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MacRumors
Sep 26, 2007, 04:03 PM
http://www.macrumors.com/images/macrumorsthreadlogo.gif (http://www.macrumors.com)

The iTunes Store is now offering content from the fall television season, including a number of free episodes (http://phobos.apple.com/WebObjects/MZStore.woa/wa/viewRoom?fcId=264784085&id=37) from Fox.

Despite conflicting reports, NBC's new shows, including Chuck (http://phobos.apple.com/WebObjects/MZStore.woa/wa/viewTVShow?id=262603760) and Journeyman (http://phobos.apple.com/WebObjects/MZStore.woa/wa/viewTVShow?id=262686220), have become available on iTunes. NBC's contract with iTunes expires in December and has not been renewed. As a result, NBC shows will only be available until December of this year.

Apple had originally claimed that NBC's new fall season would not be added to the iTunes Store, but it appears this is not the case.



Article Link (http://www.macrumors.com/2007/09/26/fall-television-shows-on-itunes-including-nbc/)



bluebomberman
Sep 26, 2007, 04:07 PM
Maybe this is solely due to contractual obligations.

If so, I wonder why Apple wouldn't just bury the shows in their listings instead of showing "Journeyman" on the front page.

Ha ze
Sep 26, 2007, 04:08 PM
Someone can correct me, but doesn't the season last through December?
If I purchase a "season" is it going to be the full season or just till through the december episodes?

adrianblaine
Sep 26, 2007, 04:09 PM
Someone can correct me, but doesn't the season last through December?
If I purchase a "season" is it going to be the full season or just till through the december episodes?

The season goes into the spring (May/June), so who knows what will happen with season passes...

BTW
Sep 26, 2007, 04:11 PM
As I've said before Apple and NBC will kiss and make-up. They are both just using the media for leverage. ;)

Peace
Sep 26, 2007, 04:12 PM
Both Journeyman and Chuck are produced by other companies.Not NBC.

jeejeebu
Sep 26, 2007, 04:14 PM
Both Journeyman and Chuck are produced by other companies.Not NBC.

Yep. And considering any NBC shows that are produced by NBC have not shown up, I think Journeyman and Chuck fall outside of this. The test will be if My Name is Earl shows up on Friday.

bluebomberman
Sep 26, 2007, 04:18 PM
Someone can correct me, but doesn't the season last through December?
If I purchase a "season" is it going to be the full season or just till through the december episodes?

I don't think anything's been decided about what to do about season passes that are aborted in the middle.

My understanding is that when December rolls around and there's no deal, all of NBC's back catalog will be pulled off of iTunes.

adrianblaine
Sep 26, 2007, 04:20 PM
Both Journeyman and Chuck are produced by other companies.Not NBC.

They are even listed under the NBC category in iTunes now though. It's all very confusing

abrooks
Sep 26, 2007, 04:20 PM
Yep. And considering any NBC shows that are produced by NBC have not shown up, I think Journeyman and Chuck fall outside of this. The test will be if My Name is Earl shows up on Friday.

Surely Heroes would have turned up by now?

siurpeeman
Sep 26, 2007, 04:23 PM
As I've said before Apple and NBC will kiss and make-up. They are both just using the media for leverage. ;)

if nbc's decision to distribute their digital content through amazon and hulu prove unsuccessful, i'm sure they'll come back to itunes.

Peace
Sep 26, 2007, 04:23 PM
Surely Heroes would have turned up by now?


Heroes is produced by NBC/Universal

abrooks
Sep 26, 2007, 04:26 PM
Heroes is produced by NBC/Universal

And premiered on Monday, so has it arrived on iTunes?

The point Im getting at is, if you're correct and these two programs mentioned in the original post aren't produced by NBC and thus are turning up on iTunes, it proves that Apple are sticking to their word and no NBC content is coming to iTunes.

jeejeebu
Sep 26, 2007, 04:28 PM
And premiered on Monday, so has it arrived on iTunes?

The point Im getting at is, if you're correct and these two programs mentioned in the original post aren't produced by NBC and thus are turning up on iTunes, it proves that Apple are sticking to their word and no NBC content is coming to iTunes.

