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After two months with Lion, thoughts on my return to Snow Leopard

S

seetheforest

macrumors regular
Original poster
Dec 24, 2010
104
12
After seeing so many threads filled with endless justification on one side and pure vitriol on the other, I wanted to give my thoughts.

First, what I am missing from Lion now that I am back to Snow Leopard:
  • iCal: In the run up to Lion's release I was so skeptical of iCal, but now I can see that from a UI standpoint Lion's iCal is leagues ahead of SL. I never thought I would say it, but I miss the faux leather.
  • Mail: One of the headline app changes in Lion and for good reason. However, since it still doesn't not play nicely (seamlessly) with Gmail I do not miss it too much.
  • Quicklook: Lion has perfected Quicklook. Resizable windows on the fly. Stays open in the background. Button to open in App. It's... perfect.
  • More refined Finder: I'll miss having the actual "Kind" categories displayed in Column View for sure. It's a small, but useful feature in Lion.

And now, here are the things that drove me away from Lion:
  • Unstable OS: It was this in a nutshell. When I wake from sleep and have to perform gymnastics to get my wireless connection back (even when the network diagnostics says everything is good), then there is a problem. Last week it went past the tipping point when my screen would regularly not wake from sleep for a few minutes.
  • System Performance, Memory Leaks: Chalk it up to whatever metric you can cite, Snow Leopard is just a faster, more stable OS. Coming back and using it after two months of Lion makes this incredibly apparent.
  • Incomplete implementation of new features: The gestures in Lion are just flawed. There are bonafied conflicts when you play with the scrolling directions and the forward and back gestures. The same can be said with full-screen app implementation.

All in all, I'm happy that I can return to a stable Snow Leopard OS. I just hope Lion can mature nicely in the next few months so I can come back to it, because some of the features are really compelling.
 
In my opinion, SL is not all that great compared to Lion. Those that have problems with Lion should not own a computer. There, that will stir the pot. :p
 
Last edited:
darster said:
In my opinion, SL is not all that great compared to Lion. Those that have problems with Lion should not own a computer. There, that will stir the pot. :p
Click to expand...

LOL! Lion is my first experience with a Mac, and it came installed, so I have nothing to compare it to, nor did I suffer any upgrade pains. All I can tell you is I have none of the OP's problems and Lion is perfect.

So there's your solution! Buy a new Mac! It's a conspiracy I tell you! :apple:
 
How many of these do we need? Half the forum is people whining about the Lion and the other half posting their own personal reasons why it doesn't cut it above Snow Leopard.

Good for you. Run Snow Leopard. What do you want from us? A cookie? :rolleyes:
 
People do care. They want to know they are not alone and that hopefully with the number of people complaining out there Apple with fix the mess they created.

Lion is a Joke. Its all gimmicks and trying to appease to the Ipad users so they will buy a mac. But... they are trying to sell it to us saying we are in a "post pc" world. So why try to get them to like the Mac if its time has come? Its because even Jobs knows that BS. Tell me one company that has replaced their computers with Tablets for real work... there aren't any.

They should have let the people who wanted an ipad, or that an ipad does everything they need be happy with just their Ipad, and made their Desktop OS more powerful to people who want a REAL computer.

They created a new market and now they are trying to cram it together with an old one? doesn't make any sense... neither does much about Lion.
 
iStudentUK said:
So after seeing so many annoying threads on the subject the solution was to... er... post another one?
Click to expand...

Apple isn't going to get the hint if only one thread exists. They need to be nagged consistently if you expect them to do things right.

ps. I upgraded back to Snow Leopard. Lion is pretty craptacular. Mission Control kills my productivity.
 
You guys are serious? You think they're going to have a media event next week and announce they are axing Lion in favour of bringing Snow Leopard back? Credit everyone their $29.99 and mail them all USB sticks with SL?

You don't think the same whining and complaining happened when Snow Leopard came out? People cursing it and saying they'll never update? What about when Leopard came out? People fired up over the loss of carbon?

Yeah, this is totally new. No one ever complained about a major update before. Come on guys, get your head out of the sand. All you're doing is commiserating and it's really getting old. I wish mods would merge all the whining threads into one big abomination and ban any new ones from starting.

Love it, hate it, can we just move on to learning about it and disseminating that knowledge? Or is this the wrong crowd for that...
 
Lokheed said:
You guys are serious? You think they're going to have a media event next week and announce they are axing Lion in favour of bringing Snow Leopard back? Credit everyone their $29.99 and mail them all USB sticks with SL?
Click to expand...

Nobody wants Lion to be scrapped. We want it to be IMPROVED.
You don't think the same whining and complaining happened when Snow Leopard came out? People cursing it and saying they'll never update? What about when Leopard came out? People fired up over the loss of carbon?
Click to expand...

One of those complaints when SL came out was that shortcut folders in the dock elminated alphabetical list view. Apple heard all the complaints and added back the option.

Are you against choice?

