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Old Sep 24, 2012, 07:01 PM   #51
jason2811
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Two questions:

1) Does this mean if I take my Verizon iPhone 5 overseas, I will be able to put in an international SIM and it will work automatically?

2) If I ask Verizon to unlock my current iPhone 4S, what does that mean exactly? Can someone pop in an AT&T sim card and have it work? Or does it just mean the phone will work overseas with an international SIM?
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Old Sep 24, 2012, 07:03 PM   #52
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Customer friendly:

Why can't they all just completely unlock the phones and make the baseband easy to change?

Compete on feature, value, and service! Not on unethical device lock-in!
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Old Sep 24, 2012, 07:11 PM   #53
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jason2811 View Post
Two questions:

1) Does this mean if I take my Verizon iPhone 5 overseas, I will be able to put in an international SIM and it will work automatically?

2) If I ask Verizon to unlock my current iPhone 4S, what does that mean exactly? Can someone pop in an AT&T sim card and have it work? Or does it just mean the phone will work overseas with an international SIM?
1) 4S SIM slots, and iPhone 5 SIM slots are two totally different animals. On the 4S, the SIM slot on Verizon is strictly only used for roaming, whereas on the iPhone 5, the SIM slot is used for both roaming, and authenticating to Verizon here domestically in the United States.....but all in all....Yes, you can use an international SIM card in the iPhone 5, so long as you don't lose the Verizon one, as you'll need it when you come back home.

2) AT&T/T-Mobile/Straight Talk/*Insert other US GSM SIM here* will not work in the Verizon iPhone 4S, as they have the United States carriers shut out. It is different with the iPhone 5 due to FCC Regulation, the iPhone 5 will work just fine on other US carriers with the exception of Sprint, because Sprint is CDMA.

----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lershac View Post
Why can't they all just completely unlock the phones and make the baseband easy to change?

Compete on feature, value, and service! Not on unethical device lock-in!
One can only hope. With Verizon and Sprint iPhones having SIM card slots and radios for both CDMA/LTE and GSM/HSPA+, we are one step closer. All they need to do is open up their CDMA networks more to allow them to use each other's SIM Cards (via the C-SIM Authentication). Theoretically it would work easily, but VZW and Sprint will not let "foreign" devices on their network.

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Quote:
Originally Posted by KPOM View Post
But my main point is that SIM/RUIM cards are not required by the CDMA standard, which gives CDMA carriers a lot greater ability to restrict particular phones from their networks.
Yes, you are correct, it isn't *required*, it is just Verizon and Sprint opted to use them for CDMA Auth as well. (Imagine the tech support hell if CDMA activated separately from LTE or some newbie removing the SIM card and wondering why the phone won't connect to LTE, but will connect to EvDO. With SIM card authentication, removing the card removes all service from the device making it easier to narrow down tech support issues).

I am wondering if Cricket will use it with the iP5, as they do not have LTE (or last I heard).
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Old Sep 24, 2012, 08:11 PM   #54
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Originally Posted by Boutrosn View Post
Does this mean you can buy the iphone 5 at 199$ with a two year contract but use a different carier (example in the middle east; GSM network) ?
Yes, but you'll still be paying whatever your monthly rate is for the contract, in addition to whatever you pay for the GSM network rate in the Middle East.
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Old Sep 24, 2012, 08:14 PM   #55
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Originally Posted by CorporateFelon View Post
A somewhat related question.

When purchasing an unsubsidized full price unlocked phone from from apple it says that it will only work on a gsm network. Is there a technical reason for that? Or is it just Verizon and Sprint saying, only phones sold through us can work with out networks?
Annoying but true...payng 649 for unlocked from Apple.com only gets you a GSM phone...even true for the 4S..which DID HAVE cdma chip in it..Apple disabled the chip when selling the unlocked version.....i just dont know why.

