PDA

View Full Version : Steve Jobs and Bill Gates at All Things Digital Conference




MacRumors
Feb 20, 2007, 01:58 PM
http://www.macrumors.com/images/macrumorsthreadlogo.gif (http://www.macrumors.com)

A press release (http://biz.yahoo.com/pz/070220/114073.html) issued today announced that both Steve Jobs and Bill Gates will be participating in a joint appearance at The Wall Street Journal's "D: All Things Digital" (http://d.wsj.com/) conference which takes place between May 29-31 near San Diego, California.

The conference sessions are in interview-format with no prepared speeches.

Beyond the joint event, Steve Jobs will also be participating in his own segment "to discuss the latest developments at Apple, including new ventures such as the iPhone and Apple TV."

Steve Jobs has participated before at this conference, and provided some of his insights on Apple and the market.



Lynxpoint
Feb 20, 2007, 02:01 PM
it could be billed as "mac vs pc" ads, the originals.....

SpookTheHamster
Feb 20, 2007, 02:01 PM
I'd love to see this descend into a brawl. Imagine the aftermath!

Kobushi
Feb 20, 2007, 02:03 PM
I'd love to see this descend into a brawl. Imagine the aftermath!

As long as it's not a mud wrestling match.

I like Steve and all.... but... hmmm...

rdowns
Feb 20, 2007, 02:04 PM
Gates will probably try to splooge Jobs with his Zune.

mattscott306
Feb 20, 2007, 02:04 PM
This should be fun, do they normally broadcast it online?

Westside guy
Feb 20, 2007, 02:05 PM
Windows vs. Mac stuff aside: These sorts of events are not Bill's best venues - he's not particularly personable.

Telp
Feb 20, 2007, 02:07 PM
Gates will probably try to splooge Jobs with his Zune.

This should be fun. Two of the biggest rivals in the computer industy battling it ou :p

Peace
Feb 20, 2007, 02:08 PM
I really don't think these two icons hate each other as much as the internet community believes.Sure they have different philosophies about computers but in any case it should be an interesting discussion from these guys!

calculus
Feb 20, 2007, 02:09 PM
If they came on stage together and did the "I'm a Mac", "And I'm a PC" thing it would be just about the funniest thing ever.

mattscott306
Feb 20, 2007, 02:11 PM
it could be billed as "mac vs pc" ads, the originals.....

"Hi I make macs"-Jobs
"And I make PC's"-Bill
"Umm.. I think you mean you 'borrow; ideas from other OS creators."
"Why Mac, why would you think that?"
"Oh... lets look, windows 95 was nothing more then mac '89, and windows vista is nothing more then mac OSX lite."
"That's of no matter, have you seen our new zune, it's the most revolutionary music player to date."
"Oh, you mean the iPod was the most revolutionary music player to date."
"Fine, but our windows media center came out before your :apple:TV."
"Yeah, and the cassette player came out before the iPod, whats your point?"

polyesterlester
Feb 20, 2007, 02:11 PM
Steve usually turns these kind of conferences down, doesn't he? Although, I think he's done the All Things Digital one before though, right? I was more surprised that he shared the stage with Michael Dell at that education discussion.

darwen
Feb 20, 2007, 02:11 PM
That is probably going to be an interesting session. I am sure there are going to be a lot of jokes about them competing but in all honesty it makes sense the speak together on this.

They are probably the two biggest names in techonology, I am sure a lot of interesting things are going to be said in the session.

MacNut
Feb 20, 2007, 02:12 PM
I really don't think these two icons hate each other as much as the internet community believes.Sure they have different philosophies about computers but in any case it should be an interesting discussion from these guys!I think they are friendly to each other when they have to be but don't bet on them going on a weekend camping trip together.

Telp
Feb 20, 2007, 02:12 PM
If they came on stage together and did the "I'm a Mac", "And I'm a PC" thing it would be just about the funniest thing ever.

Oh man i would die of laughter.:apple: :apple:

SpookTheHamster
Feb 20, 2007, 02:13 PM
Steve should take a Zune, and go "Hey, I like how you're working the whole 'social' thing, let's see if I can find someone to share a song with.... Oh, nobody."

roland.g
Feb 20, 2007, 02:13 PM
It's sad that this passes as news.

What we need is some hardware.

You know, something other than colored shuffles and 2 of the 3 MWSF products shipping 6+ weeks after they are announced.

iMacs, Minis, Mac Pros, Displays, ultra portables, something altogether new, a long-awaited OS combined with some newer hardware to run it on.

2007, it's just the beginning... of what. A whole lot of nothing so far.

wrldwzrd89
Feb 20, 2007, 02:13 PM
That is probably going to be an interesting session. I am sure there are going to be a lot of jokes about them competing but in all honesty it makes sense the speak together on this.

They are probably the two biggest names in techonology, I am sure a lot of interesting things are going to be said in the session.
I agree - I'm looking forward to this if for no other reason than the insight everyone will get from hearing these two tech titans speak.

spicyapple
Feb 20, 2007, 02:14 PM
I hope the conference is made available to a wider tech audience via iTunes Store purchase, streamed live or as a web download.

Telp
Feb 20, 2007, 02:14 PM
It's sad that this passes as news.

What we need is some hardware.

You know, something other than colored shuffles and 2 of the 3 MWSF products shipping 6+ weeks after they are announced.

iMacs, Minis, Mac Pros, Displays, ultra portables, something altogether new, a long-awaited OS combined with some newer hardware to run it on.

2007, it's just the beginning... of what. A whole lot of nothing so far.

Oh boy 1.5 months into the year and weve gotten nothing. For gds sake mon be patient, you know how apple roles.

Peace
Feb 20, 2007, 02:15 PM
I think they are friendly to each other when they have to be but don't bet on them going on a weekend camping trip together.

