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MacRumors
Aug 8, 2007, 03:59 PM
http://www.macrumors.com/images/macrumorsthreadlogo.gif (http://www.macrumors.com)

One point of discussion about Apple's new keyboard (http://www.apple.com/keyboard/) is the absence of the Apple logo on the Command-Key of the keyboard. It seems it may not have been decided upon until late in the release.


http://images.macrumors.com/article/2007/08/08/design_keyboard20070807_300.jpg


Interestingly, Apple's Spanish site (http://www.apple.com/es/imac/design.html) has a photo of the iMac keyboard with the Apple logo still on the Command key. Apple's U.S. site shows the proper image (http://www.apple.com/imac/design.html).

Article Link (http://www.macrumors.com/2007/08/08/keyboard-missing-apple-logo/)



evilgEEk
Aug 8, 2007, 04:01 PM
That's bizarre.

I guess it doesn't really matter, but I kind of liked it there.

deryk
Aug 8, 2007, 04:02 PM
I love the new key board, but I am a little sad that the apple is gone. :(

nagromme
Aug 8, 2007, 04:02 PM
Labeling it clearly as "Command" will avoid confusion. I think the apple logo was only ever there to be like the Apple II!

Now Apple just needs to stop using the cryptic symbols (on-screen) for Option and Control...

mainstreetmark
Aug 8, 2007, 04:03 PM
How do you type those symbols, anyways. I know the Apple logo is cmd-opt-K

CTYankee
Aug 8, 2007, 04:04 PM
makes sense considering we no longer need to "open-apple control escape" or "closed apple etc etc".

Though I wish they would put the name and symbol on all the modifiers. I still for get which is which when I see the symbol.

SwiftLives
Aug 8, 2007, 04:04 PM
It's taken me *years* to start saying "Command+Q" instead of "Apple+Q."

Years!

Not to date myself, but it too me long enough just to quit saying "Open Apple+Q."

Still - as sentimental as I can be, I really don't have a problem with having the Apple logo dropped from the command key.

ETA - Just an observation, but the keys on the keyboard on the Spanish page are slightly smaller than on the US page.

gijze
Aug 8, 2007, 04:05 PM
Not only the Spanish site is showing the Apple symbol, but the Belgian and French one too... Perhaps the logo stays on the European keyboard?

Frisco
Aug 8, 2007, 04:05 PM
I was all ready to buy, until I noticed that the logo is missing, so I went with a Dell instead.

bilbo--baggins
Aug 8, 2007, 04:06 PM
Sob.

This marks the end of an era.

More annoyed about the lack of numeric keypad. Would have liked to get the newer wireless keyboard, but the lack of numerica keypad makes it a non-starter for me.

mugwump
Aug 8, 2007, 04:06 PM
Was I the only person telling people to use "apple-q" to quit, "apple-s" to save?

Maybe it's some "open apple" and "closed apple" key lust from the Apple // days, but now I wonder what all of those people will do.

Poff
Aug 8, 2007, 04:09 PM
shows the apple-symbol on norwegian site too. I hope they'll keep it on here in norway, as having to learn that a key is called "command" will be alienating to a lot of people. alt and ctrl is enough for most people.

I'm guessing they'll keep the apple in norway. (as in spain)

hob
Aug 8, 2007, 04:09 PM
It makes sense. I would say "Command-W" to my friends new to mac and they'd give me a blank look...

dale.albiston
Aug 8, 2007, 04:09 PM
but for the love of whatever does the wireless keyboard lack the number pad?

I have a macbook pro, I bought a wireless bluetooth KB specifically to give me such a keypad as and when I need it...

but if I need another one it will be bluetooth and it won't be an apple, if I want a K/B that looks like a laptop one I'll use the built in one.

also the idea of using something like a mac pro, or even an imac without a number pad is strange.

iSee
Aug 8, 2007, 04:09 PM
I was all ready to buy, until I noticed that the logo is missing, so I went with a Dell instead.

Yeah, this is the final straw: I can support Apple no longer. Look, I am willing to pay more for an Apple, but not for an inferior product. Apple, shame on you: You've gone too far.

Edit: oops, I forgot: ;)

Clive At Five
Aug 8, 2007, 04:10 PM
Labeling it clearly as "Command" will avoid confusion. I think the apple logo was only ever there to be like the Apple II!

Now Apple just needs to stop using the cryptic symbols (on-screen) for Option and Control...

Oh, yeah, like the shamrock/squiggle/butterfly/splat/propeller is any less cryptic! I'd rather have an Apple than a shamrock/squiggle/butterfly/splat/propeller!

-Clive

Poff
Aug 8, 2007, 04:10 PM
How do you type those symbols, anyways. I know the Apple logo is cmd-opt-K

on the norwegian keyboard it's alt+a. (us people probably call it option+a)

Royale w/cheese
Aug 8, 2007, 04:11 PM
Well since the rest of the keys have full names, it makes it the same across the keyboard, meh. As long as the computer stills has an Apple, I'm good.

Clive At Five
Aug 8, 2007, 04:12 PM
It makes sense. I would say "Command-W" to my friends new to mac and they'd give me a blank look...

I say "Open-Apple-W" to newbies like you and you give me a blank look. And if you don't know what "Open-Apple" is, yes, you're a newbie, at least in my book.

-Clive

mcarnes
Aug 8, 2007, 04:12 PM
I was all ready to buy, until I noticed that the logo is missing, so I went with a Dell instead.

Word. I'm going to leave work early before I start balling in front of everyone.

Poff
Aug 8, 2007, 04:13 PM
Sob.

This marks the end of an era.

More annoyed about the lack of numeric keypad. Would have liked to get the newer wireless keyboard, but the lack of numerica keypad makes it a non-starter for me.

I love it. When I'm typing a lot, I like to have the alfa-keys right in front of the screen. But then, the mouse gets too far to the right. So I have to place my keyboard a bit on the left side. But then I have to stretch my right arm longer while typing. This keyboard will solve that. (only I have no bluetooth on my lampshade..)

Markleshark
Aug 8, 2007, 04:14 PM
TBH, I think having 'Command' written there is a lot easier for switchers. What difference does it make anyway? Really?

I'll report what mine is like when it arrives (UK Version)

FWIW it has 'Command' written on, on the UK page.

mahonmeister
Aug 8, 2007, 04:15 PM
I was all ready to buy, until I noticed that the logo is missing, so I went with a Dell instead.Haha!

Sad part is that people actually get very serious about these minute details. But after they finish complaining, they go out and buy it.

They should put those other symbols on the option, ctrl, and shift keys to eliminate the confusion all together.

sw1tcher
Aug 8, 2007, 04:16 PM
First they drop "Computer" from "Apple Computer Incorporated." Now it's the :apple: logo on the keyboard. Next thing you know, they're gonna stop selling computers altogether and focus on electronic gadgets (i.e. iPhone, iPod, etc.) :p

Poff
Aug 8, 2007, 04:16 PM
I say "Open-Apple-W" to newbies like you and you give me a blank look. And if you don't know what "Open-Apple" is, yes, you're a newbie, at least in my book.

-Clive

why open-apple and not just apple?
and why do you think he's anewbie?

Carl Spackler
Aug 8, 2007, 04:20 PM
Labeling it clearly as "Command" will avoid confusion. I think the apple logo was only ever there to be like the Apple II!

Now Apple just needs to stop using the cryptic symbols (on-screen) for Option and Control...


So say we all.


...or maybe it should be, "lest we forget."

aliquis-
Aug 8, 2007, 04:21 PM
I don't know if I would call this "interestingly", or maybe even news ;D

Clive At Five
Aug 8, 2007, 04:21 PM
They should put those other symbols on the option, ctrl, and shift keys to eliminate the confusion all together.

hahaha! Next thing you know, people will be calling F3 and F4 the Expose and Dashboard keys... and then in 20 years, people will complain when Apple removes those symbols from the keyboard even though the feature was irrelevant 10 years ago.

-Clive

w00master
Aug 8, 2007, 04:22 PM
http://tinyurl.com/ypbooh

Note: the Original Macintosh Keyboard did *not* have the Apple logo on the command key. So, in a way, they're going back to their "roots."

Ultimately, the claim that it's an "end of an era" isn't really accurate. They're just going back to the original.

w00master

Markleshark
Aug 8, 2007, 04:22 PM
First they drop "Computer" from "Apple Computer Incorporated." Now it's the :apple: logo on the keyboard. Next thing you know, they're gonna stop selling computers altogether and focus on electronic gadgets (i.e. iPhone, iPod, etc.) :p

Apple still make computes?

Pah, who wants to buy those?
:rolleyes:

CormacMaclaggan
Aug 8, 2007, 04:22 PM
someone should start a business that sells replacement keys so that you can pop it out and put in one with an apple eh eh anyone wanna start a company or something;)

hamis92
Aug 8, 2007, 04:23 PM
Maybe these European keyboards have the Apple logo because the Command key would look so empty with just the "POI" symbol on it. If you look at Finnish MacBook keyboard for example, you'll notice that Command and Option keys don't say "command" and "option" they have symbols instead, and Control says just "ctrl". Same thing with Caps Lock and Tab (and Return if I remember correctly).

blouis79
Aug 8, 2007, 04:25 PM
Haha!

Sad part is that people actually get very serious about these minute details. But after they finish complaining, they go out and buy it.

They should put those other symbols on the option, ctrl, and shift keys to eliminate the confusion all together.

Agree. For usability, all the modifiers and special keys need to have writing and symbols. (including delete, return, enter, tab) Now why can't the "Command" symbol be changed from the obscure flower thing to the Apple.....? (Windows uses the Windows symbol)

Love the wireless design. Not so happy with the wired design - side view looks horrible with the USB housing not wanting to sit on the desk nicely. Surely a wedge/trapezoid shape would be more functional?

I'd also like backlighting please. Hanging out for aluminium keyboard version 2.

Clive At Five
Aug 8, 2007, 04:26 PM
why open-apple and not just apple?
and why do you think he's anewbie?

