folding on PCs, er, secretly

[zimv20]

i'm folding on several PCs which aren't mine, and are used daily. it's not terribly, well, discreet, and there's other problems. i'm hoping there's a better way.

the way i do it now: i fold under the administrator account, the windowed version, users use their own account. i use XP's fast user switching so the accounts can run simultaneously.

problem: sometimes users reboot their machines and log in only themselves. then i must:

log them out
log into the other account that has administrator access, but isn't Administrator
turn off Fast User Switching and turn on the thing that allows me to type a username
log out of this account and into Administrator
turn on Fast User Switching
switch back to the user's account

it's a pain, and sometimes it's days before i can get in to do it.

i've googled around and found some solution involving an app called hideit.exe, but it's never worked the way it's supposed to.

ideally, i'd like folding to start when the machine's rebooted. further, i'd like it as hidden from view as possible.

who can help?

[jbeetz]

to do so is a violation of the EULA...

search for threads on running as a service. I think that'll bury things sufficiently.

But don't do it!

[bousozoku]

You're not supposed to do that and the team doesn't need any more problems of that sort, so please stop before you're reported and all your points go away.

[Dreadnought]

There was a guy who did the same thing, only he had permission to do it. He had an app that would fold also when nobody was logged in and would fold in the background, didn't matter who logged on, and nobody could get to it. Look in the old threads and you will find it. I think it was about two months back.

[zimv20]

no worries, i have the owner's permission to use the machines. it's just the users i don't feel like informing, 'cuz i'll get a million "it's slowing down my machine!" calls.

so... permission, yes, advertising it, no.

[Khaldei]

Okay, when you have permission... here is what you do (2 solutions).

This solution gets you (5d8h) assuming usual log out.

1.) Go to the "All Users" folder under "Documents and Settings"
2.) Create a new folder called say "Folding"
3.) Give that folder all permissions for everyone, and I mean all
4.) Download FAH4Console.exe and HideItX into that folder
5.) Run FAH, set it up, do all the config stuff
6.) Create a shortcut with HideItX
7.) Change the shortcut in properties to: "....\HideItX.exe" -starthide ....\FAH4Console.exe (You can read the instructions from HideItX on this part if that doesn't make sense)
8.) Take that shortcut and put it in \All Users\Start Menu\Programs\Startup

Then you're done. Starts Folding@Home up every time the computer is booted in a hidden fashion. No users complaining, thinking it's actually a Big Brother program, etc. That is what I used to do. Then came the revelation of services. You'll need to visit these web pages from which you can piece together all the data for solution 2.

This solution gets you (7d24h) assuming the computer is always on.

1.) Go to this webpage First Site (http://www.overclockers.com.au/folding/service-nt2000xp_updated.htm) and download single_folding.zip. This has the files you need.
2.) Once you have those files go to this webpage Second Site (http://www.littlewhitedog.com/content-11.html) and follow the instructions.

It's quite easy. Okay, that's that. Now on to a serious note... don't do these things at your work unless you are allowed. Awhile back when I was just getting into it (staring with awe at mc68k and bertman, struggling against meeble, maxvamp, and BlackAdder) I did this to some machines (2 dual 2.8Ghz Xeon, 2 dual 3.06 Xeon Servers, and 2 dual 1Ghz XServes) that were mine to administer, but not mine to play with. It was found within days. I got away with a laugh and a request to remove them, but it could have been worse. I learned my lesson. Always ask. Some admins and users as well are surprisingly cool with it and consider your name as kind of a sub-team that they're helping. I've got a guy here who's hooked on checking the FAH log and our stats at extremeoverclocking.

[SilentPanda]

Go here http://teammacosx.homeunix.com/software.html and download the Windows Service Installer. It works on my XP and 2000 machine even when nobody is logged in. Very very easy to use. Run it again to uninstall it.

Although... I'm *trying* (in vain) to catch up to you so maybe I shouldn't help... :)

[zimv20]

thanks, khaldei

i also found this (http://folding.amdmbpond.com/service.html)

a note about my situation: i am the admin for these machines. the company owner is hip to the idea of folding and scientific research and granted permission to use the machines. what i want to avoid is
1) losing folding time when a user reboots
2) giving users admin passwords so they can restart folding
3) giving users a reason to think their new, fast PCs are slow

so basically it's a secret between me and the owner, who knows to simply ask me to remove the processes should it ever be an issue

[SilentPanda]

Yeah... the exe on the page I posted does all that but it's automated and such... up to you...

