing link. My 12" G4 is still used for exactly this reason; it fits in a coach seat, has a long battery life, etc.

I'm quite happy to have two lappies; a 17" one for the office/hotels/on-site, and a itty-bitty one for travelling.

k2k koos
Feb 16, 2007, 05:43 PM
Oh yes, we did. Though looking back, they were a bit ridiculous, much like our clothing (blasphemy! I know).

I wanted a duo back in the day, but couldn't afford it (and didn't like the color difference between the duo, and the desktop hardware when docked), but if they can come up with a design that seemlessly blends in, then I am all for it :-) My G4 ALu PB 1.25Ghz, despite still going (very) strong, is perhaps ready to be re-assigned to my wife, and getting me a new powerhouse (I know, it won't be top of the line, but it will probably out perform my current PB by a large margin ).

iMikeT
Feb 16, 2007, 05:53 PM
If this were a Newton ][, I'm there!

uv23
Feb 16, 2007, 08:41 PM
I couldn't care less if it docks or not. It's a subnotebok, not a desktop replacement. I have a 15" MBP and would consider also having a 10" subnote to cart around work and conferences as a supplemental machine. Give me built in wireless, one USB, audio in/out, and I'm happy. The optical can be an included external option. Video will be integrated, which is fine for a machine of this class. 1gb ram standard, 2gb ram max is fine. 40-100gb hard drive.

ictiosapiens
Feb 16, 2007, 08:51 PM
Waiting for:
12" non widescreen. Matte.
Aluminium.
No optical drive.
Full size, PB/MBPro class keyboard.
HiSpeed Wifi + mini DV for connectivity.
Low power Core Duo. Intel graphics.
up to 2GB RAM
up to 80GB HD (1.8" with same NAND help).
3lb.
$1500.


I reckon it will come with the rubish ultra low voltage core solo... I wouldn't expect more...

coffey7
Feb 16, 2007, 09:40 PM
I will stick with my old out of date 32 bit macbook core duo. I'm so old school.

christ3d
Feb 16, 2007, 10:17 PM
i bet that this 12 inch unit will be a separate product line from the mac book and mac book pro lines. it will be THE powerbook. when you think about it, a 12 inch disc driveless laptop doesnt fit in either the consumer or the pro families. its going to be too expensive for consumers, and its not going to be full featured enough for the pros. they supposidly got rid of the powerbook name because of its loose connection to "power pc"... well its been a year, and people don't care about ppc, but the name powerbook still has alot of market share in the minds of mac enthusiasts, consumers and professionals.

Zadillo
Feb 16, 2007, 10:20 PM
i bet that this 12 inch unit will be a separate product line from the mac book and mac book pro lines. it will be THE powerbook. when you think about it, a 12 inch disc driveless laptop doesnt fit in either the consumer or the pro families. its going to be too expensive for consumers, and its not going to be full featured enough for the pros. they supposidly got rid of the powerbook name because of its loose connection to "power pc"... well its been a year, and people don't care about ppc, but the name powerbook still has alot of market share in the minds of mac enthusiasts, consumers and professionals.

As much as I'd like to see the PowerBook name come back (I always thought it was silly that it got axed along with "Power Mac", even though the PowerBook brand name predates the PowerPC), I just can't see Apple releasing a separate product with the PowerBook name while still continuing to use the new MacBook name. I think it would just be too confusing.

SiliconAddict
Feb 16, 2007, 10:48 PM
While I'm interested if it truely is a sub-notebook I'm not willing to spend more then 1000-1500 on such a system. Mainly due to its sub-ish nature. Sub-notebooks are great for on the go work but really aren't designed for doing work for long stretches of time.

iEdd
Feb 16, 2007, 11:03 PM
http://msnbcmedia.msn.com/j/msnbc/Components/Photos/060309/060309_origami_hmed_6a.standard.jpg

Umm well heavy text input maybe hard but thats what bluetooth keyboards are for.
Light typing like search words or changing titles is easily done with on screen non-dynamic keyboards.

