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seany916
Jan 8, 2008, 08:57 AM
We can always install them later, but why not have it as a BTO option? Are they still waiting for the "war" to end? The store didn't show any BR or HD-DVD options. It is currently down right now. Who knows...



acearchie
Jan 8, 2008, 09:23 AM
Because just maybe they havent finalized a software update that supports bluy ray in leopard?

deathshrub
Jan 8, 2008, 09:53 AM
Why don't you wait until next week's Stevenote before you starting complaining?

:mad::rolleyes:

drrich2
Jan 8, 2008, 02:50 PM
I question how great the demand is for Blu-ray. Yes, there's strong interest, but consider:

1.) Expensive drive.

2.) Expensive media - too expensive for most routine back up procedures, and who knows how durable it'll be over time?

3.) Once you've burned a disc, do you know anyone else who can use it yet?

With time market penetration will grow, but I'm not sure they're at enough critical mass to make it worthwhile. Apple has a lot of sticks in the fire to occupy itself.

My 2 cents.

Richard.

newtech
Jan 8, 2008, 03:02 PM
My $0.02...

Blu-Ray will require some OS support, likely to be in 10.5.2. Since 10.5.2 will likely also have references to unreleased hardware ( other than new MP ), Blu-Ray will still be under wraps till the new hardware debuts.

PlaceofDis
Jan 8, 2008, 03:09 PM
it makes no sense to offer blu-ray at this point. there is some demand, yes. but the 'battle' between formats isn't over, and it doesn't bring anything to the market thats 'needed'

its more of a connivence format than anything imo.

mcarnes
Jan 8, 2008, 03:18 PM
I dunno, I think there is some demand. The Blu-Ray Forum (http://forum.blu-ray.com/) is pretty active (some threads get like 800 posts in one day). It is largely fan boy based, but so is MR...

sal
Jan 8, 2008, 03:23 PM
I question how great the demand is for Blu-ray. Yes, there's strong interest, but consider:

1.) Expensive drive.

2.) Expensive media - too expensive for most routine back up procedures, and who knows how durable it'll be over time?

3.) Once you've burned a disc, do you know anyone else who can use it yet?

hit the nail on the head. There is a demand for it. But in all seriousness, I doubt many here would add that option if it were made available because of it's expense.

I do mostly video work and although I'd love to deliver in a bluray format, it's currently too expensive. God forbid my client tells me they have HDDVD. :eek:

It's also worth mentioning that FCPstudio2 is not even bluray aware yet. meaning I can't author a bluray disc with dvdstudio pro. So a bluray burner would just be collecting dust in my machine at this point in the game.

Once this 'battle is over', technology becomes affordable, pro apps can author bluray, will there be a high demand for this option. Until then, don't hold your breath.

OnePumpChump
Jan 8, 2008, 03:36 PM
As far as the war is concerned, with Warner Brothers signing on to release just Blu-ray, how much longer is the war going to last anyway. There is 2 major companies left that release HD, and one of those still release in both formats.

UltraNEO*
Jan 8, 2008, 03:56 PM
If someone wishes to use the format for backup, it won't matter
who wins the media war and it won't matter if other's ain't supporting the format.

As far as Blu-Ray media goes, it's actually dirt cheap here,
if you compare the price per GB verses DVD-R & DVD DL media.

CWallace
Jan 8, 2008, 04:00 PM
Apple might be waiting for prices to come down. Most Blu-Ray/HD-DVD combi-readers are around $300+. Sony just announced a $200 player, but I believe it is Blu-Ray only.

toke lahti
Jan 8, 2008, 04:01 PM
Comparing to dvd-r when it arrived to G5, br is quite affordable right now. Then apple was ahead of others, now it isn't.

sal
Jan 8, 2008, 04:03 PM
If someone wished to use the format for backup, it won't matter who wins the media war and it won't matter if other's ain't supporting the format. As far as Blu-Ray media goes, it's actually dirt cheap here, if you compare the price per GB verses DVD-R & DVD DL media.
how much does a bluray disc cost in japan?(i assume this is where you live)

for me, backing up to an external drive(which are also cheapnowadays) is not only cheaper than backing up to disc but it's more convenient.

I think many would agree with me.

toke lahti
Jan 8, 2008, 04:16 PM
Apple might be waiting for prices to come down. Most Blu-Ray/HD-DVD combi-readers are around $300+. Sony just announced a $200 player, but I believe it is Blu-Ray only.

