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MacRumors
Nov 29, 2009, 06:54 AM
http://www.macrumors.com/images/macrumorsthreadlogo.gif (http://www.macrumors.com/2009/11/27/apple-to-take-iphones-maps-app-to-the-next-level/)

MacRumors has found a new Apple job listing (http://jobs.apple.com/index.ajs?BID=1&method=mExternal.showJob&RID=44070&CurrentPage=3) seeking an iPhone Software Engineer to join the iPhone and iPod Touch Maps team with the goal of taking the iPhone's built-in Maps App (http://www.apple.com/iphone/iphone-3gs/maps-compass.html) to "the next level": We want to take Maps to the next level, rethink how users use Maps and change the way people find things. We want to do this in a seamless, highly interactive and enjoyable way. We've only just started.The specificity of the job description is somewhat unusual for Apple, and particularly interesting given recent events.

Apple and Google have increasingly become competitors in the mobile space while Google's mapping data remains an integral part of the iPhone's Maps application. Google has recently stepped up even further with the introduction (http://www.macrumors.com/2009/10/28/google-introduces-free-gps-navigation-for-android-2-0/) of many new features for their Android mapping application. This included advanced features such as plain english search, voice search and more. Although Apple and Google are said to be working on bringing the same technology to the iPhone, there's been evidence that Apple is working on their own mapping technology.

Apple recently acquired (http://www.macrumors.com/2009/09/30/apple-acquired-mapping-company-placebase-in-july/) a mapping company called Placebase which had differentiated itself (http://gigaom.com/2008/05/21/placebase/) from Google's offerings. The former CEO of Placebase is now part of the "Geo Team" at Apple, which has led to speculation that Apple is looking to separate itself from their dependance on Google maps.

Article Link: Apple to Take iPhone's Maps App to 'the Next Level' (http://www.macrumors.com/2009/11/27/apple-to-take-iphones-maps-app-to-the-next-level/)



Doju
Nov 29, 2009, 06:59 AM
Very cool. They'll have to do a lot to make me give up my TomTom app.

zedsdead
Nov 29, 2009, 07:00 AM
Very cool. They'll have to do a lot to make me give up my TomTom app.

I just picked up Tom Tom because of the discount. Oh well...sounds like this a year off anyway.

Darkroom
Nov 29, 2009, 07:03 AM
good-bye google maps. hello new and improved MKMapKit framework.

calemon
Nov 29, 2009, 07:34 AM
Imagine this! It's a regular "map" where when you switch to street view and by using the iPhones built in compass and GPS will enable you to see both businesses and friends around you in 'real-time' depending on where you look and it's all thanks to the integration of a location-based social network and directory system. They can even coin the phrase 'augmented reality'.

No one has thought of this before, and no one but Apple can bring it out to you in such a way, and even better they can then eliminate other 3rd party apps that replicate this form of technology out of the App Store because it reproduces something the base software already provides.

Perfect!

/sarcasm

pmz
Nov 29, 2009, 08:03 AM
I would have a hard time believing that Apple is only in the hiring phase for a developer to further the built in Maps app, which surely will be abandoning Google Maps in the near future...

...if it weren't for the fact that Apple all but abandoned in house iPhone software development the day they introduced the SDK. No reason to develop when you make money off of other's work.

(honestly, does anyone ever believe these stories the way the author seems to? It's much more likely that Apple makes fancy moves such as putting out snarky job ads to buzz the community)

I wonder how the original developer of the Maps app feels about this job listing? Is he not capable of copying off all the great Location-based app ideas and rolling them into one App? Surely he can.

shady825
Nov 29, 2009, 08:09 AM
I wonder how the original developer of the Maps app feels about this job listing? Is he not capable of copying off all the great Location-based app ideas and rolling them into one App? Surely he can.

you mean Google!?
I'm sure they'll live. ;)

pmz
Nov 29, 2009, 08:10 AM
Imagine this! It's a regular "map" where when you switch to street view and by using the iPhones built in compass and GPS will enable you to see both businesses and friends around you in 'real-time' depending on where you look and it's all thanks to the integration of a location-based social network and directory system. They can even coin the phrase 'augmented reality'.

No one has thought of this before, and no one but Apple can bring it out to you in such a way, and even better they can then eliminate other 3rd party apps that replicate this form of technology out of the App Store because it reproduces something the base software already provides.

Perfect!

/sarcasm

I hear you. When they introduced the App store, I laughed heartily, and when I saw the icon, my jaw simply dropped. It's hard to say it was copied directly from Installer.app, but its even harder to say that it wasn't.

But this is what Apple does. Success in the consumer world is two fold: you need a solid idea, and you need to get it into people's lives. Many companies and proprietors succeed at the first task, but fail utterly at the latter.

Look at 3G data. The iPhone was a year late with 3G connectivity compared to most smartphones, but yet its release was many people's first 3G experience, and it now accounts for 50% of the cellular data usage in the world.

Good idea, medicore idea, stolen idea... makes no difference. Make people want it, and you WIN.

shady825
Nov 29, 2009, 08:13 AM
Good idea, medicore idea, stolen idea... makes no difference. Make people want it, and you WIN.

what Apple is best at!
(making us wAnt it, not stealing ideas)

strike1555
Nov 29, 2009, 08:15 AM
good-bye google maps. hello new and improved MKMapKit framework.

Wrong. Read the article again, carefully.

ouimetnick
Nov 29, 2009, 08:21 AM
I just hope they don't kill google Maps. If they lock u to Apples new mapping service, it MUST Be Kick ass to leave out Google.

pmz
Nov 29, 2009, 08:21 AM
you mean Google!?
I'm sure they'll live. ;)

Wouldn't Google's involvement have been simply paperwork? Meaning licensing agreements? Google Maps itself was just copied and pasted code, used within an otherwise rudimentary App?

I've done my own App development and from what I can see, anyone could easily recreate the built in Maps app with just the given APIs. Google Maps is the easiest part.

pmz
Nov 29, 2009, 08:24 AM
Wrong. Read the article again, carefully.

Easy there killer. There is a laundry list of reasons why Google Maps' days on the iPhone are numbered. This article is just one more indication that the app is going to receive a due overhall.

*LTD*
Nov 29, 2009, 08:29 AM
Very nice. Seems Apple will redefine the online/mobile maps space as well.

ARF900
Nov 29, 2009, 08:39 AM
Well this will clearly will kill tom tom and apps like it.

Though I think that this will end up being exclusive for the next iphone. I think the next iphone will be different, so different that OS 4 will not be available for previous phones. This is why i avoided the 3GS

shady825
Nov 29, 2009, 08:51 AM
Wouldn't Google's involvement have been simply paperwork? Meaning licensing agreements? Google Maps itself was just copied and pasted code, used within an otherwise rudimentary App.

I'm sure more is involved in google maps than just "signing paperwork" as you say. ;)
the iPhone app could and probably is based off google maps.com.
Weather they copied it or not, someone at one point had to do some work to develop the program.
Either way, I'm eager to see what Apple comes up with

Cybbe
Nov 29, 2009, 08:55 AM
AFR900: Apple would never be foolish enough to abandon the existing user base. While new functions may depend on new hardware (such as was the case with 3GS and 3.0), Apple understands the importance of catering to existing customers. Basically, by making OS upgrades incremental and compatible, Apple can leverage its existing user base and number of downloaded apps. I can almost guarantee you that you are wrong.

