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arn
Jul 18, 2002, 06:42 PM
Apple

The previously promised MPEG-2 playback is a $19.99 add-on (http://www.apple.com/quicktime/products/mpeg2playback/) to Quicktime 6.

iDVD 2.1 (http://www.apple.com/idvd/download/) was released with AppleScript support and general enhancements.

iTunes 3.0 (http://www.apple.com/itunes/) - smart playlists, music ratings and Audible.com (http://www.audible.com) support.

Jaguar (10.2) (http://www.apple.com/macosx/) is available for pre-order from Apple.

Other

Maya Complete 4.5 (http://www.aliaswavefront.com/en/products/maya/whatsnew/v4.5/maya45mac.shtml) - Now Maya for Mac OS X uses the same file format and provides a comparable feature set to Maya on other platforms. Maya for Mac OS X users can exchange files with other Maya 4.5 running on other platforms.

Remote Desktop Connection Client for Mac OS X (http://www.microsoft.com/mac/DOWNLOAD/MISC/RDC.asp) - allows you to connect to a Windows-based computer and work with programs and files on that computer from your Macintosh computer.

EverQuest OS X (http://eq.castersrealm.com/) - EverQuest will be released for Apple Macintosh's running Max OS X in Spring of 2003.

Folding @ Home 3.0 (http://folding.stanford.edu/download.html) - Mac OS X Version.

drastik
Jul 18, 2002, 06:49 PM
uh oh, people aren't going to like this one. apple must really need the money. Oh well, guess i'll use my DVD player.

menoinjun
Jul 18, 2002, 06:50 PM
i don't get it...mpeg2 playback?

Aren't movie files mpeg2? What am I missing?

-Pete

drastik
Jul 18, 2002, 06:54 PM
I don't get it either, unless its for the PC crowd mainly, or for Divx. Although, I find divx nearly useless, and it seems to really only be useed for pirates stuff, so be glad it even gets support

arn
Jul 18, 2002, 06:57 PM
Most Movie MPEG's on the net are MPEG-1

MPEG-2 is used in DVD's and SVCD's. Useful for people who do their own authoring, rip dvd's, trade SVCDs etc....

not useful for the general population.

The reason Apple probably charges for it is:

1) Most people don't want/need it
2) I think it costs them $$ to distrbute it (under MPEG-2 licensing)

Now... iTunes costs them $$ to distrubte as well (MPEG licensing) - but they suck it up, and offer it free for everyone.

arn

ShaolinMiddleFinger
Jul 18, 2002, 06:59 PM
Don't mind my stupidity but what exactly will MPEG 2 do for me? I know it's the same compression for DVD and it allows you to watch DVDs but isn't that what DVD player is for?

Sir Realistic
Jul 18, 2002, 07:23 PM
I noticed that MOTU has posted a screenshot of Digital Performer for OSX on their website... I also noticed video clips from Mac World on it as well... Was their any mention of DP's release date at the show?

Gelfin
Jul 18, 2002, 08:33 PM
I'm a fairly limited demographic, but MPEG-2 support will allow me to pull shows off my ReplayTV and watch them on my Powerbook.

And EverQuest... man, I guess they heard me. Now I'm going to have to restrain myself from EQing from work on the PB. :cool:

Macette
Jul 18, 2002, 08:43 PM
when is ipod software going to be updated? WHEN?

jelloshotsrule
Jul 18, 2002, 08:44 PM
Originally posted by Macette
when is ipod software going to be updated? WHEN?

supposedly when jaguar comes out.... supposedly

DakotaGuy
Jul 18, 2002, 08:52 PM
When I clicked on the Jaguar 10.2 link and read through I noticed some stuff that will make some people happy. I see now that Apple advertises that only 16MB of video RAM is needed to run Quartz Extreme, good news for people that just got new iBooks. Of course I don't even have the right video cards so I won't ever see it, but hey they do say that there is some speed improvement even without Quartz Extreme on all systems including G3's so I suppose I will upgrade to 10.2 here in awhile. Nice to hear about the other software updates as well.

sparkleytone
Jul 18, 2002, 09:12 PM
Remote Desktop Client is the real news here. Now the IT people won't have to leave their Mac at all. This is going to be the most useful Microsoft Software on my iBook barnone.

peterjhill
Jul 18, 2002, 09:56 PM
Originally posted by ShaolinMiddleFinger
Don't mind my stupidity but what exactly will MPEG 2 do for me? I know it's the same compression for DVD and it allows you to watch DVDs but isn't that what DVD player is for?