"Open-Apple" was the name of the key since the Apple II. That's the way I learned it 20 years ago and the key on the keyboard never changed so I just kept calling it what it was... the open-apple key. (There was also a "Closed-Apple" key but it died. That's okay. It was confusing.)

So basically anyone who lived, thrived and survived on an Apple II (as I did) calls it the "Open-Apple" key... mainly out of habit more than anything else.

-Clive

sw1tcher
Aug 8, 2007, 04:26 PM
why open-apple and not just apple?
and why do you think he's anewbie?

He's a newbie because he doesn't know what the open-apple (or for that matter what closed-apple) key is.

When the Apple IIe came out in the early '80s, the keyboard had an open-apple and closed-apple key. That's why it's not a "just apple" key. There was actually and open- and closed-apple key.

SilvorX
Aug 8, 2007, 04:27 PM
On the Apple Canada website, it has the apple logo on the keyboard, but when you click on the "popup" pictures of the keyboard and it shows "Command"

I grew up with saying "Open Apple". I remember when there was even a "Closed Apple" key on Mac keyboards, looked like this: :apple:

Poff
Aug 8, 2007, 04:28 PM
"Open-Apple" was the name of the key since the Apple II. That's the way I learned it 20 years ago and the key on the keyboard never changed so I just kept calling it what it was... the open-apple key. (There was also a "Closed-Apple" key but it died. That's okay. It was confusing.)

So basically anyone who lived, thrived and survived on an Apple II (as I did) calls it the "Open-Apple" key... mainly out of habit more than anything else.

-Clive

hmm.. I learn something new every day.. :)

Poff
Aug 8, 2007, 04:29 PM
On the Apple Canada website, it has the apple logo on the keyboard, but when you click on the "popup" pictures of the keyboard and it shows "Command"

I grew up with saying "Open Apple". I remember when there was even a "Closed Apple" key on Mac keyboards, looked like this: :apple:

the pop-up pictures show the US keyboard no matter which country page you are on.

nickelcokes
Aug 8, 2007, 04:29 PM
Now I can tell me girlfriend, "Command-W" without her asking, "Which one is Command again? The Apple?"

sw1tcher
Aug 8, 2007, 04:30 PM
someone should start a business that sells replacement keys so that you can pop it out and put in one with an apple eh eh anyone wanna start a company or something;)

What, and get sued by Apple for using their trademark? No thanks.

Squareball
Aug 8, 2007, 04:31 PM
The usability has clearly improved and here is why.

1. Keys on the keyboard that have two symbols rather than one are toggled with Shift. Example, to type $ or 4 it's the same key but with a modifier key to get $. Having a key that has two symbols but acts the same is confusing... which brings me to point 2.

2. On windows keyboard there is a windows icon, when you press it it opens the Start (or Windows) menu. On the start menu there is a picture of the windows icon so it makes sense that pressing it would open the menu just as pressing the volume controls toggles the volume. On the apple keyboard, pressing the apple button does NOT open the apple menu in the top left yet the icon is there. So because there are two icons on the key (see point 1) there surely must be a way to press a modifier key and that key and get the apple menu to open. Nope. Again, confusing to some degree.

The keyboard I use (Macally Slimkey) it doesn't have the apple logo anyways, it just has the command glyph. Simple and although the glyph doesn't explain what it does it serves the purpose because menus throughout the system use this glyph so it's obvious to the user to press command + s to save a document.

slicecom
Aug 8, 2007, 04:31 PM
I say "Open-Apple-W" to newbies like you and you give me a blank look. And if you don't know what "Open-Apple" is, yes, you're a newbie, at least in my book.

-Clive

Why do you say "Open-Apple-W"? Does it make you feel hardcore or something? There hasn't been a Closed-Apple on the Mac keyboard for years, so saying Open-Apple is pretty stupid IMO.

sw1tcher
Aug 8, 2007, 04:35 PM
Why do you say "Open-Apple-W"? Does it make you feel hardcore or something? There hasn't been a Closed-Apple on the Mac keyboard for years, so saying Open-Apple is pretty stupid IMO.

Saying "open-apple" is out of (bad) habit. Remember, there are still some of us dinosarus left. :p

mcic1984
Aug 8, 2007, 04:36 PM
The missing Apple key may actually be present in international versions - after all, Apple's international keyboards have always been different.

In the UK, the MacBook Pro keyboards do not even say "option" (it has the odd 'switch' sign in the menu and "alt" written on it) and the shift key has an outlined up arrow on it.

There are strange icons for buttons like tab, caps lock, enter, return, backspace as well;
although to make things more complicated, control says "ctrl", even though the icon on the menu is a strange up arrow that looks more like the one on the enter key...

Pic of the UK macbook keyboard –– http://www.powerpage.org/images/apple/macbook/macbook-keyboard.jpg

The keyboard on display on the Apple UK Keyboard site is almost certainly NOT the UK keyboard – http://www.apple.com/uk/keyboard – it does not even have the sign (the replaces # in UK keyboard).

I think Apple has to decide what they want to use – symbols or text? I can imagine Mac newbies being baffled by the US keyboard in that the menu icons show funny symbols, and the only symbol they can find on their keyboard is the cloverleaf for the command key!

quigleybc
Aug 8, 2007, 04:37 PM
ridiculous that this is front page news

I love Macrumors

LOL

:):p

Royale w/cheese
Aug 8, 2007, 04:39 PM
I actually know a few people younger than me (26) that say open apple still. It always surprises me a little bit.

MacNut
Aug 8, 2007, 04:41 PM
He's a newbie because he doesn't know what the open-apple (or for that matter what closed-apple) key is.

When the Apple IIe came out in the early '80s, the keyboard had an open-apple and closed-apple key. That's why it's not a "just apple" key. There was actually and open- and closed-apple key.Now that is a real keyboard.:)

jay-t
Aug 8, 2007, 04:42 PM
did anyone notice that not only the apple logo is missing but also the led of the caps lock button?

Poff
Aug 8, 2007, 04:45 PM
did anyone notice that not only the apple logo is missing but also the led of the caps lock button?

The LED is there on the norwegian keyboard.. strange..

http://images.apple.com/euro/imac/0807/images/design_keyboard20070807.jpg

hey wait.. that's not a norwegian keyboard. this one has the @ on the 2, while a no-keyboard has it besides "return". So I'm guessing this really is an old revision.. :/ bummer!

KindredMAC
Aug 8, 2007, 04:47 PM
He's a newbie because he doesn't know what the open-apple (or for that matter what closed-apple) key is.

When the Apple IIe came out in the early '80s, the keyboard had an open-apple and closed-apple key. That's why it's not a "just apple" key. There was actually and open- and closed-apple key.

Look at the travel in those keys!!!!! Holy schnikies Batman!!!!
Amazing what you get used to isn't it?

I was just talking to my friends on the way out of work an hour ago and was telling them how I remember how small the 3G iPod used to feel to me... now it feels like a giant in my hands!

farmboy
Aug 8, 2007, 04:47 PM
bawling, not balling. But maybe you live somewhere where balling is a spectator sport....:)

Clive At Five
Aug 8, 2007, 04:48 PM
Why do you say "Open-Apple-W"? Does it make you feel hardcore or something? There hasn't been a Closed-Apple on the Mac keyboard for years, so saying Open-Apple is pretty stupid IMO.

No, what's pretty stupid is ever using a DOS-based box. Why did you ever do that? Did it make you feel hardcore?

The real question throughout all this is why do you NOT say "Open-Apple?"

-Clive

dwwd
Aug 8, 2007, 04:52 PM
Hi, My father is in washington DC (i'm in Brazil) and he wants to know where to buy the new keyboard for me... as a PC user he is not going to look around too much for a keyboard (PC users just don't understand why we long to touch new Apple products...). Is there a place I can send him where he is sure to find it?

heyisa
Aug 8, 2007, 04:53 PM
I really dislike how they make f1-f9 shared keys with computer functions (brightness, expose, dashboard, etc.) For some of us we really need those function keys for certain programs, and having to hold down the alt button is a pain. Why can't they put the computer control keys on f14-f20. No program i know uses those keys. I also don't like the new placement of the eject keys. Top right was perfect.

DPazdanISU
Aug 8, 2007, 04:54 PM
bootcamp + apple key is too confusing? lol :confused:

Poff
Aug 8, 2007, 04:54 PM
I really dislike how they make f1-f9 shared keys with computer functions (brightness, expose, dashboard, etc.) For some of us we really need those function keys for certain programs, and having to hold down the alt button is a pain. Why can't they put the computer control keys on f14-f20. No program i know uses those keys. I also don't like the new placement of the eject keys. Top right was perfect.

what kind of programs uses the function keys? (in the tone of a genuine question and not an accusation)

jellomizer
Aug 8, 2007, 04:55 PM
Either it was a publishing error on the Apple Site...

A mistake in production (which may mean that the prices of these keyboards may skyrocket as a collector item)

An attempt by apple to sell keyboard to non-mac users (its a cool keyboard, people may want them for their PC, but are afraid do because the apple logo makes it seems apple only. Conversely people may be afraid of getting a Mac because they think they need a special keyboard for it, if it breaks, getting rid of the apple logo makes it seem less apple only)

Making use a little easier document tell you to use the command key or show that silly picture...

Reduces clutter on the keyboard, make it a cleaner looking keyboard with less clutter.

Bootcamp compatibility just so people can imagine better that is is the windows button.

Saves a $0.01 a key. One less sticker to post.

Attempt to hide the secret. Perhaps apple had an idea that the keyboard design was going to be leaked so by making it without the apple it would bring up enough doubt about its creditability to keep it secret even with its publicicy. Most likely the supplier had a bad track record of keeping secrets but may still be on contract with them so they give them the less secret parts.

Clive At Five
Aug 8, 2007, 04:55 PM
I actually know a few people younger than me (26) that say open apple still. It always surprises me a little bit.

Add me to your list. I'm 23. The day I was born I started using an Apple II gs. My first words were "opie-appa" (Open-Apple) and I could pass "Mouse Tutorial" before I could walk. Anyone else remember smashing the bugs on the window by clicking them? Then clicking and dragging that car through the narrow road [and every time you even nicked the side, it would squeal and honk]?