ChazUK
Nov 29, 2009, 08:58 AM
Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (Linux; U; Android 1.5; en-gb; HTC Hero Build/CUPCAKE) AppleWebKit/528.5+ (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/3.1.2 Mobile Safari/525.20.1)

Interesting. I wonder what the clever people at Apple have planned? :)

shady825
Nov 29, 2009, 08:59 AM
Though I think that this will end up being exclusive for the next iphone. I think the next iphone will be different, so different that OS 4 will not be available for previous phones. This is why i avoided the 3GS

Same here. I'm glad I didn't get the 3GS.
It honestly didn't seem like enuff of a "upgrade" to me.
CAN'T wait for the 2010 iPhone tho! (I'm not gonna call it any name as of right now, 4G, 4GS....)
the only thing I dislike about my 3G is I SWEAR TO GOD that ever since the 3GS came out, they slowed down the 3G iPhone. What better way to make people want the "S" for Speed and make them upgrade.

Shodan
Nov 29, 2009, 09:13 AM
Very cool. They'll have to do a lot to make me give up my TomTom app.

In the case of the TomTom app, they won't have to do much.

In the case of the CoPilot app, they will have to do a lot.

dagamer34
Nov 29, 2009, 09:15 AM
good-bye google maps. hello new and improved MKMapKit framework.

The MapKit framework still depends on the tiles which Google owns. The app itself is simply a front-end.

Little Endian
Nov 29, 2009, 09:32 AM
I just hope they don't kill google Maps. If they lock u to Apples new mapping service, it MUST Be Kick ass to leave out Google.

+1, I must say that Apple has a long road ahead if they intend to outclass google maps in a substantial way.

pkoch1
Nov 29, 2009, 09:33 AM
I'm excited for what it could be but I'm nervous that it won't be as good as the new google offerings.

joemama
Nov 29, 2009, 09:36 AM
Um, how about we start with a FREE map/navigation app first?

If Apple doesn't offer this, they are going to miss out on a LOT of people signing with Droid.

shady825
Nov 29, 2009, 09:41 AM
Um, how about we start with a FREE map/navigation app first?

If Apple doesn't offer this, they are going to miss out on a LOT of people signing with Droid.


Who said anything about Apple charging for the app?
If you didn't know, google maps come free on all iPhones. Now I'm no computer programer or anything but I suspect the Apple Maps will replace google maps. AKA be free.

rjtyork
Nov 29, 2009, 09:43 AM
This article tells me they are trying to move as far away from Google as possible. This makes me sad. Google is a great company and I only hope that Apple's maps application will either be as good as, or exceed google's maps already on the iPhone. That's going to be hard to do, though. What sucks even more is this lessens the chance that the google voice app will EVER be allowed back on the iPhone. But I could be wrong. With a different maps application, Apple may be willing to let Latitude back on the iPhone as a native app, and with it, google voice. But with apple, you never know. I don't like seeing Apple and Google fight. I like both of their products too much and I want to be able to use them both without jumping through any hoops.

Little Endian
Nov 29, 2009, 09:44 AM
Same here. I'm glad I didn't get the 3GS.

the only thing I dislike about my 3G is I SWEAR TO GOD that ever since the 3GS came out, they slowed down the 3G iPhone. What better way to make people want the "S" for Speed and make them upgrade.

meh... is it Apple or AT&t? I agree though that the iphone 3G has gotten slower.... but how much of that performance difference is due to Apple? I would say the burden of blame lies on both parties. Like you I am waiting for something better than the 3GS.

RKilbane20
Nov 29, 2009, 09:45 AM
Same here. I'm glad I didn't get the 3GS.
It honestly didn't seem like enuff of a "upgrade" to me.
CAN'T wait for the 2010 iPhone tho! (I'm not gonna call it any name as of right now, 4G, 4GS....)
the only thing I dislike about my 3G is I SWEAR TO GOD that ever since the 3GS came out, they slowed down the 3G iPhone. What better way to make people want the "S" for Speed and make them upgrade.


Not a big upgrade? Its way bigger then the 2G to 3G iPhone upgrade

ilogic
Nov 29, 2009, 09:48 AM
Do it Apple, do it.

MacKiddyWiddy
Nov 29, 2009, 09:48 AM
thank god, good bye google http://macblog.***********/imgs/signature_SmileyFace.jpg u cant wait for the day when i can just hold my thumb on the icon, and let it press the cross on maps

shady825
Nov 29, 2009, 09:50 AM
Not a big upgrade? Its way bigger then the 2G to 3G iPhone upgrade

I'm sure a lot of people will agree, iPhone 3G to 3GS is NOT much of a upgrade.
I never said anything about upgrading from a 2G. The 3G was my first iPhone and I dont see the 3GS as a worth while upgrade.

Compile 'em all
Nov 29, 2009, 09:56 AM
Wrong. Read the article again, carefully.

What article? It is a job listing.

shady825
Nov 29, 2009, 09:57 AM
meh... is it Apple or AT&t? I agree though that the iphone 3G has gotten slower.... but how much of that performance difference is due to Apple? I would say the burden of blame lies on both parties. Like you I am waiting for something better than the 3GS.

Smart move on Apple's part if you think about it. What better way to make the 3GS shine.
Since the release of the 3GS I would say without a shadow of a doubt the 3G got slower. Ive seen a lot of threads where people are sticking to 2.x.x (cant remember the exact number) firmware because they swear its faster. That firmware is pre 3GS release.
Even on wifi my 3G is a dog sometimes. When I play around with my grandpas 3GS I always think "thats how my iPhone used to be"

Imhotep397
Nov 29, 2009, 09:57 AM
I think Apple trying to play a game of brinkmanship with Google is a bad idea...and not because I think Apple can't win. With Apple's ZFS implementation breaking down Google wanting to move into the hardware world I think it's a match made in heaven. Google having the largest database of information on the plan one could argue that they know a thing or two about building the ever critical fast and efficient file system and obviously everyone knows Apple's capability in hardware. Google wanted to merge for years and Apple didn't...rather than Apple spending money to do something that Google already does well it would make more sense them to just cooperate and do so before some other player innovates their way into the market.

homersparkle
Nov 29, 2009, 10:13 AM
I guess we'll just have to see what it will look like. if it isnt as user friendly as google maps, (the best mapping out there), then it will really hinder my iphone usage.

Google maps has the best userabillity, because you can just zoom in easilly and type in just a single word and get results. Yahoo! has a great perk which is neighborhood color schemes, but you can't just look up an address, you need to put in directions and zooming in lags.

What I'd really like is an OS where we can have multiple apps running. It sucks when I'm walking and listening to last.fm and I have to get out to look at Maps or a newspaper site. :(

shady825
Nov 29, 2009, 10:19 AM
What I'd really like is an OS where we can have multiple apps running. It sucks when I'm walking and listening to last.fm and I have to get out to look at Maps or a newspaper site. :(

Yea I get annoyed with that to. I listen to Coast to Coast AM on AOL Radio every night and it does suck having to break the transmission to check a text message or something of that nature..

phaedarus
Nov 29, 2009, 10:25 AM
I can't see how it can get much better than Google's map viewer.