So lets see keyboard less tablets would actually be easier for up to medium typing, but higher than that would need a keyboard. But usually those situations only arrive at an office or at home withere a bluetooth keyboard would be easy to keep.

I say go slate. Get an on board keyboard. Ditch the keyboard. Ditch the optical drive.

Now that makes for a light computer. Make it 12"-13" and suddenly you have what people have always been hoping for..... a virtual notepad. Plus battery life would be a lot more. Sans optical, sans keyboard.

I really don't see the point of making thinner laptops. They could be a bit thinner yes, but a 11x8" laptop is going to require the same room no matter its thickness. It doesn't matter if it's 2 inches thick or 0.25 inch thick, it still takes 11x8" room to use, carry around, etc.
Edit: I'm also with the "we don't need optical drive in sub-notebooks" crowd. In these days of internet downloads, wi-fi networking and external USB and FireWire drives, it's not needed anymore. At least not in a sub-notebook.

I'd like to point out that an optical drive doesn't sit there spinning. Not having one won't give you a minute more battery life vs having one and not using it.
What I don't get about Chef's post is that he wants a 12-13" tablet. Why not just have 12-13" like we already have, which HAS a keyboard, rather than carrying around a bluetooth keyboard and optical drive "incase you need it". Sure it will be thinner without those two things, that is why I agree with the last poster about only saving 5mm or so by removing them, so I think they should be there.
iPhone is your tablet.
So what I gather is that these "people" you talk about want a 13" inch macbook, without half it's connections, less storage, no keyboard or optical drive, 'oh n0es no wireless docking, must be wired'. Yeah it would be fun to play with for 5 minutes. Until you realise you need a dock, a keyboard, an external drive, etc for the $1000 POS you just purchased.
As for saving weight, wha? They are light enough as it is, but yes they will get lighter. If something comes out, it will be 11" and will most likely have a keyboard and optical drive. Why? Because fingerprints suck ;)

EDIT: Also the clamshell laptop design stops scratches on the screen. I guess you could have a thin 'lid' on a tablet, but it just adds to the tackyness.

Jimmery
Feb 16, 2007, 11:33 PM
Maybe the next iMac will be a tablet computer without optical drive and hard drive, and its base station will contain a 5.25" hard drive and optical drive (along with keyboard, etc). The tablet would only have flash memory for storage, unless it was communicating with its base station wirelessly. The iMac would become hand-held this way, unless you wanted to sit down at the base station to use the keyboard and mouse.

kcmac
Feb 17, 2007, 12:25 AM
Dude,lay down the crackpipe!!


Grow up.

I expect a lot of Apple. I had the icebook and now own a 12" PB. I am a professional user that travels a lot and carry my PB everywhere I go. I posted my desires. You obviously disagree.

But don't be a jerk.

solvs
Feb 17, 2007, 06:30 AM
While I'm interested if it truely is a sub-notebook I'm not willing to spend more then 1000-1500 on such a system.

It's going to be about $1700-$1800 probably. Hopefully it'll be worth it. If it's just a smaller Santa Rosa MacBook, I'll be buying the SR MB. If it's better, even if more expensive than the difference, I'll buy it. I want ultra portable, but I'd like a better video card (even than the Intel X3000) and better battery life. I like the 15", but it's still too big and overkill for what I need it for. A 12-13" with a better video card would work too though.

Whatever is coming out, I need a new laptop, but find current offerings kinda lacking.

BWhaler
Feb 17, 2007, 08:32 AM
i can see an apple ultra portable, but a docking one? i'm not so sure about that. but boy, i remember wanting a duo back in the day.

Me too.

Ah...flashbacks to college.

