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View Full Version : Why Apple just lost a sale




coldmack
Sep 16, 2009, 01:47 AM
http://www.engadget.com/2009/09/16/video-l-sony-nw-a840-packs-oled-noise-cancellation-and-64gb-of/

Apple Nano size with out the unless camera, a larger screen than both the Nano and Classic, noise canceling better standard headphones(and sound I assume) and 64gb of space. Those are Asian prices, so American price should be a good bit lower to be a little more competive with the Nano.

Come on Apple don't let the Nano line stagnet. I don't want a 64gb touch screen player, I want a compact 64gb Nano, with out a silly camera. And don't say iPod Classic as that is HDD device, and I want a flash device for the gym.

WE HAVE TO FIGHT THE MAC TO IMPROVE THE MAC!



ziggyonice
Sep 16, 2009, 01:50 AM
That's pretty ugly.

Sure, it's got some nice specs, but it's not an iPod.

sammich
Sep 16, 2009, 01:51 AM
Sony releasing a new nano competitor only steals 1 sale from Apple? Sounds alright to me :D

newcronos
Sep 16, 2009, 02:00 AM
That's pretty ugly.

Sure, it's got some nice specs, but it's not an iPod.

and *that* is why Apple can just do whatever they want without worrying :D

coldmack
Sep 16, 2009, 02:05 AM
That's pretty ugly.

Sure, it's got some nice specs, but it's not an iPod.

This comment does not compute. So its not an iPod it seems to better. The main purpose of any mp3 player, including the ipod line, is to play music, and from the reviews I saw of the preivous Sony it is better at playing music vs the ipod line, the sole reason for many of us getting an mp3 player. It doesn't use any software so it shows up as external drive so we can manage our music with iTunes, and then just drag it on to the player. I don't see what the problem is here? Unless your talking about looks, which is a wash in my opinion, which then goes back to specs which this takes.

and *that* is why Apple can just do whatever they want without worrying :D
amen!

bloodycape
Sep 16, 2009, 02:12 AM
Sony releasing a new nano competitor only steals 1 sale from Apple? Sounds alright to me :D
Unless people start realizing the Nano line has not see a space increase in a while and in order to get a larger space player you either have to step up to the Classic or Touch which some may find larger or offers more than they want. Then if a person is at a store like Best Buy or Fry's they may see that Sony or some other compact 32gb+ mp3 player and go, why can't Apple offer that to us?

rgarjr
Sep 16, 2009, 02:16 AM
like others say, competition is a good thing.

anjinha
Sep 16, 2009, 02:20 AM
It doesn't use any software so it shows up as external drive so we can manage our music with iTunes, and then just drag it on to the player. I don't see what the problem is here? Unless your talking about looks, which is a wash in my opinion, which then goes back to specs which this takes.


amen!

And iTunes is a big part of why I, and I'm sure a lot of other people, stick with iPods. Drag and drop doesn't do it for me.

chrono1081
Sep 16, 2009, 02:38 AM
Um, unless sony has REALLY changed since I last owned a sony mp3 player have fun with their mandatory atrac format and only being able to transfer songs 3 times back and forth from the device.

Like I said maybe things have changed since I owned one.

gnasher729
Sep 16, 2009, 02:52 AM
http://www.engadget.com/2009/09/16/video-l-sony-nw-a840-packs-oled-noise-cancellation-and-64gb-of/

Apple Nano size with out the unless camera, a larger screen than both the Nano and Classic, noise canceling better standard headphones(and sound I assume) and 64gb of space. Those are Asian prices, so American price should be a good bit lower to be a little more competive with the Nano.

Come on Apple don't let the Nano line stagnet. I don't want a 64gb touch screen player, I want a compact 64gb Nano, with out a silly camera. And don't say iPod Classic as that is HDD device, and I want a flash device for the gym.

WE HAVE TO FIGHT THE MAC TO IMPROVE THE MAC!

