Is Apple too secretive?

[yamabushi]

Apple appears too be constantly annoyed with rumor sites killing their sales as people dream of updates and new products. Meanwhile consumers find it difficult to plan for future purchases when these products appear at irregular intervals. Is Apple too secretive?

Secrecy has helped to make some product launches more surprising and exciting. However some users have a justifiable need for some idea of what the future holds. Businesses and government agencies in particular are bound by budgets and future purchasing plans.

I personally set a budget and plan for personal purchases of expensive items such as computers. Whenever my needs fail to match up well with the products offered at the time I plan to make a purchase I feel frustrated. I think that many others feel likewise. If I had some official announcement to go by as a guideline it would make my life a little easier.

So why was last years announcement of 3GHz within twelve months such an unusual occurance? Why the obsession with secrecy?

[mj_1903]

Short answer, no.

Long answer, no.

Apple can stay secretive and will because they are a public company. The announcement of the 3Ghz G5 was simply to help give faith to Mac users that everything would be fine from now on in clockspeed.

[mac15]

I like the secretness, without would be we have the plethora of mac rumor sites we do now? It keep things fun, unlike M$ who promie things but never deliver. Apple wouldn't want that

[mmmdreg]

Yeah. It's part of what makes being a Mac user so great :P

[Pseudonym]

I think Apple has to be secretive. Since it supplies both the hardware and software of a computer sales would be seriously hit if Apple were to say the next upgrade is around the corner. Rumour sites will affect sales, announcements from Apple would kill them.

Microsoft are in a totally different situation. People care less about software updates than they do about processor/product updates. You can always upgrade software, it is a pig to upgrade Apple hardware.

[Chip NoVaMac]

I think that they have to be secretive since their marketshare is so small. It is hard enough for them when rumor sites mention something like a bump in speeds on the 15 and 17 PB. Because they have to manage their inventories much more closely.

[virividox]

i like the mystery, it gives you something to look forward to and talk about with other mac users. as well as it pushes the envelope for other developes who start scrambling to copy macs products, notice how many companies are make 17 inch laptops now

[yamabushi]

Well sure, they can't say "we're going to release the G6 next month so don't buy anything." But they could be a little clearer than "Things are coming that look really good."

Is Apple going to wait until June to release a new PM or can we expect incremental speed increases between now and then? Can we expect MacOS 10.4 to appear sometime in 2004? 2005? 2006?

My point is that in the absence of any facts of any kind we are forced to speculate. So Apple created the void of information which spawned rumor sites and the hassles for their inventory by this secrecy.

The result is that we never know how long to wait and this hurts their overall sales.

[alset]

True, but they were burning because of leaks, back in the 90s. If you are so worried about the release of an updated proc than just wait for an announcement. Dell and other companies do the same thing. They just don't have zealots, like Apple does.

Dan

[iGav]

Originally posted by alset
If you are so worried about the release of an updated proc than just wait for an announcement. Dell and other companies do the same thing. They just don't have zealots, like Apple does.


Spot on, Apple are no different then any other company with regards to new products.

[MacBoyX]

No,

In fact as much as I love rumor sites, the PowerBook fiasco of last year shows the problem. Every month there was a "PowerBooks" are coming rumor and sales really were hurt. If Apple said, G5 PowerBooks are coming this summer imagine how many G4 PowerBooks would not be bought. As it is as soon as we hear a rumor we don't buy. This hurts Apple and us actually, I firmly believe that there have been times when a product was ready to roll but was delayed because of Inventory surplus.

Although we all love Apple and are "zealots" about their products, there are still a business first and must make business decisions.

Give this a thought, if there were no rumor sites, would you even have been able to ask that question?

macboyX
check out http://www.macboyx.com

[kkubaryc]

Personally, I think Apple is too secretive, but I understand that they need to keep some things private. For example, there have been several times that I said to myself that I would get a new powerbook now if the wait for a g5 is a year or more. Since I'm not fully convinced that the wait will be more than a year, Apple loses my sale.

Anyhow, it's funny that even though we make up a tiny niche in the computer market, try typing "Rumors" (with the "s") into Google. We have the top two links!

[Squire]

Apple needs to be secretive because so much of its business depends on innovation- innovation that is constantly being copied by the competition. However, I feel for the people who, for example, are presently in the market for a PowerMac. I have the luxury of holding off until I hear the announcement before diving in. Some people need computers and such right away.

Squire

[SiliconAddict]

Originally posted by Squire
Apple needs to be secretive because so much of its business depends on innovation- innovation that is constantly being copied by the competition. However, I feel for the people who, for example, are presently in the market for a PowerMac. I have the luxury of holding off until I hear the announcement before diving in. Some people need computers and such right away.

