PDA

View Full Version : New Cases, Faster Performance


arn
May 13, 2002, 07:44 PM
MacOS Rumors (http://www.macosrumors.com/) provides some hints towards markedly improved performance jumps by MacWorld NY, as well as new cases:

We can't promise multi-processor 2GHz G5s, but we can promise a performance leap of more than 100% in processing speed alone over the existing PowerMac....and major leaps in almost every category on the motherboard.

(towards the bottom of the page)

Catfish_Man
May 13, 2002, 07:51 PM
...how MOSR gets its info, don't you? They write a bunch of random rumorlike things down, put them on a dart board, then toss darts to see which they post. Still, if it's true, that'll be pretty cool.

Macmaniac
May 13, 2002, 07:52 PM
We can only wonder with this one. If this is true we may be into some big upgrades at MWNY. Looks like the G4 has lots of life in it.

arn
May 13, 2002, 07:58 PM
Originally posted by Catfish_Man
...how MOSR gets its info, don't you? They write a bunch of random rumorlike things down, put them on a dart board, then toss darts to see which they post. Still, if it's true, that'll be pretty cool.

I don't judge 'em... I just link 'em.... :)

arn

Mr. Anderson
May 13, 2002, 08:22 PM
Originally posted by arn
We can't promise multi-processor 2GHz G5s, but we can promise a performance leap of more than 100% in processing speed alone over the existing PowerMac....and major leaps in almost every category on the motherboard.

More than 100% over the current processing speed would give us 2GHz+ G4s and add to that bus/memory/mobo increases we might even have a CPU that could go head to head with the best of the Intel/AMD world. I find it strange though, that this is the first I've heard of G4s at this speed.

Tomorrow will set the tone. I don't see G3s in the server, even if IBM has faster CPUs, but it would be uprecedented if Apple surprised and dissapointed us.

Hemingray
May 13, 2002, 08:30 PM
Well, every time MOSR languishes for two weeks, they certainly come back with a bang don't they. ;)

I'm looking forward to July.

GetSome681
May 13, 2002, 08:30 PM
Originally posted by dukestreet


More than 100% over the current processing speed would give us 2GHz+ G4s and add to that bus/memory/mobo increases we might even have a CPU that could go head to head with the best of the Intel/AMD world. I find it strange though, that this is the first I've heard of G4s at this speed.

Tomorrow will set the tone. I don't see G3s in the server, even if IBM has faster CPUs, but it would be uprecedented if Apple surprised and dissapointed us.

I think the 100% isn't meant in terms of pure clockspeed, but rather the overall increase in performance brought upon by an increase in clock speed coupled with mobo improvements (ie - ddr, etc.). Maybe I'm wrong?...at least it would be nice to hope so.

MacManiac1224
May 13, 2002, 08:44 PM
100% is a big move, i am thinking G5, even though i doubt it, i don't think a DP 1.4Ghz is going to give a 100% boost, even though it does have a fast motherboard. What about 1.0ghz, 1.2ghz, 1.4ghz, G4's, and maybe a 1.6Ghz G5? what do you guys thinks?

dongmin
May 13, 2002, 08:50 PM
we can promise a performance leap of more than 100% in processing speed alone over the existing PowerMac....and major leaps in almost every category on the motherboard.

Great, they're "promising." That means it's a definite. We're beyond just rumors here. We're talking about gospel, and MOSR is leading us to the promised land. Haleluyah.

So does this mean that we can sue MOSR for emotional damage if the Powermacs come in at 1.4 ghz instead of 2.0?

TyleRomeo
May 13, 2002, 08:51 PM
MacManiac1224 youre not getting that 1.6 G5
I know we all want G5 but its not happening this July.
If apple were to release a single G5 as the top PM then they could sell it for $4000+ and you people would go out and kill for them.

people be reasonable
wait till january.

lets all hope that we see those dual 1.4 GHZ g4s. for $3300 with new mobo, ddr, USB and Firrwire 2, A BRAND NEW SUPERDRIVE, and who know if we'll see the NVIDIA 128MB card, ohh and throw in an ATA 133 120 GB HD and blue tooth, NOW ALL THIS IS AMAZING. Give me this comp right now.

