Go Back   MacRumors Forums > News and Article Discussion > iOS Blog Discussion

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old Feb 11, 2013, 12:44 PM   #1
MacRumors
macrumors bot
 
Join Date: Apr 2001
Tim Cook Opposed Suing Samsung Over Mobile Device Patents




In a report outlining the well-examined "frenemies" relationship between Apple and Samsung, Reuters notes that Apple CEO Tim Cook was opposed to suing Samsung for allegedly copying iOS, iPhone and iPad patents in the creation of its own line of tablets and smartphones. Cook's thoughts illustrate the differences between him and predecessor Steve Jobs, who said he was willing to wage "thermonuclear war" on companies that "stole" from Apple.
Quote:
Tim Cook, Jobs' successor as Apple chief executive, was opposed to suing Samsung in the first place, according to people with knowledge of the matter, largely because of that company's critical role as a supplier of components for the iPhone and the iPad. Apple bought some $8 billion worth of parts from Samsung last year, analysts estimate. [...]

Cook, worried about the critical supplier relationship, was opposed to suing Samsung. But Jobs had run out of patience, suspecting that Samsung was counting on the supplier relationship to shield it from retribution.
Cook's operational expertise no doubt influenced his perspective in worrying about impacts on the supply chain side of the equation, but he was overruled by Jobs. Since the dispute with Samsung broke out into the legal arena, Apple has been working to reduce its reliance on Samsung, but the two remain closely linked.

During Apple's Q2 2012 conference call, Cook said he has always "hated litigation", noting that he would prefer to settle rather than battle it out in the courts, although he emphasized that Apple does not want to become the "developer for the world".*Apple has settled with other companies that it has had patent issues with, including HTC, but last November Samsung publicly said that it was not interested in settling with Apple.

Article Link: Tim Cook Opposed Suing Samsung Over Mobile Device Patents
MacRumors is offline   0 Reply With Quote
Old Feb 11, 2013, 12:46 PM   #2
turtlez
Banned
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Cook fails to see this:

You can choose another manufacturer. You can't get back stolen designs. EVER
turtlez is offline   8 Reply With Quote
Old Feb 11, 2013, 12:48 PM   #3
MattMJB0188
macrumors 65816
 
MattMJB0188's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: California
I like Tim Cook. Jobs' tantrums were ridiculous. All he did was cry like a baby over stupid stuff.
MattMJB0188 is offline   17 Reply With Quote
Old Feb 11, 2013, 12:53 PM   #4
MH01
macrumors 68040
 
MH01's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
You can't tell the difference between Apple and Samsung mobile devices?

I think Cook knows how to play the game. Sometimes you keep your enemies closer.
MH01 is offline   3 Reply With Quote
Old Feb 11, 2013, 01:01 PM   #5
macnerd93
macrumors 6502a
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: United kingdom
Cook needs to understand direct competition, not just let them get away with it and vice versa. The reason being i've seen it happen all too often just look at the British automotive and motorcycle industry.

Britain were at the top of their game in the 1950's and 1960's. Then other manufactures from other countries began copying our designs and concepts.

We did nothing and well the rest is history, we have no car industry today.
__________________
21.5'' iMac, iMac G4, iMac G5, Power Mac G5 Dual, PowerBook G4, MacBook Pro, MacBook, Mac mini C2D, eMac, Power Mac G4 AGP Graphics, Power Mac G4 Quicksilver, iPod 4th Gen, iPad mini, iPhone 5S,
macnerd93 is offline   4 Reply With Quote
Old Feb 11, 2013, 01:02 PM   #6
Gnomepatrol
macrumors member
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: Metro East Area
Quote:
Originally Posted by turtlez View Post
Cook fails to see this:

You can choose another manufacturer. You can't get back stolen designs. EVER
I am much more apt to listen to a CEO than a forum surfer. As I have said in the past, Samsung is the best supplier of flash, nand, chips, and screens on the planet. From productions standpoint they would be shooting themselves in the foot to sever the ties with samsung. The higher failure rate of the alternatives was and still are unacceptable. They need samsung until they can find a manufactuerer that can meet the needs they have. We have already seen the issues with the new screen manufacturer (tracking diagonal swiping correctly) and I am sure they would like to avoid that.

