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View Full Version : What do we think of this then? (New BMW 1-series coupe)


AlBDamned
Jul 1, 2007, 07:22 PM
It's still got that horrible swoopy line along the bottom, but with a boot and the twin turbo engine this little thing could redefine the term "pocket-rocket".

OutThere
Jul 1, 2007, 07:31 PM
I dig it. If they come to the US I'd totally be in the market for a used one (maybe new if I plan it right) in a few years.

BMW has struggled to get their smaller models right for a while, though from the looks of it this one's been done properly.

AlBDamned
Jul 1, 2007, 08:22 PM
I dig it. If they come to the US I'd totally be in the market for a used one (maybe new if I plan it right) in a few years.

BMW has struggled to get their smaller models right for a while, though from the looks of it this one's been done properly.

They are indeed coming to the US (http://jalopnik.com/cars/ah_cha%21/the-2008-bmw-1+series-coming-to-america-now-with-official-press-photos-274026.php). :)

quagmire
Jul 1, 2007, 09:43 PM
They are indeed coming to the US (http://jalopnik.com/cars/ah_cha%21/the-2008-bmw-1+series-coming-to-america-now-with-official-press-photos-274026.php). :)

Although without the diesels. :(

saturnino3
Jul 1, 2007, 10:08 PM
nice looking bimmer....anybody have a gist about US pricing?

quagmire
Jul 1, 2007, 10:19 PM
nice looking bimmer....anybody have a gist about US pricing?

Rumors are ~$25K for the 128i and somewhere around $30K+ for the 135i.

Kamera RAWr
Jul 2, 2007, 12:02 AM
Ahhhh... a poor man's BMW ;)

walangij
Jul 2, 2007, 12:10 AM
Ahhhh... a poor man's BMW ;)

poor man + BMW + twin turbo = me and my face :D everytime I drive somewhere.
Besides that, is there a release date in stone yet or is it just sometime 2008 maybe but hopefully not 2009 for the US still?

John Jacob
Jul 2, 2007, 02:25 AM
Will the 135i be available in hatchback guise too? I prefer hatches to coupes...

Not that I can afford one anyway, and in any case only the 3 and 5 series are available in India.

nplima
Jul 2, 2007, 03:45 AM
Looking at this and the hatchback model I just wonder what took BMW so long before producing something that can compete with the Audi A3 in terms of looks... 3 years late?

Counterfit
Jul 2, 2007, 04:21 AM
Ahhhh... a poor man's BMW ;)

Since when is $25k+ something for a poor person? :rolleyes:
I also want to slap anyone who calls a Boxster a "poor man's Porsche" with a mid-engined roadster (and I don't mean the MR-2 Spyder).

Killyp
Jul 2, 2007, 05:02 AM
I really like it, although it looks kinda a bit more 'average' at the back than a BMW really should, plus that horrible side-line along the bottom makes it look like the whole side of the car has sagged down...

dmw007
Jul 2, 2007, 06:27 AM
I think that it looks like a nice car- similar to the previous design of the 3 series. Lately, I have been kicking the idea around of buying a new 3 series Coupe/Sedan. :)

iBlue
Jul 2, 2007, 06:35 AM
Ahhhh... a poor man's BMW ;)
Or perhaps it's just practical.



I've seen several of them here (UK) and I really like them.

Lord Blackadder
Jul 2, 2007, 08:47 AM
The styling is an improvement over some of the other BMWs, but still a step down from the previous generation in terms of looks.

I'm not convinced BMW can build a successful car under $30k these days, especially in the face of competition from Volkswagen and the Japanese. Still, it looks to be a better package than the lame 318. But Merc failed with their "cheap" hatchback, so we'll see I guess. The diesel option is missing - why?

