PDA

View Full Version : How strong is a PowerMac G5 casing? According to a shipper, not very.




timswim78
Aug 30, 2007, 06:22 PM
So, I shipped a PowerMac G5 from Baltimore, MD to someone in Florida. I carefully packed it. The tops and bottoms were supported by the dense foam blocks that computers are shipped with. The computer was wrapped in bubble wrap, and the box was tightly packed with peanuts.

The computer arrived in FL completely mangled. I filed a claim with the shipping company (who shall remain nameless for now). After losing the package twice and resending it to the receiver in Florida, their claims department got a hold of it. They denied the claim for "insufficient packaging," which is bologna.

I got the computer back today, and posted some pictures (link below). Even if the computer had been improperly packed (I believe that it was properly packed), I do not see anyway that normal shipping could have caused such extensive damage.

You can see the before pictures here:
http://picasaweb.google.com/biboadmin/KindaHappyMac

Here are the pictures when I received the product back at my house today:
http://picasaweb.google.com/biboadmin/SadMac



Eidorian
Aug 30, 2007, 06:23 PM
That's definitely some nasty drop damage.

Fearless Leader
Aug 30, 2007, 06:25 PM
damn. I think the truck driver played futball with that thing. You'd have to purposely do that.

Schtumple
Aug 30, 2007, 06:28 PM
Looks like something way way too heavy was placed ontop of it.

That's stupidly damaged...

timswim78
Aug 30, 2007, 06:33 PM
I've been trying to find out what type/gauge/strength of steel fearless leader has pointed out that Apple uses Aluminum, not steelApple used in the PowerMacs, so that I can quote it when I talk with the shipping company tomorrow. I've googled all over without any luck.

It's obvious that this thing was crushed or dropped from a pretty high vehicle or building.

zap2
Aug 30, 2007, 06:37 PM
wow, some one dropped that thing or something

Fearless Leader
Aug 30, 2007, 06:37 PM
It's aluminum. My dad works for Alcoa (they make aluminum) and he's commented on how much they make off apple for their cases.

timswim78
Aug 30, 2007, 06:38 PM
It's aluminum. My dad works for Alcoa (they make aluminum) and he's commented on how much they make off apple for their cases.

Thanks for the info. Any idea on where I can get the spec's for the casing?

chas0001
Aug 30, 2007, 06:59 PM
I had the same problem. I shipped my Powermac G5 2Ghz from the England to the Netherlands. I told the shipper to protect the computer (as I threw away the box :eek:) and they promised me that it would be packed and protected. When it arrived in the the netherlands was battered and bruised. The insurance company did pay up but it was an effort to get them to do it.

Dont Hurt Me
Aug 30, 2007, 07:02 PM
So, I shipped a PowerMac G5 from Baltimore, MD to someone in Florida. I carefully packed it. The tops and bottoms were supported by the dense foam blocks that computers are shipped with. The computer was wrapped in bubble wrap, and the box was tightly packed with peanuts.

The computer arrived in FL completely mangled. I filed a claim with the shipping company (who shall remain nameless for now). After losing the package twice and resending it to the receiver in Florida, their claims department got a hold of it. They denied the claim for "insufficient packaging," which is bologna.

I got the computer back today, and posted some pictures (link below). Even if the computer had been improperly packed (I believe that it was properly packed), I do not see anyway that normal shipping could have caused such extensive damage.

You can see the before pictures here:
http://picasaweb.google.com/biboadmin/KindaHappyMac

Here are the pictures when I received the product back at my house today:
http://picasaweb.google.com/biboadmin/SadMacLooks like UPS to me, Im running a warehouse and they beat the Sh.. out of our stuff. Many many times items never arrive because they have been destroyed in shipment. Call the Lawyer.

PlaceofDis
Aug 30, 2007, 07:06 PM
Looks like UPS to me, Im running a warehouse and they beat the Sh.. out of our stuff. Many many times items never arrive because they have been destroyed in shipment. Call the Lawyer.

we deal with UPS at my place on a daily basis. we get damages all the time. but FedEx is no better. same with DHL. its a game of luck usually.

this is pretty bad if you ask me. its obviously been dropped or had something done to it. i'd escalate the situation asap.

did you have insurance on it too?

Fearless Leader
Aug 30, 2007, 07:45 PM
Thanks for the info. Any idea on where I can get the spec's for the casing?

