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MacRumors
Jul 19, 2003, 02:09 PM
Macnews.net.tc (http://macintosh.fryke.com/cgi-bin/ikonboard/ikonboard.cgi?act=ST&f=10&t=150) claims that Powerbooks will be coming in September with speeds ranging from 1.1 GHz and 1.3 GHz powered by the PowerPC 7457.



synthetickittie
Jul 19, 2003, 02:15 PM
PLEASE of please tell me it'll happen before that.. I realy realy want a new powerbook when I buy before school. But this must be why apple just took of more for students today

Ambrose Chapel
Jul 19, 2003, 02:22 PM
I guess this is as likely as any of the other rumors that said June, July, etc. But a Sep release seems too late for the back-to-school shoppers. Hopefully we'll see a mid-August release.

AppleMatt
Jul 19, 2003, 02:23 PM
I think this is conjecture, all the sites are saying 'next big event' for PowerBook announcements. It's kind of a safe prediction.

That doesn't mean I think it'll happen btw, I just hope it will.

AppleMatt

chazmox
Jul 19, 2003, 02:30 PM
I have been waiting for the update for so long to get a AL version of the 15... I'm almost worn down by these rumors...

This would seem to be almost the last date possible for them to come out... if they don't come out in Sept... then what's the hold up??? Only Mot? G5's? By that time, who knows...

iJon
Jul 19, 2003, 02:54 PM
man i hope that isnt true. apple will be shooting themselves in the foot if they do. mom and dad are reading to buy their kids what they need for college, i think apple is smarter than this.

iJon

solvs
Jul 19, 2003, 03:03 PM
Promo ends in Sept. Trade shows in Sept. Counting on Moto to deliver the new chips due in June. Looks like late Sept. Whether Apple, or anyone else, hates it or not.

ZildjianKX
Jul 19, 2003, 03:24 PM
The motherboards will feature on-board ATi graphics chips

Come on Radeon 9600m :) and 200 MHz FSB and 2X Superdrive :)

jettredmont
Jul 19, 2003, 03:31 PM
Hmmm. A full 9 months since the 12" and 17" intros, and a full 10 months since the last 15" speed bump ... for a minor speed increase (10-30% more raw CPU speed, but much less actual performance increase)? 3/4 of the "year of the laptop" without an update ...

Dissapointing is an understatement.

After waiting for nine months one would hope to see around 50% improvement in speed across the board. Yes, I realize this ain't gonna happen with the G4 ... it's just time to get the G5 into the notebook lineup as well. Until that happens, the laptop line is, essentially, on life support.

I should hope that, at the least, the prices go down as well.

Does this mean we'll be waiting another 9-12 months before the next update to the PB line?

iJon
Jul 19, 2003, 04:04 PM
Originally posted by jettredmont
Hmmm. A full 9 months since the 12" and 17" intros, and a full 10 months since the last 15" speed bump ... for a minor speed increase (10-30% more raw CPU speed, but much less actual performance increase)? 3/4 of the "year of the laptop" without an update ...

Dissapointing is an understatement.

After waiting for nine months one would hope to see around 50% improvement in speed across the board. Yes, I realize this ain't gonna happen with the G4 ... it's just time to get the G5 into the notebook lineup as well. Until that happens, the laptop line is, essentially, on life support.

I should hope that, at the least, the prices go down as well.

Does this mean we'll be waiting another 9-12 months before the next update to the PB line?
honestly i feel the reason its been so long is the time difference between the 15's and new Al books. it wouldnt make to much sense to update the 15 without updating the 17. i think they have been waiting for the 17 and 12 to reach their first time for revision and them come out with all 3 of them at the same time. now all we are trying to figure is when its gonna be.

iJon

ZildjianKX
Jul 19, 2003, 04:21 PM
Originally posted by iJon
man i hope that isnt true. apple will be shooting themselves in the foot if they do. mom and dad are reading to buy their kids what they need for college, i think apple is smarter than this.

iJon

The PB is not really a computer for most college kids... At my very large university I've only ever seen one student with a powerbook to date, but I see TONS of ibooks. Not everyone has rich parents :) On the other hand, probably about 10-20% of professors have powerbooks.

mislabeledstar
Jul 19, 2003, 04:26 PM
Originally posted by ZildjianKX
The PB is not really a computer for most college kids... At my very large university I've only ever seen one student with a powerbook to date, but I see TONS of ibooks. Not everyone has rich parents :) On the other hand, probably about 10-20% of professors have powerbooks.

It depends where you go to school I suppose. I'm a film student at the academy of art college anf I've seen more PBs than iBs in my department. It really depends what you need it for. If I was just using it for word and the internet then an ibook would be just fine.

chazmox
Jul 19, 2003, 04:28 PM
I'll bet that Apple has wanted to release an update already and has had it in their roadmap. It's probably other example of Motorola delaying Apple's product line.

DrGonzo
Jul 19, 2003, 04:44 PM
man, Apple just tell us already what date you'll be announcing the new 15pb. All these rumors are just getting annoying, if we had a date we could just wait in anticipation. I will keep waiting for the 15pb, oh i will wait.

pilotgi
Jul 19, 2003, 06:28 PM
It's probably other example of Motorola delaying Apple's product line.
Originally, Moto said the 7457 would be ready at the end of the year. Recently they said they were ahead of schedule. This could be the reason the 15" has been delayed so long, although I'm surprised Moto is ever ahead of schedule.

1.3 Ghz and 200 Mhz bus speed ought to be a nice performance increase, but if I was a PowerBook user, I'd want a G5.

chazmox
Jul 19, 2003, 06:46 PM
Yes, I've heard that the 7457 is ahead of schedule also and have also seen a Mot press release implying that the 7457 is starting to ship.

http://www.motorola.com/mediacenter/news/detail/0,1958,2687_2175_23,00.html

I also doubt Mot doing anything ahead of schedule.

The reason I put the blame to Mot is that I can't imagine that Apple delaying the release of the update PB so long. No proof that Mot was responsible - it may have been Apple's plan all along.

bertinman
Jul 19, 2003, 07:07 PM
Don't care anymore.

just put the updated 15 in the store so I can put an order down (even if it doesn't ship till Sept) for my sister--she really needs it before school starts.

Plus I want it avail before my ADC membership needs to be renewed, which is Aug 27th.

- bert

vniow
Jul 19, 2003, 08:11 PM
Originally posted by ZildjianKX
The PB is not really a computer for most college kids... At my very large university I've only ever seen one student with a powerbook to date, but I see TONS of ibooks. Not everyone has rich parents :) On the other hand, probably about 10-20% of professors have powerbooks.

I'm going to be taking some graphics/video classes this fall and an iBook won't cut it for me, the classes are taught on Macs (yay!), I'm going to need the G4 and the expandability of a Powerbook rather than the Altivec-less G3 and 1024x768 12" screen in the iBook so I'm anxiously awaiting updates even if I can't afford a new one, refurbs and the used prices will go down if new models are released...

I think Apple really dropped the ball on this one, announcing the year of the notebook and releasing a whopping two new models while the PC world introduces notebooks that are superior to the Powerbooks in a lot of ways....and then holding off the update to the midrange model until after school starts....very dissapointing Apple..

It may be the year of the notebook, but apparently not for Apple...