In essence cutting ties with samsung, for now, would result in lower quality products. That is not to say that in the future it will be the same issue. Until the day comes though apple needs to play nice.

Tim Cook is a supply chain guy, he knows his stuff and wouldn't have raised these concerns if there was no reason.
Gnomepatrol is offline   7 Reply With Quote
Old Feb 11, 2013, 01:05 PM   #7
Tankmaze
macrumors 65816
 
Tankmaze's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
cook was thinking objectively... Just like don corleone said.. It's not personal, Sonny. It's strictly business . Steve took it very personally..
__________________
Check out our game Tank Maze
Tankmaze is offline   9 Reply With Quote
Old Feb 11, 2013, 01:06 PM   #8
SockRolid
macrumors 65816
 
SockRolid's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Almost Rock Solid
Quote:
Originally Posted by MacRumors View Post
... Cook said he has always "hated litigation", noting that he would prefer to settle rather than battle it out in the courts ...
But I imagine he hates flagrant systematic copying even more than litigation.

"It's important that Apple not become the developer to the world."
- Tim Cook, 4/12/2012, during Apple's FYQ2 earnings call

True then. True now. True forever.
__________________
Sent from my iPad Simulator
SockRolid is offline   0 Reply With Quote
Old Feb 11, 2013, 01:07 PM   #9
iMikeT
macrumors 68020
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: California
Definitely the difference between a leader and a manager.

Jobs was obviously a leader. Cook on the other hand, is a good manager but definitely no leader. He's willing to play nice to make sure the ship stays on course but is not willing to make the tough decisions that Jobs would have. Either way, Jobs is gone and we have Cook as the CEO and Jobs chose him for a reason or simply because he was the most qualified at the time.....
iMikeT is offline   1 Reply With Quote
Old Feb 11, 2013, 01:10 PM   #10
KdParker
macrumors 68030
 
KdParker's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tankmaze View Post
cook was thinking objectively... Just like don corleone said.. It's not personal, Sonny. It's strictly business . Steve took it very personally..
What about he business impact or losing revenue to another company using your designs?

I would assume that is the angle most CEO's would take.
__________________
64g iPhone6+Space Grey; 16g iPhone6 Silver;16g iPhone5s Space Grey;
15" retina - MBP 2.6 GHZ 16 RAM;
iPad4 retina
KdParker is offline   3 Reply With Quote
Old Feb 11, 2013, 01:16 PM   #11
blackcrayon
macrumors 65816
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Quote:
Originally Posted by MattMJB0188 View Post
I like Tim Cook. Jobs' tantrums were ridiculous. All he did was cry like a baby over stupid stuff.
Nah I'm pretty sure that's not all he did.
blackcrayon is offline   3 Reply With Quote
Old Feb 11, 2013, 01:22 PM   #12
MattMJB0188
macrumors 65816
 
MattMJB0188's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: California
Quote:
Originally Posted by blackcrayon View Post
Nah I'm pretty sure that's not all he did.
I'm pretty sure it is.
MattMJB0188 is offline   3 Reply With Quote
Old Feb 11, 2013, 01:25 PM   #13
SockRolid
macrumors 65816
 
SockRolid's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Almost Rock Solid
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gnomepatrol View Post
[...] As I have said in the past, Samsung is the best supplier of flash, nand, chips, and screens on the planet. From productions standpoint they would be shooting themselves in the foot to sever the ties with samsung. [...]
Unless, of course, Apple has plans to design their own flash memory components.

You might remember that Apple bought Anobit, an Israeli flash memory controller design firm. Their intellectual property includes advanced techniques for increasing flash memory performance and longevity while reducing costs.

And guess what. Samsung had a large contract with Anobit for their NAND flash memory designs. But now that Apple owns Anobit, that deal has been cancelled. Samsung must now get their flash memory from someone else, and they won't have Anobit's advanced technology any more.

Also, Samsung will be losing Apple's flash memory business. And as we all know, that business is huge. Apple is the world's leading consumer of flash memory. They control the market.