I'll go ask to see If he can find out about it.
edit: asked him and he said he could probably find out what kind of alloys and stuff go into it and from there we could figure out the strength.

Gymnut
Aug 30, 2007, 07:56 PM
Best of luck with your claim. I used to unload the USPS mail from the AMJ containers and they're almost always packed tightly from top to bottom. Generally the guys loading these containers will use the larger boxes to form a base and build their way up until every nook and cranny is occupied. That being said, you could literally have hundreds if not a thousand(s) of pounds sitting on your computer. I generally tried to be careful when I saw computer boxes when unloading the AMJ onto the post office's conveyor belts but it never surprised me to see the odd box completely smashed as the result of sitting underneath all that weight.

GoCubsGo
Aug 30, 2007, 07:57 PM
Seems to me UPS is famous for this type of thing. Dell shipped a 21" CRT as a replacement to me a couple of years ago. I came home to a hole on the side of the box and the glass was kicked in. Dell gave me another and dealt with UPS, but I have to tell you UPS said it wasn't packaged correctly. When I told them it came from Dell they quickly shut up.

tuxtpenguin
Aug 30, 2007, 07:57 PM
It looks like they ran over it with a truck.

timswim78
Aug 30, 2007, 08:29 PM
rrrr

valiar
Aug 30, 2007, 08:38 PM
Let me guess... The "unnamed" shipping company was UPS. Aka United Parcel Smashers.

"Insufficient cushioning" my shiny metal arse. They send the same form letter to everyone.

Same thing happened to me too when I was shipping a printer a year ago.

And to many others.

Also of note that they actually "insure" the packages themselves - i.e. they are BOTH the shipper AND insurer. Naturally, this is against the law - and feds did catch UPS on that, they got investigated... And they still continue doing the same thing. The companies providing insurance and damage assessment are their affiliated structures.

Just google for "UPS sucks" - you will find a lot of useful info.

And next time you ship - just avoid them outright. Save yourself the aggravation and use FedEx. Granted, I had stuff damaged or lost by FedEx too - but FedEx were always reasonable when confronted with the fact, and I have always received my money back.

Plus, FedEx rocks for other reasons. You can pick your stuff up the same day if they missed you - try that with United Parcel Smashers... And they deliver on Saturdays.

I hate UPS so much I avoid shopping at online stores that offer only UPS shipping. No FedEx or US Mail options - and they are just not getting my money. That simple.

valiar
Aug 30, 2007, 08:39 PM
we deal with UPS at my place on a daily basis. we get damages all the time. but FedEx is no better. same with DHL. its a game of luck usually.

this is pretty bad if you ask me. its obviously been dropped or had something done to it. i'd escalate the situation asap.

did you have insurance on it too?

FedEx actually use a non-affiliated insurance company, and they pay back for damages. Try that with UPS (well, the OP has tried :):):):) - need I say more?).

valiar
Aug 30, 2007, 08:46 PM
It looks like they ran over it with a truck.

I have just finished looking at the photos... WOW.

Even if it was "not packed right", this is clearly an excess amount of damage.

This is ridiculous, and is an obvious case of mishandling.

UPS' claim couls hold some water if there was a small dent, or even internal damage... But that Mac is SMASHED.

SUE THEM.
Go to Small Claims Court, and sue their asses for the maximum amount possible. It is likely they won't even show up (3K is small change for them, and hiring a lawyer will be more expensive), so you have a chance of winning by default. If not, the judge will be on your side once you show him the pictures, or the ruined Mac itself. No reasonable person would consider this can happen simply because of "bad packaging".

sblasl
Aug 31, 2007, 12:02 AM
Lesson to be learned; Never, Ever put an Apple product in a HP box!!

pagansoul
Aug 31, 2007, 07:45 AM
Always keep the box of your current computer. Apple packs their products so well you would never find anything to protect your computer better.

petite
Aug 31, 2007, 09:09 AM
It's aluminum. My dad works for Alcoa (they make aluminum) and he's commented on how much they make off apple for their cases.

I'd like to point out that Apple doesn't just use aluminum – they use some heavy duty aircraft grade aluminum. Real tough stuff. This computer has clearly been mistreated (dropped or thrown around). No question about it.

In few weeks I was planning on shipping a Mac Pro between continents.... Now I am pretty scared of doing that. I do have the original box though :confused:

Sdashiki
Aug 31, 2007, 09:15 AM
Always keep the box of your current computer. Apple packs their products so well you would never find anything to protect your computer better.

