OS X 10.3.6 Expected Soon? [Archive]

MacRumors

Oct 12, 2004, 01:13 AM

According to AppleInsider (http://www.appleinsider.com/article.php?id=685), the next revision to Apple's OS X 10.3 Panther operating system is expected within the next 30 days. Enhancements are said to be in Networking, OpenGL, Updated ATI & NVidia graphics card drivers, additional FireWire audio and USB device compatibility, and improved compatibility for third party applications. Also expected are updated versions of Apple's Calculator, DVD Player, Image Capture, and Safari applications, as well as previous standalone Mac OS X security updates.

Doctor Q

Oct 12, 2004, 01:15 AM

A Calculator update!?

BWhaler

Oct 12, 2004, 01:16 AM

I hope to God it fixes the ripple issue on the new G5's.

MacFan26

Oct 12, 2004, 01:16 AM

That would be nice, good to see them working on more compatibility for external devices and third party stuff :D

mikeyrogers

Oct 12, 2004, 01:17 AM

As always, I'm looking forward to the OpenGL updates even though I will never admit that a PowerBook G4 does not make a good gaming machine. :D

Cannibal

Oct 12, 2004, 01:20 AM

i'm just excited to actually be on a computer that CAN be use the new updates...

have i mentioned how much i love my new iMac?

-Cannibal-
:D

Avicdar

Oct 12, 2004, 01:21 AM

Hopefully nice updated drivers for the 9800 Pro SE 256mb!

Bring it on!

rendezvouscp

Oct 12, 2004, 01:22 AM

I hope they iron out the bugs in the developer version (right now I can't control the audio level of the back audio out port on my Mac).
–Chase

Peyote

Oct 12, 2004, 01:22 AM

All I wanna know is when the hell is CHESS going to be updated?! I think we've waited long enough!

MacFan26

Oct 12, 2004, 01:23 AM

I hope to God it fixes the ripple issue on the new G5's.
ripple issue?

JFreak

Oct 12, 2004, 01:23 AM

this can very well be true - at least firewire audio updates MUST be significant, as there are severe problems with pro audio apps with the 10.3.5 version, compared to the 10.3.4 which is imho the best osx version so far.

bring it on, even with the feature set of 10.3.5 only having all bugs worked out.

MacinDoc

Oct 12, 2004, 01:31 AM

Maybe this will improve the OpenGL speedup times that everyone was complaining about with the new iMacs. Or maybe that's too much to hope for... :rolleyes:

JFreak

Oct 12, 2004, 01:40 AM

or... why hasn't anyone yet said this: this must mean the new G5 powerbook is on its way :D :D :D

(i must admit, i feel a little ashamed in joking about this. the G5 will eventually make its way into powerbooks and the day will come when it comes. no need to hype it, seriously.)

LeeTom

Oct 12, 2004, 01:43 AM

comictimes

Oct 12, 2004, 01:46 AM

As always, I'm looking forward to the OpenGL updates even though I will never admit that a PowerBook G4 does not make a good gaming machine. :D
heh. I'm definitely with you there. games run wonderfully on my powerbook... really...

munkle

Oct 12, 2004, 01:52 AM

A Calculator update!?

Yeah, I remember reading some article lambasting the Calculator, apparently it's wildly off on some sums.

Edit: beaten to it!

rikers_mailbox

Oct 12, 2004, 01:57 AM

10.3.6 update? Cool. Finder already feels snappier. :D

Seriously though, I feel like Apple is gonna release something new tomorrow. Not necessarily 10.3.6, but possibly iTMS Pan-Euro? maybe 60GB iPod? Flash iPod? New eMacs? I dunno, things have been quiet. . . too quiet.

coolfactor

Oct 12, 2004, 01:58 AM

Yeah, I remember reading some article lambasting the Calculator, apparently it's wildly off on some sums.

Technically, it's not doing mis-calculations, but how it presents the answer to the user, by default, is a bit unexpected leading people to believe the answer is wrong. It's not.

munkle

Oct 12, 2004, 02:03 AM

Technically, it's not doing mis-calculations, but how it presents the answer to the user, by default, is a bit unexpected leading people to believe the answer is wrong. It's not.

Technically, what's the difference? The answer isn't wrong, just how it's written down, which in turn the simple layman reads wrongly?! :confused:

swissmann

Oct 12, 2004, 02:03 AM

Chaszmyr

Oct 12, 2004, 02:04 AM

As far as the Calculator update goes, I remember reading an article about how it is actually not very accurate for even some intermediate math.
Ah... here it is:
http://www.mikeindustries.com/blog/archive/2004/08/apple-calculator

haha, that's kind of amusing

I wonder if they gave the updated Safari a new version # yet...

Ja Di ksw

Oct 12, 2004, 02:12 AM

heh. I'm definitely with you there. games run wonderfully on my powerbook... really...

Games run fine on mine, but I guess I don't play anything more intensive than wc3. Mainly it's just for school and simplistic video editing / DVD making

BWhaler

Oct 12, 2004, 02:20 AM

ripple issue?

With the ati cards, the screen will ripple when scrolling. It's not overly bad, just annoying. I have read it is a driver issue.

fatbarstard

Oct 12, 2004, 02:31 AM

BrianKonarsMac

Oct 12, 2004, 02:35 AM

i hope this fixes all of the issues with gaming...at least with blizzard :D.

Private Public

Oct 12, 2004, 02:50 AM

I hope the Nvidia cards are actually fixed this time unlike the last two updates. I hate having to run halo with all the extras because of the problem when zooming.

Vanilla

Oct 12, 2004, 03:02 AM

With regards to the calculator update all I ask for is that we have an option to display results that are formatted. ie rather than displaying "12345678" allow us to ask to display the result as "12,345,678.00"

Its a feature I really miss from my Windows XP days.

Unless of course this option exists in OSX and I have just missed it? (fingers crossed hoping.....)

Vanilla

Loge

Oct 12, 2004, 03:22 AM

Apparently, the calculator was using badly truncated conversion factors, for example for square inch to acre (okay, not something you do every day), leading to a fairly significant error. More details here

http://davidakin.blogware.com/blog/_archives/2004/8/10/121754.html

I also read some people having issues with updating currency conversion rates.

Dalriada

Oct 12, 2004, 03:24 AM

New dual core PB's running OS X 10.3.6 for November.... ?!?! Can't wait :D :D :D

BakedBeans

Oct 12, 2004, 03:28 AM

(i must admit, i feel a little ashamed in joking about this. the G5 will eventually make its way into powerbooks and the day will come when it comes. no need to hype it, seriously.)

yeah... i can see that the wont be much hype ;)

it might even slip by not noticed... we might be able to get the g6 in it before people notice??

or maybe not

maybe when it comes out people wont say
"what a great acheivement to fit that in there"

but will say?
"how long before the spead bump, idont want to buy a rev.a"

AmigoMac

Oct 12, 2004, 04:20 AM

I just need to dream about Core Image/Video full compatibility for G4 iBooks... then I could wait a new revision of the Dual-Core PB G4 ... but if that's not the case, then this baby will go to ebay... (I almost know the answer to that).

anyway, nice to see apple working for a better OS every single day, and how they will soon introduce the new G4 PBs and iBooks ... middle of november, latest!