[zimv20]

Go here http://teammacosx.homeunix.com/software.html and download the Windows Service Installer. It works on my XP and 2000 machine even when nobody is logged in. Very very easy to use. Run it again to uninstall it.

Although... I'm *trying* (in vain) to catch up to you so maybe I shouldn't help... :)
ah, just saw this. thanks!

there will be no catching up! bwah ha ha ha ha!!! until my boss decides to stop folding, anyway. then i'm down to just a couple processors on my macs. eek! :-)

[Dreadnought]

Hmmm, I would love to install that on every pc at work! Too bad that our firewall doesn't let folding fetch and send WU's... BTW, that program, if you use it, can a user of a pc shut it down/is it visible with contral+alt+delete?

[sushi]

Anybody do both?

If so, how long does it take relatively speaking.

For example, if my computer can do a SETI WU in say 5 hours, how long would it take to do one Folding WU on the same machine?

TIA,

Sushi

[Dreadnought]

Well, really don't know that Sushi. But fold a couple of WU's for the team and find out for us will you? :D

BTW, I think you are in the wrong thread...

[sushi]

Well, really don't know that Sushi. But fold a couple of WU's for the team and find out for us will you? :D

BTW, I think you are in the wrong thread...
Well, I am up to about 5K on SETI so I will soon get the next tab. 10K is so far away, that it will probably not be worth it if SETI 2 comes along. So I was thinking of folding.

The original message caught my eye in how to set up a PC to fold in secret. So I think that I am on the right thread, just wondering what the difference in time is.

Anyhow, right now, I only use my PCs for SETI. I was thinking of moving to folding. Just wanted to gather some info before making a decision.

Sushi

[SilentPanda]

Hmmm, I would love to install that on every pc at work! Too bad that our firewall doesn't let folding fetch and send WU's... BTW, that program, if you use it, can a user of a pc shut it down/is it visible with contral+alt+delete?

It's visible in the task manager and the user can nuke the process.

[Dreadnought]

Well, I am up to about 5K on SETI so I will soon get the next tab. 10K is so far away, that it will probably not be worth it if SETI 2 comes along. So I was thinking of folding.

The original message caught my eye in how to set up a PC to fold in secret. So I think that I am on the right thread, just wondering what the difference in time is.

Anyhow, right now, I only use my PCs for SETI. I was thinking of moving to folding. Just wanted to gather some info before making a decision.

Sushi

Well Sushi, the only real test is to get all your pc's off Seti and into folding till you hit the 5000 points mark. We also need you very badly in our folding team! (we need everybody!!) So come on, give it a try!

[sushi]

Well Sushi, the only real test is to get all your pc's off Seti and into folding till you hit the 5000 points mark. We also need you very badly in our folding team! (we need everybody!!) So come on, give it a try!
We'll see. Thanks for the info.

Sushi

[Dreadnought]

Sushi, How many and what kind of machines are we talking about? Are they on 24/7. If I know I can sort of give you a prediction of how many points your setup wil make.

[sushi]

Sushi, How many and what kind of machines are we talking about? Are they on 24/7. If I know I can sort of give you a prediction of how many points your setup wil make.
Currently, I have two PCs that can work on Folding.

They both are Athlon XP 2500+ with 256MB RAM, 40GB HD.

One is overclocked to a XP 3200+ It takes about 4 hours per WU running the screen saver version.

The other is running at 2500+. I haven't been able to accertain the time yet since it is remote.

In the near future, I may be able to add a few more (about 10) to whichever cause I go with.

Sushi

[zimv20]

i'd say 100 - 125 pts/day, if you can get them to run 100% of the time

[Dreadnought]

I would say more, something like 150-200 points per day, about a 1000 points per week if you leave them on 24/7. If I got it right those Athlons are both 1.8 Ghz machines, my dual G5 1.8 does that per day. Also, folding doesn't like overclocked machines, maybe you get problems with that.

[sushi]

Thanks for the info!

Sushi

[zimv20]

Go here http://teammacosx.homeunix.com/software.html and download the Windows Service Installer.
wow, that worked GREAT. thanks!

best. tool. ever.

added two more, btw. one 2.8 GHz P4, one 1.8 GHz P4. should be averaging around 800/day now.