Looking at the photos, I still don't like the way the headlights taper to a point on the outside, which gives the car a squinty look. Also, the car pictured is presumably the 135i with the "M appearance package"...which looks nice and aggressive, but what does the base model look like?

mahashel
Jul 2, 2007, 02:32 PM
So I guess this is another option when I consider upgrading my Jetta 1.8T next year.
I like the look of the BMW, but wonder how many critical corners were cut in order to keep the price down. Would it really be that much of an upgrade from a higher-end VW or lower-end Audi? (I love my german cars) There are some really nice european cars to compete with in the 25K-30K range.
I guess I'll just have to test drive one. :D

imac/cheese
Jul 2, 2007, 02:40 PM
I really like it, although it looks kinda a bit more 'average' at the back than a BMW really should, plus that horrible side-line along the bottom makes it look like the whole side of the car has sagged down...

I agree. From the back it reminds me of VW styling, but.... I like VW styling too.

Kamera RAWr
Jul 2, 2007, 04:02 PM
Wow, seems I'm getting a little heat from my comment, haha :p . I suppose to me the idea reminds me of the 318... was really only a BMW in name only :D

Lord Blackadder
Jul 2, 2007, 04:32 PM
Wow, seems I'm getting a little heat from my comment, haha :p . I suppose to me the idea reminds me of the 318... was really only a BMW in name only :D

The 318 - yes, it was a BMW, but it was expensive and it was crap.

The only true "poor man's BMW" is an older used one.

You can't really get a nice cheap German car these days - VWs are climbing over $30k, and are heavy and fat. I think I'd definitely take a GTI over a 128, except I'd very much prefer a RWD car.

AvalonX
Jul 2, 2007, 10:33 PM
I think its a bad idea. Its just going to degrade the BMW brand. Also, every BMW shares a common styling theme with its distinctive front kidney grill etc., and having a bunch of these low cost models filling the road it would no longer be a cool thing to see BMW driving by... it may end up as another redundantly annoying car on the road that all look the same.

And if you live is Southern California like I do. There are enough of them already.

i.e. if they release the 1-series I may no longer be interested in getting the 3-series convertible.

daze
Jul 2, 2007, 10:46 PM
The 318 - yes, it was a BMW, but it was expensive and it was crap.

The only true "poor man's BMW" is an older used one.

You can't really get a nice cheap German car these days - VWs are climbing over $30k, and are heavy and fat. I think I'd definitely take a GTI over a 128, except I'd very much prefer a RWD car.
Actually, in Canada, you can purchase either the City Jetta/Golf for $14K - 17K Canadian. Check out http://www.vw.ca. Infact, I am seriously thinking of trading in my piece of crap Pontiac Grand Am 2002 which I bought new... and just finished payments on. Sucks.

Lord Blackadder
Jul 3, 2007, 07:53 AM
I think its a bad idea. Its just going to degrade the BMW brand. Also, every BMW shares a common styling theme with its distinctive front kidney grill etc., and having a bunch of these low cost models filling the road it would no longer be a cool thing to see BMW driving by... it may end up as another redundantly annoying car on the road that all look the same.

News flash - BMWs are pretty numerous already. 9 out of 10 yuppies choose BMW...If you've got $30k to burn, there are other options...Audis are much less common, for example. Or, if you must go BMW, how about a used M3?

savar
Jul 3, 2007, 08:03 AM
poor man + BMW + twin turbo = me and my face :D everytime I drive somewhere.
Besides that, is there a release date in stone yet or is it just sometime 2008 maybe but hopefully not 2009 for the US still?

Seriously! $25k is a great deal for any car with a twin turbo... (I can hear the turbos spinning up in my head.)

iBlue
Jul 3, 2007, 08:20 AM
I think its a bad idea. Its just going to degrade the BMW brand. ...
<etc>

i.e. if they release the 1-series I may no longer be interested in getting the 3-series convertible.
I bet you were one of those people who said "If Bush wins this election, I am moving to Canada." too. ;)

bartelby
Jul 3, 2007, 08:25 AM
Meh, BMWs are pretty dull cars style wise.
The only interesting ones they've done in recent years have been the Z4 Coupe M and the M Coupe.