Freg3000
Jul 19, 2003, 08:14 PM
I think everyone needs to stop taking the "year of the notebook" statement so seriously. You may think that Steve Jobs is God, but he is not. Just because he said doesn't mean it is true. I think the statement was just a distraction for the six months between MWSF and WWDC and the G5.

neutrino23
Jul 19, 2003, 08:37 PM
Originally posted by jettredmont
Hmmm. A full 9 months since the 12" and 17" intros, and a full 10 months since the last 15" speed bump ... for a minor speed increase (10-30% more raw CPU speed, but much less actual performance increase)? 3/4 of the "year of the laptop" without an update ...

Dissapointing is an understatement.

After waiting for nine months one would hope to see around 50% improvement in speed across the board. Yes, I realize this ain't gonna happen with the G4 ... it's just time to get the G5 into the notebook lineup as well. Until that happens, the laptop line is, essentially, on life support.

...

A new 15" Al powerbook with roughly the features of the 17" Al PB and a bump up of the CPU and GPU would be very tasty. Sure, a G5 PB will be a powerful addition to the high end of the portable laptop. But the laptop line is hardly on "life support" just because that one segment is missing. The low end, middle and even the high-middle end parts of the line up are strong.

I now use a Pismo 500 as a portable. It is OK running OS X. However, it is a little slow and doesn't have a GPU adequate for Keynote. The new 15" Al PB will be wonderful for my purposes. Hardly on life support.

ZildjianKX
Jul 19, 2003, 09:14 PM
Think we'll see the 15.4" screen?

jbomber
Jul 19, 2003, 09:37 PM
listen, we all know apple won't release the new aluminum powerbook 15" until I plunk down $3000 for a frickin 17"....

JtheLemur
Jul 19, 2003, 09:46 PM
hahaha, just when everyone is happy that they finally dumped Moto for desktops, now it's gonna be about dumping Moto for the PowerBooks! And I say, the sooner the better. =D

jbomber
Jul 19, 2003, 09:51 PM
Originally posted by solvs
Promo ends in Sept. Trade shows in Sept. Counting on Moto to deliver the new chips due in June. Looks like late Sept. Whether Apple, or anyone else, hates it or not.

Yeah. that coupon/promo is the most convincing evidence that apple's going to play it close to the vest on new pbooks til september. even if they know that the update is woefully overdue, there's no way they're going to cut students that sweet a deal on new equipment.

The other thing is that they wouldn't want to deal with potential order retractions on G5s, if the new pbooks shipped earlier than the desktops. I know the two aren't exactly comparable, but customers get antsy sometimes.

shecky
Jul 19, 2003, 11:14 PM
Originally posted by ZildjianKX
The PB is not really a computer for most college kids... At my very large university I've only ever seen one student with a powerbook to date, but I see TONS of ibooks. Not everyone has rich parents :) On the other hand, probably about 10-20% of professors have powerbooks.

i attend a high end design school and all of the design & architecture students (eg. NOT fine art students) other than a few specific programs are required, not requested, REQUIRED to purchase PowerBooks. I would say around 65% of the entire school participates in this "laptop program" and of that 65%, 85% are on Powerbooks, the others use Dell (mostly for CAD type stuff)

I am in graphic design and the spec for this September is the top of the line 15" SuperDrive PowerBook. The issue i am having is that if i am going to spend $2500 on a laptop thats going to go for 3 years, I damn well want the current, most up to date model. and since i am sure that a rev is imminent, i am extremely hesitant to buy soemthing now only to find a revision a week later.

What i am really, REALLY preparing to be pissed off about is Apple releasing a 15" in mid to late september, right after i started my classes and outside of my return/exchange period for the laptop that i must have by sept 10th. I can only belive Apple is NOT playing the card of forcing students to buy out these tibooks, knowing they must get it by a certain date, in order to clear out inventory before releaseing a new AlBook revision. Please tell me you are not doing that, Apple.

I love apple, the current TiBook is a great product, and its at a very good price right now and its certainly adiquate for my needs. I am hard pressed to commit now when i know something is coming down the line. I am very dissapointed in this aspect of Apple's business...10+ months for a revision is flat out ridiculous and i am getting annoyed that they are holding off on a new release. So long as i can have a new AlBook in my hands a few days before classes start I will be happy, but i could do without the uncertainty Apple is in some ways forcing on me.

jbomber
Jul 19, 2003, 11:39 PM
Originally posted by shecky
What i am really, REALLY preparing to be pissed off about is Apple releasing a 15" in mid to late september, right after i started my classes and outside of my return/exchange period for the laptop that i must have by sept 10th. I can only belive Apple is NOT playing the card of forcing students to buy out these tibooks, knowing they must get it by a certain date, in order to clear out inventory before releaseing a new AlBook revision. Please tell me you are not doing that, Apple.

I love apple, the current TiBook is a great product, and its at a very good price right now and its certainly adiquate for my needs. I am hard pressed to commit now when i know something is coming down the line. I am very dissapointed in this aspect of Apple's business...10+ months for a revision is flat out ridiculous and i am getting annoyed that they are holding off on a new release. So long as i can have a new AlBook in my hands a few days before classes start I will be happy, but i could do without the uncertainty Apple is in some ways forcing on me.

I hear you, but I'm afraid at this point, Apple's probably doing exactly what you fear. It seems incredibly doubtful that the new processors will be ready to go before mid/late-august and the actual books themselves can't start shipping before 1) the G5s ship in early september, and 2) the educational promo has expired. Apple probably won't announce the new powerbooks in advance, because that'll only further slow sales of the current powerbooks that they're trying to unload. Prepare to sit on your hands for another month or so. :(

job
Jul 19, 2003, 11:59 PM
Originally posted by jbomber
Prepare to sit on your hands for another month or so. :(

I don't understand what everyone's complaining about. ;)

All these extra months simply gives me more time to save more cash to blow on a fully loaded 12" when the eventual update finally arrives. :p ;) :D

(I'm kidding. Except for the whole 'saving money' part. I'm serious. ;) Sorta.)

NNO-Stephen
Jul 20, 2003, 12:03 AM
Originally posted by shecky
i attend a high end design school and all of the design & architecture students (eg. NOT fine art students) other than a few specific programs are required, not requested, REQUIRED to purchase PowerBooks. I would say around 65% of the entire school participates in this "laptop program" and of that 65%, 85% are on Powerbooks, the others use Dell (mostly for CAD type stuff)

I am in graphic design and the spec for this September is the top of the line 15" SuperDrive PowerBook. The issue i am having is that if i am going to spend $2500 on a laptop thats going to go for 3 years, I damn well want the current, most up to date model. and since i am sure that a rev is imminent, i am extremely hesitant to buy soemthing now only to find a revision a week later.

What i am really, REALLY preparing to be pissed off about is Apple releasing a 15" in mid to late september, right after i started my classes and outside of my return/exchange period for the laptop that i must have by sept 10th. I can only belive Apple is NOT playing the card of forcing students to buy out these tibooks, knowing they must get it by a certain date, in order to clear out inventory before releaseing a new AlBook revision. Please tell me you are not doing that, Apple.

I love apple, the current TiBook is a great product, and its at a very good price right now and its certainly adiquate for my needs. I am hard pressed to commit now when i know something is coming down the line. I am very dissapointed in this aspect of Apple's business...10+ months for a revision is flat out ridiculous and i am getting annoyed that they are holding off on a new release. So long as i can have a new AlBook in my hands a few days before classes start I will be happy, but i could do without the uncertainty Apple is in some ways forcing on me.

well, i have a solution for you. maybe.

since the keynote is on September 16th, they won't be announced in time for your back to school needs... but... CompUSA... if they have a 30-day exchange or return thingy... you could get a 15" like the 9th or something, and then if PowerBooks are announced in september, you can order one of those and take your 15" back to compUSA when you get the new one. not sure if CompUSA even offers this kinda deal or not, but it's at least worth checking into since i would bet that is what Apple is doing... that and theyc an't really announce them any sooner.