G4scott
May 13, 2002, 09:06 PM
I think that MOSR is a somewhat creditable source, it just depends on where they get their info... If this is true, it's great news for us Macophiles... This is what Apple needs to compete with the intel world...

upthereapple
May 13, 2002, 09:10 PM
they mentioned new cases...

i tried showing that in the my Quick Lead post. Quicklead, rather than Quicksilver!!!

----
a 12 year old boy playing with barbies :rolleyes:

Backtothemac
May 13, 2002, 09:13 PM
Originally posted by upthereapple
they mentioned new cases...

i tried showing that in the my Quick Lead post. Quicklead, rather than Quicksilver!!!

----
a 12 year old boy playing with barbies :rolleyes:

Hey, I like the quote in your sig, how about giving up a little credit on it :p

3rdpath
May 13, 2002, 09:22 PM
MOSR is as good a source as any---i'd rate them in the top three in accuracy, though they're not updated as frequently as macrumors. as far as the new, faster g4's(?) in july----wooohooooo!. i've been waiting since december and something twice as fast as the dual 1ghz is just the ticket.:)

Rocketman
May 13, 2002, 09:35 PM
Originally posted by GetSome681


I think the 100% isn't meant in terms of pure clockspeed, but rather the overall increase in performance brought upon by an increase in clock speed coupled with mobo improvements (ie - ddr, etc.). Maybe I'm wrong?...at least it would be nice to hope so.

Agreed. The memory speed is supposed to be about double. The main bus speed is supposed to be about double and the processor perhaps 30% higher. But since the processor was not the bottleneck last week, this will give headroom and incentive for faster processors. This might be a board for both high end G4 chips and mid-range G5's.

If I were Apple, I would want a motherboard with legs.

I am hoping the mobo has higher than necessary speeds other than CPU just to say you did.

Given the server news is likely to utilize a version of this board I suspect tomorrow will be interesting when the server is released as what I think might be a superset of speed of the powermacs.

But narrower service goals.

Rocketman

Why don't I have my image attached to my posts?
http://v-serv.com/-upload/avatar.jpg<BR>http://v-serv.com/-upload/avatar.jpg

nero007
May 13, 2002, 09:37 PM
Don't count on G5's anytime soon, unless Jobs pulls a rabbit out of his ace tomorrow. Also, from what I've heard we will see the new G4's powermac's before MWNY.

Beej
May 13, 2002, 10:11 PM
Well they sound might confident, don't they. For some reason, I believe them, well, as much as one can believe a rumor. And this is still a rumor.

Like others have said, we don't need to see twice the clock speed to see twice the performance. We may only see dual 1.4s, but with a better mobo etc. That could quite easily give us twice the performance.

I gotta say, if we are going to get twice the performance out of these G4s, the G5s will be something very special! *drools*

Curiousstrngmint
May 13, 2002, 10:28 PM
Does anybody think we'll see a 1ghz or faster titanium powerbook in july?

If not, say that too.

arn
May 13, 2002, 10:36 PM
Originally posted by Curiousstrngmint
Does anybody think we'll see a 1ghz or faster titanium powerbook in july?

If not, say that too.

Very unlikely... they just bumped the Powerbooks.

arn

dongmin
May 13, 2002, 11:24 PM
Not to be nitpicky here but what MOSR is saying is a lot bolder than just doubling of overall clockspeed, which most of us seem to think is realisticly attainable with a 1.4ghz G4 combined with faster bus and memory.

No, they're saying we should expect a doubling of the processor speed alone AND across-the-board improvements in other aspects of the motherboard. That would blow away most people's expectations, G5 or no G5.

Personally, I don't care much about a case redesign; it's what's inside that matters. The current case is stylish enough for me. But damnit, give me DDR Ram and faster bus!

And don't you think "Quicklead" is kind of a dumb name? Lead is a heavy, black metal. Toxic too. Not exactly the image you want for a majorly redesigned motherboard and case. Not too believable, IMO.

groovebuster
May 14, 2002, 12:58 AM
Originally posted by dongmin
And don't you think "Quicklead" is kind of a dumb name? Lead is a heavy, black metal. Toxic too. Not exactly the image you want for a majorly redesigned motherboard and case. Not too believable, IMO.

Since quicksilver is just another name for mercury the toxic part can't be a reason to outrule the name.

But still the name sounds dumb to me too... it doesn't have any elegance and lacks any fantasy.

groovebuster

zed
May 14, 2002, 01:05 AM
I hope they dont change the cases to much, i still like the Quicksilver case, but if they do change them, I hope we get something completely different and just as effective.