I bought it for Straight Talk, so i dont care....but it would be nice to know that my dormant cdma chip inside my apple.com unlocked 4s could be put to use 1 day..in virgin, or boost, or metro, etc....it seems silly that a dormant cdma chip is just lying there in the 4s not being useful.
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Old Sep 24, 2012, 08:30 PM   #56
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Originally Posted by MarlboroLite View Post
Hmm...why didn't the FCC force the other carriers to do the same thing when they purchased their LTE spectra? Is there something special about this 700Mhz band that Verizon acquired?
Yes, it was the most valuable because it has the most coverage (the whole US, basically) and widest bandwidth (double any other block), which allows more room for users and speed.

Quote:
Originally Posted by tbrinkma View Post
The other blocks weren't part of the same auction. The 'C' block was a special auction, and Google (as one of the bidders) convinced the FCC to add special conditions to the use of the block regardless of the winner. Not locking devices was one of those conditions.

IOW, we have Google to thank for this. (snip)
This.

By paying to enter the auction, and then bidding up Verizon to trigger the special rules, Google ended up paying millions out of pocket to ensure that the C block was open.
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Old Sep 24, 2012, 08:53 PM   #57
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Originally Posted by rufwork View Post
Because Verizon's the only carrier on Block C which has the open access caveat:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_...of_the_auction
So we have Google to thank for this?
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Old Sep 24, 2012, 09:12 PM   #58
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I don't understand why they were ever locked in the first place, the contract is not tied to the phone, if it was when you lose a phone you would lose the contract with it.
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Old Sep 24, 2012, 10:04 PM   #59
MufasaTheWise
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I'm new in the US and wanted to buy the iPhone 5 at full retail price from an Apple Retail Center. That said, what are the pros(and cons) of having to wait for Apple to release an unlocked iPhone 5 or buying a Verizon Model at full price? To clarify, I want to use it on T-Mobile but here's what befuddles me, will Apple's own unlocked iPhone 5 have LTE on any of the US' carriers?

TL;DR What is the difference between Verizon's unlocked iPhone 5(bought at full price) and Apple's yet to be released unlocked version?
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Old Sep 24, 2012, 10:08 PM   #60
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dontwalkhand View Post
1) 4S SIM slots, and iPhone 5 SIM slots are two totally different animals. On the 4S, the SIM slot on Verizon is strictly only used for roaming, whereas on the iPhone 5, the SIM slot is used for both roaming, and authenticating to Verizon here domestically in the United States.....

...

Yes, you are correct, it isn't *required*, it is just Verizon and Sprint opted to use them for CDMA Auth as well. (Imagine the tech support hell if CDMA activated separately from LTE or some newbie removing the SIM card and wondering why the phone won't connect to LTE, but will connect to EvDO. With SIM card authentication, removing the card removes all service from the device making it easier to narrow down tech support issues).
The Verizon 4S requires a SIM card in it to function, (consistent with your second statement which I'm not sure if you were talking just about the 5 or the 4S also).
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Old Sep 25, 2012, 03:04 AM   #61
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Originally Posted by Roessnakhan View Post
Yes
so how does apple make money ? If thats true ill ask my cousin to buy the iphone 5 from Verizon at 199$ and send to me 'i live in the middle east' and i could sell it for 1200$ which is the actual market price for any new iphone.
And ill get one for me since i dont own an iphone
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Old Sep 25, 2012, 08:08 AM   #62
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Boutrosn View Post
so how does apple make money ? If thats true ill ask my cousin to buy the iphone 5 from Verizon at 199$ and send to me 'i live in the middle east' and i could sell it for 1200$ which is the actual market price for any new iphone.
And ill get one for me since i dont own an iphone
Your cousin will be committed to a 2 year contract that will cost considerably more than just buying the phone outright from the start.
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Old Sep 25, 2012, 09:20 AM   #63
Roessnakhan
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Originally Posted by Boutrosn View Post
so how does apple make money ? If thats true ill ask my cousin to buy the iphone 5 from Verizon at 199$ and send to me 'i live in the middle east' and i could sell it for 1200$ which is the actual market price for any new iphone.
And ill get one for me since i dont own an iphone
Apple makes money regardless if Verizon does or not. The ETF covers what Verizon paid for the phone, so your cousin will be out $325 or 350 if he buys then cancels said contract.
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Old Sep 25, 2012, 09:40 AM   #64
jmass777
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ATT phone in Europe

In the past I've unlocked my ATT 3G and unlocked my ATT 4S and used them in Europe. Will that be possible with the 5, or is ATT LTE different than European LTE?