HiRez

Oct 12, 2004, 05:22 AM

With the ati cards, the screen will ripple when scrolling. It's not overly bad, just annoying. I have read it is a driver issue.With which card? (5200/9600/9800?)

Analog Kid

Oct 12, 2004, 05:31 AM

As far as the Calculator update goes, I remember reading an article about how it is actually not very accurate for even some intermediate math.
Ah... here it is:
http://www.mikeindustries.com/blog/archive/2004/08/apple-calculator

It was written in August, so it's nice to see Apple turning it around this quickly with a fix, if that is indeed what they are doing.

Lee Tom
That's floating point for you... It's just showing the result that the FPU gives it. I'd guess they can fix it with a little bit of smart formatting (ie. figure out the "precision" based on the inputs rather than leave it to the user). Easier to solve for addition and subtraction than for, say, division.

I'd heard that Apple bought a graphing calculator app they were planning to use as part of the base system-- figured they'd leave that for Tiger, but who knows...

Analog Kid

Oct 12, 2004, 05:38 AM

Hope this fixes my Entourage crashes - the only programme that goes nuts on my PB 17"... have been running Activity Monitor to see what is going on - even when Ent is open but parked in the dock the damn thing is hogging CPU and memory like it owns the place..

Which makes everything else run a bit more slowly...

That's the only problem I've got/had with my Mac's in the past five years and I'm onto number 5....
I don't think this is an Apple issue... I had the same problem with Entourage at work when running Jaguar, and when Panther added better support for large mailboxes, I dumped Entourage. Never liked the interface, it never played nice with MS Exchange anyway even after they supposedly added support for it (using some stupid HTTP protocol rather than actually support MAPI), and it would bring everything I was doing to a grinding halt every time it checked mail.

And you're right, it would just sit there and chew cycles for no good reason when it wasn't checking mail or doing anything else as far as I could tell.

The only mail app that I could find worse than Entourage was Outlook for Windows-- never could get past the feeling that they had a bunch of summer interns try to bolt together a bunch of pet projects into Outlook.

Given the choice between checking my mail by IMAP using Entourage or by IMAP using Mail, I opted for Mail.

MacFan26

Oct 12, 2004, 05:42 AM

With the ati cards, the screen will ripple when scrolling. It's not overly bad, just annoying. I have read it is a driver issue.
ah, yeah I can see how that would be annoying. :(

C-Mezak

Oct 12, 2004, 06:02 AM

cb911

Oct 12, 2004, 06:17 AM

good. finally i might be able to play Halo on my PB? :rolleyes: although i dont' know if any amount of updates will fix a bad port... :(

risc

Oct 12, 2004, 06:22 AM

With the ati cards, the screen will ripple when scrolling. It's not overly bad, just annoying. I have read it is a driver issue.

I don't get anything like that on my Power Mac G5 (Rev B) ATI Radeon 9800 XT.

toughboy

Oct 12, 2004, 06:28 AM

johnnyjibbs

Oct 12, 2004, 06:32 AM

I usually do a clean install when I do these updates. I didn't with 10.3.5 and have had a lot of crashes etc. I don't know if anyone else has has worse luck with 10.3.5 than previous minor revisions - input would be nice. I do hope that a simple update to 10.3.6 fixes these bugs but don't think it will happen.
That's a bit extreme isn't it? I've never done a clean install and I rarely ever have crashes.

To the other poster who was wondering, a clean install would wipe your hard drive (effectively putting it back to factory settings) which you would do using your software restore discs that came with your computer (or Panther discs if your computer is older). Then you'd go onto the internet (or software update) and get the combo updater to the current OS X minor revision. This means you have to copy everything you want to keep (documents, other apps, etc) oton a different hard drive. This process would take hours and I see very little point. If you want to do a clean install, wait for Tiger and do it then when you upgrade.

Regarding the calculator, I did remember having issues with it crashing and quitting every time I tried to update the currency converter but then that mysteriously fixed itself as suddenly as it came (probably in a previous OS update). I'm guessing this update has something to do with the inaccuracies other posters are reporting.

virividox

Oct 12, 2004, 06:44 AM

haha read the blog about the calculator funny conclusion :)

hmm i wouldnt mind improvements to safari more website compatibility would be great

AT71

Oct 12, 2004, 07:11 AM

10.3.6 is supposedly to solve the font issue in 10.3.5 update. Keeping fingers crossed.

Shagrat

Oct 12, 2004, 07:24 AM

That's floating point for you... It's just showing the result that the FPU gives it. I'd guess they can fix it with a little bit of smart formatting (ie. figure out the "precision" based on the inputs rather than leave it to the user). Easier to solve for addition and subtraction than for, say, division.

I'd heard that Apple bought a graphing calculator app they were planning to use as part of the base system-- figured they'd leave that for Tiger, but who knows...

They have indeed bought a new graphing calculator app. Curvus Pro X is the app. More details here...

http://www.appleinsider.com/article.php?id=652

killmoms

Oct 12, 2004, 08:23 AM

All I want is for my PowerBook to consistently wake from sleep. >_>

themacman

Oct 12, 2004, 08:29 AM

anyone thing new poerbooks with 10.3.6, the same day

Foocha

Oct 12, 2004, 08:40 AM

Let's hope they fix the NFS bugs and Safari cookie bug - see link below for details:

http://algesten.blogspot.com/

sirjimithy

Oct 12, 2004, 09:01 AM

anyone thing new poerbooks with 10.3.6, the same day

eh?

Mr. Anderson

Oct 12, 2004, 09:09 AM

As far as the Calculator update goes, I remember reading an article about how it is actually not very accurate for even some intermediate math.
Ah... here it is:
http://www.mikeindustries.com/blog/archive/2004/08/apple-calculator

That's friggin great!

4. The principal software engineer at my company couldn’t tell me how this was even possible

Damn funny, haven't even noticed it myself and until I read this I was a bit surprised to here about it.....

I was hoping that they might add graphing to the standard calc -

D

ASP272

Oct 12, 2004, 09:13 AM

~Shard~

Oct 12, 2004, 09:21 AM

Glad to see we're getting at least one more update to Panther before Tiger is released and Panther is forgotten about... ;)

And come on, all you guys going on about the Calculator update - you're overlooking the key update to this whole thing - ImageCapture! Come on, where would we all be without that tool - I think it needs a serious overhaul and hopefully this will be the sole focus of 10.3.6. ;) :cool:

takao

Oct 12, 2004, 09:26 AM

hmm for the calculator issue: sometimes forgetting binary is dangerous when programming around with floating point calculations ;)...( like "while" loops with a variable counting .3 .4 etc. )

for those who don't know: 0.1 can't be displayed in binary with a limited amount of numbers...

orb

Oct 12, 2004, 09:28 AM

I'd like to see Java 1.5 in 10.3.6 so that at least we can pretend that OS X isn't a second-tier Java development platform.

robbieduncan

Oct 12, 2004, 09:43 AM

I was hoping that they might add graphing to the standard calc -
D

I beleive that this is coming in Tiger. You can add it to the Panther one, but the graphing view does not really work all that well.

wdlove

Oct 12, 2004, 10:03 AM

A Calculator update!?