Heroes has not. My Name is Earl is the only other show on NBC not produced by NBC. (Scrubs, too, but will not premiere for another month.) If My Name is Earl shows up, I would expect that it does depend on the production company, and this isn't just NBC trying to get exposure for new shows.

dvkid
Sep 26, 2007, 04:33 PM
Just because NBC/Universal does not produce Journeyman or Chuck does not mean they wouldn't also control the means in which said content can be released. They have strict stipulations on how and when shows can be released on DVD and the web. This would have had to have been negotiated with the studio that produces these shows long ago and seeing as the NBC Apple tiff didn't occur "long ago" I don't feel that is the case. If the NBC Apple relationship is as sour as they want us to believe than I don't think NBC would be allowing the content to play on the site, let alone permitting the use of the NBC peacock logo and the schedule ("Watch Chuck Mondays at 8 p.m. on NBC" adorns the Chuck page). And the Season Pass availability

It just seems to me like NBC hasn't abandoned Apple quite as thoroughly as we once thought.

abrooks
Sep 26, 2007, 04:36 PM
It just seems to me like NBC hasn't abandoned Apple quite as thoroughly as we once thought.

It is a little bit the other way around. NBC had no intentions of pulling content before December but Apple came out and said "screw you!". Basically saying no content at all unless we come to an agreement, which they haven't...yet :rolleyes:

Peace
Sep 26, 2007, 04:38 PM
It could very well be NBC saying "Hey.We have a contract till December.Put these up or you're in breach of the contract".Apple may have no choice.

MacNut
Sep 26, 2007, 04:40 PM
Just because the shows are not produced by NBC does not mean that they don't own the broadcast rights to the shows. The contract with Apple is all shows owned by NBC.

bob_the_gorilla
Sep 26, 2007, 04:40 PM
The explanation which fits with all of the facts is that these shows are on iTunes because they are not produced by NBC. NBC-produced shows have not turned up, and Apple said they would not.

The original article really ought to be updated to at least reflect the likelihood of this scenario, rather than NBC or Apple having given in.

RidleyGriff
Sep 26, 2007, 04:40 PM
It is a little bit the other way around. NBC had no intentions of pulling content before December but Apple came out and said "screw you!". Basically saying no content at all unless we come to an agreement, which they haven't...yet :rolleyes:

Exactly. In fact, I wouldn't be surprised if Apple uses iTunes to promote the hell out of "Chuck" and "Journeyman" -- to hopefully illustrate to NBC how vital a tool iTunes can be in helping launch new shows.

Rot'nApple
Sep 26, 2007, 04:47 PM
I wonder why Apple wouldn't just bury the shows in their listings instead of showing "Journeyman" on the front page.

You probably had the answer to your question within your question...

"Maybe this is solely due to contractual obligations."

reallynotnick
Sep 26, 2007, 04:52 PM
I think I might just download an episode of Chuck for a good laugh in NBC's face.
Too bad I still think the shows are overpriced for me to just watch them once and never watch them again or care to own them.

Rot'nApple
Sep 26, 2007, 04:56 PM
Exactly. In fact, I wouldn't be surprised if Apple uses iTunes to promote the hell out of "Chuck" and "Journeyman" -- to hopefully illustrate to NBC how vital a tool iTunes can be in helping launch new shows.

Unfortunately, it won't do anygood for me. Out of all the NBC or otherwise named "shows" throughout this post, I have yet to see one of them.

That's not to say I haven't viewed a show produced by either/or NBC / Universal and aired on Fox or something... it's just NBC hasn't been on my viewing radar for a very long time... way longer than this iTune/NBC spat.

jeejeebu
Sep 26, 2007, 05:00 PM
Just because the shows are not produced by NBC does not mean that they don't own the broadcast rights to the shows. The contract with Apple is all shows owned by NBC.
Digital rights are usually retained by the production company. There was a recent contract between ABC and WB which was unique because ABC got digital rights for two years.

john7jr
Sep 26, 2007, 05:13 PM
Despite being aired on NBC, Journeyman is listed as " 2007 Twentieth Century Fox Film Corporation"

No Heros season 2 though... I agree with the pattern. NBC produced shows are gone, but shows produced by other companies are there.

abrooks
Sep 26, 2007, 05:28 PM
No Heros season 2 though... I agree with the pattern. NBC produced shows are gone, but shows produced by other companies are there.

