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D3lta
Jul 10, 2008, 11:13 AM
I was looking at the AIM apps description and it says "send and receive messages over WiFi, EDGE, or 3G networks" in the description.

Does that mean that messages count as data and not SMS? Could someone please confirm?



Niiro13
Jul 10, 2008, 11:16 AM
AIM website:

Note the URL.

philgilder
Jul 10, 2008, 11:18 AM
it is data

niiro13, the OP was asking if the IM send using AIM would count as sms or data, not whether SMS sent using AIM on a mac/pc would count as data or cost money

Niiro13
Jul 10, 2008, 11:20 AM
it is data

niiro13, the OP was asking if the IM send using AIM would count as sms or data, not whether SMS sent using AIM on a mac/pc would count as data or cost money

Well, first, the URL shows it's the iPhone AIM FAQ.

Secondly, if you read the sentence, it says SMS is part of normal IM which is part of the phone's data plan.

So it counts as data.

Me1000
Jul 10, 2008, 11:22 AM
It almost looks like all the apps in the store give the SMS warning...

lukeman3000
Jul 10, 2008, 01:13 PM
It almost looks like all the apps in the store give the SMS warning...

Wait wait wait, let me rephrase this question:

If I have only 500 texts per month, but unlimited data, does using AIM on the iphone take away from my 500 texts or is it seen as data? This would be pretty important to know!

The General
Jul 10, 2008, 01:18 PM
It is NOT SMS. It does NOT count as SMS. It doe NOT send text messages. It counts as DATA. You can sit there and send instant messages ALL DAY LONG because you have unlimited data.

It counts as DATA. There should be no confusion here. It goes over wifi, 3G or EDGE. This is not SMS, it is not text messaging, it is an internet application that uses the data connection, not SMS messaging.

They are two complete and totally separate things.

lukeman3000
Jul 10, 2008, 01:21 PM
It is NOT SMS. It does NOT count as SMS. It doe NOT send text messages. It counts as DATA. You can sit there and send instant messages ALL DAY LONG because you have unlimited data.

It counts as DATA. There should be no confusion here. It goes over wifi, 3G or EDGE. This is not SMS, it is not text messaging, it is an internet application that uses the data connection, not SMS messaging.

They are two complete and totally separate things.

Ok.. gotcha. I didn't read the agreement that someone posted, just the replies in this thread. And some of them seemed to contradict each other. One person said something about an "sms warning" in the agreement, that's all. Thanks for clarifying that though.

The General
Jul 10, 2008, 01:23 PM
WAIT WAIT WAIT.

WTF

Look at the iTunes page for AIM. It is totally unclear and this makes absolutely no sense. Why would they even mention SMS messages? Why would AIM even need to use SMS messages? WTF does AIM have anything to do with SMS at all? :mad::mad::mad:

rally.yellow
Jul 10, 2008, 01:29 PM
Just got off the phone with AT&T business care and AIM DOES USE SMS! The only thing it does not charge for is the "internet connection" required to get online. So, I am officially out of words and lost :confused: anyone hear anything different? Because it makes no sense for the ipod touch... who is going to charge me for that? IT MAKES NO SENSE!!!!

bacaramac
Jul 10, 2008, 01:31 PM
WAIT WAIT WAIT.

WTF

Look at the iTunes page for AIM. It is totally unclear and this makes absolutely no sense. Why would they even mention SMS messages? Why would AIM even need to use SMS messages? WTF does AIM have anything to do with SMS at all? :mad::mad::mad:

I think they are saying that you can SMS someone from AIM possiblely??? The apps on the RAZR, etc count towards your messages so that is the OP's concern with this app.

I think only AT&T or AOL can clear this up. I would send an email to AT&T and ask the question (they would know if they count). That way you have documented proof if they say it doesn't count.

EDIT:

Just got off the phone with AT&T business care and AIM DOES USE SMS! The only thing it does not charge for is the "internet connection" required to get online. So, I am officially out of words and lost :confused: anyone hear anything different? Because it makes no sense for the ipod touch... who is going to charge me for that? IT MAKES NO SENSE!!!!