-Clive

DudeDah
Aug 8, 2007, 04:58 PM
Slow news day?

heyisa
Aug 8, 2007, 04:59 PM
what kind of programs uses the function keys? (in the tone of a genuine question and not an accusation)

I use function keys when using after effects, photoshop, apple motion, final cut pro mainly.

chilipie
Aug 8, 2007, 04:59 PM
The real question throughout all this is why do you NOT say "Open-Apple?"

Because it takes longer and isn't necessary?

Clive At Five
Aug 8, 2007, 05:02 PM
Because it takes longer and isn't necessary?

Brevity is overrated.

-Clive

sw1tcher
Aug 8, 2007, 05:03 PM
I really dislike how they make f1-f9 shared keys with computer functions (brightness, expose, dashboard, etc.) For some of us we really need those function keys for certain programs, and having to hold down the alt button is a pain. Why can't they put the computer control keys on f14-f20. No program i know uses those keys. I also don't like the new placement of the eject keys. Top right was perfect.

What? :eek: There's an Alt key now too? :p

Schtumple
Aug 8, 2007, 05:04 PM
Slow news day?

Hit the nail on the head....

For the people crying over split milk (the no numberic pad on the wireless keyboard) seriously, pick up your wireless keyboard, move about from place to place, bit annoying having a full size heavy keyboard isn't it? I'm glad they've made it smaller and lighter.

sw1tcher
Aug 8, 2007, 05:04 PM
what kind of programs uses the function keys? (in the tone of a genuine question and not an accusation)

Umm.....the only program that matters. World of Warcraft. Duh. :D

willybNL
Aug 8, 2007, 05:07 PM
Labeling it clearly as "Command" will avoid confusion. I think the apple logo was only ever there to be like the Apple II!

Now Apple just needs to stop using the cryptic symbols (on-screen) for Option and Control...

They'd better call it ALT-APPLE X or so...

Everybody knows what the alt key is... everybody knows the apple key.
Nobody knows the command, or option key.

(from switcher perspective)

twoodcc
Aug 8, 2007, 05:14 PM
That's bizarre.

I guess it doesn't really matter, but I kind of liked it there.

yeah i agree. i liked it there. oh well

milatchi
Aug 8, 2007, 05:24 PM
TBH, I think having 'Command' written there is a lot easier for switchers.
To Hell with switchers!
I've been using a Mac since 1996. Before everyone thought they were "cool, hip, clutch, throttle, chill." If they remove the Apple logo from the keyboard I will not be buying another Mac anytime soon.

withnail
Aug 8, 2007, 05:26 PM
Oh, yeah, like the shamrock/squiggle/butterfly/splat/propeller is any less cryptic! I'd rather have an Apple than a shamrock/squiggle/butterfly/splat/propeller!

-Clive

I think that's the Swedish cartography symbol for a landmark...

lucas
Aug 8, 2007, 05:28 PM
To Hell with switchers!
I've been using a Mac since 1996. Before everyone thought they were "cool, hip, clutch, throttle, chill." If they remove the Apple logo from the keyboard I will not be buying another Mac anytime soon.

you're very shallow, in fact you sound like the typical stereotypical poser

slffl
Aug 8, 2007, 05:29 PM
I'm so glad they got rid of the apple. I've been using OSX for 4.5 years and have always called it the apple-key. The 'command' that's now there will make it much easier.

milatchi
Aug 8, 2007, 05:30 PM
Why do you say "Open-Apple-W"? Does it make you feel hardcore or something?
Yes, yes it does... amateur.


saying Open-Apple is pretty stupid IMO.
Your face is pretty stupid IMO.

roy_g_biv
Aug 8, 2007, 05:31 PM
ETA - Just an observation, but the keys on the keyboard on the Spanish page are slightly smaller than on the US page.

i noticed this too. did a ctrl-click and opened both images in a new tab, then scrolled back and forth between the two. these two keyboards use a different case "stencil"/key size all together.

milatchi
Aug 8, 2007, 05:31 PM
you're very shallow, in fact you sound like the typical stereotypical poser

That sounds like something a tourist who just jumped on the Mac bandwagon would say.

navsaria
Aug 8, 2007, 05:38 PM
And how many of you remember what the open-apple and closed-apple keys actually "emulated"?

(Since I probably won't get a chance to look at this thread again for a few days, I'll tell you...open-apple was the first joystick button (button 0) and closed-apple was the second button (button 1) )

It was handy when my first joystick button started going bad -- I could at least still play games by keeping one hand on the keyboard to hit the open-apple key. It was kind of awkward, but it worked. :-)

TuffLuffJimmy
Aug 8, 2007, 05:40 PM
To Hell with switchers!
I've been using a Mac since 1996. Before everyone thought they were "cool, hip, clutch, throttle, chill." If they remove the Apple logo from the keyboard I will not be buying another Mac anytime soon.

You have contradicted yourself there. If you bought a mac back then before they were cool, so obviously not because it was iconic, then why would you be mad about a keyboard lacking that iconic image? I mean to say: why would it matter if they remove that 'cool' apple logo from something you bought not because it was cool?

I'm too young to remember the open apple key, but I remember playing Put Put (not golf, it's a car game)....

zorinlynx
Aug 8, 2007, 05:44 PM
Third party keyboards have never carried the logo; maybe Apple is trying to standardize their keyboard in a way that third parties can create identical keyboards without dealing with trademark issues?

Apple does support third party keyboards openly; they even sell quite a few models at the Apple Store.

As for the logo... I've been seeing that logo ever since the key was called "Open-Apple" on my Apple IIe, and option was "solid apple". It's a shame to see another of the few remaining vestiges of the Apple II disappear.

(the second most recent vestige to vanish was open-apple + Control + Power doing a hardware reset on the machine. Power used to be known as "reset" on the IIgs keyboard, and openapple+control+reset used to reboot the Apple IIs. This went away on the Intel Macs; you can still reboot this way but only if the OS is actually running, which seems pointless for what used to be a *hardware* reset.)

jellomizer
Aug 8, 2007, 05:45 PM
what kind of programs uses the function keys? (in the tone of a genuine question and not an accusation)

Terminal Emulators... After I saw that keyboard I bought it right away... I do a lot of programming on a VMS station and the Applications on it use higher function keys I am glad the mac keyboard has the keys I need. Also when configuring Mac OS it is nice to have high end keys for future features in MacOS.

offwidafairies
Aug 8, 2007, 05:46 PM
First they drop "Computer" from "Apple Computer Incorporated." Now it's the :apple: logo on the keyboard. Next thing you know, they're gonna stop selling computers altogether and focus on electronic gadgets (i.e. iPhone, iPod, etc.) :p

i hope not.

Peace
Aug 8, 2007, 05:48 PM
Sob.

This marks the end of an era.

More annoyed about the lack of numeric keypad. Would have liked to get the newer wireless keyboard, but the lack of numerica keypad makes it a non-starter for me.

TBH, I think having 'Command' written there is a lot easier for switchers. What difference does it make anyway? Really?

I'll report what mine is like when it arrives (UK Version)

FWIW it has 'Command' written on, on the UK page.

IMHO this was done to make the Apple environment more (sic) "user friendly" for Windows users.

Pieira
Aug 8, 2007, 05:48 PM
I don't care about losing the apple but...

I really dislike how they make f1-f9 shared keys with computer functions (brightness, expose, dashboard, etc.) For some of us we really need those function keys for certain programs, and having to hold down the alt button is a pain. Why can't they put the computer control keys on f14-f20. No program i know uses those keys. I also don't like the new placement of the eject keys. Top right was perfect.

Me too, I love the new keyboard but the labeling on F keys does bug me. If I want to move a shortcut like expose, say back to f9, I have a key with an expose label on it that doesn't do expose and that would ruin my life.
I guess they've done it to be consistent between the wired and the wireless keyboards.

Also doesn't expose need 3 keys, I guess they'll use option/cmd f3. hmm.

Also also, if exposes got a key why not Spaces.

Also also also, why get rid of the icons for shift and option but not cmd. Will they show icons for these onscreen for shortcuts? One word and one icon for each would be perfect. But I do think command text and the icon as it is doesn't sit too well the key just is quite wide enough, I'd move the infinite loop up to the top right of the key, but now I really am being insanely picky, I know this.

Right finally. Get rid of "alt" text, if your using windows programs on a mac you have bigger problems than finding a key for alt or is there other reasons for this?

motorazr
Aug 8, 2007, 05:48 PM
I never call the command key the command key...rather I always call it the apple key! I always say "apple-w" or "apple-q"...now I'm going to have to use the proper term. **sigh**

matticus008
Aug 8, 2007, 05:48 PM
but for the love of whatever does the wireless keyboard lack the number pad?
So you can use the keyboard directly in front of you without having to angle your arms off to the side. This isn't possible without weird balancing with a number pad. It's designed like a notebook keyboard intentionally, because it's primarily for desktop computers.

It's a purely ergonomic decision, but man, do people hate proper ergonomics.

The real question throughout all this is why do you NOT say "Open-Apple?"
Because it's been the command key for over 20 years and resisting change is only cool for the first few years. This is particularly true when one didn't start using Macs until after the key and functions had already been changed. The alternate explanation for the real Steve-lovers is that Steve Jobs hated the Apple key and felt it was gratuitous use of the company logo--hence the clover/butterfly/bowen knot icon to replace it.

verniesgarden
Aug 8, 2007, 05:48 PM
honestly i could care less about the :apple: on the keyboard but why did the mess with the function keys? where people complaining?

the media keys would of bee perfect over the "help/home/page up" keys and left the rest where the were

maybe it has something to do with leopard


but also why has the dim keys printed some of us with mac pro or others with mac minis don't use the ACD so they are symbols on keys that serve no purpose. i stopped at my local apple store today and want to get the new keyboard for my mac pro, i love the feel and the look (as it matches my mac pro, as it doesn't match the new imac)


another thing that stings me black/aluminum imac with white/aluminum keyboard-apple is all elegant design and drops the ball on obvious

make a black and white version maybe illuminated keys on the black one... cause we all know they'd charge more for black

PumaGuy
Aug 8, 2007, 05:50 PM
Apple symbol on command key is confirmed on Apple Canada's website, but only on the page where the iMac Design is shown:
http://images.apple.com/ca/imac/images/design_keyboard20070807.jpg

But, not on Apple Canada's store page for the Apple Keyboard and Apple Wireless Keyboard:

http://a248.e.akamai.net/7/248/2041/1301/store.apple.com/Catalog/US/Images/mb110_125.gif

http://a248.e.akamai.net/7/248/2041/1301/store.apple.com/Catalog/US/Images/mb167_125.gif

I'm pondering? :apple:

bilbo--baggins
Aug 8, 2007, 05:50 PM
I say "Open-Apple-W" to newbies like you and you give me a blank look. And if you don't know what "Open-Apple" is, yes, you're a newbie, at least in my book.

