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MacRumors
Feb 10, 2004, 08:34 AM
David Hyatt posts (http://weblogs.mozillazine.org/hyatt/archives/2004_02.html#004874) a detailed log of improvements that can be found in Safari 1.2.

Changes cover LiveConnect, Downloads, Printing, Accessibility, CSS, DHTML, Caching and more...

Safari 1.2 was recently released (http://www.macrumors.com/pages/2004/02/20040202165215.shtml) by Apple for Mac OS X 10.3 users.

scorpion
Feb 10, 2004, 08:35 AM
The biggest difference for me is the printing -- it finally works!

And my banking works just fine -- has since 1.1.

davy the bunny
Feb 10, 2004, 08:42 AM
Now that I can tab to menuboxes and radio buttons, I'm happy.

jholzner
Feb 10, 2004, 08:50 AM
I want Safari to support the viewing of PDFs in the browser and nativly. I use the PDF plug-in now but I can't print PDFs from the browser...I just get blank pages.

griz
Feb 10, 2004, 08:55 AM
Now if they would only fix the issue of having to use Internet Explorer for online banking.
With no IE updates coming and Safari unable to be used for my online transactions, I get increasing apprehensive about continuing to do "secure" online activity with IE.Safari needs to do everything 100% as well as IE or else it will never completely replace it. Sooner or later people will either be forced to stop doing secure online business where IE is required or we will all need two machines, one with Windows and IE and our Macs with Safari. Sooner or later, someone is going to exploit a gaping hole in IE5 for Mac and we will be forced to fully retire it.

DGFan
Feb 10, 2004, 09:07 AM
And, conveniently, it also screws up some websites that had been working properly prior to 1.2 (and do work properly in gecko-based, IE, etc...)

nfldraftblitz is one such site. The text is all gone now!!!

Frobozz
Feb 10, 2004, 09:12 AM
Originally posted by jholzner
I want Safari to support the viewing of PDFs in the browser and nativly. I use the PDF plug-in now but I can't print PDFs from the browser...I just get blank pages.

Why not use the Preview application? It's much faster and prints just fine.

tileeater
Feb 10, 2004, 09:12 AM
i've got 2 macs running panther and safari 1.2 both have the same tabs issue. it's impossible to tell if a tab will open or if it will decide not to show up. this is only an issue when 'always show tab bar' is not checked.

occasionally (pretty often actually) the tab bar just decides to stay hidden.

Frobozz
Feb 10, 2004, 09:16 AM
Originally posted by DGFan
And, conveniently, it also screws up some websites that had been working properly prior to 1.2 (and do work properly in gecko-based, IE, etc...)

nfldraftblitz is one such site. The text is all gone now!!!

Before jumping to conclusions about Safari being to blame, you might want to do some snooping on the site. It might be a Safari bug, or it might be a web site bug that, up until now, Safari was able to make up for the incorrect code.

A little known fact about Mozilla, and many other browsers, is that they have multiple render modes for HTML. They look at the structure of the document, the DTD, and any legacy support and will render a page in either "Standards Compliance Mode" or "Quirks Mode." If the web site was able to fool Safari into thinking it was Standards compliant, but it was actually Quirky (wrong), then you _might_ end up with what you are seeing.

Frobozz
Feb 10, 2004, 09:22 AM
Originally posted by griz
Now if they would only fix the issue of having to use Internet Explorer for online banking.
With no IE updates coming and Safari unable to be used for my online transactions, I get increasing apprehensive about continuing to do "secure" online activity with IE.Safari needs to do everything 100% as well as IE or else it will never completely replace it. Sooner or later people will either be forced to stop doing secure online business where IE is required or we will all need two machines, one with Windows and IE and our Macs with Safari. Sooner or later, someone is going to exploit a gaping hole in IE5 for Mac and we will be forced to fully retire it.

You need to write the authors of the web site. There is no reason why Safari can't run any banking web site out there. It's the result of legacy code either not identifying the feature set of a browser correctly, or simply blocking anything but a small subset of browsers.

Web programmers often make the mistake of coding a page to only work in IE, when all they really want to say (in their code) is that they require feature "X". When a new browser comes out that supports feature "X", but is blocked in the scripts instead of asking if the browser supports feature "X", you get the problem you're seeing on your bank web sites.