One thought based on the call to AT&T, the reps are probably not smart enough to understand the iPhone may work different the Razr's etc so they may say it counts as SMS.

rally.yellow
Jul 10, 2008, 01:45 PM
it is considered "over the air data". I went up the executive ladder and they said to think about it as when you check your minutes using the txt message. it shows up as a text message, but it does not count against it. she said she was 100% positive and made a note on the account about it just in case seomthing happens. like she put it, "it's all new to us and we're still working out the details".... :rolleyes:

billchase2
Jul 10, 2008, 01:52 PM
if i had a nickel for every time someone asked this question...

The General
Jul 10, 2008, 02:05 PM
Guess I'll have to get unlimited SMS now. :rolleyes:

This is retarded. Now my bill will be $100/mo. :D

billchase2
Jul 10, 2008, 02:12 PM
i'm testing it out right now. just IMed my phone and am waiting to see if it appears on my online log of texts.

it is interesting that online, they are now called "Text/IM Messaging"

ebrunn
Jul 10, 2008, 02:12 PM
The IM SMS's go through AIM's servers as data so I dont know how it would count against your real SMS's you get from ATT. That ATT rep dosent know what there talking about.

kmay37
Jul 10, 2008, 02:19 PM
Yea I asked an ATT tech support person online the other day and she said it counts as both SMS and data....:mad: I really hope she is just clueless like everyone else at att and if it does cost a text...that is the worst thing ever...

ebrunn
Jul 10, 2008, 02:23 PM
It says on the App page you can use it with the iPod Touch so it has to do it through data.

Whorehay
Jul 10, 2008, 02:24 PM
WAIT WAIT WAIT.

WTF

Look at the iTunes page for AIM. It is totally unclear and this makes absolutely no sense. Why would they even mention SMS messages? Why would AIM even need to use SMS messages? WTF does AIM have anything to do with SMS at all? :mad::mad::mad:

Because you can send SMS text messages via AIM by adding the number +1xxxxxxxxxx (the person's phone number).. which is why the iPod touch will be able to send SMS texts via WiFi. It will be data only.

billchase2
Jul 10, 2008, 02:24 PM
after 15 minutes: nothing on my at&t data usage site...

unconncious
Jul 10, 2008, 02:33 PM
i just asked they told me it would count against my text messages :mad:. still didnt' answered me if i'd use my wireless network if it count against text or data.

bubbagumpshrimp
Jul 10, 2008, 03:47 PM
Can someone please get us a straight answer on this? It seems that talking to ATT reps isn't going to get us anywhere.

ebrunn
Jul 10, 2008, 03:49 PM
Can someone please get us a straight answer on this? It seems that talking to ATT reps isn't going to get us anywhere.

Does not use your SMS messages.

TonyHoyle
Jul 10, 2008, 03:53 PM
I've got it working on a PayG SIM with zero credit.

It does not use SMS.

lukeman3000
Jul 10, 2008, 03:59 PM
I've got it working on a PayG SIM with zero credit.

It does not use SMS.

Awesome. Thanks for confirming this. The more people that can confirm this the better...

Although I would like to say, I wonder why they even mention SMS at all in that promotional ad... Where they say that SMS is not available in all countries... Weird. Because as far as the user is concerned, there is no SMS involved on their end, only the receiving party if it gets sent to a cell phone.

Smith288
Jul 10, 2008, 04:00 PM
Does not use your SMS messages.

Clam shell phones that use some sort of Aim "client" is really just a stupid SMS bridge.

THe one on the iPhone is a real data app.

steffi
Jul 10, 2008, 04:01 PM
As always with these things do assume that it updates in real time.

Also messaging is sometimes supported with a zero balance but it just catches up after you refill.

I'm suspect that even if it's using a DATA connection to send the message that either AOL's servers or the App itself will message AT&T to reduce the subscribers message quota by one.

AT&T is not going to blindly stand by and allow DATA to canabolize their SMS revenue.

Awesome. Thanks for confirming this. The more people that can confirm this the better...

bubbagumpshrimp
Jul 10, 2008, 04:06 PM
As always with these things do assume that it updates in real time.

Also messaging is sometimes supported with a zero balance but it just catches up after you refill.

I'm suspect that even if it's using a DATA connection to send the message that either AOL's servers or the App itself will message AT&T to reduce the subscribers message quota by one.