Last edited by jmass777; Sep 25, 2012 at 09:42 AM. Reason: clarity
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Old Sep 25, 2012, 09:52 AM   #65
PracticalMac
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So, getting Verizon (or Sprint) version is best if you plan to travel a lot?

Not doing data and voice at same time is bummer, unless you are doing FaceTime (or Skype)
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Old Sep 25, 2012, 11:57 AM   #66
nsayer
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jtrenda33 View Post
so will the AT&T iPhone 5 work on Verizon's network?
No. Verizon's 3G network is EvDO, which is not supported on the HSPA/GSM variant, and Verizon's LTE network is not tunable with the AT&T IP5.

----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by discuit View Post
The Verizon 4S requires a SIM card in it to function,
My wife and daughter have the 4S. There is no SIM installed, and they work perfectly well.

The SIM slot in the 4S is for GSM/HSPA roaming only.

----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by vartanarsen View Post
Annoying but true...payng 649 for unlocked from Apple.com only gets you a GSM phone...even true for the 4S..which DID HAVE cdma chip in it..Apple disabled the chip when selling the unlocked version.....i just dont know why.
Because CDMA networks require the equivalent to a SIM to be built-in to the phone (this manifests itself as the MEID). Since GSM uses SIMs instead, there's no need to provision phones intended to operate on GSM/HSPA networks with MEIDs. Without one, CDMA won't work. QED.

----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by CorporateFelon View Post
A somewhat related question.

When purchasing an unsubsidized full price unlocked phone from from apple it says that it will only work on a gsm network. Is there a technical reason for that? Or is it just Verizon and Sprint saying, only phones sold through us can work with out networks?
It's because GSM/HSPA phones aren't provisioned with MEIDs, which is equivalent in function to the SIM for CDMA networks, but is built-in to the phone.

----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by baweathe View Post
Can I use my Verizon iPhone 5 on AT&T simultaneously? We live in a dead spot for Verizon coverage, but we have LTE coverage everywhere else. AT&T tower is a mile away. Could I use AT&T's network on my iPhone 5 when I'm at home, and use Verizon's LTE network everywhere else?
Sure. Of course, you'll be paying more, and you'll need to swap SIMs a lot.

I'd suggest instead that you get the Verizon network extender. In the long run, it'll cost you less.

----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wheelie4 View Post
I've NEVER owned or used a cell/mobile phone. So this cell phone usage and service plans is all new to me. I was considering getting an iPhone 5 to use basically for phone service and specifically for emergencies. Since I'm bedridden I can always use my Wi-Fi network here at home to access the internet so a data plan nor LTE is as important to me as for everyone else. So does this mean if I get a Verizon iPhone 5 I could probably use it with Straight Talk whenever they come out with the nano sim cards to allow me to save money on the cost of a service plan?
For you, I think the advantages of a mobile phone are rather lost. If you're concerned about being able to make calls in an emergency, you might consider the Verizon Home Phone Connect. We've got one of those, and it works well, has the same reliability as a cell phone (including battery back-up), but has a plan that's intended to compete with VoIP offerings - $20/mo for unlimited domestic calling. Another advantage is that you just plug in whatever landline phone you're currently using.

Get one of those and a WiFi iPad. Net monthly cost, $20 + whatever your internet connection is already costing you. The HPC is either free with a 2 year contract or $120 (last I checked).
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Old Sep 25, 2012, 01:44 PM   #67
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Didn't verizon also disable the gps chips in some phones not too long ago to force you to pay for their own navigation service??? Good move FCC, that'll show those greedy pigs
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Old Sep 25, 2012, 01:56 PM   #68
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Originally Posted by SPNarwhal View Post
Is Sprint only unlocking for international use? Or does the Sprint model also work on AT&T out of the box?
From what i know, people have tried an AT&T sim in their Sprint iPhone 5 without any luck. However, I've personally tried an international SIM, and i got it to work, so it seems like Sprint customers won't have to wait 3 months to get their iPhone 5 internationally sim unlocked, it's internationally unlocked out of the box.
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Old Sep 25, 2012, 02:04 PM   #69
Robbkt
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Some People says that once you insert a sim, the Verizon iPhone lock to sim operator and we can't use another sim. Someone knows about these information??