So write the web site and kindly ask them to get their act together. In Safari's defense, I can log on to my banking web sites... and they total 5 individual vendors.

gwuMACaddict
Feb 10, 2004, 09:30 AM
Originally posted by griz
Now if they would only fix the issue of having to use Internet Explorer for online banking.

i bank with wachovia just fine with safari... manage multiple accounts and transfer money between, pay bills and use it for an ameritrade account....

sushi
Feb 10, 2004, 09:30 AM
Originally posted by griz
Now if they would only fix the issue of having to use Internet Explorer for online banking.
With no IE updates coming and Safari unable to be used for my online transactions, I get increasing apprehensive about continuing to do "secure" online activity with IE.Safari needs to do everything 100% as well as IE or else it will never completely replace it. Sooner or later people will either be forced to stop doing secure online business where IE is required or we will all need two machines, one with Windows and IE and our Macs with Safari. Sooner or later, someone is going to exploit a gaping hole in IE5 for Mac and we will be forced to fully retire it.
You might try adding the debug menu to Safari.

Then select the USER AGENT as IE something (Mac 5.2 or Win 6.0). Or just have Safari select automatically.

I found that most sites that didn't work because they check for IE, now do because Safari looks like IE.

Works for me! :-)

...of course you could always respectfully suggest to the sites that don't work that maybe they could alter their code to allow Safari to work.

Sushi

Spock
Feb 10, 2004, 09:40 AM
Originally posted by sushi

...of course you could always respectfully suggest to the sites that don't work that maybe they could alter their code to allow Safari to work.

Sushi

Thats funny, and if we ask the game companys respectfully that they will port all games to the mac at the same time it comes out for the PC

batmanppc
Feb 10, 2004, 09:41 AM
Originally posted by jholzner
I want Safari to support the viewing of PDFs in the browser and nativly. I use the PDF plug-in now but I can't print PDFs from the browser...I just get blank pages.

Safari can't print anything that's being viewed through plugins afaik. You can print PDF from safari by bringing up the contextual menu on the pdf (control-click) or use the menu triangle right above the vertical scrollbar.

SilentPanda
Feb 10, 2004, 09:42 AM
Originally posted by sushi
Then select the USER AGENT as IE something (Mac 5.2 or Win 6.0). Or just have Safari select automatically.

I've thought about doing this but at the same time... I want them to know that I'm using Safari. If every browser identifies itself as IE then why *should* they write code for standards compliant browsers if they think you're using IE? I would suggest that you run it identifying as Safari and if it doesn't work, try it identifying as IE. If that works then e-mail the webmaster to get them to change it. Then switch it back to Safari.

bperkins
Feb 10, 2004, 09:45 AM
Originally posted by jholzner
I want Safari to support the viewing of PDFs in the browser and nativly. I use the PDF plug-in now but I can't print PDFs from the browser...I just get blank pages.

If you want this feature now try this pdf Safari plug in:

http://www.schubert-it.com/pluginpdf/

sushi
Feb 10, 2004, 09:55 AM
Originally posted by SilentPanda
I've thought about doing this but at the same time... I want them to know that I'm using Safari. If every browser identifies itself as IE then why *should* they write code for standards compliant browsers if they think you're using IE? I would suggest that you run it identifying as Safari and if it doesn't work, try it identifying as IE. If that works then e-mail the webmaster to get them to change it. Then switch it back to Safari.
Agree.

Right now, I am letting Safari identify itself.

Only when I have a problem do I switch.

...well, sometimes I forget. But for the most part, that is what I do. And with the IE workaround, I haven't had trouble with any sites...knock on wood!

Sushi

DGFan
Feb 10, 2004, 09:57 AM
Originally posted by Frobozz
Why not use the Preview application? It's much faster and prints just fine.

How do you get the PDF to show in Preview automatically? I would rather not have to hunt for it on the desktop and double-click it.

DGFan
Feb 10, 2004, 09:59 AM
Originally posted by Frobozz
Before jumping to conclusions about Safari being to blame, you might want to do some snooping on the site. It might be a Safari bug, or it might be a web site bug that, up until now, Safari was able to make up for the incorrect code.

A little known fact about Mozilla, and many other browsers, is that they have multiple render modes for HTML. They look at the structure of the document, the DTD, and any legacy support and will render a page in either "Standards Compliance Mode" or "Quirks Mode." If the web site was able to fool Safari into thinking it was Standards compliant, but it was actually Quirky (wrong), then you _might_ end up with what you are seeing.