LG GGW-H20L is already under $300...

UltraNEO*
Jan 8, 2008, 04:18 PM
how much does a bluray disc cost in japan?(i assume this is where you live)

for me, backing up to an external drive(which are also cheapnowadays) is not only cheaper than backing up to disc but it's more convenient.

I think many would agree with me.

Depending on the brand, they vary from 1700yen to 5000yen. You have the option of 25Gb or 50Gb per disk, though TDK are planning to bring out 100GB discs, whether it'll appear, well.. who knows.. not heard anything about them yet.

CWallace
Jan 8, 2008, 04:18 PM
LG GGW-H20L is already under $300...

And I see LiteOn has one for $199 at Newegg.com.

Some think Apple pushed the Mac Pro update out early to help the stock price. Maybe we'll see more product and accessories announced at MacWorld.

Eraserhead
Jan 8, 2008, 04:26 PM
Blu-Ray only became sensible a week ago with the Warner deal, unless Apple knew about that in advance there was nothing they could do to add it, I could possibly see it as a BTO option at MacWorld.

toke lahti
Jan 8, 2008, 04:53 PM
Apple's delay can't have anything to do with bd-drives' street prices.
In professional post production $k's are thrown all the time, one for raid, couple to the memory, etc. HD video tapes cost a whole lot more than bd-disks and you'll have to use them even for "daylies" if there's no other options.

How could any professional talk about "professional video" in 2008 without bd-authoring?
Apple's solution now is "use windows".

Hope this changes after a week...

Lyra
Jan 8, 2008, 05:05 PM
Seriously, I have a hard time understanding why we STILL don't have BluRay in the Macs...

By now, we should all have them as standard part of the main product line for the MacPro.

But we don't even have an option to have one as a build to order.

It's very strange considering that Apple, and Disney had a few good ideas in the past and that somehow they should have had this in order a long time ago. Most of all, they should have gone with the promos they used to.

Disney packages included in the macs. Why not do some cool promo now? Have the Pixar BluRay disc included in the top model with BluRay drives?

Do something to show that Apple isn't lagging behind!!!

They don't update their product lines fast enough and when they do, they're just not that much ahead...

On a different note... who else feels it's time to invent new plugs for mini jacks and phono plugs for TVs etc. I know HDMI is one of the new ways to do things, but stuff like EuroScart is terrible, S-VHS is horrible, etc...

Just a thought...

Other than the lack of BluRay, if I was rich I'd get my self one of these new beasts...
;)

newtech
Jan 8, 2008, 05:09 PM
Paramount too is rumored to be ready to jump ship on HD-DVD in favor of Blu-Ray. Wait and see what 10.5.2 brings it may be very close at hand.

astrostu
Jan 8, 2008, 05:12 PM
I agree that at the very least there should be a BTO option (I wouldn't get it, but I plan on it within 1-2 years) for those that want/need it now.

They may possibly add this after NAB '08 or WWDC '08, though the likelihood of Apple adding something to a product that was "just" updated within 4-7 months is unlikely given their track record with the MPs the last 2 years.

toke lahti
Jan 8, 2008, 05:48 PM
They may possibly add this after NAB '08 or WWDC '08, though the likelihood of Apple adding something to a product that was "just" updated within 4-7 months is unlikely given their track record with the MPs the last 2 years.

Raid card was a "silent update" between upgrades. Let's hope bd-drive will be also...

Madhawk
Jan 8, 2008, 06:07 PM
Blu-Ray is still too expensive, check what happened with playstation 3. They had to bring the price down to sell more units.

Imagine what the price of the Mac Pro would be with a Blu-Ray drive.
I don't think Apple is ready to jump on the bandwagon...;)
Maybe later in 2008...

Lyra
Jan 8, 2008, 06:08 PM
Funny how, a lot of people want these BluRay drives in their macs, and yet Apple isn't responding... Stevo Jobso, did say some time ago that they would support BluRay, but thus far, I see nothing.

Yet Toast has a section that allows the Mac to Burn BluRay discs, but I don't even know which burner to buy?

Is there something out there that is BluRay and Mac compatible? Or is ANYTHING with FireWire or USB2 compatible with the mac?

Oh one last dumb question : LightScribe... does it use ink to print on discs? And if so, where do you refill the cartridges? or is this another technology?

astrostu
Jan 8, 2008, 06:08 PM
Raid card was a "silent update" between upgrades. Let's hope bd-drive will be also...