I'm glad some styling cues made it from the X-coupe...

steviem
Jul 3, 2007, 09:39 AM
I would totally go for one of these, although, I wish it was the UK equivalent to $30k. I cant see it happening though :(

I'm so glad BMW brought out the 3 door hatch and this, they look much nicer than the 5 door 1 series.

true777
Jul 3, 2007, 04:34 PM
Looking at this and the hatchback model I just wonder what took BMW so long before producing something that can compete with the Audi A3 in terms of looks... 3 years late?

The 1-series hatchback has been around in Europe for years. They just didn't sell it in the US, which might have been smart since Mercedes sold so few of the C-class "sports coupe" hatchbacks that they discontinued selling them in the US in 2006, while still producing and selling them in Europe. I believe the Audi A3 is slightly larger than the 1-series and C-class hatchbacks, so it's slightly more suitable for US customers. The BMW 1-series hatchback really is quite small (I have been inside one), as is the C-class sports coupe which I own. I love these cars but apparently US customers don't.

Lord Blackadder
Jul 3, 2007, 06:21 PM
I love these cars but apparently US customers don't.

I'm an American auto afficionado, but not a typical one. Generally speaking, Americans prefer sedans over hatchbacks, al else being equal. American car manufacturers sell cheap V6 sedans, which the public gobble up. In the case of the C-class coupe, it lost out here to Acura (RSX), Honda (Civic Si), the BMW 3-Series and the VW GTI/R32/V6 Jetta. For some reason this time, the badge wasn't enough to pip more run of the mill (but more entrenched & popular) marques.

I test drove a C-class coupe and liked it...not sure if I'd have bought one though - I am a bit wary of bottom of the range luxury cars.

cycocelica
Jul 4, 2007, 03:57 AM
People who drive BMWs are stereotypically rude and think they own the road.

bartelby
Jul 4, 2007, 03:59 AM
:) People who drive BMWs are stereotypically rude and think they own the road.

Them and Vauxhall Vectra drivers!

iGav
Jul 4, 2007, 06:03 AM
So perfect for pissing off every other BMW driver whose model doesn't include a prominent M on their motor. :p :p :p

Only thing is... why has it taken BMW so long? the 1 Series is due a straightforward ****** over now it's getting on a bit in the style stakes. :confused:

AlBDamned
Jul 4, 2007, 08:40 AM
Only thing is... why has it taken BMW so long? the 1 Series is due a straightforward ****** over now it's getting on a bit in the style stakes. :confused:

Who knows mate. Considering its looks got hammered by every single magazine out there when it came out, I'm surprised they didn't or haven't changed it sooner as well.

When the current Seven came out and flopped because it looked like a big barge, they smoothed out a few of the lines within about 2-2.5 years. I think the 1-series hatch is undoubtedly the worst of the Bangle designs. They usually grow on me, but I still hate the hatch even now. This new coupe is a big improvement, even if it does have a slight toy-car look to it.

Chris Bangle
Jul 5, 2007, 08:16 AM
0-60 5.3secs, 50-50 weigh, its going to be awesome. and it has an lsd. dont like rear lights. shame they are not making m1. apart rom that it looks stunning.

walangij
Jul 5, 2007, 08:51 AM
0-60 5.3secs, 50-50 weigh, its going to be awesome. and it has an lsd. dont like rear lights. shame they are not making m1. apart rom that it looks stunning.