That's simply the cost of entry into the browser market. I work in the software industry and I know what a bug is - anything software does that doesn't meet the customer's expectations.

uv23
Feb 10, 2004, 10:02 AM
For the love of God, add cache control, Apple! Maybe it's a coincidence, but since installing 1.2 I have to constantly manually refresh most of the forums I visit to see updated threads and topics. Why can't they just add an option to check for a new version of a page each time, like every single other browser out there... *sigh*:rolleyes:

Photorun
Feb 10, 2004, 10:10 AM
I second those who had sites that worked fine before Safari 1.2 but now don't. I've found three such sites, one is JAVA intensive so it may be the JAVA update on that one.

tduality
Feb 10, 2004, 10:41 AM
Originally posted by Photorun
I second those who had sites that worked fine before Safari 1.2 but now don't. I've found three such sites, one is JAVA intensive so it may be the JAVA update on that one.

Looks like I'm one of the happy guys who can use my internet banking and another Java heavy site since Safari 1.2 without any problems. Didn't work at all with Safari 1.1.

griz
Feb 10, 2004, 10:42 AM
After switching to IE spoofing, my online banking works. Now that I know this. I will be sure to contact them to ask them to allow Safari users rather than having to spoof everytime I want to log on. The best part of this is knowing that I don't need to use IE anymore. WOOOOO HOOOOO!!! Do the dance of joy!!!!

andyduncan
Feb 10, 2004, 10:44 AM
I love 1.2, but the decision to make the delete key function as a back button is the bane of my existence. I know thats how other browsers do it, but it's a poor design decision that shouldn't be repeated just because a vocal group of people want it.

billyboy
Feb 10, 2004, 10:48 AM
Originally posted by bperkins
If you want this feature now try this pdf Safari plug in:

http://www.schubert-it.com/pluginpdf/

I used to have this plug in with Jaguar and it was great, but it just seems obsolete now with the speed that PDFs get opened in Panther. Or does it have some other nifty features I never found out about?

mrsebastian
Feb 10, 2004, 10:56 AM
downloading the new safari right now :D the one thing that grabs me from the improvements, is the ability to continue downloads! nothing more frustrating than trying to dl from a slow site and not having it finish.

stcanard
Feb 10, 2004, 11:04 AM
Originally posted by griz
After switching to IE spoofing, my online banking works. Now that I know this. I will be sure to contact them to ask them to allow Safari users rather than having to spoof everytime I want to log on. The best part of this is knowing that I don't need to use IE anymore. WOOOOO HOOOOO!!! Do the dance of joy!!!!

I always figure the best option (and gives them a CYA) is:

request that if they haven't been able to test other browsers sufficiently and are worried about quality control and compatibility issues (much better than saying "you're idiots"), use the browser detection code to throw a splash page warning that there may be compatibility issues, with a link allowing you to continue as long as you are aware it may not work.

That gives the company an out, and makes the managers feel better, as it is often a business ("we don't have time to test anything other than IE"), rather than a technical decision to block browsers.

I never have understood why people don't do that in the first place. Why would I want to forcefully exclude potential customers from my site?

A perfect example of what I'm talking about is here:

http://ee.canada.com/Default/Layout/CapScreens/BP_Warrning.asp?skin=VancouverSun&Daily=VASN&GZ=T

(may only work if you're in safari or mozilla/firefox)

fraeone
Feb 10, 2004, 11:07 AM
Originally posted by griz
With no IE updates coming and Safari unable to be used for my online transactions, I get increasing apprehensive about continuing to do "secure" online activity with IE.Safari needs to do everything 100% as well as IE or else it will never completely replace it. Sooner or later people will either be forced to stop doing secure online business where IE is required or we will all need two machines, one with Windows and IE and our Macs with Safari. Sooner or later, someone is going to exploit a gaping hole in IE5 for Mac and we will be forced to fully retire it.

I deleted IE the first day I got my Mac, I don't think I ever even ran it. For sites that don't work with Safari I always use Mozilla FireFox! with much success. FireFox also has a new name and a new version (used to be Firebird) and a more mac-friendly gui.

Safari is #1 on my Mac, w/ FireFox a close second. When I use a PC, FireFox is the only thing I will touch. Down with IE!