Yeah, but it was August '06 to a silent update in April '07 ... 10 months. As I said, it could happen, I just don't see it as too likely given Apple's update frequency, silent or otherwise.

Lyra
Jan 8, 2008, 06:15 PM
Blu-Ray is still too expensive, check what happened with playstation 3. They had to bring the price down to sell more units.

Imagine what the price of the Mac Pro would be with a Blu-Ray drive.
I don't think Apple is ready to jump on the bandwagon...;)
Maybe later in 2008...

But if you look at the prices on some standalone BluRay, I don't see why Apple can't offer it as a built to order option... I mean they stuff the machines with so much high tech stuff, how about adding something that can at least give us some form of enjoyment watching Blade Runner on BluRay on a the biggest Apple Screen or a 50 inch LED Screen.... ANYTHING....

Yeah... I know, moaning and bitching about it won't make Apple change their minds... I just think their computers are lagging in many ways...

I mean we can see Laptops with HD drives... why oh WHY doesn't apple have this?

CWallace
Jan 8, 2008, 07:28 PM
They may be waiting for 10.5.2 and a revision of the DVD player that supports Blu-Ray playback.

synth3tik
Jan 8, 2008, 07:29 PM
Personally I would not want to be buying any blu ray or HD DVD right now. Have to let them fight it out on which one will be standard, then I might think about a HD drive.

CWallace
Jan 8, 2008, 07:35 PM
Personally I would not want to be buying any blu ray or HD DVD right now. Have to let them fight it out on which one will be standard, then I might think about a HD drive.

Blu-Ray is just about ready to win that battle, at least in terms of studio releases. New Line just went Blu-Ray exclusive today, which leaves only two (?) studios supporting HD-DVD: Paramount and Dreamworks.

And Paramount is rumored to be leaving, as well.

newtech
Jan 8, 2008, 07:36 PM
As the 10.5.2 update is said to weigh in at 300MB, I'd say there are a lot of things on the horizon. It would be suprising if Blu-Ray wasn't part of that package.

ethernet76
Jan 8, 2008, 07:39 PM
It doesn't make sense to offer it.

It'd make sense on a portable, but I'd venture to guess very few people watch movies on a mac pro.

CWallace
Jan 8, 2008, 08:03 PM
It doesn't make sense to offer it.

It'd make sense on a portable, but I'd venture to guess very few people watch movies on a mac pro.

I would think it would look pretty nice on a 23" or 30" ACD...

Lyra
Jan 8, 2008, 08:03 PM
See....

They may just be prototypes, but I'm telling ya....

THIS is what apple should be doing :

http://www.engadget.com/2008/01/08/toshibas-portable-hd-dvd-player-prototypes/

AND they have HD-DVD drives...

leoz
Jan 8, 2008, 10:50 PM
I won't buy a new Mac until it supports Blu-ray. My movie files are often over size. Here is an external drive with Mac support - LaCie d2 External Blu-Ray, DVD, CD Writer - USB2.0 & FireWire. It is a bit expensive but it is a step in the right direction.

toke lahti
Jan 9, 2008, 12:17 AM
Blu-Ray is still too expensive, check what happened with playstation 3. They had to bring the price down to sell more units.
One pretty big difference: ps3 is not marketed as professional workstation.
Imagine what the price of the Mac Pro would be with a Blu-Ray drive.
I don't think Apple is ready to jump on the bandwagon...;)
Maybe later in 2008...
You can already BTO MP to cost more than $20k. How significant is another $200-$300 to bd/hddvd-combo? Many people throw 3 times more to raid card.

Blogger
Jan 9, 2008, 02:58 AM
See....

They may just be prototypes, but I'm telling ya....

THIS is what apple should be doing :

http://www.engadget.com/2008/01/08/toshibas-portable-hd-dvd-player-prototypes/

AND they have HD-DVD drives...

I'm sorry, but you've got to be kidding. What a load of Crap.

LethalWolfe
Jan 9, 2008, 03:20 AM
I don't think Apple will offer Blu-Ray drives until they release Mac hardware and software that is HDCP compliant (this means disc drives, video cards, displays, and OS/Blu-Ray DVD player software). If Apple released Blu-Ray machines that were essentially write-only (in that they wouldn't properly play back Blu-Ray movies) I think people would be pissed and rightfully so.


Lethal

Eraserhead
Jan 9, 2008, 03:21 AM
Blu Ray became sensible to release a few days ago.

