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jb1280

macrumors 6502a
Jan 13, 2009
869
255
difference is unlike Apple, Amazon never acted like oh it can do it nor started it.
Apple changed the rules and no ifs and or buts about it. If apps like Kindle and others did not work on iOS sells would be a lot lower.
Apple is showing its true greedy colors here.

Your argument fails when that little fact is pointed out. Did Amazon ever pretend that the kindle would read other books, Nope. Did Amazon ever even allow it, Nope.

Apple Allowed it then Apple gets it own services started and pretty much strong arming everyone else out. They make MS tactics of the pass look nice. Apple is behaving by far worse than MS ever did at its worse.

You are merely setting up a straw man that Apple is indeed strong-arming actors off of their platform. The fact that Amazon decided to update their app and continue to support iOS demonstrably proves that they have not strong-armed Amazon off of the platform.

The fact that I just spent $150 via amazon.com on my iPad for reading content on my iPad proves that it is possible for the two companies to reach an amicable settlement in this issues.

Just as Amazon may or may not decide to become a platform, Apple has the right to change the manner in which they conduct business. Developers are then faced with the question of whether or not they want to continue developing for iOS. Amazon has clearly decided to stick with the platform.

Only those that are ideologically opposed to iOS are raising a fuss over this issue.

We can discuss a counterfactual where Amazon pulls Kindle from iOS, but its a moot point since it has not happened.
 

greytmom

macrumors 68040
Jun 23, 2010
3,566
1,002
difference is unlike Apple, Amazon never acted like oh it can do it nor started it.
Apple changed the rules and no ifs and or buts about it. If apps like Kindle and others did not work on iOS sells would be a lot lower.
Apple is showing its true greedy colors here.

Your argument fails when that little fact is pointed out. Did Amazon ever pretend that the kindle would read other books, Nope. Did Amazon ever even allow it, Nope.

Apple Allowed it then Apple gets it own services started and pretty much strong arming everyone else out. They make MS tactics of the pass look nice. Apple is behaving by far worse than MS ever did at its worse.

Actually, they didn't "change" the rules. They started enforcing the rules.

Your vehement argument that Apple is a big bully is cracking me up. It's business, kiddo. Amazon isn't sitting in the playground nursing a black eye. They couldn't work out terms that both sides were happy with, so they went with option B, which is to make people do what they've BEEN DOING ALL ALONG - purchase via browser. I repeat... you have NEVER been able to purchase books in-app with the Kindle app.
 

rjohnstone

macrumors 68040
Dec 28, 2007
3,896
4,493
PHX, AZ.
When Amazon releases their tablet should they be compelled to allow Nook on their platform?

Do you think it's likely that Amazon would permit that to occur?
Why should they?
Amazon is not trying to be all things to everyone like Apple is and there is no legal precedence that would compel Amazon to do so.

Apple didn't have to open it's app store to other developers, they CHOSE to do so.
Amazon can choose not to.
 

Rodimus Prime

macrumors G4
Oct 9, 2006
10,136
4
You are merely setting up a straw man that Apple is indeed strong-arming actors off of their platform. The fact that Amazon decided to update their app and continue to support iOS demonstrably proves that they have not strong-armed Amazon off of the platform.

The fact that I just spent $150 via amazon.com on my iPad for reading content on my iPad proves that it is possible for the two companies to reach an amicable settlement in this issues.

Just as Amazon may or may not decide to become a platform, Apple has the right to change the manner in which they conduct business. Developers are then faced with the question of whether or not they want to continue developing for iOS. Amazon has clearly decided to stick with the platform.

Only those that are ideologically opposed to iOS are raising a fuss over this issue.

We can discuss a counterfactual where Amazon pulls Kindle from iOS, but its a moot point since it has not happened.


Apple strong armed Amazon to eat less money because now it is harder for people go buy new books instead of being cut off of iOS.
Amazon should of stood its ground and forced Apple to do something. These is pretty insane by Apple.
 

KnightWRX

macrumors Pentium
Jan 28, 2009
15,046
4
Quebec, Canada
You are merely setting up a straw man that Apple is indeed strong-arming actors off of their platform. The fact that Amazon decided to update their app and continue to support iOS demonstrably proves that they have not strong-armed Amazon off of the platform.

We can discuss a counterfactual where Amazon pulls Kindle from iOS, but its a moot point since it has not happened.

So you'd want to wait for developers to actually pull out before we start questionning Apple's policies ? Because as it is, developers are already starting to remove features...

This is a tug-o-war match. Apple is trying to see how far they can go without having 3rd parties pull out. 3rd parties don't want to pull out yet, because simply removing functionality isn't hurting their business yet.

When iOS becomes too big a bother to support, they will pull out and that's when Apple will know they went too far (the initial rules were in that territory, hence why they were changed).
 

jb1280

macrumors 6502a
Jan 13, 2009
869
255
Why should they?
Amazon is not trying to be all things to everyone like Apple is and there is no legal precedence that would compel Amazon to do so.

Apple didn't have to open it's app store to other developers, they CHOSE to do so.
Amazon can choose not to.

And Apple has the right to choose to change how it conducts business fully knowing the risk of developers pull out of the platform.

Clearly Apple made a decision and Amazon has made their choice about whether or not to continue supporting their platform.

Given that consumers can still purchase content via Amazon, like they always have been able to, for Kindle on iOS, why is this a big deal?
 

126351

Guest
Sep 17, 2007
175
0
This is a tug-o-war match. Apple is trying to see how far they can go without having 3rd parties pull out. 3rd parties don't want to pull out yet, because simply removing functionality isn't hurting their business yet.