The ability to switch between standard map view, satellite imagery and see photos of the actual location itself all seamlessly has proven its value many times over for me.

str1f3
Nov 29, 2009, 10:41 AM
I can't see how it can get much better than Google's map viewer.

Agreed, especially when you consider that Apple's own implementation of Google Maps is better than Google's on Android.

I don't really see this as a big deal. Apple may just need an extra hand on the Maps application considering they will have their own implementation of Google Navigation and probably apply voice control to it in OS 4.0.

Like another poster said, before Apple releases their own Maps solution, they had better make sure it is far better than what Google Maps already offers.

ChazUK
Nov 29, 2009, 10:52 AM
What I'd really like is an OS where we can have multiple apps running. It sucks when I'm walking and listening to last.fm and I have to get out to look at Maps or a newspaper site. :(

That was the main reason I gave my iPhone 3g up for. Even basic multitasking (1 3rd party app at a time) would have been enough.

I know that backgrounder worked on a jailbroken phone but I wanted something that could multitask as a core feature.

I'm sure Apple will address this eventually, especially with the 3GS (and beyond) with its extra ram.

sohelpme
Nov 29, 2009, 10:53 AM
Would that be 'CloudView' or 'TunnelView'?

ChazUK
Nov 29, 2009, 10:55 AM
Agreed, especially when you consider that Apple's own implementation of Google Maps is better than Google's on Android.

This seems to have all changed with the navigation added to Android 2.0 and now Adnroid 1.6. The Apple implementation on Google Maps (especially on the 3GS) had quite a few Android owners asking why Google had left them with an inferior version.

I can't wait to get 2.0 on my Hero!

simulacra
Nov 29, 2009, 10:56 AM
Look at 3G data. The iPhone was a year late with 3G connectivity compared to most smartphones, but yet its release was many people's first 3G experience, and it now accounts for 50% of the cellular data usage in the world.


A year? Try 4 years, maybe not in the US, but in the rest of the world, I'd say that the iphone 3G/GS isn't as USA-centric as it the first generation was.

Which is why remarks that iChat and front facing cameras would "bring down the networks" annoys me, they might bring down the sorry excuse of a 3G-network that AT&T has (when I visited NYC this summer I was without any covergare for extended periods of time, in one of the most famous cities in the world).
But I dont really see any issue surfacing here in sweden where our largest telecom opeators are selling 3G modems at 14.4 Mbps en masse to consumers as an alternative to DSL.
and that's happening all over europe, and my guess is that japan is going the same route.

I dont really understand why AT&T are having such issues with this, yes, they have a larger geographical area to cover, but they could atleast make sure that the cities have good enough coverage.

But on topic: I really look forward to a rehash of the maps app, but at the same time it seems like a less important issue, there are larger issues to be fixed in the iphone before that.

aucl
Nov 29, 2009, 11:08 AM
I would have a hard time believing that Apple is only in the hiring phase for a developer to further the built in Maps app, which surely will be abandoning Google Maps in the near future...

...if it weren't for the fact that Apple all but abandoned in house iPhone software development the day they introduced the SDK. No reason to develop when you make money off of other's work.

(honestly, does anyone ever believe these stories the way the author seems to? It's much more likely that Apple makes fancy moves such as putting out snarky job ads to buzz the community)

I wonder how the original developer of the Maps app feels about this job listing? Is he not capable of copying off all the great Location-based app ideas and rolling them into one App? Surely he can.

currently they just depend too much on google maps.
may it be the iphone app, or in iPhoto to show picture locations, find my iPhone, ... and i guess there is even more.

carmenodie
Nov 29, 2009, 11:09 AM
you have to admit, when Apple jazzes stuff up it is impressive. I can imagine all types of new and clever features they could add to a mapping program. Go Apple. This is the type of stuff that sets them apart.
Funny how MS doesn't do this. Oh well.

skinnylegs
Nov 29, 2009, 11:23 AM
I hear you. When they introduced the App store, I laughed heartily, and when I saw the icon, my jaw simply dropped. It's hard to say it was copied directly from Installer.app, but its even harder to say that it wasn't.

But this is what Apple does. Success in the consumer world is two fold: you need a solid idea, and you need to get it into people's lives. Many companies and proprietors succeed at the first task, but fail utterly at the latter.

Look at 3G data. The iPhone was a year late with 3G connectivity compared to most smartphones, but yet its release was many people's first 3G experience, and it now accounts for 50% of the cellular data usage in the world.

Good idea, medicore idea, stolen idea... makes no difference. Make people want it, and you WIN.There is no denying that Apple has stellar marketing but I think you're missing the key element to Apple's success...

Have you ever heard the expression the difference is in the details? This, IMO, is what has made Apple such a successful company. Since we're talking about phones, let's forget OS X and iLife and iMacs and iPods and other Apple hardware/software. Let's simply talk phones. When the iPhone was released, there were other touch based products and certainly there were other smartphones but *none* of them brought it all together in a *polished* product like the iPhone. The ability to access all of your apps. with the flick of a finger without having to navigate through archaic looking submenus. Brilliant! The detail given to each and every application. Incredible! Take for instance, the phone app. Having favorites, recents, contacts, keypad and voicemail *all* available right there without having to navigate to a different app. Fantastic! BTW...I could be wrong but I don't think any other phone places all of these elements directly within the phone app. Also, have you noticed that if you close out the phone app. and return to it, it will be at the last sub-function you left it at? Pretty sure this is true for every app. Once again, the difference is in the details. Even syncing via iTunes and the App Store store experience was light years ahead of what other phones offered in terms of getting stuff *on* your phone and purchasing third-party apps. I could go on and on but I'm sure that most people will agree that in creating the iPhone, Apple married new technology and existing technology and created a product that was polished and approachable by the common man. *That*, my friend, is what Apple does so well.

Let me say that one more time - approachable by the common man. My g/f had a pre-iPhone smartphone which was very popular at the time. Let me get another cup of coffee in me and I might even remember the name of the damn thing. :D Anyway, it was <allegedly> able to play music and retrieve her email but hell if we could figure out how to perform either of those functions. I mean, I'll be the first to admit that I'm no uber-geek but I'm a pretty bright guy and I gave up on it.

Those who think that marketing alone will drive consumer sales is kidding themselves. Take the Motorola Droid, for instance. They had some *awesome* adds running on TV and their pre-release website was very cool but have you had any personal hands-on experience with the thing? If not, and you plan to do so, be prepared to be very underwhelmed. I'm not 'gonna turn this into an iPhone vs. Droid thread but it brings me back to my point that the difference is in the details.

To take this a step further, the reasons I have stated above lead me to believe that Apple will be equally successful with the iPad or iTablet or whatever you want to call it. The market has been established and there are already players including Kindle and Nook but they are all very, dare I say, boring! Nothing excites me less than to take existing print, format it into a PDF file or whatever and deliver it electronically to a device. -Yawn- Once again, Apple will marry existing technology and new technology and make said device approachable by the common man. Oh yeah...also, be prepared to be blown away. :D

Palm! That's what my g/f's device was. It was a Palm.

Rant over...

aucl
Nov 29, 2009, 11:25 AM
I guess we'll just have to see what it will look like. if it isnt as user friendly as google maps, (the mest mapping out there), then it will really hinder my iphone usage.