Chef Medeski
Feb 17, 2007, 08:50 AM
I'd like to point out that an optical drive doesn't sit there spinning. Not having one won't give you a minute more battery life vs having one and not using it.
What I don't get about Chef's post is that he wants a 12-13" tablet. Why not just have 12-13" like we already have, which HAS a keyboard, rather than carrying around a bluetooth keyboard and optical drive "incase you need it". Sure it will be thinner without those two things, that is why I agree with the last poster about only saving 5mm or so by removing them, so I think they should be there.
iPhone is your tablet.
So what I gather is that these "people" you talk about want a 13" inch macbook, without half it's connections, less storage, no keyboard or optical drive, 'oh n0es no wireless docking, must be wired'. Yeah it would be fun to play with for 5 minutes. Until you realise you need a dock, a keyboard, an external drive, etc for the $1000 POS you just purchased.
As for saving weight, wha? They are light enough as it is, but yes they will get lighter. If something comes out, it will be 11" and will most likely have a keyboard and optical drive. Why? Because fingerprints suck ;)

Firstly, I know how I use my computer. I take it in my backpack all day to various classes. Weight is of big importance to me because I have to fit papers, books, and a laptop. So the heavier the laptop the more my bag becomes. And as to the remark of needing a dock, a keyboard, and an external drive. I dont even use my internal drive on the go. So, dont need that. I would need a dock for what? I dont connect any peripherials on the go and the only one I would ever need is a keyboard, which works with bluetooth. So, no I dont need a dock on the go, maybe at home yes, but not on the go. The external drive might be used once in a blue moon once again AT HOME. Now finally keyboard. I dont believe I would need one on the go. I dont do heavy typing while taking notes. Mostly I record the audio which is very helpful and do summarize the notes, im not the copy every word kind of guy. If it had an on board keyboard lik Origami I believe I would be fine. If it didnt work out as I thought cause it was a pain in the ass, I would carry around a small foldable BT keyboard that weigh about a CD, and are the same size. And that would be a lot lighter than the current Macbook. So actually I wouldnt figure out its a POS but actually use it. Understandably if this does not corroborate to ur user habits, then you would not want such a device. But me, I love Mac OS X, I love Tablets, and I really see little need for a keyboard but tons of needs for a pen.

And if you dont believe anyone is doing it or if it provides a saving. Tablet Kiosk (http://www.tabletkiosk.com/products/sahara/i400s_pp.asp)
Look a 12" slate tablet. With 2 USB, 1 Firewire, 1 eSATA, 1 PCI express, BT, Wi-Fi, Finger print. With touch screen. 3.3 lbs. Thats a pound and a half lighter than my 12" PB. BUt its has a 1.83Ghz Core 2 Duo processor. With an actual video card which means support for a second display at 2048 x 1536. I mean you cant beat that. No CD drive. No keyboard. $2,000. I would buy it in a heartbeat if it ran OS X. They have even installed the UMPC add-on software so you can have an origami keyboard on it. Its perfect. Apple, take that make it multi-touch and I'll pay you $2,400. No multi touch, $2,200. But maybe a widescreen version would be better.

christ3d
Feb 17, 2007, 12:47 PM
As much as I'd like to see the PowerBook name come back (I always thought it was silly that it got axed along with "Power Mac", even though the PowerBook brand name predates the PowerPC), I just can't see Apple releasing a separate product with the PowerBook name while still continuing to use the new MacBook name. I think it would just be too confusing.

i don't think it would be confusing at all. in all honesty, by changing the ibook/powerbook lines into the macbook/ macbook pro, they've merged them into the same product, they're both macbooks. its like college football and professional football... they're both football. i mean, the only thing that truely seperates them is one is plastic and one is aluminum... they look almost exactly the same.

a 12 inch super light computer with tons of battery life would be a totally different beast. they could break out a totally new design for their laptops and get rid of the tired original white ibook look thats been going on wayy too long.

call it a powerbook, hell call it an ibook, but if the thing is anything like what the rumors are saying, it doesn't deserve to be called a macbook.

rimbaud@mac.com
Feb 17, 2007, 02:04 PM
Mac LightSpeed... No not the C-Compiler

Light rechargeable (solar)... (notice the recent move to black)

The screen is where the keyboard is on a usual laptop, and the two-sided solar array is where the screen is on a usual laptop.