I definitely hope that it will be an awesome calculator. If anyone needs this feature updated it's Doctor Q.

We have a gift coming prior to Thanksgiving. :)

Sharewaredemon

Oct 12, 2004, 10:04 AM

Mac Chess Is Impossible

keysersoze

Oct 12, 2004, 10:17 AM

Mac Chess Is Impossible

Amen to that.

sirjimithy

Oct 12, 2004, 10:23 AM

Mac Chess Is Impossible

if you ever need a little put-me-down, play this game. Put it on the easiest difficulty, and it will still kick your ass in 6 moves.

gopher

Oct 12, 2004, 10:34 AM

Firewire device compatibility

Still waiting to put to rest the Firewire bug:

http://www.macmaps.com/firewirebug2.html

DWKlink

Oct 12, 2004, 10:43 AM

With the ati cards, the screen will ripple when scrolling. It's not overly bad, just annoying. I have read it is a driver issue.

Have you tried downloading ATIs new Utilities from its website? They now work on OEM cards, and you can create a profile for each application you use. For example, I created a profile for SimCity 4 and enabled "Verticle Sync." That cured the rippling for my 9600xt (the game still hangs up and freezes though). Give it a try...

pimentoLoaf

Oct 12, 2004, 10:56 AM

The calculator is available in two modes, Basic and Advanced, selectable from the View menu. Wish they would take the ol' os9 Graphing Calculator and merge it in.

DVD Player has real problems since X.3.5 update. Certain films like "The King and I" which should display edge-to-edge in widescreen, shrink a bit so there are black bars to either side in addition to the usual top & bottom. It's almost as if I'm viewing the film on a 12" screen on my 17" powerBook.

silvergunuk

Oct 12, 2004, 11:09 AM

I read somewhere that the ipod will celebrate its 3rd birthday on the 23rd of this month. Possible release date for the new ipod?

Jovian9

Oct 12, 2004, 11:12 AM

Mac Chess Is Impossible

Most definitely.

Mr_Ed

Oct 12, 2004, 11:16 AM

if you ever need a little put-me-down, play this game. Put it on the easiest difficulty, and it will still kick your ass in 6 moves.
:D LOL! I know what you mean, but I'm not really an avid chess player. I wonder how a long time chess player feels about it.

On the 10.3.6 update, I'm sure there are some needed fixes included, but the fact that most of this thread so far has talked about the 'Calculator' app bugs leads me to believe 10.3.5 doesn't exactly have a lot of earth shattering problems :) Maybe most of "10.3.6" is just the bundled Security Updates.

asphalt-proof

Oct 12, 2004, 11:22 AM

if you ever need a little put-me-down, play this game. Put it on the easiest difficulty, and it will still kick your ass in 6 moves.

I was able to beat the computer once... and I play about 5-8 games a day on it for the past year. Sometimes I even cheat and use the back button but still get beat. Very embarrassing. What's worse is after a particularly bad beatdown, it starts openly flirting with my wife. :p

Mr_Ed

Oct 12, 2004, 11:25 AM

.... What's worse is after a particularly bad beatdown, it starts openly flirting with my wife. :p
Wow! I've heard of the bully kicking sand in your face at the beach in front of your girl, but this is ridiculous! :D

Foocha

Oct 12, 2004, 11:33 AM

10.3.5 doesn't exactly have a lot of earth shattering problems
There are some major bugs in 10.3.5 - like the Safari cookie bug and the NFS bugs I already mentioned, and the Firewire bug mentioned by Gopher (I haven't personally encountered that one).

Also, performance of sharing in general seems to have deteriorated significantly since 10.3. We have several PowerBooks at my company, and they all used to rediscover AFP shares when woken from sleep, even when moved to a different network, connected via the AFP share via VPN. Since 10.3.2, this has not worked so well - the connection just times out. Shame - hope they can resolve it.

Also, the log in screen - when connected to a network with a Mac OS X server with Open Directory, the "Other" login option takes some time to appear. If you have already selected an account from the list and have started to type in your password, the window goes funny and it takes you back to the list again. Very annoying!

I could go on and on - Apple has plenty of work to do!

G4-power

Oct 12, 2004, 11:53 AM

I could go on and on - Apple has plenty of work to do!

Yes, they do, 10.3.5 is un-Appleishly buggy. But tey don't have as much work to do as Microsoft, I'm glad.

zv470

Oct 12, 2004, 11:58 AM

RqThrottle

Oct 12, 2004, 12:05 PM

if you ever need a little put-me-down, play this game. Put it on the easiest difficulty, and it will still kick your ass in 6 moves.

I am a not particularly good chess club player, and I have drawn a few quick games (at lowest level). Last one last night as black. The computer will desperately draw by repetition once it smells defeat.

The chess program could use a lot of improvements, like been able to create databases with your games, edit games, insert comments, ICC interface?, support online playing, chessbase compatibility (.cbh), etc. The list could go on forever.

For the casual player that only wants to play a quick game, the program is great. For the serious tournament player that uses Fritz & Chessbase on PC, its bad.

I believe most users fall in the first group, and are quite happy with it.

AidenShaw

Oct 12, 2004, 12:25 PM

i find when i copy numbers from a website, the calculator app can get confused with new line characters (even if you're very careful to only copy the numbers), seems like it needs to strip those non-numeric characters before converting them to doubles. Also... when you enter eg: 1.0005 the 0s don't display until you type the 5, :o

A double is far too small for the calculator app - it should be using synthetic arithmetic with "infinite" precision and range.

Try 123456789012345678901234567890 * 100 with a double.... And then try it with calc, and then try XP's calc.

double a, b, c;

a = 123456789012345678901234567890.;
b = 100.;
c = a * b;
printf ("Product of %f and %f", a,b);
printf (" is %f\n", c);

produces

Product of 123456789012345680000000000000.000000 and 100.000000
is 12345678901234567000000000000000.000000

XP's calculator gives the expected:

12345678901234567890123456789000

jsw

Oct 12, 2004, 12:26 PM

I'd like to see Java 1.5 in 10.3.6 so that at least we can pretend that OS X isn't a second-tier Java development platform.
Of course, you have to love the fact that Java 5 (a.k.a. Java 1.5) is codenamed "Tiger".... I'd like to see it on 10.3 as well, but "Tiger on Tiger" has a nice ring to it.

However, since the Java 1.5 developer preview on runs on 10.4, I doubt we'll see it until then.