You will have to give time for Apple to setup a contract with a source for the drives and get them to their manufacturing plant so they can be included in Mac Pro's. Then they have to get protected path to be supported by the software, and the Apple displays. Some patience is required for this one ;).

EDIT: LethalWolfe puts it better, but I am a drone after all :p.

Lyra
Jan 9, 2008, 04:54 AM
I'm sorry, but you've got to be kidding. What a load of Crap.

Well at least you're polite and apologize before you insult my post... ;)

But, honestly I'm not commenting on the design, but the fact that they try to make something new and different. I just miss Apple's innovative designs and awesome power.

S'all...

;)

Blogger
Jan 9, 2008, 05:04 AM
Fair enough, and nicely said!

toke lahti
Jan 9, 2008, 05:11 AM
Blu Ray became sensible to release a few days ago.
Maybe offering bd to consumers became sensible for Apple only few days ago.
Mut this forum is about Apple's professional workstation which is essentially marketed for "creative pro"s.
And creative video pro's do have to be able to author hd videos...

Eraserhead
Jan 9, 2008, 06:38 AM
Maybe offering bd to consumers became sensible for Apple only few days ago.
Mut this forum is about Apple's professional workstation which is essentially marketed for "creative pro"s.
And creative video pro's do have to be able to author hd videos...

Fair point. Then they can buy a drive separately (http://fastmac.com/slim_bluray.php)then, the Mac Pro has two CD drive slots after all ;).

toke lahti
Jan 9, 2008, 06:57 AM
Fair point. Then they can buy a drive separately (http://fastmac.com/slim_bluray.php)then, the Mac Pro has two CD drive slots after all ;).
Too bad that software that everybody uses (dvd studio pro) comes also from Apple and since Apple doesn't want to support bd, there's no help from hardware without supporting software.
And if the whole hardware chain does not support hdcp, there's no help if one chain supports it.
So you can't watch what you're authoring...

Eraserhead
Jan 9, 2008, 06:59 AM
Toast works.

sal
Jan 9, 2008, 02:45 PM
Toast works.

and? what good is a burning utility when apple's pro application(dvd studio pro) can't author?

I guess they should probably rename the software. Bluray studio pro? or bluray/HDDVD studio pro?

granted, if I knew dvd studio pro supported the authoring of bluray discs, I'd probably be a bit more ticked off that mac pros weren't shipping with a bluray burner. But right now, even if there was a bluray burner option, there's nothing useful I can do with it.

I guess I could go ahead and buy CS3 since adob'es encore supports authoring HD discs.

So maybe this is calculated move on apples part. If they released bluray burners today, without their own software supporting it, people will flock to adobe. I can understand why apple might be holding back.

At this point in time, it's not in apple's best interest to release a bluray burner with their mac pro.

Blogger
Jan 10, 2008, 12:17 AM
At this point in time, it's not in apple's best interest to release a bluray burner with their mac pro.[/B]

Perhaps all will be revealed on Tuesday.

HDproducer
Jan 10, 2008, 12:58 AM
FCP has been an billed as an HD option for a long time now, and I think apple needs to get some HD distribution option quick. DVDSP has an option for "blue laser" I have not had the opportunity to use it. I have buned DVD-5 with h264 HD content on it that looks great and plays on the Toshiba HD DVD players. I almost bought one just for that reason, glad I didn't.

Maybe 10.5.2 will support blu, and the special announcement on the 16 will be DVDSP 5. Phenomenon seems more likely, but that isn't exactly super secret. DVDSP didn't get the big update when FCS 2 came out so it is due. Then people could buy the format drive of their choice.

There is a lot more going on with the Hi Def disks, that DVDSP will need a significant overhaul.

As far as Warners move and the end to the format war, this would have no bearing on the new MP release. Lets just be thankful Apple didn't wait until there was a winner to release the new MP.

toke lahti
Jan 10, 2008, 03:39 AM
and?I guess I could go ahead and buy CS3 since adob'es encore supports authoring HD discs.
Can bd-videos be authored with cs3 in osX?

Just hoping that Apple doesn't try to be so bold that they will never support hd optical disks saying that "quicktime downloadables" are better choise...

peterjun
Jan 10, 2008, 04:51 AM
I just don't see a good reason to spend $$$ on a blu ray drive right now. If you want to backup large files get an external hardrive... If you own a mac pro I'm pretty sure you already own a HDTV with blu ray capabilities (ps3?). I can't watch movies on computer screens but thats just my personal opinion.