AT&T is not going to blindly stand by and allow DATA to canabolize their SMS revenue.
Why not? Aren't we already paying $30 for the data plan? If IM becomes the norm in the future ATT will just up the cost of the data plans.

njchris
Jul 10, 2008, 04:09 PM
It doesn't take a brain surgeon to figure out it is data.

If it was SMS and you closed the app, you would get an SMS notification. You don't. The description also just mentions data as what it uses, as I had stated before.

bubbagumpshrimp
Jul 10, 2008, 04:12 PM
It doesn't take a brain surgeon to figure out it is data.

If it was SMS and you closed the app, you would get an SMS notification. You don't. The description also just mentions data as what it uses, as I had stated before.
Well you do have to take in consideration that some of these phones out there that have IM already on them are counted as text. I was a verizon customer and I know that they counted their IM applications as text.
My hope is that since this is 3rd party IM it wont have any direct ties to ATT so that they can't monitor it has text.

cboom4250
Jul 10, 2008, 04:14 PM
Hope this helps...

How do I send text messages using AIM?

To send a text message using AIM for iPhone, tap the IMs button and then tap the new IM button in the upper right corner of the screen. Enter your buddy's full phone number like: +14085551212. You can also enter just the 10 digit number and we'll add the +1 for you. You can also add phone numbers to your Buddy List view by entering the full number in the Add Buddy panel. Currently, you can only send messages to mobile phones in North America (phone numbers in country code 1).

What does it cost to send text messages using AIM?

AOL does not charge a fee to send text messages using AIM. Text messages are treated the same as normal IM messages and are included as part of your device's data plan.

From http://daol.aol.com/software/mac/iphone/aim/faq (found through App Store AIM Support link and then the FAQ)

bubbagumpshrimp
Jul 10, 2008, 04:16 PM
Good find, thanks.
You really should re-post this info so that we can put this to rest.

Djmx
Jul 10, 2008, 04:22 PM
WOW some ppl are really DUMB!!!

IF IT DID CHARGE as TEXT MESSAGE.. it wouldn't be available for the iPod Touch! IT USES 3G, EDGE, WiFI, what more proof do you need. People at AT&T dont' know jack *****. IT USES DATA... can we move along now please? THANKS!

bubbagumpshrimp
Jul 10, 2008, 04:37 PM
WOW some ppl are really DUMB!!!

IF IT DID CHARGE as TEXT MESSAGE.. it wouldn't be available for the iPod Touch! IT USES 3G, EDGE, WiFI, what more proof do you need. People at AT&T dont' know jack *****. IT USES DATA... can we move along now please? THANKS!
You are aware that their are some IM apps out their that are directly connected to the phone provider meaning they can regulate IM as text right??
This is very good news to me as im sure it is to many others on this forum.

Djmx
Jul 10, 2008, 04:39 PM
You are aware that their are some IM apps out their that are directly connected to the phone provider meaning they can regulate IM as text right??
This is very good news to me as im sure it is to many others on this forum.

YES, like the Razor and such.. iPhone is different... i use to have a pocket pc phone that i used my wifi and data for IM.. so i know a bit bout those stuff

Dingo Dave 69
Jul 10, 2008, 05:09 PM
if you use AIM you can type in the persons phone number and it will send them an SMS for free. Never be charged for using your SMS messages again :)

lgivens
Jul 10, 2008, 05:25 PM
I was looking at the AIM apps description and it says "send and receive messages over WiFi, EDGE, or 3G networks" in the description.

Does that mean that messages count as data and not SMS? Could someone please confirm?

Hello Everyone,
I'm the AOL Mac Product Lead and wanted to make sure everyone had the best information.

First, AIM for iPhone DOES NOT use SMS for messaging. It uses the AIM servers at AOL.

You CAN send an AIM message to a SMS account in the U.S. by formatting the IM to: +13335551212 - You will not be charged an SMS message from AIM but the recipient may be charged an SMS when receiving (this is subject to the recipient's mobile plan).

Thanks...
Lee Givens
AOL Mac Product Lead

Niiro13
Jul 10, 2008, 05:28 PM
Edit: ^^^ he beat me to it.