Im probably still attached to the big handle design because ive never had one.........

Beej
May 14, 2002, 02:13 AM
How about "QuickCadmium"? Sounds dumb, but it's the element after Silver, and is "a soft, bluish-white metallic element."

DannyZR2
May 14, 2002, 02:49 AM
Wow this would be just an amazing machine.. I can't believe a 2 ghz processor speed, but if we're reading mosr correctly.. that's what they are "promissing"... Only thing is I can get a 933 (actual production computer) for $1740 whereas if I wait for "what my come" the rebate will be over and I'll be taking the chance, plus paying $300 extra! grrr....

I bet I could sell the 933 for between 1700 - 1900 though... since some people will be wishing they'd taken advantage of the rebate...

but 2ghz!!!! how sweet would that be!

GetSome681
May 14, 2002, 04:08 AM
Originally posted by Rocketman


If I were Apple, I would want a motherboard with legs.


True, considering how long apple stayed with the PC133 architecture. But, if we get 266 mhz ddr, is that going to be enough, considering the above fact, and that we might be stuck with that for quite some time? I myself am hoping for the ddr 333 mentioned in some rumor not too long ago.

iGav
May 14, 2002, 04:15 AM
I won't hold my breath............. ;) :p

I'll just wait and see...... :D

Pants
May 14, 2002, 04:33 AM
True, considering how long apple stayed with the PC133 architecture. But, if we get 266 mhz ddr, is that going to be enough, considering the above fact, and that we might be stuck with that for quite some time? I myself am hoping for the ddr 333 mentioned in some rumor not too long ago.

fair point. Since when is 266 DDR 'cutting edge'? over a year back? samsung is starting to ship 400mhz ddr, whilst 333 is now pretty common......
its always kind of annoying to think that our version of (expensive!) 'cutting edge' contains bits and pieces that pc box builders would consider difficult to shift to punters.... For once, Im hoping Apple start pushing the envelope in something other than connection interfaces. :)
p.s. - am i the only one that baulks at paying for a superdrive?

Beej
May 14, 2002, 04:49 AM
Originally posted by Pants
p.s. - am i the only one that baulks at paying for a superdrive? Heh... I decided to fork out the extra for a SuperDrive when I got my 933 a couple of months ago. I still haven't used it! I really should, just soo I can stop feeling bad about it. Thing is, I don't have anything to put on a DVD. I guess I could back up some of my MP3s...

I think the SuperDrive is something I will grow into. DVDs will become more and more common, and I think if I'd decided not to get one, I'd be kicking myself a year from now.

barkmonster
May 14, 2002, 04:51 AM
If the chip can push more instructions per second than the current one (2310 MIPS @ 1Ghz) and the memory bandwidth is 266 or 333Mhz, I think that could add up to a 100% speed increase seeing as a 1Ghz chip on the same motherboard as a 500Mhz chip isn't going to be 100% faster because the system bus would bog it down.

RE: am i the only one that baulks at paying for a superdrive?

I think the superdrive is a bargain for the extra 160 you pay for it on the towers, you can shop around till you're bored silly and still not find the one the G4s use for less than 325 if you wanted to add one later on. You're also not forced to have one on any model apart from the top of the range iMac.

MikeH
May 14, 2002, 05:29 AM
The post earlier on in the week about the dual 1.4's seem far more likely to me, rather than huge leaps in clock speed - I just hope the motherboard is up to spec too.

As for the case - how about a Titainium effect case? Perhaps a Ti coloured palstic behind a clear overlay in a more industrial (squared off maybe) looking case. It would be in keeping with the Pro Ti laptop, as the consumer iMac/iBook are white. Just a thought, I'm probably way off the mark.

Tokyo
May 14, 2002, 07:21 AM
Originally posted by Curiousstrngmint
Does anybody think we'll see a 1ghz or faster titanium powerbook in july?

They better as hell not. People like me who just shelled out $3200 for a new top-of-the-line TiBook would be outraged to see such a large speed bump just two months after ours were released.

Also, it's against past patterns. There has been a fairly consistent lag time of 8-10 months between high-end laptop speed bumps (Dec 00, Oct 01, May 02), though they did do an interim Combo-drive upgrade late last year. I would not expect to see new TiBooks until Macworld Tokyo next March. I would figure MW SF '03 will bring the G5 Power Macs, 1GHz+ TiBooks that March, and then in MacWorld SF '04, we see the Powerbooks jump to G5 and the iBooks to G4.