Google maps has the best userabillity, because you can just zoom in easilly and type in just a single word and get results. Yahoo! has a great perk which is neighborhood color schemes, but you can't just look up an address, you need to put in directions and zooming in lags.

What I'd really like is an OS where we can have multiple apps running. It sucks when I'm walking and listening to last.fm and I have to get out to look at Maps or a newspaper site. :(

maybe i am wrong, but i think the google maps app was done by apple, based on the google services.
and what they maybe do is taking the google part out of it, or make it redundant, just in case

skinnylegs
Nov 29, 2009, 11:29 AM
- Pssst - You can do that on your iPhone. :D

but i think the google maps app was done by appleThe Maps app. UI is *all* Apple. They simply have a licensing agreement with Google to use that actual maps.

cmaier
Nov 29, 2009, 11:32 AM
maybe i am wrong, but i think the google maps app was done by apple, based on the google services.
and what they maybe do is taking the google part out of it, or make it redundant, just in case

Apple wrote the software, Google provides the map tiles and related data.

Presumably, in addition to new features, Apple would like to replace the google data with its own data at some point.

ARF900
Nov 29, 2009, 11:35 AM
Same here. I'm glad I didn't get the 3GS.
It honestly didn't seem like enuff of a "upgrade" to me.
CAN'T wait for the 2010 iPhone tho! (I'm not gonna call it any name as of right now, 4G, 4GS....)
the only thing I dislike about my 3G is I SWEAR TO GOD that ever since the 3GS came out, they slowed down the 3G iPhone. What better way to make people want the "S" for Speed and make them upgrade.

Ive been having the same problem, everything is so slow now. I actually spent hours looking for a way to go back to OS 2.X, but it is impossible.

Sonicjay
Nov 29, 2009, 11:37 AM
I can't see how it can get much better than Google's map viewer..

Then you must not have seen Bing's Maps "Bird's Eye View" yet. Instead of staring straight down at indistinguishable rooftops, you have a diagonal ariel view that you can actually recognize things from

str1f3
Nov 29, 2009, 11:39 AM
This seems to have all changed with the navigation added to Android 2.0 and now Adnroid 1.6. The Apple implementation on Google Maps (especially on the 3GS) had quite a few Android owners asking why Google had left them with an inferior version.

I can't wait to get 2.0 on my Hero!

Apple will have it and, even more important, is Goggle has said they want it. Google is fully interested in the iPhone platform an I think the acquisition of AdMob proves that. Apple has to work the new abilities into their own UI.

nicroma
Nov 29, 2009, 11:40 AM
Funny how MS doesn't do this. Oh well.

I'll take birds eye view over street view any day.

bruinsrme
Nov 29, 2009, 11:45 AM
I have 2 3G and 2 3GS.
The 3G (unjailbroken)is a great back up in the event I crash a 3Gs that are jailbroken.

The 3G is slow slow slow in everything I try to do with even surfing the web and checking email.

I am glad I upgraded from the 3G to the 3Gs.

I hope that the Google Apple relationship doesn't go south.
Google could limit the amount of map data they license to Apple while using mre advanced data for their own phone platforms. Who knows.

Didn't microsoft buy mappoint years ago? did they ever do anything with that.

As off the wall as that is, I can't help seeing Apple and Microsoft strengthening their relationship in fending off google.

str1f3
Nov 29, 2009, 11:46 AM
I'm sure a lot of people will agree, iPhone 3G to 3GS is NOT much of a upgrade.
I never said anything about upgrading from a 2G. The 3G was my first iPhone and I dont see the 3GS as a worth while upgrade.

I felt the same way (as a 3G owner) but if you actually look at the feature list it is a larger upgrade than the 2G to 3G. I do believe that next year you will see where Apple is actually headed with PA Semi designed chips and probably significantly better battery life. Chances are it will be the iPhone that is built to multitask.

Things like multitasking will still happen on the 3GS because of the doubling of the RAM.

Jayomat
Nov 29, 2009, 11:52 AM
Take for instance, the phone app. Having favorites, recents, contacts, keypad and voicemail *all* available right there without having to navigate to a different app. Fantastic! BTW...I could be wrong but I don't think any other phone places all of these elements directly within the phone app.

Wrong..^^ Android does. ;)

shady825
Nov 29, 2009, 11:58 AM
Ive been having the same problem, everything is so slow now. I actually spent hours looking for a way to go back to OS 2.X, but it is impossible.

Man i wish i could find this thread for you... I was just reading it the other day. It was the one I mentioned about the 2.x.x being faster.
The guy had instructions to get back down to 2.x.x.
It required an earlier version of iTunes is all I remember :confused: sorry..

charlituna
Nov 29, 2009, 12:01 PM
I would have a hard time believing that Apple is only in the hiring phase for a developer to further the built in Maps app, which surely will be abandoning Google Maps in the near future...

...if it weren't for the fact that Apple all but abandoned in house iPhone software development the day they introduced the SDK. No reason to develop when you make money off of other's work.

I would agree with you, except for one detail.

they provided maps for free as a base function of the phone. if they just drop google maps for nothing, they will get never PR via the blogs, boards and such. cause folks love to gripe about what Apple is not doing, stops doing, did wrong, etc.

so in the matter of adding new 'free' functions I would agree that it seems unlikely. but replacing a 'free' function provided by a third party they are no longer in bed with, I can see where it could be happening.

This article tells me they are trying to move as far away from Google as possible. This makes me sad.

there may be unrevealed legal issues behind this move. things that might play into why the men on both the Apple and Google boards had to cut one board or the other. unfair competition, favoritism etc

meh... is it Apple or AT&t? I agree though that the iphone 3G has gotten slower.... but how much of that performance difference is due to Apple?

none whatsoever. the S is about the phone hardware and I've used both and it is faster.

the trouble is that, for many areas, the iphone finally become really popular so the user to tower saturation became worse, thus more folks on the bandwidth, less speed on the carrier side of the equation (more dropped calls etc)

I guess we'll just have to see what it will look like. if it isnt as user friendly as google maps,

Apple will have no trouble with the UI. it's the database that is the issue. and Google Maps sucks. I have to use them along with another mapping service because they give horrid directions 80% of the time. 90% of you want to avoid highways. and they make it near to impossible to correct their information.

I'm actually excited to see what Apple has in mind.

labman
Nov 29, 2009, 12:33 PM
googles net worth is 153 billion
Apple is about the same according to financial reports.

apple stock $209
Google $579

I think I'd rather they were allies then competitors. next Apple will have there own search engine like Microsoft Bing that sure upset google! :rolleyes:

palmerc2
Nov 29, 2009, 12:33 PM
is it really a possibility that apple will completely remove google from their mapping system?

Google is HUGE with maps (I use maps.google.com very often). They offer many amazing features, 1. Pictures...I love seeing pictures, it goes through a website called panoramio.com where users can upload their own photos and place it on the map, why this is important cuz I was thinking Apple and Google would put that in the pipeline (Google already has it in their Google Earth.app)....guess not, 2. Satellite imaging, how Apple can top that, I don't know...wouldn't it take a longgggg time to get satellite imaging?

I guess when push comes to shove, Apple isn't going to do a move to push themselves under a bus, guess we'll have to wait and see.