Squire

Well, There is no reason why Apple can't at least give a roadmap of where they are planning to go with the their various products. This doesn't mean that they have to give specific details but they could, for example, say. OS X Puma in 2004, OS X Tiger in fall of 2006. This doesn't really give anything away but gives users at least an idea of what to expect.

[applebum]

I was thinking about this the other day. I would love it if Apple had a particular day each quarter where they would release any new products (if there were any) - say 1st Tue in Jan, Apr, Jul, Oct. You would still have rumors as to what might come out next quarter, but people in Feb would know that it would be 2 months before the next thing comes out. This month has been terrible when waiting to buy a new Mac. First it was the 20th, then it was the 24th but that was a Sat so then it was the 27th, now it is after the Superbowl. I finally bit the bullet and bought my eMac - sure would have been easier had I known that nothing new would be introduced before April.

[dwishbone]

Is Apple too secretive?

You can be killed for asking such questions. shhhhhhhhh
i could be taken away just for posting here.
*booom booom booom*
"Open up!!!!!"
gotta go...apple gastapo.

[Downdivx]

I think less secrecy make sense if you're serious about getting people to switch.
Switching over from the Intel processor increases to Apple increase is a huge change (as I'm finding out). Intel releases a new processor every couple of months (slower lately), and the old processors all move down one notch. With Intel I could buy the second fastest processor and know that for the next several months it would be one of the fastest. With apple, an entirely new product line could come from nowhere or every processor speed could suddenly be replaced.
Personally, I would like a road map: PM upgrades in the summer, Imac upgrades in the Fall, Xserve upgraded in the winter, etc. I'm not asking for detailed product info and release dates, I would just like more direction than this, especially if Apple is trying to get people to Switch!
W

[dwishbone]

personally i think it was a mistake for Jobs to have his 3Ghz in a year comment. because we are about a year later from the G5's unvailing. if apple doesnt get updated G5's out this month all the "harbinger's of doom" will start showing up again. "apple's going under...yadda yadda". makes me ill. its good to know something faster is coming...but that is always going to be the case.
i think apple should keep doing as they are doing now, but offer more kind of discounts or buy backs for people that get "shafted" on recent purchases before an upgrade. apple does do this sort of thing. i remember getting my first G3. i ordered a beige G3. they held my order and held my order until i was frothing at the mouth. they wouldnt tell me why they wouldnt ship it. low and behold it was because the B&W G3 came out. i forgot how mad i was and just enjoyed my computer. thats what everyone should do. buy the best you can when you can. enjoy your purchase. dont worry so darn much.

[Downdivx]

Yet at the same time it seems that there are plenty of people out there (or at least in these forums) who are interested in buying a PM, but are willing to wait for faster processors. We're all assuming that there will be an intermediary step between 2.0 and 3.0, but if Apple would just say next PM revision this summer, a bunch of us would go ahead and buy.
I'm going to graduate from College in May, so I can't wait till this summer because I want to use my Education discount. I'm assuming that a 50% performance increase is too much and one year is too long to wait, so I'm waiting for an upgrade before I buy.
W

[MacsRgr8]

Originally posted by dwishbone
buy the best you can when you can. enjoy your purchase. dont worry so darn much.

Quote of the day.... Beautifully put!:)

[Rower_CPU]

Originally posted by dwishbone
personally i think it was a mistake for Jobs to have his 3Ghz in a year comment. because we are about a year later from the G5's unvailing. if apple doesnt get updated G5's out this month all the "harbinger's of doom" will start showing up again.
...

PowerMac G5s unveiled at WWDC, June 23, 2003 [link (http://www.apple.com/pr/library/2003/jun/23joint.html)]

Today's date is January 28. That's just under 5 months 'til the 1 year is up.

Apple has plenty of time to get to 3GHz.

[Squire]

Originally posted by SiliconAddict
Well, There is no reason why Apple can't at least give a roadmap of where they are planning to go with the their various products. This doesn't mean that they have to give specific details but they could, for example, say. OS X Puma in 2004, OS X Tiger in fall of 2006. This doesn't really give anything away but gives users at least an idea of what to expect.

True.


However, I think a lot of it is not so much a matter of Apple being secretive rather than us being nosy/curious.

I remember before I bought my Canon Powershot G2, I did Net searches for "G3" hoping I would know when the updated model was coming. Nothing. Three weeks after I got it...Boom...G3 released. I haven't checked, but I doubt there's a Powershotrumors.com site.