Hey Now !! I never said they would go camping together.
Maybe a little Phishing trip though :D

SpookTheHamster
Feb 20, 2007, 02:17 PM
Windows vs. Mac stuff aside: These sorts of events are not Bill's best venues - he's not particularly personable.

In the same way that vampires and the Demon Headmaster aren't particularly personable? Or just boring?

MacNut
Feb 20, 2007, 02:17 PM
Hey Now !! I never said they would go camping together.
Maybe a little Phishing trip though :DHey Steve Im gonna cast out, Ok Bill, Oh god my ear.....:D

roland.g
Feb 20, 2007, 02:22 PM
Oh boy 1.5 months into the year and weve gotten nothing. For gds sake mon be patient, you know how apple roles.

Sorry, but usually MWSF gives us 2-3 somethings in the computer department and by the end of January or mid-february, something else has seen a Tuesday revision. It's just really quiet. And I see the next home page change, :apple:tv now shipping. Ok great, something we already knew about is now available as promised - in February.

I have to imagine their sales are hurting a bit with so many people waiting on Mini and iMac revisions.

mikeinternet
Feb 20, 2007, 02:22 PM
I hope the conference is made available to a wider tech audience via iTunes Store purchase, streamed live or as a web download.

does anyone know what type of coverage this event will have?

Peace
Feb 20, 2007, 02:24 PM
Sorry, but usually MWSF gives us 2-3 somethings in the computer department and by the end of January or mid-february, something else has seen a Tuesday revision. It's just really quiet. And I see the next home page change, :apple:tv now shipping. Ok great, something we already knew about is now available as promised - in February.

I have to imagine their sales are hurting a bit with so many people waiting on Mini and iMac revisions.

Apple's last quarterly report said this would happen.So keep an eye out.;)

goosnarrggh
Feb 20, 2007, 02:26 PM
"Oh... lets look, windows 95 was nothing more then mac '89, and windows vista is nothing more then mac OSX lite."

Seriously oversimplified. Apple has "borrowed" ideas others too.

Consider the initial introduction of system-wide co-operative multitasking (not just a handful of desktop accessories), the introduction of preemptive multitasking, and the possibility of dynamic per-process memory allocation as some examples.

If we define OSX Lite as the operating system running on an iPhone, then we really don't have an objective basis for comparison yet.

If you simply mean that Vista is a lame imitation of Tiger, then I have to agree that MS has probably followed the wrong path with the Aero UI. It gives me a headache. I find myself switching back to the Windows Classic theme if I need to use a Vista machine for any length of time.

Telp
Feb 20, 2007, 02:28 PM
Sorry, but usually MWSF gives us 2-3 somethings in the computer department and by the end of January or mid-february, something else has seen a Tuesday revision. It's just really quiet. And I see the next home page change, :apple:tv now shipping. Ok great, something we already knew about is now available as promised - in February.

I have to imagine their sales are hurting a bit with so many people waiting on Mini and iMac revisions.

Well they will get those sales back, and i still see a ton of people walking into the apple story and buying. Also, its just the silence before the storm, we know somethings coming, so it hasnt come out yet, if it makes the product that less buggy, then amen good for apple, i cant wait.

mattscott306
Feb 20, 2007, 02:31 PM
Seriously oversimplified. Apple has "borrowed" ideas others too.


If it's based on a commercial, then stretching of the truth is allowed. :)

Maccus Aurelius
Feb 20, 2007, 02:52 PM
The iMac is in no serious need of revision. It just got a RAM support boost and Core 2 Duo, it's not really hurting for any big changes (though I'd LOVE to see easily swappable HDD's, that would sell me for sure) The Mini is the one that's still in need of revisions, like better max RAM more accessible parts a better processor and so forth.

People will always be "hurting" for mac revisions for some reason or other. I'm sure people were hurting for Core 2 Duo as soon as we all got wind of them. And just as I thought, when Macbooks and iMacs came with C2D's as standard, people began murmuring about Santa Rosa platforms and faster processors. Now people want octo-core Mac Pros, even though most would probably never use all of the power. It's like clamoring to get a 12 cylinder engine just to drive to the supermarket for some people.

Wild-Bill
Feb 20, 2007, 02:52 PM
Good,

Maybe they can persuade Steve & Bill to don those big sumo-wrestling outfits and duke it out for charity............or something. :p

cloudnine
Feb 20, 2007, 02:53 PM
If they came on stage together and did the "I'm a Mac", "And I'm a PC" thing it would be just about the funniest thing ever.

Yeah, but considering that Bill Gates has stated before that he's "never seen one of those advertisements", it might be a little hard for him to play along...

As if he's never watched one... pshaw! :cool:

nukiduz
Feb 20, 2007, 03:00 PM
Steve Jobs has participated before at this conference, and provided some of his insights on Apple and the market.

And has Apple ever released something then?

Peace
Feb 20, 2007, 03:01 PM
For the record Steve Jobs normally does talk shows and this type of thing after a product has been released.

mattscott306
Feb 20, 2007, 03:05 PM
For the record Steve Jobs normally does talk shows and this type of thing after a product has been released.

Maybe he'll do it this time to release the product? I.E. When he's out talking with Gates about vista, he drops leopard.

**Shakes head to stop dreaming**

Peace
Feb 20, 2007, 03:12 PM
Maybe he'll do it this time to release the product? I.E. When he's out talking with Gates about vista, he drops leopard.

**Shakes head to stop dreaming**

The fact that Steve Jobs and Bill Gates will be doing this in May to me implies OS 10.5 will already be out.Think about it.
Gates talks up his new Vista and Jobs talks about his "upcoming release" ??

Doesn't make sense.

ClimbingTheLog
Feb 20, 2007, 03:20 PM
it could be billed as "mac vs pc" ads, the originals.....

It'd go a little something like this:

http://www.youtube.com/profile?user=nerdsmusical

Steve usually turns these kind of conferences down, doesn't he? Although, I think he's done the All Things Digital one before though, right? I was more surprised that he shared the stage with Michael Dell at that education discussion.