MrMacMan
Jul 20, 2003, 12:11 AM
Originally posted by job
I don't understand what everyone's complaining about. ;)

All these extra months simply gives me more time to save more cash to blow on a fully loaded 12" when the eventual update finally arrives. :p ;) :D

(I'm kidding. Except for the whole 'saving money' part. I'm serious. ;) Sorta.)

I mean really, just wait it out.

Apple has delived before, just wait it out.

There good.

Save a little more money and we will all be good.

cb911
Jul 20, 2003, 12:13 AM
i don't understand why the G5 PowerMacs would have to be released before the new PowerBooks could come out. i mean they are in a completely different league. the PowerMacs have a G5 and the PowerBooks will still only have about a 1.3GHz G4. that's assuming that the new PowerBooks will still use a G4...;)


either way, i'm sick of waiting so i'm probably just going to get a 1GHz TiBook.:rolleyes:

shecky
Jul 20, 2003, 12:50 AM
i have to belive that Apple is not releasing a new rev for a good reason. It may not be a good reason to ME, but i am sure its a good reason to THEM:

-chips not ready from Moto
-enclosures not ready from wherever
-waiting to sell out more current hardware
-waiting for Panther install out of the box
-waiting for new fiscal quarter/year/whatever
-waiting for post education back to school sales (tho i don't know why)
-waiting for another major software/hardware/whatever announcement to coincide with updates

regardless of what the real reason is, i am sure its a REAL reason. Apple is not arbitrarily saying "nahh...... let's hold off. just a hunch." i truly belive that is NOT why we are all still waiting. Nevertheless, i am frustrated. Things like Bluetooth, DDR bus, AE, etc... are important to a power user like me. and hence worth waiting for.

As far as the CompUSA suggestion goes, i work there part-time so i get cost on anything in the store. I can probbabbly stretch the 14 day return policy a bit if i need to...BUT there are 2 problems with buying from CompUSA for me

1. even at my employee cost, i can STILL get a current model tibook cheaper thru an education outlet, aditionally, i do not think i pay state sales tax either (i do not know if this will or will not hold true on a 15" AlBook)

2. i get a $200 mail-in-rebate when i buy a laptop with an iPod from education outlets only. CompUSA does not qualify for this. (again, we will see if a 15" AlBook counts towards this or not)

bambam1648
Jul 20, 2003, 12:52 AM
I would concure. I work as a system admin at a law school and we were looking at the whole line. After seeing that most of the current students have PB we recomend them over the iBooks to incoming students. The 12' on the low end is at a great price point for students on a budget as most students budget at least 1300-1400 dollars for a new laptop for school. Also the Univ. is private and the student generally are pretty well off so it is not suprising that most of our students have PB's.

Abstract
Jul 20, 2003, 02:06 AM
I really don't care to see the 15" PB in the Alu case. I don't. I don't need a big, flashy introduction, or a Keynote. I just need a date. Its vain to leave semi-large updates for Keynotes and such in order to see his image projected on a screen. They're not introducing a new case design. They're just making the 15" up-to-date in comparison to the other 2 PB models.


I need a date. I need Apple to start selling these machines right now and have their orders deliverable by this particular date, whether it's in September or October, even if they're not ready yet at this moment. A date is better than speculation.

If Steve-o doesn't announce them in September, I'll kick him in the nuts (if I can find them). Yes, you heard me.

Wonder Boy
Jul 20, 2003, 02:11 AM
Originally posted by Freg3000
I think everyone needs to stop taking the "year of the notebook" statement so seriously. You may think that Steve Jobs is God, but he is not. Just because he said doesn't mean it is true. I think the statement was just a distraction for the six months between MWSF and WWDC and the G5.

why should we stop taking their statement seriously? They made a special point to say that it was the year of the laptop 6 months ago and damnit im going to hold them to it. some think hes a god, but judging by the disapointment this year, hes the anti christ right now to me. i have yet to blown away or even inspired to buy anything this year except for the 30gb ipod. anti christ, i love that ipod.

NNO-Stephen
Jul 20, 2003, 02:27 AM
Originally posted by Wonder Boy
why should we stop taking their statement seriously? They made a special point to say that it was the year of the laptop 6 months ago and damnit im going to hold them to it. some think hes a god, but judging by the disapointment this year, hes the anti christ right now to me. i have yet to blown away or even inspired to buy anything this year except for the 30gb ipod. anti christ, i love that ipod.

maybe he meant year of the notebook as in sales... cause so far he would be right. they are a huge part of it.

Analog Kid
Jul 20, 2003, 03:06 AM
My guess? Apple expected to be able to introduce a 15" AlBook with the other two, but then realized they couldn't improve the processor speed so decided that the 12" and 17" chassis were worth releasing, but it wasn't worth the cost of yet another 15" model in distribution. From here, all the Powerbooks will get updated together.

Can't update without faster chips...

I wish people would stop insisting that Apple has to release a G5 Powerbook. That's absurd... You're saying that Apple can't release a fast desktop unless they can cram the same power into a laptop. We've gotten used to near-parity because the G4's have nothing else to offer but low power-- this isn't a normal situation.

I feel for the students though that have a firm deadline. All I can suggest is that we're pretty sure the next rev will still be G4's with a modest speed bump so you're not missing out on too much... I've got a 1GHz Ti and love it. I'm an engineer and use it for simulation work and it performs admirably for a laptop.

If you're out of time, take the price difference between what you'll buy a 1GHz machine for and what you'd have to spend on the next rev and put that into RAM. You'll probably do almost as well...

I think this is out of Apple's hands. An update would be pointless without a 7457, and they're not going to overhang sales on their biggest sellers by pre-announcing.

Analog Kid
Jul 20, 2003, 03:11 AM
Originally posted by NNO-Stephen
maybe he meant year of the notebook as in sales... cause so far he would be right. they are a huge part of it.

That's my guess, but I can't remember the context of the statement...

It's also possible that they thought the G5 systems would be lower power at the time and things turned out differently.

Either way, I think the Powerbook has done well this year. Sales have saved the company and we've got two new models. I think the complaints are based on people using rumors to set their expectations...

ZildjianKX
Jul 20, 2003, 03:15 AM
Originally posted by shecky
i attend a high end design school and all of the design & architecture students (eg. NOT fine art students) other than a few specific programs are required, not requested, REQUIRED to purchase PowerBooks. I would say around 65% of the entire school participates in this "laptop program" and of that 65%, 85% are on Powerbooks, the others use Dell (mostly for CAD type stuff)

Wait, so you attend the school, or you're going to be attending the school since you are going to be buying a PB (like you already don't have one if its required and you're attending)?

My college has a high-end design program and powerbooks are required too, but a "high-end" powerbook isn't totally needed- they always just list whatever is the best. Design schools hardly make up most college students anyways, and probably make up 1% of my school's population.

Dragonneyes
Jul 20, 2003, 08:15 AM
Originally posted by shecky
The issue i am having is that if i am going to spend $2500 on a laptop thats going to go for 3 years, I damn well want the current, most up to date model. and since i am sure that a rev is imminent, i am extremely hesitant to buy soemthing now only to find a revision a week later.