Hey, has anyone ever made a chart showing processor releases in all four lines (pro and consumer, desktop and laptop) since the G3's first came out? Would be interesting to see if there's a pattern to be taken from it.


Tokyo

theconns
May 14, 2002, 08:22 AM
I hate to bring this up, usually I just sit quietly and read what everyone else is saying and either agree or disagree. This time, however, I've noticed something that so far no one has mentioned.

The MOSR article says that "We can't promise multi-processor 2GHz G5s, but we can promise a performance leap of more than 100% in processing speed alone over the existing PowerMac"

It DOES NOT say there will be a G4 or G5 speed increase, but a 100% increase in processing speed. A speed which chips from both Intel and AMD now occupy.

Could this finally be the the oft rumored MacOS on Intel?

????

Beej
May 14, 2002, 08:37 AM
Originally posted by theconns
Could this finally be the the oft rumored MacOS on Intel?No.

X on x86... here we go again...

Backtothemac
May 14, 2002, 08:40 AM
Originally posted by theconns
I hate to bring this up, usually I just sit quietly and read what everyone else is saying and either agree or disagree. This time, however, I've noticed something that so far no one has mentioned.

The MOSR article says that "We can't promise multi-processor 2GHz G5s, but we can promise a performance leap of more than 100% in processing speed alone over the existing PowerMac"

It DOES NOT say there will be a G4 or G5 speed increase, but a 100% increase in processing speed. A speed which chips from both Intel and AMD now occupy.

Could this finally be the the oft rumored MacOS on Intel?

????

With all due respect the easy answer to this question is no. Steve has been perfectly blatent about the fact that there will not be an OS X on Intel. It will not happen now, then, or ever. Too much of the OS and apps rely on features of the PPC. So everyone out there please, for the love of God, can we please stop talking about OS X on Intel. It will never happen.

MrSarkazm
May 14, 2002, 08:59 AM
Originally posted by Backtothemac


With all due respect the easy answer to this question is no. Steve has been perfectly blatent about the fact that there will not be an OS X on Intel. It will not happen now, then, or ever. Too much of the OS and apps rely on features of the PPC. So everyone out there please, for the love of God, can we please stop talking about OS X on Intel. It will never happen.


Now what was that Quote about never needing more than 512K of memory? lol :D

Not that I care if it goes to intel... But never doubt possibilities.

drastik
May 14, 2002, 09:02 AM
Back's right...

not to mention, if OS X suddenly appeared for intel or AMD, Steve himself would have a serious problem as well as apple, you can't lie to the public about not doing a product, its securities fraud

nero007
May 14, 2002, 09:07 AM
Originally posted by Backtothemac


With all due respect the easy answer to this question is no. Steve has been perfectly blatent about the fact that there will not be an OS X on Intel. It will not happen now, then, or ever. Too much of the OS and apps rely on features of the PPC. So everyone out there please, for the love of God, can we please stop talking about OS X on Intel. It will never happen.

From what I hear it already exists, although most likely will never see the light of day. (Unless you work at Apple)

nero007
May 14, 2002, 09:08 AM
Originally posted by DannyZR2
Wow this would be just an amazing machine.. I can't believe a 2 ghz processor speed, but if we're reading mosr correctly.. that's what they are "promissing"... Only thing is I can get a 933 (actual production computer) for $1740 whereas if I wait for "what my come" the rebate will be over and I'll be taking the chance, plus paying $300 extra! grrr....

I bet I could sell the 933 for between 1700 - 1900 though... since some people will be wishing they'd taken advantage of the rebate...

but 2ghz!!!! how sweet would that be!

Maybe you should read again. MOSR said that they could NOT promise a 2 ghz G5. IE, don't plan on it.

Backtothemac
May 14, 2002, 09:16 AM
Originally posted by nero007


From what I hear it already exists, although most likely will never see the light of day. (Unless you work at Apple)

I did work at Apple for nearly two years, and I can tell you that every rumor based on it is crap. It will not ever happen. Not ever. Believe me on this one. You would have better odds being crowned the next prince of Saudi Arabia than this one does of coming true.