-Clive

I say Paddle 0 and Paddle 1, and you give me a blank look. If if you don't know what "Paddle 0" is, yes, you're a newbie, at least in MY book.

chubad
Aug 8, 2007, 05:52 PM
Hey Apple. I was set to order a wireless keyboard until I found out it had no numeric keypad. One more lost sale. :mad:

Peace
Aug 8, 2007, 05:57 PM
Hey Apple. I was set to order a wireless keyboard until I found out it had no numeric keypad. One more lost sale. :mad:


Good grief.Buy the old white wireless keyboard then.

verniesgarden
Aug 8, 2007, 05:57 PM
Hey Apple. I was set to order a wireless keyboard until I found out it had no numeric keypad. One more lost sale. :mad:

i really think apple is gonna go back on them selves with this one

yes people like less clutter, but they don't want less function!

Cameront9
Aug 8, 2007, 05:58 PM
Does anyone actually HAVE one of the damn things yet to confirm which way it is?

Anyway, at first I was a little saddened by this until I realized that the Apple key was not on the original Mac anyway, and the reason was that S. Jobs thought it was "taking the Apple logo in vain"

See this story on Folklore.org:
http://www.folklore.org/StoryView.py?project=Macintosh&story=Swedish_Campground.txt&sortOrder=Sort%20by%20Date&detail=medium&search=swedish

So like other posters have said...just going back to the roots!

Lesser Evets
Aug 8, 2007, 05:59 PM
Does anybody TRULY care about the Apple symbol disappearing? Or staying??

No.

monke
Aug 8, 2007, 06:01 PM
Without it, there's nothing that really says 'Apple' just from looking at the keyboard. Of course, you would be able to get that from the way it looks, but how many people really could tell you that?

Just write command somewhere else on it, or change it in the system.

Keep the :apple: on the keyboard!

Pieira
Aug 8, 2007, 06:03 PM
To Hell with switchers!
I've been using a Mac since 1996. Before everyone thought they were "cool, hip, clutch, throttle, chill." If they remove the Apple logo from the keyboard I will not be buying another Mac anytime soon.

Wow I didn't think Apple was gaining any new customers in 1996.

xli_ne
Aug 8, 2007, 06:03 PM
The bluetooth model is also missing a numberpad.

bilbo--baggins
Aug 8, 2007, 06:06 PM
i really think apple is gonna go back on them selves with this one

yes people like less clutter, but they don't want less function!

I love having the old white bluetooth keyboard, the idea of going back to getting one with a cable just to keep the numeric keypad seems unappealing. Mind you, having a wireless mightymouse is far more important. Certainly I'd rather have a wired keyboard than lose the numeric keypad.

Let's hope that enough people hold off from making those sorts of compromises so that Apple feel obliged to create a fully functional wireless keyboard. I'm sure there must be a good market for both - and surely it can't be difficult to come up with a cross between their new wired and wireless keyboards (and no I'm NOT talking about a wired version without the numeric keypad!!!!).

CaptainScarlet
Aug 8, 2007, 06:10 PM
It doesn't matter what they change it too, it's still open-apple.....

That button-combo saved my butt MANY times playing Ultima III!!!

Pieira
Aug 8, 2007, 06:11 PM
the media keys would of bee perfect over the "help/home/page up" keys and left the rest where the were

Agreed


but also why has the dim keys printed

Agreed


another thing that stings me black/aluminum imac with white/aluminum keyboard-apple is all elegant design and drops the ball on obvious

Agreed

These are the kind of things I expect apple to get right, while they wouldn't affect whether I buy it or not they take the gloss of a bit.

lazyrighteye
Aug 8, 2007, 06:13 PM
To Hell with switchers!
I've been using a Mac since 1996. Before everyone thought they were "cool, hip, clutch, throttle, chill." If they remove the Apple logo from the keyboard I will not be buying another Mac anytime soon.

Dumbest.
Post.
Ever.

mcdermd
Aug 8, 2007, 06:15 PM
To Hell with switchers!
I've been using a Mac since 1996. Before everyone thought they were "cool, hip, clutch, throttle, chill." If they remove the Apple logo from the keyboard I will not be buying another Mac anytime soon.

Well, I've been using a Mac since 1984 and we didn't have the Apple key until the ADB keyboards came out. They put the Open-Apple key on so you could use it with the IIgs as well as the Mac as they both had the ADB bus.

Ironically, the MacBook/New Mac keyboards remind me a lot of the IIgs-specific keyboard with a small bezel and short, square, chicklet-style keycaps:

http://www.old-computers.com/museum/photos/Apple_IIgs_Keyboard_1.jpg

smueboy
Aug 8, 2007, 06:17 PM
It's still the 'Apple' key to me....

all-in-my-head
Aug 8, 2007, 06:21 PM
Anyone know what the expose button will do - will we program it to our favourite expose function - what about the other two functions - now we can't have them all together?? (Well not without dashboard breaking them up)

And surely it's a little short sighted of Apple to ignore Spaces which they're adding in Leopard, since this keyboard is probably gonna be around for a few years.

CaptainScarlet
Aug 8, 2007, 06:30 PM
Well, I've been using a Mac since 1984 and we didn't have the Apple key until the ADB keyboards came out. They put the Open-Apple key on so you could use it with the IIgs as well as the Mac as they both had the ADB bus.


The first apple that came with an open-apple, was the Apple IIe...

http://apple2history.org/history/ah07.html

bilbo--baggins
Aug 8, 2007, 06:30 PM
And surely it's a little short sighted of Apple to ignore Spaces which they're adding in Leopard, since this keyboard is probably gonna be around for a few years.

Like the Airport Extreme 802.11n, they'll bring out a new version in a couple of months with a Spaces button added...

But they'll remove the space bar just to wind us up...

Or perhaps a space bar on the wired version, and a Spaces button on the wireless version?

rdrr
Aug 8, 2007, 06:35 PM
Why not just call it "missing-apple" key? :p

bilbo--baggins
Aug 8, 2007, 06:36 PM
The first apple that came with an open-apple, was the Apple IIe...

http://apple2history.org/history/ah07.html

I still think it should say Paddle 0...

(or can nobody remember back THAT far?).

arn
Aug 8, 2007, 06:39 PM
Ironically, the MacBook/New Mac keyboards remind me a lot of the IIgs-specific keyboard with a small bezel and short, square, chicklet-style keycaps:


I really liked the feel of the //gs keyboard. That might have been my favorite keyboard.

arn

benjags
Aug 8, 2007, 06:43 PM
The alternate explanation for the real Steve-lovers is that Steve Jobs hated the Apple key and felt it was gratuitous use of the company logo--hence the clover/butterfly/bowen knot icon to replace it.

He didn't hated the key, he hated the apples in every menu command...anyway, for those who think they're cool because they call open-apple to the command key this should be a good news, now the can be super-cool by calling the open-apple key to a key that doesn't even have an apple on it!

matticus008
Aug 8, 2007, 06:46 PM
He didn't hated the key, he hated the apples in every menu command...
It's the same thing. What good is a keyboard that doesn't reflect its on-screen function? Why would you leave a symbol on the keyboard that serves zero possible function in the software? Eliminating the shortcut indicator from the screen required replacing the matching symbol on the keyboard.

lucas
Aug 8, 2007, 06:47 PM
That sounds like something a tourist who just jumped on the Mac bandwagon would say.
at least I'm not so shallow that I'd divorce my wife over wearing a dress the wrong colour

Doctor X
Aug 8, 2007, 06:48 PM
All I can say is "New Coke."

--J.D.

all-in-my-head
Aug 8, 2007, 06:50 PM
Unboxing pics from another thread show that the Apple is gone is favour of CMD and alt and ctrl remain the same!

http://gallery.mac.com/felixkunze#100002/DSC00027&bgcolor=black

zorinlynx
Aug 8, 2007, 06:52 PM
I say Paddle 0 and Paddle 1, and you give me a blank look. If if you don't know what "Paddle 0" is, yes, you're a newbie, at least in MY book.

Don't you mean PDL(0) and PDL(1)?

And you can't read from both in succession because it doesn't give a timing circuit enough time to reset and the second read will be inaccurate.

More of a problem in integer basic than Applesoft because intbasic was faster.

;)

izzle22
Aug 8, 2007, 06:52 PM
Hey Apple. I was set to order a wireless keyboard until I found out it had no numeric keypad. One more lost sale. :mad:

Same Here!:mad:

milatchi
Aug 8, 2007, 06:55 PM
at least I'm not so shallow that I'd divorce my wife over wearing a dress the wrong colour
If I warned her about the glasses then it's fair game.

bilbo--baggins
Aug 8, 2007, 06:56 PM
Don't you mean PDL(0) and PDL(1)?

And you can't read from both in succession because it doesn't give a timing circuit enough time to reset and the second read will be inaccurate.

More of a problem in integer basic than Applesoft because intbasic was faster.