I am very dissapointed in this aspect of Apple's business...10+ months for a revision is flat out ridiculous and i am getting annoyed that they are holding off on a new release. So long as i can have a new AlBook in my hands a few days before classes start I will be happy, but i could do without the uncertainty Apple is in some ways forcing on me.


I would totally agree with this statement. First off, just because I'm not taking up a major that is heavy in graphic design or digital video editing (in fact, my international affairs major would never utilize any of those) doesn't mean I'm not going to want a PB. I would never buy myself an iBook, simply because they are just too slow for any type of heavier, serious usage. I run into issues with my boyfriend's brand new iB, as far as speed goes, even when just running a few programs. The G3 is just not good enough.

On the other hand, a G4 is. I am completely content with it, and I hope that Apple gets some sense and realizes that the 15" is a great option for college students - even ones like me that don't have rich parents, and are buying it themselves. :) A release in September would be ludicrous.

McLaptop
Jul 20, 2003, 08:47 AM
over on appleinsider, salty chips posts a source that suggests pb revision will happen mid august. any thoughts on this?

:confused:

wow. waiting for a new powerbook. watching alien vi on it by the time it comes out ... :D

Billicus
Jul 20, 2003, 09:27 AM
Originally posted by Freg3000
I think everyone needs to stop taking the "year of the notebook" statement so seriously. You may think that Steve Jobs is God, but he is not. Just because he said doesn't mean it is true. I think the statement was just a distraction for the six months between MWSF and WWDC and the G5.

Why say it at all then? Seriously. Why give all the hype to their laptop models, saying this would be the year of the laptop if they were going to twiddle their thumbs and not do anything about it after they released the 12" and 17" PowerBook models. And when was the last time they updated the iBooks? It seems to me that they went a little overboard with the comment about this being the year of the notebook if that wasn't going to be their main area of focuse for the rest of the year.:rolleyes:

Freg3000
Jul 20, 2003, 09:41 AM
Originally posted by Billicus
Why say it at all then? Seriously. Why give all the hype to their laptop models, saying this would be the year of the laptop if they were going to twiddle their thumbs and not do anything about it after they released the 12" and 17" PowerBook models. And when was the last time they updated the iBooks? It seems to me that they went a little overboard with the comment about this being the year of the notebook if that wasn't going to be their main area of focuse for the rest of the year.:rolleyes:

It was just a marketing distraction in order to take attention away from the dismal PowerMac sales. Nothing really more.

I want new PowerBooks too, it is just that after 7 months the primary justification can't be "well Steve said it was the year of the notebook so it must be coming this Tuesday." Every Tuesday since MWSF someone has said this and they all have been wrong.

job
Jul 20, 2003, 09:57 AM
Of course, like other users have already noted, the now legendary phrase may have something do to with the fact that laptop sales are now reaching parity with desktops.

jzieske
Jul 20, 2003, 09:59 AM
Originally posted by job
Of course, like other users have already noted, the now legendary phrase may have something do to with the fact that laptop sales are now reaching parity with desktops.

I think that has something to do with it. I mean never has a computer company's laptop sales matched it dektops that I know of. So in that respect it is "the year of the laptop"

wizard
Jul 20, 2003, 10:31 AM
Legendary or not the reality is that laptop sales are booming for all manufactures in the market. Apples long standing problem is a Power MAC desktop that did not compete. The fact that their laptops did very well against those offered with Intel hardware reall drove the sales of PowerBooks.

For many a portable does not have to be a high performance machine. A stationary machine, for some, needs to be state of the art perofrmance wise. So it is almost a given that we saw Power MACs tank and Powerbooks soar.

The very real problem Apple has now is regaining credibility. The G5 will not fullfill the role of convincing people that Apple is back on track. Credibility is something that is going to take sometime to reestablish and they will have to show some concern for customer needs.

I find it impossible to believe that Apple spent much time thinking about the customer when they designed the G5. Even if the mythical workstation MAC makes an appearance, and they drop the price signifcantly on the PowerMAC G5 I'd still be in a position of wondering just to whom they are marketing the machine.

To be honest, I'm very tempted by the tought of a laptop as my next machine. But Apple is again in a position of needing a significant jump in performance to keep up with the rest of the Market. Thus this very long wait for the new PowerBooks. On a G4 this would probally mean a jump to 1.6 GHz or so. Anything less would not be competitive. I'd love a 970 based machine also, but it really needs to maintaint the good things found in a PowerBook, one of those being battery life.

Thanks
Dave


Originally posted by job
Of course, like other users have already noted, the now legendary phrase may have something do to with the fact that laptop sales are now reaching parity with desktops.

job
Jul 20, 2003, 10:51 AM
Originally posted by wizard
The G5 will not fullfill the role of convincing people that Apple is back on track.

Maybe, maybe not, however it is nevertheless a step in the right direction. Modern I/O and hardware along with a price/performance ratio that even Wintel users can stomach will allow Apple to convince most people that Apple is here to stay (as long as the G5s ship on time. ;))

I find it impossible to believe that Apple spent much time thinking about the customer when they designed the G5.

Why not? They took some of the worst flaws in the MDD design (noise) and even some new issues (heat) and were able to design a machine that's quieter and more powerful with better heat management. I'd say that certainly shows some thought.

Thus this very long wait for the new PowerBooks. On a G4 this would probally mean a jump to 1.6 GHz or so. Anything less would not be competitive.

**Sigh**

Does Mhz really matter? :rolleyes:

I think Macbidoobie (:p) is close to the mark on their Powerbook report. 1.1 to 1.3Ghz Powerbooks with standard tech across the line. The current 1.25/1.42Ghz G4s are far too hot and consume far too much power to make them viable candidates for the Powerbooks. There is no way a Powerbook is going to hit 1.6Ghz on a .18 or even .13 G4. 1.3~1.4 maybe. Not 1.6. Heck, I'd consider a 12" Albook with a 1.1Ghz G4 and a 200Mhz bus to be a decent upgrade.


I'd love a 970 based machine also, but it really needs to maintaint the good things found in a PowerBook, one of those being battery life.

I don't think we'll see a 970 based laptop before 2004. Look how long it took the G4 to make it to the Powerbooks.

macnews
Jul 20, 2003, 11:13 AM
Ok, this is just plain stupid.

1. The whole idea (as I have said before) of waiting for new anything is crap. They don't need a speed bump to update (if they wouldn't have waited so long, see 4 below). From all the posts I have seen people would have been happy with new features that the 12 and 17 have. Need to wait for old enclosures to run out - this is NOT TRUE, promise 100% accurate. How do I know this? Think about it... back in Nov Apple new it would be launching Al PB, for whatever reason the 15 would be left behind. But they could at least start using up or planning on using up their supply of Ti enclosures. Say this didn't happen until January, not Nov. What business (not to mention a high tech business) would keep more than 6 months of inventory around? This is a financial killer. High tech business normally don't have more than 60 days of inventory due to rapid advancements. This arguement is just crap, can we please stop using it as a "reason" why a new 15" PB has not seen the light of day?

2. Year of the laptop. Let's assume Steve was talking about sales on this one. Sales were up and laptops accounted for 46% of their hardware sales. W/O any new updates in any PB line for 6 months (soon to be 6+ at least) I bet you will see this number drop for the last quarter. Hardly a good way to claim a year of the laptop. I would go for just a marketing ploy which would be a major flop given the lack of updates and how it may end up hurting laptop sales - look at how many people are waiting for updates. I know of a few people who gave up and are buying the G5 instead and some potential switchers are going with Dells for back to school.