Squire

[Downdivx]

5 months is plenty of time, especially if Steve was confident enough to promise 3GHz in June. However, 7 months without an upgrade is a little unsettling to a switchers.
Also, 5 months isn't much time for 2 upgrades - first to a midlevel then to 3.0 GHZ. I guess as long as the dual 2.0s are selling well there isn't much reason to rock the boat.

And after thinking about it a little, I also realized that a lot of intel's performance jumps weren't that big. Intel would jump 10% in Ghz but only 3% in performance. So I guess switchers are trading constant, meaningless increases for irregular, significant jumps.

Oh well, I'm still going to switch, but I'm also still waiting a month or so.

W

PS: As for best you can, when you can - certainly true, but I'm a college student, this will be my BIG purchase for a while, and because I'm in video editing, it will make a difference in my performance in the real world. Every little bit helps alot.

[Counterfit]

Originally posted by Downdivx
PS: As for best you can, when you can - certainly true, but I'm a college student, this will be my BIG purchase for a while, Exactly. Before my PB, my "BIG purchase" was my Schwinn Moab in the spring of '01. It just sits at home in garage collecting dust now, I need to ride much more this summer.

[MacBoyX]

Originally posted by Downdivx
5 months is plenty of time, especially if Steve was confident enough to promise 3GHz in June. However, 7 months without an upgrade is a little unsettling to a switchers.
Also, 5 months isn't much time for 2 upgrades - first to a midlevel then to 3.0 GHZ. I guess as long as the dual 2.0s are selling well there isn't much reason to rock the boat.

And after thinking about it a little, I also realized that a lot of intel's performance jumps weren't that big. Intel would jump 10% in Ghz but only 3% in performance. So I guess switchers are trading constant, meaningless increases for irregular, significant jumps.

Oh well, I'm still going to switch, but I'm also still waiting a month or so.

W

PS: As for best you can, when you can - certainly true, but I'm a college student, this will be my BIG purchase for a while, and because I'm in video editing, it will make a difference in my performance in the real world. Every little bit helps alot.

Umm...ok I see where you're coming from but just because you buy a 2.0GHz Dual G5 and next month a dual 3.0GHz comes out , your 2.0GHz dualie is not outdated, or a crappy machine. I really think this is a major stumbling block in the switch of Wintel people (I know, I am one). When I used PCs I never sat and worried that the PC i bought was going to JUMP MHz or GHz, I just bought when I needed to buy.

I have 2.0GHz G5 and I am not gonna throw it away when the 3.0GHz G5s come out, it will still be a kick ass machine. I can see not wanting to buy a PM G4 when the G5 was around the corner (and we did know abt that via rumor sites) but this is just like finding out that the Accord you bought in 2003 had a 200HP V6 and the 2004 has 240HP. Your Accord isn't trash, it still gets you to work and pretty damn quickly.

Just buy, and don't worry. It's a fact, as soon as you buy, things will change. The machine you bought will still do what you need.

Also I think since I switched, I stopped worrying about having the "FASTEST, GREATEST, and NEWEST" and started worrying about having a machine that does what I ask.

Just my opinion.

macboyx

[Downdivx]

To quote my father, Change is the Only Constant
;)

W

[rainman::|:|]

apple is as secretive as any other PC maker. it's a maliciously competitive industry, even rumor sites like this one probably put Apple at a disadvantage. If Apple made their updates at regular intervals, we would inevitably get screwed, as technology and processor speeds aren't going to follow that schedule. i'd rather Apple release things when they can, rather than having a 3ghz G5 but not releasing it for 5 months to wait for the next product cycle.

paul

[toughboy]

quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by dwishbone
buy the best you can when you can. enjoy your purchase. dont worry so darn much.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------



Quote of the day.... Beautifully put!

I agree.. take me for instance.. I bought my 12"PB and next month Apple released 15.2"PBs with backlit keyboard.. and I really didnt get disappointed, all I do is turning on the LCDs light a bit more :)

[dwishbone]

i know there is still plenty of time to reach 3 ghz. i have faith they will. my point was anytime there seems to be any sort of setback people start talking about the death of apple.
there is always going to be something bigger and better down the pike...whether tomorrow...a year from now. its good to know yes. but say you wait 6 months. something great comes out. in another few months something better will be out. as i said...buy the best you can when you can. thats all you can do. look at me. i bought a Titanium 15 a few days AFTER the AlBooks were announced. I sized up the options and the TiBook at the time was still a better overall deal. The laptop is great then. It's great now. It will still be great 2 years from now most likely. I bought a 2x2 G5. It rocks. I knew that in 6 months they would probably have a 2.5 or so...and in a year 3. i didnt care. my machine is fast now...it will be fast then. there is very little that can really push a G5. i can use photoshop, final cut, audio apps, and everything else very fast. a 3ghz machine wont make that much difference to me. i dont regret either of my recent mac purchases. they are both great machines.