So where's the keyboard? It's on the screen like an iPhone!

No internal moving parts.

2 GB RAM.

40 GB Flash, not in SSD drive format, but 5 x 8GB memory stick format (4 are removable replaceable, e.g. 1 x 8GB plus 4 x 16GB).

Remote works as your VOIP phone.

Comes with a sling so you can carry it (wear it) on you at all times.

Who needs an iPod or iPhone when you can have your whole digital life with you at all times.

BlueRay sync drive at home with HDMI link to your HDTV.

Nukemkb
Feb 17, 2007, 02:08 PM
I don't care if its a 1.83 gig, as long as it has 3-4 gig of ram and 120 gig hard drive. AND 12 inch screen! I WANT it!!

Zadillo
Feb 17, 2007, 02:12 PM
Mac LightSpeed... No not the C-Compiler

Light rechargeable (solar)... (notice the recent move to black)

The screen is where the keyboard is on a usual laptop, and the two-sided solar array is where the screen is on a usual laptop.

So where's the keyboard? It's on the screen like an iPhone!

No internal moving parts.

2 GB RAM.

40 GB Flash, not in SSD drive format, but 5 x 8GB memory stick format (4 are removable replaceable, e.g. 1 x 8GB plus 4 x 16GB).

Remote works as your VOIP phone.

Comes with a sling so you can carry it (wear it) on you at all times.

Who needs an iPod or iPhone when you can have your whole digital life with you at all times.

BlueRay sync drive at home with HDMI link to your HDTV.

I'm having trouble visualizing how you would use this and look at what you are working on if the screen is where the keyboard is on a current laptop. It seems like you'd have to stand and look straight down on it just to view things properly, and some space would also be taken up by whatever onscreen keyboard is used. And the two-sided solar panel would seem to go to waste. Frankly I'd rather something where the screen is where it is now on a laptop, and an actual keyboard would be in the same place as always, but still have the solar panel on the other side of the screen, and also have a second solar panel embedded in the wristrest area below the keyboard.

-Zadillo

MonkeyHugger
Feb 17, 2007, 02:53 PM
IMO it will only happen in the Macbook Pro line.

iEdd
Feb 17, 2007, 03:34 PM
What? :rolleyes:
The MacMini is not pro. The 13" Macbook is not pro. Why would something even smaller be pro? :confused:

EDIT: That's assuming you're talking about this sub-notebook. If you're talking about the solar thing (which people here don't quite understand... That gimmick won't be on a mac anytime soon).

MonkeyHugger
Feb 17, 2007, 04:36 PM
What? :rolleyes:
The MacMini is not pro. The 13" Macbook is not pro. Why would something even smaller be pro? :confused:

EDIT: That's assuming you're talking about this sub-notebook. If you're talking about the solar thing (which people here don't quite understand... That gimmick won't be on a mac anytime soon).

Yes. I'm talking about what the thread was made for :rolleyes:

Zadillo
Feb 17, 2007, 04:55 PM
What? :rolleyes:
The MacMini is not pro. The 13" Macbook is not pro. Why would something even smaller be pro? :confused:

EDIT: That's assuming you're talking about this sub-notebook. If you're talking about the solar thing (which people here don't quite understand... That gimmick won't be on a mac anytime soon).

You are making an incorrect assumption that "small" somehow does not equate with "professional". In fact, the primary market for most subnotebooks (things like the Sony Vaio TX, or the under 2 pound Vaio G) are professional users who want portability and long battery life above all else, and whose primary use for these devices is e-mail, web browsing, word processing, spreadsheets and presentations. Those would fit pretty squarely into the "Professional" designation.