I wish mods would merge all the whining threads into one big abomination and ban any new ones from starting.
Click to expand...

Yeah, thats a great way for apple to notice how many people are having issues with Lion.... :rolleyes:
 
Lokheed said:
You don't think the same whining and complaining happened when Snow Leopard came out? People cursing it and saying they'll never update? What about when Leopard came out? People fired up over the loss of carbon?

Yeah, this is totally new. No one ever complained about a major update before. Come on guys, get your head out of the sand. All you're doing is commiserating and it's really getting old. I wish mods would merge all the whining threads into one big abomination and ban any new ones from starting.

Love it, hate it, can we just move on to learning about it and disseminating that knowledge? Or is this the wrong crowd for that...
Click to expand...

I upgraded from every version of Mac os x from 10.2. Sure each os had an issue that just wasn't quite right, or a weird bug that a lot of people were affected by, but it was NOTHING even remotely like this. In fact there isn't much in Lion that people aren't complaining about.

I never downgraded before after an upgrade. If there was something different I adjusted or changed settings. This isn't just different, it's worse, and the least stable OS "upgrade" I have ever done.
 
I have no problem with constructive criticism. If someone said, "I think iCal would work better if it had x, y, and z because of x, y, and z, then even I didn't see it, at least it would give Apple something to work with, and I would give them props for not just complaining.

Whining about performance or instability, or saying that the gestures are just "all messed up" doesn't tell 'em squat. It's not me that's hindering change, it's you guys.

Apple listens. They have historically demonstrated that. They are extremely consumer-centric, no question about that. But what are they supposed to do with a bunch of whining? Okay people aren't happy about Mission Control, they don't like x, y, and z... why? Because it's different, or because it's flawed in some sense. There's a difference between not liking something because it's a radical departure (Lion certainly is) or because it's broken or inherently flawed. Big difference.

So if you want to drive change, what's telling Apple that you're going to go back to SL because Lion sucks going to drive? Seriously...
 
Lokheed said:
I have no problem with constructive criticism. If someone said, "I think iCal would work better if it had x, y, and z because of x, y, and z, then even I didn't see it, at least it would give Apple something to work with, and I would give them props for not just complaining.

Whining about performance or instability, or saying that the gestures are just "all messed up" doesn't tell 'em squat. It's not me that's hindering change, it's you guys.

Apple listens. They have historically demonstrated that. They are extremely consumer-centric, no question about that. But what are they supposed to do with a bunch of whining? Okay people aren't happy about Mission Control, they don't like x, y, and z... why? Because it's different, or because it's flawed in some sense. There's a difference between not liking something because it's a radical departure (Lion certainly is) or because it's broken or inherently flawed. Big difference.

So if you want to drive change, what's telling Apple that you're going to go back to SL because Lion sucks going to drive? Seriously...
Click to expand...

If you actually read the first post, you would see that he outlined exactly what he didn't like. So, by "whining", as you put it, he did tell Apple exactly what he thought was wrong.

I have to agree with the OP. Lion blows right now and needs a major patch to get it right. I am tired of the kernel panics and other various issues caused by this quick release. People complaining does help and it lets them see that more than just one person are having the same problem.

Lastly, if you don't like it then don't post in the thread. Just unsubscribe and let us discuss it. I'm tired of hearing you whine about whining. :rolleyes:
 
http://www.apple.com/feedback

And if you try to phrase your issues like an adult, instead of a whiny teenager, I'd think you'd stand a better chance of Apple paying attention to your complaints than by starting umpteen bitchy threads on a rumour site's forum.

.tsooJ
 
seetheforest said:
And now, here are the things that drove me away from Lion:
  • Unstable OS: It was this in a nutshell. When I wake from sleep and have to perform gymnastics to get my wireless connection back (even when the network diagnostics says everything is good), then there is a problem. Last week it went past the tipping point when my screen would regularly not wake from sleep for a few minutes.
  • System Performance, Memory Leaks: Chalk it up to whatever metric you can cite, Snow Leopard is just a faster, more stable OS. Coming back and using it after two months of Lion makes this incredibly apparent.
  • Incomplete implementation of new features: The gestures in Lion are just flawed. There are bonafied conflicts when you play with the scrolling directions and the forward and back gestures. The same can be said with full-screen app implementation.
Click to expand...
How did you install Lion and how much ram do you have. I'm running my MBP with 8gb of ram and did a clean install. I have to say that Lion is as stable on the MBP (with 8 gb) then SL was. I also found that I have little to no issues with memory and performance thanks to the 8gb. I'm not saying there isn't any issues, but there's enough ram to absorb the issues.

I don't use gestures so I won't comment, I like my mouse and and keyboard. I hate using a trackpad.
 
gyorpb said:
Interpretive reading not your greatest skill, is it?

.tsooJ
Click to expand...