[billyboy]

I would agree that is best for your sanity to buy the best you can afford and enjoy it. I dont think upgrades say with G4 Powerbooks is anything to lose sleep over, even now my 867MHz is still pretty much up to speed with the latest G4. However, the difference between buying the best G4 Powermac and the G5 that came out say a month later, that would be annoying. But the stakes for Apple are that much higher with a brand new product line, juggling old stock with potential demand for new untried product, have they got the price right, blah blah blah. It makes good sense for them just to release stuff as and when they can.

You could also look at new releases from the other way round. Now the PowerMac is a G5, take a look at prices of dual processor g4s. Maybe hang out for new upgrades in order to get what is good now, a lot chaeaper. My PB is 25% cheaper now than last year and is a total bargain for a first time PB owner.

Apple do play the information game really well. Nobody knows with any certainty about any release unil the day before, if we are lucky. And I think it wouldnt be totally inconsistent for Apple to release a 3GHz PowerMac, way before June. If garageband can come out of nowhere... and the press releases from IBM about the new processors, do you really think the public are kept totally uptodate with what is going on behind the scenes?

[Counterfit]

Originally posted by billyboy
Nobody knows with any certainty about any release unil the day before, if we are lucky. Or maybe the Thursday night before ;)

[Mav451]

What makes the difference in the WinTel world is that everything is advanced, separately.

With Mac's, they release total packages--whereas, in the PC world, yes, Intel may release the exorbitant $1,000 chip, 3.2Ghz EE.

The difference is that it makes the "lower" models, cheaper--while at the SAME time not forcing a TOTAL upgrade.

Apple does not release motherboards or cpus. The closest they get to that is BTO's...but again, a TOTAL upgrade--which is very problematic--and is probably the cause of the perpetuation of rumor sites like these. Each new product is relatively expensive, representing a substantial and significant investment.

On the other hand, in the PC world, a new cpu release means cheaper prices for the older models--and it is usually a quick an easy swap (Pentium 4 2.4Ghz to a 3.2Ghz for example).

Upgrades are that much harder on the Apple side with the "a,b,c" (e.g. 1.6g5, 1.8, 2.0) model-based marketing.

*The ironic thing is, I too am waiting for something--a video card upgrade. Either nVidia/ATi will release a new card, and the older model prices will plummet--pointing to an opportune purchasing time window. Unfortunately, nVidiarumors or ATirumors.com does not exist :(

[hob]

hmmm... well, being a switcher to my G3 iBook I was... mildly dissapointed that the G4 iBook came out LITERALLY a month later... It's a really hard thing to decide - if they'd told me it was coming out soon, it would have made me wait for the release... so, if they did that then i'm sure it'd affect sales...

I read in a Dilbert book once that a tech company had been set-up, promising a certain spec of their product in august. It came out, but at the same time they anounced their next model of the product due in march... So many potential customers were put off their purchases to wait for the next product... they repeated this with version 3... and then went bust!!

I would have probably held of on purchasing the iBook if i'd have known a new one was on the way, but they'd have definately had my custom for the new iBook... Maybe a product map is the best way.... or if they actually said "We're updating iBooks every october" and this was common knowledge, then everyone would buy their iBooks at an appropriate time......

Hob

[pdrayton]

buy the best you can when you can. enjoy your purchase. dont worry so darn much.
I agree with dwishbone and other posters in this sentiment.

As a recent switcher I have to say that my "switch" was influenced most by mainstream press articles detailing accurate current comparisons of PowerBooks with wintel notebooks and showing that PowerBooks weren't "underpowered" and "more expensive" as my Mac friends said.

I briefly considered an iBook, but it was apparent from Apple's product line that a G3 processor was soon to be history (after all, everything else had either a G4 or a G5).

Rumors of speed bumps don't impress me if I know that a current product will meet my short-term and long-term needs. Mind you, rumors are fun, but when unfounded rumors (and I've seen that the vast majority are way off mark) devolve into encouraging people not to buy a product that's "a fit" then a problem is being created for both consumers and Apple.

I don't think Apple is being too secretive. I think Apple is trying to protect itself from well-meaning, yet misguided, "loyal" customers who are having a negative impact on expanding its customer base.