Nothing like a life threatening illness to reorient your priority list. Considering Disney, strong-arming Cingular, the DRM letter, blasting teachers' unions, blasting Vista, etc., Steve seems more willing to take risks to Change The World than he has previously.

spicyapple
Feb 20, 2007, 03:24 PM
The DRM issue will be a big topic of discussion. We know Steve's position, so I'd love to hear what Bill has to say about allowing Universal Music execs the opportunity of teabagging music lovers with this DRM nonsense and terrible precedent of sharing in player hardware sales. A bad move... will we see a reversing of his stance?

Westside guy
Feb 20, 2007, 03:30 PM
In the same way that vampires and the Demon Headmaster aren't particularly personable? Or just boring?

Actually I think vampires are usually portrayed as being very personable. :D

I was more thinking along the lines of "not particularly well spoken; doesn't think on his feet all that well".

spicyapple
Feb 20, 2007, 03:33 PM
I was more thinking along the lines of "not particularly well spoken; doesn't think on his feet all that well".
I see Bill Gates as more of a Mr. Burns-type character. Quiet and scheming for world domination. Like Burns, jokes told at his expense go right over his head.

direzz
Feb 20, 2007, 03:37 PM
If they came on stage together and did the "I'm a Mac", "And I'm a PC" thing it would be just about the funniest thing ever.

bill gates would never embarrass himself like that.

flyinmac
Feb 20, 2007, 03:42 PM
It's sad that this passes as news.

What we need is some hardware.

You know, something other than colored shuffles and 2 of the 3 MWSF products shipping 6+ weeks after they are announced.

iMacs, Minis, Mac Pros, Displays, ultra portables, something altogether new, a long-awaited OS combined with some newer hardware to run it on.

2007, it's just the beginning... of what. A whole lot of nothing so far.


My feelings exactly.

The problem, is that everyone is so desperate for news, that they will talk about anything. If Steve was seen brushing his hair, it would be splashed all over the Internet as the most newsworthy discussion of the year.

Come-on Apple, release something worth talking about.

Oh, wait, I gotta go. Someone just released a story about Steve brushing his teeth. Gotta go now...

flyinmac
Feb 20, 2007, 03:45 PM
Oh boy 1.5 months into the year and weve gotten nothing. For gds sake mon be patient, you know how apple roles.

True enough. But, we have been waiting for him to release updated machines since last fall. The products seem to have hit a wall. No real updates for quite a while now.

direzz
Feb 20, 2007, 03:50 PM
True enough. But, we have been waiting for him to release updated machines since last fall. The products seem to have hit a wall. No real updates for quite a while now.


we all knew that apple cant keep up with intel... but they will get there eventually. be patient.

zblaxberg
Feb 20, 2007, 03:53 PM
I really don't think these two icons hate each other as much as the internet community believes.Sure they have different philosophies about computers but in any case it should be an interesting discussion from these guys!


they're both rich and own successful companies...why should they complain? that's our job. i doubt they hate each other. it's the people like us that crack it up to be something its not

flyinmac
Feb 20, 2007, 04:02 PM
we all knew that apple cant keep up with intel... but they will get there eventually. be patient.

It does seem funny though:

We waited and waited and waited for something that didn't ever happen. Blaming IBM, Apple said IBM couldn't produce the processors they wanted fast enough to make it happen.

Then, Apple announces a switch to Intel and IBM starts rolling processors out quickly.

Now, Apple's switched to Intel, and we're waiting, and waiting, and waiting, and waiting again. Only this time we're waiting longer for updates than before. And, the updated and faster products are already available from Intel.

So, now we're waiting on Apple and not the processor manufacturer.

It would now appear as though Apple just can't keep-up in the computer industry, and has just been using IBM as a convenient excuse or scapegoat.

The problem, is that now that Apple is using roughly the same hardware as everyone else, this lack of forward movement makes it really easy to see Apple as being slow to adopt and a trailing computer company.

When Apple is the last one to implement the latest processors, it doesn't exactly scream market leader.

HP, Compaq, and several others had the quad-core processors implemented within a week to two weeks of Intel announcing. Some took around a month. But, to date, Apple hasn't even delivered (or implied that they intend to).

And, when you consider that the Mac Pro sells for $2500 to $3000 and even higher, it's hard to shell out that kind of money for a machine that doesn't implement the latest technology.

steve_hill4
Feb 20, 2007, 04:03 PM
Yeah, but considering that Bill Gates has stated before that he's "never seen one of those advertisements", it might be a little hard for him to play along...

As if he's never watched one... pshaw! :cool:

Hasn't he said in interviews that he hasn't seen one of the commercials, only to later go on about the content of them in detail he'd only know if he had seen them?

flyinmac
Feb 20, 2007, 04:12 PM
Hasn't he said in interviews that he hasn't seen one of the commercials, only to later go on about the content of them in detail he'd only know if he had seen them?

Or had someone in his staff describe it to him.

Mac-Mariachi
Feb 20, 2007, 04:28 PM
It's sad that this passes as news.

What we need is some hardware.

You know, something other than colored shuffles and 2 of the 3 MWSF products shipping 6+ weeks after they are announced.

iMacs, Minis, Mac Pros, Displays, ultra portables, something altogether new, a long-awaited OS combined with some newer hardware to run it on.

2007, it's just the beginning... of what. A whole lot of nothing so far.

I second that opinion. Iīm in the market for a new Mac, but donīt want to buy one today just to have a new one out next tuesday. Unfortunately thatīs what I been saying myself for about two months now. The wait for new Macs is almost unbearable!

I need both a desktop and a laptop, so what ever comes out first is ok by me.

Westside guy
Feb 20, 2007, 04:31 PM
I see Bill Gates as more of a Mr. Burns-type character. Quiet and scheming for world domination. Like Burns, jokes told at his expense go right over his head.

Excellent...