Localcelebrity
Feb 10, 2004, 11:08 AM
Originally posted by tileeater
i've got 2 macs running panther and safari 1.2 both have the same tabs issue. it's impossible to tell if a tab will open or if it will decide not to show up. this is only an issue when 'always show tab bar' is not checked.

occasionally (pretty often actually) the tab bar just decides to stay hidden.

dude i was beginning to think i was the only one with this problem... it's such a weird bug, especially given that they did like no noticable UI changes in this release

Frobozz
Feb 10, 2004, 11:09 AM
Originally posted by DGFan
How do you get the PDF to show in Preview automatically? I would rather not have to hunt for it on the desktop and double-click it.

I believe if you select any file that ends with .pdf, then get info on it, you will be able to choose the opening application. In that section of the get info dialog box, you can click the button that says "change all." This should make all apps that end with the same file extension open with the application you just chose.

Frobozz
Feb 10, 2004, 11:11 AM
Originally posted by DGFan
That's simply the cost of entry into the browser market. I work in the software industry and I know what a bug is - anything software does that doesn't meet the customer's expectations.


As yes, but you know what your target operating environment will be. A web developer only knows generalities, and must account for them. I work as a web designer in a software engineering company.

I see both side of the coin, really. But making a web site that works in many different browsers has, thankfully, become much easier once Netscape 4.x is abandonded for good... and it is. As for IE 5.5, we have to wait a little longer. Ugh. What a piece of crap that is.

Frobozz
Feb 10, 2004, 11:13 AM
Originally posted by andyduncan
I love 1.2, but the decision to make the delete key function as a back button is the bane of my existence. I know thats how other browsers do it, but it's a poor design decision that shouldn't be repeated just because a vocal group of people want it.

Amen.

garybooberry
Feb 10, 2004, 11:19 AM
I still cannot "tab around" in forms to radio buttons, drop down menus etc. - on two Macs (a Sawtooth G4 and an MDD G4).

Is there a pref. setting, because I can't find it...

garybooberry
Feb 10, 2004, 11:22 AM
Nevermind.
Duh.

neutrino23
Feb 10, 2004, 11:23 AM
Originally posted by griz
Now if they would only fix the issue of having to use Internet Explorer for online banking. ...

Works fine for Wells Fargo. The beta didn't.

When I have problems with a web site like this I send them an email and respectfully request they upgrade their code to meet standards.

DGFan
Feb 10, 2004, 12:42 PM
Originally posted by Frobozz
I believe if you select any file that ends with .pdf, then get info on it, you will be able to choose the opening application. In that section of the get info dialog box, you can click the button that says "change all." This should make all apps that end with the same file extension open with the application you just chose.

That's not what I asked. I asked how I get a PDF to show up in Preview automatically - without double clicking on the PDF. Here's what I want to happen:

1. click on PDF link in Safari
2. PDF appears in Preview

Is there a way to do this?

DGFan
Feb 10, 2004, 12:44 PM
Originally posted by Frobozz
As yes, but you know what your target operating environment will be. A web developer only knows generalities, and must account for them. I work as a web designer in a software engineering company.

I do too (at least until I go to law school this year! :)

Originally posted by Frobozz
I see both side of the coin, really. But making a web site that works in many different browsers has, thankfully, become much easier once Netscape 4.x is abandonded for good... and it is. As for IE 5.5, we have to wait a little longer. Ugh. What a piece of crap that is.

I am so glad Netscape 4.x is off the radar. And IE5.5 is not far behind. I had some great pages working in IE5.5 and then one of the MS security updates came along and seriously broke them. At least they still work in IE6!!

MacBandit
Feb 10, 2004, 01:48 PM
Originally posted by jholzner
I want Safari to support the viewing of PDFs in the browser and nativly. I use the PDF plug-in now but I can't print PDFs from the browser...I just get blank pages.

I don't think you know all the features of the PDF-Plug-IN.

When a PDF loads in your browser a little arrow pointing to the right will appear above the scroll bar on the right side. If you click it you will get options to open the PDF (this will open the PDF without saving it to disk to your PDF viewer of choice). You will also have options to save, print, and zoom.

SilentPanda
Feb 10, 2004, 02:06 PM
Originally posted by DGFan
That's not what I asked. I asked how I get a PDF to show up in Preview automatically - without double clicking on the PDF. Here's what I want to happen:

1. click on PDF link in Safari
2. PDF appears in Preview

Is there a way to do this?

That's what happens on my machine... you might have to enable in the preferences the "Open 'safe' files automagically after download" option.

