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View Full Version : Mario Sunshine, What's to hate?!




twistedlegato
Jun 11, 2007, 07:17 PM
I read around EVERYWHERE, and everyone hates Super Mario Sunshine.

What's to hate? The graphics are *were* fantastic, it had excellent and creative levels, not to mention the beautiful worlds those levels took place in. It introduced new characters (Bower Jr.) and had a great story ( much better than "Mario i baked you a cake, come to my castle")

Don't get me wrong i love SM64 but what's wrong with Sunshine?


It is my favorite 3D mario game. Though until Galaxy that is...



zap2
Jun 11, 2007, 07:20 PM
. It introduced new characters (baby bowser)

Might want to read up about that

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baby_Bowser

Vidd
Jun 11, 2007, 07:21 PM
It is a fantastic game but nostalgia amongst other things gets the better of people. It simply could not capture the magic of playing a proper 3D game for the first time with characters that had been 2D for so long. No game can do that.
It also was not a "pure" Mario game. People wanted another 3D exploration game without any gimmick. I enjoyed the varied gameplay, actually.

One thing though; I've always felt that the portions where the backpack was taken away were more enjoyable than the actual game. They also involved giant floating objects in space...quite like Super Mario Galaxy.

Fearless Leader
Jun 11, 2007, 07:24 PM
That sunshine word, such a horrid and hated word.

Dagless
Jun 11, 2007, 07:26 PM
I liked Sunshine. Problem was that there was so little leap from 64 to Sunshine. It feels more like a "Mario 2" since it uses different gameplay from Mario 64 too.

It's still great though. I love the music, the graphics feel all warm and cosy. Love the nighttime mushroom level. And of course the traditional platform levels! They are very well made and I'd love a Wii or DS game in that style.

I remember when I got onto the first level and slid down that hill thinking "Wow" and feeling so happy I ate a dinner I didn't even like.

GFLPraxis
Jun 11, 2007, 10:06 PM
Couldn't agree more. I loved Super Mario Sunshine. The graphics were distinctive and beautiful and the gameplay was extremely fun.

A lot of people called it "childish", "girly", or "gay", that I know of and refused to play it.

GFLPraxis
Jun 11, 2007, 10:10 PM
Might want to read up about that

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baby_Bowser

You're confusing Baby Bowser with Bowser Jr.

Super Mario Sunshine DID introduce Bowser Jr. Baby Bowser was introduced in Yoshi's Island for SNES.

Before people not familiar with the games ask what the difference is; Baby Bowser is simply Bowser when he was a baby. Bowser Jr. is Bowser's son.

Frankly, I can't stand Bowser Jr.; I want my Koopalings back.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Koopalings

SamIchi
Jun 12, 2007, 12:06 AM
I liked it, wasn't great but it was good.

Personally I found the water thing a bit "attached". I don't like how certain things were only achievable with certain nozzles or whatever. It really broke up the gameplay IMO. Another thing was that it wasn't a big improvement over M64. It was a the next gen Mario, it was supposed to be major!

Nintendo fans were expecting what SMB 2 + 3 did to the original SMB, and what SMW was to it's predecessors and what SMW2 (yoshi's island) was to SMW, and what M64 did to revolutionize gaming... and then you hit sunshine. Everyone was like ok, there's a water thingy, yea it changed the gameplay but it was basically the same 3-d platform and added a wierd weapon. Look at every Mario game and you'll see what's wrong with Sunshine. Every Mario (direct series) was new and refreshing, gameplay wise and visually.

almightyshoe
Jun 12, 2007, 12:38 AM
Hand to God, I just picked up this game for the first time ever last week at Gamestop. I've played it for about 30 minutes total and I can feel the rage building. But some of the rage comes from Nintendo's inability to let you skip scenes or really long speeches you really don't want to listen to (this goes for you too, Windwaker).

GFLPraxis
Jun 12, 2007, 02:39 AM
Hand to God, I just picked up this game for the first time ever last week at Gamestop. I've played it for about 30 minutes total and I can feel the rage building. But some of the rage comes from Nintendo's inability to let you skip scenes or really long speeches you really don't want to listen to (this goes for you too, Windwaker).
Complaining about Sunshine AND Wind Waker? I loved both.

What long speeches? The main character didn't even talk! Contrast to games like Xenosaga with thirty-minute-long-cutscenes.