Grokgod
May 14, 2002, 10:41 AM
theconns~ sorry to say this but, you should go back to being quiet .
That was the most idiotic post i have ever read on this board.
How the hell did you get the image of AMD or Intel from
the 100% increase statement.
How is the 100 % increase the realm of pcheese. Is there a one hundred percent increase intel cpu out?

Christ,, that is one LAME interpretation. No wonder no one else has said it!

mervtheswerve
May 14, 2002, 11:53 AM
of course, a doubling in processor speed could mean that we will see quad machines, eh?

Kid Red
May 14, 2002, 01:15 PM
Originally posted by theconns
I hate to bring this up, usually I just sit quietly and read what everyone else is saying and either agree or disagree. This time, however, I've noticed something that so far no one has mentioned.

The MOSR article says that "We can't promise multi-processor 2GHz G5s, but we can promise a performance leap of more than 100% in processing speed alone over the existing PowerMac"

It DOES NOT say there will be a G4 or G5 speed increase, but a 100% increase in processing speed. A speed which chips from both Intel and AMD now occupy.

Could this finally be the the oft rumored MacOS on Intel?

????

What they meant was don't expect a 2ghz G5, but do expect huge speed increases. It just means we get speed, in a new case but don't expect a 2ghz G5 to get that speed.

imamacguy17
May 14, 2002, 02:44 PM
ok kids. we are going to see a new power mac at MWNY no doubts. MOSR has been a reliable source for as long as i've been reading mac news. (when i got my subscription to macaddict, issue 4) what we are going to be seeing is the same we saw for the G4 intro. We will see a new board, we will see the new features, but with the reliable processor. i.e (for example not internet explorer i dont want to get sued) the 350 G4 tower was basically a souped up G3. This time we will have the souped up G4 but call it a g4. we will not see a g5 until 2003. this makes the most sense from their rumors of increased everything. this would bring us into the range of the G5. 1.4ghz high end G4 become the 1.4ghz low end G5. This is definately something to look forward to. Another thing pointing to the G5 coming next year is the fact that G4s have been used in all machines but the ibook and imac "classic. High end needs to be high end so we need to see improvements here.

PS. The Xserver is awsome and will kick major @$$. 2002 is the year of the Apple.:D

PSS I also play with barbies.

thjum
May 14, 2002, 05:26 PM
I`m sorry guys to ruin your hopes but maybe you will be a bit disappointed since the xserve rack will start shipping around MWNY and only has a 1 ghz G4. I think most of the changes will be on the motherboard (faster memory, bus speed, ata 133) and not with the processor.

Kid Red
May 14, 2002, 09:08 PM
Originally posted by thjum
I`m sorry guys to ruin your hopes but maybe you will be a bit disappointed since the xserve rack will start shipping around MWNY and only has a 1 ghz G4. I think most of the changes will be on the motherboard (faster memory, bus speed, ata 133) and not with the processor.

If Apple announced a 1.4ghz server today, how do you think tower sales would do until July? Apple is simply preparing these machines for the fastest chip available. A 1.2-1.4ghz chip is not currently available.

This means nothing for what will be released at MWNY.

boobers
May 14, 2002, 09:49 PM
then it seems likely they will have a new processor line with that..i'm thinkin G5 here. my .02

Originally posted by MikeH
The post earlier on in the week about the dual 1.4's seem far more likely to me, rather than huge leaps in clock speed - I just hope the motherboard is up to spec too.

As for the case - how about a Titainium effect case? Perhaps a Ti coloured palstic behind a clear overlay in a more industrial (squared off maybe) looking case. It would be in keeping with the Pro Ti laptop, as the consumer iMac/iBook are white. Just a thought, I'm probably way off the mark.

AlphaTech
May 17, 2002, 09:49 AM
IF Apple does actually put the next tower (G4 or G5) into a new housing, I just might have to get one. This would be ahead of schedule, but such is life. Right now, I am trying to get the money end worked out (shuffling some items around) so that I am ready come MWNY (or MWSF, worst case).

Only time and Apple will tell, and Apple ain't talkin.

Mr. Anderson
May 17, 2002, 11:01 AM
But the real question is with the new enclosure, will we see an updated form of the tower as it is today, or a total redesign?

I'm thinking another iteration on the current design, so that they'll do the redesign with the new chip.

jelloshotsrule
May 17, 2002, 11:04 AM
Originally posted by dukestreet
But the real question is with the new enclosure, will we see an updated form of the tower as it is today, or a total redesign?