HDproducer
Jan 10, 2008, 01:06 PM
Can bd-videos be authored with cs3 in osX?

Just hoping that Apple doesn't try to be so bold that they will never support hd optical disks saying that "quicktime downloadables" are better choise...

That would stink. I don't think that would happen the larger disks are still better. FCS 3 could come on one disk.

And the downloadable thing is still too far away. I think that will happen some day but not yet. For the mainstream population anyway. Most of us will rent movies next week just for the novelty of it. But they don't even have the SD moveis at DVD quality yet, so I don't think they will be offering downloadable 1080p next week. The 24 hour rental would be over before the movie could finish the download.:eek:

HDproducer
Jan 10, 2008, 01:14 PM
I just don't see a good reason to spend $$$ on a blu ray drive right now. If you want to backup large files get an external hardrive... If you own a mac pro I'm pretty sure you already own a HDTV with blu ray capabilities (ps3?). I can't watch movies on computer screens but thats just my personal opinion.

I like the idea of backing up a project onto a disk that I can then store in a file folder. I do a lot of commercials and industrial work in HDV. Most of my projects would fit onto a 50GB disk. Then I could put it in the same file folder as the original contract, script, and anything else. I already have five external drives and my 750GB internal is full of old projects. It would just be easier for me to archive things to disk rather than having even more HD laying around. Hook me up with FC Server and 10TB and I would be a very happy camper and never burn to disk.

sal
Jan 10, 2008, 02:01 PM
Can bd-videos be authored with cs3 in osX?
Yes, cs3 is the same on both pc and mac.

Today, you could buy a bluray burner, install it on your mac pro(even on your MBP), get cs3 and burn bluray discs from HDV content. But I don't know if you'll have enough money left over to get bluray discs :p

...or you can wait for the prices to come down so apple(and their software) can support it.

Spanky Deluxe
Jan 10, 2008, 06:47 PM
There's no point in including a Blu-Ray reader/writer until Apple releases a Bluray compatible version of DVD Player and until Mac Pros become HDCP compliant and so do ACDs.

The thing is that right now most software needs at most 2 DVDs and its a darned sight cheaper to manufacture two DVDs than a Bluray disk. Games are the same, we just don't need that much storage on optical disks right now unless you're talking high definition video which editors would usually require to transfer in uncompressed format and wouldn't fit on a Bluray disk anyway.

If I had to get a large amount of data from A to B regularly I'd probably use a portable hard drive.

HD Shooter
Jan 10, 2008, 10:20 PM
Long time lurker first time poster.

FCP was "HD" allegedly since 4.5. I run FCS2 on both my four year old G5s. I can edit fine but redering and compressing is S L O W. It was great to get the update (penryn) early but I will no way buy new systems until I can burn BD (via DVDSP).

Do whatever the h$ll it takes already! I don't want to watch a movie on my computer I want to DELIVER 1080P BD from my 1080P camera.

It kills me to see what compressing down to DVD will do to breathtaking footage! How many butt nuts out there currently own an HD camcorder of some type. This is not just for pros although we will be the early adopters here.

I wanted to be the first on my block to offer BLURAY delivery and charge a HUGE premium for it. There are people on the cutting edge who will pay.

It is really quite rediculous that apple has made us wait this long. Why can ADOBE do it on Mac systems and not MAC?

I don't want to learn/teach and new editng software so I am stuck and frustrated at this point. All I can do is hope that the 15th we get what we need.

HDproducer
Jan 10, 2008, 11:14 PM
Long time lurker first time poster.

FCP was "HD" allegedly since 4.5. I run FCS2 on both my four year old G5s. I can edit fine but redering and compressing is S L O W. It was great to get the update (penryn) early but I will no way buy new systems until I can burn BD (via DVDSP).

Do whatever the h$ll it takes already! I don't want to watch a movie on my computer I want to DELIVER 1080P BD from my 1080P camera.

It kills me to see what compressing down to DVD will do to breathtaking footage! How many butt nuts out there currently own an HD camcorder of some type. This is not just for pros although we will be the early adopters here.

I wanted to be the first on my block to offer BLURAY delivery and charge a HUGE premium for it. There are people on the cutting edge who will pay.

It is really quite rediculous that apple has made us wait this long. Why can ADOBE do it on Mac systems and not MAC?

I don't want to learn/teach and new editng software so I am stuck and frustrated at this point. All I can do is hope that the 15th we get what we need.