The price is $263 for 16 GB, compared to $179 for a Nano with 16 GB. Sony $439 for 64 GB, iPod Touch $399. And the thing is massively big compared to the Nano. Realistically, if this had been released by Apple, there would be a revolution.

j26
Sep 16, 2009, 03:07 AM
Um, unless sony has REALLY changed since I last owned a sony mp3 player have fun with their mandatory atrac format and only being able to transfer songs 3 times back and forth from the device.

Like I said maybe things have changed since I owned one.

They have - I picked up a Sony E Series mp3 for herself a few weeks ago (a radio was essential, so iPods were out at the time) - transfers are easy enough, and it plays the usual formats (AAC, mp3 etc). It was also far cheaper than an iPod.

aygie
Sep 16, 2009, 03:37 AM
Been interested in this for a while, the audio EQ is supposed to be fantastic on it.

nazuk
Sep 16, 2009, 04:05 AM
I don't think Apple will be too worried with this one, it looks fugly to me.

Besides, with iTunes, the iTunes Music Store, and the Apple experience - your not *just* buying a music player, your buying a whole experience and ease of use, and the amount of content available.

In fact, the next iPod killer.... well, Apple is so many years ahead with their "eco-system" that nobody in the forseeable future has any chance whatsoever.

Maybe sometime in a few years, but that's a long way off just yet.

So many of these rivals are so far behind with their offerings, they just don't get it.

Apple, gets it, understands it, does it, and people in ALL corners of the World, buy it.

Fan boy or no fan boy, it really doesn't matter to me - they are just labels, what matters, is that Apple have it so right. And they will do for a very long time.

old-wiz
Sep 16, 2009, 07:25 AM
Oh, sure, install the Sony software for the device on your PC and take a chance on installing another Sony rootkit? Meh.

The device is hideous.

dXTC
Sep 16, 2009, 08:47 AM
The device is hideous.

Leave it to Sony to come up with something that makes the Zune HD look beautiful by comparison. I think Sony was trying to provide a tactile-only control interface for those users who keep it tucked in a pocket. That button cluster being the hot mess that it is, I wouldn't blame the user for hiding it.

And seriously, what's the deal with that faux mono-LCD-pixel background?

EDIT: OMG. I just noticed something. Disney to sue Sony in 3... 2... 1... :D

roland.g
Sep 16, 2009, 10:29 AM
Wow that thing is ugly.

You'll need to keep it in a paper bag so no one sees you using it.

Unspoken Demise
Sep 16, 2009, 10:32 AM
I'm sure Apple stockholders are making MR accounts right now to plead you into staying a loyal Apple customer. Look for usernames such as
Appleluvsyou,
ThatSonyPOSisAPOS, and
OhDearGodOurStocksWillPlummetIfColdMackDoesNotBuyANewiPodTouchBecauseHeHasAHorribleCaseOfEntitlement SyndromeIHaveKidsToFeedPleaseDontDoThisToAppleColdMackWeNEEDYourBusiness.

Spock
Sep 16, 2009, 10:38 AM
I'm sure Apple stockholders are making MR accounts right now to plead you into staying a loyal Apple customer. Look for usernames such as
Appleluvsyou,
ThatSonyPOSisAPOS, and
OhDearGodOurStocksWillPlummetIfColdMackDoesNotBuyANewiPodTouchBecauseHeHasAHorribleCaseOfEntitlement SyndromeIHaveKidsToFeedPleaseDontDoThisToAppleColdMackWeNEEDYourBusiness.

Way to much time on your hands :rolleyes:
I really love the brown color, I have always wanted a player that will match the decore in my toilet.

Unspoken Demise
Sep 16, 2009, 10:40 AM
Way to much time on your hands :rolleyes:
I really love the brown color, I have always wanted a player that will match the decore in my toilet.

Or I type fast. ;)

chrono1081
Sep 16, 2009, 10:54 AM
Oh, sure, install the Sony software for the device on your PC and take a chance on installing another Sony rootkit? Meh.

The device is hideous.