Peyote

Oct 12, 2004, 12:26 PM

I am a not particularly good chess club player, and I have drawn a few quick games (at lowest level). Last one last night as black. The computer will desperately draw by repetition once it smells defeat.

The chess program could use a lot of improvements, like been able to create databases with your games, edit games, insert comments, ICC interface?, support online playing, chessbase compatibility (.cbh), etc. The list could go on forever.

For the casual player that only wants to play a quick game, the program is great. For the serious tournament player that uses Fritz & Chessbase on PC, its bad.

I believe most users fall in the first group, and are quite happy with it.

I don't think most user like being beat every time. I'm not a great chess player, but I've been able to beat most people I've played (other so-so players) and have never beaten Mac Chess.

The Red Wolf

Oct 12, 2004, 12:27 PM

I don't think this is an Apple issue... I had the same problem with Entourage at work when running Jaguar, and when Panther added better support for large mailboxes, I dumped Entourage...

I agree that it isn't an Apple issue. It's Entourage. Made by M$, which doesn't support its own Exchange server software with the use of public folders. Not to mention there is no delegate setup at all. Not that Outlook is any good. Why am I talking about M$ crap software? Oh yes, it's not the OS.

The Red Wolf

Oct 12, 2004, 12:31 PM

Mac Chess Is Impossible

Gods, I thought it was just me.

jsw

Oct 12, 2004, 12:32 PM

I'd like to see Java 1.5 in 10.3.6 so that at least we can pretend that OS X isn't a second-tier Java development platform.On the other hand, it's nice that Macs all have Java pre-installed and automatically updated as part of the system software, so you can always assume Java is available on Macs running current OS X versions. Can't do that on Windows systems, and it's optional on Linux systems. Plus Eclipse (www.eclipse.org) is quite nice (and free) and runs as well on Macs as on Windows systems.

Yes, we might be a bit behind on releases, but not much (nothing like years past), and the latest version is on OS X before it's in common use on Windows anyway.

LEgregius

Oct 12, 2004, 12:37 PM

anyone thing new poerbooks with 10.3.6, the same day

It was common in old church hymns to abbrieviate over as o'er to make it one syllable. I'm not sure if you needed to remove a syllable from your powerbook for singing purposes or not, but oh well.

A powerbook update won't be very helpful until Freescale gets enough production going on the dual core G4's. I certainly hope apple uses the dual core ones and not just the single core ones at, say 1.7GHz. Not that the latter would be bad, especially since they are supposed to have a proper DDR controller, but I doubt that will happen by the time 10.3.6 comes out. They may, however, add support for them in 10.3.6 anticipating the release.

If they are dual core, I'll probably be getting one. Otherwise, probably not.

Windowlicker

Oct 12, 2004, 12:38 PM

Given the choice between checking my mail by IMAP using Entourage or by IMAP using Mail, I opted for Mail.

Agreed. But what I'm really waiting is Tiger's smart folders for Mail.. Those will kick ass.

What comes to this update, it seems rather big. Well, doesn't matter as long as we get a better working system. We'll see soon enough.

Windowlicker

Oct 12, 2004, 12:44 PM

Two questions:

- Is a clean install really a good thing? Ive heard that doing a lean install rather than just an update will keep OSX running smoothly. Or does it make a difference?

- In a clean install is a good idea, can anybody point me to som info on how it can be done. Do I need to back up all of my data or can you save it somewhere else on the HD to recover after the instal?

Thanks!

Charlie

This was exactly what I thought.. I never thought I could make a clean install with an update :P ..Unless I first Install 10.3.x as a clean install and then upgrade. And just in case no one answered your questions yet (which I highly doubt):

1. Updating the system from say 10.2 to 10.3 should work ok, but there might be some unexpected problems. the safest way is to do a clean install. With 10.x.x updates I don't see a need for a clean install.

2. I don't remember if you can do a 10.3.0 clean install over 10.3.5, but if that's possible, then you can back up your files (just in case) and then do a clean install that preserves your old account. This way you won't have much to configure after installing.

Sharewaredemon

Oct 12, 2004, 12:52 PM

I am a not particularly good chess club player, and I have drawn a few quick games (at lowest level). Last one last night as black. The computer will desperately draw by repetition once it smells defeat.

The chess program could use a lot of improvements, like been able to create databases with your games, edit games, insert comments, ICC interface?, support online playing, chessbase compatibility (.cbh), etc. The list could go on forever.

For the casual player that only wants to play a quick game, the program is great. For the serious tournament player that uses Fritz & Chessbase on PC, its bad.

I believe most users fall in the first group, and are quite happy with it.

I often joke to my friends that the only reason Gary Kasperitus (sp?) beat the computer at chess, was because it wasn't Mac Chess. Mac Chess would have schooled him.

Wonder Boy

Oct 12, 2004, 12:54 PM

yeah... i can see that the wont be much hype ;)

it might even slip by not noticed... we might be able to get the g6 in it before people notice??

or maybe not

maybe when it comes out people wont say
"what a great acheivement to fit that in there"

but will say?
"how long before the spead bump, idont want to buy a rev.a"

even if i was in the market for a g5 powerbook, i wouldn't get revision A. i've had some bad luck with rev A's and would be wary of one with such a important and desired machine.

chromos

Oct 12, 2004, 01:04 PM

Hope this fixes my Entourage crashes - the only programme that goes nuts on my PB 17"... have been running Activity Monitor to see what is going on - even when Ent is open but parked in the dock the damn thing is hogging CPU and memory like it owns the place..

Yes, as others have mentioned, this is an Entourage issue, but which has been corrected in Office 2004 (I'm assuming you're working with Office vX). It only happens when you're displaying HTML mail.

Now if they can fix Word's ridiculous cpu usage...

Sharewaredemon

Oct 12, 2004, 01:19 PM

Yes, as others have mentioned, this is an Entourage issue, but which has been corrected in Office 2004 (I'm assuming you're working with Office vX). It only happens when you're displaying HTML mail.

Now if they can fix Word's ridiculous cpu usage...

word uses up a lot of the CPU? I never noticed. What is a ridiculous amount?

Ari_0

Oct 12, 2004, 01:29 PM

Im hoping this update comes with the newly built (soon enough) PowerBook as standard. They are due any day now.

I'm sooo tired.... But I finally earned enough cash to buy one; just waiting for the new version. :o

shewy

Oct 12, 2004, 01:29 PM

wrldwzrd89

Oct 12, 2004, 01:40 PM

This was exactly what I thought.. I never thought I could make a clean install with an update :P ..Unless I first Install 10.3.x as a clean install and then upgrade. And just in case no one answered your questions yet (which I highly doubt):

1. Updating the system from say 10.2 to 10.3 should work ok, but there might be some unexpected problems. the safest way is to do a clean install. With 10.x.x updates I don't see a need for a clean install.