I'm thinking another iteration on the current design, so that they'll do the redesign with the new chip.

i agree. something similar to the qs design and the one before it... but then with the g5 a totally new case.

of course, if they have the g5 in january (big IF) and they have a new case in july... it'd be kinda weird to have 2 new cases so fast. one having only lasted one version.... so i don't know.

MikeH
May 17, 2002, 11:19 AM
New case does not necessarly mean new chip.

The current case first appeared with G3 chips, in the Blue & White version, yet G3 chip had already been around for some time.

And when the G4's arrived, all that changed was the colour scheme (blue to grey, as I'm sure you know).

The current case has been around for about three and half years now, not including minor revisions, and although the current design is still leagues ahead of anything in the PC market, it is starting to show it's age next to the iMac, iBook and Ti Powerbooks.

A new case could boost tower sales (which are flagging apparently) as to most buyers a new case = new machine.

sturm375
May 17, 2002, 12:30 PM
Originally posted by MikeH
...The current case has been around for about three and half years now, not including minor revisions, and although the current design is still leagues ahead of anything in the PC market, ...

It depends on whether or not you are a true geek, or just a wannabe geek. You see the G3 style case is very pretty, and yes easy to open, but take a simple task of adding a hard drive, and you see it is not very fuctional. Although I have not been in a G4 case, I assume they still line up the Hard Drives horizontally as opposed to the PC world that stacks them. By putting them horizontally, you now need a special IDE ribbon cable to connect two drives, no matter where you put them. Also try adding a CD drive, real fun. I really prefer to use Antec cases, even though they arn't as open as the G3 style, they adhear to more standards, and you don't have to spend $30 on an IDE ribbon cable.

Mr. Anderson
May 17, 2002, 12:42 PM
Originally posted by sturm375
I really prefer to use Antec cases, even though they arn't as open as the G3 style, they adhear to more standards, and you don't have to spend $30 on an IDE ribbon cable.

Well, I guess I was lucky when I got my G4, since it seems I didn't have to spend and extra $30 for a special IDE ribbon cable.:rolleyes:

Come on, there aren't that many people around here who actually make BYO macs. There really isn't much of a market for it.

theranch
May 17, 2002, 12:51 PM
Originally posted by sturm375


It depends on whether or not you are a true geek, or just a wannabe geek. You see the G3 style case is very pretty, and yes easy to open, but take a simple task of adding a hard drive, and you see it is not very fuctional. Although I have not been in a G4 case, I assume they still line up the Hard Drives horizontally as opposed to the PC world that stacks them. By putting them horizontally, you now need a special IDE ribbon cable to connect two drives, no matter where you put them. Also try adding a CD drive, real fun. I really prefer to use Antec cases, even though they arn't as open as the G3 style, they adhear to more standards, and you don't have to spend $30 on an IDE ribbon cable.

Really? I didn't find it hard at all to add another drive to my G4.

AlphaTech
May 17, 2002, 12:51 PM
Originally posted by sturm375
I really prefer to use Antec cases, even though they arn't as open as the G3 style, they adhear to more standards, and you don't have to spend $30 on an IDE ribbon cable.

Where are you getting a $30 ribbon from??? Man, they saw you coming :D. I have used standard ribbons that come with ATA drives inside of G3/G4 systems. You want to add one drive, stack it on top of the one from Apple, they even provide you with a second connection on that ribbon. Want more, well, you have to add an ATA card, same as with a pc if you want more then two drives. You DO NOT want to put a hard drive after an optical drive inside a peecheese. Once you put the ATA card into your Mac, you can use any ribbon you want (like the ones that come with the card or drive for FREE).

As my father used to say... more money then brains (and you must be broke) :D.

Grokgod
May 29, 2002, 06:08 PM
uhh thats quite insane, I think you could find an Emachine on a street corner and grab out a ribbon out of it for nothing. Hell, next time email me and I will send you one for the cost of mailing it.

big
May 29, 2002, 07:32 PM
ide ribbon @ local mac joint-$6
ide ribbon salvation army (didn't know what it was)-$1
ummm, I'll sell you either for $25 that's a $5 discount! what a steal

oh, and on the subject of apple increasing mhz speed...didn't they just up the Imac 35%? trying to put that into the froth with other future upgrades (they don't always increase it by a specific amount)