BALLMER! RELEASE THE HOUNDS!!

roland.g
Feb 20, 2007, 04:34 PM
I second that opinion. Iīm in the market for a new Mac, but donīt want to buy one today just to have a new one out next tuesday. Unfortunately thatīs what I been saying myself for about two months now. The wait for new Macs is almost unbearable!

I need both a desktop and a laptop, so what ever comes out first is ok by me.

I used to look forward to every tuesday, usually one out of every 3-6 tuesdays sees something. That's turned into nevery tuesday.

all we need is to march on cupertino: the million mac march. with a banner that reads, we want a midrange tower.

oh, I go so far off topic. but then again the news that started this thread was sooo exciting.

funkychunkz
Feb 20, 2007, 04:38 PM
<OFFtopic>

I think they are friendly to each other when they have to be but don't bet on them going on a weekend camping trip together.

Wow, I JUST heard that joke for the first time this morning...Then I read this, strange...

roland.g
Feb 20, 2007, 04:39 PM
There are 5 main things on the :apple: home page. You can't get 3 of them from :apple: yet:

the iPhone
drm free music
:apple:tv

but you can get colored shuffles
and watch their latest ads

and p.s. the black box around the iPhone doesn't match the home page black. I'm sure someone over at :apple: has Adobe.

BWhaler
Feb 20, 2007, 04:47 PM
I was going to D this year, but didn't get my registration in.

Bummed about missing The Steve & Bill Show

Eraserhead
Feb 20, 2007, 04:48 PM
When Apple is the last one to implement the latest processors, it doesn't exactly scream market leader.
They had Merom in the iMac in September remember ;).

HP, Compaq, and several others had the quad-core processors implemented within a week to two weeks of Intel announcing. Some took around a month. But, to date, Apple hasn't even delivered (or implied that they intend to).

And, when you consider that the Mac Pro sells for $2500 to $3000 and even higher, it's hard to shell out that kind of money for a machine that doesn't implement the latest technology.

Are the 8 core processors actually worth having yet, to me they seem very expensive for very little performance.

twoodcc
Feb 20, 2007, 04:53 PM
Gates will probably try to splooge Jobs with his Zune.

yeah, lol, he probably will.

looking forward to hearing the results of this though....:apple:

GregA
Feb 20, 2007, 04:55 PM
True enough. But, we have been waiting for him to release updated machines since last fall. The products seem to have hit a wall. No real updates for quite a while now.
I agree on the MacPros, to a point, but for the rest the machines are quite top notch.

The MacPros are an interesting one. The dual and quad G5s are really fast, and Apple needed to make sure their replacements were faster. Hence Xeon Quad core (dual-dual) Intel systems. Faster than most people need, but a good move for Apple especially with people running programs in emulation.

As emulation becomes less important, the requirement for incredible speed reduces. Sure, some people still need the fastest there is (and Apple should be answering that market!!!), but for the rest of us the existing MacPros run things brilliantly. If the costs of the chips are coming down though, we should get some of those price cuts!! (are they?)

Remember also that people have put 2x quad cores in the Mac Pro - it works, and the system simply can not max out the cores. I hope Apple takes the time to factor that into their design so that when they ship quad cores they're as fast as possible.

ClimbingTheLog
Feb 20, 2007, 04:55 PM
Or had someone in his staff describe it to him.

Bill Gates has something like a dozen staff members to filter spam for him. That's cost effective. Paying somebody to watch a 30 second ad and spend two minutes explaining it isn't.

HP, Compaq, and several others had the quad-core processors implemented within a week to two weeks of Intel announcing. Some took around a month. But, to date, Apple hasn't even delivered (or implied that they intend to).

Part of the allure of Apple computers is the stability. Keeping down the number of models helps with that. If the Mac OS on a quad-core isn't of sufficient value, don't buy it. My guess is they'll release the quads with the crop of machines that do boot acceleration with solid state. Then they'll be faster than the HP's (HP owns Compaq). But Intel isn't releasing that technology until next month, IIRC. NAB seems like a natural for the OctoMac and Blu-Ray.

GregA
Feb 20, 2007, 05:05 PM
And, when you consider that the Mac Pro sells for $2500 to $3000 and even higher, it's hard to shell out that kind of money for a machine that doesn't implement the latest technology.

It's not simply a matter of $3000 = latest technology.

I know when Apple's Quad came out, the $3k for a MacPro compared quite favourably with the Dell equivalent. Are you saying that similarly configured 8-core Dells (ie latest technology) are now available at $3000? If so I'd agree with your comment above. If not, you're way off base.

I haven't done the research because I'm not in the market for a machine presently. You imply you have... so I'm interested.

timmillwood
Feb 20, 2007, 05:23 PM
so we got 'D' in May and WWDC in June? or was it July?

but they seems a bit close, there must me loads of new stuff on the way

I think 'D' will be Leopard, iLife and iWork (maybe iPhone)

Then WWDC will be new Mac Pro, new screens and some pro software

maybe we will see mac mini and macbook mini somewhere around then too.

Clive At Five
Feb 20, 2007, 05:42 PM
so we got 'D' in May and WWDC in June? or was it July?

but they seems a bit close, there must me loads of new stuff on the way

I think 'D' will be Leopard, iLife and iWork (maybe iPhone)

Then WWDC will be new Mac Pro, new screens and some pro software

maybe we will see mac mini and macbook mini somewhere around then too.

If I would have to venture a guess, I would say the exact opposite. As WWDC is a DEVELOPERS confrence, it should be software focused. I realize that in the past, Apple has released PowerMacs, Displays, and OS releases at WWDC, but if we have to pick and choose...

I say the computers will be updated sporadically between now and WWDC, not specifically on any "technology holiday."