Not forgetting the investment in developing for iOS.
 

KnightWRX

macrumors Pentium
Jan 28, 2009
15,046
4
Quebec, Canada
Apple didn't have to open it's app store to other developers, they CHOSE to do so.

And in doing so, they have gained a great deal of value for their devices. "There's an App for that" wouldn't be possible without the 3rd party developers. The relationship is symbiotic and to claim Apple has more claim to riches in this than the 3rd parties is ludicrous.
 

fifthworld

macrumors 6502
Oct 22, 2008
268
5
Think of it like free advertising. Amazon uses the iOS platform to make more money, while Apple gets no compensation for putting together the platform and hence establishing the userbase in the first place.

If Apple doen't get any compensation for putting together the platform how come that the iOS devices are not free and Apple is making record profit selling them?
 

rfrankl

macrumors 6502a
Apr 15, 2006
506
12
All the people that are complaining about Apple taking out the link, would also be the first ones complaining if someone was circumventing their system and not being compensated.
 

Rodimus Prime

macrumors G4
Oct 9, 2006
10,136
4
Then why has the Kindle app NEVER allowed in-app purchases?

in-app is one thing. Apple rule changed included then linking outside of the App. Hell the rule in Jan were even worse.

30% for a bill pay system is a rip off no matter how you cut it. All the other cost must be supported by the dev. Credit cards on the high end only take 5%
 

Bubba Satori

Suspended
Feb 15, 2008
4,726
3,756
B'ham
"All power tends to corrupt and absolute power corrupts absolutely."

"There is no error so monstrous that it fails to find defenders among the ablest men."

Lord Acton

170px-John_Acton%2C_1st_Baron_Acton_by_Franz_Seraph_von_Lenbach.jpg
 

KnightWRX

macrumors Pentium
Jan 28, 2009
15,046
4
Quebec, Canada
All the people that are complaining about Apple taking out the link, would also be the first ones complaining if someone was circumventing their system and not being compensated.

Why should Apple be compensated for doing nothing at all ? The Link wasn't using any Apple infrastructure in an unpaid way by Amazon. The iOS frameworks allow for you to write buttons that open links in Safari, this is paid for by the 99$/year fee and the 30% cut taken on your application's price.
 

jb1280

macrumors 6502a
Jan 13, 2009
869
255
So you'd want to wait for developers to actually pull out before we start questionning Apple's policies ? Because as it is, developers are already starting to remove features...

This is a tug-o-war match. Apple is trying to see how far they can go without having 3rd parties pull out. 3rd parties don't want to pull out yet, because simply removing functionality isn't hurting their business yet.

When iOS becomes too big a bother to support, they will pull out and that's when Apple will know they went too far (the initial rules were in that territory, hence why they were changed).

Apple's policies were questioned for months about this and we are now seeing the results of said policies.

When Apple sets up a new set of rules then it is worth re-litigating this issue, but at the moment it appears that the new policies stated earlier this year have been dealt with amicably by both Amazon and Apple.
 

macsmurf

macrumors 65816
Aug 3, 2007
1,200
948
To your Kindle??? (not Kindle app, but an actual Kindle e-reader?)

I must try that. What do I do, just connect Kindle to computer, open up iTunes, and then what?

Ah, I thought we were talking about the iOS platform. I don't know if you can add mobi books to the physical Kindle.
 

Popeye206

macrumors 68040
Sep 6, 2007
3,148
836
NE PA USA
Thanks Apple. You sure provide excellent "user friendly" features. You don't even get your ridiculous 30% cut.

Just another dickish move... nothing surprising really.

Personally, I don't think it's the 30% as much as they want the customer data directly. Selling through iTunes they don't get the customer name and I'm sure this is what they're more upset at.

The 30%... who cares.... that's just normal distribution.

BTW... this is not another "dickish move".... it's the same move as before.
 

jb1280

macrumors 6502a
Jan 13, 2009
869
255
Apple strong armed Amazon to eat less money because now it is harder for people go buy new books instead of being cut off of iOS.
Amazon should of stood its ground and forced Apple to do something. These is pretty insane by Apple.

I don't think we can speculate one way or another how the removal of a link to a web browser had demonstrably hurt the Kindle platform. Should iBooks gain significant leverage over Kindle in the next year we might be able to state that, but until that point you are merely speculating based on your pre-conceived notions.
 

Oletros

macrumors 603
Jul 27, 2009
6,002
60
Premià de Mar
Then why has the Kindle app NEVER allowed in-app purchases?

Because Bezos didn't like, was so difficult for them, I don't know. Android apps also doesn't have IAP and Google doesn't ban it.

The fact is that in january Apple stablished that any app which can sync content bought outside the app must provide IAP system and this rules wasn't before.
 

greytmom

macrumors 68040
Jun 23, 2010
3,566
1,002
in-app is one thing. Apple rule changed included then linking outside of the App. Hell the rule in Jan were even worse.

30% for a bill pay system is a rip off no matter how you cut it. All the other cost must be supported by the dev. Credit cards on the high end only take 5%

If I remember the article that was posted right here on MacRumors... they reinterpreted the already existing language to include links outside of the app. Now see, to me that's a "who cares" kind of thing. I don't care if I have to go look up a link on my own. I realize there are people who think that's a big deal.

And for what it is worth, I do think 30% on an in-app purchase is too high. But, it's Apple's store - they can do what they want. And since I prefer to purchase my books on Amazon anyway because I like to browse them first and check out the reader reviews, etc., it's not a problem for me.
 
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