Those are very tempting numbers, plus an LSD shoot. If the price is right, oh man debt here I come...really but jk. I don't think it'll be priced so nicely as steviem said, its just doesn't seem like bmwusa to offer us a great deal like that.

sananda
Jul 5, 2007, 09:45 PM
So I guess this is another option when I consider upgrading my Jetta 1.8T next year.
I like the look of the BMW, but wonder how many critical corners were cut in order to keep the price down. Would it really be that much of an upgrade from a higher-end VW or lower-end Audi? (I love my german cars) There are some really nice european cars to compete with in the 25K-30K range.
I guess I'll just have to test drive one. :D

i have driven a 120d quite extensively and haven't found that any corners have been cut at all. in fact, the 1 series shares a lot of components with the 3 series.

it probably isn't a massive upgrade from a vw or an audi in terms of build quality, but it will be a step up in terms of driving simply because of the rear wheel drive and 50/50 weight distribution.

Wow, seems I'm getting a little heat from my comment, haha :p . I suppose to me the idea reminds me of the 318... was really only a BMW in name only :D

that is nonsense. we have a 318ti we have had for coming up to 11 years. it has been faultless and no different in terms of quality and balanced driving from any of our other BMWs (1, 3 and 5 series).

I think its a bad idea. Its just going to degrade the BMW brand. Also, every BMW shares a common styling theme with its distinctive front kidney grill etc., and having a bunch of these low cost models filling the road it would no longer be a cool thing to see BMW driving by... it may end up as another redundantly annoying car on the road that all look the same.


i don't see how having a smaller car devalues the BMW brand. this brand was in large part built on the 1602/2002 which was a small driver oriented car just like the 1 series. the fact is that cars are have getting much bigger. the present 3 series is a bigger than the original 5 series. so BMW have merely reintroduced a car the same size as the original 3 series.

addumb@hotmail.
Jul 10, 2007, 11:58 PM
I owned the 06 325i and have to say by the end of the 2 year lease I was glad to rid myself of that car. Some minor electrical problems here and there, but mostly I got sick of looking at that design disaster. I thought it was way cool when I got it, but as time went on I thought, like most others i found, that car just didn't look right. This 1series however I personally think its kickin'. I'd buy one. But one thing I thought of; does anyone else seem to think that it looks similar to the mazda 3" Some of the styling cues? That's what it reminded me of. But anyway if they can come under 25k (which i doubt) I'd seriously consider it.

addumb@hotmail.
Jul 11, 2007, 12:02 AM
i don't see how having a smaller car devalues the BMW brand. this brand was in large part built on the 1602/2002 which was a small driver oriented car just like the 1 series. the fact is that cars are have getting much bigger. the present 3 series is a bigger than the original 5 series. so BMW have merely reintroduced a car the same size as the original 3 series.[/QUOTE]


I totally agree to this, allowing others to share in the BMW experience will only heighten bmw's brand and make it more accessible. It's very very hard to come up in the luxury market, but going down? well we'll see. The new jetta i was told is the size of the old Passat. Same thing, different company. Americans are slowly getting fatter and need more room. We want SUV's that get 90miles to the gallon. MORE MORE MORE. I live in wisconsin.

MrSmith
Jul 11, 2007, 06:46 AM
That car is butt ugly at the back. BMW seem to have lost their style. Shame. They used to be very slick.

weckart
Jul 11, 2007, 12:22 PM
i have driven a 120d quite extensively and haven't found that any corners have been cut at all. in fact, the 1 series shares a lot of components with the 3 series.

it probably isn't a massive upgrade from a vw or an audi in terms of build quality,


Almost certainly a step down, if anything. The 1-series, quite apart from being one of the most hideous hatchbacks ever foisted on the market is cheap looking on the inside and suffers from the occasional loose fitting. Pretty insulting to bracket VW and particularly Audi in the same league of workmanship, especially since Audi is pushing ever upmarket with prices to match.

sananda
Jul 14, 2007, 04:48 PM
Almost certainly a step down, if anything. The 1-series, quite apart from being one of the most hideous hatchbacks ever foisted on the market is cheap looking on the inside and suffers from the occasional loose fitting. Pretty insulting to bracket VW and particularly Audi in the same league of workmanship, especially since Audi is pushing ever upmarket with prices to match.