Leopard and the iSuites will debut at WWDC... and possibly not receive an '08 revision. If that is the case, however, expect one or both to be huge updates (iWork, I'm looking at you). A Spreadsheet app is almost guaranteed, as well as a much-needed update to Pages (or if my ultimate dreams are realized, Apple will concede that "Pages" is the competitor to "Publisher" and a true word-processor is in the works - or better yet, included in iWork '07). iWeb will receive a much-needed update. Apple will released more advanced dev. tools so that developers can more-easily use iLife-style integration in their applications.

This year's WWDC will be "all about the software."

-Clive

polyesterlester
Feb 20, 2007, 05:48 PM
so we got 'D' in May and WWDC in June? or was it July?

but they seems a bit close, there must me loads of new stuff on the way

I think 'D' will be Leopard, iLife and iWork (maybe iPhone)

Then WWDC will be new Mac Pro, new screens and some pro software

maybe we will see mac mini and macbook mini somewhere around then too.

I don't think Apple's going to announce anything at D. It's just a speaking gig. Apple won't even have a booth, I don't believe.

dontmatter
Feb 20, 2007, 06:13 PM
So, now we're waiting on Apple and not the processor manufacturer.


what yhou should have said is "now we know we're waiting on apple and not the processor manufacturer".

I think apple likes the occasional big release schedule, and always has. It means there's more hype and likability to products when they announce them (and they're in the news, etc), so people have a positive image in their mind. Then, at the end of the product lifecycle, there's a nice profit margin, because the parts have gotten cheaper, but apple hasn't updated. People still buy because the good image persists, and they can't get apple without paying for it, so they do. It's a way for apple to squeeze more money out of people that it's competitors don't/can't. Not to mention, it makes people come to places like this to figure out when to buy, which makes them major mac heads.

Dean812@msn.com
Feb 20, 2007, 06:59 PM
Jobs will totally embarass Gates. I cant wait to see this one. Its like the Devil meets Jesus 2007. Go Jesus!!!!

Lonon
Feb 20, 2007, 07:10 PM
I think they don't give a crap about the Apple/Microsoft war. Steve wants the Mac community to see his act and melt under the RDF. And Bill... well, he has so much money than i'm surprised he's even talking to people. Really, i know i wouldn't. :D

So chill out, this is just media circus.

psychofreak
Feb 20, 2007, 07:13 PM
what yhou should have said is "now we know we're waiting on apple and not the processor manufacturer".

I think apple likes the occasional big release schedule, and always has. It means there's more hype and likability to products when they announce them (and they're in the news, etc), so people have a positive image in their mind. Then, at the end of the product lifecycle, there's a nice profit margin, because the parts have gotten cheaper, but apple hasn't updated. People still buy because the good image persists, and they can't get apple without paying for it, so they do. It's a way for apple to squeeze more money out of people that it's competitors don't/can't. Not to mention, it makes people come to places like this to figure out when to buy, which makes them major mac heads.Well...iBook sales plummeted with anticipation for the macbook, and mac mini sales (no stats, just a feeling) seem to be falling as people are waiting for C2D

EagerDragon
Feb 20, 2007, 07:52 PM
Is not like Billy has anything of value to say. Hey maybe Steve releases Leopard a few days before and Billy comes in with a photocopier to the meet.

flyinmac
Feb 20, 2007, 07:58 PM
what yhou should have said is "now we know we're waiting on apple and not the processor manufacturer".


Quite right. That is a more accurate way of putting it.



I think apple likes the occasional big release schedule, and always has. It means there's more hype and likability to products when they announce them (and they're in the news, etc), so people have a positive image in their mind. Then, at the end of the product lifecycle, there's a nice profit margin, because the parts have gotten cheaper, but apple hasn't updated. People still buy because the good image persists, and they can't get apple without paying for it, so they do. It's a way for apple to squeeze more money out of people that it's competitors don't/can't. Not to mention, it makes people come to places like this to figure out when to buy, which makes them major mac heads.

Again, well put.

I do agree with that quite a lot.

My main reasons for not considering the Mac Pro at this point:

1) I really don't need the highest end machine. It is a bit over-kill for me. So, I'd rather have a mid-range system. But, I absolutely do not want and could not make-do with an iMac (need to open it up periodically to blow the dust out and also don't want to be replacing the monitor I have).

2) If I am going to be stuck buying the Mac Pro just to get something that is at least a mid-range without a built-in monitor, then:

I don't want to pay full price for a machine which should have been updated several months ago.
since I'm looking at spending almost $3000 anyway, I want more for my money than the system offers now. $3000 is a lot of money to me, and the current configuration does not equate to $3000 worth of usefulness to me.
The value of the configuration is not that great when you consider that Intel released better processors a month after the machine was introduced that offered more power at the same price points as the current chips (of course, that assumes a 4-core 2.66 GHz taking the place of a 2-core 3.0 GHz). So, the price we would pay now really should provide us with dual quad-cores.
They need to re-introduce the $1500 to $1600 PowerMac (naturally called MacPro now). With the dual quad cores going into the high-end, and the $1600 model using dual dual-cores (or a single quad-core).


And, of course, I don't want to pay full-price at the end of a manufacturing cycle.

If Apple kept bumping their specs on a monthly basis, they would not have these slow-downs where people like me wait for the next release. We'd just buy when we need the machine instead of waiting for the next release to get the most for our money.

But, we know a better machine is coming. We know the price will be similar. And, we don't want to waste our money buying at the end of a cycle.

I purchased my first iMac G5 for top dollar before I realized that a revision B was coming out. And, I paid about $2200 as it was configured. But, the revision B came out, and for the exact same specs, I could get it for about $1400 (they upped the standard specs significantly). I learned right then that if you are going to pay top dollar, don't buy an Apple that hasn't just been updated the day before you purchase. Otherwise, you'll find you spent too much for too little value when they update tomorrow.

If they were constantly updating the systems with better processors as they came available, then they wouldn't suffer these constant buying freezes that are common once a machine has been out for 4 to 5 months. Customers would just buy the machine that is available then instead of holding-out and waiting.