Brother I feel your pain!

I know it is a bitter pill, but HD footage on a DVD-5 looks great on a toshiba HD DVD player.

You can't get much on a disk, but people will pay HUGE.

HD Shooter
Jan 10, 2008, 11:22 PM
I did try a few times to accomplish the HD DVD burn. Long and painfull. I must say after I RTFM and got it down DVDSP was ahead of its time on this.

All the reading I did on the various forums led me to believe the DVDSP burned disks (HD DVD) were not ready for prime time. THerefore my business model would have had issues.

Plus BLURAY just sounds sexier :)

HD

toke lahti
Jan 11, 2008, 07:08 AM
Yes, cs3 is the same on both pc and mac.
So the situation is mad, you can author bd-video on MP with adobe's software, but there's no way to watch that authored content in OsX.
My understanding is also that you can't use boot camp to watch bd movies, since Apple's hardware does not support hdcp. Is it so?
There's no point in including a Blu-Ray reader/writer until Apple releases a Bluray compatible version of DVD Player and until Mac Pros become HDCP compliant and so do ACDs.
Exactly!

And if Apple can't update the whole line in same instant, they should start somewhere. Windoze hardware and software makers have already done this last year or before.

Apple hasn't done any of that yet and the usual secresy leave us in the dark about future. If Apple does not include hdcp to their graphics card drivers, there's nothing that other software of hardware companies can do.

Uncertainity is the worst thing. If Apple is not going to hdcp/brd route, they should at least announce that, so I could buy other hardware and software than OsX & Mac. I'd like to keep all things OsX & FCS, but if it's not possible, I need to know that.

I'm starting a post production of documentary which will be released as digital cinema, hd & sd tv. I can barely wait for another week and then I should update to FCS2 to start color correcting & making graphics. If I need CS3 for authoring and standalone bd player / ps3 / windows equipment, my budget might not be enough and then I have to reconsider updating FCS.
I'm also interested to buy new graphics adapter to my old MP, but without knowing its possible future support for hdcp, I can't buy it. (Heck, nobody even knows if new adapters work with old MP. So much for upgradability...)

Apple might do same thing with hdcp/bd than with xraid update. Nobody's buing badly outdated xraid, because after a couple of years you can't get pata disks anymore with cost effective price / speed / size ratio, so Apple can just say that there's no demand for it.
Same thing could happen with authoring / watching bd, if everybody first need to buy windoze equipment, and Apple releases their bd /hdcp support too late, people might not invest again to OsX equipment so there will be no demand for it.
If I had to get a large amount of data from A to B regularly I'd probably use a portable hard drive.
Like everybody does. That doesn't help for limited small scale distribution.
Or would you buy 100 hdd's and go to install them to your client's clients' computers and offer support for playbacking the content?
Hard drive is no good for small scale archiving in video business.
Projects are too big for Time Machine, hard drives are too unreliable to keep offline on shelf for years and some hardware / software / human error can always delete files on online disc. This can't happen with write once optical storage.

Consultant
Jan 11, 2008, 08:59 AM
Just buy Blu-Ray burner and install it. Costs is around $250 on sale.

HDproducer
Jan 11, 2008, 10:05 AM
I did try a few times to accomplish the HD DVD burn. Long and painfull. I must say after I RTFM and got it down DVDSP was ahead of its time on this.

All the reading I did on the various forums led me to believe the DVDSP burned disks (HD DVD) were not ready for prime time. Therefore my business model would have had issues.

Plus BLURAY just sounds sexier :)

HD

Sorry, but what is "RTFM" read the _____ manual?

True about the disks not being ready for prime time, but very little in the High Def. DVD world is. I remember starting out with SD DVDs and there were the same issues.

I don't know what types of projects you work on, but I have found the DVDSP HD DVD (blu-ray IS MUCH sexier) to work rather well. I lot of my projects are promotional dvds. I deliver one HD disk and supply the player, for the client to use "in house". The DVDs for distribution are all still SD. And probably will be for still some time. This gives the client the oppertunity to show off in HD, and a leave behind that is ready for "Prime Time" Even a small project, the added cost of buying a player is worth it for the client.

I have been very careful, to let clients know that HD DVD and blu-ray are still battleing in out, and the player my be obsilet. But because it is for a specific purpose, the cost is still justifiable.

By using the h.264 codec, once blu-ray is an option I just make a new disk and I don't have to re-encode.