i really don't find the interior on the 1 series cheap looking at all (although it did take me a while to get used to it and the 3 series bmw interior since i prefer the old dash curved toward the driver). haven't found any loose fitting unlike the mini i had for a couple of years which rattled a lot. never had an audi but i hear their build quality is exemplary but i just don't like them aesthetically. vw are according to reliability surveys not that good.

mark!
Jul 16, 2007, 02:17 PM
chris bangle :mad:

AlBDamned
Jul 16, 2007, 06:59 PM
chris bangle :mad:

LOL, say no more...

Alex72
Jul 16, 2007, 10:43 PM
"I think its a bad idea. Its just going to degrade the BMW brand. ...
<etc>

i.e. if they release the 1-series I may no longer be interested in getting the 3-series convertible.


I bet you were one of those people who said "If Bush wins this election, I am moving to Canada." too."

Actually, anybody who is worried about this car "degrading the brand" may well have voted for the man, even in 2004, when it was completely inexcusable.

As far as the car's design goes, I agree with the recent frowny-face for C. Bangle... I loathe the "flame" look with a passion. Like most recent BMW designs, it is hideous from the sides and front, though I will admit (in this case), mildly okay from the rear.

Still, I hope this does well. Some people forget that 318s and the like are or were completely legitimate BMWs. In Europe, especially, it's not all about the power, it's also about an enjoyable motoring experience, even at fairly low-end levels of equipment.

Folks here, in the U.S., often aren't aware that BMW makes plenty of cars like 316s and 518s with cloth or vinyl interiors and minimal equipment levels for the rest of the world. Yet these cars are still "BMWs." In fact, most of the BMW purists I know are more intrigued by the 1-series than by, say, a "6" or a "7."

scrambledwonder
Jul 17, 2007, 02:24 AM
Meh. A ho-hum vehicle. I'd rather have a Honda Civic.

iGav
Jul 17, 2007, 07:57 AM
chris bangle :mad:

What exactly does it have to do with Chris Bangle?

sananda
Jul 17, 2007, 09:21 AM
chris bangle :mad:

i like the new designs. it works best on the z4. it took me a while to get used to the 1 series but it has grown on me. the only one i think is unsuccessful is the 3 series saloon. it looks fine from the front but completely boring from the side. unless you get the 330i the rear wheels don't fill the arches and it looks terrible. also i don't like the rear lights. whereas the coupe is much more successful with it rear arches and rear lights.

of course bangle was also responsible for some of the previous generation's designs which were very conservative. despite the criticisms of the new designs they are selling better than the previous incarnations. whether this means buyers like the designs or that they'll be a BMW whatever the design..i don't know.

sananda
Jul 17, 2007, 09:25 AM
Meh. A ho-hum vehicle. I'd rather have a Honda Civic.

if you don't notice the difference between having the wheels that are steering putting the power down and having rear wheel drive, then you are probably better off with a civic.

djarum69
Jul 17, 2007, 01:17 PM
The 1 series isn't really moving into new territory for BMW, it's just revisiting some territory that the 3 series used to live in. The 1 series is the exact same length as the E36 3 series that was so wildly popular here in the States (4227mm vs. 4208mm) and the same weight (1375kg vs. 1380kg) as well.

As the 3 series packed on the pounds and the price it left a gap the right size for the 1 series. If they don't screw it up, this will be a wild success with car guys in the US where some of us consider the E36 generation to be the last sporty 3 series.

Alex72
Jul 17, 2007, 10:02 PM
The 1 series isn't really moving into new territory for BMW, it's just revisiting some territory that the 3 series used to live in.

Exactly. A colleague of mine is a hard-core 2002tii guy, and he has often expressed interest in the 1-series, at least from a driving perspective; not so much from a styling perspective.