Agreed, the original article should be removed or updated to reflect this. It will only help spread rubbish.

twoodcc
Sep 26, 2007, 05:34 PM
Maybe this is solely due to contractual obligations.

If so, I wonder why Apple wouldn't just bury the shows in their listings instead of showing "Journeyman" on the front page.

yeah i agree. i don't see the point. maybe there's something more behind it?

and where's smallville?

skellener
Sep 26, 2007, 05:41 PM
NBC.com has the new full episode of Heroes. You can always just watch it there.

rdowns
Sep 26, 2007, 05:46 PM
Maybe this is solely due to contractual obligations.

If so, I wonder why Apple wouldn't just bury the shows in their listings instead of showing "Journeyman" on the front page.

Maybe this is solely due to contractual obligations. :D

LizKat
Sep 26, 2007, 05:53 PM
It is a little bit the other way around. NBC had no intentions of pulling content before December but Apple came out and said "screw you!". Basically saying no content at all unless we come to an agreement, which they haven't...yet :rolleyes:

sometimes i really think this was one of those unintended wars. critical mass was attained by mistake and it shroomed.

jburrw
Sep 26, 2007, 05:55 PM
It looks like House, MD might be a casualty of this as well. It is broadcast on FOX, but produced by NBC/Universal. The season premiere was last night, but has not shown up on iTunes today.

ATimson
Sep 26, 2007, 06:11 PM
Despite being aired on NBC, Journeyman is listed as " 2007 Twentieth Century Fox Film Corporation"
Fox the network and Fox the television company share little but the name. (WB and UPN were the same way.)

MacNut
Sep 26, 2007, 06:13 PM
It's all owned by NewsCorp.

Ha ze
Sep 26, 2007, 06:27 PM
It looks like House, MD might be a casualty of this as well. It is broadcast on FOX, but produced by NBC/Universal. The season premiere was last night, but has not shown up on iTunes today.

I would bet that most people thought that it was just NBC broadcasted films, not NBC produced.. at least I know I did.

Are there any other popular shows produced by NBC on other networks?

synth3tik
Sep 26, 2007, 06:53 PM
Too hell with NBC.



It's been 24 hours, come on Fox. Guve me some House

Bosunsfate
Sep 26, 2007, 06:54 PM
NBC.com has the new full episode of Heroes. You can always just watch it there.

Got to this UK site.
http://www.tv-links.co.uk/listings/1/41

You can't download, but everything is commerical free. Plus the divx player is pretty nice.

jburrw
Sep 26, 2007, 06:55 PM
I would bet that most people thought that it was just NBC broadcasted films, not NBC produced.. at least I know I did.

That was my assumption as well.

Bosunsfate
Sep 26, 2007, 06:57 PM
Someone can correct me, but doesn't the season last through December?
If I purchase a "season" is it going to be the full season or just till through the december episodes?

No season pass for Journeyman, which is a bit disappointing. But might mean that it is possible you won't get the full season posted on iTunes.

Which is frustrating as I really liked the pilot and would get the season pass.

bluebomberman
Sep 26, 2007, 07:01 PM
Maybe this is solely due to contractual obligations.

If so, I wonder why Apple wouldn't just bury the shows in their listings instead of showing "Journeyman" on the front page.

You probably had the answer to your question within your question...

"Maybe this is solely due to contractual obligations."

Maybe this is solely due to contractual obligations. :D

Yeah, perhaps so, but I was thinking that they would only be contractually obligated to offer the shows, but not contractually obligated to actively promote the show.

Maybe I'm correlating too much to the iTunes Music Store, where the staff has a lot of editorial pull in determining which artists they promote.

sanford
Sep 26, 2007, 07:06 PM
Apple had originally claimed that NBC's new fall season would not be added to the iTunes Store, but it appears this is not the case.

Read: negotiations underway; the kids will work it out all peaceful like.

Doctor Q
Sep 26, 2007, 07:14 PM
I wonder if either Apple or NBC is going to say something about this, to make clear where the deal stands. I can understand that ongoing negotiations are private, but can't they explain to us which content is covered under the current contract?

offwidafairies
Sep 26, 2007, 07:40 PM
Read: negotiations underway; the kids will work it out all peaceful like.