2. I don't remember if you can do a 10.3.0 clean install over 10.3.5, but if that's possible, then you can back up your files (just in case) and then do a clean install that preserves your old account. This way you won't have much to configure after installing.
Regarding Question #2, you can't actually install 10.X.Y-Z over 10.X.Y, but you can Archive and Install or Erase and Install 10.X.Y-Z over 10.X.Y (including using the preserve users and network settings option).

nmk

Oct 12, 2004, 02:00 PM

I agree with others on the Mac Chess issue. I remember having beaten it on two or three occasions on the default setting, but damn it was tough. The occasions on which I did win required massive overdoses of concentration, to the point that I felt like my head was about to explode. A vast majority of the time the computer will beat me silly.

tazznb

Oct 12, 2004, 02:01 PM

Seems like we a have some visitors that hate anything Apple, because no matter how positive the article they always post negative on the front page of the article. (Been happening for a few months now)
:cool:

skvngrx

Oct 12, 2004, 02:04 PM

1280x720 so I can use my DLP RPTV without a hack app!

kcmac

Oct 12, 2004, 02:13 PM

This was exactly what I thought.. I never thought I could make a clean install with an update :P ..Unless I first Install 10.3.x as a clean install and then upgrade. And just in case no one answered your questions yet (which I highly doubt):

1. Updating the system from say 10.2 to 10.3 should work ok, but there might be some unexpected problems. the safest way is to do a clean install. With 10.x.x updates I don't see a need for a clean install.

2. I don't remember if you can do a 10.3.0 clean install over 10.3.5, but if that's possible, then you can back up your files (just in case) and then do a clean install that preserves your old account. This way you won't have much to configure after installing.

I used to immediately download the update. Now I wait a few seconds for the combo updater on Apple's site. I never clean install for an updater and have had no issues that I can recall.

chromos

Oct 12, 2004, 02:46 PM

word uses up a lot of the CPU? I never noticed. What is a ridiculous amount?

Well, "ridiculous" is relative, but any app that chews up 10% cpu on a 1 GHz TiBook while doing *nothing* in the background, I consider ridiculous.

I hate apps that reduce my battery life for no good reason.

stcanard

Oct 12, 2004, 02:55 PM

word uses up a lot of the CPU? I never noticed. What is a ridiculous amount?

Word X for some reason is constantly repaginating, even if you aren't modifying the document.

If you have a single page document -- 0% CPU

Multiple pages start at 10% CPU constantly churning in the background.

With a large document / tables, I have seen Word in the background churn constantly at 30% CPU, spiking up to 50%. If I run Word, the fan on my powerbook will turn on guaranteed.

wrldwzrd89

Oct 12, 2004, 03:04 PM

Word X for some reason is constantly repaginating, even if you aren't modifying the document.

If you have a single page document -- 0% CPU

Multiple pages start at 10% CPU constantly churning in the background.

With a large document / tables, I have seen Word in the background churn constantly at 30% CPU, spiking up to 50%. If I run Word, the fan on my powerbook will turn on guaranteed.
That's why I don't use MS Word :) I find Apple's TextEdit perfectly adequate for all my word processing needs, and if I needed something better, I can choose just about anything because I don't care about compatibility with Office formats - I just make my document into a PDF (using Mac OS X save as PDF printing feature) if anyone else needs to read it.

Windowlicker

Oct 12, 2004, 03:41 PM

Regarding Question #2, you can't actually install 10.X.Y-Z over 10.X.Y, but you can Archive and Install or Erase and Install 10.X.Y-Z over 10.X.Y (including using the preserve users and network settings option).

ok thanks... that was actually what I had in mind. but that doesn't do the trick of having your account and stuff stay on the new system all ready to be used.

Sharewaredemon

Oct 12, 2004, 03:44 PM

wrldwzrd89

Oct 12, 2004, 03:57 PM

ok thanks... that was actually what I had in mind. but that doesn't do the trick of having your account and stuff stay on the new system all ready to be used.
If you do an Archive and Install with the "Preserve users and network settings" option checked, your user account will be preserved, but you'll need to reinstall all the software updates and your applications.

jayscheuerle

Oct 12, 2004, 03:57 PM

Glad to see we're getting at least one more update to Panther before Tiger is released and Panther is forgotten about...

I'll bet we get up to 10.3.9 before then... What's the latest guess? March? June? They may even need another decimal place...

CubaTBird

Oct 12, 2004, 03:59 PM

isn't the chess program in os x gnu chess made by the open source community? :confused:

ultrafiel

Oct 12, 2004, 04:06 PM

I never clean install for a minor update, but for any major system upgrades I will. It has always saved me headaches and will last until the next major upgrade. It takes most of a day to get everything how I want it, but it's worth it. I can't wait until Tiger.

Can anyone confirm if 10.3.6 will have native support for the Pioneer DVR-108? I only want to use Superdrives that Apple supports in the OS. 108s are so cheap now that I really wouldn't get a different one unless a new version comes out before my drive needs replacement.

~Shard~

Oct 12, 2004, 04:28 PM

I'll bet we get up to 10.3.9 before then... What's the latest guess? March? June? They may even need another decimal place...

Good point. Jobs did say Tiger would be ready in the "first half" of 2005 - that gives him until the end of June, technically, before he has to release it... ;)

johnnyjibbs

Oct 12, 2004, 04:36 PM

isn't the chess program in os x gnu chess made by the open source community? :confused:
Yes it's gnu chess with an Apple front end slapped on it. I doubt they'll do anything to change it - it got a nice facelift from Jaguar to Panther anyway - but I'm still part of the camp who says it's impossible to beat.. :D

paulypants

Oct 12, 2004, 04:57 PM

With the ati cards, the screen will ripple when scrolling. It's not overly bad, just annoying. I have read it is a driver issue.

Really? I've got a Rev B G5 and an ATI9600XT and I've never seen that?
Not that I'm complaining... ;)

swissmann

Oct 12, 2004, 05:42 PM

A clean install just to update? That's really extreme! :eek: I've run every update since 10.2.0 and 10.3.0 on the same computer without a reinstall or any major bugs. What I do, and what you need to do, is run disk permissions repair after an update or software installation. This will resolve any problems the update may have caused in most cases (unless Apple simply messed something up in the update coding). Don't have any other applications running when you run updates either - that too can cause problems with permissions and file structure. Of course, this advice comes from my experience with single and dual G4s - not the G5. :)

Extreme? I guess it is. However, let me clarify a bit. I don't install every update unless I am having problems. If everything seems to be working well I leave it alone went from 10.3.3 to 10.3.5). Still I am doing a clean install about every 4-6 months. My business is run off of my computers and being used all the time. I find that the 3 hours or so it takes to do it on my G5 is easily made up for in the next 4-6 months because of how well it runs. I look at it as changing oil in my car. This last time I tried an upgrade from 10.3.3 to 10.3.5 without a clean install and am having problems. May or may not be the upgrade.

ijimk

Oct 12, 2004, 05:44 PM

glad to see apple keepig up to date on their side I look foward to any updates they put out it only makes their stuff better than before. :)

Sharewaredemon

Oct 12, 2004, 05:53 PM

glad to see apple keepig up to date on their side I look foward to any updates they put out it only makes their stuff better than before. :)

I just want to beat Mac Chess, is that too much to ask?