Maybe it will come out with software 4.0 when the new iPhone is released in June / July timeframe? :confused:

ntrigue
Nov 29, 2009, 12:34 PM
This article means nothing to me. I bought a Black Friday Nuvi with free traffic for $200 from $699. I don't need my iPhone to do a hundred mediocre tasks.

*LTD*
Nov 29, 2009, 12:37 PM
This article means nothing to me. I bought a Black Friday Nuvi with free traffic for $200 from $699. I don't need my iPhone to do a hundred mediocre tasks.

Good. The rest of us do.

nagromme
Nov 29, 2009, 12:43 PM
Sounds great, but Iíd be happy if Maps worked at all.

OS 3.0 broke my GPS functionality (accuracy went way off) and it has never been fixed. I got a new phone and even that did not help, so I think itís some corrupt data that gets backed up and restored. (Maybe I could solve it if I allowed it to be an even WORSE bug and wiped out all my backup data!)

Threads at the Apple forums show Iím far from alone. Itís why I havenít bought a GPS app: if Location Services is miles off, then itís no use.

I think Apple probably DID fix the bug that causes this problem to start (since I donít see many NEW complaints on the Apple boards) but the many people who already had the problem still have no solid fix to this day.

CWallace
Nov 29, 2009, 12:46 PM
is it really a possibility that apple will completely remove google from their mapping system?

Unlikely.

Google wants to be on the iPhone because they make their revenue from selling advertisements and user demographic data and the iPhone's user base is a goldmine for both.

And Apple draws benefits from having Google's applications and datastores available on the iPhone to make it more desirable to consumers.

MacRacer
Nov 29, 2009, 12:50 PM
I figure Apple is trying to do something against Verizon's new Droid commercial shows how the iPhone's Maps Program doesn't do things the Google Map Droid programs does. Apple might add turn-by-turn direction and new features to their map app.

ThunderSkunk
Nov 29, 2009, 01:08 PM
If I hear the phrase "the next level" one more time, I'm going to punch the very next person I see right in the face.

What does that even mean, "the next level"? There are set levels? And what is the next one? Is it better or worse? No idea, just "next"? Is this a video game? WTF

Goona
Nov 29, 2009, 01:13 PM
I figure Apple is trying to do something against Verizon's new Droid commercial shows how the iPhone's Maps Program doesn't do things the Google Map Droid programs does. Apple might add turn-by-turn direction and new features to their map app.

Seeing as how Google says they are bringing this feature to the iphone, your point is irrelevant.

Eriamjh1138@DAN
Nov 29, 2009, 01:22 PM
Dear Apple,

How about being able to ROTATE the google maps app?!?!?!

fishmoose
Nov 29, 2009, 01:28 PM
Man i wish i could find this thread for you... I was just reading it the other day. It was the one I mentioned about the 2.x.x being faster.
The guy had instructions to get back down to 2.x.x.
It required an earlier version of iTunes is all I remember :confused: sorry..

Sounds like the thread TheSpaz made, if that helps. You can search for threads made by him it will make it easier to find it.

EDIT: Here's his profile: http://forums.macrumors.com/member.php?u=54683 I don't have the time to look for the thread but maybe someone else has.

CFreymarc
Nov 29, 2009, 01:37 PM
Whenever you see a public ad for "take us to the next level" or "show us your vision" someone very important in the organization quit or they didn't come to terms and conditions on a licensing a product plan was about. My guess is that some third party software house was trying to take Apple on a licensing fee with an 11th hour zinger to double their revenue as a gambit.

Steve himself probably spotted it and it all blew up. Steve is famous / infamous for throwing suppliers and licensees over the board room table at the last minute to get a better deal. Thus, my guess is some took the highway instead of their way. Apple is now broadcasting for anyone for the right deal.

I have a lot of sympathy for that personnel team assigned to filtering responses from this ad.

shady825
Nov 29, 2009, 01:58 PM
Sounds like the thread TheSpaz made, if that helps. You can search for threads made by him it will make it easier to find it.

EDIT: Here's his profile: http://forums.macrumors.com/member.php?u=54683 I don't have the time to look for the thread but maybe someone else has.

Yep that was him ;)

alexhasfun28
Nov 29, 2009, 02:13 PM
This is good. Apple is finally going out independently with working on their own maps. That should be a big step through their current technology.
Who knows, maybe they'll start supporting their own weather system on the iPhone and iPod touch later in the future :)
:apple:

powers74
Nov 29, 2009, 02:15 PM
Would that be 'CloudView' or 'TunnelView'?

I don't think Apple thinks or speaks that literally!

I imagine Apple is after all that juicy info that company has. Now, I don't have an iPhone *yet*, so I didn't know that google maps could be better or worse on different platforms. would it be possible that Apple could simply be looking to augment google maps with this additional technology? I mean if gm's can be altered for different platforms, it could be just another value proposition for iPhone.

arn
Nov 29, 2009, 02:23 PM
2. Satellite imaging, how Apple can top that, I don't know...wouldn't it take a longgggg time to get satellite imaging?


Google didn't take the satellite images themselves. They license it from a 3rd party company. Looks like from http://www.terrametrics.com/. I'm sure Apple can license from the same or another source.

arn

yayitsezekiel
Nov 29, 2009, 02:32 PM
Google didn't take the satellite images themselves. They license it from a 3rd party company. Looks like from http://www.terrametrics.com/. I'm sure Apple can license from the same or another source.

arn

hmm I didn't know what. Well from the looks of it, apple can get their own deal. Nevertheless, It's always exciting to hear someone at apple is trying to be innovative and make something new :)

shady825
Nov 29, 2009, 02:44 PM
Google didn't take the satellite images themselves. They license it from a 3rd party company. Looks like from http://www.terrametrics.com/. I'm sure Apple can license from the same or another source.

arn

I'm pretty sure Google has cars and takes there own pictures for "street view"

cmaier
Nov 29, 2009, 02:44 PM
I'm pretty sure Google has cars and takes there own pictures for "street view"

Yes. But that's not satellite view.

shady825
Nov 29, 2009, 02:59 PM
Yes. But that's not satellite view.

Right. I'm just saying some of the pictures, such as street view, are most likely Google's property.

fishmoose
Nov 29, 2009, 03:04 PM
Right. I'm just saying some of the pictures, such as street view, are most likely Google's property.

True, Apple need a way around that because Street View is awesome! So fun looking at city's using street view, I do it all the time!

shady825
Nov 29, 2009, 03:06 PM
True, Apple need a way around that because Street View is awesome! So fun looking at city's using street view, I do it all the time!

Thats what I'm saying. If Apple wants to compete, they better have a plan for something like street view.

joemama
Nov 29, 2009, 04:01 PM
Who said anything about Apple charging for the app?
If you didn't know, google maps come free on all iPhones. Now I'm no computer programer or anything but I suspect the Apple Maps will replace google maps. AKA be free.

What I meant was a free TURN-BY-TURN navigation app, like the droid - at no charge, so you wouldn't need a third party one, like the tom tom one.

powers74
Nov 29, 2009, 04:05 PM
Thats what I'm saying. If Apple wants to compete, they better have a plan for something like street view.