Maybe this MacRumors post will refresh your memory (pun intended):

http://www.macrumors.com/2012/01/10/...y-firm-anobit/

And here's a little more on Anobit at Wikipedia (65 patents owned or pending):
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anobit
__________________
Sent from my iPad Simulator
SockRolid is offline   1 Reply With Quote
Old Feb 11, 2013, 01:31 PM   #14
samcraig
macrumors G5
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Quote:
Originally Posted by SockRolid View Post
Apple is the world's leading consumer of flash memory. They control the market.
Sure about that in 2012? Source?
samcraig is offline   0 Reply With Quote
Old Feb 11, 2013, 01:38 PM   #15
charlituna
macrumors G3
 
charlituna's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Quote:
Originally Posted by turtlez View Post
Cook fails to see this:

You can choose another manufacturer. You can't get back stolen designs. EVER
I suspect that Cook knew this and the insiders statements are bogus.

It's more likely that what he said was that he was opposed to suing Samsung until they got more manufacturers in place. that way if Samsung tried to throw a tantrum they would have their backup already going and it wouldn't screw with their supplies and seriously hurt things.

But it's more fun and gets more hits to make Apple look bad, thus the incorrect phrasing. Or these so called insiders are just stupid

----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by SockRolid View Post
But I imagine he hates flagrant systematic copying even more than litigation.

"It's important that Apple not become the developer to the world."
- Tim Cook, 4/12/2012, during Apple's FYQ2 earnings call

True then. True now. True forever.
Which is why he didn't call off all the lawsuits as soon as he was fully in charge. And even perhaps started a few.

The settlement comment was more likely in regards to how some companies don't call the alleged offender first to try to work things out but go straight to the lawsuits. Cook probably doesn't like that tactic because it is a headache of legal wranglings, its costly etc. So under his watch, Apple sends a letter or makes a phone call and if the other side isn't willing to talk it out over tea, then a suit is filed. And Cook probably wishes other companies would give Apple that chance as well.

NOT that he would never sue if there was cause.
charlituna is offline   0 Reply With Quote
Old Feb 11, 2013, 02:26 PM   #16
Tankmaze
macrumors 65816
 
Tankmaze's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Quote:
Originally Posted by KdParker View Post
What about he business impact or losing revenue to another company using your designs?

I would assume that is the angle most CEO's would take.
Well that is another way to look at it... losing your vendors or losing your customers, like which is worse... it sort of lesser of two evil kind of decision, and we know how that went down.

and the CEO take should really be an inform decision, like make a balance sheet on which is worse. but steve took it like a personal vendetta, maybe because it happen to him with windows, and now android (idk, i'm speculating here).

but at the end of the day, it is really a hard decision to make.

----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by macnerd93 View Post
Cook needs to understand direct competition, not just let them get away with it and vice versa. The reason being i've seen it happen all too often just look at the British automotive and motorcycle industry.

Britain were at the top of their game in the 1950's and 1960's. Then other manufactures from other countries began copying our designs and concepts.

We did nothing and well the rest is history, we have no car industry today.
Thats a nice info, I remember watching a documentary about a motorcycle in the 60's where honda made a better engine, model and style against the british manufacturer. and not only it was better, but it's also cheaper.

maybe cook should take note of this.
__________________
Check out our game Tank Maze
Tankmaze is offline   0 Reply With Quote
Old Feb 11, 2013, 02:35 PM   #17
2 Replies
macrumors regular
 
Join Date: Apr 2010

This is cool. This is the sort of thing we should see from CEOs.
But it needs to be followed though on.
He can't just bend over when his lawyers or managers insist on pushing through with the litigation.

In the end he's responsible for the company's image, and giving in to internal pressure to litigate isn't going to help the image. It's going to hurt the long term image, just for a short term court-ruling judgement.
2 Replies is offline   0 Reply With Quote
Old Feb 11, 2013, 02:59 PM   #18
rdlink
macrumors 68000
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tankmaze View Post
cook was thinking objectively... Just like don corleone said.. It's not personal, Sonny. It's strictly business . Steve took it very personally..