No, it is, but you could have also accomplished the same thing without your whining. For as many whiny threads about Lion there are whiners about the Lion threads. It is a conundrum...
 
maflynn said:
How did you install Lion and how much ram do you have. I'm running my MBP with 8gb of ram and did a clean install. I have to say that Lion is as stable on the MBP (with 8 gb) then SL was. I also found that I have little to no issues with memory and performance thanks to the 8gb. I'm not saying there isn't any issues, but there's enough ram to absorb the issues.

I don't use gestures so I won't comment, I like my mouse and and keyboard. I hate using a trackpad.
Click to expand...

I have a 2011 15'' 2 Ghz quad i7 with 8GB RAM. I had Safari+Safari web content sucking up over 2GB RAM in fairly heavy use.

My issue with the gestures is this: if you implement natural scrolling and are on Safari two fingers to the right will take you back a page while three fingers to the right will take you forward a page. Seriously just adding one finger to the gesture completely reverses it's function. It's maddening for me.
 
B737 said:
lion sucks
Click to expand...

+1

The OP just wanted to state their opinion and experiences, which is why this forum exists. They did in a calm, coherent and thoughtful way. Unsubscribe or don't open them message if you don't like the topic.
 
wpotere said:
If you actually read the first post, you would see that he outlined exactly what he didn't like. So, by "whining", as you put it, he did tell Apple exactly what he thought was wrong.

I have to agree with the OP. Lion blows right now and needs a major patch to get it right. I am tired of the kernel panics and other various issues caused by this quick release. People complaining does help and it lets them see that more than just one person are having the same problem.
Click to expand...

Where?

  • Unstable OS: It was this in a nutshell. When I wake from sleep and have to perform gymnastics to get my wireless connection back (even when the network diagnostics says everything is good), then there is a problem. Last week it went past the tipping point when my screen would regularly not wake from sleep for a few minutes.
  • System Performance, Memory Leaks: Chalk it up to whatever metric you can cite, Snow Leopard is just a faster, more stable OS. Coming back and using it after two months of Lion makes this incredibly apparent.
  • Incomplete implementation of new features: The gestures in Lion are just flawed. There are bonafied conflicts when you play with the scrolling directions and the forward and back gestures. The same can be said with full-screen app implementation.

1. Unstable OS. What does Apple have to go on there? What specific problems made it unstable. Screen would regularly not wake and wifi issues... that's all I got. Okay.

2. SL is faster and more stable. Okay. Apple has a ton of data there. I'm looking for data, but, hey, there's none there. I guess we just go by feelings and placebos.

3. They don't like full screen and whine about scrolling direction, the latter of which, sure, they can file a bug.

If that's your interpretation of precision problem reporting, then you set a low bar.

I'm tired of hearing you whine about whining.
Click to expand...

Then stop posting whiny posts about Lion. Then you won't have to hear us whining about your whining. Seems pretty simply to me! :p #fail of an argument.
 
Lokheed said:
Where?

  • Unstable OS: It was this in a nutshell. When I wake from sleep and have to perform gymnastics to get my wireless connection back (even when the network diagnostics says everything is good), then there is a problem. Last week it went past the tipping point when my screen would regularly not wake from sleep for a few minutes.
  • System Performance, Memory Leaks: Chalk it up to whatever metric you can cite, Snow Leopard is just a faster, more stable OS. Coming back and using it after two months of Lion makes this incredibly apparent.
  • Incomplete implementation of new features: The gestures in Lion are just flawed. There are bonafied conflicts when you play with the scrolling directions and the forward and back gestures. The same can be said with full-screen app implementation.

1. Unstable OS. What does Apple have to go on there? What specific problems made it unstable. Screen would regularly not wake and wifi issues... that's all I got. Okay.

2. SL is faster and more stable. Okay. Apple has a ton of data there. I'm looking for data, but, hey, there's none there. I guess we just go by feelings and placebos.

3. They don't like full screen and whine about scrolling direction, the latter of which, sure, they can file a bug.

If that's your interpretation of precision problem reporting, then you set a low bar.



Then stop posting whiny posts about Lion. Then you won't have to hear us whining about your whining. Seems pretty simply to me! :p #fail of an argument.
Click to expand...


Clearly you can't read...

Unstable OS was only part of it. WiFi that does not come back on after sleep. Hmm, that sounds like some information. Also, every time mine crashes I send the report to Apple so there is more info for them.

Memory leaks - A lot of us have been complaining about the massive amount of memory the kernel is using and not letting go, especially on my 4 Gig machine. In fact, my machine has crashed a few times due to the lack of memory available, it didn't even go to swap and run slow, it just tanked.

The gestures are also being complained about as being difficult to understand. This could be considered a simple customer complaint. I don't have them so I don't care but that doesn't mean that it isn't a valid complaint.

So, could you glean some useful information from this? Sure and the rest of the "whining" posts on the forum about Lion. It has issues for people. If you don't have problems then great, good for you but don't put down the ones that do. I for one am fed up with Lion and have decided to simply run Windows 7 via Bootcamp on my Mac until Apple can fix things. My hopes is that they will get it fixed soon.
 
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