:( i was looking forward to some more cat fight

Dwight Schrute
Sep 26, 2007, 09:37 PM
Needless to say, I'm VERY disappointed that The Office will no longer be available on iTunes. Considering this article from January 2006...

NBC credits The Office's higher ratings with the show's availability on iTunes. While the number of downloads of The Office do not figure into weekly ratings, the number people watching The Office has increased since the show became available for download. This is pretty big news, because all the networks have been banking on some sort of ratings boost by making their shows available on the internet. At first, it seemed like a gamble that people would try out new shows online and then start watching them, but it seems to have worked. The Office has been huge for NBC on iTunes. It accounts for one-third of all NBC downloads (there are currently 12 NBC shows for sale on iTunes). The people who are downloading shows off the internet are exactly the audience that all the networks are fighting for: the 18-49 demographic.

ABC reports the same bump in ratings for Lost and Desperate Housewives, since they launched on iTunes way back in October. Lost ratings have jumped 14% and DH ratings went up 7%.

...I can't understand how NBC figure to reach more viewers through any other means. They are stupid mutha uckas.

Darthzilla
Sep 26, 2007, 09:38 PM
NBC's player is way too crappy for me.

Looks like if i miss an episode im be getting Heroes via other means. NBC looses my fist .99

Josephkyles
Sep 26, 2007, 10:05 PM
So, If Apple is adding these new shows, does that mean they will add new episodes of existing shows such as The Office?!?! I hope soooo bad they do! I would get a season pass in a second!!

Remixen
Sep 27, 2007, 05:52 AM
Journeyman have a lot of apple stuff in it. He is constantly typing on his iPhone, in 1987 too:p

So maybe they got a deal whit Apple to get all things free, but they have to get Journeyman up on iTunes,:confused:

MrCrowbar
Sep 27, 2007, 07:08 AM
Wow, I didn't know the video quality on the ITMS shows was so bad. Seriously, that's pretty bad. Big file sizes but bad/blurry picture... Even I can do better with Quicktime Pro or Handbrake!

ssmoot
Sep 27, 2007, 09:24 AM
Wow, I didn't know the video quality on the ITMS shows was so bad. Seriously, that's pretty bad. Big file sizes but bad/blurry picture... Even I can do better with Quicktime Pro or Handbrake!

I registered just to reply to this. :-)

I'm not sure what your basis for comparison is. Sure, on manual encodes, with lots of tweaked filters, you may get better, but what's the point of that comparison?

iTMS quality is better than any SD DVR I've owned (ReplayTV 5040, DirecTV Dual-DVR, DishDVR). Better than any MythTV boxen I've built (Plextor?420 MPEG4/USB first, then dual PVR150's in the second). Way better than XBox Live Marketplace SD content, and about equal to the "HD" content offered there as well (higher-res, but really lousy, low bitrate stuff).

It's 9 times out of 10 better than the available XviDs of comparative file size.

Are we looking at the same thing? Or maybe you're looking at a particularly bad encode for a specific show or episode?

jeejeebu
Sep 28, 2007, 02:21 PM
Well, My Name is Earl is up now, while The Office (and every other NBC show) is not, so I would say that confirms that the contract issues have to do with the production company, not the distributor.

NightStorm
Sep 28, 2007, 02:31 PM
Well, My Name is Earl is up now, while The Office (and every other NBC show) is not, so I would say that confirms that the contract issues have to do with the production company, not the distributor.
Figures, now I have to decide if I'm going to get My Name Is Earl from iTunes, or just say screw you to NBC entirely. Hmm....

gburbidge
Sep 28, 2007, 04:57 PM
Hey All,

I waited too long? Does anyone know why the Chuck season pass is no longer available? I decided I really liked the pilot, so I was going to get a season pass but it's not up there anymore, now it's the single episodes.

I'd like to get passes to big shots and dirty sexy money too but neither of those shows have hit itunes. Oddly, Private Practice hasn't gone up there even though grey's anatomy does so well in the store. Anyways, anyone have any ideas what happened to the chuck season pass?