Well, if you have a connection to Internet2, you can subscribe to a mpeg-2 encoded feed for things like NASA-TV via multicast. There is software called MacTV that allows you to find the multicast streams, and uses qt to display them. The MPEG 1 stream is 2 mbps, that is pretty huge, I can get 1600x1200 that looks like tv streamed to my desktop.

So mpeg-2 is cool.

oldMac
Jul 18, 2002, 10:02 PM
I'm a developer and having Remote Desktop for Windows on my Mac will make my life much easier. One less reason to use a PC.

Of course, there was already a solution for this called HOBLink. HOBLink is a pure java product from Germany that would allow Macs to connect to WTS and was pretty quick once you got it launched, but now I'm glad I didn't drop the $100 for it!

vitrector
Jul 18, 2002, 10:42 PM
MPEG 2 is very useful!
Lack of MPEG2 support has been a great void for MDs trying to show good video. In our Ophthalmology Department we have been using a Windows box to edit and save surgical videos as MPEG2, and I have been extremely annoyed that I canŐt play them on my PowerBook. QuickTime files just do not cut it for the quality that is required to show a surgical video at a conference! The files are too large, and the quality does not come close to MPEG2. I have been waiting for this feature for over a year, now my anti-Mac, Windows colleagues can stop making fun of my Mac!

While $19.99 is not really expensive, it is more than MPEG2 support in Windows Media Player (MPEG2 support is free), and I am unhappy that I apparently canŐt encode MPEG2 with QuickTime, even after paying. And no, iDVD will not cut it because it will save the files in DVD format, and they canŐt be incorporated into a PowerPoint presentation (or am I wrong?).
For me, this is a big step in the right direction, but I also want encoding support for MPEG2 in QuickTime. Once I have that I can turn my back on the Windows box and that incredibly annoying Adobe Premiere.
There are a lot of physicians that like Apple, and SJ and Co. need to support our needs.

kansaigaijin
Jul 18, 2002, 11:04 PM
I would urge anyone who bought 10.1 not to pre-order 10.2

We should get a break on an upgrade to the finished product.

Grokgod
Jul 18, 2002, 11:24 PM
I agree that it would not be a good move to pre-order.

We need to let APPLE know how we feel!

There needs to be an upgrade option in the price structure!

kansaigaijin
Jul 19, 2002, 12:00 AM
"Asked about that possibility, Jobs said that first the company had to finish the transition to the OS X operating system, expected around the end of this year. "

paid for 10.1 and now they want more for 10.2, but by his own admission the transition is not finished yet, so we are going to pay again?

solvs
Jul 19, 2002, 01:48 AM
Originally posted by kansaigaijin
"Asked about that possibility, Jobs said that first the company had to finish the transition to the OS X operating system, expected around the end of this year. "

paid for 10.1 and now they want more for 10.2, but by his own admission the transition is not finished yet, so we are going to pay again?

Uh... I think he means the users. People who own Apple computers doing a transition from OS 9.x to 10. They figure about 40% + after Jaguars realease.

And Developers. Death of 9, and all.

But just like any OS, it'll never truly be finished. That's just the nature of computing.

solvs
Jul 19, 2002, 02:02 AM
Anyone else notice all the rebates you can get if you buy OS X.2 (Jagwire) with other software and hardware?

http://www.apple.com/promo/coupon/

Check the Savings it's called. Trying to soften the blow I guess.

Course, if you just want the OS, yer kinda screwed.

j763
Jul 19, 2002, 03:07 AM
EQ for OS X!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!



w00t!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

kansaigaijin
Jul 19, 2002, 05:18 AM
he says "the company".

he's talking about the possibility of moving to intel (or alternative) processors. if he means users, like you say,then he would want all users to move to OSX first, then start making hardware with alturnative processors.
he doesn't have any control over users, he can just transition the company.

Look at what people who buy a system now are told, pay another $20 to upgrade a system you just bought, and paid thousands for. Is that reasonable?

drastik
Jul 19, 2002, 09:46 AM
Originally posted by kansaigaijin

Look at what people who buy a system now are told, pay another $20 to upgrade a system you just bought, and paid thousands for. Is that reasonable?

yes, it is, and lets not get into it again. It still cheaper than windows for a better product.

evilpenguin21
Jul 19, 2002, 10:24 AM
2 things. First you all have fun with your little boycott. I'll be buying Jagwire day one and loving it. It's good stuff, and i'll pay for good stuff. Just close your eyes and pretend it's 10.5 (which an upgrade this big should be ).