Also if that isn't your flavor I'm certain a folder action would do the trick.

coolsoldier
Feb 10, 2004, 02:19 PM
I get this weird bug in Safari where sometimes the address bar will disappear when I scroll a large page. It still shows up as "on" though, and if you click where it's "supposed" to be, it lets you type an address (but you can't see what you are typing). Apparently the only way to get it back is to quit.

Also, I am pleased that tabbing to non-typing controls only happens when you have "full keyboard access" turned on in the keyboard preference pane.

SilentPanda
Feb 10, 2004, 02:28 PM
coolsoldier: same things happens to me on occassion... 'cept I just have half an address bar... it's weird... so I just close the window and reopen a new one... no idea why it happens though... can't even remember what site it always happened on...

sjk
Feb 10, 2004, 02:50 PM
My major gripe with Safari 1.2 is how changes for full keyboard access apparently interfere with emacs-style keybindings for navigation while text editing, even tho' I don't have full keyboard access enabled(!)

For example, if I type control-p while editing this forum reply the "Preview Reply" button/action is run instead of moving the text input cursor to the previous line like in older versions.

It's bad enough not having undo/redo while text editing in Safari. Now it's even more crippled since it's not obvious which unwanted actions may happen when typing certain control characters since they differ depending on the site. And I haven't found a way to disable this annoying new "feature".

coolfactor
Feb 10, 2004, 03:29 PM
Originally posted by griz
Now if they would only fix the issue of having to use Internet Explorer for online banking.
With no IE updates coming and Safari unable to be used for my online transactions, I get increasing apprehensive about continuing to do "secure" online activity with IE.Safari needs to do everything 100% as well as IE or else it will never completely replace it. Sooner or later people will either be forced to stop doing secure online business where IE is required or we will all need two machines, one with Windows and IE and our Macs with Safari. Sooner or later, someone is going to exploit a gaping hole in IE5 for Mac and we will be forced to fully retire it.

I've been able to do online banking since version 1.0 beta. Which bank are you with?

Macette
Feb 10, 2004, 03:54 PM
There's just one feature I really notice the absence of... When I have a whole of tabs open in one window, I often close the window accidentally, when I meant to only close the front tab. I would love a preference that I could tick to say "Ask me before closing a window with hidden tabs" or something like that.

I notice that the Omniweb beta has this feature :)

j33pd0g
Feb 10, 2004, 04:10 PM
Can anyone else please see if this page gives the new Safari a problem: http://wwwapps.ups.com/etracking/tracking.cgi. It's the page where you go to track your order. Used to work for me.

Rasmuskl
Feb 10, 2004, 06:07 PM
Originally posted by j33pd0g
Can anyone else please see if this page gives the new Safari a problem: http://wwwapps.ups.com/etracking/tracking.cgi. It's the page where you go to track your order. Used to work for me.


Works fine for me. :)

j33pd0g
Feb 10, 2004, 06:21 PM
Thanks. I got it to work after I emptied the cache, and restarted Safari.

The Ancients
Feb 10, 2004, 06:28 PM
Originally posted by Spock
Thats funny, and if we ask the game companys respectfully that they will port all games to the mac at the same time it comes out for the PC

One large difference here - making a web site standards compliant (or even well-formed) from the start enables all modern browsers to access the site. Porting games requires a rewrite of the code specifically for OS X.

..k

The Ancients
Feb 10, 2004, 06:31 PM
Originally posted by DGFan
That's simply the cost of entry into the browser market. I work in the software industry and I know what a bug is - anything software does that doesn't meet the customer's expectations.

In that case, then IE is full of them - for example, I expect it to render a box model correctly.

rdowns
Feb 10, 2004, 06:45 PM
Originally posted by gwuMACaddict
i bank with wachovia just fine with safari... manage multiple accounts and transfer money between, pay bills and use it for an ameritrade account....

Safari has always worked for me on JP Morgan Chase's banking site, my American Express brokerage accounts, TD Waterhouse and ING Direct. Transfer funds, pay bills, buy stocks and mutual funds.

Seems the problem is not Safari, it's your bank.

I run the web division of my company and our quoting system did not work on Safari. IT said, no big deal, there are so few Macs. I ran the WebTrends browser report and showed my boss that Macs represented just under 11% of our visitors. Quote system works in Safari now. Took our web developer under 2 hours to fix it.