As for the post which mentions BMW sales being brisk in the Chris Bangle era, I think it has less to do with people liking the looks of the cars (no one I know does) and more to do with continued refinements making the cars more pleasant to drive for a wider range of people.

AlBDamned
Jul 17, 2007, 11:22 PM
where some of us consider the E36 generation to be the last sporty 3 series.

And only the M3 Evo version at that.

Despite that, for me the E46 M3 coupe is as pretty close to perfect. If I had the money, I would buy one in a flash.

GoCubsGo
Jul 17, 2007, 11:23 PM
So beautiful.

macinfojunkie
Jul 25, 2007, 01:49 PM
People who drive BMWs are stereotypically rude and think they own the road.

As a BMW driver all I can say in response is.. ******* *** and get out of may way you peasant!

Just kidding

:D

mark!
Jul 25, 2007, 02:01 PM
People who drive BMWs are stereotypically rude and think they own the road.

On the contrary, my dad (who owns 2 BMWs) think this about a majority of SUV drivers.

What exactly does it have to do with Chris Bangle?

He designs BMWs...? He has everything to do with it.

i like the new designs. it works best on the z4. it took me a while to get used to the 1 series but it has grown on me. the only one i think is unsuccessful is the 3 series saloon. it looks fine from the front but completely boring from the side. unless you get the 330i the rear wheels don't fill the arches and it looks terrible. also i don't like the rear lights. whereas the coupe is much more successful with it rear arches and rear lights.

of course bangle was also responsible for some of the previous generation's designs which were very conservative. despite the criticisms of the new designs they are selling better than the previous incarnations. whether this means buyers like the designs or that they'll be a BMW whatever the design..i don't know.

Of Chris Bangles designs, I say I like the Z4 the most, MAYBE the X3. I can stand the new designs, and wouldn't mind having one, it's just their older cars are more attractive to me. Even though he had part in the older designs, they were fine, but he didn't start ******** them up until 2002 with the 7 series (E65).

iGav
Jul 26, 2007, 07:34 AM
He designs BMWs...? He has everything to do with it.

That's the thing. He doesn't.

techlover828
Jul 26, 2007, 07:36 AM
I love BMW's especially the 5 series, but this looks nice

blitzkrieg79
Jul 26, 2007, 08:42 AM
That's the thing. He doesn't.

Isn't Von Hooydonk the one that actually is in charge of the current BMW designs?

iGav
Jul 26, 2007, 09:34 AM
Isn't Von Hooydonk the one that actually is in charge of the current BMW designs?

Yup.

What is usually attributed to Bangle actually stemmed from the pen of Adrian van Hooydonk (and his team of course).

-hh
Jul 26, 2007, 11:07 AM
I'm an American auto afficionado, but not a typical one. Generally speaking, Americans prefer sedans over hatchbacks, al else being equal.

...and the general problem in the US Market is that many of the hatchbacks that they were offered (Dodge Omni, anyone?) were rarely the 'equal'. As such, Americans developed a mindset of "hatchbacks = cheap crap", because that was mostly what they saw.

FWIW, GM did the same sort of mindset sabotague with their passenger car diesel engines in the 1970s.


American car manufacturers sell cheap V6 sedans, which the public gobble up.

All too true. Its partly because American drivers don't know poop about real driving, so they are satisfied with the garbage that they're sold because its got a nice shiny finish.

I'm very reminded of my wife's "education"...her last American sedan was a Ford Tempo (despite me trying to get her into a Jetta), but five years later, she got an Audi 80 (she's now in an A4 now) ... over the years, she has proceeded to complain LOUDLY to me about how this rental car and that rental car (that she was getting on business trips) were such a piece of garbage, with vague steering, mushy or touchy brakes, wallowing understeer, etc, etc, etc. She's just preaching to the choir :D

FWIW, she took a performance driving class last summer...and loved it.


In the case of the C-class coupe, it lost out here to Acura (RSX), Honda (Civic Si), the BMW 3-Series and the VW GTI/R32/V6 Jetta.