3. Back to school/general laptop market. While the PB may not be their main EDU buy it is some of the market, why give it up? More importantly, the PB line is more aimed at pro users who are also lured by the new G5. This group has been waiting for a few YEARS for a major update to the desktop line (ok, maybe not yearS) and I am betting most of them will be buying DESKTOPS not laptops. I know a few pro designers that already have a 15Tibook that is 1-2 years old but are sitting with a desktop that is 3-4 years old. They are going to get a new G5 but why get a new laptop? Even if it is updated to the 17" specs (including speed) it would be worth waiting a year to see if a G5 is dropped in the line.

4. Why it is wrong to delay the 15" update. You introduce the 12 and 17 Al PBs. Ohhs and ahhs. People are waiting for the 15" Al and desktop updates. You then introduce the G5 desktop - more ohhs and ahhs, but no 15" update. The 15" has now gone 7 months with no changes, 12 months since the last "major" updates. Finally in August or Sept. the new 15"AlPB is shown (sans a G5 processor). While 2-3 months ago people would have been happy with no or a small speed bump, the introduction of the G5 has fueled their need for speed. Now, a 1.3Ghz G4 doesn't cut it plus they are speculating a G5 release in January. At the very least, people are guessing a G5 would have to arrive by July in the PB line. Sales drop for laptops. Not a good thing for something that makes up 46% of your total hardware sales.

Apple is in a bad position with their laptops. Steve was/is right about how people are looking at laptops more vs desktops. Right now, the PB line is in the same spot the desktop line was before the G5 - limbo. Some might disagree but what did the 12" and 17" do? They didn't boost performance that much. Their main reason was to increase the market reach for the PB line - one reason being to replace the desktop (17") thus the "year of the laptop" statement.

If Apple doesn't introduce a new 15" before July 31, the odds of a G5 appearing in January will most likely be reduced - hurting sales. Apple is almost creating their own "performance" (mghz) myth. Ex. How good can the G3 ibook be when there is the G4 powerbook, but how good can the G4 powerbook be when there is a G5 out there? Sure, laptop chip are not (at least right now) the same as the desktop even on the PC side. But it does effect buyers' impressions.

Sorry for the long rant but I had to get it off my chest. I love my mac and want a laptop. I just am dreading a possible rerun of the past year and half like the desktop line - only in laptops.

bokdol
Jul 20, 2003, 11:19 AM
Originally posted by shecky
i attend a high end design school and all of the design & architecture students (eg. NOT fine art students) other than a few specific programs are required, not requested, REQUIRED to purchase PowerBooks. I would say around 65% of the entire school participates in this "laptop program" and of that 65%, 85% are on Powerbooks, the others use Dell (mostly for CAD type stuff)



haha sounds like rhode island.... they had all there kids buy laptops. i had graduated before the required buy 3 grand worth of laptop and programs

shecky
Jul 20, 2003, 11:32 AM
Originally posted by ZildjianKX
Wait, so you attend the school, or you're going to be attending the school since you are going to be buying a PB (like you already don't have one if its required and you're attending)?

i go to the school now, you do a freshman year foundation priogram, and then get into your actual major in your 2nd year, then you buy your laptop specific to that major. I am going into my 2nd year in september.

shecky
Jul 20, 2003, 11:37 AM
Originally posted by bokdol
haha sounds like rhode island.... they had all there kids buy laptops. i had graduated before the required buy 3 grand worth of laptop and programs

sounds like.............and is indeed RISD.

zach
Jul 20, 2003, 01:57 PM
The reason apple is waiting to announce these new powerbooks is that they have to come up with a name for the 7457. :D

How about G4.5? :D

Seriously, though, I think we will see a G5 in the new Powerbooks.

My predictions:

12" Powerbook:

1 GHz G5
everything else the same as now

15" Powerbook:

1.4 GHz G5
Airport Extreme
Bluetooth built in
Lit keyboard

17" Powerbook:

1.4 GHz G5
everything else the same
(possibly this new rumor about built in video cameras in 15" and 17")


At the same time, I also think iBooks will move to G4, or G3 Gobi.

And remember, His Steveness said the year of the portable , not the year of the laptop, so we always might get the iNewton....

vniow
Jul 20, 2003, 02:04 PM
Originally posted by job
**Sigh**

Does Mhz really matter? :rolleyes:

**Sigh**

When your chips are behind the competition in a lot of ways, yes it does.

http://anandtech.com/mobile/showdoc.html?i=1800

AHDuke99
Jul 20, 2003, 02:14 PM
If we were all mean, we could play Apple's card and all buy wintel laptops since apple can't update theirs, then they lose money and don't clear all the outdated inventory. I'll use my Tibook 667 non-dvi for a while longer just so I won't play into Apples hands and spend $3000 on a 7-9 month old computer.

job
Jul 20, 2003, 02:24 PM
Originally posted by vniow
**Sigh**

When your chips are behind the competition in a lot of ways, yes it does.

http://anandtech.com/mobile/showdoc.html?i=1800

Great. Wonderful. I don't care what Intel is at. Why? It still doesn't run OSX. Call me whatever you want, a zealot, a fanatic. Fine. I still don't give a fat flying one about how fast Intel's chips are.

Do I really need 2.4Ghz or a 1.6Ghz chip to type and send the occasional email and/or essay? Do I need 2.4Ghz to sync my iPod? Do I need 1.6Ghz to watch a DVD? Do I need 2.4Ghz to code HTML in BBEdit? I think not. Isn't the main purpose of a laptop portability first, speed and tech second?

The only reason why I posted that is because wizard said that if the new Powerbooks were less than 1.6Ghz they weren't going to be viable contenders with the Wintel world, a claim I disagree with.

bokdol
Jul 20, 2003, 02:27 PM
Originally posted by shecky
sounds like.............and is indeed RISD.

haha yeah my friend she is in GD now and had tyo buy the laptop but the store was out so she did not get hers. i was in illustration so we had no need to buy one. but now all the design major have to have one right? i wonder if spikes is still on thayer? i am in the mood for a late night hot dog... :D

shecky
Jul 20, 2003, 02:36 PM
<---eats a Sinatra dog for bokdol

of course Spike's is still there :)

all the GD majors hafta buy the spec'd powerbook as mentioned above. RISD does offer a fairly attractive package to the students who are new/unfamilair with Apple, but since i am an older student, already own all the software they provide in the package, already know the products inside out, already have renter's insurance that covers the laptop anyway, and am in the loop to know and care about a new product, i am not going to take part in thier laptop program.

The RISD package is:

-15" TiBook Superdrive/512MB/60GB
-Applecare
-Spare battery
-3 yr insurance
-Adobe Design collection + 24 month upgrades
-Flash MX + 24 month upgrades
-Norton AV
-Toast
-Font Folio
-Font Agent

all for $3428 (the laptop, applecare, case, and spare battery are $2278)

like i said, not a bad deal. my biggest issue is paying for software i already own. also they only install the software, they do NOT give you the CD's of the programs. big problem when you need to do an emergency installation of something at 3 AM.

vniow
Jul 20, 2003, 02:43 PM
Originally posted by job
Great. Wonderful. I don't care what Intel is at. Why? It still doesn't run OSX. Call me whatever you want, a zealot, a fanatic. Fine. I still don't give a fat flying one about how fast Intel's chips are.

I do because it encourges competition. If Intel creates a faster chip that gets better battery life than the G4 and gets them at a lower price then I sure as hell care what Apple's going to put out as a competitor.