Dagless
Jun 12, 2007, 05:29 AM
I can count the number of cutscenes on one hand :D skippable would be great though, I just never saw it as a problem since there were so few.

Thing is, Mario Sunshine didn't even contain the "Mario 128 formula", there wasn't even a multiplayer mode. I've no doubt Galaxy will surpass Sunshine and hopefully give Mario 64 a run for its money. It's 1000 points money.

ChrisK018
Jun 12, 2007, 08:48 AM
Sunshine was the first AAA Mario game that failed to live up to my expectations. I agree with jimmi that it was not much of a step up from Mario 64.

It's still a pretty darn good game, but Sunshine lost the delicate balance of rage-inducing frustration vs. reward for accomplishment. It turned me into a quitter. First Mario game I lost my desire to finish/complete.

Haoshiro
Jun 12, 2007, 12:06 PM
SMS is great.

Especially loved the "classic" challenge levels. (no water pack)

zap2
Jun 12, 2007, 12:14 PM
You're confusing Baby Bowser with Bowser Jr.

Super Mario Sunshine DID introduce Bowser Jr. Baby Bowser was introduced in Yoshi's Island for SNES.



The OP said the game introduced Baby Bowser...I said it didn't.

Anorak
Jun 12, 2007, 12:19 PM
SMS is great.

Especially loved the "classic" challenge levels. (no water pack)

Same here. Super Mario Sunshine was great (my favourite game on the GameCube).

The classic challenges were so fun - many people (myself included) wished that Nintendo released a "classic challenge" game only.

it5five
Jun 12, 2007, 01:20 PM
I think it could have been a better game with no water pack and more "classic". It's still really fun though.

twistedlegato
Jun 12, 2007, 01:28 PM
The OP said the game introduced Baby Bowser...I said it didn't.

Just some small confusion, i dont understand all the "rage" everyone gets:confused:

zap2
Jun 12, 2007, 01:33 PM
Just some small confusion, i dont understand all the "rage" everyone gets:confused:

I'm not going to lie....I've never played Mario Sunshine! So I had NO idea what I was talking about. I looked it up on Wikipedia...I'm not raging, I'm just bored, so I'm nitpicking(sp?)

MacRumorUser
Jun 12, 2007, 03:05 PM
I'm not going to lie....I've never played Mario Sunshine! So I had NO idea what I was talking about. I looked it up on Wikipedia...I'm not raging, I'm just bored, so I'm nitpicking(sp?)

Zap2, you should be bound, chained and whipped. Not for not playing MarioSunshine, I mean just for fun ;) :D

Seriously though I am surprised, I like the game - I still play it on my Wii, whilst eagerly waiting Mario Galaxy sometime in the next 4 years :p

twistedlegato
Jun 12, 2007, 04:02 PM
Seriously though I am surprised, I like the game - I still play it on my Wii, whilst eagerly waiting Mario Galaxy sometime in the next 4 years :p

I just wish there was a little switch in my brain where i could forget everything about a game, so when i re-play it, it is just as fun as the first time i played it

rockthecasbah
Jun 12, 2007, 04:18 PM
I agree with the OP, i love Super Mario Sunshine. It was great and a refreshing change from the stereotypical "Mario World." I think people do not like change and so because you collected "Shines Sprites" instead of "Stars" and had a jetpack that people disliked those new elements.


If games don't try new things they get old and i applaud Nintendo for spicing up the franchise. You'll never please everyone but hey it sold well so im thinking they aren't too worried. Plus Mario has such a cult following i don't think too many people got scared off of Mario games just yet :p

MacRumorUser
Jun 12, 2007, 04:47 PM
I just wish there was a little switch in my brain where i could forget everything about a game, so when i re-play it, it is just as fun as the first time i played it


We all wish for that. There's nothing better than the first time
unless your a male, and then the first time is usally a bitter dissapointment ;) :p

furcalchick
Jun 12, 2007, 05:16 PM
i personally love the game. i agree that it was a bit of a letdown after 64, but still great. i would give it 9/10 easily. only major complaint would be that the game world felt a bit small compared to 64.

mario has never let me down.:)

MacRumorUser
Jun 12, 2007, 05:42 PM
mario has never let me down.:)

Mario in Time ? Mario Paint ? Mario Sodomy ? I may have made the last one up.. ;) :D

devilot
Jun 12, 2007, 06:00 PM
I tried playing this.. (if this is indeed the game where you go around trying to hose off oily spots and attempt to collect big gold coins).