The same can also be said of the BMW 318ti, within certain limits. The general problem with both of these comparisons is that it is slightly apples-vs-oranges (3-Series sedans, Jetta)...

For some reason this time, the badge wasn't enough to pip more run of the mill (but more entrenched & popular) marques.

...but also that the manufacturers assumed that their badge alone could generate sales in a customer base that in the USA is more focused on hatchback practicality mindset as it relates to overall product value ... wrong move.

They then hurt themselves further by failing to know their customer base niches - - specifically, the motor in the 318ti was anemic, so it didn't qualify as a "HOT" Hatch against VW's stroker motors, which killed the BMW on torque.

The final straw was that they failed to put any emphasis on where their product was materially different from its competitors...which in the case of the C230K was lower NVH and superior back seat room (legs & head).

I test drove a C-class coupe and liked it...not sure if I'd have bought one though - I am a bit wary of bottom of the range luxury cars.

I test drove the 318ti ...and almost bought it back in 1995. Was turned off when I took a second test drive with a salesperson in the passenger seat and saw how much the extra 150lbs killed its "go fast" ability.

I bought a Saab 900S instead (huuuuuge hatchback), which I replaced by the C-Coupe in 2002. The only realistic competitor was the GTI, but the GTI had a relatively poor back seat and much worse NVH, which gave it poor prospects as a fast, long distance highway cruiser. This is one of those subtle factors that doesn't show up in a 15 minute test drive, unless you really know what to look for.

Had the Audi A3 been available, it would have been on my contenders list...and the A3 is currently on my wife's list as a contender in 2008, as is probably also the 1-Series...question for her is if she still wants 4 doors to transport grown adult coworkers.


-hh

mark!
Jul 26, 2007, 12:54 PM
Yup.

What is usually attributed to Bangle actually stemmed from the pen of Adrian van Hooydonk (and his team of course).

My bad...

When did he take over?

iGav
Jul 26, 2007, 01:18 PM
My bad...

When did he take over?

He became the Head of BMW's Automobile Design Division in 2004, after Bangle was bumped up to overall Director of BMW Design (basically overseeing the design, creative direction and consistency of all of BMW's brands).

But van Hooydonk himself (and his team, whilst working at, and later heading up Designworks/USA ) were responsible for the 7 Series, including the somewhat incorrectly labeled Bangle Butt, and as far as I'm aware, the exterior design of pretty much every 'Flame Surfaced' BMW both prior to and since, including the Z4, 6 Series and X cars.

Chris Bangle
Jul 26, 2007, 02:54 PM
Bangle, Van Hooydonk, Fisker..... Anything desgined by these three men is amazing...... 135i, 0-60, 5.3 is phenomenal, most "fast" cars are slower, e.g 911, 5.7 etc...... Any apparently some american magazine tested the 0-60 of the 335i and it was faster then the time published by BMW....

AlBDamned
Jul 27, 2007, 03:40 AM
He became the Head of BMW's Automobile Design Division in 2004, after Bangle was bumped up to overall Director of BMW Design (basically overseeing the design, creative direction and consistency of all of BMW's brands).

But van Hooydonk himself (and his team, whilst working at, and later heading up Designworks/USA ) were responsible for the 7 Series, including the somewhat incorrectly labeled Bangle Butt, and as far as I'm aware, the exterior design of pretty much every 'Flame Surfaced' BMW both prior to and since, including the Z4, 6 Series and X cars.

So the whole "Flame surface" philosophy was more of a team effort and Bangle got all the credit? The 7 series (pre-facelift), Z4 and of course the 5-series were all penned and finalised well before 2004 (the 1-series was launched in 2004) so I guess he had a reasonably large part to play in their design somewhere along the line?

bartelby
Jul 27, 2007, 03:44 AM
Talking of ugly cars, has anyone seen the new Porsche Panamera?

iGav
Jul 27, 2007, 07:25 AM
So the whole "Flame surface" philosophy was more of a team effort and Bangle got all the credit?