+1 This is why I will never buy another sony anything that requires software.

I have no clue what sony was thinking when they thought installing an unremovable rootkit was a good idea.

iMJustAGuy
Sep 16, 2009, 11:23 AM
You'll need to keep it in a paper bag so no one sees you using it.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

MasterDev
Sep 16, 2009, 11:33 AM
I wonder how much Arsenic is in the glass... :eek:

Or how much Mercury lies within it... :confused:

Or just how recyclable it is... :(

I know not everyone cares on this part, but I really do and I'd imagine others would too. Not only that, but the iPod is just way better with looks, functions, and price.

So iPod for me.

rhett7660
Sep 16, 2009, 12:06 PM
Leave it to Sony to come up with something that makes the Zune HD look beautiful by comparison. I think Sony was trying to provide a tactile-only control interface for those users who keep it tucked in a pocket. That button cluster being the hot mess that it is, I wouldn't blame the user for hiding it.

And seriously, what's the deal with that faux mono-LCD-pixel background?

EDIT: OMG. I just noticed something. Disney to sue Sony in 3... 2... 1... :D

Ok.....I don't see it? Explain please.

wkearney99
Sep 16, 2009, 12:12 PM
I know not everyone cares on this part, but I really do and I'd imagine others would too.

But you conveniently ignore the chinese slave labor used to make it. And the utter horrors of chinese factories polluting their local resources. But hey, you go with that pompous sense of self-righteousness...

bloodycape
Sep 16, 2009, 12:24 PM
Oh, sure, install the Sony software for the device on your PC and take a chance on installing another Sony rootkit? Meh.

The device is hideous.

If someone is installing a software to use this, something is wrong. This is a UMS/MSC device.

JAT
Sep 19, 2009, 02:53 PM
Well, here's why they lost a sale from me. It's en route, so I have no comments on it, yet.

http://www.amazon.com/Witness-2GB-Digital-Recorder-players/dp/B001F51GU2/ref=sr_1_7?ie=UTF8&s=office-products&qid=1253389142&sr=8-7

I've been considering an upgrade to my 1G Touch all summer, waiting for the new models, but fm didn't happen and I don't know that the speed and storage is enough upgrades for another $400 purchase right now. I mean, I do have a functioning Touch, already. The fm implementation on the Nano might have been enough if it was in the Touch since I need to record some fm on occasion, but I just jumped straight to the real thing.

Ugliness matters not.

bloodycape
Sep 19, 2009, 08:08 PM
Well, here's why they lost a sale from me. It's en route, so I have no comments on it, yet.

http://www.amazon.com/Witness-2GB-Digital-Recorder-players/dp/B001F51GU2/ref=sr_1_7?ie=UTF8&s=office-products&qid=1253389142&sr=8-7


Hate to break it to you, but you could have gotten something much better with more features, for the same or even lower price.

sushiman
Sep 19, 2009, 08:16 PM
http://www.engadget.com/2009/09/16/video-l-sony-nw-a840-packs-oled-noise-cancellation-and-64gb-of/

Come on Apple don't let the Nano line stagnet.
WE HAVE TO FIGHT THE MAC TO IMPROVE THE MAC!

Stagnet ...Is that a net for catching stags ? ;)

stagNATE . :apple:

Hayduke60
Sep 19, 2009, 10:43 PM
That was a 60's cop show with small European deer as the main characters.

ironman159
Sep 20, 2009, 12:50 AM
Leave it to Sony to come up with something that makes the Zune HD look beautiful by comparison. I think Sony was trying to provide a tactile-only control interface for those users who keep it tucked in a pocket. That button cluster being the hot mess that it is, I wouldn't blame the user for hiding it.

And seriously, what's the deal with that faux mono-LCD-pixel background?