MacBandit
Feb 10, 2004, 06:48 PM
Originally posted by uv23
For the love of God, add cache control, Apple! Maybe it's a coincidence, but since installing 1.2 I have to constantly manually refresh most of the forums I visit to see updated threads and topics. Why can't they just add an option to check for a new version of a page each time, like every single other browser out there... *sigh*:rolleyes:

Get a program like Safari Enhancer (http://www.versiontracker.com/dyn/moreinfo/macosx/17776) and turn off caching if you are on a broadband connection of some sort. Pages will actually load faster because it won't have to check to see if it's chached.

It would be nice if this was an option in Safari though.

illumin8
Feb 10, 2004, 06:52 PM
My work uses a client-side SSL certificate that they issue to us to authenticate into our customer support database. This is one of the features that Safari 1.2 "supposedly" supports now. Well, it still doesn't work, not even after importing the private key and certificate into my keychain. Has anyone else gotten this feature to work? I have to use Mozilla FireFox in order to access this site, and I really would like to be 100% Safari.

Also, while I'm bitching about SSL connectivity, has anyone ever noticed that Safari hogs 100% of the CPU whenever it's doing SSL handshaking? This is completely unacceptable and smacks of poor coding. Mozilla FireFox is able to negotiate SSL just fine without eating more than 1 or 2 percent of the CPU, but whenever I use Safari, or even Mail.app (I use IMAP over SSL for my email), I can count on my CPU usage spiking to 100% every time I request a page. Apple needs to get off their ass and fix this browser. It's kind of sad when the code it's based on (gecko and Konqueror) is a better browser than Safari is. You'd think that Apple would have at least improved it, not made it worse.

MacBandit
Feb 10, 2004, 06:52 PM
Originally posted by billyboy
I used to have this plug in with Jaguar and it was great, but it just seems obsolete now with the speed that PDFs get opened in Panther. Or does it have some other nifty features I never found out about?

Well for one it opens PDFs right in Safari without having to download them to your disk. From there if you want to open it in Preview without saving it to disk just go to the right pointing triangle above the right hand scroll bar and click open. It will open in Preview directly from Safari.

tny
Feb 10, 2004, 08:52 PM
Originally posted by Spock
Thats funny, and if we ask the game companys respectfully that they will port all games to the mac at the same time it comes out for the PC

Apples and oranges. There are plenty of banks that work fine in Safari (for instance, Sovereign Bank, BankNorth, in addition to the other banks mentioned here). So, if they don't fix their banking system for non-IE users, non-IE users can use another bank.

Doctor Q
Feb 10, 2004, 09:43 PM
With Safari 1.2, I still don't get a control-click choice to Copy Image Address to Clipboard, or words to that effect. Grrrr.

MacBandit
Feb 11, 2004, 12:16 AM
Originally posted by tileeater
i've got 2 macs running panther and safari 1.2 both have the same tabs issue. it's impossible to tell if a tab will open or if it will decide not to show up. this is only an issue when 'always show tab bar' is not checked.

occasionally (pretty often actually) the tab bar just decides to stay hidden.

I had this problem with Safari for a couple days after the update. I then ran all the options in System Optimizer X (http://www.versiontracker.com/dyn/moreinfo/macosx/17776) and repaired the permissions and I haven't had the problem for at least 3 days when I was having it a couple times a day prior to the repairs.

System Optimizer is just another program to run nightly/weekly/monthly tasks, prebind, and empty caches. You can also use programs like Onyx or Cocktail or run the tasks from the terminal if you know how. After I ran it I started up on the OSX install disk and ran permissions from there. I learned quite a while ago that the best way to repair permissions was from a different startup disk.

MacBandit
Feb 11, 2004, 12:22 AM
Originally posted by garybooberry
I still cannot "tab around" in forms to radio buttons, drop down menus etc. - on two Macs (a Sawtooth G4 and an MDD G4).

Is there a pref. setting, because I can't find it...

You should have an option in Safari preferences to under advanced to tab to links if you do select the option you like there. Once you have done that and reasured me that you indeed have the updated Safari by having that option go to the system preferences. There go to the keyboard prefpane and then within that prefpane select the keyboard shortcuts tab. At the bottom left of the window is an option to turn on full keyboard access. Turn it on. Once you have done this you can tab to anything within the currently active window area. For instance if you click on the button bar of a Safari window you can tab through the buttons. On the other hand if you click on the active page area of a Safari window you will only tab through the links (if you set that option in the Safari prefs) and the input areas and buttons etc.. This will work within any program now that you turned on full keyboard access.