;)

OK, I give you a blank look...

verniesgarden
Aug 8, 2007, 06:57 PM
well you can't call it an "open apple key" if there is no "closed apple key" so once the keyboard got rid of the closed apple key, there was only left one apple symbol

so all the "old schoolers" that say open apple are incorrect, it is just an apple key now... well now it's nothing so get over it move on... and b*tch about something worth while like the rearranging of the F keys

law guy
Aug 8, 2007, 07:00 PM
Has anyone had the opportunity to type on the new keyboard yet? I'm hoping the reports will be very good, and am resisting searching on-line to snap up remaining "old" style keyboards. Look this company puts form over function sometimes (cough - hockey puck mouse - cough) and I'm concerned that ergonomics may not have trumped sexy (who doesn't like the perfect combination of both though) in the development of this keyboard.

bilbo--baggins
Aug 8, 2007, 07:00 PM
Actually, this situation of either having a numeric keypad or having wireless, reminds me of a Fiat advert from a few years ago.

It was something like the Fiat Brava and Fiat Bravo. One you got an engine and the other you got a stereo. Something like that.

Pieira
Aug 8, 2007, 07:05 PM
Unboxing pics from another thread show that the Apple is gone is favour of CMD and alt and ctrl remain the same!

http://gallery.mac.com/felixkunze#100002/DSC00027&bgcolor=black

Thats different to both websites isn't it. Crazy

The unboxing on engadget is like the US website.

http://www.engadget.com/gallery/apple-4g-imac-first-unboxing-impressions/344905/

Return keys are different

F.D.
Aug 8, 2007, 07:06 PM
Put the damn Apple logo back on our damn Apple keyboard. Stop pandering to the effing switchers.

all-in-my-head
Aug 8, 2007, 07:06 PM
... What good is a keyboard that doesn't reflect its on-screen function? Why would you leave a symbol on the keyboard that serves zero possible function in the software? Eliminating the shortcut indicator from the screen required replacing the matching symbol on the keyboard.

I love the way this page shows 2 different versions of the keyboard (one with apple logo, one with command) right above the heading "Every Detail Matters"

http://www.apple.com/uk/imac/design.html

Plus, it turns out the button is actually "cmd" anyway!

blueflame
Aug 8, 2007, 07:13 PM
the wireless keyboard is really there for an ADD ON piece. Its real heart lies in the apple tv. it gained all these media controls, i think thats what its for.
Too bad, i was really looking forward to my iphone controlling my frontrow, and apple tv.

Multimedia
Aug 8, 2007, 07:17 PM
It's not in the iMac section. But I am at the Palo Alto Store now typing this on the new keyboard on a new 24" iMac and this keyboard is worse than lame. It blows big time.:eek: :p

CBAviator
Aug 8, 2007, 07:25 PM
I wasn't sure if I would like this keyboard or not. I finally got a chance to try it out today at the Apple store and I love it! As far as the missing Apple logo...well, the keyboard works just as well without it! The missing logo doesn't bother me at all.

ghall
Aug 8, 2007, 07:26 PM
I really like the new keyboard design. It's totally awesome. But I can't believe they got rid of the Apple key. It's like a frying pan without a handle! :eek:

! V !
Aug 8, 2007, 07:33 PM
but for the love of whatever does the wireless keyboard lack the number pad?

I have a macbook pro, I bought a wireless bluetooth KB specifically to give me such a keypad as and when I need it...

but if I need another one it will be bluetooth and it won't be an apple, if I want a K/B that looks like a laptop one I'll use the built in one.

also the idea of using something like a mac pro, or even an imac without a number pad is strange.

The reason Apple dropped the number pad on the wireless version is:

1. it is more mobile;
2. the wireless keyboard now only uses 3 AA batteries instead of 4 AA;
3. people do no usually use the number pad when holding it on they lap and at a distance; and
4. it gives the consumer more choice or shall I say makes Apple more money. ;)

nickster9224
Aug 8, 2007, 07:38 PM
RIP :apple:key

drater
Aug 8, 2007, 07:40 PM
damn, i want the apple key back...maybe i'll just paint one on :D

synth3tik
Aug 8, 2007, 07:41 PM
No One ever knew what I was talking about when I said command, I would have to say open apple. That was annoying. I think this will make things easier, if only the rest of the keyboard didn't suck.

law guy
Aug 8, 2007, 07:44 PM
It's not in the iMac section. But I am at the Palo Alto Store now typing this on the new keyboard on a new 24" iMac and this keyboard is worse than lame. It blows big time.:eek: :p

Interesting to hear MM.

law guy
Aug 8, 2007, 07:50 PM
I really liked the feel of the //gs keyboard. That might have been my favorite keyboard.

arn

It reminded me of the TRS 80 or IIc, and included some photos in another thread a little while back - but very 80s. http://forums.macrumors.com/showpost.php?p=3971385&postcount=498

tyr2
Aug 8, 2007, 07:58 PM
Unboxing pics from another thread show that the Apple is gone is favour of CMD and alt and ctrl remain the same!

http://gallery.mac.com/felixkunze#10...&bgcolor=black


Thats different to both websites isn't it. Crazy

The unboxing on engadget is like the US website.

http://www.engadget.com/gallery/apple-4g-imac-first-unboxing-impressions/344905/

Return keys are different

The first keyboard linked above is the English - 'International' version and has and symbols. The Engadget one is, afaics, the US version. The return key on the International version more closely matches that of the existing keyboard, but is much thinner. In fact all the keys on the right side of the main section appear to have lost some width.

Really looking forward to having a go on one of these keyboards, I've never really got on with the previous version but love the MacBook keyboard.

Hairball
Aug 8, 2007, 08:04 PM
Does it really matter? Didn't think so ... :apple::apple::apple:

piermac
Aug 8, 2007, 08:05 PM
First they drop "Computer" from "Apple Computer Incorporated." Now it's the :apple: logo on the keyboard. Next thing you know, they're gonna stop selling computers altogether and focus on electronic gadgets (i.e. iPhone, iPod, etc.) :p

First they changed portable's color from white to a Dell-like black, then they delayed some months the Leopard distribution, then they distributed worldwide a bugged Safari 3.0, finally they deleted from the keyboard the apple, the symbol of the difference. Perfect consequence.

I am an ex-windows user, happily converted to the Mac few years ago, and I am very worried. Will next step be a name change to MACrosoft? :mad:

I was going to order the new keyboard, but I noticed immediatly that the apple symbol was not on the key, and I decided to delay the purchase. My enthusiasm is gone. Maybe I will buy it later, or maybe never at all. Honestly I do not want on my table a keyboard which can be mistakened with a PC keyboard. I have a sort of allergy to PCs.

There are many strange and nice keyboard for PC. But only one keyboard has the apple key... :apple:

Hairball
Aug 8, 2007, 08:07 PM
It's not in the iMac section. But I am at the Palo Alto Store now typing this on the new keyboard on a new 24" iMac and this keyboard is worse than lame. It blows big time.:eek: :p

I kind of thought it would. No big surprise.

breatheright
Aug 8, 2007, 08:07 PM
I just returned from the Apple Store here in Miami. Used the new iMac 20" and 23" with the new keyboard. The Macs looks beautiful and sleek, much more modern than the previous version and yet still keeps the look. The actually showed them side by side, since they were just putting them up. The screens are bright and glossy, looks great.

Now the keyboards that they had, had NO Apple Logo. Thats right, NO Apple Logo on the WIRED Keyboard. These were the wired ones, that included the number pad. They look very cool. They felt pretty good for the time that i used them too, if that changed during long term use i wasnt able to find out at the time. But even though a similar look that takes after the MacBook, the keyboard surprisingly had its own feel. They did not have the wireless ones out yet though. I was a little disappointed since thats the version that I was most interested in seeing. I wanted to see the size comparisons and if the lack of the number pad was something I could live without. A problem Im concerned about since I currently use a MacBook Pro, and kinda miss a regular keyboard.

All in all.. I was skeptical at first but I was definitely sold on the new iMacs and keyboards. I would like to see a new mouse hopefully soon as well. :)

But im definitely going to be a buyer! :apple::apple::eek::eek::apple::apple:

lucas
Aug 8, 2007, 08:19 PM
First they changed portable's color from white to a Dell-like black, then they delayed some months the Leopard distribution, then they distributed worldwide a bugged Safari 3.0, finally they deleted from the keyboard the apple, the symbol of the difference. Perfect consequence.

I am an ex-windows user, happily converted to the Mac few years ago, and I am very worried. Will next step be a name change to MACrosoft? :mad:

I was going to order the new keyboard, but I noticed immediatly that the apple symbol was not on the key, and I decided to delay the purchase. My enthusiasm is gone. Maybe I will buy it later, or maybe never at all. Honestly I do not want on my table a keyboard which can be mistakened with a PC keyboard. I have a sort of allergy to PCs.

There are many strange and nice keyboard for PC. But only one keyboard has the apple key... :apple:

it's not an allergy, it's called "being a tryhard poser". some grow out of it, others are cursed with it for life.

piermac
Aug 8, 2007, 08:38 PM
it's not an allergy, it's called "being a tryhard poser". some grow out of it, others are cursed with it for life.

No, when I switched from PC to MAC I really discovered a new world. Not only a different computer but a different philosophy. And I was enthusiast and proud of this difference. And I successfully convinced parents and relatives to switch to Apple too. Seven Mac solt by Apple.

Now I hate to see that some fundamental differences looks to be going to disappear. I mean e.g. the delays, the bugged software, etc. Obviously the problem is not the apple-key. The apple-key is only a bare symbol. But its disappearing is - in turn - a symbol of some disappearing differences.

In my opinion not all Mac users recognize the importance of this difference. Some of them seems to have the secret dream to become windows user...
On the other hand, Steve Jobs tries to diminish some practical differences with windows to make easier the switch of windows users. But I do not think that he will have more users if differences disappear too much.

breatheright
Aug 8, 2007, 08:52 PM
No, when I switched from PC to MAC I really discovered a new world. Not only a different computer but a different philosophy. And I was enthusiast and proud of this difference. And I successfully convinced parents and relatives to switch to Apple too. Seven Mac solt by Apple.