EDIT: OMG. I just noticed something. Disney to sue Sony in 3... 2... 1... :D

I thought I got that last part... but really... I didn't. Care to explain? Yes I know... it's probably so obvious, but I'm kinda slow. :D

SactoGuy18
Sep 20, 2009, 11:01 AM
You can all laugh now, but one thing Paul Thurrott (of WinSuperSite.com and Windows Weekly podcast fame) suggested is that Microsoft may be on the verge of merging Windows Media Player and the Zune software into a singular program.

If that happens, that could be a gigantic game changer, since I've played around with the with Zune software program and it's actually quite good in terms of file management. If Microsoft designs the new combined WMP/Zune program to sync and do file management with portable music players from Creative, Samsung, Sandisk and Sony, Apple may finally get some serious competition in the portable media player market.

I actually like the potential of the new Sony NW-A840; pair it with the rumored combined WMP/Zune software and it could seriously cut into iPod nano and possibly iPod classic sales.

alfonsog
Sep 20, 2009, 11:37 AM
I thought I got that last part... but really... I didn't. Care to explain? Yes I know... it's probably so obvious, but I'm kinda slow. :D

It has a hidden mickey...

mikes63737
Sep 20, 2009, 12:20 PM
Wow that thing is ugly.

You'll need to keep it in a paper bag so no one sees you using it.

But at least no one's going to steal it.


I think the reason Apple is letting the nano's specs become stale is because the iPod touch has more revenue potential due to the App Store.

j26
Sep 20, 2009, 05:04 PM
...that Microsoft may be on the verge of merging Windows Media Player and the Zune software into a singular program....

You mean they're only thinking of it now? (Don't spend much time on Windows, except in work, so I really don't know)

That kinda confirms they're idiots, doesn't it?

gnasher729
Sep 20, 2009, 07:35 PM
You mean they're only thinking of it now? (Don't spend much time on Windows, except in work, so I really don't know)

That kinda confirms they're idiots, doesn't it?

It means they drop any pretence that "PlayForSure" was ever meant as something serious to help manufacturers of music players, and admit that all the program was there for was to **** their competitors until their own music player was ready.

SactoGuy18
Sep 21, 2009, 06:25 PM
You mean they're only thinking of it now? (Don't spend much time on Windows, except in work, so I really don't know)

That kinda confirms they're idiots, doesn't it?

You have more or less the same situation on the Mac: iTunes and QuickTime are in many ways separate programs.

What Thurott hinted at is essentially the Zune software and Windows Media Player being one and the same program (it may even become the replacement for the Windows Media Center program, too). Imagine one singular program that not you can buy music and videos and do file management on a portable music player, but also becomes the main program for media playback of all types from uncompressed .WAV files all the way up to playing back Blu-ray discs.

I wouldn't be surprised that this combined Zune/WMP program will be available about a year from now, likely a free download for Windows 7 users and a low-cost paid download for Windows XP and Windows Vista users.

eddiel
Sep 21, 2009, 06:49 PM
One of the biggest advantages that Apple has are its Apple Stores. You can walk into anyone of these and actually play around with the product you want to buy.

Try doing that with another brand as easily. I have been looking to move away from ipod for several reasons and was interested in the Sony and Cowon series of mp3 players. I had a look in London's west end and I barely could find a dealer for Cowon and when I did they were all boxed up. Nothing on demo at all.

Heck the Sony store I popped into didn't even have the Sony mp3 player on display or if they did it wasn't easy to find.

Apple has this market sown up with brilliant marketing and good product. The ipods don't even sound as good as the Sony or Cowon (from reports I have read by audiophile types) but still they sell. They look good and they are so easy to use.

Despite the hatred I have towards that rubbish 120gb Classic that Apple released I still would rather find a way to stay with Ipods - hence I am considering the touch. The integration with Itunes is great and so easy to use.

I do feel Apple will eventually lose some steam but that is a long way off and it will cost other companies considerable money in marketing and product development to catch them.

Eddie

bloodycape
Sep 21, 2009, 07:11 PM
One of the biggest advantages that Apple has are its Apple Stores. You can walk into anyone of these and actually play around with the product you want to buy.