-Zadillo

Chef Medeski
Feb 17, 2007, 05:47 PM
What? :rolleyes:
The MacMini is not pro. The 13" Macbook is not pro. Why would something even smaller be pro? :confused:

EDIT: That's assuming you're talking about this sub-notebook. If you're talking about the solar thing (which people here don't quite understand... That gimmick won't be on a mac anytime soon).
14.1" iBook
12" Powerbook.

Remeber?

Pro doesnt mean bigger. It means faster or with more features.

timmillwood
Feb 18, 2007, 03:36 AM
i think that the specs will be low, due to the size and to save battery life.

but on a small screen no one wants super apps like photoshop or Final Cut Pro

I think max 2.0Ghz Core 2 Duo,
1x1GB ram standard, room for 1x2gb stick
80gb HDD
shared graphics
Wi-Fi
Bluetooth
all wrapped with a 10" multitouch screen and keyboard

so basicly like a mini high end Macbook, not as high spec as MBP

iEdd
Feb 18, 2007, 04:22 AM
Thankyou timmillwood, someone who can put 2 & 2 together (it equals 4 by the way). I will make note to make my posts dead obvious in future. Yes I meant that something smaller will not have as good specs and therefore not be "pro".
I basically agree with your specs, just that if the HDD is 1.8" then 80GB would be the maximum (as you said), until 100s or 120s come out. Otherwise a 2.5" would allow up to 200GB.
Maybe that 'dumb idea' with the disc drive under the laptop will be used. I mean it's less of a pain than carrying around or plugging in an external.

matticus008
Feb 18, 2007, 07:03 AM
Yes I meant that something smaller will not have as good specs and therefore not be "pro".
Something being part of the Pro lineup has relatively little to do with specs and far more to do with little features (optical audio, backlit keyboards, and FW800 as historical examples), target markets, and price.

Any quality tablet would carry the hefty pricetag and the assortment of odd little features that would put it squarely in the pro range--something with similar performance to a MacBook but a couple hundred dollars more expensive couldn't be sold as anything but a "pro" product, regardless of its ultimate name. Remember that the 12" PowerBook underperformed the iMac for quite some time and the iBooks were often only a step behind the PowerBooks in performance (much as the MacBooks now are not terribly slower than MBPs).

Roadstar
Feb 18, 2007, 07:49 AM
I think max 2.0Ghz Core 2 Duo,
1x1GB ram standard, room for 1x2gb stick
80gb HDD
shared graphics
Wi-Fi
Bluetooth
all wrapped with a 10" multitouch screen and keyboard


I don't see this happening, as having a single memory module and shared graphics could create a performance bottleneck to the memory controller as there would be no dual-channel available on the stock configuration. They don't ship MacBooks and Minis with two equally sized memory modules just for fun.

timmillwood
Feb 18, 2007, 12:20 PM
I don't see this happening, as having a single memory module and shared graphics could create a performance bottleneck to the memory controller as there would be no dual-channel available on the stock configuration. They don't ship MacBooks and Minis with two equally sized memory modules just for fun.

Oh yeh, i haven't really got the hardware knowledge. I was just thinking about saving space.

Also i think this will be a Pro machine, or maybe a blur a bit like the mac mini, i think the mac mini could be classed as a pro machine just for an office, not graphics or video, or home. The iMac seems to be styled as a pure home machine. like the Macbook.

This new machined may have a low spec but not styled 100% pro or home. I am sure it will not be classed as a home machine like the iMac and Macbook.

rimbaud@mac.com
Feb 18, 2007, 07:39 PM
I'm having trouble visualizing how you would use this and look at what you are working on if the screen is where the keyboard is on a current laptop. It seems like you'd have to stand and look straight down on it just to view things properly, and some space would also be taken up by whatever onscreen keyboard is used. And the two-sided solar panel would seem to go to waste. Frankly I'd rather something where the screen is where it is now on a laptop, and an actual keyboard would be in the same place as always, but still have the solar panel on the other side of the screen, and also have a second solar panel embedded in the wristrest area below the keyboard.