The Mad Hatter

Oct 12, 2004, 05:58 PM

I'd just be happy if they added a "CE" clear entry button. Is that to much to ask? :rolleyes:

mvc

Oct 12, 2004, 06:00 PM

I just want to run PC software on my Mac, is that too much to ask? :p

Sharewaredemon

Oct 12, 2004, 06:08 PM

I just want to run PC software on my Mac, is that too much to ask? :p

I might go as far as to say yes,
maybe

but i think we are a bit off topic here, back to the mac chess discussion

:p

ddbean

Oct 12, 2004, 06:11 PM

That's why I don't use MS Word :) ... I can choose just about anything because I don't care about compatibility with Office formats - I just make my document into a PDF (using Mac OS X save as PDF printing feature) if anyone else needs to read it.

I've tried this and my 74 page .doc file got split up into 4 or 5 random sized pdf files. Is there something I need to adjust to force pdf file to stay as one file when using "Save as PDF" from the Print dialog? Is this function controlled by the amount of actual printer ram available even if I don't even go to printer?

wrldwzrd89

Oct 12, 2004, 06:15 PM

I've tried this and my 74 page .doc file got split up into 4 or 5 random sized pdf files. Is there something I need to adjust to force pdf file to stay as one file when using "Save as PDF" from the Print dialog? Is this function controlled by the amount of actual printer ram available even if I don't even go to printer?
That's an MS Word printing bug, completely unrelated to the PDF system in Mac OS X. Try sending the document to your printer (stop jobs if you don't want to waste paper) - does Word submit it as 4 or 5 separate jobs of random size? If it does, then it's DEFINITELY a Word bug. If it doesn't, it could just be intermittent - try it again and see what happens this time.

manu chao

Oct 12, 2004, 06:43 PM

I've tried this and my 74 page .doc file got split up into 4 or 5 random sized pdf files. Is there something I need to adjust to force pdf file to stay as one file when using "Save as PDF" from the Print dialog? Is this function controlled by the amount of actual printer ram available even if I don't even go to printer?

This could be due to changes in the paper size or paper orientation. As far as I know, changing the document orientation from portrait to landscape (or vice versa) between different pages within a document causes Word to split the PDF at these positions.

stcanard

Oct 12, 2004, 06:48 PM

Ok i've noticed 12 pecent before but it never occured to me that that was too much.

Well, IMO using any amount of CPU to do *nothing* is too much!

gekko513

Oct 12, 2004, 07:05 PM

I'd just be happy if they added a "CE" clear entry button. Is that to much to ask? :rolleyes:
Oooh ... is that what the CE stands for. On those manual calculators I usually end up pressing both Cs twice when I want to clear the result to make sure that there's no hidden result in there. I would prefer just the C, but then of course I really prefer the graphical calculators with a better "paper roll".

Warlock7

Oct 12, 2004, 07:12 PM

Then, maybe the manufacturers will start making the DL DVD-R discs already. :)

iswimbikeandrun

Oct 12, 2004, 08:03 PM

I've tried this and my 74 page .doc file got split up into 4 or 5 random sized pdf files. Is there something I need to adjust to force pdf file to stay as one file when using "Save as PDF" from the Print dialog? Is this function controlled by the amount of actual printer ram available even if I don't even go to printer?
Use LaTeX, there is an excellent and easy to use program for MacOS X called TeXSHOP. You can get the base files by searching for teTeX or installing fink and fink commander. LaTeX can typeset anything, books, articles, etc...

BWhaler

Oct 12, 2004, 08:34 PM

Really? I've got a Rev B G5 and an ATI9600XT and I've never seen that?
Not that I'm complaining... ;)

I think the magic combination is D2.5, 23", and ATI card. It's really not that annoying, but when you drop 6 grand, you want perfection. Luckily, it is just a drvier issue.

nek

Oct 12, 2004, 08:46 PM

As far as the Calculator update goes, I remember reading an article about how it is actually not very accurate for even some intermediate math.
Ah... here it is:
http://www.mikeindustries.com/blog/archive/2004/08/apple-calculator

It was written in August, so it's nice to see Apple turning it around this quickly with a fix, if that is indeed what they are doing.

Lee Tom

I had noticed some weird results with the Calculator a while ago. I just tested it again and the problem is obvious if you try the following:

4096.1007 - 0.1
= 4096.0007

4096.1006 - 0.1
= 4096.000599999999

You will also notice that the zeros typed after the decimal point don't show up when you type them until you type a non-zero digit.
4096.100 will stay as 4096.1 until you type the 7 for 4096.1007

aswitcher

Oct 12, 2004, 08:58 PM

It would be nice to see some Tiger features provided if they are ready now in a big update...

AidenShaw

Oct 12, 2004, 09:11 PM

Then, maybe the manufacturers will start making the DL DVD-R discs already. :)

Three packs of Verbatim DL are now available here ($34.99 at Best Buy, EPA and $39.99 at Fry's Sunnyvale).

High priced now, but if you have an 8 GB ISO file to burn you don't have a choice....

The price will drop. Do you remember when $5 was a good price for a DVD-R? Do you remember when $5 was a good price for a CD-R?

reorx

Oct 12, 2004, 09:17 PM

I'd like to see Java 1.5 in 10.3.6 so that at least we can pretend that OS X isn't a second-tier Java development platform.

Lord, not the Java 1.5 crud again... I think we beat this topic to death in another thread. Hell if J2EE is the best we can do for a software development platform, we're all in trouble.

gekko513

Oct 12, 2004, 09:47 PM

Lord, not the Java 1.5 crud again... I think we beat this topic to death in another thread. Hell if J2EE is the best we can do for a software development platform, we're all in trouble.
What's wrong with J2EE?? I thought it was one of the two biggest development platforms in the enterprise segment. The other biggie is controlled by Microsoft (.net).

Even if other smaller platforms have their supporters and strength, being a first class java supporting platform sure can't hurt Mac OSX.

7on

Oct 12, 2004, 10:05 PM

There are some major bugs in 10.3.5 - like the Safari cookie bug and the NFS bugs I already mentioned, and the Firewire bug mentioned by Gopher (I haven't personally encountered that one).

Also, performance of sharing in general seems to have deteriorated significantly since 10.3. We have several PowerBooks at my company, and they all used to rediscover AFP shares when woken from sleep, even when moved to a different network, connected via the AFP share via VPN. Since 10.3.2, this has not worked so well - the connection just times out. Shame - hope they can resolve it.

Also, the log in screen - when connected to a network with a Mac OS X server with Open Directory, the "Other" login option takes some time to appear. If you have already selected an account from the list and have started to type in your password, the window goes funny and it takes you back to the list again. Very annoying!