Second, EQ for OS X roxxors. I'll be pharming me some phat loot on my uber OS. Now if only we can get them to port Chip n' Dales MMORPG...

amnesiac1984
Jul 19, 2002, 10:55 AM
i don't see why anyone really needs this mpeg-2 for quicktime playback. Mpeg-4 encoding is built in and it kicks mpeg-2's butt.

julzmon
Jul 19, 2002, 11:14 AM
I see nothing wrong with being Charged a full price for 10.2 . It's been more then a year since I paid anything for OS X. Granted Jaguar is what OS X should have been in the beginning but I totally understand and was patient.
Now .Mac.... I do feel shafted with that one. I do feel email should be free but am totally willing to pay for it. I just think with no price flexibility it was a mistake. I think $50 a year is a nice deal for a pakage like that. And first time byers should get first 6 months free for them to enjoy and see the quality of the service.
I'm still going to pay for .Mac though. But I will wait to last minute so that way it will extend the time they will charge me next year.

When new PowerMac Case comes out...
That's when I will be buying the second revision.

Have a nice weekend...

rainman::|:|
Jul 19, 2002, 02:01 PM
Originally posted by Grokgod
I agree that it would not be a good move to pre-order.

We need to let APPLE know how we feel!

There needs to be an upgrade option in the price structure!

I agree completely, have you guys ever heard of www.PetitionOnline.com ? I understand there's quite a large petition going to keep part of .mac free, perhaps this would make a good petition? I'd sign. $129 is just abhorrent for an upgrade like this-- if i'm going to shell out that much for an upgrade, it had better be a full version, not a x.y upgrade-- hell even if it was $99 or something, it'd at least be showing support for upgrading customers...

:)
pnw

amnesiac1984
Jul 19, 2002, 02:07 PM
if we use petition online too much it will degrade its effect on apple. They will soon realise how easy it is to petition online about something especially when it involves gettinf free stuff, hey why don't i start a petition to demand that apple introduces a new powermac and charge only $10 for it!!!!!

edenwaith
Jul 19, 2002, 04:28 PM
When I first heard that Everquest was coming over to the Mac (finally), my heart nearly stopped. It was great news. My brother, the poor PC using clod (who has had his share of PC problems which I, curiously, never have on my Mac) once said that he would get a PC if Everquest came over to the Mac. Well, I'm going to have to try and coax him a little more. Either that, or when I get a nice job (w/i the next several months, I hope), I'll help him finance one, or buy him one.

As with 10.2, I hope they do what they did with 10.1. For the first month, they distributed free copies of the 10.1 upgrade, and after that it cost $20. Even if all it costs is $20 for the upgrade, that sounds okay. Does anyone remember if some of the 8.x upgrades cost anything? When I bought my iMac, it came with 8.1 and 8.5 disks already, and 8.6 was a free download.

elmimmo
Jul 19, 2002, 07:04 PM
All major companies developing cd recording software for the everyday domestic user are bundling VideoCD recording capabilities in them, be it Roxio both in Mac's Toast or Win's Easy CD Creator or be it Ahead in Win's Nero (do not know about Mac's NeroMax). Roxio even bundles a VCD compliant MPEG1 encoder to use in stuff like iMovie or the very QuickTime, because since VideoCD can be played on DVD players while recorder on 60 cent CDs, they feel the general consumer would be happy to have that.

MPEG2 would have EXACTLY the same use for the general user, since SuperVideoCD does exactly the same as VideoCD (plays on DVDs, records in CDs) but at an incredibly much higher quality with almost no impact on encoding time. SuperVideoCDs use MPEG2 of course. Your DVD player can play them, your Mac not though, until now at least (not at all in OS 9, and not wihtout 3rd party open sorced, fan-made=buggy free software). You could hardly notice the difference between a not so greatly mastered DVD and a SVCD. VideoCDs OTH look like a brand new VHS on a TV.

Pro user have already had MPEG2 encoding capabilities for long, either bundled in Final Cut pro or whatever other pro editing/compression soft.

Apple, then, is marketing the MPEG2 QuickTime component to the general users, not pro ones, the very same users that have at least a single time whatched a VideoCD with their Mac, or authored anything with iMovie or iDVD. This has nothing to do with piracy.

If you never cared for VideoCD, then, of course, you could not care less about SuperVideoCD.

So THAT's the target that so many people were wondering.

Now that its use is clear, the main question if that is worth any money. I completely agree on a not-free MPEG2 encoding software. Its very powerfull technology and at tandem with QuickTime or iMovie, a very intuitive one. But considering it is also a relatively old one now and it is widely free on other platforms be it in Mac OS X itself, through the X-only video player VideoLan (www.videolan.org), or the SEVERAL free MPEG2 decoders for Windows (nothing for OS 9), I think a free MPEG2 decoding-only component for QuickTime, or if only SVCD playing capabilities bundled into the system's DVD player is a must, and has been a must for a long time, both in OS X as in OS 9.

That is arguable, of course.