-Zadillo

Think tablet (no not Think C-Compiler)... Think stand it up to watch the screen and use the remote to control it... Think disappearing touch keyboard, like the iPhone's.

Zadillo
Feb 18, 2007, 08:20 PM
Think tablet (no not Think C-Compiler)... Think stand it up to watch the screen and use the remote to control it... Think disappearing touch keyboard, like the iPhone's.

I can understanding standing it up to watch the screen, but I don't see how you would practically use this to type on like a normal notebook. I've seen keyboard-less tablets (although those don't have a second section with panels on them), but those are really designed mostly for keyboard input. Samsung's UMPC has a vaguely clever onscreen keyboard concept meant to be used with your thumbs (two circular keyboards on the bottom left and right corners that you can use).

I'm just not sure I see the real benefit of putting the display panel on the bottom, having to use that to type, and having solar panels on a top panel. It seems like you end up with something that takes up as much space, etc. as a normal laptop but would be more inconvenient to use.

MBp lover
Feb 18, 2007, 10:07 PM
cnat wait for a tablet to compliment my mbp, apple is really trying hard to make its presence felt

tertiaryAdjunct
Feb 19, 2007, 10:00 PM
My wallet is ready. :)

I predict this sub-notebook will have a touch control screen instead of a traditional keyboard.

If it is a touch screen, where will they put the rest of the display? A touch screen might be good for a phone, but how well would that work for a sub-notebook? If you want to fire up a word processor, the virtual keyboard would leave no room for the document being edited.

After G
Mar 8, 2007, 04:26 PM
If it is a touch screen, where will they put the rest of the display? A touch screen might be good for a phone, but how well would that work for a sub-notebook? If you want to fire up a word processor, the virtual keyboard would leave no room for the document being edited.How about two touch screens? One for the input (keyboard, mouse, etc) and one as the normal screen.

You can do things at keyboard+mouse speed without needing either.
You can zoom in on one part of an image on one touch screen while being fully zoomed out on the other touch screen..
You can have active controls for audio/graphics/video applications and manipulate more than one control simultaneously (impossible with mouse).

Multi-touch touch-screen technology, if produced in large enough volume, may be what sets Apple above and beyond everybody else.

grafikat
Mar 11, 2007, 11:34 AM
I am still waiting for an apple UMPC. I still say a pepperpad type of surfing machine would really go over well.

Hello, Steve? Are you listening?