Street view is pretty handy, but I'm thinking it will be a more gradual departure from GMaps. Apple will probably use the new map tech to make iPhone stand out from the competition until they can cook up their own solution to street view.

heisetax
Nov 29, 2009, 04:05 PM
AFR900: Apple would never be foolish enough to abandon the existing user base. While new functions may depend on new hardware (such as was the case with 3GS and 3.0), Apple understands the importance of catering to existing customers. Basically, by making OS upgrades incremental and compatible, Apple can leverage its existing user base and number of downloaded apps. I can almost guarantee you that you are wrong.

But Apple has already abandoned the PPC Macs. A little quieter is the abandonment of most of the early 1st gen & maybe a little later Intel Macs including the 1st gen Intel Mac Pro. Its in Apple's history to abandon older technology when the new comes out. Apple was the first to introduce the 3.5" floppy, Steve Jobs was the first to get rid of it when he started his Next Computer CO Apple followed with the elimination of the floppy with the iMac introduction.

j-Phone
Nov 29, 2009, 04:30 PM
I hope Google Android comes out with all of the features that will cause Apple to go into their bag of tricks and finally make the iPhone what it should have been in the beginning. Apple always holds back!

Supa_Fly
Nov 29, 2009, 04:37 PM
I hear you. When they introduced the App store, I laughed heartily, and when I saw the icon, my jaw simply dropped. It's hard to say it was copied directly from Installer.app, but its even harder to say that it wasn't.

But this is what Apple does. Success in the consumer world is two fold: you need a solid idea, and you need to get it into people's lives. Many companies and proprietors succeed at the first task, but fail utterly at the latter.

Look at 3G data. The iPhone was a year late with 3G connectivity compared to most smartphones, but yet its release was many people's first 3G experience, and it now accounts for 50% of the cellular data usage in the world.

Good idea, medicore idea, stolen idea... makes no difference. Make people want it, and you WIN.

Um I disagree with the iPhone 3G/3GS being many people's first 3G experience, lol. The main reason for iPhone accounting for 50% of cellular data usage in the US, not the world is:
* Large screen displaying more website information, zoom helps.
* Large 3G footprint of AT&T and initial contract cost being dropped to $199/mth.
* Basically overall better Webkit browsing experience for end users, that dealt with a 2" screen on a feature phone before.

Supa_Fly
Nov 29, 2009, 04:40 PM
Well this will clearly will kill tom tom and apps like it.

Though I think that this will end up being exclusive for the next iphone. I think the next iphone will be different, so different that OS 4 will not be available for previous phones. This is why i avoided the 3GS

If there will be a compatibility break, you can be assured its not because of a single in-house app like maps!! It'll be a hardware (cpu & chipset support) & OS break, along with different screen (resolution increase, maybe not size increase: to help reduce manufacturing costs: increase screen size means new cases to be used, seperate production line, more fees for handling 2 main device warranty's).

Supa_Fly
Nov 29, 2009, 04:47 PM
Google didn't take the satellite images themselves. They license it from a 3rd party company. Looks like from http://www.terrametrics.com/. I'm sure Apple can license from the same or another source.

arn

Hmm. Like Navteq (the world's larget map location provider). Considering Navteq is owned by Nokia, Apple could leverage a licensing agreement with Nokia to have it provided as a replacement to iPhone (giving the same features of Ovi Maps; without the co-branding etc). Apple could allow co-advertisement of Navteq - helping Nokia out with consumer awareness of their mapping solution to other players, while dropping the lawsuit against Apple ;).

However, that just gets Apple into the same sort of ship they're in with Google.

twoodcc
Nov 29, 2009, 05:21 PM
i don't like the "we've only just started" part of that. makes me think it'll be a while before anything becomes of this

hamis92
Nov 29, 2009, 05:23 PM
If Apple abandons Google Maps it's like saying goodbye to detailed maps of remote areas. But we'll see, whatever happened this sounds exciting.

CQd44
Nov 29, 2009, 05:37 PM
If Apple abandons Google Maps it's like saying goodbye to detailed maps of remote areas. But we'll see, whatever happened this sounds exciting.

Would Apple be able to say "no, users are not allowed to use Google Maps ever again"?

cmaier
Nov 29, 2009, 05:40 PM
Would Apple be able to say "no, users are not allowed to use Google Maps ever again"?

Huh? All we are talking about is where the data for "Maps" on iPhone comes from.

Khryz
Nov 29, 2009, 06:29 PM
Ugh, this is stupid.

They've just started yet Google already has a super updated version of Maps on the Android phones. I want that, not something Apple is going to create that may take a year and still be less than what Google offers.

I guess my hope of seeing Google Maps Navigation on the iPhone is slim to none now.

cmaier
Nov 29, 2009, 06:34 PM
Ugh, this is stupid.

They've just started yet Google already has a super updated version of Maps on the Android phones. I want that, not something Apple is going to create that may take a year and still be less than what Google offers.

I guess my hope of seeing Google Maps Navigation on the iPhone is slim to none now.

No. Google already said they are working with Apple to add navigation.

This job posting is about a longer-term plan.

Supa_Fly
Nov 29, 2009, 06:35 PM
Ugh, this is stupid.

They've just started yet Google already has a super updated version of Maps on the Android phones. I want that, not something Apple is going to create that may take a year and still be less than what Google offers.

I guess my hope of seeing Google Maps Navigation on the iPhone is slim to none now.

What if this new mapping application allows you the following:
- Ability to route maps and send the full map data to your friend/family/colleague/etc (via chat!)
- Ability to receive mapped data like the above.
- ability to send during a chat your location, the recipient opens it even OFFLINE and can see your location and find it from THEIR location when online!

there is plenty more missing, even in Androids' Google Maps and Navigation.

MattInOz
Nov 29, 2009, 06:47 PM
- Pssst - You can do that on your iPhone. :D

The Maps app. UI is *all* Apple. They simply have a licensing agreement with Google to use that actual maps.

Plus didn't they acquire a mapping company recently?

I think they are seeing the demand for GPS apps and thinking if we had our own maps to license we could get a double bite of the cherry. Then again you have to offer up something better as an API. Wasn't the draw card of the company their overlay engine to geo-locate all sorts of information over the maps.

Sounds like they have all the talent they need to build there new Map program and API to let others take advantage. Maybe they just want to see what people might show up with as ideas for what the next level is.

I could see maps getting richer and richer layers of both historical and future information. The next question does Apple need a 3DSketching API to go with this like Sketchup but for any app to take advantage of. I'm sure the Pixar connections would have something to bring to the table here.

dicklacara
Nov 29, 2009, 07:33 PM
*

Something caught my eye a while back and I ended up at the PlaceBase web site.

Their mapping GUI and display were pedestrian (hehe) at best. For display, navigation, etc. they would be no competition for Google Maps (on the iPhone or anywhere else).

What PlaceBase offered was access to public and private databases, programs to analyze the data, and a method to overlay the results no a map.


With Google Maps, you can see [a somewhat dated] picture of your house from above (or from the street). Zoom out and you can seen how your house is GPS mapped within the community.


PlaceBase allows you to shows the demographics of:

[For purpose of illustration]

1) your house: cost, payment, number of baths, etc.
2) the people inside your house: age, income, political party, employment

Zoom out with PlaceBase and you can see how the Map of the community is broken down by whatever demographics are of interest.


You can see the residue of the PlaceBase site at:

http://www.pushpin.com/api/1.3/docs/

Be sure to try some of the examples.