I could go on and on - Apple has plenty of work to do!

Yes, and some of my aliases in column view takes one click to open and others take 2. These are aliases to network drives.

Some_Big_Spoon

Oct 12, 2004, 11:52 PM

Probably been said before, but the bug where my PB goes to sleep with no warning on a supposedly ok battery charge. See Macfixit for details.

orb

Oct 13, 2004, 12:39 AM

Lord, not the Java 1.5 crud again... I think we beat this topic to death in another thread. Hell if J2EE is the best we can do for a software development platform, we're all in trouble.

Trust me when I say that Java developers are moving to OS X in large numbers. When they wake up and realize that it OS X isn't really a viable platform for Java development, it'll be quite a blow.

reorx

Oct 13, 2004, 01:42 AM

Trust me when I say that Java developers are moving to OS X in large numbers. When they wake up and realize that it OS X isn't really a viable platform for Java development, it'll be quite a blow.

Like I mentioned: In the previous thread about the Java Update 2 we discussed the 1.4.x vs 1.5.x issue. No one in their right mind is "betting the farm" on 1.5 in the enterprise now. Its too new and unproven. Most of the "Java server container" vendors in the industry are just getting 1.4.x pushed.

And don't tell me that 1.5 has some kind of "must-have" feature that all Java developers absolutely can't live without -- and thus won't use Apple hardware and development tools. The JVM version, minus serious bugfix releases, is just not that important to a stable, mature codebase...

JFreak

Oct 13, 2004, 02:51 AM

1280x720 so I can use my DLP RPTV without a hack app!

i agree. i sent feedback to apple and if you do too, we double our chances of getting the support for it :D

orb

Oct 13, 2004, 08:34 AM

Like I mentioned: In the previous thread about the Java Update 2 we discussed the 1.4.x vs 1.5.x issue. No one in their right mind is "betting the farm" on 1.5 in the enterprise now. Its too new and unproven. Most of the "Java server container" vendors in the industry are just getting 1.4.x pushed.

And don't tell me that 1.5 has some kind of "must-have" feature that all Java developers absolutely can't live without -- and thus won't use Apple hardware and development tools. The JVM version, minus serious bugfix releases, is just not that important to a stable, mature codebase...

You aren't entirely wrong. 50% wrong, 50% misguided. :) First, "enterprise" development is only one small aspect of the whole thing. It happens to be what I do, so I can speak to it. But those Java developers out there are doing much, much more.

Of, the facts on Java 1.5 in the enterprise. Were you aware that EJB 3 (can't get anymore "enterprise" than that) requires Java 1.5? We just released our EJB 3 preview release at JBoss (you know, the app server that Apple ships) for people to play with. We aren't telling people to "bet the farm" on it today, but we are telling people to go play with it. Test it out. Learn it. Be ready for it. EJB 3 will change the face of "enterprise" Java in a major way. If you are a Java developer and don't have access to Java1.5 (that the rest of the world has for 6-8 months in the form of pre-releases) then you are crazy. Now is the time to learn the stuff. Java 1.5 is an extreme case because of the huge changes in the system. And EJB 3 is an even more extreme case. The need for Java 1.5 is larger than for any other Java update.

It was very distressing that Java developers using OS X couldn't get their hands on 1.5 previews 6 months ago with the rest of the world. The fact that it is out NOW and we still can't use it is unacceptable.

flexoffset

Oct 13, 2004, 12:04 PM

With the ati cards, the screen will ripple when scrolling. It's not overly bad, just annoying. I have read it is a driver issue.

I have also read a thread at the Apple site some time ago where Apple says that ripple is entirely in spec. :confused:
I trust they're gonna be smart enough to go ahead and address the issue even if they don't see it as a big deal.

I have an ATI 9600 card on my Dual 2.5 G5 and it doesn't ripple so I dodged that bullet.

wrldwzrd89

Oct 13, 2004, 01:08 PM

You aren't entirely wrong. 50% wrong, 50% misguided. :) First, "enterprise" development is only one small aspect of the whole thing. It happens to be what I do, so I can speak to it. But those Java developers out there are doing much, much more.

Of, the facts on Java 1.5 in the enterprise. Were you aware that EJB 3 (can't get anymore "enterprise" than that) requires Java 1.5? We just released our EJB 3 preview release at JBoss (you know, the app server that Apple ships) for people to play with. We aren't telling people to "bet the farm" on it today, but we are telling people to go play with it. Test it out. Learn it. Be ready for it. EJB 3 will change the face of "enterprise" Java in a major way. If you are a Java developer and don't have access to Java1.5 (that the rest of the world has for 6-8 months in the form of pre-releases) then you are crazy. Now is the time to learn the stuff. Java 1.5 is an extreme case because of the huge changes in the system. And EJB 3 is an even more extreme case. The need for Java 1.5 is larger than for any other Java update.

It was very distressing that Java developers using OS X couldn't get their hands on 1.5 previews 6 months ago with the rest of the world. The fact that it is out NOW and we still can't use it is unacceptable.
I hate to fan the flames of a hot topic, but...

Some of the factors governing Java releases for Apple Macintoshes are outside Apple's control. The biggest factor is that Apple does the development of the Macintosh version, not Sun. Therefore, a delay between when Sun gives the necessary code to Apple and when that code is proven to work under Mac OS X is inevitable. You must also factor in the fact that Sun probably releases updates to Apple (and all other porters) in batches to save money; although less expense is involved for both Apple and Sun, the delay between Sun's releases and Apple's releases gets even longer because of it.

orb

Oct 13, 2004, 02:09 PM

The biggest factor is that Apple does the development of the Macintosh version, not Sun.

Exactly. I think we all understand WHY it is like that. The problem is that it makes OS X a second-tier platform for Java developers who use OS X. Is that acceptable for Apple? Maybe. Most Java developers don't develop for OS X, they develop on it. Being a capable java dev platform sells tons of powerbooks. Is that important in the overall scheme of things? I dunno.

If I were apple wanted to make Apple a premier platform for Java developers, they would increase ties with Sun to make sure that the OS X version of the JVM didn't lag so far behind.

gopher

Oct 13, 2004, 02:12 PM

It isn't always a question of Apple's lagging behind. They use a fairly recent version of Java. The problem is that Microsoft has taken Java code and corrupted it a bit with some of its own. Web developers not realizing this test the Java on their own machine and think it is good to go. It isn't. Web developers should read over http://www.anybrowser.org/ if they want to make sure their webpages are platform neutral.

reorx

Oct 13, 2004, 09:24 PM

You aren't entirely wrong. 50% wrong, 50% misguided. :) First, "enterprise" development is only one small aspect of the whole thing. It happens to be what I do, so I can speak to it. But those Java developers out there are doing much, much more.

Hmm. Enterprise Java is what I do, and until the *major* EJB containers ship and prove reliable, a move to 1.5 JVMs is not going to happen quickly. Most organizations cannot afford to throw away their investments in their Java apps year after year, chasing the latest Sun spec. Its expensive in terms of time and cost - especially re-certifying.