I just couldn't get the hang of the movements and whatnot. :o But then again, I'm really crap at video games. Like, just downright terrible. :o

applekid
Jun 12, 2007, 09:51 PM
Frankly, I can't stand Bowser Jr.; I want my Koopalings back.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Koopalings

Here here!

Anyways, I hated Sunshine. The controls just didn't work for this game. Then you have those silly FLUDD-less platforming scenes to get your stupid Shine. Totally gave up on that game.

It's a graphically beautiful game (and definitely shows what the GameCube and the Wii are capable of), but the controls were not tight and the gameplay was mediocre at best.

twistedlegato
Jun 12, 2007, 09:55 PM
Here here!

Anyways, I hated Sunshine. The controls just didn't work for this game. Then you have those silly FLUDD-less platforming scenes to get your stupid Shine. Totally gave up on that game.

It's a graphically beautiful game (and definitely shows what the GameCube and the Wii are capable of), but the controls were not tight and the gameplay was mediocre at best.

In M64 you were FLUDD less and were chasing after a Star!

SAME THING PEOPLE!

applekid
Jun 13, 2007, 08:02 AM
In M64 you were FLUDD less and were chasing after a Star!

SAME THING PEOPLE!

Except you didn't have gigantic jumps to make with weird platforms and wooden blocks rotating in all sorts of directions. It was too easy to die.

Consider this: I played Super Mario 64 by myself for the first time because of the Wii. I had like 70+ stars in a couple of days play. Sunshine? I have like 25 Shines at best.

Rice Cooka
Jun 13, 2007, 10:45 AM
Super Mario Sunshine is a GOOD game. One of the best platformers of the GC, PS2, XBox generation. It's predecessor Mario 64 is one of my top 3 games of all time (this is not nostalgia speaking as I downloaded 64 on the Virtual Console and STILL think no other 3D platformer can touch it). When you're following up a mind blowing, genre defining masterpiece, being just good isn't good enough.

Here were my 2 biggest gripes with Sunshine:

BIG Gripe #1 - Too much collecting. I know Mario 64 pioneered the "collect X pieces of crap" formula but, here's the difference: most of the time in 64 you were doing some fun task (racing a penguin, fighting a caterpillar, flying through rings). Sure it had a "collect 8 red coins" and a "collect 100 coins" star in each level but those were by far the weakest parts of it. Mario sunshine on the other hand had 2 or 3 (or more! I can't quite remember) "collect the coins" shines per level PLUS harder 100 coin shines PLUS other shines were the whole task was to FIND crap. Add in the incredibly tedious blue coin hunt and you have a game that eventually becomes a chore. I did not rest until I had 120 stars in M64 but I had no problems quitting Sunshine after only finding around 90 shines.

BIG Gripe #2 - Not enough freedom. I LOVED how in Mario 64, with very few exceptions, you could jump into a level and try to find any one of the 7 stars, not just the one for which a hint was provided. Consequently I HATED how in Sunshine most (if not all) of the time you were FORCED to go after a single particular shine because the level layouts changed and would only allow that single route. Ugh. Give me back my freedom to solve problems and find my own path to stars.

Other smaller gripes: Camera in the theme park level, most useless and unwieldy incarnation of Yoshi ever, abysmally bad cutscenes and an anticlimactic final battle.

To be honest, the most common complaints I hear about sunshine like it not being set in the mushroom kingdom, having to use a water pack and lack of variety in level settings did not bother me at all.

Like I said, it's STILL a good game, just disappointing. Among my Gamecube sequels to classic N64 games I would EASILY pick Wind Waker with all its flaws over Mario Sunshine.

I'm still almost peeing my pants in anticipation of Galaxy.

Dagless
Jun 13, 2007, 11:10 AM
Oh yea, without a doubt Sunshine was the best platformer of last gen. Thing is all 3D platformers will be compared to Mario 64 until the next big one comes along. I've got high hopes for Galaxy (along with Nintendo's "revolution-evolution" cycle in consoles, the same can be applied to Mario games). It seems like it does have the freedom of Mario 64 and art direction of Sunshine (with much better soft lighting).