Now I hate to see that some fundamental differences looks to be going to disappear. I mean e.g. the delays, the bugged software, etc. Obviously the problem is not the apple-key. The apple-key is only a bare symbol. But its disappearing is - in turn - a symbol of some disappearing differences.

In my opinion not all Mac users recognize the importance of this difference. Some of them seems to have the secret dream to become windows user...
On the other hand, Steve Jobs tries to diminish some practical differences with windows to make easier the switch of windows users. But I do not think that he will have more users if differences disappear too much.

Lol.. what a joke.. I dont believe theres someone out there like this person that actually exsists..

Omni Geno
Aug 8, 2007, 09:23 PM
While the apple logo certainly gave our Apple keyboards personality, I for one welcome the new "command" wording. I can't even count the number of times I've told my Mac n00b friends to press command-W or something like that, and they're like "uhh don't you mean 'control'?" Yeah, it's about time that people are told explicitly what the command key is. I've never said "apple key" except to people who don't know what's going on.

djohnsto77
Aug 8, 2007, 09:42 PM
why open-apple and not just apple?




That goes back to the ancient Apple ][ days. On those machines there was an open Apple and a solid Apple. The solid Apple became the option key on Macintosh.

poe diddley
Aug 8, 2007, 10:03 PM
i don't think it's a good idea.
the apple has always been on their keyboards, so what's really the point of removing it? if for no other reason, keep it for sentimental branding reasons. i will miss it :(

Cameront9
Aug 8, 2007, 10:11 PM
No, when I switched from PC to MAC I really discovered a new world. Not only a different computer but a different philosophy. And I was enthusiast and proud of this difference. And I successfully convinced parents and relatives to switch to Apple too. Seven Mac solt by Apple.

Now I hate to see that some fundamental differences looks to be going to disappear. I mean e.g. the delays, the bugged software, etc. Obviously the problem is not the apple-key. The apple-key is only a bare symbol. But its disappearing is - in turn - a symbol of some disappearing differences.

In my opinion not all Mac users recognize the importance of this difference. Some of them seems to have the secret dream to become windows user...
On the other hand, Steve Jobs tries to diminish some practical differences with windows to make easier the switch of windows users. But I do not think that he will have more users if differences disappear too much.

WTF? The Cmd cloverleaf symbol has just as much Apple history as the Open-Apple. If anything, the absence of the Open-Apple logo is just the last vestige of the Apple ][ finally dying. Took a long time. The Apple logo was not originally on Macs, anyway. It was added later when they brought out a keyboard compatible with both Macs and the Apple ][ (whatever derivative it was at the time, not sure)...

Besides, the Apple key only brought confusion to users. "Press the Command key? What's that? Oh, you mean the Apple Key." Maybe this will start to sort it out.

Good lord, you remind me of the people that complained that Apple was disowning their heritage by dropping the Powerbook name in favor of MacBook Pro. Sheesh.

deannnnn
Aug 8, 2007, 10:27 PM
lol.... I'll put an Apple sticker on there.
I will never give up saying Apple-Z :D

bretm
Aug 8, 2007, 10:31 PM
No, when I switched from PC to MAC I really discovered a new world. Not only a different computer but a different philosophy. And I was enthusiast and proud of this difference. And I successfully convinced parents and relatives to switch to Apple too. Seven Mac solt by Apple.

Now I hate to see that some fundamental differences looks to be going to disappear. I mean e.g. the delays, the bugged software, etc. Obviously the problem is not the apple-key. The apple-key is only a bare symbol. But its disappearing is - in turn - a symbol of some disappearing differences.

In my opinion not all Mac users recognize the importance of this difference. Some of them seems to have the secret dream to become windows user...
On the other hand, Steve Jobs tries to diminish some practical differences with windows to make easier the switch of windows users. But I do not think that he will have more users if differences disappear too much.

OMG loser, I thought your original post on this was a joke, or maybe sarcasm. I thought it was kinda funny. But you're actually serious? They're just tools. Kind of like an expensive car. Not always necessarily better than a cheaper car, just preferable to those that can afford them. PCs can be workhorses. At times, a lot more bang for the buck, but Apple offers form and usability factors that some fine as necessary as fine leather seats. The bigger Apple gets, the less efficient it will become. The same holds for ANY big company. On the other hand, they become more powerful. Right now they've grown into this crossover intel/windows world where the apple might be turning away a few buyers. Or perhaps, they just realized that is was kinda stupid. Real mac users call it the command key. But for some reason the word command is not on the thing at all. Books and tutorials never use the apple sign or call it the apple key. They call it the command key and display the cloverleaf thing for the abbreviation. Putting cmd or command on the thing was long overdue. Something had to go.

And they didn't "switch the portable from white to black." HELLO? Apple's Powerbook has been black since it's inception. When they introduced the iBook it was all kinds of girly colors. Then it was just white. Now, it's white or black and they're copying DELL?

You're not from around here is ya?

AidenShaw
Aug 8, 2007, 10:46 PM
Lol.. what a joke.. I dont believe theres someone out there like this person that actually exsists..

I think that you might be dismissing a reasonable dissertation from someone who doesn't speak English as their first language.

You, therefore, might be the joke.

piermac has a concern that the Mac is becoming homogenized into a Windows world. Making fun of a turn of phrase that's not quite typical American English shows your smallness, not hers.

(this applies even more to you "bretm", your post is almost a personal attack)

cleanup
Aug 8, 2007, 10:55 PM
I'm gonna stick an Apple sticker on mine. :D

iowamensan
Aug 8, 2007, 11:00 PM
I don't think I have ever said Command - anything. It has always and will always be Open Apple - Q etc. Sometimes I do say Apple Q to shorten it, but I don't think I can ever get myself to say Command.
Oh, and I see I have been beat to the Swedish connection. (GIS Swedish campground if you have any questions)

iBookCT77
Aug 8, 2007, 11:01 PM
this is long overdue. Apple should have taken off the logo when keyboards went USB, and portables shouldn't have ever had them to begin with.

Pre-ADB machines (Macintosh plus and earlier) didn't have the apple logo on the command key.. It was added on to support the Apple IIgs which used the apple key, not command. All ADB keyboards would work with the IIgs.

And to date myself further, we refer to the command key as the "open-apple" key because the pre IIgs Apple 2's had two apple keys, one open, one closed (normal solid logo). This was replaced with the option key on the IIgs--always wondered why they didn't put the closed apple on that key as well.

mnb
Aug 8, 2007, 11:18 PM
Mac documention has always referred to it as the command key. It's always been the Command key to me since 1986. When I worked at Apple, no one referred to it as the 'Apple' key, it was the Command key.

Having 2 names for the same key was stupid.

La Porta
Aug 8, 2007, 11:22 PM
Thank God. I never have minded the Apple there itself, even though it is a hold over....but the people saying "apple-" whatever instead of the proper "command-" whatever has always pissed me off.

mnb
Aug 8, 2007, 11:23 PM
And they didn't "switch the portable from white to black." HELLO? Apple's Powerbook has been black since it's inception. When they introduced the iBook it was all kinds of girly colors. Then it was just white. Now, it's white or black and they're copying DELL?

You're not from around here is ya?

Apple's Powerbooks haven't been black since the first Titanium model years ago. I think he was referring to the ibook (now MacBook) that is now available in black as well as the white it's been for some time.

La Porta
Aug 8, 2007, 11:28 PM
Apple's Powerbooks haven't been black since the first Titanium model years ago. I think he was referring to the ibook (now MacBook) that is now available in black as well as the white it's been for some time.

Not to mention that the Portable was regular old Apple Platinum as well.

Goldenbear
Aug 9, 2007, 12:48 AM
The Apple //e was my 2nd computer, and I used it for nearly eight years, before buying a IIcx.

As far as I was concerned, the Command key was always "COMMAND", NOT "Apple"! There was no confusion, no nostalgia, no question... it just WAS.

As people have pointed out, since the very 1st Mac, it has been the Command key, so nothing has changed. There are too many REAL problems with the new Macs and keyboards to be wasting time pining for something that never was.

Thank God. I never have minded the Apple there itself, even though it is a hold over....but the people saying "apple-" whatever instead of the proper "command-" whatever has always pissed me off.

Yes, very annoying.

Me: "Hit Command-S".
Client/Family Member: "Where's Command?"
Me: "Besides the Space Bar."
Client/Family Member: "You mean Apple?"
Me: Big sigh "...Yes."

stephenli
Aug 9, 2007, 01:01 AM
I was all ready to buy, until I noticed that the logo is missing, so I went with a Dell instead.

ha haha you are a funny guy.

I was thinking Vaio TP-1 or Mac Mini for living room
but i dont like windows logo on keyboard,
so I get back to mac :apple:

well...i decided to add back the apple logo myself...or go to Spain / Canada store to buy a new keyboard with :apple: logo

MacFly123
Aug 9, 2007, 01:20 AM
I really can't make up my mind... I really like the new keyboard but am really mad about the other keys being cut off the wireless version, but does anyone else think that the white keys don't match the iMac now??? Don't you think they should have made the keys black with backlights as well as the mouse and Apple Remote??? I LOVE white Apple products, but the keyboard seems out of place now. It matches the mouse and remote but not the iMac :( Anyone else agree???

ctango
Aug 9, 2007, 02:03 AM
Really... you're taking away the :apple:, but are leaving us with the clover? The clover? Really Steve?

As if people already don't have a hard enough time understanding my instructions. Now I'll have to go back through and re-write all my documentation to say "command" instead of "apple". I still say and will continue to say "open apple" just because it's what is right.

Doesn't really matter to me anyways, I can't afford an iMac now. Just throwing in my two cents.

Long live the :apple:!

andrewag
Aug 9, 2007, 02:49 AM
Wow, looks crudy!

Sort of reminds me of car instrument dash panels that have words for the US, and the "international" versions have symbols. :rolleyes:

piermac
Aug 9, 2007, 04:04 AM
And they didn't "switch the portable from white to black." HELLO? Apple's Powerbook has been black since it's inception. When they introduced the iBook it was all kinds of girly colors. Then it was just white. Now, it's white or black and they're copying DELL?