It's not like they'd have to redesign the machine constantly. Just bump the CPU specs as they come available.

This would give them a steady revenue instead of a month or two of heavy buying and then 4 months of increasingly slower buying, and then 2 months of heavy buying, and 4 months of slower buying, etc.

I guess that's just the way I see it. It makes sense to me.

EagerDragon
Feb 20, 2007, 08:08 PM
Bill Gates has something like a dozen staff members to filter spam for him. That's cost effective. Paying somebody to watch a 30 second ad and spend two minutes explaining it isn't.



Part of the allure of Apple computers is the stability. Keeping down the number of models helps with that. If the Mac OS on a quad-core isn't of sufficient value, don't buy it. My guess is they'll release the quads with the crop of machines that do boot acceleration with solid state. Then they'll be faster than the HP's (HP owns Compaq). But Intel isn't releasing that technology until next month, IIRC. NAB seems like a natural for the OctoMac and Blu-Ray.

Sounds like Bill needs to buy a Mac and get a life. The fact that he has never seen one of the commercials means he is out of touch, in his own Vista world.

IMHO Bill has nothing interesting to say.

polyesterlester
Feb 20, 2007, 08:21 PM
Sounds like Bill needs to buy a Mac and get a life. The fact that he has never seen one of the commercials means he is out of touch, in his own Vista world.

IMHO Bill has nothing interesting to say.

Whoa. I wouldn't have seen these commercials if it wasn't for the internet. I don't have TV—if I had one, I'd spend time watching it instead of getting work done. And I'm fairly certain most busybusy people don't watch TV either.

EagerDragon
Feb 20, 2007, 08:28 PM
Whoa. I wouldn't have seen these commercials if it wasn't for the internet. I don't have TV—if I had one, I'd spend time watching it instead of getting work done. And I'm fairly certain most busybusy people don't watch TV either.

Life is about balance, I have a TV and mainly watch it for the news and a movie once in a while. I use my Mac a heck of a lot more than the TV.

He needs balance and contact with the rest of the world. Maybe he will then realize how well Vista is being received.

Hey Steve, sweep the floor with the man, but have him remove his glasses, it may scratch the floor.

polyesterlester
Feb 20, 2007, 08:39 PM
Life is about balance, I have a TV and mainly watch it for the news and a movie once in a while. I use my Mac a heck of a lot more than the TV.

He needs balance and contact with the rest of the world. Maybe he will then realize how well Vista is being received.

Hey Steve, sweep the floor with the man, but have him remove his glasses, it may scratch the floor.

Balance for Bill Gates very well may include watching TV, but balance for me doesn't. I'll read books or go swimming, but once I start watching TV, it gains control over me. I'll start out watching something good like BBC's Extras, and next thing I notice, five hours have flown by and I'm laying on the sofa watching What Not To Wear and, coincidentally, not wearing anything. I've gone two years now without TV, and I feel much better.

I'm not arguing against TV, I'm just saying that people who have very hectic, high-demand schedules are usually better off not watching it, and I'm sure Bill Gates doesn't watch it that often.

Willis
Feb 20, 2007, 08:49 PM
Steve should take a Zune, and go "Hey, I like how you're working the whole 'social' thing, let's see if I can find someone to share a song with.... Oh, nobody."

ahahahahaha

Xeem
Feb 20, 2007, 08:54 PM
This will either be very fun or very dull, depending on how bold Gates and Jobs are feeling (and Gates has been mighty bold lately)...

EagerDragon
Feb 20, 2007, 08:55 PM
Balance for Bill Gates very well may include watching TV, but balance for me doesn't. I'll read books or go swimming, but once I start watching TV, it gains control over me. I'll start out watching something good like BBC's Extras, and next thing I notice, five hours have flown by and I'm laying on the sofa watching What Not To Wear and, coincidentally, not wearing anything.

LOL, sounds like you find TV more interesting than all the other stuff you just mentioned.

But seriusly, Billy needs to stop and get in contact with the user base and their needs, then dream how to really make their life better, not how to dominate them.

Steve is a dreamer but he knows what make people tick and what they really want. He knows how to move the masses and he has a personality that makes people want to hear what is in his mind.

I agree 100% with the comparizon of Mr. Burns to Mr. Gates. Both are patetic.

EagerDragon
Feb 20, 2007, 09:02 PM
This is what billy has to say http://weblog.infoworld.com/openresource/archives/2007/02/bill_gates_we_w.html

Not much!

Cult Follower
Feb 20, 2007, 11:24 PM
This is going to be an exciting event. The two most important rivals in the technology industry on the same stage. I can't wait. I hope Apple posts a Quick Time stream on the website.

polyesterlester
Feb 20, 2007, 11:26 PM
This is going to be an exciting event. The two most important rivals in the technology industry on the same stage. I can't wait. I hope Apple posts a Quick Time stream on the website.

Yeah, me too. But it's doubtful, as they didn't do it last time Jobs spoke at 'D', and also it's run by the Wall Street Journal, so I doubt they'd let Apple stream the conference.

Cult Follower
Feb 20, 2007, 11:36 PM
The Apple TV as it is now will have appeal to loads of people that have downloaded movies off of iTunes, but I think it will really catch on when you can stream content from across the internet to your tv (ie. YouTube) and when the iTs gets more studios and the digital movie phenomenon catches on. I personally am gonna buy one, I love the idea of digital movies.
Edit: wrong post but point still applies.