And as long as Cook continues to think "objectively" instead of taking it personally Apple will lose its luster. "Taking it personally" is what brings passion to the game. I wouldn't want anyone working for me who wasn't as pissed off as Jobs was about this.
__________________
Desktop, Desktop, Laptop, Phone, Tablet
rdlink is offline   0 Reply With Quote
Old Feb 11, 2013, 03:07 PM   #19
Renzatic
macrumors 604
 
Renzatic's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Who puts the washers in the woods?
Quote:
Originally Posted by iMikeT View Post
Definitely the difference between a leader and a manager.

Jobs was obviously a leader. Cook on the other hand, is a good manager but definitely no leader. He's willing to play nice to make sure the ship stays on course but is not willing to make the tough decisions that Jobs would have. Either way, Jobs is gone and we have Cook as the CEO and Jobs chose him for a reason or simply because he was the most qualified at the time.....
"All that most maddens and torments; all that stirs up the lees of things; all truth with malice in it; all that cracks the sinews and cakes the brain; all the subtle demonisms of life and thought; all evil, to crazy Steve, were visibly personified, and made practically assailable in Samsung. He piled upon the corporation's similar design the sum of all the general rage and hate felt by his whole race from Adam down; and then, as if his chest had been a mortar, he burst his hot heart’s shell upon it."

- Walter Isaacson, Steve Jobs
Renzatic is offline   0 Reply With Quote
Old Feb 11, 2013, 03:11 PM   #20
blackhand1001
macrumors 68030
 
blackhand1001's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Quote:
Originally Posted by macnerd93 View Post
Cook needs to understand direct competition, not just let them get away with it and vice versa. The reason being i've seen it happen all too often just look at the British automotive and motorcycle industry.

Britain were at the top of their game in the 1950's and 1960's. Then other manufactures from other countries began copying our designs and concepts.

We did nothing and well the rest is history, we have no car industry today.
Pretty sure the horribly unreliable land rover and jaguar was more to blame then copiers.
__________________
Macbook 2008
HP Dv7t - 2.53 ghz, 9600m GT, WSXGA+, 120gb ssd, 250 gb 7200rpm
Core i7 3770k, 8gb ram, 2x 120gb sdd raid0, 500gb hdd, GTX 460
Moto X Dev Edition (VZW) Nexus 7
blackhand1001 is offline   3 Reply With Quote
Old Feb 11, 2013, 03:13 PM   #21
pacalis
macrumors 6502
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by turtlez View Post
Cook fails to see this:

You can choose another manufacturer. You can't get back stolen designs. EVER
Your post isn't even internally consistent.

If you can't get back stolen designs. Ever. Than why sue?

Apple's supply arrangements with Samsung are far more valuable than the likely outcome of the suit. So the good business decision is to not sue. Also, suing your suppliers doesn't exactly help you get the best suppliers.

It is also a good business decision to find alternative suppliers, which they have been doing. But Apple can walk and chew gum at the same time.
pacalis is offline   0 Reply With Quote
Old Feb 11, 2013, 03:13 PM   #22
Giuly
macrumors 68040
 
Giuly's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: That depends whether you ask for timezone, state of mind or GPS coordinates.
Well, but not suing Samsung is not entertaining either. Also, I guess SJ saw a little bit of Big Blue in, well,
Thumb resize.
Giuly is offline   1 Reply With Quote
Old Feb 11, 2013, 03:15 PM   #23
iMikeT
macrumors 68020
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: California
Quote:
Originally Posted by Renzatic View Post
"All that most maddens and torments; all that stirs up the lees of things; all truth with malice in it; all that cracks the sinews and cakes the brain; all the subtle demonisms of life and thought; all evil, to crazy Steve, were visibly personified, and made practically assailable in Samsung. He piled upon the corporation's similar design the sum of all the general rage and hate felt by his whole race from Adam down; and then, as if his chest had been a mortar, he burst his hot heart’s shell upon it."

- Walter Isaacson, Steve Jobs


Did you really have to quote from a book that I haven't read/listened to yet? Next time, please put "SPOILER ALERT" before I start reading!

Luckily, I'll start this book soon as the girl I'm dating just gave it to me as an audio book.
iMikeT is offline   0 Reply With Quote
Old Feb 11, 2013, 03:21 PM   #24
Renzatic
macrumors 604
 
Renzatic's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Who puts the washers in the woods?
Comeon. Everyone knows about Steve Jobs going thermonuclear. I'm not spoiling anything.