OK, maybe I exaggerated. However when I switched from my blackish Dell laptop and my greysh PC desktops to the Mac world, Apple colors were white and silver. And I switched from an ugly world to a beautiful luminous world. No problem for me if some Mac is black (they are nice and they do not copy Dell) provided that the Mac is not "becoming homogenized into a Windows world". AidenShaw perfectly understood my point.

zac4mac
Aug 9, 2007, 07:06 AM
@piermac and Aiden -
I'm not big on "me too" posts but this is a good one to mark.

The biggest reason I stay a Mac user ARE the differences, not the similarities to Windoze.
I'll have to call the store and see if I can order an "international" model keyboard, I like the Apple symbol on the Command key.

Z

gkarris
Aug 9, 2007, 09:31 AM
@piermac and Aiden -
I'm not big on "me too" posts but this is a good one to mark.

The biggest reason I stay a Mac user ARE the differences, not the similarities to Windoze.
I'll have to call the store and see if I can order an "international" model keyboard, I like the Apple symbol on the Command key.

Z

This is news for me... What??? No :apple: key? I want the :apple: key back! :(

(runs off crying....)

MizuInOz
Aug 9, 2007, 10:02 AM
I think the "open Apple" is good. Why?
Because Apple will now have to localize - as in translate into every language and alphabet (character set) the "command" statement. Heaps of keys - when an explanation in the "user booklet" would be fine. BUT as we all know - who reads the user booklet for a keyboard?

So now you will see "command" in all the languages of The European Community (on the key in very fine print! - you cannot leave any out!) and in Kanji and Katakana and Hebrew and Arabic and Hindi and "Straine" and who know what else - oh and in Spanish in the US - except in Germantown PA where it will be in, of course, German.

Get my drift? It's OK for the ligua-myopic Americans who do not speak anything but English (actually American) but the "rest of us" would prefer a bit of tradition!
:)
:apple:

c3str
Aug 9, 2007, 10:37 AM
Wow. Even with as much abuse as I take from people for saying "Open Apple + S" or "Open Apple + Q", I never thought there'd be a day where they could out and out say I was wrong.

Moment of silence for what was and always will be the open Apple key.

Oh, and just on a total nerd note: graphically I always loved the way the Apple logo looked next to the command symbol.

brianus
Aug 9, 2007, 11:04 AM
I'm not fond of Apple's recent moves towards abandoning their distinctive look and feel (new iMac, Leopard UI, and so on). However, this is one "tradition" that really, really needed to die, and it's good they finally took an axe to it. Having the apple on the key made no sense. No sense! At all! Non-technical types (not even newbies) wouldn't understand when you'd quote from a manual, or memory, or even a frickin' UI menu! -- and use the correct term "Command". The icon itself is indescribable (clover? quatre-foil?), though, so you inevitably would refer to it as the "Apple key". But "Apple" had no meaning in the user interface -- unless it opens the Apple menu like the Windows key opens the Start menu, it has no business being there.

As for having to be translated into European languages -- uh, so? Don't option, shift, return and the rest need to be translated, too? What difference does it make? It will finally have the correct terminology on every international keyboard. Sounds good to me.

As for "Open Apple" -- now that's just plain stupid. There's no "closed Apple", so noone who wasn't around in ancient times would have any idea what is meant by "Open". When I first read that I thought it had something to do with the command "Open" in the File menu, or that there was a separate "open" key back in the day. As if the Apple/Command thing wasn't confusing enough! I hope none of you guys do tech support.

Would it please you whiners if they put the Apple somewhere else? Maybe on one of those keys nobody uses like 'home'. Even on the command key it was just branding, nothing more, for the last few decades, so it could really go anywhere. Or maybe they could distribute little mini versions of the white Apple stickers, just with the keyboards, so you could decide for yourself :p

zRedbullz
Aug 9, 2007, 11:22 AM
I'm going to chime in.

Those who are arguing over the fact that there isn't an Apple logo on command key need to get a bloody life. Command is command. FULL STOP. Simple eh?

Secondly, what is wrong with Apple's original keyboard? The new design IMO looks as if it would barely last five minutes. I've dropped my wireless keybord several times and refuses to seize.

heffeque
Aug 9, 2007, 11:31 AM
just to comment that Spain store corrected the image and now they show the one without the apple, but as for the Specifications comparative between the 4 models... they still say that the wifi is G instead of N.

Maccus Aurelius
Aug 9, 2007, 11:44 AM
Wow, so much over so little. Oh, next Apple might just fill in that little bite in the logo, and all bloody hell will break loose. :rolleyes:

Exhiter
Aug 9, 2007, 12:08 PM
http://www.zippy.com.tw/backend/download/productimage/keyboard/BT-726-s.jpg
/Zipper.jpg :confused:

stompy
Aug 9, 2007, 02:53 PM
Oh, yeah, like the shamrock/squiggle/butterfly/splat/propeller is any less cryptic! I'd rather have an Apple than a shamrock/squiggle/butterfly/splat/propeller!


I think that's the Swedish cartography symbol for a landmark...

withnail knows... Here's the full story. (http://www.folklore.org/StoryView.py?project=Macintosh&story=Swedish_Campground.txt&sortOrder=Sort%20by%20Date&detail=medium&search=command)

To lazy to read it? Steve doesn't agree with Clive.

honestly i could care less about the :apple: on the keyboard but why did the mess with the function keys? where people complaining?

the media keys would of be perfect over the "help/home/page up" keys and left the rest where the were


Now some of the easiest to hit keys are unassigned by default? (Above help/home/pageup AND the number pad -- formerly eject and volume controls.)

I assume this is to be consistent with the optional mini-me bluetooth keyboard that maybe 5% of customers will buy? Wow.

arn
Aug 9, 2007, 03:06 PM
Wow, so much over so little. Oh, next Apple might just fill in that little bite in the logo, and all bloody hell will break loose. :rolleyes:

Apple filling the bite in their logo would probably be bigger news than the iPhone.

arn

CalBoy
Aug 9, 2007, 03:10 PM
Wow, so much over so little. Oh, next Apple might just fill in that little bite in the logo, and all bloody hell will break loose. :rolleyes:

Changing a corporate logo is actually quite a big deal. The reason most companies don't do it too often is because that image is easily recognized by many people, and changing it might cause confusion and a loss of brand awareness. Frankly, I think the lack of an Apple logo is not a good thing. For the past few decades, people have become comfortable knowing that the Apple key will be there for certain things. Now all that has changed.

j-a-x
Aug 9, 2007, 03:54 PM
I know it's really called command but a lot of people called it the "apple key" (possibly because they are used to the windows key). Anyways it might lead to a bit of confusion but who cares, it won't be too big of a deal.

blouis79
Aug 9, 2007, 04:48 PM
Mac documention has always referred to it as the command key. It's always been the Command key to me since 1986. When I worked at Apple, no one referred to it as the 'Apple' key, it was the Command key.

Having 2 names for the same key was stupid.

But there is no generally recognized international icon or symbol for "Command" prior to Apple inventing it. The key was called Apple pre-Mac and Macs have always had the apple on the key for the last decade. Only a lunatic would think they could change 150 million users by scrubbing out something they are familiar with.

One compromise I can think of is to shrink the horrible command icon (which means nothing when you see it) and put it inside the apple icon.

If I tell a novice use press "apple-S", they know what to do. If I say press "command-S" I have to explain which is the command key. (Which is obviously the logic behind the internal political design fight that resulted in the end of the apple.) Apple is faster to say and it's much better for the marketing department that we say it often.

withnail knows... Here's the full story. (http://www.folklore.org/StoryView.py?project=Macintosh&story=Swedish_Campground.txt&sortOrder=Sort%20by%20Date&detail=medium&search=command)

To lazy to read it? Steve doesn't agree with Clive.

So:
The computer designers called it the Apple key.
Steve thew a fit because there were too many apples on the screen.
They misused a Swedish symbol for campground landmark to mean command.
Userss still call it the apple key.

It's time the swedes took legal action against inappropriate usage of their icon and claimed licence fees. Long live Apple.


PS Wikipedia knows more:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Command_key
"It is used in Denmark, Estonia, Finland, Iceland, Norway and Sweden as a symbol of "sites of historical or touristic interest", for example church ruins, museums, interesting natural formations, and so forth. It is used as a roadsign at such places."

matticus008
Aug 9, 2007, 05:01 PM
I think the "open Apple" is good. Why?
Because Apple will now have to localize - as in translate into every language and alphabet (character set) the "command" statement. Heaps of keys - when an explanation in the "user booklet" would be fine. BUT as we all know - who reads the user booklet for a keyboard?
How does the Apple key avoid that? There is no on-screen cue for the logo key. All documentation based on Apple guidelines has been calling it the command key since 1984. The Apple logo on the key does not make any sense to anyone who doesn't know its history. It certainly doesn't make any sense to a first-time user who wants to know what it does, because the answer is nothing. At least the "alt" tag on the control key is useful in terminals and when running Linux/Windows.

The other icon, the Bowen knot/Saint-whatever cross, on the other hand, appears on screen, in print documentation, and in the Apple official character map. It was simply an exercise in sloth that people called it the Apple key casually.

Marky_Mark
Aug 9, 2007, 05:10 PM
I actually know a few people younger than me (26) that say open apple still. It always surprises me a little bit.

I've been using Macs for eighteen years and I'd never heard "Open Apple" before today. You live and learn.

Not to mention that the Portable was regular old Apple Platinum as well.

...and the original PowerBooks were slate grey, which showed off the rainbow Apple a treat. Them's were the good ole days...

gkarris
Aug 9, 2007, 10:27 PM
The new keyboards have nothing saying, "hey, this is an Apple keyboard".

I just unboxed at work a new HP system, and the HP keyboard not only has the HP logo on it, the new "Windows Vista" key has the logo covered in a fancy clear plastic bubble.

If HP and MS is so proud to have their symbols ON their keyboard, why not Apple???

Omni Geno
Aug 9, 2007, 11:29 PM
The new keyboards have nothing saying, "hey, this is an Apple keyboard".