Also, this site has some excellent examples of the PlaceBase PushPin system in use:

http://www.policymap.com/


Finally, this endeavor may be Apple's way of defining their relationship with Google...

...reminds me of the woman in the dentist's chair-- The dentist picks up the drill and says: "Open wide!".

The woman grabs the dentist's testicles and says: "We're not going to hurt each other, are we?"

*

cmaier
Nov 29, 2009, 08:13 PM
The GUI is only a demo. Their product is the API.

*

Something caught my eye a while back and I ended up at the PlaceBase web site.

Their mapping GUI and display were pedestrian (hehe) at best. For display, navigation, etc. they would be no competition for Google Maps (on the iPhone or anywhere else).

What PlaceBase offered was access to public and private databases, programs to analyze the data, and a method to overlay the results no a map.


With Google Maps, you can see [a somewhat dated] picture of your house from above (or from the street). Zoom out and you can seen how your house is GPS mapped within the community.


PlaceBase allows you to shows the demographics of:

[For purpose of illustration]

1) your house: cost, payment, number of baths, etc.
2) the people inside your house: age, income, political party, employment

Zoom out with PlaceBase and you can see how the Map of the community is broken down by whatever demographics are of interest.


You can see the residue of the PlaceBase site at:

http://www.pushpin.com/api/1.3/docs/

Be sure to try some of the examples.

Also, this site has some excellent examples of the PlaceBase PushPin system in use:

http://www.policymap.com/


Finally, this endeavor may be Apple's way of defining their relationship with Google...

...reminds me of the woman in the dentist's chair-- The dentist picks up the drill and says: "Open wide!".

The woman grabs the dentist's testicles and says: "We're not going to hurt each other, are we?"

*

Ranma13
Nov 29, 2009, 08:41 PM
In the article, the correct spelling is 'dependence', not 'dependance'.

MattInOz
Nov 29, 2009, 09:06 PM
The GUI is only a demo. Their product is the API.

Even more reason why Apple would be looking for someone with a good idea of how this should work GUI wise instead of just API wise.

dicklacara
Nov 29, 2009, 09:09 PM
The GUI is only a demo. Their product is the API.


I agree, but I'd go a little further-- their product includes the infrastructure and
[legal] agreements that allow them to access and analyze data from many disparate sources.

*

dicklacara
Nov 29, 2009, 09:12 PM
Even more reason why Apple would be looking for someone with a good idea of how this should work GUI wise instead of just API wise.

Right!

The Apple/Google GUI is a good one. Maybe, Apple and Google have reasons to cooperate-- each has something the other wants or needs.

*

cmaier
Nov 29, 2009, 09:50 PM
The GUI isn't likely going to change in fundamental ways. You're looking at Apple getting ready to switch to a different source of its data, one that offers a rich API and capabilities for integrating all sorts of additional data into maps. You'll still be able to pinch zoom, drag, and all the other good stuff that the Maps app can do, since Apple wrote the Maps.app in the first place.

Derrick Velasco
Nov 29, 2009, 10:12 PM
Same here. I'm glad I didn't get the 3GS.
It honestly didn't seem like enuff of a "upgrade" to me.
CAN'T wait for the 2010 iPhone tho! (I'm not gonna call it any name as of right now, 4G, 4GS....)
the only thing I dislike about my 3G is I SWEAR TO GOD that ever since the 3GS came out, they slowed down the 3G iPhone. What better way to make people want the "S" for Speed and make them upgrade.

They added features so that slows down the 3G and 2G. Apple would never do that to it's early costumers. :rolleyes: Honestly though, I am GLAD I got the 3GS, It's a big improvement when opening apps and handling graphics. I couldn't deal with (chug chug a chug) speeds any longer so I upgraded. Glad I did. LOVE YA 3GS! :D

BTW
Nov 29, 2009, 10:51 PM
Their mapping technology will get thrown into the next SDK revision and hopefully their augmented reality APIs will finally be open to developers officially. Cool stuff!

junior86
Nov 29, 2009, 10:54 PM
with the increasing competition from Android, differentiation seems to be the only strategy. you can't trust a partner forever, especially huge companies like Google. Apple has learned that from its early years with Microsoft in the 1980's. Don't trust anyone for too long!:D

str1f3
Nov 30, 2009, 01:08 AM
The GUI isn't likely going to change in fundamental ways. You're looking at Apple getting ready to switch to a different source of its data, one that offers a rich API and capabilities for integrating all sorts of additional data into maps. You'll still be able to pinch zoom, drag, and all the other good stuff that the Maps app can do, since Apple wrote the Maps.app in the first place.

Yes, but until you see Apple-logoed trucks rolling around the countryside it will not be as useful as Street View. Unless they have an alternative to this and Google Navigation.

scottness
Nov 30, 2009, 02:28 AM
I'd like them to take their GPS receiver to the next level.

y3k
Nov 30, 2009, 03:18 AM
This is not going to be easy. Google business including the maps is not about mapping technology, not about various street views and sat images. The main business around mapping is still the same: Google is acting as a worldwide advertising agency. Free of charge if you don't need to jump above the others or you can pay to get real attention of the users. So, if Apple now wants to repeat all of that, make it real and useable, they need to start indexing web pages on the Internet, parse the information they find, enrich the data and incorporate that info into their maps. Besides, they need to establish it as a process, not just one-time thing - the data must be actual. That's what Google evidently does and that's what I don't believe Apple can do in the near future. Otherwise, just to have another Geo app where you can't find anything? Not interested at all...

eastercat
Nov 30, 2009, 06:00 AM
This article tells me they are trying to move as far away from Google as possible. This makes me sad. Google is a great company
I don't like seeing Apple and Google fight. I like both of their products too much and I want to be able to use them both without jumping through any hoops.
Google isn't that great. They have issues, when it comes to violation of privacy. I use their products, however, because their usefulness outweighs my concerns about their intrusions.
Apple and Google are competitors. Actually, all companies are competing with each other in some fashion. So their rivalry isn't scary. This isn't your parents getting a divorce. When it comes time to choose, just choose the best offering for you.

Then you must not have seen Bing's Maps "Bird's Eye View" yet. Instead of staring straight down at indistinguishable rooftops, you have a diagonal ariel view that you can actually recognize things from
I'll have to remember to give it a try. Thanks for the head's up.

kernkraft
Nov 30, 2009, 06:21 AM
... a bit crap at navigation.


I spent the weekend in London. In my car, I've had my Garmin GPS and my iPhone with TomTom and Co-Pilot. I was pleased with the price of Co-Pilot and I got TomTom through some 'Pineapple promotion' for testing.


In the car, there was no question that Garmin beat the hell out of both iPhone apps. In pedestrian mode, the iPhone had the advantage of GoogleMap, so at least the map would be usable. However, in Kensington, our location was regularly placed as if we were in South London. This is completely unacceptable. For me, the iPhone will not replace a dedicated unit for a while.