Someone could try Verizon iPhone in Europe?

Sorry if I post on different thread
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Old Sep 25, 2012, 02:59 PM   #70
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Originally Posted by SPNarwhal View Post
How can that rule apply to all Smart Phones and yet Verizon is the only carrier that has it fully unlocked pretty much? Shouldn't it be this way for all carriers then? Is Sprint only unlocking for international use? Or does the Sprint model also work on AT&T out of the box?
I guess there's no way to only lock international usage. The Sprint Iphone 5 should be locked for all other carriers.
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Old Sep 25, 2012, 03:48 PM   #71
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So, I've tried doing some research, but maybe it's too early to get anything definite, but I'm curious:

1) If I have a Verizon iPhone 5, and I use it with an AT&T SIM to use AT&T's FauxG service, can I use simultaneous voice and cellular data? I've realized that I do this much more frequently than I expected.

2) Is it worth it to buy a Verizon iPhone 5 and pay the $350 ETF? It seems like it would be less expensive than buying an unlocked iPhone 5 directly from Apple when they are available. Or am I not calculating correctly?
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Old Sep 25, 2012, 05:17 PM   #72
nsayer
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Originally Posted by dcheng View Post
2) Is it worth it to buy a Verizon iPhone 5 and pay the $350 ETF? It seems like it would be less expensive than buying an unlocked iPhone 5 directly from Apple when they are available. Or am I not calculating correctly?
Don't forget the $35 activation fee.

$350+$35+$199 = $584. Right now, it's $649, but after Nov 8, the announcements I've seen said the price would be $449.

I'm not sure whether that $65 is fodder for arbitrage or not, but if it is, then it's going to sunset fairly soon.
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Old Sep 26, 2012, 01:02 PM   #73
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Originally Posted by nsayer View Post
Don't forget the $35 activation fee.

$350+$35+$199 = $584. Right now, it's $649, but after Nov 8, the announcements I've seen said the price would be $449.

I'm not sure whether that $65 is fodder for arbitrage or not, but if it is, then it's going to sunset fairly soon.

I'm not really looking to sell it. It's more along the lines of taking it for travel and getting the equivalent of an unlocked iPhone 5 now. I'm trying to weigh whether or not that is worth it or not. My travel phone is an unlocked iPhone 3GS or 4, so it's not a huge deal.

I don't think I've seen the discussion about the unlocked iPhone going down to $449, but that is definitely food for thought now.

Thanks much for the info.
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Old Sep 28, 2012, 09:16 AM   #74
sojay
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Unsuccessful

I just bought a Verizon subsidized iphone5 and tried to put in an AT&T sim, but didn't have any success.

Not sure what I am doing wrong. I have active lines on both carriers (that I plan to keep), and it was straightforward to go into an AT&T store and request a nano sim. Before activating the Verizon sim, I tried the AT&T one. No service. Then I activated the verizon sim. It was a little complicated but I got it done over the phone. Then I tried the AT&T sim. Still no service.

Wondering how to activate the AT&T sim - do I need to have that done in a store?

When I check on this site http://www.iphone-officialunlock.com/imei/
for whether it's unlocked, I get Activated status: no, and sim lock status: locked ( iPhone lock)? Could this possibly just be because I only just activated today and it takes a while? Any suggestions?
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Old Sep 29, 2012, 04:42 AM   #75
Adambys
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how i got my unlocked iphone 5

Maybe Verizon allows it but at&t only unlocks your phone if you paid full price.
Still at&t locked iPhone 5's are the cheapest.

I bought mine for 499$ from eBay than i used an unlocking service from http://attiphoneunlocking.com , they unlocked it for 35$.

So i saved around 300$. My only problem with this phone that its a bit too big compared to my 4S and hardly fits into my pocket, maybe its lighter, and better camera, but its not a huge difference over the 4S, i'm thinking to will switch back..

Last edited by Adambys; Oct 2, 2012 at 06:15 AM.
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