Try doing that with another brand as easily. I have been looking to move away from ipod for several reasons and was interested in the Sony and Cowon series of mp3 players. I had a look in London's west end and I barely could find a dealer for Cowon and when I did they were all boxed up. Nothing on demo at all.

Well here in the states, and Canada we have a stores like Best Buy, Futureshop and Fry's that carry many of the larger name brand stuff like Sony and Samsung, and even Cowon at times and many of them are on the show room floor. And in many majors cities in the U.S.(and few places in UK. and Europe) from what I have seen, there is a Sony store, which works similar to the Apple store, except there are more tv's, PS3, stuff there than computers.

eddiel
Sep 21, 2009, 07:33 PM
Well here in the states, and Canada we have a stores like Best Buy, Futureshop and Fry's that carry many of the larger name brand stuff like Sony and Samsung, and even Cowon at times and many of them are on the show room floor. And in many majors cities in the U.S.(and few places in UK. and Europe) from what I have seen, there is a Sony store, which works similar to the Apple store, except there are more tv's, PS3, stuff there than computers.

Ah yes I was referring more to the UK than the US or Canada. I have been into a Sony store here in London and the Apple store was much better. The Sony shop was empty and had no buzz but it could have been an off day.

Best Buy is entering the UK market place so maybe things will change here.

Eddie

Consultant
Sep 21, 2009, 08:33 PM
Hahaha Dream on. More expensive than touch, so it's in the same class as touch.

Sony player
2.8" screen
OLED
no multi touch
apps, what apps
16gb $263
32gb $329
64gb $439

iPod touch
3.5" screen
LCD
multi touch
app store
32gb $299
64gb $399

Other facts:
Apple sells more music players in Japan, Sony's home turf than Sony.

On OLED screen, just in case you don't know anything about it.
http://obamapacman.com/2009/09/microsoft-zune-hd-vs-apple-ipod-touch-3g-feature-comparison/

You can all laugh now, but one thing Paul Thurrott (of WinSuperSite.com and Windows Weekly podcast fame) suggested is that Microsoft may be on the verge of merging Windows Media Player and the Zune software into a singular program.

If that happens, that could be a gigantic game changer, since I've played around with the with Zune software program and it's actually quite good in terms of file management. If Microsoft designs the new combined WMP/Zune program to sync and do file management with portable music players from Creative, Samsung, Sandisk and Sony, Apple may finally get some serious competition in the portable media player market.

I actually like the potential of the new Sony NW-A840; pair it with the rumored combined WMP/Zune software and it could seriously cut into iPod nano and possibly iPod classic sales.

Smells like vaporware, just like 3d games and apps MS promised for zune hd for launch date.

Wishful thinking. Another "ipod killer" wannabe.

Haha. The most popular Zune after 1 week of sales, already dropped to 30th on amazon, while iPod touch is at #2.

Ah yes I was referring more to the UK than the US or Canada. I have been into a Sony store here in London and the Apple store was much better. The Sony shop was empty and had no buzz but it could have been an off day.

Best Buy is entering the UK market place so maybe things will change here.

Eddie

Sony store is usually almost empty no matter where.

iEvolution
Sep 21, 2009, 08:34 PM
Sony the DRM kings of the world..yeah I'll pass. It could have 2TB of space, 3.5" screen with the best sound quality in the world for only $150 and I'd pass.

bloodycape
Sep 22, 2009, 12:26 AM
Hahaha Dream on. More expensive than touch, so it's in the same class as touch.

So, then by this notion, 100k MB S class is in the same class as 100K Porsche 911. No? You just can't go on price alone, you have to go with features so since this isn't a touch screen player its more comparable to Nano(or Classic even). Plus, this is just a mp3 player first(like the Nano), and this does one thing really well and that is play music with SQ that is always highly rated(and for many better than what Pioneer, Cowon, Samsung or Toshiba/MS offer).
BTW the price will be lower once it reaches the state, and its really vaporware, since there are actual pics of the actual device(with people holding them).