Why is it still unclear?

My picture says:

AOL does not charge a fee to send text messages using AIM.

Yes, that part is not what we're talking about.

"Text messages are treated the same as normal IM messages and are included as part of your device's data plan."

So SMS and normal IMs are treated the same.

Therefore, if normal IMs are part of the data plan, then so are SMS. If SMS is included as part of the data plan, then so are normal IMs.

marksman
Jul 10, 2008, 05:29 PM
Lee thanks for clearing that up.

Very good info, and very nice application. I already moved it to be my primary IM device now.

lgivens
Jul 10, 2008, 05:30 PM
As always with these things do assume that it updates in real time.

Also messaging is sometimes supported with a zero balance but it just catches up after you refill.

I'm suspect that even if it's using a DATA connection to send the message that either AOL's servers or the App itself will message AT&T to reduce the subscribers message quota by one.

AT&T is not going to blindly stand by and allow DATA to canabolize their SMS revenue.

Hello Everyone,
Just wanted to emphasize. The AOL AIM app for iPhone does not have any back-end connection to AT&T's SMS and sending an AIM message to any other user on the AIM network will not count against your SMS allotment.

You can send 1 billion (or less, depending on how tired your fingers are) IMs to other AIM/iChat users on the on the AOL network and not be charged for a single SMS message. Stop by the Mac@AOL Blog (http://macblog.aol.com) for more information on AOL's Mac and iPhone products.

thanks...
Lee Givens
AOL Mac Product Lead
http://macblog.aol.com
(http://macblog.aol.com)

iLeoMarc
Jul 10, 2008, 05:32 PM
Awesome. Thanks for confirming this. The more people that can confirm this the better...

Although I would like to say, I wonder why they even mention SMS at all in that promotional ad... Where they say that SMS is not available in all countries... Weird. Because as far as the user is concerned, there is no SMS involved on their end, only the receiving party if it gets sent to a cell phone.

That is just how aim works. You can Instant Message a cell phone here in the United States, but won't work in all countries. As people before you said it is still data because it goes through the server, like you can send a Text (SMS) to a mobile phone using ichat.

Niiro13
Jul 10, 2008, 05:33 PM
Hello Everyone,
Just wanted to emphasize. The AOL AIM app for iPhone does not have any back-end connection to AT&T's SMS and sending an AIM message to any other user on the AIM network will not count against your SMS allotment.

You can send 1 billion (or less, depending on how tired your fingers are) IMs to other AIM/iChat users on the on the AOL network and not be charged for a single SMS message. Stop by the Mac@AOL Blog (http://macblog.aol.com) for more information on AOL's Mac and iPhone products.

thanks...
Lee Givens
AOL Mac Product Lead
http://macblog.aol.com
(http://macblog.aol.com)

Hi! I think what people are most confused is: AT&T's losing bandwidth or whatever. If you can send as many SMS from AIM, then who's paying for the bandwidth? Is it AOL that's paying? Or does AT&T not mind?

marksman
Jul 10, 2008, 05:34 PM
Lee,

One follow up if you come back. What happens when the person who receives an SMS replies? Does it come back to AIM?

marksman
Jul 10, 2008, 05:35 PM
Hi! I think what people are most confused is: AT&T's losing bandwidth or whatever. If you can send as many SMS from AIM, then who's paying for the bandwidth? Is it AOL that's paying? Or does AT&T not mind?

You are paying $30 a month.

Niiro13
Jul 10, 2008, 05:40 PM
You are paying $30 a month.

Then why pay an extra $20?

lgivens
Jul 10, 2008, 07:10 PM
Lee,

One follow up if you come back. What happens when the person who receives an SMS replies? Does it come back to AIM?

Hey Marksman,
When you initiate an IM session with an SMS-capable phone, on the AIM side, it looks just like a standard IM session. On the SMS side, it looks just like a standard SMS session. The AIM network handles the SMS gateway and it just works.

For all those new to the forum, IM sessions between AIM for iPhone and AIM/iChat users on desktops or iPhones will never get charged for SMS messages. If you send a +12223334444 (Mobile SMS gateway) buddy, the SMS side of the conversation may incur SMS charges.