You are correct sir. Though I do believe he (Bangle) coined the term "Flame Surfacing", and he was certainly instrumental in developing and approving it as BMW's new design language.

If blame could be laid at his feet, it's that he is responsible for selecting and approving the designs (at the design level), though ultimately it is the responsibility of BMW's board for final approval, so they're just as culpable. If you see it that way of course. Heh.

From what I recall (I don't have my Car Design Yearbook's to hand) the actual flame surfacing aesthetic was actually realised by van Hooydonk (and can be traced back to the Z9 in '99) whilst he was working at Designworks/USA (BMW owned Design Studio).

The 7 series (pre-facelift), Z4 and of course the 5-series were all penned and finalised well before 2004 (the 1-series was launched in 2004) so I guess he had a reasonably large part to play in their design somewhere along the line?

He did, previous to being made head of BMW Automobiles Brand Design in 2004, he was heading up Designworks/USA, and has been responsible for not only the X models but almost every BMW model since the 7 Series in 2001.

Cheese
Aug 7, 2007, 11:01 PM
My 1988 - 535i was awesome. That was a poor person's bimmer. Great fun, very reliable. Luxurious, but without air conditioning. remarkable car once I got rid of the horrid TRX tires, and shod it with Conti's. Perhaps there is a 1 seriess in my future...

Lord Blackadder
Aug 8, 2007, 09:33 AM
I've been toying with the idea of getting an older BMW for a while now, but it would have to be a second car; I don't think it would be as robust as my Nissan Altima, which is unexciting but has decent handling, 32mpg economy and so far perfect reliability (although I'm going today to get the tie rod ends replaced as a precaution...).

I'm not well read on who is responsible for BMWs recent styling, I just know that I dislike it. Compared to the 2002, 635csi, or E30 M3 the current cars look disappointing.

Cheese
Aug 8, 2007, 09:59 AM
Lord B, Is your Altima the V6, or is it perhaps diesel? I had a 3,5 liter Altima, and it was plenty exciting....

techlover828
Aug 8, 2007, 10:00 AM
I think it's sexy

Lord Blackadder
Aug 8, 2007, 10:59 AM
Lord B, Is your Altima the V6, or is it perhaps diesel? I had a 3,5 liter Altima, and it was plenty exciting....

No, it's a '99, with the 2.4L KA24DE twincam 4. 150HP @5500RPM and 155lb-ft, Very torquey, economical and reliable but not terribly refined. I have the GXE base model w/ a manual and she'll do 0-60 in 7.9 sec by my stopwatch, which is pretty respectable. The steering is nice and meaty with good feedback. It has more body roll than I'd like in car and the suspension is tuned for a less-than-sporty amount of understeer, but with sticky tires it's not bad. I see real-world 30/35mpg fuel economy (odd, because that is significantly higher than it's official rating).

The worst thing about the car is that it is fairly boring. It drives well, but it ain't no sports sedan.

The newer 3.5L V6 Altima is a totally different beast - significantly faster in a straight line (especially at higher speeds). But is is also bigger, heavier, much more expensive and a lot thirstier. I test drove one once, and at full throttle the torque steer was pretty bad. Not a bad car, but I'd rather get something RWD or AWD when you're talking that much HP.

Of course, the V6 Altima gives you a lot more car for the money than a more expensive 3-series or A4, even if it isn't as accomplished as a drivers' car. Which is why we Americans lap them up. ;)

sbw
Nov 5, 2007, 12:09 PM
Hi all,

You may be interested in Autobahn Report's preview (complete with photos and as much info as we know at this time) of the 1 Series coupe:
http://www.AutobahnReport.com/

The 135i promises to be an amazing performer! It has many of the traits of BMW's high-performance M cars.