I have recently been to the US. In Boston, the iPhone had occasional problems staying on the 'Freedom Trail'. In NYC, it was pretty bad and I only had a completely reliable service in DC. As a tourist, I will just get a paper map the next time. And a proper phone, that doesn't attempt to do millions of things.

neverbuyapc
Nov 30, 2009, 07:35 AM
ANOTHER TYPO? C'mon Macrumors! You are getting sloppy. I believe instead of "been know for differentiating itself" you meant "been KNOWN for differentiating itself." STAY INTELLIGENT MACRUMORS. WE LOVE U!

cmaier
Nov 30, 2009, 08:49 AM
This is not going to be easy. Google business including the maps is not about mapping technology, not about various street views and sat images. The main business around mapping is still the same: Google is acting as a worldwide advertising agency. Free of charge if you don't need to jump above the others or you can pay to get real attention of the users. So, if Apple now wants to repeat all of that, make it real and useable, they need to start indexing web pages on the Internet, parse the information they find, enrich the data and incorporate that info into their maps. Besides, they need to establish it as a process, not just one-time thing - the data must be actual. That's what Google evidently does and that's what I don't believe Apple can do in the near future. Otherwise, just to have another Geo app where you can't find anything? Not interested at all...

I don't expect Apple to drop all ties to google. I wouldn't be surprised to see them continue to use google as a search engine, including in maps.

As for "google navigation," that will be easy to replace when the time comes. Same with the satellite data (license it directly from one of many sources). Street or birdseye view is more of a problem unless someone is willing to license it or apple replicates the data itself - it has a lot of cash on hand and a giant shiny new data center..:

UmichAg
Nov 30, 2009, 10:02 AM
Is there any reason to think that Google Navigation's upcoming app won't work on the 3GS? It'd suck to have to buy a new iPhone to get this feature.

macshill
Nov 30, 2009, 10:14 AM
I hope you enjoy paying for the privilege of using iPhone Maps, because Apple isn't in the habit of giving away apps for free. Meanwhile, Google Maps is free on the Droid.

aegisdesign
Nov 30, 2009, 10:37 AM
Just to reiterate a point but Google don't own all their map tiles. I say 'all' as there's some evidence that is changing.

They used to licence NavTeq maps before Nokia bought NavTeq. Since then they've used solely TeleAtlas. TeleAtlas isn't as accurate as NavTeq in my experience. TomTom own TeleAtlas btw.

Recently, Google Maps has been showing some tile data that is copyright Google. Where they got that data from is a mystery. Some of it seems to have been supplied by local government.

Apple aren't going to create their own maps. If they're going to cut out Google they could go to NavTeq or TeleAtlas directly or maybe use Nokia's Ovi Maps service which has some features that beat the crap out of Google Maps, not least of which is being able to download entire maps of a country to your phone so the mapping works when you can't get a phone signal. See http://maps.ovi.com

Pretty much all S60, Maemo and even some S40 based Nokias have Ovi Maps built in free and turn-by-turn navigation is a cheap subscription service. Nokia also have augmented reality apps in beta too - http://betalabs.nokia.com/betas/view/nokia-point-and-find

Apple perhaps missed out on buying one of the two big mapping companies although they could probably buy TomTom out of their cash reserves. The PlaceBase acquisition got the no map data rights - just expertise in applying GIS information to maps such as ave. house price in an area or crime rates.

Niko03
Nov 30, 2009, 10:49 AM
Agreed, especially when you consider that Apple's own implementation of Google Maps is better than Google's on Android.

I don't really see this as a big deal. Apple may just need an extra hand on the Maps application considering they will have their own implementation of Google Navigation and probably apply voice control to it in OS 4.0.

Like another poster said, before Apple releases their own Maps solution, they had better make sure it is far better than what Google Maps already offers.

I can't see Apple changing the maps application's interface or base functionality that dramatically. It would be a step back, and I think Apple is smarter than that.

If the droid's map app implementation is different, then I think it most likely is because Apple had a hand in the iPhone's map app. (which is what I thought I heard elsewhere, unless I'm mistaken) if that's the case then part of it could be carried forward.

It's all conjecture but, the acquisition apple made, I believe, speaks to the database behind the pretty map.

Niko03
Nov 30, 2009, 10:57 AM
I hope you enjoy paying for the privilege of using iPhone Maps, because Apple isn't in the habit of giving away apps for free. Meanwhile, Google Maps is free on the Droid.

The only iPhone app that I've seen that Apple charges for is Texas hold'em, which is a game, iDisk and Remote are both free as well as the dozen or so apps that come standard.

The maps application is currently free, no way in hell would they start to make you pay extra for a tweaked version.

aegisdesign
Nov 30, 2009, 11:01 AM
The maps application is currently free, no way in hell would they start to make you pay extra for a tweaked version.

And Google Maps is free on all the other smartphone platforms out there so Apple would be silly to charge for it's Maps application.

Google would just release a free Google Maps app in the App Store and there's nothing Apple could do about it. Oh, hang on a minute..... :eek: ;) :D

cmaier
Nov 30, 2009, 11:19 AM
I hope you enjoy paying for the privilege of using iPhone Maps, because Apple isn't in the habit of giving away apps for free. Meanwhile, Google Maps is free on the Droid.

Ridiculous.

ChazUK
Nov 30, 2009, 11:25 AM
The only iPhone app that I've seen that Apple charges for is Texas hold'em, which is a game, iDisk and Remote are both free as well as the dozen or so apps that come standard.

The maps application is currently free, no way in hell would they start to make you pay extra for a tweaked version.

100% agreed. Maps is one of the standard feature apps on the iPhone and the last thing they would do is reduce the basic featureset on the platform by charging for it as an update.

hamis92
Nov 30, 2009, 11:32 AM
Then you must not have seen Bing's Maps "Bird's Eye View" yet. Instead of staring straight down at indistinguishable rooftops, you have a diagonal ariel view that you can actually recognize things from

I just tried this and I was simply blown away, I couldn't imagine the images were so detailed even here in Finland.

lilo777
Nov 30, 2009, 12:33 PM
Instead of "Apple to Take iPhone's Maps App to 'the Next Level'" better choice would be "Apple wishes to Take iPhone's Maps App to 'the Next Level'". Original title implies certainty. In reality we have yet to see what they will be able to come up with. They probably will not be able to deliver a very cool feature available in Google navigation (on Droid) where one can see how the incoming intersection will look like and where one needs to go. The feature uses Google's street view.

cmaier
Nov 30, 2009, 01:28 PM
Instead of "Apple to Take iPhone's Maps App to 'the Next Level'" better choice would be "Apple wishes to Take iPhone's Maps App to 'the Next Level'". Original title implies certainty. In reality we have yet to see what they will be able to come up with. They probably will not be able to deliver a very cool feature available in Google navigation (on Droid) where one can see how the incoming intersection will look like and where one needs to go. The feature uses Google's street view.

I'm sure Google will happily continue to provide Google street view information in exchange for Apple continuing to use google for map search results (and accompanying ads).

charlituna
Nov 30, 2009, 11:40 PM
if Apple now wants to repeat all of that


or perhaps they will do better by not repeating 'all of that'. perhaps they will return to the days of a simple map with directions and traffic indicators and not try to do all the street view, pop up ads, etc that the web sites do to try to be bigger and badder than the others.

and for many that would be great. I can't stand Google Maps because they have screwed me over time and again with way out of the way directions or being behind on a street being made one way (opposite the way I need to go) or being shut down to traffic to make a new pedestrian mall.

Let's have a basic map function without all the fluff. if you want all that, i'm sure there's a few apps for it.

Bill777
Dec 8, 2009, 03:18 PM
This will be great though.............the iphone has more applications than any other phone out there and I couldn't be happier!