Thanks...
Lee Givens
AOL Mac Product Lead
http://macblog.aol.com
AOL iPhone Apps (http://mobile.aol.com/iphone/)

Sobe
Jul 10, 2008, 08:13 PM
Thanks Mr. Givens.

lukeman3000
Jul 10, 2008, 08:16 PM
YES, like the Razor and such.. iPhone is different... i use to have a pocket pc phone that i used my wifi and data for IM.. so i know a bit bout those stuff

Really? So do you think that maybe, just maybe that you might know a little bit more than people who haven't used those types of phones before?

CHILL OUT

D3lta
Jul 10, 2008, 08:36 PM
Lee, thanks for answering out questions!

A small off-topic question: is it possible for us to send feedback on the app?

EspressoLove
Jul 23, 2008, 03:50 AM
You CAN send an AIM message to a SMS account in the U.S. by formatting the IM to: +13335551212 - You will not be charged an SMS message from AIM

Hey Lee! glad to see AOL taking so much interest in  community :D

I have couple of questions - which countries besides USA have this service also? more specifically :
1) to which countries I can send SMS using your service? (free of charge/ATT charges)
2) from which countries I can receive message in iPhone AIM app, which originated as SMS? (if corresponding countries/abilities for this two scenarios differ)

EspressoLove
Jul 23, 2008, 04:14 AM
Oh, got it ... only in North America ...


But I still got the second question, as it's not obviously equals first one :
2) from which countries I can receive message in iPhone AIM app, which originated as SMS?

and another one :
3) can I receive IM (in iPhone AIM app) if I did not originate a session with SMS enabled phone of my contact?
That is - can somebody send me SMS, that I can receive as IM ?
and which number should it be then, to reach me?

or another one : if I did originate IM > SMS session .... but that person postpones to answer, will that "reply" number on my message to him - expire?
then what is timeframe?

macduke
Jul 23, 2008, 04:36 AM
This is great! I didn't realize I could use AIM to send and receive texts. Although I bet this won't be as practical until Apple releases the push notification software update for the iPhone. I may just end up canceling my text message plan!! Its only 200 anyway...all I could afford after going up to a $30 data plan.

Now bring on the iCall VOIP! Stick it to the man...

EspressoLove
Jul 23, 2008, 04:47 AM
This is great! I didn't realize I could use AIM to send and receive texts.

Yeah, that's good!
Though I think it only applies to IM > SMS you initiate, and direct immediate replies SMS > IM.
In my understanding - you still need that 200 messages plan, as it will count against pure, plain SMS'es you receive.
(i.e. when somebody decides to message you, on their own, not "replying" to your IM > SMS message)

P.S. Would be gladly proven wrong :rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

7on
Jul 23, 2008, 10:07 AM
It'd be nice if there was an option to use SMS...

Some people might be, you know, not subscribing to a data plan... and have unlimited SMS...

All 5 of us :p

ViViDboarder
Jul 23, 2008, 11:19 AM
I can not believe that people even get confused with this... Same app works on iTouch... I touch doesn't have a SMS plan...

Think about it...

Warbrain
Jul 23, 2008, 12:17 PM
Just got off the phone with AT&T business care and AIM DOES USE SMS! The only thing it does not charge for is the "internet connection" required to get online. So, I am officially out of words and lost :confused: anyone hear anything different? Because it makes no sense for the ipod touch... who is going to charge me for that? IT MAKES NO SENSE!!!!

I'm sure that they told you the standard answer about the clients on the other phones which do use SMS. This is an entirely different situation.

saminsocks
Jul 23, 2008, 11:10 PM
I wish I knew why AT&T has IM listed under my data plan. That's the only thing that confuses me.

And if you use AIM on your computer and text someone with the +1# it appears just like any other conversation. So I don't see how AIM on the iPhone would be any different. Your entire conversation should happen through AIM and not revert to SMS. That would be silly.

It's also not very effective, though, since AIM signs you off after so long.

Philberttheduck
Jul 23, 2008, 11:26 PM
I can not believe that people even get confused with this... Same app works on iTouch... I touch doesn't have a SMS plan...

Think about it...

Well no ****.