/signed

mom: "why are you still keeping that damn G5 box in my garage?!"

me: "read this thread here..."

well, actually I sold that G5 in january, but FedEx wasnt going to let me ship it, until i showed them it was all original packaging and foam, they said "alright!"

If you have all the original packaging the box can take quite a beating before even the slightest damage touches the computer. Unless its a stabbing type of damage, they yer f-ed anyway.

FedEx is a "luxury" shipper, you get what you pay for. FYI FedEx and Ground are 2 separate entities. One can not help you with the other in most cases.

xyian
Aug 31, 2007, 09:34 AM
Oh man! I think Apple should consider suing them for mangling one of their pieces of art!
That's seriously wrong. Small claims. There's no doubt that's not due to just insufficient packaging.

gnasher729
Aug 31, 2007, 09:54 AM
Go to Small Claims Court, and sue their asses for the maximum amount possible. It is likely they won't even show up (3K is small change for them, and hiring a lawyer will be more expensive), so you have a chance of winning by default. If not, the judge will be on your side once you show him the pictures, or the ruined Mac itself. No reasonable person would consider this can happen simply because of "bad packaging".

That amount of damage shouldn't even happen to a completely unpacked G5 or MacPro.

suneohair
Aug 31, 2007, 10:09 AM
The BBB (http://bbb.org/) is your friend. If UPS wants to play games file a complaint. I guarantee you will have it resolved in at least a month.

theBB
Aug 31, 2007, 10:20 AM
FedEx actually use a non-affiliated insurance company, and they pay back for damages. Try that with UPS (well, the OP has tried :):):):) - need I say more?).
My roommate some years ago, actually almost a decade ago, had his parents send him a guitar through FedEx from overseas. It arrived broken, but I remember FedEx paid up with just one simple call. I gotta say I was impressed. I hope they are still as nice.

Oh he managed to get his guitar fixed properly at a shop, so all around happy ending... :)

vohdoun
Aug 31, 2007, 04:45 PM
Why has nobody asked this question yet... or have I missed it?

Why was the G5 shipped to someone in Florida? being sold or sent away for repairs? I dunno. :)

chelseasian
Aug 31, 2007, 05:32 PM
i think the lesson I've learnt is to sell not via eBay but Craigslist. I sold my old G4 years ago and the guy came and picked it up in a cab. So that would be an easier solution that shipping (cheaper too) I think. Less hassel to deal with- for both the seller and buyer. he came, i booted the whole system up for his to see, and it's working, He is happy, I am happy. :cool:

fblack
Aug 31, 2007, 06:03 PM
UPS is horrible. I cannot tell you how many times I've received beaten up packages (really the number is too high I lost count). Instead of "what can brown do for you", it should be "what can brown smash for you?" Whenever, I get a survey from a company I purchased from asking me about the experience, I always tell them to please get rid of UPS.

i think the lesson I've learnt is to sell not via eBay but Craigslist. I sold my old G4 years ago and the guy came and picked it up in a cab. So that would be an easier solution that shipping (cheaper too) I think. Less hassel to deal with- for both the seller and buyer. he came, i booted the whole system up for his to see, and it's working, He is happy, I am happy. :cool:

Yea, that's fine if you live in a major metropolitan area, but if you live in a fairly rural area you may not get too many interested local buyers. Believe it or not macs are not universally owned or desired...

timswim78
Aug 31, 2007, 06:34 PM
To answer some questions:

This was a computer that I sold on ebay. The buyer lived in FL.

I have been riding the shipper big time. Today, they told me that my claim had moved from the claims department to the capital review department (whatever that means.) I am supposed to get a decision next week.

My plan is to wait and hear from the shipper. If their decision is not favorable to me, I'll move onto the BBB. After that, I'm not sure if I'll go the route of small claims court or something else. Hopefully neither the BBB or court will be necesary. But, I'm not getting my hopes up. This company has been a real nightmare to deal with thus far.

darthraige
Aug 31, 2007, 08:59 PM
Jeez, if you dropped one of these down the stairs and someone was there, ya probably kill them. lol

termina3
Aug 31, 2007, 09:06 PM
My plan is to wait and hear from the shipper. If their decision is not favorable to me, I'll move onto the BBB. After that, I'm not sure if I'll go the route of small claims court or something else. Hopefully neither the BBB or court will be necesary. But, I'm not getting my hopes up. This company has been a real nightmare to deal with thus far.