Kwill
Feb 21, 2007, 12:28 AM
Ironic to see Cisco is one of the proud sponsors of the event. :eek:

DaveTheGrey
Feb 21, 2007, 12:38 AM
Gates vs. Jobs (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qHO8l-Bd1O4&eurl=http%3A%2F%2Fwww%2Eunf%2Dunf%2Ede%2Fgvsj%2Ehtml) @ youtube, for those who don't know yet. :D

DISCOMUNICATION
Feb 21, 2007, 01:29 AM
Gates vs. Jobs (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qHO8l-Bd1O4&eurl=http%3A%2F%2Fwww%2Eunf%2Dunf%2Ede%2Fgvsj%2Ehtml) @ youtube, for those who don't know yet. :D

Some one already posted it a few pages back.

iMikeT
Feb 21, 2007, 02:26 AM
Jobs vs Gates, hmmm, my money is on Jobs.

timmillwood
Feb 21, 2007, 03:43 AM
I don't think Apple's going to announce anything at D. It's just a speaking gig. Apple won't even have a booth, I don't believe.

I am sure Steve will release something, he is having one show with bill gates and one on his own, if it was just to talk about current products i doubt he would go, he seems to like making big bold statements and doesn't do anything unless there is something in it for him.

polyesterlester
Feb 21, 2007, 03:53 AM
I am sure Steve will release something, he is having one show with bill gates and one on his own, if it was just to talk about current products i doubt he would go, he seems to like making big bold statements and doesn't do anything unless there is something in it for him.

I'd love to see him introduce something, but he didn't last time he spoke at 'D', and he didn't when he shared a stage with Michael Dell several days ago either. I just don't want anyone to get their hopes up, expecting new products when historically this has not been the kind of venue for introductions. This is one of those events where they're asked questions like where they think the future of computing is headed, etc.

mattscott306
Feb 21, 2007, 07:22 AM
I'd love to see him introduce something, but he didn't last time he spoke at 'D', and he didn't when he shared a stage with Michael Dell several days ago either. I just don't want anyone to get their hopes up, expecting new products when historically this has not been the kind of venue for introductions. This is one of those events where they're asked questions like where they think the future of computing is headed, etc.

But, there have been products released at 'D'. We got the airport express, an iTunes upgrade, and he also talked about the PDA that never was.

Nym
Feb 21, 2007, 07:45 AM
I think the whole Jobs Vs Gates is created mainly by the "fans" of each brand (both M$ and Apple), as far as I'm concerned Gates and Jobs get along because ultimately they have to. In the current technology market, neither one of them can afford to make a mistake by underestimating the other IMO.

Though I must say, that whole "back-stab" that Gates gave to Steve in the 80's must still be stuck in his throat, I personally don't know if I would ever forgive someone who did that s*** to me :) I can't even imagine what it was, now I can only watch "Pirates of Sillicon Valley" and look at Noah's (acting as Steve) saying "YOU ARE STEALING FROM US!", so scary :D

guzhogi
Feb 21, 2007, 09:00 AM
Jobs vs Gates, hmmm, my money is on Jobs.

Maybe it's going to be like the JFK-Nixon debate: people who listened to the the radio version said that Nixon won, but those who watched the TV version said JFK won. Nixon had better points, but JFK didn't look like a crook. I have a feeling that the Jobs/Gates thing is going to be the same way. Gates will have better points, but Jobs would come off as more personable.

mattscott306
Feb 21, 2007, 09:44 AM
On D5's site, it lists Steve Ballmer, not Bill Gates as a speaker. (Forgive me if someone has already posted this, I didn't see it when I skimmed before).

mattscott306
Feb 21, 2007, 09:44 AM
Gates will have better points, but Jobs would come off as more personable.

What points will Gates have that are better?

guzhogi
Feb 21, 2007, 09:49 AM
What points will Gates have that are better?

I don't know. :confused: I just have a feeling, you know? We'll just have to wait & see.

Nym
Feb 21, 2007, 11:12 AM
Gates? Better? AHAHAHAHAHAH! :D

SPUY767
Feb 21, 2007, 11:38 AM
The Mini is the one that's still in need of revisions, like better max RAM more accessible parts a better processor and so forth.

I've never understood why people feel that the mac mini needs to be user upgradeable. It's not designed to be from the get go. It is designed to be a computer which you unbox, and plug into you existing peripherals and it just works with no fuss. If you want user upgradeability get an iMac or a MacPro. However, the iMac, with something similar to the wat that the Mac Pro switches out hard drives would rock my socks.

Lonon
Feb 21, 2007, 12:11 PM
Gates vs. Jobs (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qHO8l-Bd1O4&eurl=http%3A%2F%2Fwww%2Eunf%2Dunf%2Ede%2Fgvsj%2Ehtml) @ youtube, for those who don't know yet. :D

The Finder song... LOL. And Bill "what is that music? it's like baby music!" :p

Maccus Aurelius
Feb 21, 2007, 12:36 PM
I've never understood why people feel that the mac mini needs to be user upgradeable. It's not designed to be from the get go. It is designed to be a computer which you unbox, and plug into you existing peripherals and it just works with no fuss. If you want user upgradeability get an iMac or a MacPro. However, the iMac, with something similar to the wat that the Mac Pro switches out hard drives would rock my socks.

But then if the Mini suddenly had a bad drive or bad RAM, I'd have to have it serviced to remove them instead of taking it out myself and switching them with better equipment, which is what I'd rather do anyway, and is what I do with my macbook, which is far more accessible. This isn't too much to ask. It's not just user upgradeability that I'm concerned with, but also ease of faulty part replacement. I'd rather not have a desktop whose innerds are sealed in like my iPod's.

guzhogi
Feb 21, 2007, 12:50 PM
But then if the Mini suddenly had a bad drive or bad RAM, I'd have to have it serviced to remove them instead of taking it out myself and switching them with better equipment, which is what I'd rather do anyway, and is what I do with my macbook, which is far more accessible. This isn't too much to ask. It's not just user upgradeability that I'm concerned with, but also ease of faulty part replacement. I'd rather not have a desktop whose innerds are sealed in like my iPod's.

I think the Mini's designed for those people who just need something simple and don't know that much about computers. If the hard drive goes bad, they wouldn't know what to do.

On the other hand, you bring up a good point. There are many people out there who need something simple, but also know how to fix problems they might encounter.