"The Touch doesn't have a camera, txt, phone calling, 3G network, pricing plan per month" so why should it be the same as the iPhone? People also didn't have to pay 10 dollars just for some firmware upgrade so that could've been AT&T's reasoning, defeating your logic.

AT&T's policy on their website clearly states that an IM is part of their messaging plan (txting, MMS included). Nonetheless, each IM is charged via data plan, not messaging plan. Too bad, because I'm not paying 20 a month for dialup on my phone and have unlimited messaging..

danigmatico
Feb 13, 2009, 02:13 AM
AIM messages are counting towards your SMS texting messaging plan! And that's just NOT right!

I'm with T-Mobile, but apparently Verizon and AT&T clients have the same issue. AIM is a WEB application using your DATA plan! These carriers are stealing from us!

AOL official site state clearly that the ONLY charge is the data plan (internet fee):
http://daol.aol.com/software/mac/iphone/aim/faq
http://help.aol.com/help/microsites/microsite.do?cmd=displayKCPopup&docType=kc&externalId=223756

We have to stop complaining in these forums about it and START doing something. I'm starting with writing AOL some feedback (link below). Because at least they have to follow up with that or correct the wrong information are providing in their website (2 links above) about the "no cost" of AIM.

http://www.aolfeedback-clarabridge.com/se.ashx?s=04BD76CC65A7BB3C&tid=40&r=http%3A%2F%2Fmobile.aol.com%2Faolproducts%2Faim-for-windows-mobile&ch=us.mbdash&oid=a63e4da218dd9b619bd4a35479cfffaf064916f9d7d6884139c7dab55960a6e4&c=en-US

superstrikertwo
Feb 13, 2009, 03:17 AM
AIM messages are counting towards your SMS texting messaging plan! And that's just NOT right!

I'm with T-Mobile, but apparently Verizon and AT&T clients have the same issue. AIM is a WEB application using your DATA plan! These carriers are stealing from us!

AOL official site state clearly that the ONLY charge is the data plan (internet fee):
http://daol.aol.com/software/mac/iphone/aim/faq
http://help.aol.com/help/microsites/microsite.do?cmd=displayKCPopup&docType=kc&externalId=223756

We have to stop complaining in these forums about it and START doing something. I'm starting with writing AOL some feedback (link below). Because at least they have to follow up with that or correct the wrong information are providing in their website (2 links above) about the "no cost" of AIM.

http://www.aolfeedback-clarabridge.com/se.ashx?s=04BD76CC65A7BB3C&tid=40&r=http%3A%2F%2Fmobile.aol.com%2Faolproducts%2Faim-for-windows-mobile&ch=us.mbdash&oid=a63e4da218dd9b619bd4a35479cfffaf064916f9d7d6884139c7dab55960a6e4&c=en-US

It counts as data. Don't bump old threads and spread false info.

steffi
Feb 14, 2009, 10:42 PM
Recently AOL have introduced a confirmation step to receiving an SMS message on the iphone. The recipient has to send either "a" or "d" back in order to accept or decline the message. Presumably the recipient is charged a 1 message count for that confirmation message.

It counts as data. Don't bump old threads and spread false info.

neilp4453
Feb 15, 2009, 12:17 AM
Yeah, that's good!
Though I think it only applies to IM > SMS you initiate, and direct immediate replies SMS > IM.
In my understanding - you still need that 200 messages plan, as it will count against pure, plain SMS'es you receive.
(i.e. when somebody decides to message you, on their own, not "replying" to your IM > SMS message)

P.S. Would be gladly proven wrong :rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

This is right, but when I used to use AIM to text on my iphone, I just gave my better friends the unique AIM number linked to your SN when you text someone.

I told them to txt me using that number.

If there was push notification, it would be pretty sweet. Even if the native e-mail client had push functionality, it would be great on beehive.

pianoplayer1
Feb 15, 2009, 01:59 PM
I don't get whats so hard to understand???

It has never counted against text, ever, and that probably is against the SDK rules anyway.

bnorris10
Aug 1, 2009, 11:18 AM
I came across this thread trying to find out about it and I was told by the ATT rep that if you download the actual application for yahoo or aim that it is considered data and part of the $30 plan

But if you set it up without the the application it counts as a text