[Cprossu]

no worries, i have the owner's permission to use the machines. it's just the users i don't feel like informing, 'cuz i'll get a million "it's slowing down my machine!" calls.

so... permission, yes, advertising it, no.

so you talked to all the netadmins and people at the top of the company about what you are doing correct?



also dont go about making an installer or script that already has your username already programmed in or pretends to be somthing else than folding@home....

i'd see if you can get it written in writing that it is ok to use the program if i were in your place.

also it might be a good idea to let the workers know about it so we dont get calls over at folding-community when that 1 out of a 100 people will drop by and say that f@h has magically appeared on their work comp and they want to know how to get rid of it and why it is there.
let them know of the cause and purpose for the program as well.

and as always stick to the EULA as close as possible, ive seen three too many where this same type of thing would backfire or somthing would be maliciously released somehow (ei an installer or script)

thanks,
Cprossu

edit:
sorry i didnt say anything earlier, but i was out on vaccation and just got caught up with all my other forums =)

[MrMacMan]

so you talked to all the netadmins and people at the top of the company about what you are doing correct?



also dont go about making an installer or script that already has your username already programmed in or pretends to be somthing else than folding@home....

i'd see if you can get it written in writing that it is ok to use the program if i were in your place.

also it might be a good idea to let the workers know about it so we dont get calls over at folding-community when that 1 out of a 100 people will drop by and say that f@h has magically appeared on their work comp and they want to know how to get rid of it and why it is there.
let them know of the cause and purpose for the program as well.

and as always stick to the EULA as close as possible, ive seen three too many where this same type of thing would backfire or somthing would be maliciously released somehow (ei an installer or script)

thanks,
Cprossu

edit:
sorry i didnt say anything earlier, but i was out on vaccation and just got caught up with all my other forums =)

Maybe if you READ the thread it wouldn't TALK about those things.

God damn. Really people. This is why I don't come here much anymore, people just randomly pop in and pull out some of this. Jeth. WAS WRONG.

We get it.

Let us be.

We have permission.

We understand the rules.

We are following the rules.

Macrumors has the utmost respect for the rules of Folding and respects the community.


Now Let Us Be.

[Cprossu]

dont worry i do this to all forums im subscribed to.

i just dont want to see another repeat of what happened, not only here, but elsewhere before and after the JT event.
i did read the thread btw, im just somewhat scared of what could possibly happen.


if you know any "friendly" way to say it let me know, as it would be much appreciated. im not out to make anybody here mad or otherwise disgruntled =( .

[zimv20]

so you talked to all the netadmins and people at the top of the company about what you are doing correct?

no worries. i'm the sole IT guy, admin guy, tech guy, et. al.

it's a small company, the owner is a friend of mine, my continued "employment" there (i'm a 1099) is viewed as a favor. in fact, when i first brought up folding, the owner wanted to put it on the production server, and i'm the one who said "no."

most of the users aren't computer literate. i'll get calls like, "i think the print driver you installed is slowing down my machine," or "ever since you gave me more RAM, i'm getting more spam." as i've said, the last thing i want to do is give the users another reason to think something is wrong.

[Cprossu]

ok understood
:)

[MrMacMan]

dont worry i do this to all forums im subscribed to.

i just dont want to see another repeat of what happened, not only here, but elsewhere before and after the JT event.
i did read the thread btw, im just somewhat scared of what could possibly happen.


if you know any "friendly" way to say it let me know, as it would be much appreciated. im not out to make anybody here mad or otherwise disgruntled =( .
Which is why I am angry, because you said this before and this was the team that got nailed for the jeth. incident.

His software got bundled with some spyware virus thingy, and we got like 1000 people on our case calling all of out points into question.

[Cprossu]

well i want to get back to f-c on good terms, so i will be as nice as possible.


im not here to bitch because of the jt incident. (i said before and after)

your points as a team was never in question, just the ones gotten from jt. we did not see this as a whole thing, but an individual screw up in which the whole team shouldnt suffer...granted jt racked up a huge amount of points and i feel sorry that it bumped you guys down when you lost his donation.

i am not that into the whole "points" race, but rather interested in the safety of this project as a research device which i need to defend the best i can. this means that the forums i check i need to at least respond if i see anything a little shady. I am again sorry i have angered you, and if you want to correspond further my aim is cprossu2..

[mmmdreg]

Heh for RC5-72 (which is a bit off topic but anyhow..) I changed the file names to "System Idle Process" and installed it as that. Since it can hide and run on start due to its own capabilities, it was a good solution. Many people wouldn't be able to tell it's not the real idle, even with it's fat CPU usage.