There is another reason why you might want MPEG2 for. As you probably know by now, DVDs also use MPEG2, but since the DVD player in OS X does not use QuickTime to decode it, it is not capable to use the powerful and specific MPEG2 decoding hardware that has been coming with all Macintosh's graphics cards for a long time now (both is Ati's and Nvidia's models), and this way free the processor of such load. It is not that those cards's processors could be as good as the G4 at doing that, but that they excel far more at it than the G4 does. It is already there, and for free. What is the exact reason why not to choose this path is beyond my knowledge.

But graphic cards manufacturers will only make drivers that help the OS boost performance in this kinds of things through QuickTime, since that was the main use and philosophy behind QT: to provide a unified imaging system that all applications could be helped by, and thus if you accelerated QT, you accelerated any app using QT. You cannot expect them to make drivers helping this particular application now, and that different one then, and that other completely different one then, that's crazy.

Up until the existence of this new MPEG2 QuickTime component which Apple sells, even my iMac G4 700, while capable of playing a DVD almost perfectly, will still show small but still annoying interlacing at fast motion scenes, even if the DVD movie has full frames encoded in it (that is called progressive video, opposed to interlaced video where only alternative half frames are shown in the display, as were on the VHS era). That means the processor just cannot handle it 100%, just 95%. That would be OK, unless I knew there is a phantastic piece of hardware sitting beside the G4 starving for MPEG2 to decode. My iMac suffers from it, I said, as well as my brother's iMac DV 400 which suffers even more (more than with OS 9, since the rest of the interface asked for les to the processor).

I do not know if this new MPEG2 codec features hardware acceleration, but probably it does not accelerate DVD playback since the software DVD player does not use QuickTime to play content. What I am sure of, and I honestly doubt anyone will disagree on (maybe I'm wrong) is that if Apple sold me a hardware DVD unit, with a powerfull graphic card, its price should have included hardware accelerated (through the graphic card) DVD playback software.

Pepzhez
Jul 19, 2002, 08:34 PM
For me, this is a big step in the right direction, but I also want encoding support for MPEG2 in QuickTime. Once I have that I can turn my back on the Windows box and that incredibly annoying Adobe Premiere.

Why don't you use Cleaner 5? It encodes MPEG2 (and everything else you can possibly think of), runs wonderfully on OS X and offers far more options and control over your final result than QT Pro ever will.

http://www.discreet.com

Adobe Premiere has got to be the most bug-ridden, crash-prone app ever to come into widespread use. It is a lousy app on any platform. I hate that app as much as I hate MS Windows. Actually more.

Pepzhez
Jul 19, 2002, 11:00 PM
There is another reason why you might want MPEG2 for. As you probably know by now, DVDs also use MPEG2, but since the DVD player in OS X does not use QuickTime to decode it, it is not capable to use the powerful and specific MPEG2 decoding hardware that has been coming with all Macintosh's graphics cards for a long time now (both is Ati's and Nvidia's models), and this way free the processor of such load. It is not that those cards's processors could be as good as the G4 at doing that, but that they excel far more at it than the G4 does. It is already there, and for free. What is the exact reason why not to choose this path is beyond my knowledge.

Take a closer look at Apple's page on the QT MPEG-2 add-on. It won't play commercial (i.e. - encypted) DVDs! So your point, albeit a good one, is rendered moot thanks to Apple crippling the technology.

You could get around this by backing up the DVD to your HD, using an app like DVD Backup (search the net - it's out there), stripping out the encyption, but - hell - who is going to go through all of that just to watch a DVD on a Mac? But this is what you'll have to do if you want to watch it in QT!

prechrchet
Jul 20, 2002, 03:27 PM
I know this is a little off subject, but I'm hoping someone can answer this one.

Does anyone know what Apple's plans are for the CRT iMac? Yesterday I read an article that said that they are being phased out, and just now I read an article on Macsurfer that seemed to indicate just the opposite.

Do they plan to keep the original iMac, or is it about to go the way of the beige G3?

TechLarry
Jul 22, 2002, 09:57 PM
I agree. The TS/RDC client is the most exciting (and frankly suprising) announcement/release of the event.

MS has just basically given every MacOS X user access to nearly every non-game Application ever written for a Windows PC.

It's not good for high-speed games, though...

TL

Sauron1440
Jul 23, 2002, 03:22 PM
Call me a nooB, but do those coupons do anything? The three little proof of purchase things that came with a relatively (last year) new mac that say save em', use em for updates and special offers - can we use these?:confused:

skippee
Jul 23, 2002, 03:59 PM
Originally posted by Macette
when is ipod software going to be updated? WHEN?

According to Audible.com, the new iPod update is supposed to come the first week in August.