Plus, I don't think the current class of XServe and Wintel rack-mounts are big enough. IBM and Sun big UNIX clusters are the preferred deploy platforms because they provide near-mainframe reliability and support.

Having the 1.5 spec JDK right now is just not necessary. Unless you're a spec-chaser, in which case the Sun and Windows platforms would be your preferred development platform... :D

reorx

Oct 13, 2004, 09:33 PM

Exactly. I think we all understand WHY it is like that. The problem is that it makes OS X a second-tier platform for Java developers who use OS X. Is that acceptable for Apple? Maybe. Most Java developers don't develop for OS X, they develop on it. Being a capable java dev platform sells tons of powerbooks. Is that important in the overall scheme of things? I dunno.

If I were apple wanted to make Apple a premier platform for Java developers, they would increase ties with Sun to make sure that the OS X version of the JVM didn't lag so far behind.

The problem with increased ties to Sun is Microsoft... They just settled their score with satan (aka Bill G) and are if Apple threatened their lucrative mid/low priced server market with an aweseome end-to-end Java platform, it'd cut them completely out of profitability. I think that Steve is happy with being a "2nd tier" platform. I just don't see a lot of off-the-shelf Java apps driving sales of our platform.

I just like developing on a really awesome UNIX based platform. Too bad we don't support Apple where I work... I'd love to have a dual G5 as my dev box. :cool:

orb

Oct 13, 2004, 10:19 PM

Hmm. Enterprise Java is what I do, and until the *major* EJB containers ship and prove reliable, a move to 1.5 JVMs is not going to happen quickly. Most organizations cannot afford to throw away their investments in their Java apps year after year, chasing the latest Sun spec. Its expensive in terms of time and cost - especially re-certifying.

Enterprise Java is what I do. I happen to work for a company the creates one the the *major* EJB containers. We have customers who are in production on 1.5 today. I don't recommend it, but it's the truth. We have even more customers who are developing on 1.5 with an eye on deploying on it in the future. That's more reasonable. What's even more reasonable is the need to be able to prototype and get experience on Java 1.5 with an eye towards the future. You have to learn the technology first, and to do that you need access to the technology.

I'm not sure why you keep going back to enterprise Java, though. J2EE is only one segment of Java developers. I'm glad you chose it, since it's one I'm intimately familiar with. But just keep in mind that the needs of Java development community for Java 1.5 go well beyond J2EE.

Plus, I don't think the current class of XServe and Wintel rack-mounts are big enough. IBM and Sun big UNIX clusters are the preferred deploy platforms because they provide near-mainframe reliability and support.

Nobody deploys J2EE on OS X. Really. Yeah, you'll find an adventurous soul here or there, but you can dismiss them as statistical anomalies. However, lot's and lots of people DEVELOP J2EE applications on OS X, and that's the important crowd. If you have any eye to the future, having access to Java 1.5 for prototyping and developing future applications is critical.

Despite this it seems we both agree that OS X is a second-tier Java platform, which was all I was trying to say. If we're lucky Apple will provide 1.5 before 10.4 comes out (or deliver 10.4 soon) so that the practical effects of being a second-tier platform aren't as devastating.

edenwaith

Oct 14, 2004, 01:02 AM

~Shard~

Oct 14, 2004, 01:13 AM

Updated calculator, huh? I'm curious if this ends up being a graphing calculator, or just some minor bug fix. Calculator 3.1 has some interesting plug-ins...nothing which seems very flushed out, but there are the possibilities.

Maybe it will be a magical calculator that allows you to input the date you ordered a new G5 PowerMac and the output will be the actual date by which you'll receive it! The Apple Store would be wise to implement such a calculator, for the sake of its customers, especially the ones who have been waiting for months already and have had their shipping dates changed multiple times!

relimw

Oct 14, 2004, 01:45 AM

Maybe it will be a magical calculator that allows you to input the date you ordered a new G5 PowerMac and the output will be the actual date by which you'll receive it! The Apple Store would be wise to implement such a calculator, for the sake of its customers, especially the ones who have been waiting for months already and have had their shipping dates changed multiple times!

That's just plain silly Shard, didn't you see klaus finally got his? ;)

By klaus' experience, just tell everbody to wait 4 months before you start calling :(

Ah well, I expect 10.3.6 to be out soon, since it's been seeded to developers again for a few days now. Prolly be out next Thursday. (New music on Tuesdays, new updates on Thursdays :D)

G4-power

Oct 14, 2004, 08:38 AM

Ah well, I expect 10.3.6 to be out soon, since it's been seeded to developers again for a few days now. Prolly be out next Thursday. (New music on Tuesdays, new updates on Thursdays :D)

IIRC, before there was "New Music on Tuesdays" most Apple updates, upgrades and stuff came on Tuesdays.

johnnyjibbs

Oct 14, 2004, 08:45 AM

IIRC, before there was "New Music on Tuesdays" most Apple updates, upgrades and stuff came on Tuesdays.
Apple updates are always on Tuesdays... except when they're on Mondays or Wednesdays.. :p

Warlock7

Oct 15, 2004, 08:33 AM

Three packs of Verbatim DL are now available here ($34.99 at Best Buy, EPA and $39.99 at Fry's Sunnyvale).

High priced now, but if you have an 8 GB ISO file to burn you don't have a choice....

The price will drop. Do you remember when $5 was a good price for a DVD-R? Do you remember when $5 was a good price for a CD-R?

Hey Aiden, nice to see you.

I could only find this (www.bestbuy.com/site/olspage.jsp?id=1089889722897&skuId=6778631&productCategoryId=cat01163&type=product) Verbatim three pack of DL media at the BB site.
You can get this same media for less from Sony, here (http://www.sonystyle.com/is-bin/INTERSHOP.enfinity/eCS/Store/en/-/USD/SY_DisplayProductInformation-Start?ProductSKU=DL94912), with free shipping.:) They're only $9.99 per disc and they're being sold a single disc at a time.

I want to see the "-R" media get released already, not the "+R" media.

I also want to see Apple begin to support the DL media in their apps too. The only way I can burn to any DL media at the moment is by using Toast... :(

I doubt that we'll actually see any of this until Tiger gets released though.

TrenchcoatJedi

Oct 15, 2004, 12:41 PM

They really should get Safari RSS out already. Firefox just added that functionality in their latest revision.

Noiseboy

Oct 15, 2004, 01:17 PM

Having just received the splendid Nokia 7610, my only desire for the 10.3.6 update is that it adds support for it in iSync. That would be a major change to the way iSync works but would open far more phones up to be able to work with the app. If it doesn't include the change I will probably not install the update, Digidesign have not qualified 10.3.5 for use with ProTools LE on a G4 yet, maybe Tiger will be out before they can qualify 10.3.6 :p

Warlock7

Oct 15, 2004, 06:13 PM