Do I really need 2.4Ghz or a 1.6Ghz chip to type and send the occasional email and/or essay? Do I need 2.4Ghz to sync my iPod? Do I need 1.6Ghz to watch a DVD? Do I need 2.4Ghz to code HTML in BBEdit? I think not. Isn't the main purpose of a laptop portability first, speed and tech second?

Do I really need a 2.4ghz to edit 720x480 video?
Do I really need 1.6Ghz to work with a RAW file in Photoshop?

As long as the notion that the average consumer will never need more then X amount of speed then what's the point of making things faster?

The only reason why I posted that is because wizard said that if the new Powerbooks were less than 1.6Ghz they weren't going to be viable contenders with the Wintel world, a claim I disagree with.

They were at the beginning of the year but now that Centrino has been released, they have some catching up to do...

I'm waiting for this update because I don't want to plunk down a large amount of ca$h on an outdated piece of machinery, only to have it updated with in a month or a week or whatever.

job
Jul 20, 2003, 03:15 PM
Originally posted by vniow
I do because it encourges competition. If Intel creates a faster chip that gets better battery life than the G4 and gets them at a lower price then I sure as hell care what Apple's going to put out as a competitor.

Apple doesn't make the chips as you well know. If Moto can't deliver and IBM needs more time for a die shrink, then it looks like we will be stuck with the G4 laptops running close to the current speeds for some time to come. Apple isn't the weak link here. Apple can only put out what they are capable of.

Do I really need a 2.4ghz to edit 720x480 video?
Do I really need 1.6Ghz to work with a RAW file in Photoshop?

Maybe, maybe not. In either case it's none of my concern. Each user here has their own opinion as to what their own personal machine ought to do.

As long as the notion that the average consumer will never need more then X amount of speed then what's the point of making things faster?

What's the point for making computers and chips faster? For those that actually need it. I don't and thus would be fully satisfied with a 1.1Ghz 12" Powerbook with a Combo drive at $1399. Again, points like these are relative.

I'm waiting for this update because I don't want to plunk down a large amount of ca$h on an outdated piece of machinery, only to have it updated with in a month or a week or whatever.

No one here is forcing you to buy anything. Unless you absolutely need a Powerbook by tomorrow, it's your choice as to when to buy a Powerbook. It's your money and you are obviously free to do what you want with it.

vniow
Jul 20, 2003, 04:28 PM
Originally posted by job
Apple doesn't make the chips as you well know. If Moto can't deliver and IBM needs more time for a die shrink, then it looks like we will be stuck with the G4 laptops running close to the current speeds for some time to come. Apple isn't the weak link here. Apple can only put out what they are capable of.


Intel doesn't make notebooks either but they're still in competition with Apple because they're trying to get to the same consumer, the potential notebook purchacer and that's why i care what's going on over at Intel,


Maybe, maybe not. In either case it's none of my concern. Each user here has their own opinion as to what their own personal machine ought to do.

It may not be any of your concern but for some of us, its a big deal how fast our computers are.


No one here is forcing you to buy anything. Unless you absolutely need a Powerbook by tomorrow, it's your choice as to when to buy a Powerbook. It's your money and you are obviously free to do what you want with it.

You're right, it is my money but I'm going to make the most of it as I can so that's why I'm a bit pissed that the updates are taking so goddamn long.

bokdol
Jul 20, 2003, 06:13 PM
Originally posted by shecky
<---eats a Sinatra dog for bokdol
of course Spike's is still there :)
it was the texas ranger for me. the bacon and bbq sauce...


i thought they gave the cd's. oh man thqt sucks.

thank god my friend never bought one. if it came with all the cd's it was a great deal. she is now going to be a junior. when she was suppose to the could not get any at the risd store...


oh and one of those sandwiches for geoffs would be good now too. the only thing i really remember fro provy is the food. oops and a few teachers.

Abstract
Jul 20, 2003, 06:54 PM
Comparisons to Intel/AMD/"PC" laptops is necessary for progression. If speed doesn't matter to you, then you should be happy with an 8 year old Mac, or a Pentium 133MHz. Something you feel is excessive or unnecessary can be very necessary for someone else.

@Job: if you don't need a new Powerbook, then congratulations. But why do you need to criticise someone elses need for speed in a thread concerning new PowerBooks? If a Wintel laptop can do something 2 times faster than a Mac laptop when editing video or something, then the comparisons DO matter to those who need to buy a laptop and want a Powerbook. If speed is necessary, and an Apple 15" is just too slow for what you do, then some people may have to go with the alternative, unfortunately, like a Wintel laptop, or an Intel laptop with Linux loaded.

job
Jul 20, 2003, 09:18 PM
Originally posted by Abstract
But why do you need to criticise someone elses need for speed in a thread concerning new PowerBooks?

I'm not criticising wizard's need for speed.

I'm criticising his claim that if the Powerbooks don't hit 1.6Ghz by the next revision they will no longer be in contention with the Wintel world. After I stated my issue with his claim, we went off on the tangents.

It is that assumption/claim that I have an issue with.

job
Jul 20, 2003, 09:22 PM
Originally posted by vniow
It may not be any of your concern but for some of us, its a big deal how fast our computers are.

Sure it is. I'm not saying speed doesn't matter. I understand that pro users need the bleeding edge technology. But I still don't agree with the statement that if the Powerbooks don't hit 1.6Ghz by their next revision that they will no longer be in contention with the Wintel world. We've had 2.4Ghz Wintel notebooks for quite a while, yet we Mac users were content with buying a 1Ghz 17".

You're right, it is my money but I'm going to make the most of it as I can so that's why I'm a bit pissed that the updates are taking so goddamn long.

Why are you pissed? The more time you have the more money you can save. :p ;)

job
Jul 20, 2003, 09:24 PM
Originally posted by vniow
It may not be any of your concern but for some of us, its a big deal how fast our computers are.

Originally posted by me
What's the point for making computers and chips faster? For those that actually need it. I don't and thus would be fully satisfied with a 1.1Ghz 12" Powerbook with a Combo drive at $1399. Again, points like these are relative.

I agree with you vniow. It just seems I haven't made it that clear yet. What may be fine for me obviously isn't for the majority of the users here.

vniow
Jul 20, 2003, 09:34 PM
Originally posted by job

Why are you pissed? The more time you have the more money you can save. :p ;)

But...I want one now!

Waaaaaaa!

NNO-Stephen
Jul 20, 2003, 11:54 PM
Originally posted by vniow
But...I want one now!

Waaaaaaa!

too bad.

:D

or you could go get one of them sharpie pens and write on there PowerBook G5...

WRITE OUT LOUD

jbomber
Jul 21, 2003, 12:43 AM
Originally posted by zap23


Seriously, though, I think we will see a G5 in the new Powerbooks.

My predictions:

12" Powerbook:

1 GHz G5
everything else the same as now

15" Powerbook:

1.4 GHz G5
Airport Extreme
Bluetooth built in
Lit keyboard

17" Powerbook:

1.4 GHz G5
everything else the same
(possibly this new rumor about built in video cameras in 15" and 17")


Are you kidding? I suppose the processors will be cooled by liquid nitrogen...

anyone expecting a G5 in a laptop before late next year is going to be sorely disappointed.

I mean honestly, the desktop has NINE FREAKIN FANS! NINE!!!!

ooartist
Jul 21, 2003, 07:35 AM
... sold an upgraded PowerMac G4 1.2Ghz(Quicksilver 2002) for $1200 bucks on eBay. Went to CompUSA they were having a 18 months same as cash deal on their Macs. I could not resist. I have been lusting for the Titanium books since they came out. I bought the fully loaded 15(2499 + free laptop case). I got it home and I am in love with it. Sure it is not the newest but it is just as fast as the PowerMac that I sold plus it has a SuperDrive!