Also Snape kills Dumbledore, and the Matrix is a computer simulation the robots set up so they can use people as batteries.
Renzatic is offline   2 Reply With Quote
Old Feb 11, 2013, 04:10 PM   #25
deconstruct60
macrumors 603
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Quote:
Originally Posted by SockRolid View Post
Unless, of course, Apple has plans to design their own flash memory components.
they don't.


Quote:
You might remember that Apple bought Anobit, an Israeli flash memory controller design firm. ....

And guess what. Samsung had a large contract with Anobit for their NAND flash memory designs.
having a microprcocessor design (ARM core based one ) doesn't mean you have a DRAM design. Similarly, a flash controller is not NAND flash chips. They are two different kinds of chips.


Quote:
But now that Apple owns Anobit, that deal has been cancelled. Samsung must now get their flash memory from someone else, and they won't have Anobit's advanced technology any more.
Anobit can't make squat. Samsung has factories that make physical thinks people can buy. Samsung is not lacking at all in flash memory abilities at all.

Marvell , LSI/Sandforce , Intel, etc all make flash controllers with ECC and work arounds for flash wear problems. Samsung is not particularly pressed about this shift in controllers for a smaller subset of their business. Even back when the initially hooked up with Anobit it wasn't betting all of its money on just one solution

"... Samsung has a partnership with Seagate to develop and cross-license flash controller technologies, so there may conceivably be a role for Anobit in this relationship. It could also get a look-in with server flash storage supplier Fusion-io where Samsung has made an investment. ... "
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2010/08/18/samsung_anobit/

Samsung is a basic flash block supplier. It was and still is in their basic interest as a basic component supplier to work with all the Flash controller developers out there. If Apple wants to be boneheaded and exclude Samsung, a major flash provide, that their choice. Long term it is a bozo move. Especially, since Apple doesn't make anything.

There are also different levels of flash controller. Some are aimed at USB flash drive contexts. ( like this one that got some Anobit tech SK6630 and others ) and others are aimed at SSD drives... which Samsung has their own for MLC...

" ... Their Samsung 830 Series SSD is not based on the very common SandForce or Marvell controllers. The company uses their own design called S4LJ204X01. This controller is based on a triple core ARM processor, similar to what you have in your smartphone. The flash chips and controller DRAM are also produced by Samsung which means the company has full control over every component in their drive, certainly a unique situation. ..."
http://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/S...es_SSD_512_GB/


Apple shouldn't be as dependent upon Samsung as they are now (more bids and investments in other suppliers ) but to cross them off completely is silly.


Quote:
Apple is the world's leading consumer of flash memory. They control the market.
Apple is a player, but in so far they make nothing they hardly control it.

Apple purchased Anobit likely to merge the flash controller into future Apple SoC ( Apple A(6+?) ) and not have to pay for the IP license per 100 million sold. If $10 a pop the deal would easily pay for itself.

Kneecapping Samsung? Hardly.
deconstruct60 is offline   1 Reply With Quote

Reply
MacRumors Forums > News and Article Discussion > iOS Blog Discussion

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Similar Threads
thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Tim Cook: Mobile Payments 'One of the Thoughts' Behind Touch ID MacRumors MacRumors.com News Discussion 32 Jan 29, 2014 01:16 AM
Tim Cook Asked About Larger iPhone at China Mobile Launch MacRumors MacRumors.com News Discussion 143 Jan 22, 2014 06:18 AM
Tim Cook 'Incredibly Optimistic' About New Partnership with China Mobile MacRumors MacRumors.com News Discussion 59 Jan 16, 2014 09:56 AM
Tim Cook on Mobile Payments: 'It's In Its Infancy' MacRumors MacRumors.com News Discussion 168 Apr 29, 2013 08:19 PM
Tim Cook calls Samsung’s OLED screens “awful”, is he right? The Game 161 Alternatives to iOS and iOS Devices 121 Feb 19, 2013 08:18 PM

Forum Jump

All times are GMT -5. The time now is 12:06 AM.

Mac Rumors | Mac | iPhone | iPhone Game Reviews | iPhone Apps

Mobile Version | Fixed | Fluid | Fluid HD
Copyright 2002-2013, MacRumors.com, LLC