I'd prefer to hear from the people who comments tend towards different studios make different results, rather than that "nbc is trying to screw itunes with new material" type posts.

jeejeebu
Sep 28, 2007, 05:10 PM
The only thing I can think of is that maybe iTunes is waiting to see if there really will be a full season (in general, not just available to iTunes) to offer season passes? I checked several new shows and none of them have the season pass option.

Peace
Sep 28, 2007, 05:11 PM
I'm guessing NBC bought the rights from Warner Entertainment.Thus no more season pass.

Just like Journeyman.It's currently being shown on the SciFi Network so it's destined to be dropped by NBC and they don't care about that since NBC gets a lot more revenue from commercials through prime time networks than they do through SciFi channel..

This is ALL about commercial exposure and NBC's "I've got a big one" mentality .Plain and simple.



It could also be because NBC has decided to air all episodes on NBC and Apple doesn't want to sell a season pass when they know they can't fulfill the obligation.

jeejeebu
Sep 28, 2007, 05:24 PM
I'm guessing NBC bought the rights from Warner Entertainment.Thus no more season pass.
Not likely.

Plus, My Name is Earl has a season pass. I think it's most likely that iTunes is waiting to see which new shows actually get full season orders to offer season passes.

Peace
Sep 28, 2007, 05:29 PM
Not likely.

Plus, My Name is Earl has a season pass. I think it's most likely that iTunes is waiting to see which new shows actually get full season orders to offer season passes.

My Name Is Earl is a 20th Century Fox Production.It doesn't belong to NBC.

Warner Brothers produces Chuck. and has had close ties to Universal over the years.

jeejeebu
Sep 28, 2007, 05:31 PM
My Name Is Earl is a 20th Century Fox Production.It doesn't belong to NBC.

Warner Brothers produces Chuck. and has had close ties to Universal over the years.
Therefore Chuck does not belong to NBC either. No new shows have season passes available.

artalliance
Sep 28, 2007, 05:42 PM
Just like Journeyman.It's currently being shown on the SciFi Network so it's destined to be dropped by NBC and they don't care about that since NBC gets a lot more revenue from commercials through prime time networks than they do through SciFi channel..
[/edit]

SciFi Network is owned by NBC/Universal, so NBC is using SciFi as a repeat platform for all their new SciFi-themed shows like Journeyman and Bionic Woman. They did the same thing last year with Heros.

JeffDM
Sep 29, 2007, 10:20 PM
It is a little bit the other way around. NBC had no intentions of pulling content before December but Apple came out and said "screw you!". Basically saying no content at all unless we come to an agreement, which they haven't...yet :rolleyes:

The public statements were probably little more than sleazy negotiation tactics, the negotiations don't go your way, you complain to the public. And they both spoon feed the public so little information that the impression they give is probably the opposite of what's really going on.

NBC.com has the new full episode of Heroes. You can always just watch it there.

That's hardly the ideal thing for everyone. And you have to watch it on your computer on a stable high speed internet service. If you're poaching WiFi or even legitimately using a WiFi signal on the go that happens to be weak, you might not be able to do that, however, if you've downloaded it, you just play the file in your player or notebook without buffering problems, dropped or corrupted frames. The plans I've heard about is that after a week, NBC quits hosting it, so you have to keep up rather than allowing you to catch up. That's not good for NBC either because a person that's not allowed to catch up to the current episode may as not watch current episodes either.

jeejeebu
Sep 29, 2007, 11:23 PM
That's hardly the ideal thing for everyone. And you have to watch it on your computer on a stable high speed internet service. If you're poaching WiFi or even legitimately using a WiFi signal on the go that happens to be weak, you might not be able to do that, however, if you've downloaded it, you just play the file in your player or notebook without buffering problems, dropped or corrupted frames. The plans I've heard about is that after a week, NBC quits hosting it, so you have to keep up rather than allowing you to catch up. That's not good for NBC either because a person that's not allowed to catch up to the current episode may as not watch current episodes either.

NBC is actually going to launch a new download site for their shows. You have to download with ["limited"] commercials and I believe there is something about the download expiring after two days, so you can always have the "freshest" commercials. But it does allow offline viewing and I believe episodes will stay up for more than a week. They are supposed to launch sometime in October. And, of course, it's free.

Edit: Also, I believe they are planning on eventually having iPod formatted shows avaiable, but probably not right away.