For me it is different I just wanted something portable that was as good as my old PowerMac. This new TiBook does everything I need.

Call me crazy but if the current TiBook can meet your needs then you are stupid not to take the great prices/financing deals that are out there. Then again if your not in a hurry then wait for about a 10% - 20% increase in performance.

My useless 2 cents. I think all I did was ramble. I need more coffee.

ooartist

Sun Baked
Jul 21, 2003, 07:49 AM
I wonder how many people will go insane over the PowerBook 15 if it ends up being a similar feature enhancement like the eMac got -- while keeping OS 9 alive for yet another generation.

And I don't mean crazy with joy, but stark raving looney.

Obviously Apple's been doing some strange stuff lately with regards to OS 9.

Remember the eMac showed Apple can add some of the current features to the SDR chipset, and keep OS 9 chugging along. And the TiBook is running the same chipset as the eMac -- so Bluetooth and Airport Extreme aren't too big a stretch for a TiBook. ;)

cubist
Jul 21, 2003, 10:24 AM
Originally posted by AHDuke99
If we were all mean, we could play Apple's card and all buy wintel laptops since apple can't update theirs, then they lose money and don't clear all the outdated inventory. I'll use my Tibook 667 non-dvi for a while longer just so I won't play into Apples hands and spend $3000 on a 7-9 month old computer.

We certainly don't need to buy wintel laptops. That wouldn't hurt Apple. Just keep using your 667, as I will keep using my 500, until some compelling update comes out.

If you need a notebook, don't spend $3K on a 7-9 month old computer - spend $1K on a used machine that's nearly as good. MacResQ has some very nice used PowerBooks for a little over $1K.

wizard
Jul 21, 2003, 11:24 AM
It is my contention that the current Apple hardware is not comptitive with the latest Intel hardware. This is not a crime on Apples part but is something to be aware of if your open meinded and consider all of your computing options.

It is true that OS/X is a very strong reason to buy Apple hardware. However the great majority of Apples portable line is really not suitable for use with OS/X without additions to the hardware. I'm talking specifically memory here. an item that Apple has historically skimped on.

Yep I agree that portability is a primary concern for many users and with that battery lifetimes, which Apple has excelled at. If that is your primary concern, then given equal systems the next thing to look at is performance.

The bigger issue if Apple doesn't up the clock rate dramatically on the PowerBooks they won't even be able to run Apples own software in a reccomended manner. Just look at the latest requirements for iChat and other software. Yes for simple editing any of the current laptops will do, they won't do optimally for implementing some of the latest technology from Apple.

I'd like to get 4 to 5 years out of any laptop I purchase, at the rate that Apples software is advancing you will need a top end processor.

Dave



Originally posted by job
Great. Wonderful. I don't care what Intel is at. Why? It still doesn't run OSX. Call me whatever you want, a zealot, a fanatic. Fine. I still don't give a fat flying one about how fast Intel's chips are.

Do I really need 2.4Ghz or a 1.6Ghz chip to type and send the occasional email and/or essay? Do I need 2.4Ghz to sync my iPod? Do I need 1.6Ghz to watch a DVD? Do I need 2.4Ghz to code HTML in BBEdit? I think not. Isn't the main purpose of a laptop portability first, speed and tech second?

The only reason why I posted that is because wizard said that if the new Powerbooks were less than 1.6Ghz they weren't going to be viable contenders with the Wintel world, a claim I disagree with.

zach
Jul 21, 2003, 11:36 AM
Originally posted by jbomber
Are you kidding? I suppose the processors will be cooled by liquid nitrogen...

anyone expecting a G5 in a laptop before late next year is going to be sorely disappointed.

I mean honestly, the desktop has NINE FREAKIN FANS! NINE!!!!

What i forgot to say was that i don't think we will see any updates until the G5, which i think will come next january. I think that Apple does not want to rely on any new Motorola products.

Of course, you will all be laughing at me in september....

robeddie
Jul 21, 2003, 11:56 AM
Why is the 12" powerbook unsatisfactory? If you want to play many of the latest games... that's easy.
Try reading the system requirements on the side of the box for unreal tournament 2003. It says any g4 above 700mhz will work... except for the 12" powerbook manufactured in 2003. (This is not a 'laptops just aren't made for games' issue... the 15" g4 and 17" g4 run UT2003 just fine)

I called macsoft for an explanation of exactly why... and was told it basically comes down to one thing... the lack of an L3 cache slows the system down so much... they were not able to achieve reasonable frame rates.
This... despite the fact that the processor speed and video card... in and of themselves... are just fine to run a game like UT2003.
Even Tiger Woods 2003 staggers on the 12" powerbook... (By the way, both games run like silk w/high detail on my g4 933 desktop)

Why Apple crippled one of the 'pro' model laptops by excluding an L3 cache is beyond me. I thought that was only something they would only do to the 'budget' ibook models.

But I also wonder WHY? How much does a 1mb cache cost apple anyway? It must be alot... or that fact that most people don't notice/bitch about it.

Even if Apple updates the powerbook to 1.1 ghz... if it doesn't have that L3 cache... I'll still be suspect of it's real performance abilities.

Rob S.

freundt
Jul 21, 2003, 12:11 PM
Originally posted by jbomber
Are you kidding? I suppose the processors will be cooled by liquid nitrogen...

anyone expecting a G5 in a laptop before late next year is going to be sorely disappointed.

I mean honestly, the desktop has NINE FREAKIN FANS! NINE!!!!

But those nine fans are not running at top speed.. To make an analogy - they are slowly rotating like a ceiling fan, not blowing like an A/C unit.

And we are talking about lower speed processors than the desktop models here too. While I do not think it is likely, I do think that it is not impossable, improbable yes - impossbile, no.

_f

the above post is a perfect example of creative spelling at it's finest. I Have left it in it's prisitne state for all to glorify in

supercres
Jul 21, 2003, 12:52 PM
I'm afraid I'm another story of "can't wait any longer but really want an updated PB."

I have to head up to PA on Aug. 20th to start my IT advisor training (sweet work-study, IMO). Needless to say, I'd like to be able to show off a brand-spanking-new PB, but I can't if Apple doesn't pick up the pace. I think that the TiBook is my only option if the new 15" doesn't make a debut.

Oh yeah, and I'm having my wisdom teeth out the week before I leave. Having a new laptop by then would mean I'd get to surf the MacRumors forums while on the pain meds and muscle relaxers.