MarkWayne
Mar 13, 2007, 04:52 PM
When we started talking about subnotebooks, I flashed back to the old Windows CE devices with cramped QWERTY and color screens. An idea whose time had not come, like tablets and the Newton. I imagine something very different, whether technically feasible at present or not. Other members have considered this: In terms of personal computing, how might an ordinary user do stuff with a MiniBook (to call it something obvious)? For a business trip, my Minibook would write documents, answer webmail, deliver a presentation, edit photos and watch a movie.
Since the Minibook has 60 GB max and no optical drive, it runs Leopard in full but partners with my I-Mac. I firewire connect and open Spaces on the I-mac (we’re in Leopard).
I’m speculating about Spaces here, but virtual desktops would make a great interface for satellite devices. One Space for my I-phone and one for my Minibook. Unlike earlier devices, these run their full parent OS, not CE or Leopard Lite (Jobs emphasized the full-OS capability of the I-phone).
I drag stuff into the Minibook Space. Pages, Safari, Keynote and I-Photo. Tagged folders sync automatically so I have my files.
If I have some GB left, I drag the movie over from I-tunes and head for the airport.
The Minibook has no keyboard, no stereo speakers (who cares), and a battery that does not scorch my thighs. It has FW800, 1 USB, phone jack, Airport, Ethernet, maybe I-Sight and Bluetooth. Let’s say it’s 8 by 10 inches, no thicker than a MacBook, and the two halves are of equal thickness. Inside is a luminous Multi-Touch display, cleverly hinged in the center - one continuous Apple desktop, not a “screen” and a “keyboard” (stay with me, we’re speculating). The display surface is tensile and slightly soft. How I arrange the device depends on what I want to do. For word processing the upper half stands erect, in traditional perpendicular display behind a flat “keyboard.”
When I touch Pages in the Dock, the document field opens on the upper half, with a virtual keyboard on the lower half of the display. I tug the keyboard wider with my forefingers, slide the touchpad around, and bend the QWERTY to an ergo shape. All Pages tools are on the lower, "keyboard" pad. No tracking device needed. 10 inches of Multi-Touch, wide enough for Michael Jordan. It’s ergo, it’s eco, it’s lo-power, it’s Apple!
In Safari I surf, email and make calls with a different, web-functional “keyboard,” specific to the software, QWERTY with web-specific command buttons. No need for toolbars cluttering up the web page.
Then I wipe coffee stain off the table and flatten the whole device wide open, nearly 16 inches wide and 10 inches high, bigger than a 17-inch Pro.
Remember the lower half of a smart phone is wasted? Same for notebooks. With Multi-Touch, tablet detachments and swivels are unneeded.
Now I open I-Photo and edit pix with my fingers like Steve Jobs or Jeff Han. The people in Starbucks FREAK OUT.
On the plane the guy beside me opens his Dell, with hinges as elegant as an outhouse door. I open my Minibook, spin out some feet, and stand the entire device on its left edge. I tap Play with my finger, “Babel” begins, and I doze off.
This may not be technically feasible today, but it would extend the new ideas glimpsed in January, plus Leopard as a radically new environ and Multi-Touch as a new age in hardware.

princealfie
Mar 20, 2007, 10:35 AM
IF Apple can reinvent my Jornada 720 or NEC Mobilepro 900c then I could get out of the Windows CE platform quickly. However I really do think that any type of subnotebook needs to have flash drive memory and that's about it. I don't want 1.8 or 2.5 drives anymore because I had 2 of them die on me this year (yuck, Toshiba HDD are lousy!). Honestly, Apple can improve on the original Handheld PC market which used to be big during the early 2000's. Also most of the Handheld PC's had touch screens with stylus. Apple could emulate the same and ditch the touchpad. Perhaps maybe no stylus and just use the finger (less control however).

This is one smart move for Apple to get into the subnotebook market. They need to price it lower than the MacBook base model and then this thing will really fly. Just don't use the full version of Tiger but a remixed slim version like Tiger CE/Lite on the flash drive. :)

garylapointe
Mar 22, 2007, 04:14 PM
Some of you may not have been around... but back in the day people really loved their Duos. The Duo was, without question, the best tiny laptop ever made.

I had a dock at home and one at the office. The dock "sucked" in the duo in the way that macs used to pull in the floppy disk.

The dock had a floppy drive, ethernet, video and a card slot (or two) which I used to make it a dual display. The SCSI ports probably had a zip disk drives and CD drives connect too.

And there were portable accessories if you really needed stuff on the go. They were a hassle but if you needed to transfer files, etc.

Remember, this was all pre-WiFi and USB thumb drives...

Sigh. I miss my duo. I had one and then upgraded the motherboard to a PPC 601(?) when it came out (this was a official Apple upgrade).

Gary

garylapointe
Mar 22, 2007, 04:16 PM
14.1" iBook
12" Powerbook.I believe the 12" iBook was before the 12" PB.

It seems to me that's why I bought my iBook (smaller is better).

Gary

danny_w
Mar 22, 2007, 04:24 PM
I would have rather had a Mac, but already bought a used Thinkpad X40. For my needs (very little, actually) it is a perfect fit. And the fit and build are way above most Apple products. My iMac will suffice for home use for a long time to come.