Just remember, most people aren't as computer literate as those who are reading this.

mattscott306
Feb 21, 2007, 12:55 PM
I think the Mini's designed for those people who just need something simple and don't know that much about computers. If the hard drive goes bad, they wouldn't know what to do.

On the other hand, you bring up a good point. There are many people out there who need something simple, but also know how to fix problems they might encounter.

Just remember, most people aren't as computer literate as those who are reading this.

See, I'm looking at getting a Mini after the line update, and I would be ticked if I decided to replace the ram and had to take into into ProCare for something as simple as that. Apple can still keep the mini aesthetically pleasing, and add some sort of functionality to open the beast up.

goosnarrggh
Feb 21, 2007, 01:13 PM
The Mini is the one that's still in need of revisions, like better max RAM more accessible parts a better processor and so forth.
If you void the warranty (or wait until your Mac Mini goes out of warranty; the first of them should be expiring in the next few weeks), you can have a Core 2 Duo Mac Mini today. Unlike the MacBook or the MacBook Pro, the Mac Mini's CPU is socketed.

And Merom C2D chips have the same form factor, the same pinout, the same chipset interface, and an extremely similar thermal profile.

autrefois
Feb 21, 2007, 03:18 PM
"Hi I make macs"-Jobs
"And I make PC's"-Bill
"Umm.. I think you mean you 'borrow; ideas from other OS creators."
"Why Mac, why would you think that?"
"Oh... lets look, windows 95 was nothing more then mac '89, and windows vista is nothing more then mac OSX lite."
"That's of no matter, have you seen our new zune, it's the most revolutionary music player to date."
"Oh, you mean the iPod was the most revolutionary music player to date."
"Fine, but our windows media center came out before your :apple:TV."
"Yeah, and the cassette player came out before the iPod, whats your point?"

:D

Maybe Steve could convince Bill to do a Mac vs. PC commercial or two, or at least do a parody of it at the conference. It would show that Bill actually does have a good sense of humor (to make up for his lack of a good OS ;) ).

DISCOMUNICATION
Feb 21, 2007, 07:13 PM
The Finder song... LOL. And Bill "what is that music? it's like baby music!" :p
Yeah, the Finder seemed to be channelling Morrissey there at the end.

SirithX
Feb 21, 2007, 08:04 PM
Here's what Jobs and Gates are like together:

http://www.trappedbydogma.com/blog/steve-jobs-and-bill-gates-rare-public-appearance-together-photos/

WildCowboy
Feb 21, 2007, 08:18 PM
Here's what Jobs and Gates are like together:

http://www.trappedbydogma.com/blog/steve-jobs-and-bill-gates-rare-public-appearance-together-photos/

Not sure why they say they're "recent" photos...they're from All Things Digital 2005.

zac4mac
Feb 22, 2007, 08:41 AM
To heck with the "recent photos" - check out another link on that page, the commercial for Windows 1.0 by Ballmer. Try to not pee yourselves.

http://www.trappedbydogma.com/blog/steve-balmer-1986-tv-ad-selling-windows-10/

Better than the Monkey Boy dance.

Z

psychofreak
Feb 22, 2007, 08:47 AM
To heck with the "recent photos" - check out another link on that page, the commercial for Windows 1.0 by Ballmer. Try to not pee yourselves.

http://www.trappedbydogma.com/blog/steve-balmer-1986-tv-ad-selling-windows-10/

Better than the Monkey Boy dance.

Z

Is that a joke?!

zac4mac
Feb 22, 2007, 03:02 PM
Thought it might be a joke, but the stuff on wiki looks like it's maybe real. Guess Ballmer was a used car salesman before joining NanoFlaccid.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microsoft_Windows

Z

Confirmed from 2005 - http://d.smugmug.com/gallery/581721#24354093

Zigster
Feb 22, 2007, 06:30 PM
Wonder if Steve will ask for a job after he has to take an SEC-recommended "vacation"...

flyinmac
Feb 22, 2007, 07:15 PM
Wonder if Steve will ask for a job after he has to take an SEC-recommended "vacation"...

Wouldn't be the first time in the computer industry where a CEO left and went to lead a competing company. It's been done many times in the 80's when we had dozens of competing computer platforms. It was always fun to watch them convert and rebuild the underdog to kick the butt of the company that they had previously turned into a staggering success.

It might be fun to see what Steve would do if he were to try and take-on Apple as CEO of another company. That could be a fun show.

flyinmac
Feb 22, 2007, 07:54 PM
It's not simply a matter of $3000 = latest technology.

I know when Apple's Quad came out, the $3k for a MacPro compared quite favourably with the Dell equivalent. Are you saying that similarly configured 8-core Dells (ie latest technology) are now available at $3000? If so I'd agree with your comment above. If not, you're way off base.

I haven't done the research because I'm not in the market for a machine presently. You imply you have... so I'm interested.


Well, I haven't done an exhaustive search to find the best price on an 8-core setup. So, there very well may be some in the $3000 range that are faster.

But, I have found one nicely configured 8-core Dell for $3347 that runs with dual quad-core 1.86 GHz CPU's (8-cores total).

The 2.33 GHz version is about $4167 for 8-cores running at 2.33 GHz. And, of course they have higher models yet.

I didn't bother going through their entire product line to see if another model would come-in cheaper. But, someone certainly could.

You can read that discussion in the thread at:
http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?p=3381939

I did also find some offerings from Alienware though they were a bit more.

I'm sure with some time devoted to it, that I could likely come-up with a pretty decent priced 8-core system. But, with only a couple of minutes invested, I did find some decent 8-core packages. Naturally, I'd investigate deeper for bargains if I were actually going to purchase one of the PC types instead of a Mac.

tshakey
May 30, 2007, 04:42 PM
PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE i want to see this interview...as soon as it comes on youtube or whatever can somebody post a link, it sounds like its gonna b golddust!!