"Oooh... swirly colors..." ;)

Any other thoughts for poor ol' me? (Other than "quit yer bitchin," of course)

Brewstafari
Jul 21, 2003, 01:31 PM
I too am a college student deciding what to do with my Powerbook dilemma. For the work I'll be doing (some IT some graphic design) the 17 is too big, and the 12 is too small. For the most part, the 15 is just right. I'd love some additions: DDR ram, backlit keyboard, airport extreme, bluetooth, but they're not absolutely necessary for me. What nobody else has mentioned are the problems with the TiBook. Being that it's still made of Titanium, it scratches REALLY easily. My dad has one that looks like it's been through hell, and it's just a few months old. Secondly, the airport reception - which I could deal with. And lastly, the worst part, is that horrible problem with the keyboard leaving an imprint in the screen. There is no way I'm going to pay 3 grand for a laptop whose screen I won't be able to read after a few months. If the TiBook didn't have these problems, i'd be willing to sacrifice. For now, it looks like I'll be going a month or so of school without a laptop and sucking it up.

nextdayflight5
Jul 21, 2003, 06:26 PM
okay guys, do you remember that old G5?? yeah its not available to the "consumer" yet. well think back hard... yeah

the G5 came outta nowhere!!!!!!!!! no one knew about it and then...just when you go on apple.com to order your G4 theres a huge ad for a shiny new G5!!!!

its gonna be the same way with the new powerbooks!

and by the way theres noway they are gonna be G5s cus those new G5 desktops are huge!!! there like 4-5inches taller that the G4, they cant fit that in a notebook, they can barely make it a desktop

thank you

NNO-Stephen
Jul 21, 2003, 09:12 PM
Originally posted by nextdayflight5
okay guys, do you remember that old G5?? yeah its not available to the "consumer" yet. well think back hard... yeah

the G5 came outta nowhere!!!!!!!!! no one knew about it and then...just when you go on apple.com to order your G4 theres a huge ad for a shiny new G5!!!!

its gonna be the same way with the new powerbooks!

and by the way theres noway they are gonna be G5s cus those new G5 desktops are huge!!! there like 4-5inches taller that the G4, they cant fit that in a notebook, they can barely make it a desktop

thank you

what are you talking about nobody knew about the G5? are you serious? EVERYONE AND THEIR GRANDMA knew about it... at least everyone that reads this site on a semi-regular basis. but yeah, a G5 wont go into PowerBooks till next year when they get it down to 90um process from the current 130. then we'll see, but for now, nah. MPC 7457 just fits perfect. low heat, low power, high performance. perfect for a PowerBook!

Phil Of Mac
Jul 23, 2003, 11:32 PM
Originally posted by job
Of course, like other users have already noted, the now legendary phrase may have something do to with the fact that laptop sales are now reaching parity with desktops.

I watched the keynote. On sattelite. That is EXACTLY what he meant.

Originally posted by zap23
Seriously, though, I think we will see a G5 in the new Powerbooks.


Apple themselves said that's not going to happen for awhile :)

trek7k
Jul 24, 2003, 09:07 PM
I'm in the market for a 15" powerbook and I've been looking at buying one from Amazon for a while now. Anyway, Amazon is no longer selling the 15" powerbooks (as of today). They still sell the 12" and 17" models but the 15" is only being offered by J&R Computers with no rebate (amazon had been offering a $100 rebate). Anyway, I reckon this means the new 15s are coming soon...

jbomber
Jul 25, 2003, 12:12 AM
Originally posted by freundt
But those nine fans are not running at top speed.. To make an analogy - they are slowly rotating like a ceiling fan, not blowing like an A/C unit.

And we are talking about lower speed processors than the desktop models here too. While I do not think it is likely, I do think that it is not impossable, improbable yes - impossbile, no.

_f

the above post is a perfect example of creative spelling at it's finest. I Have left it in it's prisitne state for all to glorify in


It's kinda funny how everyone is in denial about the fans. :)

yes they're running slower than full speed, but people, there are 9 OF THEM!

Phil Of Mac
Jul 25, 2003, 01:15 AM
Originally posted by jbomber
It's kinda funny how everyone is in denial about the fans. :)

yes they're running slower than full speed, but people, there are 9 OF THEM!

Yeah, and that's the same as maybe 3 or 4 fans full-speed--which is about standard. It's a noise and efficiency issue here, not one of necessity.

NNO-Stephen
Jul 25, 2003, 01:21 AM
Originally posted by Phil Of Mac
Yeah, and that's the same as maybe 3 or 4 fans full-speed--which is about standard. It's a noise and efficiency issue here, not one of necessity.

also the fact that a lot of those go for the GPU and PCI-X slots.

DrGonzo
Jul 25, 2003, 09:26 AM
9 fans you say. With all the fan action and time they've had to develop the G5 i wonder if they seriously considered water cooling with maybe a 120mm fan or two running at very low speeds to blow over the pci/agp slots.. Obviously it would have to be a fail safe system, but i think apple has the capability to make a truely mainstream/failsafe (or as failsafe as the heatsink/fans on it now). ALlthough a water cooled system might make the computer a little more intrusive as there would be basic maitenence issues... oh well just a ramble

Phil Of Mac
Jul 25, 2003, 05:56 PM
Originally posted by DrGonzo
9 fans you say. With all the fan action and time they've had to develop the G5 i wonder if they seriously considered water cooling

Unnecessary, expensive overkill. They only need maybe 3 fans, 9 fans is for noise and efficiency reasons.

DrGonzo
Jul 25, 2003, 10:14 PM
Originally posted by Phil Of Mac
Unnecessary, expensive overkill. They only need maybe 3 fans, 9 fans is for noise and efficiency reasons.

I know man, i'm joking, hence just being a ramble. Then again, it is apple and they are known for being "expensive" ;)

jbomber
Jul 26, 2003, 04:32 AM
anyone think that apple would be so bold/stupid to let macworld paris come and go without updating the 15".

OS9 bootability or not, the revision needs to happen. it's getting embarassing...

camion
Jul 26, 2003, 01:29 PM
I am in line to get an Apple demo computer this summer or fall. When I got the last demo price list from Apple, updated 07/19, the 12" and 15" powerbooks had been removed so that in the powerbook line only the 17" was available for purchase as a demo. I am hopeful that this means a change is coming. Please, please, please let me be right.

nextdayflight5
Jul 26, 2003, 02:45 PM
yeah, wouldnt that be crazy if mac, stopped selling the tibook off the site, then we would know for a fact that somethings gonna blow up

well thats just what i typed so to all you nerds: dont analize the crud outta what i put, i love you all
:p

sacrilicious
Jul 27, 2003, 06:16 PM
I think the real question is when are they going to update the 15?

And why do you all think it's going to be 15.4? I keep hearing it over and over. It'd be cool to jump .2 inches, I guess, but it seems firm. Was there some confirmed report of larger screens being ordered or something?

Phil Of Mac
Jul 27, 2003, 10:57 PM
Originally posted by sacrilicious
I think the real question is when are they going to update the 15?

And why do you all think it's going to be 15.4? I keep hearing it over and over. It'd be cool to jump .2 inches, I guess, but it seems firm. Was there some confirmed report of larger screens being ordered or something?

Something like that. Someone designed a 15.4 inch widescreen, so a lot of people assumed it would be in the next PowerBook due to production reports. Or something.

sacrilicious
Jul 28, 2003, 01:15 AM
15.4" is being used on the new Dell D800, I think.

Yeah, there are more widescreen laptops on the market, now. Apple is losing its edge.

ZildjianKX
Jul 28, 2003, 02:17 AM
Originally posted by sacrilicious
15.4" is being used on the new Dell D800, I think.

Yeah, there are more widescreen laptops on the market, now. Apple is losing its edge.

And they deserve to... 9+ months between releases?

sacrilicious
Jul 28, 2003, 02:57 AM
Well, widescreen is what first brought Apple into consideration for me. And I'd quickly go Dell widescreen for much cheaper, had I not learned the glory of OSX and the crappiness of Dell computers.

jaedreth
Jul 28, 2003, 03:04 PM
This is essentially the same type of discussion as in PowerBook Delays, but I'm not going to duplicate a post, but I am going to sumarize. You can read my post in the other thread if you want more detail.

Blame Scumorola, not Apple. If they had delivered their chips by the very first promised delivery date, we'd have 15" powerbooks in our hands right now.

Jaedreth