Perhaps not explicitly, but the design speaks for itself. Also, as far as I know, almost no other companies' keyboards have the cloverleaf for the command key.

MizuInOz
Aug 10, 2007, 01:19 AM
How does the Apple key avoid that? There is no on-screen cue for the logo key. All documentation based on Apple guidelines has been calling it the command key since 1984. The Apple logo on the key does not make any sense to anyone who doesn't know its history. It certainly doesn't make any sense to a first-time user who wants to know what it does, because the answer is nothing. At least the "alt" tag on the control key is useful in terminals and when running Linux/Windows.

The other icon, the Bowen knot/Saint-whatever cross, on the other hand, appears on screen, in print documentation, and in the Apple official character map. It was simply an exercise in sloth that people called it the Apple key casually.

Not meanin' to take the piss outta ya, mate but:

You know, you are so right - I guess you need to be right! Consider that localization (outside of Happy Valley USA) will require that "command" be in different languages. That is my point. I know it is called the "command" key... which is easier to grock an :apple: key or a "command" key in some other character set.

Question - have you even seen an Apple Keyboard in a different character set? I have one on my 17" PB in Russian - had to order it from Cupertino. So I guess all the keys will be in Russian and then the key to the left of the space bar will be in roman characters with "command" - makes perfect sense!

I get it. Such a revelation!

Oh, BTW - I have been an Apple product user since 1983 - thank you for the history lesson. Read other comments in this thread and you may see (or not) why it has been called the "open Apple" key for since pre-1984!

BTW #2 - try shift-option-"k" and you will see the :apple: on screen. ;)

Hooroo!!!

matticus008
Aug 10, 2007, 02:11 AM
Not meanin' to take the piss outta ya, mate but:

You know, you are so right - I guess you need to be right! Consider that localization (outside of Happy Valley USA) will require that "command" be in different languages. That is my point.
I'm sorry, what? How does the Apple logo have anything to do with that? How would the presence of the Apple logo solve the problem? What function would the Apple logo serve on the key?
So I guess all the keys will be in Russian and then the key to the left of the space bar will be in roman characters with "command"
Is there some reason to believe it wouldn't match the shift, caps lock, control, or tab keys?
...it has been called the "open Apple" key for since pre-1984!
Tell me, do you insist on calling Nissans Datsuns? Do you still call the internet ARPANET? Do you call radio "the wireless"? There comes a time to let the past go. Apple did, 22 years ago.

brianus
Aug 10, 2007, 09:57 AM
I just unboxed at work a new HP system, and the HP keyboard not only has the HP logo on it, the new "Windows Vista" key has the logo covered in a fancy clear plastic bubble.

If HP and MS is so proud to have their symbols ON their keyboard, why not Apple???

Uh, it's not a matter of pride; the Windows key actually does something with its fancy, clear bubble equivalent on the screen.


If I tell a novice use press "apple-S", they know what to do. If I say press "command-S" I have to explain which is the command key. (Which is obviously the logic behind the internal political design fight that resulted in the end of the apple.) Apple is faster to say and it's much better for the marketing department that we say it often.

And now, if you say press 'Command-S', they will know what to do because it's printed on the key. Better, right? We should be glad this is one of those (rare) instances in which logic won out over 'the marketing department.'

dernhelm
Aug 10, 2007, 10:36 AM
Was I the only person telling people to use "apple-q" to quit, "apple-s" to save?

Maybe it's some "open apple" and "closed apple" key lust from the Apple // days, but now I wonder what all of those people will do.

You know, it's funny - my first mac was an PowerMac 6100/60AV and the keyboard I received with it did not have the Apple. It took me about a week to figure out what people were talking about when they were mentioning the "apple key". For a while after that I switched away, but when I switched back, I got an iMac (not the newest one, mind you) and the Apple was back on the command key.

I figured my 6100/60AV had it removed because it was around the time when Apple computers were being produced by non-Apple companies, and having an Apple key was kind of a "misnomer".

I for one am really sad to see it go. To me it's a throwback to the dark days to take it away.

brianus
Aug 10, 2007, 12:38 PM
How many other languages do you speak, by the way?

I see your point - do you see mine? At all?
Or do you need to be so right that you fail to see anyone else's side to anything?

Chill, Mate...

Uh.. sounds like you need to chill, 'mate'. And actually, you've yet to explain your side, so how can we see it? It's a perfectly legitimate question how the Command key thing should be seen any differently than the other special keys like tab, shift, etc. Maybe you could provide a visual aid (snapshot of a non-US keyboard layout) to demonstrate whatever the heck it is your beef is? Because right now you're just not making it clear.


it isn't like Ned Kelly robbed your local fish and chips! Opps, you are probaly mad as a cut snake now, aye?

....? :confused:

BTW - you are so right what purpose does the Apple :apple: logo serve! Write a note to Steve Jobs and tell him to just get rid of it.

YOU are so right: Branding has no value. <snip>

He asked what purpose does it serve on the key, meaning that specific key. Based on this diatribe, I assume you'd be ok with the Apple logo anywhere on the keyboard? Maybe at the top on the wireless one and between the 'end' and 'up arrow' keys on the wired. That'd be ok with you? No? :eek: Then what's the point of complaining about the lack of branding?

k2k koos
Aug 10, 2007, 03:23 PM
In my opinion, apple missed a chance by not installing backlighting into these keyboards, as it is done on the Macbook Pro's.

The very same pro's that use the MBP's also use Mac Pro's and even may use these new iMacs, in Studios etc. It would be great to have these with auto dimming backlight for the same reasons, and on top of that it looks cool too!
I love it in my studio personally, I often have dimmed light conditions, so I can see the LCD displays on various equipment better at all kinds of viewing angles, and I am thinking of replacing the Powerbook I use there now, with one of these new iMacs, but I'd miss the backlit keyboard...

:apple:

penter
Aug 10, 2007, 08:37 PM
i actually prefer that the new keybard says "command" instead of ":apple:".

it may be just me, but it IS kind of irritating when giving instrutions to non-apple regulars that don't know where the command key is.
now the key says "COMMAND" right on their face, and i wont have to repeat myself, or explain: "the one with the little apple on it"

GanleyBurger
Aug 12, 2007, 02:45 AM
.

I am really disappointed that the new WIRELESS KEYBOARD doesn't have the help, home, end, section, nor the numeric pad.

What were they thinking???

And what is up with ALL GLOSSY oon the imacs ???:eek::eek::eek:

This is just insane.:mad::mad::mad:

I'm happy I bought the 17" MBP last month. LCD matte rules!!! I'll stick with my white wireless keyboard for now.

vohdoun
Aug 12, 2007, 07:44 AM
The new keyboards have nothing saying, "hey, this is an Apple keyboard".

Sure it does, it's style speaks for itself. Simple, minimal and style. There's not one keyboard that looks as compact as this but still remains the Apple style and colours. All the other keyboards are big and gaudy or have too much going on. I like just what I need. Granted some of the Logitech keyboards are nice when you need MCE like controls and such. I just love the minimal approach though, which these new Apple keyboards are.

I just unboxed at work a new HP system, and the HP keyboard not only has the HP logo on it, the new "Windows Vista" key has the logo covered in a fancy clear plastic bubble.

If HP and MS is so proud to have their symbols ON their keyboard, why not Apple???

They do have their logo, look below the keyboard.

http://img119.imageshack.us/img119/1904/applemetalyo2.png (http://imageshack.us)


Most of the time Windows products are logos nuts, splattered everywhere.

Thats one thing I cannot stand, is the win key flag. I'm not bothered when it's just a white glyph, but when it becomes a giant colourful things all over it. I wouldn't buy such a thing.

http://www.darrenstraight.com/blog/images/2006/07/livekeyboard.jpg

http://www.logitech.com/repository/223/jpg/1418.1.0.jpg
http://www.logitech.com/repository/499/jpg/4144.1.0.jpg

http://gizmodo.com/assets/resources/2007/02/ONKYO_1.jpg
http://pics.krawall.de/2/speedlink-flat-keyboard_2.jpg


i actually prefer that the new keybard says "command" instead of ":apple:".

it may be just me, but it IS kind of irritating when giving instrutions to non-apple regulars that don't know where the command key is.
now the key says "COMMAND" right on their face, and i wont have to repeat myself, or explain: "the one with the little apple on it"

I agree. I've never used or associated the term Apple key. Even when you read the docs on getting into Open firmware etc etc, its command, option etc

Command sounds better than Apple.

tyr2
Aug 14, 2007, 06:51 AM
I'm glad it's gone.

Having moved to the Mac a couple of years ago, the 'command' key was a whole load of confusion. When viewing docs saying 'press command-v', I didn't know if it meant, ctrl, alt or the 'apple' key.

Since it's an international keyboard I'd first assumed 'command' was a synonym for 'control', which would made more sense than it meaning 'apple / that weird symbol'.

jamesdm49
May 16, 2010, 06:20 PM
I didn't know where to put this query, so forgive me if I am posting in the wrong forum.

I just switched from a PC to a jazzy new Mac, but some of the little things are driving me crazy. The latest thing is that I've installed the Russian keyboard driver (the layout they use in Russia, which is what I know how to touch-type on), but the period and comma are missing. They are usually on the key to the immediate left of the right-hand shift key (where the question mark is on a US keyboard). Where are they?

PinkyMacGodess
May 16, 2010, 07:37 PM
I've been using a 'new keyboard' for almost a year and it doesn't have an Apple logo.

Old news?

PinkyMacGodess
May 16, 2010, 07:38 PM
Oops, it is old news...

Kristenn
May 16, 2010, 08:29 PM
I always say Apple command because my first computer was a very slow 2001 iMac G3. Pretty sure it has the Apple on the command key. So if they put it back... people with PowerBook G3's will still not be confused and the people with newer macs will still be confused but I wont.

Wait... anyway... I still hope they put it back. >.>

<.<







Because I liked it there.

NeoCrusader
May 17, 2010, 12:41 AM
I was all ready to buy, until I noticed that the logo is missing, so I went with a Dell instead.


hahaha