Seems like a good plan to me. I had some problems with UPS–not close to as bad–and will probably never use them (if I have a choice) for a few years.

Fearless Leader
Aug 31, 2007, 09:39 PM
My dad emailed the guy who would know. He left for vacation though, so we will get an answer by Tuesday.

Sorry its so slow.

bld44
Aug 31, 2007, 10:03 PM
I will never ship my Mac Pro, ever. Seeing those photos makes me want to cry :(

G4-power
Sep 1, 2007, 06:14 AM
Ouch. That looks bad, really bad. I'd even sit on our G5, it's that sturdy. That looks like they've crushed your computer with tonnes of stuff. Usually the Finnish post or our local "Yellow Express" keep stuff in good condition. But when my brother ordered an iBook G4 from the Apple Store, they shipped it from the Netherlands to Finland, and the box was soaked in some kind of oil. We checked with the postman that the contents were okay, and it wasn't a problem that the box was damaged, but it just made my wonder how the heck can they spill oil on computer boxes...

Macinposh
Sep 3, 2007, 01:04 PM
But it just made my wonder how the heck can they spill oil on computer boxes...


It propably was timswim78´s crushed G5 that had spewed it´s coolants all over the place?

dontwalkhand
Sep 3, 2007, 01:25 PM
Am I the only one getting 404 Not Found errors?

Eidorian
Sep 3, 2007, 01:29 PM
Am I the only one getting 404 Not Found errors?It was working back when the thread was first posted.

SpaceMagic
Sep 3, 2007, 01:30 PM
I am going through the EXACT same problem at the moment.

I sent my G5 via eBay and when the buyer got it, it was as mangled as yours if not more.

Now, after several letters and claim forms (despite paying extra insurance) they say I packed it wrongly. Bull ****! How could they possibly know.

The point is, you need more than dropping to make this damage! This is ridiculous.

Please keep me informed cos I need to find a way to get them back.

suneohair
Sep 3, 2007, 01:40 PM
I would say "If it wasn't packaged well, why did you take my money. If it wasn't packaged well I presume you would be able to provide evidence of that considering you did take my money, which means you found it acceptable to mail my package."

Sdashiki
Sep 4, 2007, 08:45 AM
I would say "If it wasn't packaged well, why did you take my money. If it wasn't packaged well I presume you would be able to provide evidence of that considering you did take my money, which means you found it acceptable to mail my package."

Dont know if this can be attributed to UPS being the "discount" shipper...but ive never seen a YouTube video of a FedEx person throwing a package against a door.

But with FedEX, if its over $500 they will NOT ship it without their approval. Which typically means either original package or let them pack it for you. I can only assume UPS has the same kind of policy.

Its their a$$ when it breaks, so they have to make sure YOU packed it right.

if they let a package go, it is not only assumed but probably set in stone, that it was "OK" to ship as it was.

Ive seen people ship computer monitors in regular boxes with some bubble wrap. UPS then "forces" them to open the package for inspection and they say "We aint shipping that, package it better". I mean, they were adamant about things being packaged like tanks just so it wouldnt be their problem when the beat the crap out of the box.

///alpinepower
Sep 4, 2007, 06:16 PM
The BBB (http://bbb.org/) is your friend. If UPS wants to play games file a complaint. I guarantee you will have it resolved in at least a month.

i would file in small claims court - it's usually $20, and a company like UPS resolves things as soon as they are served. cheap use of time.

dontwalkhand
Sep 4, 2007, 06:30 PM
i would file in small claims court - it's usually $20, and a company like UPS resolves things as soon as they are served. cheap use of time.

Yep, and constitution does state as long as its worth more than $20, you can take them to court ;)

Fearless Leader
Sep 5, 2007, 05:44 PM
Alloy Info. Hope this provides useful


http://wilkinsonsteel.com/Aluminum/5052.htm



5052 is one of the higher strength non-heat-treatable alloys. It has a
high fatigue strength and is a good choice for structures subjected to
excessive vibration. The alloy has excellent corrosion resistance,
particularly in marine atmospheres. The formability of the grade is
excellent and in the annealed condition it offers higher strengths than
1100 or 3003 grades.
- Top - <5052.htm>

Typical Applications
5052 is often used in high strength sheet metal work, marine components,
appliances, fuel and oil tubing.
- Top - <5052.htm>
http://att.macrumors.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=84198&stc=1&d=1189032009